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Title: Four in five Vatican priests are gay, book claims
Source: [None]
URL Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2 ... an-priests-are-gay-book-claims
Published: Feb 13, 2019
Author: Harriet Sherwood
Post Date: 2019-02-13 09:40:39 by Ada
Keywords: None
Views: 114
Comments: 12

French journalist’s book is a ‘startling account of corruption and hypocrisy’, publisher says

Some of the most senior clerics in the Roman Catholic church who have vociferously attacked homosexuality are themselves gay, according to a book to be published next week.

Eighty per cent of priests working at the Vatican are gay, although not necessarily sexually active, it is claimed in the book, In the Closet of the Vatican.

The 570-page book, which the French journalist and author Frédéric Martel spent four years researching, is a “startling account of corruption and hypocrisy at the heart of the Vatican”, according to its British publisher Bloomsbury.

It is being published in eight languages across 20 countries next Wednesday, coinciding with the opening day of a conference at the Vatican on sexual abuse, to which bishops from all over the world have been summoned.

Martel, a former adviser to the French government, conducted 1,500 interviews while researching the book, including with 41 cardinals, 52 bishops and monsignors, 45 papal ambassadors or diplomatic officials, 11 Swiss guards and more than 200 priests and seminarians, according to a report on the Catholic website the Tablet.

Many spoke of an unspoken code of the “closet”, with one rule of thumb being that the more homophobic a cleric was, the more likely he was to be gay.

Martel alleges that one Colombian cardinal, the late Alfonso López Trujillo, who held a senior Vatican position, was an arch-defender of church teaching on homosexuality and contraception while using male prostitutes, the Tablet said.

The author found that some gay priests accepted their sexuality and a few maintained discreet relationships, but others sought high-risk casual encounters. Some were in denial about their sexuality.

Although the book does not conflate homosexuality with the sexual abuse of children, Martel describes a secretive culture among priests that creates conditions in which abuse is not confronted, say people familiar with the book’s contents.

According to Bloomsbury’s promotional material, Inside the Closet “reveals secrets” about celibacy, misogyny and plots against Pope Francis. It uncovers “a clerical culture of secrecy which starts in junior seminaries and continues right up to the Vatican itself”.

Francis has riled his conservative critics in the Vatican over his apparently softer tone towards gay people. A few months into his papacy, he told reporters who asked about a “gay lobby” at the Vatican: “If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge?”

Last year Juan Carlos Cruz, a Chilean survivor of sexual abuse, said Francis told him in a private meeting: “Juan Carlos, that you are gay does not matter. God made you like this and loves you like this and I don’t care. The pope loves you like this. You have to be happy with who you are.”

But a Polish priest who was sacked from his Vatican job and defrocked after announcing he was gay has accused the church of making the lives of millions of gay Catholics “a hell”.

In a letter to Francis in 2015, Krzysztof Charamsa criticised what he called the Vatican’s hypocrisy in banning gay priests and said the clergy was “full of homosexuals”.

In December, Francis was quoted in a book about vocations as saying homosexuality was a “fashion” to which the clergy was susceptible.

“The issue of homosexuality is a very serious issue that must be adequately discerned from the beginning with the candidates [for the priesthood]. In our societies it even seems that homosexuality is fashionable and that mentality, in some way, also influences the life of the church,” he said.

The timing of Inside the Closet’s publication, at the start of a milestone summit on sexual abuse, will raise concerns that some people may seek to conflate the two issues.

But the book’s allegations are likely to be pored over by senior bishops flying into Rome from more than 100 countries for the four-day summit.

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#1. To: Ada (#0)

Should be no surprize to those that have read Father Malachi Martin's accounts of the sordid goings on within the walls of the Vatican.

The Catholic church inherited greatly from its cultic Roman predecessors in terms of administration and finance as well heirarchy, custom and apparel, also including celibate and often effeminate priestly orders. The Greeks by and large rejected these cults. Bully on them. Glad to say I got nothing to do with this business.

I had to put a dog down once. Didn't like it one bit. Had to be done though.

www.gofundme.com/dr-corsi-legal-expenses/donate

randge  posted on  2019-02-13   16:33:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: randge (#1)

In the 1960s the Church was hemorrhaging priests--straight priest who for some reason wanted to marry. Solution was to ordain men who didn't want to marry.

