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Title: JFK - Shocking New Footage! Stabilized, filtered and in high definition: 05/12/2009
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Published: Jun 24, 2009
Author: youtube
Post Date: 2009-06-24 18:28:52 by Clitora
Keywords: None
Views: 2600
Comments: 77
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#38. To: christine (#37)
Probably the same thing that all of the other people saw, who were photographed standing and pointing at the infamous "grassy knoll".
yeah, you're right. jackie obviously saw something though that made her realize the shots had come from the front, not behind.
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#39. To: Elliott Jackalope, All (#2)
Agreed. It looks more like the hair/head of the man in the front passenger seat than anything else. No flash, but there is the appearance of a recoil, which looks more like the front passenger's reaction to the fatal shot. I agree there is, unfortunately, no shortage of false theories that do nothing but dilute trust and credibility in the real & credible ones. We really need to be objective and discriminating rather than believing every anti-gov, the-Fed-did-it type claim that is made. Obviously JFK was shot, and certain powers had motive. That much we can believe. But I think this video is perpetuating an illusion.
Actually, I think the "gun" you see is the reflection of the sun off of Agent Kellerman's hair. Part of the drivers "arm" appears to be the curb.
When the moment comes when the "gun" supposedly goes off, there's no muzzle flash and no recoil.
I am of the opinion that the "Greer shot JFK" theory is a classic example of a "honeypot" set out by those who seek to discredit those who question the official lie.
#40. To: randge, IndieTX (#18)
Tell the Army, it was their experiment.
Firing at a melon is not a particularly useful experiment in this case.
"The hour is fast approaching, on which the Honor and Success of this army, and the safety of our bleeding Country depend. Remember officers and Soldiers, that you are Freemen, fighting for the blessings of Liberty - that slavery will be your portion, and that of your posterity, if you do not acquit yourselves like men."
--George Washington, General Orders, August 23, 1776
#41. To: tom007 (#22)
Go shoot a pig in the head and see what happens. Say what you will. Does not matter to me. Army experiments show what I said it showed. Shoot a melon, closest thing to a human head, and it will jump towards the shot. Always.
So you kick a watermelon and it jumps at you??
"The hour is fast approaching, on which the Honor and Success of this army, and the safety of our bleeding Country depend. Remember officers and Soldiers, that you are Freemen, fighting for the blessings of Liberty - that slavery will be your portion, and that of your posterity, if you do not acquit yourselves like men."
--George Washington, General Orders, August 23, 1776
#42. To: christine (#33)
That is an interesting question. My only point was dealing with the one aspect. Army test footage shows a melon, closest thing they could get to a human head, always jumped towards the shot. The impact force from the front is not much but the blowout in the back is.
if the shot came from behind, how do you explain jackie climbing out over the trunk. she would have ducked down into the limo...unless she saw the driver shoot kennedy or realized the shots had come from the front.
"The hour is fast approaching, on which the Honor and Success of this army, and the safety of our bleeding Country depend. Remember officers and Soldiers, that you are Freemen, fighting for the blessings of Liberty - that slavery will be your portion, and that of your posterity, if you do not acquit yourselves like men."
--George Washington, General Orders, August 23, 1776
#43. To: farmfriend (#41)
The govt used cadavers for their most comprehensive ballistics testing unless they were testing ammo for use against enemy melons or trying to keep the phony Warren Commission Report alive.
Shoot a melon, closest thing to a human head, and it will jump towards the shot. Always.
#44. To: HOUNDDAWG (#43)
Whatever, this is not a hill I want to die on. I'm just reporting what I saw. You guys chose not to believe me, oh well.
The govt used cadavers for their most comprehensive ballistics testing unless they were testing ammo for use against enemy melons or trying to keep the phony Warren Commission Report alive.
"The hour is fast approaching, on which the Honor and Success of this army, and the safety of our bleeding Country depend. Remember officers and Soldiers, that you are Freemen, fighting for the blessings of Liberty - that slavery will be your portion, and that of your posterity, if you do not acquit yourselves like men."
