4um: PATRIOT ACT EXTENSION FAILS

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Title: PATRIOT ACT EXTENSION FAILS
Source: Campaign for Liberty
URL Source: http://AbMail
Published: Feb 8, 2011
Author: C4L
Post Date: 2011-02-08 20:32:58 by abraxas
Keywords: None
Views: 2365
Comments: 90

PATRIOT ACT EXTENSION FAILS
Thanks to your dedicated efforts, the motion to suspend the rules and pass the extension of three PATRIOT Act provisions failed tonight in the House of Representatives! Since they were attempting to pass it on the suspension calendar, the vote required two thirds (290 members) of the House to agree to it.
The vote came down to the wire, and you could hear the arms breaking on Capitol Hill out here in Springfield, VA.
By a vote of 277-148, the House failed to pass the extension - click here for the roll call vote to see how your representative voted!
Thanks again for all you've done, but remember, we can't let up pressure now. This won't be the last we've heard of the PATRIOT Act renewal in the House.
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#41. To: Jethro Tull (#40)
Many of the 26 Republicans who voted against the bill Tuesday were new House members.

OK, so I am a wet blanket at the party.
When this comes to the finish line we will see how steadfast the newbies are.
Both "parties" love the Patriot Act.

Cynicom posted on 2011-02-08 22:45:36 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#42. To: Jethro Tull (#30)
you got it. i am doing a comparison between who voted for what. now there were 87 new gop congressman sworn in last month. Last year, only 10 gop congressmen voted no on the patriot act. this year, it was 26, a gain of 16.

16 out of 87 is small %, but it did the trick. i will list all of them as well as those who claimed tea party status yet voted yes on it.thes thigns are important to expose the rats.
mcclintock, a previous fave candidate of mine here in ca, is one who i criticized for voting yes on it last year. he voted no this time round, for some reason.
"if I have all faith so as to move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing." 1 Cor 12:31—13:13
"I don't know where Bin Laden is. I truly am not that concerned about him"
George W, Bush, 3/13/02 http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2002/03/20020313-8.html
Artisan posted on 2011-02-08 23:19:51 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#43. To: Cynicom (#41)
Cyni, be as wet as you want it still won't change the fact that were it not for new blood in the House this change wouldn't have happened. It's a bad day for big government and thank those who made it possible :P

Jethro Tull posted on 2011-02-08 23:28:11 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#44. To: Artisan (#42)
16 out of 87 is small %, but it did the trick. i will list all of them as well as those who claimed tea party status yet voted yes on it.thes thigns are important to expose the rats.

I couldn't have said it better myself.
Keep the good and toss the bad next cycle, and so it goes.

Jethro Tull posted on 2011-02-08 23:30:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#45. To: Jethro Tull, All Americans (#43)
I admit to being rather jaded about politics.
I was first really aware of its machinations about 1940. Since then, tides of change have come and gone, always bringing a ray of hope for the masses, only to be dashed, time after time.
The relentless growth of government has continued unabated, no matter the President, no matter the party. There have been numerous "new brooms" going to Washington to end the corruption, to free Americans, all hopes were without truth or foundation.
The ballot box and voting has turned out to be the best control system of the masses ever envisioned.

Cynicom posted on 2011-02-08 23:41:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#46. To: Flintlock (#34)
Why are they allowed to try to block the sunlight of freedom?

That which does not kill you makes you stronger.
And that's also why, while I'm certainly not displeased, I'm not gonna get excited about this news.
Nations can survive "Patriot Acts."
Nations can survive "Patriot Acts."
Empires over nations always have "Patriot Acts."
The next president will be: Romney
Prefrontal Vortex posted on 2011-02-09 0:23:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#47. To: Cynicom (#45)
The relentless growth of government has continued unabated, no matter the President, no matter the party.

It had to.
It's dedicated to a proposition.
The next president will be: Romney
Prefrontal Vortex posted on 2011-02-09 0:27:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#48. To: abraxas (#0)
click here for the roll call vote to see how your representative voted!

Final Vote Results for Roll Call 26
Many thanks to those who voted No.
Re: the Senate, this was posted Feb 4th at whatreallyhappened.com.

