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Title: What happens when it gets cold and there isn't enough energy?
Source:
examiner.com
URL Source: http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x- ... d-and-there-isnt-enough-energy
Published: Sep 10, 2009
Author: Kirtland Griffin
Post Date: 2009-09-10 15:11:02 by farmfriend
Ping List: *Agriculture-Environment* Subscribe to *Agriculture-Environment*
Keywords: None
Views: 479
Comments: 45
September 9, 10:32 PM Seems that every day you read about how successful the environmentalists have been at stopping a coal fired plant, a hydroelectric dam, or a nuclear reactor in favor of unreliable wind and solar power. This brings up a serious question, one that I would like to hear an answer from the enviros, politicians and others who are either preventing the building of these facilities or profiting from the alternatives. This would, of course, include our Connecticut governor and the entire Connecticut legislature that unanimously passed the climate bill requiring an 80% cut in carbon emissions by 2050. Throw in the entire Department of Environmental Protection while we are at it. They too are complicit. The scenario is that the Sun, as it proceeds toward the barycenter of the solar system, and slows to half its former velocity, with a fraction of its former intensity, will result in the predictions you have read here of a long deep cold spell. Some say the spell could last 30 years. Others have predicted 100 years and at least one has suggested 300 years is not out of the question and maybe even more. If this scenario plays out in concert with the environmentalists penchant for stopping every new source of power, other than wind, solar and bio-fuels, there is an extreme likelihood we will not have sufficient power to heat our homes and power our factories. There will be shortages of critical commodities. Farming will be out of the question in most of the temperate areas. Food shortages will be everywhere and starving people, and animals too, will be common even in the most affluent countries. It won't necessarily be about money. There won't be any food. There won't be any energy. There won't be any warmth, period! So the question I ask of all these people who played on our fears of man-made global warming and duped the public into accepting these draconian measures for a scam, supported by the scantiest of nebulous evidence, perpetrated, at least in a significant part, by the UN, is this. When the power sources that could have been built, but for your inane scheme, are not available along with the power that they would have produced, and will all of you self righteous opportunists who sold your souls to the UN step aside and allow those who played no part in the scam to have the available power and food? I think all we know the answer to that question. Fat Chance! But don't worry. They'll take care of you. And that's what I am worried about.
What happens when it gets cold and there isn't enough energy?
New Haven County Environmental Policy Examiner
Kirtland Griffin
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#6. To: farmfriend, SonOfLiberty, randge (#0)
If a free human being doesn't want a coal fired power plant to rain down mercury in their area, or a hydroelectric dam build to destroy their river, or a nuclear reactor that will leak and cause birth defects, then that is your fault. Instead of attacking those with whom you disagree like puppets pulling your own strings, why don't you get a clue and do something about the Millitary Industrial Complex that is hiding the technology that could free US ALL! You people are selfish jerks and make me want to join the NWO in putting you into cattle cars.
http://kaygriggs.blogspot.com/ On freedom4um.com, Alex Jones is more dangerous than Henry Kissinger. May you live in interesting times.
You expect me to answer you, after you just called me a selfish jerk and proclaimed that you want to put me into a cattle car? If you want civil discussion, you're going to have to try it the non-Obama way, and start out conversations with me in a civil manner.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
That's change I can believe in!
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
If you want civil discussion, you're going to have to try it the non-Obama way, and start out conversations with me in a civil manner. Well, that just don't make no sense. So you want me to kiss your ass (and tell you your shit don't stink) but yet you want me to try it the "non-obama way"? You are confused, obviously.
http://kaygriggs.blogspot.com/ On freedom4um.com, Alex Jones is more dangerous than Henry Kissinger. May you live in interesting times.
It makes perfect sense. I made one post on the thread, that was a joke (and clearly so). You respond by calling me (and others) selfish jerks that you'd like to round up and put in cattle cars. Simply posing your question without the sneering insults is not "kissing my ass", and you know it. Grow up, learn to interact with others like a mature adult, or you're on bozo. Fair warning.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
There you go. Great idea!
