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Title: Film of DC rally (How many does it look like to you?)
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Published: Sep 14, 2009
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Post Date: 2009-09-14 12:37:53 by christine
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Views: 1193
Comments: 117
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#1. To: christine (#0)
The Lamestream media is in the perception management business not the news business. It should come as no surprise to the critical observer of media manipulations that they would of course attempt to understate and minimize the numbers of people in attendance. Since bandwagon followers are influenced and encouraged by numbers of people holding a given viewpoint, and do not want to be seen as different from what the herd is doing, they will join a popular grassroots movement if it is seen as the popular thing to do. These are the same people who spoke admiringly, and tried to get close, to the BMOC or BGOC in skool. So, the PsyOp is to prevent that from happening. Since people are emboldened by numbers, if not principle, then the game for the media is to disparage, smear, and minimize the affect of so many people standing up against government tyranny. We couldn't actually allow the people to influence the government could we? What do you think this is? A free country?
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
At a minimum, there are 250,000k. At the high end, double that. The left can
ignore, mock and/or deny, but this is the tip of the iceberg. The nation is
finally fractured as many here hoped for. I live is the America that DEMANDS
that our selected hires reduce government, eject illegal aliens and return to
our constitutional principles. This event was non violent, but I can assure
all here violence will come as sure as the sun rises in the East. It's been
inevitable for decades. Arm up, get supplies in, and draw your family close.
Nail on head. Nothing short of massive non compliance (no one to collect tolls, repair downed power lines, truck milk and bread to local stores, etc.,) will force the arrogant "molders of public opinion" to acknowledge that something is wrong in the hinterland. Of course they'll deliberately miss the point and report that the people are demonstrating in support for more night raids, 1040 audits, federal tax increases, bailouts to Edomite banksters and grants to synagogues to install SAM missiles.....
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
I visited the rally after the march, as a spectator, hoping to maybe bump into someone I knew from years gone by. There were many, many people there both departing and arriving (both directions) when I got there at about 12:45. I spent about an hour there and walked at least a good mile or more before I headed back to my hotel on the other side of the river.
And that is exactly what the elites fear. Their entire hold over the body politic, as they suck it dry, is fear and manipulation. Their numbers are too small to actually impose their tyranny by force, at this point, so they rely on Psychiatrically devised mind control programs of various kinds. Since most of those tactics rely upon the subject not becoming aware of what is going on they have to minimize and marginalize resistance via manipulation. If their minions suddenly realized what was actually going on they would be virtually powerless over night. That is just how fast their empire of the mind can, and eventually will, fall. The battle at that point will be to hold the society together long enough to resuscitate the patient without radical surgery.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
March on Washington: How Big Was the Crowd?
#2. To: christine (#0)
#3. To: Original_Intent (#1)
So, the PsyOp is to prevent that from happening. Since people are emboldened by numbers, if not principle, then the game for the media is to disparage, smear, and minimize the affect of so many people standing up against government tyranny. We couldn't actually allow the people to influence the government could we? What do you think this is? A free country?
#4. To: christine (#0)
#5. To: HOUNDDAWG (#3)
Nothing short of massive non compliance (no one to collect tolls, repair downed power lines, truck milk and bread to local stores, etc.,) will force the arrogant "molders of public opinion" to acknowledge that something is wrong in the hinterland.
#6. To: christine (#0)
 | "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." -- C. S. Lewis |
#7. To: HOUNDDAWG, christine (#3)
Then maybe, just maybe, that should be the next step, especially if they ramrod through this communism behind closed doors like they're sniveling about even as I type this? You know, all of the producers, taking a "strike week" vacation, all at one time? That's another weapon we have on our side. By and large, we're the productive class. If a bunch of whiny socialists threaten to strike, nobody notices. If the producers of the world flip the bird and sit at home a week, the ship of state comes to a screeching halt. Something to consider. I'm thinking this belongs under "I need to find a way to organize this". :)
Nothing short of massive non compliance (no one to collect tolls, repair downed power lines, truck milk and bread to local stores, etc.,) will force the arrogant "molders of public opinion" to acknowledge that something is wrong in the hinterland.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#8. To: Original_Intent (#5)
Exactly. People are able to break and ride horses simply because horses don't know their own strength relative to ours. I've posted repeatedly that at the height of their "campaign of tax terror" the IRS/DOJ brought no more than 50 tax trials to fruition each year nationwide, or about one per state. And, yet the fear mongers come on websites like this one and say "BOOGA BOOGA! Pay YOUR taxes or the IRS will throw ya in jail!" And, if the govt tried a Draconian crackdown then jurors (some of who are tax cheats which is why the IRS needs more computers and agents according to them!) would go rogue even more than they do now, and just as with Prohibition it would be the end of "The Law That Never Was!" Right now they can still sift out a pool of 22 perspective jurors who are obvious state worshipers in large metro areas about once a year. You know, people who are beholden to the govt and who consume more taxes than they ever paid. But, it's getting increasingly more difficult to impanel juries for any reason these days. And, if the IRS/DOJ tried to realize their dream of tax tyranny they'd soon be forced to seat knowledgeable (i.e. Fully Informed) people on juries. And that would be the death knell for the G_d-cursed Federal Reserve Tribute Tax.
