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Title: The thread that's changed its focus from the original title. Carry on ;)
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Published: Mar 21, 2009
Author: m e
Post Date: 2009-03-21 08:19:06 by Itistoolate
Keywords: None
Views: 11565
Comments: 2261

Officer Jack McLamb's shows:
arc.gcnlive.com/Archives2009/mar09/McLamb/030209.mp3
arc.gcnlive.com/Archives2009/mar09/McLamb/030309.mp3
arc.gcnlive.com/Archives2009/mar09/McLamb/030409.mp3
arc.gcnlive.com/Archives2009/mar09/McLamb/030509.mp3
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#1559. To: war (#1558)
UL did not certify the steel

You're confused. You and I never discussed UL. The last time we discussed 9/11, you tried to rewrite the Odigo article I submitted.
Then again, that's what moonbats do - rewrite things to their liking.
This moonbat thing of yours...which Freeper cell did you train in?
Eff the Bankers
bluegrass posted on 2009-03-27 14:04:50 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1560. To: war (#1558)
[21] See here for pictures and comments in FEMA’s report mentioning the melted steel: www.911research.wtc7.net/...nce/metallurgy/index.html
“Although virtually all of the structural steel from the Twin Towers and Building 7 was removed and destroyed, preventing forensic analysis, FEMA's volunteer investigators did manage to perform "limited metallurgical examination" of some of the steel before it was recycled. Their observations, including numerous micrographs, are recorded in Appendix C of the WTC Building Performance Study. Prior to the release of FEMA's report, a fire protection engineer and two science professors published a brief report in JOM disclosing some of this evidence.” 1
“The results of the examination are striking. They reveal a phenomenon never before observed in building fires: eutectic reactions, which caused "intergranular melting capable of turning a solid steel girder into Swiss cheese." The New York Times described this as "perhaps the deepest mystery uncovered in the investigation."2 WPI provides a graphic summary of the phenomenon.”
“The severe corrosion and subsequent erosion of Samples 1 and 2 are a very unusual event. No clear explanation for the source of the sulfur has been identified. The rate of corrosion is also unknown. It is possible that this is the result of long-term heating in the ground following the collapse of the buildings. It is also possible that the phenomenon started prior to collapse and accelerated the weakening of the steel structure. A detailed study into the mechanisms of this phenomenon is needed to determine what risk, if any, is presented to existing steel structures exposed to severe and long-burning fires.”
Evidence of evaporated steel as reported by the New York Times:
“Engineers have been trying to figure out exactly what happened… ‘Fire and the structural damage… would not explain steel members in the debris pile that appear to have been partly evaporated’” from:
Glanz, James (2001). “Engineers are baffled over the collapse of 7 WTC; Steel members have been partly evaporated,” New York Times, November 29. 2001.

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-27 14:08:11 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1561. To: TwentyTwelve (#1560)
Engineers are baffled over the collapse of 7 WTC

More likely, they can't accept the reality of what happened.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 14:10:02 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1562. To: TwentyTwelve (#1560)
The FEMA Report is a non starter.

war posted on 2009-03-27 14:11:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1563. To: bluegrass, Original Intent (#1559)
ROFLMAO...I rewrote squat Moonie...you're tentmate here even admits that the story was never authenticated.

war posted on 2009-03-27 14:12:55 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1564. To: TwentyTwelve (#1560)
A detailed study into the mechanisms of this phenomenon is needed to determine what risk, if any, is presented to existing steel structures exposed to severe and long-burning fires.

They don't have to worry about that anymore. They only made one batch of the Magickal Jet Fuel™.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end.
Lord Acton
James Deffenbach posted on 2009-03-27 14:13:22 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1565. To: James Deffenbach (#1564)
ehehe

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 14:14:12 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1566. To: war, Original Intent (#1563)
I rewrote squat...

Yeah, you did.
You're a rank amateur.
Eff the Bankers
bluegrass posted on 2009-03-27 14:19:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1567. To: Rotara (#1565)
Well, think about it. How many skyscrapers caught on fire and never fell into their own footprint before 9/11? How many after? And of course the answer is that it never happened before or since. Ergo, Magickal Jet Fuel™.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end.
Lord Acton
James Deffenbach posted on 2009-03-27 14:23:38 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1568. To: James Deffenbach, Rotara (#1567)
Well, think about it. How many skyscrapers caught on fire and never fell into their own footprint before 9/11? How many after? And of course the answer is that it never happened before or since. Ergo, Magickal Jet Fuel™.