Ada  posted on  2019-02-13   17:17:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Ada (#0)

But a Polish priest who was sacked from his Vatican job and defrocked after announcing he was gay has accused the church of making the lives of millions of gay Catholics “a hell”.

The Bible itself (God's Incarnate Word) makes practicing homosexuality a hell, in all senses and meanings of the word. As I understand it...

“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken

Lod  posted on  2019-02-13   17:20:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Ada (#2)

Solution was to ordain men who didn't want to marry.

There is no Biblical reason for priests, ministers, or pastors to remain celibate and not marry.

Although St. Paul thought it a good idea...for what reason no one knows.

“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken

Lod  posted on  2019-02-13   17:25:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Ada (#2)

In the 1960s the Church was hemorrhaging priests--straight priest who for some reason wanted to marry.

I believe you're right there.

But the celibate male priesthood stretches quite a bit further back into history than the 60s.

Nigh on two millenia of dirty secrets.

www.gofundme.com/dr-corsi-legal-expenses/donate

randge  posted on  2019-02-13   18:16:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Lod (#4)

1 Corinthians 7 King James Version (KJV)

7 Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.

2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.

3 Let the husband render unto the wife due benevolence: and likewise also the wife unto the husband.

4 The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife.

5 Defraud ye not one the other, except it be with consent for a time, that ye may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again, that Satan tempt you not for your incontinency.

6 But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment.

7 For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that.

8 I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, it is good for them if they abide even as I.

9 But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:

11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.

14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife?

17 But as God hath distributed to every man, as the Lord hath called every one, so let him walk. And so ordain I in all churches.

Paul, and I paraphrase, said that it was a gift from God to not need a wife and also not burn with lust.

My own supposition is that he didn't want to divide his interests nor be distracted or burdened as his mission was intense.


"Define yourself as one beloved by God. This is the true self. Every other identity is illusion."—Brennan Manning

Rotara  posted on  2019-02-13   20:02:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Rotara (#6)

My own supposition is that he didn't want to divide his interests nor be distracted or burdened as his mission was intense.

My supposition is that prior to his trip to Damascus, Paul was the horn-dog of all horn-dogs, and did a complete 180. Who knows, 2000 years later?

“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken

Lod  posted on  2019-02-13   20:29:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Lod (#7)

Hahahaha oh yes Saul might have been a 'playuh' before he was converted. Quite likely as the religious leaders of that day might have resembled the Vatican.


"Define yourself as one beloved by God. This is the true self. Every other identity is illusion."—Brennan Manning

Rotara  posted on  2019-02-13   21:22:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Ada, All (#0) (Edited)

Four in five Vatican priests are gay

I told a story on the Chicago Outfit Facebook page about what happened in Chicago in the late 70s. I loaned this guy $100. He had a month to get it back to me.

When he was late, I put out the word on him. Someone told me they saw him going into the Food & Liquors store on the main drag. So I drove over there and caught him coming out the front door. I said to him, "Come out here." on the traffic side of truck.

I said to him, "So where is my money?" He starts to give me a line, so I grab him by his shirt and tell him, "If you don't get me my money FAST, (I look left and there is a car coming.) you might have an accident." I pushed him back. He rocked back on his heels. I pulled him back just before the car hit him. It was so close the car stopped.

His eyes got big around and he screamed at me, "YOU'RE ON DRUGS! YOU GOTTA BE ON DRUGS!"

I had my cash the next day.

One of those guys on the Outfit page told me, "You would have made a good enforcer."

I told the priest here at the Catholic church that same story and he thought I meant Clint Eastwood.

I told him, "No. These guys were mobsters." ROTFLMAO!

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2019-02-13   21:39:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: Lod (#4)

There is no Biblical reason for priests, ministers, or pastors to remain celibate and not marry.

Although St. Paul thought it a good idea...for what reason no one knows.

Paul didn't think anyone should marry if possible, but "its better to marry than to burn". He didn't forbid bishops from marrying but they had to be married to only one wife.

He thought the second coming was imminent and marriage, therefore, was a distraction.

Eastern rite church and, of course, Orthox priests marry.

Ada  posted on  2019-02-13   21:50:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Rotara (#8)

this was found searching "definition of vatican" ~ amazing if true

weblogs.asp.net/dneimke/396780

“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken

Lod  posted on  2019-02-13   22:08:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Ada (#10)

Correct, thank you.

“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken

Lod  posted on  2019-02-13   22:09:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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