And that is exactly what the elites fear. Their entire hold over the body politic, as they suck it dry, is fear and manipulation. Their numbers are too small to actually impose their tyranny by force, at this point, so they rely on Psychiatrically devised mind control programs of various kinds. Since most of those tactics rely upon the subject not becoming aware of what is going on they have to minimize and marginalize resistance via manipulation. If their minions suddenly realized what was actually going on they would be virtually powerless over night. That is just how fast their empire of the mind can, and eventually will, fall. The battle at that point will be to hold the society together long enough to resuscitate the patient without radical surgery.
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#9. To: Jethro Tull (#2)
Right you are Jethro. I side with you on this one. TPTB outta fear of losing their control over us will fire the first shot. They are working overtime to send the next disaster our way. They have all the tanks, the military, and the nukes and germ warfare weapons. They have proved to us that they will use them against us as they did on 9-11-2001. Their taking away our freedoms, our money, and voiding our Constitution incrementally is a way for them to measure our resolve. We are just about at the boiling point. It's not a matter of if, but when.
This event was non violent, but I can assure all here violence will come as sure as the sun rises in the East. It's been inevitable for decades. Arm up, get supplies in, and draw your family close.
#10. To: SonOfLiberty (#7)
I read a great article yesterday that said that DEM REPs are finally sweating re-election and they won't dare vote for it. Every town hall meeting in every state ends up as a torches & tarpots parade, and because there's nothing left to give away to seniors (after Bush's Medicare prescription drug perk-what's left but a million bux worth of free stem cells treatments per senior?) the reps know that they could be doing heavy lifting in the rat race with the rest of us after the next election. Any attempt to take from seniors and share with the rest of America will result in failed incumbencies, so the house may soon be trapped in a snare of its own design! Even if they don't vote for ObamaCare, they may get booted just because people don't like the arrogance that congress has repeatedly displayed of late. It's up to us to start as many rumors as we can that will upset seniors. You know, when you have the attention of some oldsters say things like, "I heard Obama wants to include inner city children in social security and send them half a pension check each month!" Let the seniors figure out where that half of a check will come from with no help from you! ;) HAH!
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#11. To: HOUNDDAWG (#10)
That's cruel. Mean. Downright evil. I like it.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#12. To: sourcery, christine, LACOUMO. all (#6)
After looking at this time lapse camera (3.5 hours) I revise my estimate. There is close to one million people there.
#13. To: Jethro Tull (#12)
It's probably only one hundred of Ron Paul's supporters going 'round and 'round the same way they skewed the internet polls in his favor after all the presidential debates! "Okay guys, spread out and try to look more numerous! Take two steps forward and one step back and you'll be photographed in three places two seconds apart!'
After looking at this time lapse camera (3.5 hours) I revise my estimate. There is close to one million people there.
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#14. To: christine (#0)
Honestly, unless there is a third party movement from this, if it is called "The Tea Party", or what ever, I'm not paying much attention. The talking heads on the radio are pushing the answer to be the Republican Party.
Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
#15. To: HOUNDDAWG (#13)
LOLOLOLOL A continuous loop of 100 RP supporters :P
#16. To: Kamala (#14)
Look at the bright side Mark. We need the system to collapse and that has begun. The economy is a joke, and there are now at least 2 or 3 versions of America, so the balkanization process has begun. Yes, I'd love a 3rd party to evolve, and if you fear the Rs getting out in front of this, don't fret. If they do it will peter out quicker than poorly dosed Viagra addled hard on.
#17. To: LACUMO (#9)
Their taking away our freedoms --- Is English your first language?
Their taking away our freedoms
#18. To: Jethro Tull (#16)
... yes, a cruel joke.
The economy is a joke
#19. To: Kamala (#14)
Honestly, if it turns into a third party movement, I'll stop paying attention. Get this: It is mathematically impossible for a third party to be viable in a winner-take-all election system, such as the one we have in the US. Got that? 2 + 2 = 4, and third parties cannot be viable. Both statements are true with the same level of strength and certainty. Yes, I know. The Republican Party displaced the Whig party. The operative word, however, is replaced. That's not just an accident of history. It was mathematically required. The question, then, is what are the chances of a new party replacing one of the existing ones? A rough estimate would have to be once every 235 years, based on US history. Not good odds. It's much more likely that a determined group of activists might be able to take over an existing party from within. That's happened many times in US history.
Honestly, unless there is a third party movement from this, if it is called "The Tea Party", or what ever, I'm not paying much attention.
| "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." -- C. S. Lewis |
#20. To: Jethro Tull (#16)
Then at the same time, citizens need to withdraw and quit participating in the fraud of the economy and the political system.
We need the system to collapse and that has begun....
Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
#21. To: sourcery (#19)
You are probably right about replacing a party, but change from within at this point, I don't think will happen.
It's much more likely that a determined group of activists might be able to take over an existing party from within. That's happened many times in US history.....
Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
#22. To: Kamala (#20)
I keep thinking of all the Gerald Celente 'tubes and interviews I've listened to over the past year. He has been dead on and I suspect people will begin to suspend participation. Saturday was an enormous step toward that possibility.