The FBI Has Been Violating Your Liberties in Ways That May Shock You

Last week, Senate Judiciary Chairman Patrick Leahy, [Democrat]- VT, introduced legislation to extend the Patriot Act past its February 28 expiration date to December 2013.
Though the extension once again saves some of the most nefarious, First- Amendment trampling provisions of the act — roving wiretaps, secret access to third-party records, the hunting of targets unafilliated with foreign powers — Leahy released a statement assuring us that the new extension will increase citizen protections.

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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-09 2:55:59 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#49. To: Artisan (#42)
Last year, only 10 gop congressmen voted no on the patriot act. this year, it was 26, a gain of 16.

More than doubled -- about 62% more. Applause!
Re: this problematic flashback from your 'House out of order' link at Post #2:

Ten Republicans who voted no to renew Patriot Act in 2010
Martin Hill
May 9th, 2010 5:10 am PT
On February 25th, Congress voted to renew three sections of the Patriot Act which were set to expire. They did so in a secretive way, lumping the 'Patriot Act' renewal into a group of other bills that were set to expire. In effect, they bundled the bills into one vote as to avoid public debate or publicity on the matter. So at 7:25 PM on a Thursday night, it was extended for another year, in bill H R 3961 titled Medicare Physician Payment Reform Act.

That skullduggery of lumping bills together should be abolished. So should their redundant maneuvers at taxpayer's expense to force legislation that's been voted down back onto the floor before the ink has even dried. The States should nullify any such reprehensible, steamrolled legislation -- as well as any bills not read and debated before voting, like the oxymoronic "PATRIOT" Act of 2001 -- and bill the DC offenders for the time.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-09 4:30:04 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#50. To: Cynicom (#12)
They have abject fear of Lone Wolves.

Hopefully, for good reason !
"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical. " Thomas Jefferson
noone222 posted on 2011-02-09 4:38:16 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#51. To: GreyLmist (#49)
That skullduggery of lumping bills together should be abolished.

ALL things FEDERAL should be abolished - terminated !
"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical. " Thomas Jefferson
noone222 posted on 2011-02-09 4:39:37 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#52. To: GreyLmist, randge, flintlock, rotara, eric stratton, original_intent, itistoolate, farmfriend, jethro tull, christine, wudidiz, twentytwelve, formerlurker, x-15, paddlefeet, freepatriot32, lod (#49)
Here are a few posts with details sorting through who did what.

26 Repubs who supported liberty & rejected the Patriot Act: Who are they?
http://www.examiner.com/la-county-libertarian-in-los-angeles/26-repubs- who-supported-liberty-voted-no-on-the-patriot-act-who-are-they
Excerpt: Now on to the eighteen people who voted No on the Patriot Act in 2011 who were not on the 'NO' LIST in 2010. Ten of them were already in office, and switched their votes to support liberty. Eight others took office for the first time this year. Out of the following eighteen people, only eight are serving their very first term in Congress. This means that out of 87 newly elected Republican Congressman, only eight of those voted NO on the Patriot Act. (13 new Republican Senators took office last mont for their first term).

44/52 'Tea Party Caucus' members voted to renew Patriot Act
http://www.examiner.com/la- county-libertarian-in-los-angeles/44-tea-party-caucus-members-voted-to-renew- patriot-act

'House out of order' after first blockage of Patriot Act in ten years
http://www.examiner.com/la- county-libertarian-in-los-angeles/gop-house-blocks-extension-of-patriot-act

Ron Paul launches LibertyPac.com in prep for possible 2012 bid
http://www.examiner.com/la-county-libertarian-in-los-angeles/ron-paul- launches-libertypac-com-prep-for-possible-2012-presidential-bid
"if I have all faith so as to move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing." 1 Cor 12:31—13:13
"I don't know where Bin Laden is. I truly am not that concerned about him"
George W, Bush, 3/13/02 http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2002/03/20020313-8.html
Artisan posted on 2011-02-09 5:14:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#53. To: All, patrickhenry, noone222, happy2bme4um (#52)
ping to post #52
"if I have all faith so as to move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing." 1 Cor 12:31—13:13
"I don't know where Bin Laden is. I truly am not that concerned about him"
George W, Bush, 3/13/02 http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2002/03/20020313-8.html
Artisan posted on 2011-02-09 5:19:15 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#54. To: noone222 (#51)
ALL things FEDERAL should be abolished - terminated !