So, I take it NONE OF YOU can actually debate anything, but instead would rather satisfy yourself by whining (while excusing yourself from having to be intellectually honest). Makes sense.
http://kaygriggs.blogspot.com/ On freedom4um.com, Alex Jones is more dangerous than Henry Kissinger. May you live in interesting times.
Being intellectually honest does not mean you have to call names or make ad hominem attacks as your initial post to any given forum member. And you know it. Your assertions about the "military industrial complex", are bogus, there is no secret super duper technology that they as a group of hundreds of thousand could keep secret for any length of time, the group of people is too vast for that level of security to hold credibly. There is simply nothing to debate. However, if you'd tried being something other than shrill, you might have gotten that answer sooner. If you find that intellectual honesty requires name calling and sneering to somebody who has said nothing to you or against you on a thread, then you'll profit better to address somebody other than me. I've had it with your kind, and frankly, am not wont to give you folks the benefit of the doubt any longer. Grow up, or be ignored by an ever increasing number of your intended audience.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
Did you hear that?? NONE OF YOU can actually debate anything! NONE OF YOU. You all ought to be ashamed of yourselves. Time for Christine to close this pop stand.
SALUS POPULI SUPREMA LEX The global elites want control of not only us but the energy markets. Government regulation is always their answer. I love this post by Carry_Okie. It explains it all so well and while he was posting about the energy crisis in California, it applies to what has been going on with the whole global warming hoax. The key to cracking the Constitutional system was international law, a loophole in Article VI Clause 2 of the Constitution, governing the adoption of treaties and the scope of their powers (IMO the rat Patrick Henry and others smelled only too clearly; if you want a good chuckle read Hamilton's defense of the manner of treaty ratification in Federalist #75). To implement the plan European investors needed a foothold in the US before they could get into the market. Until the Civil War, corporations were haltered in the US because they were not allowed to own land and were not protected under the Constitution in a manner co-equal to citizens. After the Civil War the US was deeply in debt to that very European investor class. The 14th Amendment changed that balance of power between the individual and corporate. Once the appropriate Supreme Court cases were in place interpreting persons "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" as including corporate persons, corporations then derived equal protection under the laws and could own property, the investment floodgates opened, and that not only created an American industrial colossus, it produced an American investor class owning enormously influential private tax-exempt foundations. So it isn't exactly by coincidence that it is those same colossal foundations that are making all those "charitable" donations to those icky Greens. The Environmental Grantmakers Association? That's Rockefeller. The Pew Charitable Trusts? That's Sunoco. W. Alton Jones? That's Citgo. The World Wildlife Fund? BP and Shell. You do see a pattern, don't you? These are more than investors in energy, their assets include timber, mining, banking, food production… They aren't fools. They use the same simple and ancient recipe as did their European forbears by which to manufacture a predictable return: Kill the competition with regulations, create a shortage, and cash in. It's become so common there is even an excellent book out on the topic that I suggest you read, . It's a simple process that has accelerated over the last five decades. It's a vertically integrated racketeering system that extends over the entire planet. American investors in multinational operations are perfectly happy taking a hit on US operations destroying domestic production because their investments abroad get the business. They either convert domestic resource land to real estate or mothball it under tax exempt conservancies, Federal monuments, and such. It's been done in industry after industry: timber, energy, mining, beef, fish, agriculture, real estate development, soon water… ALL taking advantage of economies of scale in environmental compliance and sometimes selective enforcement. Tax-exempt foundations buy the research "data" they need, fund a few ideological groups trained by the same professorate that lives off their grant money, and not a word need be breathed to the companies in which they are invested. Their pet executives wail about the regulations and scream how stupid and counterproductive they are, just like you do. It makes great theater. There is virtually no way of getting caught. The same thing that happens when Hell freezes over.
It made me a sad panda. :(
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
Outstanding post, with quite a ring of truth to it.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
Your opinion stated as fact does not make it so. I know you and your ilk don't like to be challenged (intellectually) that much, but at least fake it for your followers.lol
http://kaygriggs.blogspot.com/ On freedom4um.com, Alex Jones is more dangerous than Henry Kissinger. May you live in interesting times.