www.prisonplanet.com/arti...st2007/190807Building.htm
Ground Zero Building Catches Fire, Doesn't Collapse
Prison Planet
Sunday Aug 19, 2007
The 40 story Deutsche Bank building next to the ground zero site in New York, where the world trade center once stood, caught fire yesterday and burned intensely for seven hours without collapsing.
This represents another modern day miracle in light of the commonly accepted premise that since 9/11, all steel buildings that suffer limited fire damage implode within two hours. This building had even suffered structural damage on 9/11 and had been partially dismantled.
The raging fire, which killed two firefighters, was finally declared under control late saturday afternoon, a full seven hours after it had begun to burn.
On 9/11 the south tower of the WTC burned for just 56 minutes before collapsing, while the north tower lasted around an hour and 45 minutes. According to the official transcripts of the firefighter tapes, fires in both towers were almost out immediately before the collapses.
The saving grace that could have prevented Deutsche Bank from imploding may have been the fact that it was not hit by a plane, as the twin towers were on 9/11.
However, the absence of a jet strike wasn't enough to prevent WTC 7 from crumbling into its own footprint within 7 seconds later that fateful afternoon.
Hundreds of buildings worldwide suffered major fires that gutted the entire facade of their structure before 9/11 and did not collapse, but since the twin towers behaved differently, rather than consider an alternative explanation for the collapse of the towers, experts simply decided to reverse the fundamental precepts of all known physics to make it easier for everyone to understand.
Since that time, it has been commonly accepted that limited fires in tall buildings are 99% certain to cause an almost instantaneous collapse.

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-27 14:28:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1569. To: bluegrass (#1566)
ROFLMAO...you folks are killing me today...it was an illustration to you as to how the story could be manipulated, doofette. WAY to miss the obvious point!!!

war posted on 2009-03-27 14:29:24 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1570. To: James Deffenbach (#1567)
BEIJING SKYSCRAPER FIRE & WTC 7
• Beijing Skyscraper Fire: The Silence Is Deafening
• Still Standing: The Building That Proves WTC 7 Was Imploded

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 14:31:16 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1571. To: TwentyTwelve (#1568)
1570

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 14:32:03 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1572. To: TwentyTwelve (#1568)
Hundreds of buildings worldwide suffered major fires that gutted the entire facade of their structure before 9/11 and did not collapse, but since the twin towers behaved differently

How many more times, to the nearest 10,000th, does it need to be pointed out to you that those buildings were of an entirely different framing construct than WTC? And don't ***think*** I didn't notice your use of the word "facade", weasle.

war posted on 2009-03-27 14:32:10 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1573. To: Rotara, James Deffenbach (#1570)
BEIJING SKYSCRAPER FIRE & WTC 7
• Beijing Skyscraper Fire: The Silence Is Deafening
• Still Standing: The Building That Proves WTC 7 Was Imploded

Five days after being continuously flooded with water, molten metal at the bases of WTC-2 and WTC-7 was measured approximately 1,3500F. Peter Tully, president of Tully Construction of Flushing, N.Y., told Christopher Bollyn that while removing debris from the site he had seen pools of “literally molten steel” at the World Trade Center.
Bollyn phoned Loizeaux. “Yes,” confirmed the man in charge of the WTC clean-up, “hot spots of molten steel in the basements.” Specifically, the hot areas were found “at the bottoms of the elevator shafts of the main towers, down seven levels,” Loizeaux said.
Loizeaux also confirmed that molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which suddenly collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon of September 11—apparently from a city-ordered demolition.
New York City firefighters remain under a tight government gag order to not discuss the explosions they heard, felt and saw. FAA radar personnel are also under a similar gag order.
Taken From: www.willthomas.net/Convergence/Weekly/WTC_Bombs.htm

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-27 14:32:17 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1574. To: war (#1569)
how the story could be manipulated

And you manipulated it, expecting a big ol' 'case closed'.
The original story still stands, amateur. Odigo said they were warned.
Eff the Bankers
bluegrass posted on 2009-03-27 14:32:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1575. To: war (#1572)
those buildings were of an entirely different framing construct than WTC?

WTC 7 wasn't.
Eff the Bankers
bluegrass posted on 2009-03-27 14:33:14 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1576. To: TwentyTwelve (#1568)
Since that time, it has been commonly accepted that limited fires in tall buildings are 99% certain to cause an almost instantaneous collapse.