#23. To: christine (#0)
Look at all those racists. Obummer should have dropped napalm on them to put them in their place. 
_________________________________________________________________________
"This man is Jesus,” shouted one man, spilling his Guinness as Barack Obama began his inaugural address. “When will he come to Kenya to save us?”
-Schweizerische Schuetzenzeitung (Swiss Shooting Federation) April, 1941
#24. To: sourcery, Kamala, all (#19)
That is pretty much true. The laws regulating who and how someone gets on the ballot have been rigged in favor of the existing Republicrat Party. If you are not a Republicrat the hurdles are so high that it is virtually impossible for a 3rd Party Candidate to get on enough ballots to win - even if 100% voted for it.
Get this: It is mathematically impossible for a third party to be viable in a winner-take-all election system, such as the one we have in the US. Got that? 2 + 2 = 4, and third parties cannot be viable.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
#25. To: sourcery (#19)
Yes, I know. The Republican Party displaced the Whig party. The operative word, however, is replaced. That's not just an accident of history. It was mathematically required. The question, then, is what are the chances of a new party replacing one of the existing ones? A rough estimate would have to be once every 235 years, based on US history. Not good odds. It's much more likely that a determined group of activists might be able to take over an existing party from within. That's happened many times in US history. This is why Ron Paul decided to stay in the Republican Party.
Honestly, if it turns into a third party movement, I'll stop paying attention. Get this: It is mathematically impossible for a third party to be viable in a winner-take-all election system, such as the one we have in the US. Got that? 2 + 2 = 4, and third parties cannot be viable. Both statements are true with the same level of strength and certainty.
#26. To: Jethro Tull (#22)
There are a few ways. Quit spending and buying. Quit borrowing and applying for credit. Stop paying debts. File foreclosures or bankruptcy. General strike. I think the most devastating would be spending and credit. Most citizens can participate. The entire system depends on ever expanding debt and credit, without this, it crumbles.
Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
#27. To: Kamala (#26)
I think the most devastating would be spending and credit. Most citizens can participate. The entire system depends on ever expanding debt and credit, without this, it crumbles. If you think the "System" crumbling would result in more liberty you are smoking some fine weed my friend. If conservatives called a "general strike" and the economy fell apart, you'd see a socialist dictator in place in a month. American's can't go a week without TV, do you think they'll stand for grocery stores running out of food? Obama would say the conservatives are trying to starve them, and will promise "Change" and take control forever. History shows time and time again, that societies that crumble will follow a strong man who puts food on the table. Just look at American history, the single time a significant number of Americans had to worry about starving, during the great depression, America made FDR President for life.
Quit spending and buying. Quit borrowing and applying for credit. Stop paying debts. File foreclosures or bankruptcy. General strike.
#28. To: Rhino369 (#27)
History shows time and time again, that societies that crumble will follow a strong man who puts food on the table. LOL. Obama a "strong man" to take control forever? Now that's what I call a funny conspiracy theory...
Obama would say the conservatives are trying to starve them, and will promise "Change" and take control forever.
#29. To: HOUNDDAWG (#3)
You are insane. Stopping society in this way so that you and others can "protest" disrupting people's lives is the dumbest idea I have heard today. If you have a problem, take it to your leaders. Be a man for once in your life and step up.
Nothing short of massive non compliance (no one to collect tolls, repair downed power lines, truck milk and bread to local stores, etc.,) will force the arrogant "molders of public opinion" to acknowledge that something is wrong in the hinterland.
http://kaygriggs.blogspot.com/ On freedom4um.com, Alex Jones is more dangerous than Henry Kissinger. May you live in interesting times.
#30. To: Rhino369, Kamala, HOUNDDAWG (#27)
On principal alone this is the dumbest Idea I have ever heard over and over again from flat earth libertarian mouth breathers.
If you think the "System" crumbling would result in more liberty you are smoking some fine weed my friend.
http://kaygriggs.blogspot.com/ On freedom4um.com, Alex Jones is more dangerous than Henry Kissinger. May you live in interesting times.
#31. To: christine (#0)
For those who missed it - CSPAN Channel 1 feed coming from the massive 9/12 Rally in Washington D.C. Tune in now: 
#32. To: sourcery (#19)
Are you committed to preserving the Union then?
Anti-racism is code for white genocide. The call of "equality," is a siren song that can only mean the destruction of all that we cherish as being human. -- Murray Rothbard It is perfectly legitimate to assume that the races are different in their cognitive abilities and in their willpower and accordingly are unequally suited for the task of setting up societies, and that the better races are characterized in particular by their special ability to strengthen social bonds. -- Ludwig von Mises
#33. To: Prefrontal Vortex (#32)
Not in any absolute sense. But I don't currently see any viable alternatives. I'd listen to any proposals that seem well-founded, plausible and implementable...
Are you committed to preserving the Union then?
| "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." -- C. S. Lewis |
#34. To: Fred Mertz (#4)
?
I visited the rally after the march, as a spectator, hoping to maybe bump into someone I knew from years gone by.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#35. To: robnoel (#31)
www.republicmedia.tv (video) The march Saturday was called "Taxpayer March on Washington" and was organized by FreedomWorks Foundation and a coalition of other groups such as The National Taxpayers Union and The Teaparty Patriots. I think your assumption that every attendee there was a republican (McCain voter) and that the "RP Revolution has been hijacked by the forces of evil" is premature. Also, how do you know that it wasn't Ron Paul's decision to be in Alvin, Texas this weekend rather than at the DC rally?