And then what? Anarchy? I agree there needs to be some massive rollbacks. You might like this new book by Tom Woods:

Who’s Afraid of a Free Society?
by Thomas E. Woods, Jr.
Today is the release date for my new book, Rollback : Repealing Big Government Before the Coming Fiscal Collapse. It could just as easily have been called Everything Needs to Be Abolished, and Here’s Why.
[sic]
let’s suppose that the federal government has in fact been an enemy of the people’s welfare, and that the progress in our living standards has occurred quite in spite of its efforts. It pits individuals, firms, industries, regions, races, and age groups against each other in a zero-sum game of mutual plunder. It takes credit for improvements in material conditions that we in fact owe to the private sector, while refusing to accept responsibility for the countless failures and social ills to which its own programs have given rise. Rather than bringing about the "public good," whatever that means, it governs us through a series of fiefdoms seeking bigger budgets and more power. Despite the veneer of public-interest rhetoric by which it camouflages its real nature, it is a mere parasite on productive activity and a net minus in the story of human welfare.
Now if this is a more accurate depiction of the federal government, we are likely to have a different view of the consequences of the coming fiscal collapse. So an institution that has seized our wealth, held back the rise in our standard of living, and deceived schoolchildren into honoring it as the source of all progress, will have to be cut back? What’s the catch? This is no calamity to be deplored. It is an opportunity to be seized. The primary purpose of the book, therefore, is to demonstrate that we would not only survive but even flourish in the absence of countless institutions we are routinely told we could not live without.

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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-09 6:07:44 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#55. To: Artisan (#52)
Thanks for the timely updates!! I gotta leave the house early this morning, but when I get back, I will read all!
It is a violation of Natural Law to use this document in a manner inconsistent with its labeling.
randge posted on 2011-02-09 6:32:10 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#56. To: Artisan (#52)
Here are a few posts with details sorting through who did what.

Thanks. I especially appreciate the research in these two links:
26 Repubs who supported liberty & rejected the Patriot Act: Who are they?
44/52 'Tea Party Caucus' members voted to renew Patriot Act: Out of the 87 new Republican Congressman and 13 new GOP Senators who were sworn into their first terms last month, it is not known how many consider themselves tea partiers, since there is no updated list.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-09 6:41:12 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#57. To: All, (#54)
And then what? Anarchy?

State and County Government are more than sufficient. And, if they became dictatorial, shut them off too.
Look, I wouldn't call it anarchy ... I'd call it UNarchy. What we have today is the most sophisticated and intrusive techno-dictatorship to have ever existed on planet earth. Personally, I don't like it one bit and am quite willing to go it alone or with a group of my choosing.
To those people that think of themselves as self sufficient, independent, self- starters, self-motivated, whatever best fits your own description of yourselves, to sit back and watch these anti-freedom ghouls steal every last crumb, to squeeze out every last drop of blood, to shit all over freedom as well as murder all over the world, I say prove it.
I much prefer anarchy to this highly organized blitzkrieg rolling out from D.C.
If it's FEDERAL it's fucked. Get it ? There isn't anything good or even well intended oozing out of that cess pit, so stop fucking financing it if you have an ounce of backbone or intestinal fortitude.
Otherwise you are a traitor to yourself and everyone else that's ill effected through your most generous contributions to the FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM / IRS / War Mongering, fucking satan. Got it yet ??? Talk is cheap. Freedom has a price attached to it.
Look in the fucking mirror and catch a glimpse of the REAL ENEMY of FREEDOM. Yes ! It's you !!! Followers of the Great Satan in D.C. [Bend down and lick the boot of your master].
April 15th "IS" April FOOL's DAY !
Don't hate me for stating the truth.
"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical. " Thomas Jefferson
noone222 posted on 2011-02-09 6:55:22 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#58. To: Artisan, 4 (#52)
Thanks for the terrific, impartial research Artisan. For now it's clear the "Tea Party" splits heavily on issues of war and this Act. Most can't be counted on to help extract us from foreign entanglements or draconian domestic law. OTOH, the eight more libertarian tea party members who supplied the necessary votes to (for now) put a stake in the heart of parts of this Patriot Act mess deserve our thanks. It's a victory, make no mistake about it. I never thought all the new folk would be like us on 4um. We are a very small group of America Firsters and to think change will come immediately after one voting cycle is unrealistic. To those who want to do something I suggest calling these Reps and thanking them for a start. From there, we need to continue to weed out the good from the bad come election time. We've been given a start from a core of people who voted with Ron Paul and against big government. If one looks at the people (Obama, establishment Rs) who wanted the extension, yesterday's rejection is a solid start. Thanks are in order to those who helped put these eight votes in the House. Their vote did matter.