--George Washington, General Orders, August 23, 1776
#45. To: Elliott Jackalope, christine (#38)
Probably the same thing that all of the other people saw, who were photographed standing and pointing at the infamous "grassy knoll". You may recall when discussing why people would jump to certain death from the WTC I mentioned bare fear, which by definition is the absence of all reason. Jackie didn't have to be thinking anything except that a coup was in progress and she wasn't safe seated close enough to be covered with her husband's brains and blood.....
yeah, you're right. jackie obviously saw something though that made her realize the shots had come from the front, not behind.
#46. To: HOUNDDAWG, farmfriend (#43)
Probably the best book about the shooters is Craig Roberts' "Killzone: A Sniper Looks at Dealy Plaza". Roberts was a professional sniper and trained snipers for 20 years. His analysis is pretty conclusive - there was at least a 3 way crossfire. The shots came from the front.
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
#47. To: christine (#33)
Stating it frankly, within about a half second, she went from having a pleasant drive on a sunny day to witnessing her husbands head getting blown off. People don't tend to react rationally when that sort of thing happens, and I can guarantee you she wasn't thinking about anything right about then. So her reaction, no matter what it may have been, doesn't mean a thing. There is nothing to interpret.
if the shot came from behind, how do you explain jackie climbing out over the trunk. she would have ducked down into the limo...
#48. To: Original_Intent (#46)
Roberts was a professional sniper and trained snipers for 20 years. His analysis is pretty conclusive - there was at least a 3 way crossfire. The shots came from the front. Roger that. And I already told you what Gunny Hathcock told me on the phone. He was the sniper that the FBI asked to set up the simulation and to fire Oswald's crab trap anchor of a rifle, and Hathcock said "It couldn't be done." Years ago after reading MARINE SNIPER-93 CONFIRMED KILLS I located Gunny Hathcock (93 Raff RD, Va Beach, VA) and I began calling him to ask questions about the finer points of rifle shooting. I lived in CA and I breathed, ate and slept for ways to tighten my lovingly hand loaded groups (.243 and .308) and The Gunny was all too happy to talk rifles with me. After a few months (and I was sure he knew who I was and what I was about) I asked "the question": "Gunny, did Oswald fire three shots in 6 seconds at the Kennedy motorcade?" "The FBI asked me the same question!" he replied. Gunny was the Wimbledon 1,000 yd champion in 1968 (shooting for the marines) the same year the FBI asked him to duplicate the alleged assassination scenario. And, the detail that some folks refuse to deal with is this: Oswald's rifle had a poorly mounted scope that was too low for the action (OTR or production scope bases come in at least three different heights) and it was impossible to cycle the bolt in one smooth practiced throw because of the excessive wear and play in the bolt and the fact that the fingers had to be moved to clear the scope in both directions of travel. In other words, he had to firmly grasp the bolt in order to open it on a fired and swollen brass, then reposition his fingers to clear the scope in both directions thus making it impossible to even cycle the action in the time allowed, never mind shooting it or, shooting for any attempt at accuracy! This little detail is tantamount to proving that someone didn't outrun the police in a car with only one front wheel, (and execute one of the most important if not highest paying contracts in the history of assassinations) and yet those "true believers" in the Warren Report refuse to accept the fact that it was physically impossible for Oswald to be the lone sniper at Dealey Plaza on that terrible day. And they never seem to be the slightest bit curious about why the entire establishment lined up to file off so many rough edges of the lone assassin story. TIME MAGAZINE stopped their presses and pulled some photos from the Zapruder sequence, The Commission moved the bullet wound in JFK's back 6 inches to coincide with the "magic bullet" fairie tale, and the WC never even bothered to hear the truly important testimony of witnesses, i.e. doctors describing wounds, people in the Plaza who fingered the grassy knoll, the different type of ammo in Oswald's .38 S&W caliber (.38 short-not .38 spl) revolver and in his possession at home versus the type used to kill Dallas PD Officer J.D. Tippett, etc.,.