#36. To: Original_Intent (#1)
Good comment.
So, the PsyOp is to prevent that from happening. Since people are emboldened by numbers, if not principle, then the game for the media is to disparage, smear, and minimize the affect of so many people standing up against government tyranny.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#37. To: sourcery (#33)
Good. :) Seems to me the claim is only true assuming Union. There are many such winner-take-all games at different levels in the Union, and I think a local or regional third party could be successful, locally or regionally replacing one of the two primary parties. Especially secessionist.
Anti-racism is code for white genocide. The call of "equality," is a siren song that can only mean the destruction of all that we cherish as being human. -- Murray Rothbard It is perfectly legitimate to assume that the races are different in their cognitive abilities and in their willpower and accordingly are unequally suited for the task of setting up societies, and that the better races are characterized in particular by their special ability to strengthen social bonds. -- Ludwig von Mises
#38. To: Jethro Tull, christine (#2)
At a minimum, there are 250,000k. At the high end, double that. The left can ignore, mock and/or deny, but this is the tip of the iceberg.
#39. To: Jethro Tull, original_intent, christine (#2)
I'd say there were at least few dozen in that vid. ;-) one thing comes to mind though,. so 2 million marched. and what the hell has changed from it? i dont know if 'marching' is the answer? other than to build momentum and show the puppetmasters what is happening.
Glory to God in the highest, and Peace to His people on Earth.
"I don't know where Bin Laden is. I truly am not that concerned about him"
George W, Bush, 3/13/02 http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2002/03/20020313-8.html
#40. To: sourcery (#6)
Beautiful.
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. C. S. Lewis
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#41. To: HOUNDDAWG (#13)
"Okay guys, spread out and try to look more numerous! Take two steps forward and one step back and you'll be photographed in three places two seconds apart!' LOL!!
It's probably only one hundred of Ron Paul's supporters going 'round and 'round the same way they skewed the internet polls in his favor after all the presidential debates!
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#42. To: christine (#35)
FreedomWorks- you mean the organization led by Dick Armey, Republican, and whose board is made of people like Steve Forbes. The National Taxpayers Union-a legit grassroots organization tea party patriots- a website that is run by anonymous people, but who are "partned" with Michelle Malkin and Red State.com Just look at websites like Free Republic and libertypost. All the statist republicans there are teabaggers. Campaign for Liberty hasn't been hijacked its being ignored. These teabaggers got Glen Beck to listen to.
FreedomWorks Foundation and a coalition of other groups such as The National Taxpayers Union and The Teaparty Patriots.
and that the "RP Revolution has been hijacked by the forces of evil" is premature.
#43. To: Rhino369 (#42)
So what do you suggest? That Obama gets his way without a fight? Did you ever think that we need allies in this fight and that the enemy of my enemy is my friend? As for me, I'll take a victory anyway I can get one.
FreedomWorks- you mean the organization led by Dick Armey, Republican, and whose board is made of people like Steve Forbes.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#44. To: Flintlock (#43)
So what do you suggest? That Obama gets his way without a fight? What kind of retarded logic would make you conclude that from me showing the teabaggers are being led by republicans and not Paul supporters? Not when the enemy of your enemy is also your enemy. If you think people like Army, or Beck actually want to change anything you are mistaken. Its political theater. Electing republicans instead of democrats isn't victory any way you frame it.
Did you ever think that we need allies in this fight and that the enemy of my enemy is my friend?
As for me, I'll take a victory anyway I can get one
#45. To: Rhino369 (#44)
Ok, assume you're right for the sake of argument. What would you suggest as an alternative? Many have tried voting for Ron Paul, or Libertarians, or "take your pick". They voted, then they voted again, and voted voted voted voted. And here we are. So much for voting. Now what? What are your ideas? Do you even want there to be ideas or resistance (not a leading question, I'm being genuine)? You offer criticism, which is fine, but do you have more to give than that? If so, what?
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#46. To: Rhino369, Flintlock, all (#44) (Edited)
Let me give you a not so unrealistic hypothetical. Suppose Obama woke up one day and decided gun ownership wasn't in the best interest of Americans, and subsequently managed to get legislation that nullified our 2nd amendment. Would you stand with a group of that size who was united in opposition, regardless of who was in a leadership role? A simple yes or no will do.
#47. To: Rhino369 (#44) (Edited)
Agreed, but stopping Obama should be priority #1 If it takes guys like Beck or Armey to get the troops out, I'll take it and be grateful for their efforts. The last time I checked, RON PAUL IS A REPUBLICAN
Electing republicans instead of democrats isn't victory any way you frame it.
What kind of retarded logic would make you conclude that from me showing the teabaggers are being led by republicans and not Paul supporters?
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#48. To: Flintlock (#47)
Please dont confuse the deranged with facts.
The last time I checked, RON PAUL IS A REPUBLICAN
#49. To: Jethro Tull (#46)
YES! Give me victory, we can figure out who to blame later.