Well yeah, if they made another batch of that fuel and splashed a few drops on one and lit it. It would most certainly be doomed. I hope they lost the formula for that $#it--it's way too dangerous.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end.
Lord Acton
James Deffenbach posted on 2009-03-27 14:34:38 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1577. To: war (#1572)
www.newworldpeace.com/coverup5a.html
Professor of fire prevention engineering states the jet fuel could not have caused the collapse alone, and asks for a full investigation.
We must try to find out why the twin towers fell.
--------------------------------------------------------------
THE JET fuel fires in the World Trade Center towers did not bring down those two buildings. Indeed, the fuel burned up in minutes. Why, then, did the towers and their 44-story neighbor, WTC-7, which was not struck by a plane, collapse? It's a question that bears generally on fire safety, the safety of building occupants and firefighters and the vulnerability of our buildings to terror by fire.
I expected the National Response Team of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms would participate in an investigation that I surely thought would follow the Sept. 11 attacks. The ATF has the authority to investigate arson involving interstate commerce. Certainly, these horrendous attacks should be construed as arson. I later learned that the ATF was told it would not be needed.
I expected the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) to head the investigations. It's noted for its thoroughness, objectivity and know-how with respect to large-scale disasters. But it was relegated to flight issues dealing with the two hijacked aircraft and the aircraft debris. The buildings were not to be within the scope of their investigation.
There is an ad hoc investigative group, which is sponsored by the Federal Emergency Management Agency and the American Society of Civil Engineers. But it does not have the full resources that might be made available, nor does it control the site.
I became increasingly concerned the more I learned about the investigative process, or lack of one. The site teams at the towers were focused on rescue, retrieval and cleanup, not investigation. The structural steel pieces, coded with chalk and stamped numbers to indicate their building location, were being sold as scrap metal.
The evidence needed to identify the cause of the collapse and intensity of the fire was being lost. Had the NTSB or ATF been involved, the site would have been secured, evidence documented and protected. Remember how the pieces of TWA Flight 800 were brought up from the ocean bottom off Long Island and restored to preserve structural evidence essential to identifying the cause of the 1996 crash?

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-27 14:34:52 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1578. To: TwentyTwelve (#1573)
Loizeaux also confirmed that molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which suddenly collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon of September 11—apparently from a city-ordered demolition.
New York City firefighters remain under a tight government gag order to not discuss the explosions they heard, felt and saw. FAA radar personnel are also under a similar gag order.

Gag a shill !

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 14:37:14 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1579. To: bluegrass, war (#1575)
WTC 7 wasn't.

1993
“[Building designer] John Skilling recounts his people having carried out an analysis which found the twin towers could withstand the impact of a Boeing 707. Our analysis indicated the biggest problem would be the fact that all the fuel (from the airplane) would dump into the building. There would be a horrendous fire. A lot of people would be killed.” But, he says, “The building structure would still be there.”[4]
“The analysis Skilling is referring to is likely one done in early 1964, during the design phase of the towers. A three-page white paper, dated February 3, 1964, described its findings: “The buildings have been investigated and found to be safe in an assumed collision with a large jet airliner (Boeing 707—DC 8) traveling at 600 miles per hour. Analysis indicates that such collision would result in only local damage which could not cause collapse or substantial damage to the building and would not endanger the lives and safety of occupants not in the immediate area of impact.”

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-27 14:38:09 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1580. To: bluegrass, war, all (#1534)
Helpful hint to war:
You'd come off as a better disinfo artist if you questioned one or two aspects of the 9/11 Official Story rather than acting as though everything on the matter that came out of DC was gospel.
O_I thinks you're a pro. That little ol' me has to point this out to you shows you to be an amateur.

It's hard to get good help at 9 bucks an hour.
Of course since CENTCOM runs its own disinfo operation it could be PFC war.
""I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
Original_Intent posted on 2009-03-27 14:49:16 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1581. To: Original_Intent (#1580)
Of course since CENTCOM runs its own disinfo operation it could be PFC war.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 14:52:08 ET (1 image) Reply Trace Private Reply
#1582. To: Rotara, war, bluegrass, TwentyTwelve, Wudidiz, FormerLurker, all (#1578)
Loizeaux also confirmed that molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which suddenly collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon of September 11—apparently from a city-ordered demolition.
New York City firefighters remain under a tight government gag order to not discuss the explosions they heard, felt and saw. FAA radar personnel are also under a similar gag order.
Gag a shill !

