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Title: Magnetic forces to blame for 9/11 tower collapse
Source:
The Independent
URL Source: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/s ... 911-tower-collapse-924509.html
Published: Jul 24, 2009
Author: Steve Connor
Post Date: 2009-07-24 16:54:32 by Lysander_Spooner
Keywords: None
Views: 1400
Comments: 119
Magnetic forces to blame for 9/11 tower collapse By Steve Connor Wednesday, 10 September 2008 Scientists can finally explain why the Twin Towers collapsed on September 11, despite the temperature of the fires being well below the 1,500C melting point of the steel girders holding up the buildings. The discovery that unusual magnetic forces within the girders made them weak at temperatures of about 500C explains away the conspiracy theories that have spread like wildfire since the disaster. Sergei Dudarev, of the UK Atomic Energy Agency, found that steel loses its strength above 500C because its molecules undergo a physical transition from one state to another due to magnetic fluctuations. "The steel didn't melt, it just became soft. It is an unusual state and the temperatures in the Twin Towers were high enough to cause it because the thermal insulation was knocked off the girders through the impact with the aircraft," he said. "Understanding how materials behave means we can find the right 'medicine' to make steel stronger at high temperatures... and if our work can be used for other applications, such as safeguarding tall buildings against disasters, so much the better," he said.
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#6. To: Lysander_Spooner (#0)
$#it, the best thing, and one we need to be getting done, is evacuating all these death traps that can be taken down by a bit of kerosene.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. With respect, Shoonra, go fuck yourself. Not only did we see Building 7 burn to a crisp on that ill-fated day, but a number of very significant highrise conflagrations have also transpired since then to demonstrate quite clearly that modern steel construction does not suffer catastrophic disintegration from fire alone. And be gone, you foul spirit. Hence to your master.
Join 2x4 Tuesdays & protect your RKBA. But in fairness 7 probably got splashed with a couple of gallons of Magickal Jet Fuel. Must not have made but one small batch of it, just enough to fuel the planes that took out the buildings of the WTC. I hope they never make any more of it, that $#it is more dangerous than nukes!
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. Credit for illustration: deesillustration.com
The technology of our reckless globalist assassins evolves apace. It was not long ago that these swine depended on the magic bullet to do their sordid work of destroying our lives and our institutions. Now they have magic jet fuel with which they can commit not just one murder at a time, but thousands at a stroke.
Join 2x4 Tuesdays & protect your RKBA. Yeah, and then they have their stoolies, sycophants, and assorted ne'er-do-wells to parrot the party line and tell us how the government is never wrong and has never knowingly harmed anyone. America is making its last spin around the bowl or at least that is how it seems.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. There will be blood.
Join 2x4 Tuesdays & protect your RKBA. Does your frying pan turn to silly putty when you fry an egg? And, by the way, some nut started the story of a pool of molten steel at Ground Zero, still liquid days after the collapse. Simply impossible. BTW, what do you think these images indicate? Click on image below for video; Destro's wet noodle theory! ;)
Tell that to the NYC News Crew that filmed the firefighters pulling red hot steel out of the rubble 6 WEEKS after the towers collapsed. Let me repeat that in the event you are reading challenged a NYC News Crew filmed the firefighters pulling red hot steel out of the rubble 6 WEEKS after the towers collapsed. As well the molten pools of red hot metal were reported by knowledgable individuals. Here is one of the videos: Molten Steel 8 WEEKS after Towers Collapse. Archives on What Really Happened - including video documentation
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
OI, you need to fix that link, it's pointing to 4um and doesn't work.
Ping.
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
Will do.
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
I wrote the link and then forgot to paste in the URL. Oops! "I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
Good gawd! The PERPS are gettin' desperate! Israel will go to whatever length it thinks necessary, no matter how NUTTY, to try to deflect attention (which is growing each day) away from THEMSELVES and their EVIL paranoia. Watch for more NUTJOB 'stories' to spring up from the four corners as they attempt with futility to cover their tracks... Wonder how they'll screw with all that molten steel? Yes, the 'jewish' life is one of perpetual drama and shenanigans. They're "Chosen" to always 'get the pass.' Glad. Very glad to be an ex!
Forging temperature is a temperature at which a metal becomes soft like clay or its shape can be changed by applying a relatively small force without creating cracks in metal. Chart for forging Temperature: Material Celsius Fahrenheit Retrieved from "en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fo rging_temperature"
Join 2x4 Tuesdays & protect your RKBA. Being raised in a steel mill town, I have known since I was a kid that steel quickly loses its strength when heated. It's why I laugh at the ignoramuses who in their ignorance babble about remote-controlled planes and explosives in the WTC.