And, you're on bozo. I'm not here for your entertainment, statist. Since you mentioned you'd like to put me on a cattle car, I can only assume that you're the kind of person who would do such a thing in real life if given a chance. Have fun debating yourself.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
Yes, you are here for your own (and your ilk's) self aggrandizedment.
http://kaygriggs.blogspot.com/ On freedom4um.com, Alex Jones is more dangerous than Henry Kissinger. May you live in interesting times.
"I know you and your ilk" is really boring theater. If you possess data or arguments that contravene whatever the hell it is that another poster maintains, ferchrissakes cough it up. That's what it's all about here. I eschew the bozo, but you are tempting me. The whining is a big yawn.
SALUS POPULI SUPREMA LEX I urge all to read the entire original post. He lays it out quite well including tables of financial contributions. It's long but an interesting read.
He's already commented that libertarians are flat earthers.
I am beginning to think, you remind me of a poster on NPR's site..
You mean the Earth is not flat? WOW!, who knew...LOLOL
Nice precis of the last several hundred years of woe. I meet sneering Europeans from time to time, that think that we are one only, the sole source of discord and trouble on this planet. They, the denizens of Europe's socially conscious social democracies are the light to the world. In my view they are as complicit in the rot that's infecting the planet as we are. Your little screed, farmfriend, is the kind of thing that I like to stick under their noses. From time to time.
SALUS POPULI SUPREMA LEX I sleep with two fat girls and a pug. I'm nice and warm.
You burn tree-huggers to stay warm?
LOL
Maybe more so.
Oh man, that would be too much heat for me.
Never mind, stupid reply. I'll try again later if I think of something better.
Before I hit Ignore Thread, the thought crossed what's left of my mind that you change your nic to WarmFriend. ;_)
The dumb ones will kill each other = good thing The smart ones will kill those responsible = better thing I guess it's a win/win for the good guys, no?
Obama's health care plan shall be written by a committee whose head says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it, signed by a president who smokes and has no birth certificate, funded by a treasury chief who did not pay his taxes, overseen by a surgeon general who is overweight and financed by a country that is nearly broke. What could possibly go wrong? - buckeroo LOL I like it.
Yes, it's much better than my ill-advised nic change a few weeks back. Time to figger out what's to be grilled for dinner this evening, and hoping that a trip to the grocer is not required.
Hmmm, I don't remember that one. I did consider a nick change back when everyone seemed to be switching. I'm always open to suggestions for humor sake alone if nothing else.
How about we have just one human generation in history where no groups kill any other groups. That's what I would call a "win-win."
SALUS POPULI SUPREMA LEX Let's just say that 'Nigger Jim' didn't get all that much love, but we had a great discussion of Huck Finn and who was the good guy, etc. There are some really smart, and very well-read members here; and I enjoy reading their thoughts and takes on various books.
Oh yes that I do remember.
May I point out a pattern prevalent here and on the few other forums devoted to free discourse? The primary utility, in my opinion, of these discussion fora, is to encourage: 1) the deconstruction of Media-Matrix' propaganda, separating the truth, if any, from the spin and framing 2) the propagation and dissemination of information ignored or distorted by the MSM 3) The sharpening of critical thinking and communication skills 4) The building of community and consensus There are many who share in good faith and many more who seem to desperately crave attention, even negative attention. (A certain poster with an aptly chosen reptilian moniker, apparently desiring to remain within his shell of self-absorbed ignorance, comes to mind) First, debate is a performance art form, NOT intended to establish any kind of truth. Once you agree to the rules of that form, you are already "framed". It is the favored verbal sport of those to whom words are weapons with which to vanquish the opposition, not as a path to truth, certainly not to reach a useful consensus! It is used by lawyers to sway humans to their view, by vapid bloviators to incite the ignorant and by politicians, to fill in time between lobbyist perquisites (children, drugs and money) and to make a show for the rubes that they are working for their bribes, er salaries. (I respectfully exclude Dr. No from this category) What debate is NOT designed to do, is reveal the truth. (unless you are in Perry Mason or Hollywood land) If we diligently remove fallacies from formal debates, we are left with hot air and tautologies. On the other hand, when people offer their thoughts, in a forum such as this, in a sincere effort to reach the state of communication with others of good faith, everyone gains by observing the process of paring away fallacies (unconsciously