Probably the best book about the shooters is Craig Roberts' "Killzone: A Sniper Looks at Dealy Plaza".
#49. To: farmfriend (#44)
No, I believe you. It's just that the govt has plenty of evidence that directly contradicts that melon demo, and there's only two reasons to even show such a thing: A) To see what a bullet does to a melon and B) To confuse people about the truth of the assassination of JFK. The fact that you saw fit to mention it as if it proved anything regarding the assassination means the govt was correct to cloud the issue with that footage. There are only a handful of real ballistics experts who's find any interest in the subject and none of them are likely to finger the govt as the lying murdering bastards they are for obvious reasons. Those involved in internal, external and terminal ballistics research are by definition involved with all levels of govt, and for the same reason scientists weren't too anxious to point out the big lies about the controlled demolitions on 9/11. The president of the National Fire Fighters Magazine called BS on the whole story and he lost his job so fast it was scary, and that message traveled real fast. Of course lots of FDNY firefighters have spoken about explosions and other things that don't fit, but who in the federal mafia is paying any attention? If any decide to pursue it and press for a real investigation to the media or on speaking tours then they'll get a response, alright. Would you do that? Mee neether.....
Whatever, this is not a hill I want to die on. I'm just reporting what I saw. You guys chose not to believe me, oh well.
#50. To: HOUNDDAWG (#48)
There are just too many anomalies even if one were to swallow the "Majick Bullet" Theory of Arlen, the opportunist apparatchik, Spectre. For one one of the Dallas PD Detectives first on the scene of Oswald's alleged "Sniper's Nest" identified the recovered Rifle as a Mauser - and he was both a veteran and a veteran of the European Theatre - so he knew a Mauser from a Carcano. There may have been a sniper in the Book Depository but it wasn't Oswald, and my guess is that the Carcano was later substituted in order to complete the "frame" on Oswald. As well when the Dallas PD came running into the book depository within a couple of minutes Oswald was in the second floor lounge drinking a Coke, was not winded, and not sweating. Pretty neat trick in Dallas to go from the 9th floor to the 2nd Floor in under 3 minutes, get a Coke and be nonchalantly lounging when the cops come bursting in. Many other anomalies as well as I know you are aware. Tying in with the throat and head wounds was David Lifton's research into how the autopsy was likely cooked to support the "lone nut" conspiracy theory.
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
#51. To: HOUNDDAWG (#50)
P.S. My dad shot for the Corps in '44 - Scout Sniper South Pacific. Although I still like the way my Uncle Les put it: "He could shoot the hair out of frog's ass at 50 yards with a "Peep Sight".
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
#52. To: Clitora (#23)
I don't know. I'm glad you liked it.
Who is the agent who calls them off? that is an interesting vid.
"If I were going to construct a God I would furnish him with some ways and qualities and characteristics which the Present One lacks... He would spend some of His eternities in trying to forgive Himself for making man unhappy when He could have made him happy with the same effort and He would spend the rest of them in studying astronomy." ~ Mark Twain
#53. To: Original_Intent (#50)
He also worked in a gun shop part time. I wasn't there of course but, I'd bet a fist full of Krugerrands that a TX police officer and a military vet/firearms enthusiast with his experience and under those tragic circs would have been well aware of the historical and evidential importance of his observations and that he'd never mistake a MODEL 1938 Mannlicher Carcano carbine for any model of a Mauser. Either of those rifles would have stamped nomenclature on the receivers/barrels and there would have been no reason for anyone to make such a mistake. More than likely the rifle was swapped for the one mail ordered by "O.H. Lee" which of course means the Dallas PD was involved up to their anti commie necks in the frame up. Considering how they removed their experienced police dispatcher from duty after she received an unexplained invitation to hear Kennedy speak, and how easily Jack Ruby gained access and a clear shot at Patsy Oswald, I don't have any problem believing that the cops, The Hunt Bros, LBJ, the CIA and half the state of Texas were happy to pitch in and kill that nigger luvin' Yankee Catholicker who screwed the invasion forces at El Bayo De Cochinos.