And so Jeenyus you can explain to us the exact mechanism which produced sufficient heat to bring down the towers (despite the fact that FEMA and NIST have been unable to do so). Hint: Only 2 of the 3 Towers were hit by planes, and the fires were limited in extent to several floors. Your job is to: A. Explain in detail (show your work) how the heat was generated. B. Explain in detail how it caused a uniform failure in the structure in a 360 degree radius thus initiating a collapse identical to what one would see in a controlled demolition. C. Explain in detail the exact physical mechanism which resulted in there being near molten debris after 8 WEEKS. Get back to us when you've got it all nailed down jeenyus.
"I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
For the record, I meant to say Building 5 in the post above. Join 2x4 Tuesdays & protect your RKBA. All the steel didn't heat at the same rate. If the steel got weak at one point it would have fallen over instead of pancaking. Add that to the reports of firemen of bombs being in building. Add the fact tha it fell at freefall speeds without resistance from the floors belown. Add to the fact that the building that got hit with more fuel took longer to "collapse. It doesn't add up.
Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson
It will be repeated again and again, as often as necessary, that it takes quite nearly twice the heat of a building fire to weaken construction steel to the point of catastrophic failure. Look at fires that destroyed Building 5 as well as high rise towers in Madrid, Bogota and Beijing in recent years. All of these structures were totaled due to fire, and all of them were left standing.
Join 2x4 Tuesdays & protect your RKBA. Repeat as often as needed. It takes longer with some folks. Turtle, you know I think you're ok but you're off base on this thing. Don't be taken in by the government's stupid claim that Magickal Jet Fuel got hot enough to make not just one, not just two, but THREE steel skyscrapers collapse in what appeared to be a controlled demolition. Add that to the fact that no other such building(s) ever collapsed before 9/11 or since then due to fire. The government's fairy tale doesn't hold water.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. Never scientifically proven or reproduced.
Mark If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
Pure speculation. Many, many witnesses reported molten iron or metal at the WTC. The $20 million NIST study presents not one piece of core steel showing heating above 480 degrees F--no physical evidence to support the claim that high temperature fires weakened the steel. Other factors brought down WTC 1,2 and 7. Office fires were not the cause.
Mark If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
So how did it(the steel) explode and what produced the pyroclastic flow ?
Sorry Turtle, you are right on some things but not this one. Yes, steel when heated loses strength, but does not explode, disintigrate and create pyroclastic flow. "ignoramuses", neat, I guess I am one with a double degree in Physics and Chemistry and Doctoral degree in Medicine. UR just way off on this one Turtle.
gotta love the wet noodle theory. ;P and how the hell does that explain the explosive pulverization and the free fall speed? if the steel had simply weakened, the buildings would have been standing. can you believe these dolts are still advancing that bs?
Like what? Turtle is consistantly wrong.
"This is suspicious at best. Sounds like a bunch of nutty conspiracy theorists, or, as others have pointed out, a government program to find nutty conspiracy theorists who could be dangerous."
Magickal jet fuel...whooooo hooooo hhooooooo...watch out for the magickal jet fuel...
"This is suspicious at best. Sounds like a bunch of nutty conspiracy theorists, or, as others have pointed out, a government program to find nutty conspiracy theorists who could be dangerous."
Turtle soup is tasty, yum !
I normally would not eat turtle soup, but in his case I can make a concession...
"This is suspicious at best. Sounds like a bunch of nutty conspiracy theorists, or, as others have pointed out, a government program to find nutty conspiracy theorists who could be dangerous."
A. Explain in detail (show your work) how the heat was generated. B. Explain in detail how it caused a uniform failure in the structure in a 360 degree radius thus initiating a collapse identical to what one would see in a controlled demolition. C. Explain in detail the exact physical mechanism which resulted in there being near molten debris after 8 WEEKS. Get back to us when you've got it all nailed down jeenyus. Turtle?