Would you stand with a group of that size who was united in opposition, regardless of who was in a leadership role? A simple yes or no will do.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#50. To: Flintlock, Jethro Tull (#49)
A qualified "yes". The qualification being that those along for the ride are not absolute asshats. For example, if the KKK were openly organizing and pushing all of this, along with skinheads, neo-nazis and stormfront types, then I wouldn't even look in their direction. Since this current movement is more or less leaderless (yes, there are groups jumping on board, but they're not leading, they're jumping on board, which is something the "leader at all cost" left doesn't understand), then I'm ok if they tag along. Lots of conversions to a more libertarian outlook are happening, and that's always a good thing. If we can change a former Dubya supporter into somebody who can finally think for his/herself, then how is that not a net gain? If some aren't "pure", well who the deuce cares? Who is ideologically pure anywhere, where actual live human beings reside? As long as we're all trying to be honest and honorable, I'm ok having them tag along.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#51. To: Flintlock, Cynicom, all (#47)
How does anyone on this forum know what RP thinks about that gathering Saturday? Maybe I have this wrong but his message to me has always been to change the Republican party from within. That's the least favorite method of change for me, but it's obvious that the march wasn't aroused or mobilized by the politics of a Dick Armey or any other establishment R. Armey, et al, might be trying to plant their flag in front of the parade, but IMO the true leadership hasn't yet bubbled up.
#52. To: SonOfLiberty (#50)
IMO, if the KKK, skinheads, Aryan Nations, etc. decided to hold an all expenses paid national conference in Hawaii, they'd have about 100 people show up, and half of those would be feds. They are a SPLC/ADL manufactured fund raising entity, nothing more.
For example, if the KKK were openly organizing and pushing all of this, along with skinheads, neo-nazis and stormfront types, then I wouldn't even look in their direction.
#53. To: Jethro Tull (#52)
Sure, no question. I was just looking for the most despicable examples. Fill in the blanks for whatever group(s) you may feel fit the definition of utterly grotesque. The power of this entire movement is that it has no real leaders and is organically self organized by individuals of no consequence standing up and saying 'no more'. It's a beautiful example of spontaneous order, in my opinion. Utterly different than how the statists work, who need to be organized by Supreme Leaders and told what to say, when to say it, and where to go.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#54. To: Jethro Tull (#51) (Edited)
Paul chose that method because he knows full well it is impossible. His own son is running as a bona fide republican. We saw the evidence on national TV when Paul never once took on McCain, instead he allowed himself to be laffed off stage.
That's the least favorite method of change for me,
#55. To: buckeroo, Mudboy Slim (#34)
I was in town for a different function. I had some free time on Saturday so I hopped on the Metro and checked out the rally/protest. I was too late to see the march so I headed toward the Capitol to check it out. Mudbot says he was there too. I didn't bump into him or anyone else I knew from over the years - too many people were there.
?
#56. To: SonOfLiberty (#53)
Yep, I see what's happening the same way. How the leadership vacuum is filled will determine it's future success, or lack thereof.
The power of this entire movement is that it has no real leaders and is organically self organized by individuals of no consequence standing up and saying 'no more'. It's a beautiful example of spontaneous order, in my opinion.
#57. To: Fred Mertz (#55)
I was thinking Jim Robinson was there, strolling around in his wheelchair looking for some donations.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#58. To: Jethro Tull, Rhino369, Cynicom. Flintlock, SonofLiberty, robnoel (#51)
agreed. is it the detractors contention then that none of these people should have shown up to this event or any of the townhall/tea parties all over the country? events, btw, where R politicians get confronted and boo'ed. regarding Ron Paul, why hasn't he commented one way or the other? and, let me remind folks that he's doing an event with Michelle Bachmann.
That's the least favorite method of change for me, but it's obvious that the march wasn't aroused or mobilized by the politics of a Dick Armey or any other establishment R. Armey, et al, might be trying to plant their flag in front of the parade, but IMO the true leadership hasn't yet bubbled up.
#59. To: Jethro Tull (#56)
Thing is, I don't see a 'vacuum' per se that needs filled. There's no lack of purpose or sense of direction that needs provided. This may well end up being fully spontaneous the entire time. I certainly hope so.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#60. To: christine (#58)
This is what those who just insist it must be some kind of R conspiracy utterly overlook, whether intentionally or out of ignorance.
events, btw, where R politicians get confronted and boo'ed.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#61. To: buckeroo (#57)
I like your tag line. I had an eye out for a guy in a wheelchair, but it wasn't meant to be.
#62. To: Fred Mertz (#61)
Was there a contingent of freepers there with signs waving, "FreeRepublic.com"?
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#63. To: HOUNDDAWG, SonOfLiberty (#10)
Let the seniors figure out where that half of a check will come from with no help from you! ;) HAH! LOL ..... I like the way you think. ..... are you any relation to Saul Alinsky? ;-)
It's up to us to start as many rumors as we can that will upset seniors. You know, when you have the attention of some oldsters say things like, "I heard Obama wants to include inner city children in social security and send them half a pension check each month!"
#64. To: buckeroo (#62)
I was looking for FReakers, but like I said, the crowd was too big and lady luck wasn't on my side. I spent about 45 minutes looking and walking but I didn't bump into anyone. I suppose if I wanted to spend hours I might have found out where they were.