The problem the poooooooooooor shills, such as war, run into is that the moment they try to spin away one piece of evidence, in isolation from all the others, is that another piece of evidence contradicting the Official Fairy Tale pops up and they then either have to avoid it or hope that they can use diversionary tactics to direct attention elsewhere. At this point I'm sure they have books of preprogrammed responses and all they have to do is quickly thumb through the "Playbook" and cut and paste the approved response. Problem is that too many of the anomalies are well enough documented at this point, along with rebuttals of their "talking points", that they actually have to try and think - not something they are terribly good at - particularly when debating people who are 20 or 30 IQ points above them.
Poooooooooooooor shills. Oy Vey!
""I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
Original_Intent posted on 2009-03-27 14:59:27 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1583. To: Rotara (#1581)
LOL!
"Private! Your responses are FAILING PRIVATE!"
""I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
Original_Intent posted on 2009-03-27 15:01:45 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1584. To: Original_Intent (#1582)
Oy Vey!

It just has to suck AND blow to be them.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 15:04:03 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1585. To: Original_Intent (#1583)
EHEHEEEEEEEE !

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 15:04:33 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1586. To: bluegrass (#1574)
Odigo said they were warned. `

Warned yes...about the Towers...no...

war posted on 2009-03-27 20:18:30 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1587. To: TwentyTwelve (#1579)
Post a primary source to Skilling's quote...thanks...
You Moonbats are famous for making shit up...like NORAD 'standing down" and UL approviong the steel..and WTC 7 collapsing in 6.odd seconds until you're shown a video that it was actually 13 odd...

war posted on 2009-03-27 20:50:40 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1588. To: bluegrass, war (#1534)
Helpful hint to war: You'd come off as a better disinfo artist if you questioned one or two aspects...

Trutherism or anti-Trutherism as performance art with points awarded for technique, kind of like professional ice skating but not quite as gay.
You guys have passed through the looking glass.

TooConservative posted on 2009-03-27 23:45:08 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1589. To: TooConservative (#1588)
Come on now, only a total ignoramus or paid shill believes the Official 911 Fairy Tale® at this point.
There's no 'tween ground left to stand on. Our government is run by a treacherous cabal and the butchers are way way way way out of control.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara posted on 2009-03-27 23:50:47 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1590. To: war (#1587)
2001
“Leslie Robertson, one of the two original structural engineers for the World Trade Center, is asked at a conference in Frankfurt, Germany what he had done to protect the twin towers from terrorist attacks. He replies, ‘I designed it for a 707 to smash into it,’ though does not elaborate further.”[6]
[Leslie Robertson:] “The twin towers were in fact the first structures outside the military and nuclear industries designed to resist the impact of a jet airplane.”[7]
[Frank A. Demartini:] “The building was designed to have a fully loaded 707 crash into it. That was the largest plane at the time. I believe that the building probably could sustain multiple impacts of jetliners because this structure is like the mosquito netting on your screen door -- this intense grid -- and the jet plane is just a pencil puncturing that screen netting. It really does nothing to the screen netting.” Frank A. Demartini, on-site construction manager for the World Trade Center, spoke of the resilience of the towers in an interview recorded on January 25, 2001.[8]
[6] [Chicago Tribune, 9/12/2001; Knight Ridder, 9/12/2001]
[7] [Robertson, 3/2002; Federal Emergency Management Agency, 5/1/2002, pp. 1-17]
[8] http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/november2004/ 141104designedtotake.htm

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-28 0:43:25 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1591. To: war (#1587)
Post a primary source to Skilling's quote...thanks...

[4] [Seattle Times, 2/27/1993]

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-28 0:44:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1592. To: TwentyTwelve (#1591)
Don't expect me to lie...
Don't expect me to cry...
The ultimate effect of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. - Herbert Spencer
Dakmar posted on 2009-03-28 0:50:11 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1593. To: war (#1572)
Evidence of evaporated steel as reported by the New York Times:
“Engineers have been trying to figure out exactly what happened… ‘Fire and the structural damage… would not explain steel members in the debris pile that appear to have been partly evaporated’” from:
Glanz, James (2001). “Engineers are baffled over the collapse of 7 WTC; Steel members have been partly evaporated,” New York Times, November 29. 2001.