Jethro Tull posted on 2011-02-09 8:22:24 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#59. To: Jethro Tull (#58)
the eight more libertarian tea party members who supplied the necessary votes to (for now) put a stake in the heart of parts of this Patriot Act mess deserve our thanks. It's a victory, make no mistake about it. I never thought all the new folk would be like us on 4um. We are a very small group of America Firsters and to think change will come immediately after one voting cycle is unrealistic.

That's wisdom, a rare commodity around here.
"The person who agrees with you 80 percent of the time is a friend and an ally — not a 20 percent traitor" - Ronald Reagan
Flintlock posted on 2011-02-09 9:09:42 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#60. To: Artisan (#52)
Thanks for the info
"The person who agrees with you 80 percent of the time is a friend and an ally — not a 20 percent traitor" - Ronald Reagan
Flintlock posted on 2011-02-09 9:10:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#61. To: GreyLmist, noone222 (#54)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." - Ben Franklin
Eric Stratton posted on 2011-02-09 11:36:34 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#62. To: GreyLmist (#54)
Despite the veneer of public-interest rhetoric by which it camouflages its real nature, it is a mere parasite on productive activity and a net minus in the story of human welfare.

Therein lies the key point. Most of the government chest puffery is nothing more than the public relations of a Used Car Salesman asserting that the lemon du jour really was owned by a little old lady from Pasadena who only drove it to church on Sundays. (Of course that was 3 owners and 150,000 very hard miles ago, but what the hey?)
Remember The White Rose"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha
Original_Intent posted on 2011-02-09 12:37:34 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#63. To: Eric Stratton, GreyLmist, noone222 (#61)
I don't suppose that this book is available in the pubic libraries.

Been into the "happy weed" so early in the morning?
Remember The White Rose"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha
Original_Intent posted on 2011-02-09 12:39:06 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#64. To: Original_Intent (#63)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." - Ben Franklin
Eric Stratton posted on 2011-02-09 12:41:37 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#65. To: abraxas (#0)
That can only be good.
Solutions for Ireland. Say NO to the IMF/World bank. Default on our debt. Print our own debt free currency. Nationalise the trillion euros worth of gas and oil off our west coast. Take back our fishing (200 billion worth). Get our farmers growing again. Done deal if our politicians had the backbone. ~ Jim Corr
irishthatcherite posted on 2011-02-09 12:44:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#66. To: Jethro Tull (#40)
44 - House votes to proceed on Patriot Act extension
Posted at 4:05 PM ET, 02/10/2011 House votes to proceed on Patriot Act extension By Felicia Sonmez
The House on Thursday voted to proceed on a measure that would extend key provisions of the Patriot Act counter-terrorism surveillance law, two days after the proposal came up short in a Republican-led effort to approve it under fast-track rules.
The House voted 248-to-176 to proceed on the measure, with nine lawmakers not voting. Only four Republicans voted on Thursday against proceeding, in contrast to the 26 who opposed the bill on Tuesday night.
The four Republicans voting "no" on Thursday were Reps. Ron Paul (Texas), Chris Gibson (N.Y.), Raul Labrador (Idaho) and Tom McClintock (Calif.). All four had opposed the measure on Tuesday. Meanwhile, 172 Democrats voted against proceeding Thursday, up from the 148 who voted "no" on Tuesday.
The House is expected to easily pass the measure when it comes up for a final vote, likely early next week. Then it will get sent on to the Senate, where lawmakers are debating three separate proposed timelines.
The Patriot Act provisions are set to expire on Feb. 28 if Congress does not act to extend them.