conveyed along with the concepts), clarifying muddy thinking and arriving at a point where at least the thoughts presented are clearly stated and understood by those in the discussion. Oh, and there is usually SOME actual information content remaining, beyond the mere state of the person's mind and emotions! Contrast this with those, paid to incite or naturally ignorant and proud of it, who merely throw up straw men, vomit ad hominem attacks or just muddy the waters with their shiite. Sure, everyone's thoughts are their opinions, containing a mixture of information useful to others and subjective truth. However, not everyone is equally full of shiite; some folks' opinions are high on useful information and low on subjective self-deception. Others' expressions, as evidenced here and elsewhere in the blogosphere, seem to be mostly self-deception, compulsively "shared", in an infantile desire to play mud pies with the bigger kids who have outgrown those games years ago. The irony is, those who, when called on their empty written (or verbal, in person) expression, whine about no one wanting to debate them, when they haven't (usually) offered any information content other than a thin slice of their current mind control programming, right off the top of their pointy little heads! 8=> Modelling their "debating skills" on their media matrix heroes, they may honestly think that the game is about ego-dominance and "winning" with a display of sneering derision or "wounded" dignity, a game that NO ONE WINS! Like war, a debate MAY show who SEEMS to be leadership material, by way of word- spinning domination over the opponent, or who "thinks" better on their feet (though all pro debates are pre-scripted), or who has "street smarts". In the end, it is an empty exercise, again like war, played for the benefit of the few over the many and no truth emerges, other than the venality of the participants. (One member even cops a judgemental attitude about Ron Paul not stooping to put- down games during the Presidential dog and pony shows, and not taking the opportunity to win easy points over the hollow men on the stage with him, when he was (and is) clearly on a much more vital machine of getting information into the MSM that would otherwise be totally surpressed!) I am awed by the patience that many knowledgable people show with the pro and amateur dunces, begging for discourse by throwing stones (pebbles usually), acting in bad faith, pretending to be looking to communicate (which requires an open mind and heart) but really only interested in infantile ego stroking, however retarded that masturbation appears to the rest of us! 8=> It is not hard to realize that we all have our blind sides; some however, refuse to join the rest of us in learning to recognize our areas of blindness, trusting in the communication process to actually learn something and grow. I know that I have learned a great deal from watching people work together sculpting a coherent worldview from the lies and noise, right out in the open, in front of everyone. I have enjoyed joining in, when I believed that I had something to add to the sculpted communal vision of Reality. The easy distinction on these fora is to see those who are playing nice with others in the sincere desire to grow more aware of themselves and more accessible to others and those who are only here to take a ride on the energy, stand in the juice on center stage and say merely, look at me!, like those who mug for the TV camera when they sense that the network feed has them in the frame! That is their right, everyone has an asshole, I mean an opinion, even if 99% of the latter group's "thoughts" come straight out of the hypnotic whirlpool of the Media Matrix undigested, unapologetically self-centered and patently unconscious....
What a profoundly insightful post. A+ on that one, sir. Well spoken.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
Many thanks for the kind words! ;)
Outstanding post (whomever you are.)
Seems that every day you read about how successful the environmentalists have been at stopping a coal fired plant, a hydroelectric dam, or a nuclear reactor in favor of unreliable wind and solar power.
#7. To: Clitora (#6)
#8. To: Prefrontal Vortex (#5)
Drink and sex
#9. To: SonOfLiberty (#7)
You expect me to answer you, after you just called me a selfish jerk and proclaimed that you want to put me into a cattle car?
#10. To: Clitora (#9)
#11. To: ghostdogtxn (#1)
We invade Mexico and take it over.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#12. To: SonOfLiberty (#10)
#13. To: Clitora (#12)
#14. To: Clitora, SonOfLiberty, All (#12)
#15. To: randge (#4)
The supply regulation game is at least as old as the Dutch East India Company's manipulation of coffee prices by controlling access to the plants. Understanding that sorry history of economic tyranny by European corporate royalty, the founders of this nation tried to design a limited government, one that didn't have the power to control private property or have control of resources. Control of access to resources is too much temptation for the wealthy to purchase corrupt influence that depresses everybody else. They Founders failed.