For one one of the Dallas PD Detectives first on the scene of Oswald's alleged "Sniper's Nest" identified the recovered Rifle as a Mauser - and he was both a veteran and a veteran of the European Theatre - so he knew a Mauser from a Carcano. There may have been a sniper in the Book Depository but it wasn't Oswald, and my guess is that the Carcano was later substituted in order to complete the "frame" on Oswald.
#54. To: Original_Intent (#51)
Although I still like the way my Uncle Les put it: "He could shoot the hair out of frog's ass at 50 yards with a "Peep Sight". I remember that! He actually got to shoot some of them little nips, too! A man's man!
P.S. My dad shot for the Corps in '44 - Scout Sniper South Pacific.
#55. To: farmfriend (#44)
In any case I meant no offense and I apologize for any unintended. Please forgive.
#56. To: bush_is_a_moonie (#35)
Wow. Just wow. This israeli menace has destroyed the us and the arab world. Israel is nothing but a pox on the planet.
CIA manager was Bush Sr. and that Bush and the CIA were not happy with JFK trying to force Israel to come clean on their nuclear weapons operations/manufacturing.
“Some say that the age of chivalry is past, that the spirit of romance is dead. The age of chivalry is never past, so long as there is a wrong left unredressed on earth.” Charles Kingsley
#57. To: HOUNDDAWG (#36)
that is not logical. Connelly always said he did not want to talk about it. It is easy to silence someone forever with the knowledge they can be taken out.
And if the driver killed JFK (it would logically follow that) he (or others) would have been obligated to kill the governor and the first lady.
“Some say that the age of chivalry is past, that the spirit of romance is dead. The age of chivalry is never past, so long as there is a wrong left unredressed on earth.” Charles Kingsley
#58. To: Original_Intent (#46)
His analysis is pretty conclusive - there was at least a 3 way crossfire. I agree--JFK was triangulated. The shots came from the front. Disagree here, though. Shot one: From straight behind street level. Hit JFK in the back and exited his throat. Frame 218 or so. Shot two, a little over one second later: From above back right--an upper floor of the book depository (missed JFK and hit Connally). Frame 238. Shot three, about 4.1 seconds later: From street level front right (grassy knoll area) hit JFK i the middle right forehead. Frame 313.
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#59. To: HOUNDDAWG, tom007 (#55)
Please forgive. No offense taken sweety. As tom007 said earlier in the thread, debate amongst friends.
In any case I meant no offense and I apologize for any unintended.
"The hour is fast approaching, on which the Honor and Success of this army, and the safety of our bleeding Country depend. Remember officers and Soldiers, that you are Freemen, fighting for the blessings of Liberty - that slavery will be your portion, and that of your posterity, if you do not acquit yourselves like men."
--George Washington, General Orders, August 23, 1776
#60. To: christine, All (#34)
honestly, i can't see a damn thing except that the driver is turned around looking at kennedy. i can't tell where his hands are. what do you see? As HOUNDDAWG noted, the agent's left hand, the one that the posted video suggests is wielding a gun, is on the arm rest. The gun is some object that I can't identify that seems to be associated with the head of the agent in the passenger seat and seems to be in motion with the head as it moves from frame to frame. As far as the shot from the front or the rear goes, having shot blown a number things to bits with rifles and handguns, I draw this conclusion from looking at this frame. The angle formed by the tissue, nearly 180 degrees, suggests a shot from the front. If this had been a shot from the rear, there would have been a much narrower cone of matter issuing from the exit wound. A large portion of the parietal area of the the skull is blasted back exposing that area of the brain, which is evident is subsequent frames. Also noteworthy is the fact that with a frontal impact, there is no exit wound. A rear shot from, say the Book Depository Building, would have to cover about 90 yards. A medium caliber rifle, which was used here according to bullets recovered, would have lost a lot of momentum by the time it found its target. To create this kind of damage with in this range of calibers, I think that a near point-blank range would be required.