Tell that to the NYC News Crew that filmed the firefighters pulling red hot steel out of the rubble 6 WEEKS after the towers collapsed. Let me repeat that in the event you are reading challenged a NYC News Crew filmed the firefighters pulling red hot steel out of the rubble 6 WEEKS after the towers collapsed. As well the molten pools of red hot metal were reported by knowledgable individuals. Here is one of the videos: Molten Steel 8 WEEKS after Towers Collapse. Archives on What Really Happened - including video documentation "I think the subject which will be of most importance politically is Mass Psychology...It's importance has been enormously increased by the growth of modern methods of propaganda...Although this science will be diligently studied, it will be rigidly confined to the governing class. The populace will not be allowed to know how its convictions were generated." Bertrand Russel, Eugenicist and Logician
According to the Journal of Australian Fire Investigators, kerosene ignites at around 444°F. The temperature that the fire will eventually reach depends on both the combustion rate (based on O2) and the rate at which heat can be disbursed in the given scenario. Again, any firefighter can explain from experience and training that the black, sooty smoke (like that found on 9/11 at the WTC towers) were O2 deprived. Again, please contact professionals to verify this if you wish. In an oxygen deprived environment, higher temperatures cannot be reached. You can test this yourself by comparing a match in the open vs. a match in a bottle with a very small hole. T.C. Forensic: Article 10 - PHYSICAL CONSTANTS FOR INVESTIGATORS
TAKE A LOOK AT THESE PICTURES OF THE BUILDINGS ON FIRE!
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/911_reichstag.html The 9/11 Reichstag Fire Reichstag Fire Reichstag fire, burning of the Reichstag (parliament) building in Berlin, on the night of Feb. 27, 1933, a key event in the establishment of the Nazi dictatorship and widely believed to have been contrived by the newly formed Nazi government itself to turn public opinion against its opponents and to assume emergency powers ... his propaganda minister, Joseph Goebbels, is supposed to have devised the scheme. ... On Feb. 28, 1933, the day after the fire, Hitler's dictatorship began with the enactment of a decree "for the Protection of the People and the State," which dispensed with all constitutional protection of political, personal, and property rights. Encyclopaedia Britannica Excerpt from History Channel documentary detailing evidence of Hitler's supporters burning down the Reichstag in 1933 5.6 MB RealMedia video The Reichstag fire was a disaster for Communists because they received the blame for starting it, but it was a dream come true for Hitler and his cohorts as it allowed them to turn Germany into a dictatorship. Did the Bush administration try the same trick on September 11, 2001? The victims of the 9/11 attacks have been disaster for Muslims because 19 Arabs were named as hijackers of the planes, but they've been a dream come true for the PNAC 'think-tank' whose 2000 Statement of Principles stated a "catastrophic and catalyzing event, like a new Pearl Harbor" would advance their policies, i.e. justify wars and "regime changes". "This is about control over Middle East oil. [The Statement of Principles] indicates that America is aiming for global leadership, both military and economically..." - Michael Meacher, UK MP WMV video download (831kB) The fact that Pearl Harbor was engineered by the US government to bring America into WWII would have been known by PNAC signatories... 10 [PNAC members] are now in the Bush administration. As well as Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz, they include Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage; John Bolton, who is undersecretary of state for disarmament; and Zalmay Khalilzad, the White House liaison to the Iraqi opposition. Other signatories include William Kristol, editor of the conservative Weekly Standard magazine, and Richard Perle, chairman of the advisory Defense Science Board. [ABC News 3/10/2003] ...so their statement actually referred to policy advancement through a governmentally orchestrated "catastrophic and catalyzing event" - Operation Northwoods is an example of this thinking. The "new Pearl Harbor" occurred on 9/11... Like his father, Bush tries to keep a daily diary of his thoughts and observations. That night, he dictated: "The Pearl Harbor of the 21st century took place today." [Washington Post] ...and now wars and "regime changes" are justified by the events of that day: U.S. President George W Bush ... defended the war in Iraq, telling Americans the United States was forced into war because of the Sept 11 terror strikes. [Japan Today 17/06/05] "The Pearl Harbor of the 21st century" effectively thrust PNAC's radical ideas to the fore... The terror attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, and concerns that another similar attack might follow, gave Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld "a tremendous sense of urgency" in pushing his transformation effort ... . Rumsfeld said ... the Sept. 11 attacks underscored the importance of the transformation program he announced Sept. 10, 2001. [American Forces Press Service] ...so were the events of 9/11 governmentally orchestrated? "In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way." - Franklin D. Roosevelt There were many exercises prior to 9/11 which related specifically to the events of that day: NORAD conducted exercises with fighter jets simulating hijacked planes flown into the World Trade Center in the two years before the attacks. Pentagon planners also envisioned the attack on the Pentagon five months before it happened. WMV video download (936kB) On June 2, 2001 PNAC signatory Paul Wolfowitz predicted a military