1. Foist the necessary treaty law via (primarily American) NGOs at UN environmental agencies (largely funded by the US government).
2. Get the implementing legislation through Congress.
3. Use lawsuits by those same NGOs in federal courts to alter the meaning of the law.
4. Overwhelm the agencies with graduates brainwashed by professors who subsist of government and foundation grants.
5. Establish the regulatory power on the local level to control the decision-making with the cheapest politicians money can buy.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#16. To: farmfriend (#0)
#17. To: randge (#14)
#18. To: farmfriend (#15)
#19. To: SonOfLiberty (#13)
are bogus, there is no secret super duper technology that they as a group of hundreds of thousand could keep secret for any length of time, the group of people is too vast for that level of security to hold credibly.
#20. To: Clitora (#19)
#21. To: SonOfLiberty (#20)
I'm not here for your entertainment, statist.
#22. To: Clitora (#19)
#23. To: SonOfLiberty (#18)
Outstanding post, with quite a ring of truth to it.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#24. To: SonOfLiberty (#20)
Since you mentioned you'd like to put me on a cattle car, I can only assume that you're the kind of person who would do such a thing in real life if given a chance.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#25. To: Clitora (#19)
#26. To: farmfriend, SonOfLiberty (#24)
He's already commented that libertarians are flat earthers.
#27. To: farmfriend (#15)
#28. To: farmfriend (#0)
There's no place better thanTurtle Island.
#29. To: farmfriend (#0)
What happens when it gets cold and there isn't enough energy?
#30. To: sneakypete (#29)
You burn tree-huggers to stay warm?
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#31. To: randge (#27)
In my view they are as complicit in the rot that's infecting the planet as we are.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#32. To: Turtle (#28)
I sleep with two fat girls and a pug. I'm nice and warm.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#33. To: Refinersfire (#26)
(Edited)
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#34. To: farmfriend (#33)
#35. To: randge (#4)
The net effect is to deprive us of sources of warmth and energy that we will kill each other over should a climate crunch come.
Let me get this straight.
#36. To: Lod (#34)
that you change your nic to WarmFriend.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#37. To: farmfriend (#36)
#38. To: Lod (#37)
Yes, it's much better than my ill-advised nic change a few weeks back.
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#39. To: Critter (#35)
#40. To: farmfriend (#38)
#41. To: Lod (#40)
Let's just say that 'Nigger Jim' didn't get all that much love,
"If, from the more wretched parts of the old world, we look at those which are in an advanced stage of improvement, we still find the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry, and grasping the spoil of the multitude. Invention is continually exercised, to furnish new pretenses for revenues and taxation. It watches prosperity as its prey and permits none to escape without tribute." --Thomas Paine, Rights of Man, 1791
#42. To: SonOfLiberty, Christine, Original_Intent, all (#7)
(Edited)
Anger? as a first reaction to get your a$$ moving, once you see through the Media Matrix and set yourself free from your lifelong mind control collar. Sustainable? not enough to screen your intention to be free from the Talosians, who can’t read primitive emotions but know what you watch on cable/sat, read on the Internet and eat. Our ultimate weapon is laughter and amused detachment at the folly of the would-be emperors. Fear mongers HATE it when that card doesn’t work. The humiliation of being seen as merely a naked ape is THEIR big fear. Laugh the bastards off the stage! Tell your friends that we can build a real civilization from the ashes of the totalitarian game!
#43. To: HighLairEon (#42)
#44. To: SonOfLiberty (#43)
What a profoundly insightful post. A+ on that one, sir. Well spoken.
Anger? as a first reaction to get your a$$ moving, once you see through the Media Matrix and set yourself free from your lifelong mind control collar. Sustainable? not enough to screen your intention to be free from the Talosians, who can’t read primitive emotions but know what you watch on cable/sat, read on the Internet and eat. Our ultimate weapon is laughter and amused detachment at the folly of the would-be emperors. Fear mongers HATE it when that card doesn’t work. The humiliation of being seen as merely a naked ape is THEIR big fear. Laugh the bastards off the stage! Tell your friends that we can build a real civilization from the ashes of the totalitarian game!
#45. To: HighLairEon (#42)
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