You will get a different perspective on the "gun," the agent's "hand" and head.
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#61. To: Clitora (#32)
lunacy, pure and simple.
you are aware that he was wearing a brace that would have caused a change in the laws of thermodynamics?
"Satan / Cheney in "08" 
#62. To: wbales (#27)
Yeppers. Our government has been held in thrall by the shadows - and even the presidents aren't exactly sure who and where they are.
In my opinion a cabal of divergent interests came together to kill JFK and then cover it up. In November 1963, there was a coup d’etat .
"Satan / Cheney in "08"
#63. To: Original_Intent (#46)
The definitive book about the assasination. The best. I'm surprised it's not banned..
Probably the best book about the shooters is Craig Roberts' "Killzone: A Sniper Looks at Dealy Plaza".
#64. To: tom007 (#61)
oh. So he wasn't wearing a brace?
lunacy, pure and simple.
“Some say that the age of chivalry is past, that the spirit of romance is dead. The age of chivalry is never past, so long as there is a wrong left unredressed on earth.” Charles Kingsley
#65. To: Original_Intent (#50)
There is not 9 floors in that building, only 6 floors..
9th floor to the 2nd Floor
#66. To: randge (#60)
thanks, randge. my conclusion is tht kennedy indeed was shot from the front, but i don't think it was by the driver. i also must conclude that he was, however, InOnIt.
The smooth criminal transition from Bush/Cheney to Obama
#67. To: christine (#66)
I have to go to work, but somewhere I have a chart that shows the calculated speed of the Lincoln, frame by frame. You can see that he slows down for the head shot. Will post.
i also must conclude that he was, however, InOnIt.
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#68. To: HOUNDDAWG (#53)
He was a mick.
I don't have any problem believing that the cops, The Hunt Bros, LBJ, the CIA and half the state of Texas were happy to pitch in and kill that nigger luvin' Yankee Catholicker who screwed the invasion forces at El Bayo De Cochinos.
“Some say that the age of chivalry is past, that the spirit of romance is dead. The age of chivalry is never past, so long as there is a wrong left unredressed on earth.” Charles Kingsley
#69. To: Lady X (#65)
You are right. I stand corrected. I was tired and mis-remembered.
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
#70. To: Clitora (#0)
That is a reflection off the top of the passengers head/hair.
#71. To: maxbluto, christine, Clitora (#70)
That's apparent from many online versions of the Zapruder film online. Incidentally, here's a comparison of limousine speed and corresponidng Zapruder frames. MPH Z-frame http://imgcash2.imageshack.us/img160/7642/dpjpg110508mb6.gif
That is a reflection off the top of the passengers head/hair.
12.2 260
11.6 272
11.2 284
9.8 296
9.7 308
8.9 314 (headshot)
8.3 320
8.8 335
9.3 341
11.3 347
13.2 356
14.4 362
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#72. To: randge (#71)
I bet SS are trained to slow down that way. I mean, the guy driving couldn't have known or had anything to do with the assination. No siree bob. He is a spring chicken. A virgin.
“Some say that the age of chivalry is past, that the spirit of romance is dead. The age of chivalry is never past, so long as there is a wrong left unredressed on earth.” Charles Kingsley
#73. To: Clitora (#57)
Connelly always said he did not want to talk about it. It is easy to silence someone forever with the knowledge they can be taken out. "Easy" you say? Then why did 22 other material witnesses (not including Oswald or Ruby) die under highly suspicious circumstances? According to your "expert theory" that shouldn't have been necessary at all and it should have been "easy" to silence them with a mere warning of the consequences if they spoke of what they saw. Logic isn't your strength I see.
that is not logical.
#74. To: farmfriend (#59)
Very good and thank you.
As tom007 said earlier in the thread, debate amongst friends.