surprise: "Military history is full of surprises, even if few are as dramatic or memorable as Pearl Harbor. Surprises happen so often, that is is surprising that we're still surprised by it. ... Be prepared to be surprised. Have courage." [defenselink.mil] From July 26, 2001 John Ashcroft stopped traveling on commercial airlines: In response to inquiries from CBS News over why Ashcroft was traveling exclusively by leased jet aircraft instead of commercial airlines, the Justice Department cited what it called a "threat assessment" by the FBI, and said Ashcroft has been advised to travel only by private jet for the remainder of his term. [CBS News] World Trade Center staff received evacuation drills prior to 9/11: Ben Fountain, 42, a financial analyst with Fireman's Fund, was coming out of the Chambers Street Station, headed for his office on the 47th floor of the south tower. "How could they let this happen? They knew this building was a target. Over the past few weeks we'd been evacuated a number of times, which is unusual. I think they had an inkling something was going on." [People] On September 10 top Pentagon officials were compelled to cancel travel plans: On Sept. 10, NEWSWEEK has learned, a group of top Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel plans for the next morning, apparently because of security concerns. [MSNBC 9/24/2001] Also on September 10 Willie Brown, the former Mayor of San Francisco, was warned about air travel: Brown received a warning about 10 PM on the evening of September 10 to be cautious about air travel. He was scheduled to fly to into New York City. Brown refuses to say exactly who gave him the prescient warning, citing only "my security people at the airport." [SFGate 9/12/2001] President Bush's cousin had a fortunate change of venue for a September 11 business conference: President Bush's cousin should have been in the World Trade Centre when it was attacked. Jim Pierce, managing director of AON Corporations, had arranged a business conference on the 105th floor of the South Tower where its New York offices were based. But his group was too large so they decided to move across the street to the Millennium Hotel. [Annova] An imminent attack was forecast... "The Director of the CIA warned that there could be an attack—an imminent attack—on the United States of this nature. So this is not entirely unexpected." [Memory Hole] ...maybe that's why FEMA was in New York on September 10. Last, but not least, the timing of the 9/11 attacks was a "Godsend" for the Bush Administration. I guess the above may be seen as coincidences, but why did planes flying into buildings prompt White House staff to start taking Cipro? In October [2001], press reports revealed that White House staff had been on a regimen of the powerful antibiotic Cipro since the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks. Judicial Watch wants to know why White House workers, including President Bush, began taking the drug nearly a month before anthrax was detected on Capitol Hill. [WorldNetDaily]
I hear crickets. .
Any backyard griller can tell you that their grills never collapse to the ground at free fall speed despite grilling all day. Government stooges like you have a special place reserved for you in hell.
God is always good!
Wow, I must have made an impression for you to ping me so long after and I am sorry of replying to a post from July...... It is a fact steel does weaken when heated. I think I asked you blokes once if steel was not weakened by fire why is it fire proofed? I think one of you stated it was an insurance scam as a reply - I hope who ever it was was kidding but maybe not. Gore Vidal sums up my attitude best on 9/11 per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gore_Vidal: In May 2007, Vidal clarified his views, saying: I'm not a conspiracy theorist, I'm a conspiracy analyst. Everything the Bushites touch is screwed up. They could never have pulled off 9/11, even if they wanted to. Even if they longed to. They could step aside, though, or just go out to lunch while these terrible things were happening to the nation. I believe that of them. Stepping aside.....allowing the act to happen. In groups behind the 'Project for a New American Century' stated that they longed for a 'Pearl Harbor' like event to galvanize their agenda forward. Pearl Harbor like even is key - allow yourself to be attacked thus justifying interventionism. Not carrying out or micro-managing but just stepping aside and letting the hit happen. If that is what happened it is a lot easier to accept as a scenario than the ultra complicated and ultra involved theory that floors upon floors upon floors of high rise towers in Manhattan were mined by explosives weeks ahead of time (if not months) carried out by the gang that could not shoot straight. I really don't know what in a person's psyche needs for them to accept that complicated scenario to the point they become enraged that it could be any other kind of conspiracy like the one Gore Vidal contemplates.
"We have oil. We have Putin - all that Russians think they need." - Vladimir Dubin, senior researcher at the Moscow-based Levada Centre.
i could accept that scenario if it were not obvious that both towers exploded in plumes with everything pulverized. that could not happen from fire and weakened steel and collapsing of floor upon floor. and that's all i've got to say as i have no desire to get into another 911 debate with you. ;)
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Lord Acton
#7. To: Shoonra (#5)
www.righttokeepandbeararms.com
#8. To: randge (#7)
Not only did we see Building 7 burn to a crisp on that ill-fated day, but a number of very significant highrise conflagrations have also transpired since then to demonstrate quite clearly that modern steel construction does not suffer catastrophic disintegration from fire alone.