TwentyTwelve posted on 2011-02-10 22:40:48 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#67. To: Artisan (#2)
Final vote tally on H.R. 514 was 277 yea 148 nay.
Republicans voted 210 yes and 26 no. Democrats voted 67 yes and 122 no.

I think we can see just whom is in favor of liberty in the Congress!
"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke
BTP Holdings posted on 2011-02-12 12:21:34 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#68. To: Jethro Tull, All (#58)
To those who want to do something I suggest calling these Reps and thanking them for a start.

I think we should recall those Reps and the others that joined them in the next vote-pass. Rather than recall from D.C. all the rogues who extended the so- called "PATRIOT Act", recall from that District of Criminals all those who voted to uphold the Constitution and reseat them in a Constitutional Congress. We can maybe all pitch in towards their salaries until we can set up a different payroll method for them.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 1:46:29 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#69. To: Eric Stratton (#61)
I don't suppose that this book is available in the pubic libraries. LOL

Not yet. Maybe someday. Sounds like it would be a wise investment to buy it for our own collections if we can and also donate copies to the public libraries roundabout ASAP.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 2:03:25 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#70. To: Original_Intent (#62) (Edited)
Most of the government chest puffery is nothing more than the public relations of a Used Car Salesman asserting that the lemon du jour really was owned by a little old lady from Pasadena only drove it to church on Sundays. (Of course that was 3 owners and 150,000 very hard miles ago, but what the hey?)

But parked in her rickety old garage
Is a brand new shiny red Super-Stock Dodge -- The Beach Boys ;)
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 2:43:05 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#71. To: noone222 (#57)
I much prefer anarchy to this highly organized blitzkrieg rolling out from D.C.

A highly organized blitzkrieg of Anarchy is precisely what's been rolling out from D.C. for far too long -- Anarchy against the Constitution.

If it's FEDERAL it's fucked. Get it ? There isn't anything good or even well intended oozing out of that cess pit, so stop fucking financing it if you have an ounce of backbone or intestinal fortitude.
Otherwise you are a traitor to yourself and everyone else that's ill effected through your most generous contributions to the FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM / IRS / War Mongering, fucking satan. Got it yet ??? Talk is cheap. Freedom has a price attached to it.
Look in the fucking mirror and catch a glimpse of the REAL ENEMY of FREEDOM. Yes ! It's you !!! Followers of the Great Satan in D.C. [Bend down and lick the boot of your master].
April 15th "IS" April FOOL's DAY !

I'm not seeing any guidance there on what you think needs to be done for people, employed or not, to be able to stop the financing of that hellionry.

Don't hate me for stating the truth.

I don't hate you for stating what you believe is the truth. Don't hate me for reminding you that you took an oath to protect and defend the Constitution, not replace it with more Anarchy.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 3:18:37 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#72. To: GreyLmist (#70)
But parked in her rickety old garage Is a brand new shiny red Super-Stock Dodge -- The Beach Boys ;)

Which reminds me of the old blue hair couple who used to drive by my High School - in their Hemi-Cuda.
Remember The White Rose"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha
Original_Intent posted on 2011-02-16 3:20:59 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#73. To: Original_Intent (#72)
Which reminds me of the old blue hair couple who used to drive by my High School - in their Hemi-Cuda.

Coolness. :)
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 3:32:29 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#74. To: GreyLmist (#71)
I'm not seeing any guidance there on what you think needs to be done for people, employed or not, to be able to stop the financing of that hellionry.