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-28 0:53:36 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1594. To: war (#1572)
Do you know that those jet fuel fires only lasted a few minutes? They did not last long enough to significantly contribute to any temperature rise of the structure. Sorry, thats shear nonsense.
From Federal Building and Fire Safety Investigation of the World Trade Center Disaster
Page 52, E.8.2 Characteristics of the Fires
The dominant fuel for the fires in the towers was the office combustables. On the floors where the aircraft fuselage impacted, there was a significant, but secondary contribution from the combustables in the aircraft. Most of the jet fuel in the fire zones was consumed in the first few minutes after impact, although there may have been unburned pockets of jet fuel that led to flare-ups late in the morning.
Page 53, E.8.3 Capability for Large Fire Reconstruction
Jet fuel sprayed onto the surfaces of typical office workstations burned away within a few minutes. The jet fuel accelerated the burning of the workstation, but did not affect the overall heat released.
Page 104, 3.2.1 Nature of Combustables
While much of the public attention has been focused on the jet fuel, most of this was combusted in only a few minutes. By contrast, typical office furnishings can sustain intense fires of at least an hour's duration on a given floor (see, e.g. Nelson 1989)

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-28 0:55:27 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1595. To: war (#1572)
A far more extensive fire occurred in WTC-1 on February 13, 1975, which burned at much higher temperatures for three hours and spread over 65% of the 11th floor, including the core, yet caused no significant damage to the steel structure and no trusses had to be replaced.

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-28 0:56:46 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1596. To: war (#1572)
www.wtc7.net/location.html
Building 7's Location
WTC 7's location Building 7 occupied a city block immediately north of the World Trade Center complex. WTC 1 through WTC 6 were on the superblock bounded by West, Church, Liberty, and Vesey Streets. Building 7 was wedged between the Verizon and U.S. Post Office buildings across Vesey Street from the WTC complex. It straddled an electrical substation that filled the first two stories of about half the block.
People who have heard of Building 7 tend to assume that 'ancillary damage' from the collapses of the Twin Towers had something to do with Building 7's collapse. It is important to note that Building 7 was no closer to the towers than any of several other large buildings outside of the WTC complex. The wall of Building 7 closest to the WTC complex was more than 300 feet from the nearest wall of the North Tower. It appears that nearly all of the heavy fallout from the disintegration of the North Tower landed short of Building 7. Building 6 stood between the North Tower and Building 7.

TwentyTwelve posted on 2009-03-28 0:58:45 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1597. To: TwentyTwelve, war (#1596)
bzzzzzt

The ultimate effect of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. - Herbert Spencer
Dakmar posted on 2009-03-28 1:03:58 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1598. To: TwentyTwelve (#1591)
Twin Towers Engineered To Withstand Jet Collision
By Eric Nalder
Engineers had to consider every peril they could imagine when they designed the World Trade Center three decades ago because, at the time, the twin towers were of unprecedented size for structures made of steel and glass.
"We looked at every possible thing we could think of that could happen to the buildings, even to the extent of an airplane hitting the side," said John Skilling, head structural engineer. "However, back in those days people didn't think about terrorists very much."
Skilling, based in Seattle, is among the world's top structural engineers. He is responsible for much of Seattle's downtown skyline and for several of the world's tallest structures, including the Trade Center.
Concerned because of a case where an airplane hit the Empire State Building, Skilling's people did an analysis that showed the towers would withstand the impact of a Boeing 707.
"Our analysis indicated the biggest problem would be the fact that all the fuel (from the airplane) would dump into the building. There would be a horrendous fire. A lot of people would be killed," he said. "The building structure would still be there."
Skilling - a recognized expert in tall buildings - doesn't think a single 200- pound car bomb would topple or do major structural damage to a Trade Center tower. The supporting columns are closely spaced and even if several were disabled, the others would carry the load.
"However," he added, "I'm not saying that properly applied explosives - shaped explosives - of that magnitude could not do a tremendous amount of damage."
He took note of the fact that smoke and fire spread throughout the building yesterday. He said that is possibly because the pressurizing system that stops the spread of smoke didn't work when the electric power went off. Skilling, 72, was not involved in the design of the building mechanics.
Although Skilling is not an explosives expert, he says there are people who do know enough about building demolition to bring a structure like the Trade Center down.
"I would imagine that if you took the top expert in that type of work and gave him the assignment of bringing these buildings down with explosives, I would bet that he could do it."
Copyright (c) 1993 Seattle Times Company, All Rights Reserved

war posted on 2009-03-28 7:18:21 ET Reply Trace Private Reply
#1599. To: TwentyTwelve (#1590)
Robertson admitted that they could not plan for how devistating the fires were. Skilling's article is posted above. Skilling's interview, posted above, doesn't seem to make his comment as cut and dry as you'd like. DeMartini was not a design engineer.

war posted on 2009-03-28 7:21:41 ET Reply Trace Private Reply

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