#65. To: Fred Mertz (#64)
Since you got there late, what was the "feel" concerning the size of the crowd? I wasn't there but as you know that particular Washington DC demonstration was one of the LARGEST in history. And no arrests.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#66. To: HOUNDDAWG, Jethro Tull (#13)
LOL. Escher could help in making folks look more numerous.
"Okay guys, spread out and try to look more numerous! Take two steps forward and one step back and you'll be photographed in three places two seconds apart!'
#67. To: christine, Rhino369, Cynicom. Flintlock, SonofLiberty, robnoel (#58)
regarding Ron Paul, why hasn't he commented one way or the other? and, let me remind folks that he's doing an event with Michelle Bachmann. I was at a local event and can say unequivocally the Rs weren't appreciated, never mind leading it. I'm a person who hasn't voted for an R since Reagan, and haven't voted at all since '00 (Buchanan, Reform Party). Why detractors do what they do is why our tiny minority has been, and will always be fractured. We're independent souls, and each has their own take on politics. We should, however, celebrate what we saw Saturday. As to where RP was, wasn't he at a function w/Michelle Bachmann (R), the erstwhile "air head" many here believe? Tell me, if they believe that, what does it tell them about RP? SoL has a great point regarding leaderless resistance. Maybe this is an example? Time will tell. Time will also expose those "on our side" who haven't the ability to look a gift horse in the mouth.
is it the detractors contention then that none of these people should have shown up to this event or any of the townhall/tea parties all over the country? events, btw, where R politicians get confronted and boo'ed.
#68. To: SonOfLiberty (#45)
You offer criticism, which is fine, but do you have more to give than that? If so, what? The campaign for liberty is actually a good plan. It just shouldn't allow itself to be co-opted by people who clearly are only pretending to agree. A movement filled with intelligent people making rational arguments will eventually grow. At that point the republicans or democrats will change their policy to gain there votes. Right now you guys are putting out on a mere promise of a chance in policy. A change that will not occur. Though the probable outcome is that nothing changes. The republican party has 10 retards for every intelligent conservative.
Many have tried voting for Ron Paul, or Libertarians, or "take your pick". They voted, then they voted again, and voted voted voted voted. And here we are. So much for voting. Now what? What are your ideas? Do you even want there to be ideas or resistance (not a leading question, I'm being genuine)?
#69. To: buckeroo (#65)
Since I had an ant's eye view vice bird's eye my opinion is mainly subjective. I would guess 100s of thousands were in attendance over the course of several hours. Again it is just a guess. Had I tried to make the march I don't think I could have gotten on the Metro to get there because the Crystal City one was packed to the gills/street. That might be a good source of data to explore - Metro traffic on the morning of 9/12. The Metro was very full when I tried to get on at about 12:30 and this was after the march had started.
Since you got there late, what was the "feel" concerning the size of the crowd?
#70. To: Jethro Tull (#46)
No, I won't allow myself to join the Nazi's because the Commies are coming or vice versa. Though if the leadership was the leadership who are in charge of the tea parties, yes I would. It would have to be a pretty extreme leader for me not to. KKK, Nazi, Communist, Fundamentalist Christian theocracy, that type of stuff.
Let me give you a not so unrealistic hypothetical. Suppose Obama woke up one day and decided gun ownership wasn't in the best interest of Americans, and subsequently managed to get legislation that nullified our 2nd amendment. Would you stand with a group of that size who was united in opposition, regardless of who was in a leadership role? A simple yes or no will do.
#71. To: Fred Mertz (#69)
So, why would the MSM attempt to suggest it was a factor of ten less than what it was? Aren't these guys interested in BIG_STORIES any more? It is amazing to me, that we have to go outside the nation to find any accuracy in reporting anymore.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#72. To: Rhino369 (#68)
And what do you suggest? A 20 page ideological purity pre-entrance examination for everybody showing up at protests? Seriously, there's no way to filter, regardless of the group in question. We're not trying to create another debate club, like the Libertarian party. And they did kinda try the whole 'purist' mode, and it kept them marginalized. What we're seeing now, or at least I am, are people accepting more libertarian ideas fully, straight out of libertarian theory, and growing in their views and scope of political awareness. Yes yes, hangers on and flag planting wannabes are here trying to co-opt, but it's not taking. Not yet anyway. There is no way to get purity of ideas AND have a mass movement capable of changing the course of a society. Even the statists cannot achieve this, there is plenty of disagreement in their ranks, however, they are able to put up a unified front (albeit well directed and full of Strongmen Wannabes issuing orders) when they want something done. Right now our push is to stop the push by Obama and the progressives/fascists. That seems to be the only real goal that everybody agrees on. With that agreement in mind, we're achieving just that. Obama's term thus far has been an utter train wreck, precisely at a time in history when he should be able to line up every plank of the socialist party/fascist party and get them passed without opposition. Something to think about. We can stop him and his lackeys now, or we can perform anal examinations on each incoming person wanting to help, testing for ideological purity.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#73. To: SonOfLiberty (#72)
Why not just allow them to have their way with us. This method should propel some REAL change fairly quickly.