To stop financing the destruction of our country we must all say no together. If and when we do that we will end it.
Don't hate me for reminding you that you took an oath to protect and defend the Constitution, not replace it with more Anarchy.
When I was an 18 year old kid and still believed in our country I took an oath to support and defend the Constitution from "all" enemies both foreign and domestic. At the time I took the oath I was informed that until I left the military I had forfeited the "rights" protected by it. (All of this was long before "w" said the CON- sti-stupid was just a GD piece of paper).
I'm much older and far more realistic today. I do not "swear" oaths, nor do I feel compelled by the one taken as a part of my enlistment in the military. I personally consider AMERICAN TAXPAYERS the enemy of humanity.
Further, that oath, in my mind, was fulfilled the day my obligations to the military were satisfied and wasn't a perpetual commitment to an abstract concept requiring me to support unquestioned murder. And besides that, the U.S. Govt never upheld their end of the deal nor did the U.S. Govt ever intend to keep it.
These abstract pledges of allegiance or oaths to the CONstitution will never make murder or international genocide a righteous activity regardless of the "patriotic" spin." These things are childish falsehoods developed by evil people to convince us to murder each other.
The "killing machine" that we call government creates all of these abstract obligations and endless patriot promises to fill the empty heads of our youth (and borderline mentally retarded idiots) like the "sugar plums" that dance there for "childen" at Christmas time, which then justifies their murderous activity. Fucking ridiculous.
What I mean to say is that these oaths obligating 18 year old children to a tyrant or tyrannical government are pure bullshit and those taking them are what the "bull-shits" ... ignorant excrement.
Americans are accomplices to genocide and cannot hide behind bullshit excuses when justice does her thing. We will reap the whirlwind we have sewn.
America has allowed NAFTA and GATT, treasonous acts against their own interests, to stand for decades. This has destroyed many first time employment opportunities for our youth (and others) causing them to seek military positions as an alternative employment in order to have and support their families. We've effectually made them mercenaries and death merchants.
Call it what you will, but every act causes an equal and opposite reaction. Justice or karma will demand payment of us.
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt." - Essay in the Public Advertiser, 1749 - Samuel Adams
noone222 posted on 2011-02-16 6:02:45 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#75. To: GreyLmist (#69)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." - Ben Franklin
Eric Stratton posted on 2011-02-16 8:06:59 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#76. To: noone222 (#74)
I don't believe in "karma", nor the cliche that there is an equal and opposite reaction to every act, nor collective punishment as "Justice". I'd rather not have to see people such as yourself as allies against the destruction of our country only to the point where I would see Victory in a re-alignment with our Constitutional form of government, then as enemies of it thereafter prolonging conflict and the agenda to destroy our Republic. Of course the Constitution is just a piece of paper to those who have no respect for it like Bush. Doesn't make that so for those of us who do respect it, so why believe those like him and agree to throw your lot in with the enemies of it? Even if they outnumber us and have more arms, they don't really represent America. I'm thinking we should do more practical things than "Just say No" in unison -- like building our own economy, payment system, and credit unions to help people to opt out of the imposters' schematics. I think you're a Christian so I hope these verses will help you to better distinguish between Constitutionalists and alien system (s) invasion forces:
Mark 8:23-35
23 He took the blind man by the hand and led him outside the village. When he had spit on the man’s eyes and put his hands on him, Jesus asked, “Do you see anything?”
24 He looked up and said, “I see people; they look like trees walking around.”
25 Once more Jesus put his hands on the man’s eyes. Then his eyes were opened, his sight was restored, and he saw everything clearly.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 19:33:58 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#77. To: Eric Stratton (#75)
they'd probably call HOSE if anyone brought that book to the pubic libary.

Make an anonymous donation. :)

I'm getting ready to order it.

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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 19:43:12 ET (1 image) Reply Trace Private Reply
#78. To: GreyLmist (#77)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." - Ben Franklin
Eric Stratton posted on 2011-02-16 21:54:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#79. To: Eric Stratton (#78)
Done!
Rubbing my hands anticipating delivery.
: D

Great! I hope you'll give us some periodic bookreports here as you move through the chapters. :)
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
GreyLmist posted on 2011-02-16 22:05:58 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#80. To: GreyLmist (#79)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." - Ben Franklin
Eric Stratton posted on 2011-02-16 22:13:23 ET Reply Trace Private Reply

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