#75. To: christine (#66)
He stopped the vehicle which was certainly not what he was trained to do. And, a supervisor pulled the agents away from the limo shortly before the shooting thereby exposing the president and minimizing the risk of agents being shot. I can only wonder how the presidential protective detail of the US Secret Service were enlisted to assist in this coup and just what is was they believed JFK had done to deserve such a fate. I have to wonder because the Warren Commission never asked these or any other relevant questions.
thanks, randge. my conclusion is tht kennedy indeed was shot from the front, but i don't think it was by the driver. i also must conclude that he was, however, InOnIt.
#76. To: HOUNDDAWG (#73)
Logic isn't your strength I see. -Yawn- It is far easier to keep someone who is in politics silent. Happens every day with black mail and what have you. Far harder to black mail a bunch of pedesterians, so I bet they just killed them. That seems logical to me, and I remember hearing a tape recording of connely talking about how he didn't want to talk about the assination. Perhaps you need to double check on what logic is?
According to your "expert theory" that shouldn't have been necessary at all and it should have been "easy" to silence them with a mere warning of the consequences if they spoke of what they saw.
“Some say that the age of chivalry is past, that the spirit of romance is dead. The age of chivalry is never past, so long as there is a wrong left unredressed on earth.” Charles Kingsley
#77. To: HOUNDDAWG, christine, all (#75)
Among other unsettling details that have been well attested to, they were out late drinking the night before the assassination. They were in on it, but certainly not on the level of conspiracy. There actions were directed by other forces. Mordechai Vanunu endorses Michael Collins Piper's argument that the momentum for the assassination had its origin in Israel. The Howard Hunt team from what I gather was a decoy team that could have taken the heat if things went south with an investigation. It's not unlikely that Hunt thought warning shots would be fired that day to send JFK a message. but i don't think it was by the driver. i also must conclude that he was, however, InOnIt.
Final Judgment’s case in this regard is principally built on the key significance of Meyer Lansky as the real power player in American organized crime in the 1950s and 1960s, the superior of Giancana, Roselli, Marcello, Mickey Cohen, Mickey Weiner, Moe Dalitz, Frank Costello, and others previously mentioned as participants in the Kennedy conspiracy. In turn, Lansky’s role as a committed Zionist and fund-raiser for the State of Israel involved direct, palpable links between his criminal empire, his Miami-based banks, and the Banque de Credit International (BCI) in Geneva, Switzerland. This latter entity served as the European-based money laundering center for Mr. Lansky’s global activities. BCI in turn, was headed up by an Israeli banker, Tibor Rosenbaum, former Director for Finances and Supply for the Israeli Mossad. Piper then demonstrates that BCI was a chief share holder in a Rome-based corporation called CMC/Permindex, whose chairman of the board was none other than Louis M. Bloomfield of Montreal, Canada, a major fund-raiser for Israel and known asset for Israeli intelligence. CMC/Permindex, in turn, proves to be a major point of intersection which brings the shadowy Bloomfield into direct or indirect contact with Clay Shaw (the chief target of the Jim Garrison JFK investigation in New Orleans), Guy Banister, James Jesus Angleton, FBI Division 5 chief William Sullivan (who spearheaded the FBI investigation for the Warren Commission and served as FBI liaison and friend of Angleton), ex-Cuban President Carlos Prio Socarras (provable gun-running business partner of Oswald assassin Jack Ruby), Ernest Israel Japhet (chairman and president of Israeli Bank Leumi), Shaul Eisenberg (a key figure in Israel’s nuclear bomb development and participant with Rosenbaum in the Swiss-Israel Trade Bank), elements of the French nationalist Secret Army Organization (OAS), CIA agent Theodore Shackley (the CIA’s chief of station in Miami during the CIA-Lansky assassination plots against Fidel Castro), and Abe Feinberg, New York Jewish businessman used by Ben Gurion as the liaison for secret meetings with President Kennedy to resolve the dispute of the latter two over Dimona. It is thus the BCI and CMC/Permindex players and links which Piper employs to show that the players, alliances, and assets were firmly in place to bring those with motive, means, and opportunity together in a plot which culminated in Dallas.
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