Lord Acton
#9. To: Shoonra (#5)
#10. To: Shoonra (#5)
#11. To: James Deffenbach (#8)
www.righttokeepandbeararms.com
#12. To: randge (#11)
Lord Acton
#13. To: James Deffenbach (#12)
www.righttokeepandbeararms.com
#14. To: Shoonra (#5)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#15. To: Lysander_Spooner, Kamala, Destro (#0)
#16. To: Shoonra, TwentyTwelve, Wudidiz, christine, all (#5)
(Edited)
And, by the way, some nut started the story of a pool of molten steel at Ground Zero, still liquid days after the collapse. Simply impossible.
#17. To: Original_Intent (#16)
Here is one of the videos: Molten Steel 8 WEEKS after Towers Collapse. Archives on What Really Happened - including video documentation
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#18. To: randge, Lysander Spooner, FormerLurker, IndieTX, all (#16)
#19. To: FormerLurker (#17)
#20. To: FormerLurker (#17)
#21. To: FormerLurker (#17)
Here is one of the videos: Molten Steel 8 WEEKS after Towers Collapse. Archives on What Really Happened - including video documentation
#22. To: FormerLurker, Original_Intent, James Deffenbach, Shoonra, TwentyTwelve, Wudidiz, christine, , all (#14)
Carbon steel 1230 2246
Stainless steel (Magnetic) 1095 2003
Stainless steel (Nonmagnetic) 1150 2102
Nickel 1095 2003
Titanium 955 1751
Copper 900 1652
Brass 815 1499
Aluminium 540 1004
www.righttokeepandbeararms.com
#23. To: Lysander_Spooner (#0)
There's no place better thanTurtle Island.
#24. To: Turdle, Turtle, christine, FormerLurker, Wudidiz, TwentyTwelve, all (#23)
(Edited)
#25. To: All (#7)
Not only did we see Building 7 burn to a crisp
www.righttokeepandbeararms.com
#26. To: Turtle (#23)
Being raised in a steel mill town, I have known since I was a kid that steel quickly loses its strength when heated. It's why I laugh at the ignoramuses who in their ignorance babble about remote-controlled planes and explosives in the WTC.
#27. To: Turtle (#23)
(Edited)
www.righttokeepandbeararms.com
#28. To: randge, Turtle (#27)
It will be repeated again and again, as often as necessaary
Lord Acton
#29. To: Lysander_Spooner (#0)
....It is an unusual state and the temperatures in the Twin Towers were high enough to cause it because the thermal insulation was knocked off the girders through the impact with the aircraft," he said....
#30. To: Shoonra (#5)
.....What was seen was a greyish puddle of a variety of fluids, including water, paint, melted plastic, various industrial liquids, that had mixed together from the fire, collapse and fire fighting efforts at the WTC......
#31. To: Shoonra (#5)
Any blacksmith can tell you that when heated at temperatures well below the level produced in the WTC fires, steel and iron weaken and become malleable.
#32. To: Turtle (#23)
(Edited)
steel quickly loses its strength when heated
#33. To: Kamala (#30)
(Edited)
#34. To: Lysander_Spooner (#32)
Sorry Turtle, you are right on some things but not this one.
#35. To: James Deffenbach (#6)
#36. To: Clitora (#34)
Like what?
#37. To: Lysander_Spooner (#36)
(Edited)
Turtle soup is tasty, yum !
#38. To: Original_Intent, Turtle (#24)
Your job is to:
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#39. To: Shoonra, TwentyTwelve, Wudidiz, christine, all (#16)
And, by the way, some nut started the story of a pool of molten steel at Ground Zero, still liquid days after the collapse. Simply impossible.
#40. To: Shoonra (#5)
PHYSICAL CONSTANTS FOR INVESTIGATORS. by Tony Cafe. Reproduced from "Firepiont" magazine - Journal of Australian Fire Investigators. ...
www.tcforensic.com.au/docs/article10.html - 69k -
#41. To: Shoonra (#5)
#42. To: Shoonra (#5)
#43. To: Original_Intent, Shoonra, TwentyTwelve, christine, all (#39)
***** Crickets! *****
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#44. To: Shoonra (#5)
#45. To: christine, Lysander_Spooner, Kamala, randge (#15)
Destro's wet noodle theory! ;)
#46. To: Destro (#45)
(Edited)
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