Right now our push is to stop the push by Obama and the progressives/fascists.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#74. To: Flintlock (#47)
Stopping him from what? Look at Obama's tenure in office, he's pretty much been a moderate version of Bush. The question is why are all the Bushbots protesting what Bush did when it happens to be Obama? Because they are ignorant party shills. Thinking that they are engaging in some political revolution is really stupid. If Obama happened to be a republican, they'd be claiming he is single handedly saving America from economic ruin. They aren't rational people and they should be ignored. They aren't "getting the troops out" they are the generals leading them. So if you do beat Obama, the teabagging army will just vote in people Beck and Army tell them to. What you do when you ally yourself with people like Beck and Armey, is you lose all credibility with anyone who can rub two brain cells together. Its the reason why the youngest generation's best and brightest aren't going to be conservatives. In name only.
Agreed, but stopping Obama should be priority #1
If it takes guys like Beck or Armey to get the troops out, I'll take it and be grateful for their efforts.
The last time I checked, RON PAUL IS A REPUBLICAN
#75. To: buckeroo (#71)
Goldi just posted this one about crowd estimates on elPee.... 69.55.11.240/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=273390&Disp=0 This sort of debate about the size of the crowds always occurs at a large event. I heard many quoting upwards of a million while I was on the street and on the Metro. I don't know. When I got back to the hotel and checked the Internet the first story I saw was WaPo reporting 10s of thousands...I knew the fix was in.
#76. To: christine (#58)
An establishment republican. Who until Obama got elected didn't give a shit about liberty. You are proving my point.
and, let me remind folks that he's doing an event with Michelle Bachmann.
#77. To: buckeroo (#73)
Because the goal should NOT be to have a civil war, that's why. If you can stop them dead in their tracks without a drop of blood being spilled, that is ALWAYS preferable to letting them put a boot on our collective necks such that we rise up and kill them. Violence in the real world is not fun, or an adventure. It's horrible, gruesome and revolting. It should never be wished for as a first order of business, and only used as a last recourse when all other options have been tried. So far, we're winning. There's no other way to see it. We've shot down every fascist attempt since Barry and Co. took office. With a full majority in Congress, both house and senate, they still can't get their dream list passed, a dream list which they all pretty much want. That's something. That's power. Our power. As a former soldier, as a person who respects, admires and practices many tenants of the warrior culture, I'm still utterly aware of how devastating society wide violence would be. We don't want that here, if we can avoid it. Giving up when victory is standing there inviting you to a big ol' smooch is absurd.
Why not just allow them to have their way with us. This method should propel some REAL change fairly quickly.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#78. To: Rhino369 (#76)
Not really. Maybe WE'RE the ones converting people. It happens. Individuals change their minds when presented with reason. Without our movement, Bachmann may have stayed the same as she was. Our views are still political suicide, to an insider, so her taking them up isn't quite as pat as you'd think.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#79. To: Fred Mertz (#75)
I also find it interesting that 0bama skipped out of town that day. But his "speeches" in Minnesota were covered BIG_TIME. Tehese are the moments in history that we are lucky to see wherein the nation is imploding right before our eyes. Don't forget to tell your grand children about these events. The goal is to rebuild society as quick as we can without the nuisance of lies and propaganda fettering the future, too.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#80. To: SonOfLiberty (#72)
No but they aren't. They are using libertarian talking points on certain issues, but entirely disregard it everywhere else. This is how Glen Beck republicans can claim liberty for stock brokers, and health care, yet call for tyranny on the 4th amendment, terrorism, or war. The closest thing to fascists in our political spectrum are people like Glenn Beck. Progressives are socialists. Progressives aren't fascists. They may both be tyrannical but that is just about where their similarities end. These new republican allies still support a police state, still support a military state, they just want corporations to profit it from it more.
What we're seeing now, or at least I am, are people accepting more libertarian ideas fully, straight out of libertarian theory, and growing in their views and scope of political awareness.
Right now our push is to stop the push by Obama and the progressives/fascists.
#81. To: SonOfLiberty (#77)
Please explain your paradoxical perspective.
So far, we're winning. There's no other way to see it.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#82. To: Rhino369 (#80)
Ok, we're all unthinking dupes and only you see it right. Government direction and policy dictation of the means of production while private hands hold deeds is now socialism and not fascism like it's always been in the past. We're all blind. My mistake. Sorry to bother you.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#83. To: buckeroo (#79)
When I returned to the Virginia side I stopped to imbibe and watch some college football at restaurant/bar. One of the TVs was tuned to CNN and they had Obama in Minnesota speaking juxtaposed with the DC rally for a minute or two. I don't think it was a coincidence that Obama left town and visited a friendly state with a big turnout to dampen the DC rally coverage.
I also find it interesting that 0bama skipped out of town that day. But his "speeches" in Minnesota were covered BIG_TIME.
#84. To: buckeroo (#81)
Well, it's not a paradox. What bill that Obama has pushed, since we've organized, has passed into law thus far? Cap & Trade - DOA. Government run medicine - DOA. ACORN is being defunded as I understand it. He got in a few shots with taking over the auto industry, right at the very beginning before were mobilized ourselves, once that happened, his batting average hit 0.0.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#85. To: SonOfLiberty (#84)
But those are new bills and organizations. His next renewed approach is a revised immigration bill immediately following 0bamaCare. The endless onslaught of BS is increasing not decreasing. I think you have a some sunglasses on.
“Gold is the money of kings; silver is the money of gentlemen; barter is the money of peasants; but debt is the money of slaves.”
#86. To: buckeroo (#85)
You're talking about what you think might happen in the future. And there's no way to measure effect or impact on events which have not yet happened. Success or failure can only be judged by what has already happened. Using that, we're winning so far. What may or may not happen in the future is speculative at best right now. Only time will tell how we prevail or go down in flames. What I do know, however, is that throwing up our hands and saying "I surrender" before we've even acted is silly. If you cannot fight when violence is not on the table, there's no way you'll fight when it's the only option left. Men are doing the heavy lifting right now to avoid a fight, despite the gasoline pouring administration's efforts to make it otherwise. Give up if you want. Not my place to stop you.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#87. To: SonOfLiberty (#82)
Most of you are unthinking dupes yes. That is not the definition of fascism. Facism is an authoritarian nationalist ideology, that is economic policy is corporatism. Some republicans are fascists, but the leaders aren't really. They lack the nationalism. They are merely corporatists. But people like Glen Beck are (or most accurately pretend to be, Glen Beck is an actor) fascists. Socialism has a historical definition and a more common definition. The historical definition is government control of the means of production and egalitarian distribution of wealth. Under that definition the democrats are not socialists, and neither is Europe. The second more commonly used definition of socialism, is a mixed economy, with a welfare state. This is the type of socialists democrats are. And every industrialized nation is socialized, according to this definition, to varying degrees.
Ok, we're all unthinking dupes and only you see it right.
Government direction and policy dictation of the means of production while private hands hold deeds is now socialism and not fascism like it's always been in the past.
#88. To: Rhino369 (#87)
We're done. Thanks for the discussion. Later.
Most of you are unthinking dupes yes.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#89. To: SonOfLiberty (#88)
Thanks for the discussion. Later. Bye.
We're done.
#90. To: SonOfLiberty (#72)
that's what i'm seeing. i'm as cynical as the next (or at least as cynical as cyni), but in this case, because of the number of participants at townhalls and the teaparties who i saw and heard were anti-tyranny and big government, i'm going to allow myself a little optimism. great post, SoL
What we're seeing now, or at least I am, are people accepting more libertarian ideas fully, straight out of libertarian theory, and growing in their views and scope of political awareness. Yes yes, hangers on and flag planting wannabes are here trying to co-opt, but it's not taking. Not yet anyway.
#91. To: christine (#90)
great post, SoL Thanks. It's not hard to see, if you walk in without preconceived notions and old stereotypes that you won't let go of. Frankly, at this point it's too late to help those who are dead set in their beliefs that anything not pro-Obama must be pro-Republican. If appeals to reason or logic fail, let them go down their own path.
that's what i'm seeing. i'm as cynical as the next (or at least as cynical as cyni), but in this case, because of the number of participants at townhalls and the teaparties who i saw and heard were anti-tyranny and big government, i'm going to allow myself a little optimism.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#92. To: Rhino369 (#76)
then why is Ron Paul doing an event with her?
An establishment republican.
#93. To: SonOfLiberty, robnoel (#91)
point that i just had to highlight!
Frankly, at this point it's too late to help those who are dead set in their beliefs that anything not pro-Obama must be pro-Republican. If appeals to reason or logic fail, let them go down their own path.
#94. To: christine (#92)
then why is Ron Paul doing an event with her? You'd have to ask him. But she is a pro war republican who seems pretty stupid to top it off. If I had to guess its because Bachmann is pro tax cut and was anti-TARP. She is still a war state supporting republican.
#95. To: Fred Mertz (#75) (Edited)
I heard a report on a major SF area radio station that quoted a UK source saying that source had gotten the entity that takes care of the area (I believe the National Park Service) to say that they (the NPS) believed the march was the largest in history. They also said they had tried to get the same gov entity to give THEM an estimate and it had refused.
This sort of debate about the size of the crowds always occurs at a large event. I heard many quoting upwards of a million while I was on the street and on the Metro. I don't know.
#96. To: Rhino369, Jethro Tull (#74)
You really believe that? Your credibility is slipping faster than the virtue of a drunk slut on prom night.
Look at Obama's tenure in office, he's pretty much been a moderate version of Bush.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#97. To: Flintlock (#96)
Your credibility is slipping faster than the virtue of a drunk slut on prom night. Yep. What has Obama done? Continue the wars, continued bailouts, continued spending, continued spying on the nation. Obama's big policy push? Increasing public spending on health care? Why don't you look up Bush's big policy push in 2003, the largest increase in public spending on health care since LBJ. In fact I'm hard pressed to find any significant changes between the administrations. Care to share any?
You really believe that?
#98. To: Jethro Tull, christine, SonOfLiberty, Flintlock, Cynicom, all (#51)
You may recall that nine years ago Armey and original bloo dawg Dem Billy Tauzin were touring the nation with the ostensibly bipartisan "SCRAP THE CODE-Adopt A National Sales Tax" tour. Despite the rallies and tee shirt sales (I have one of them-wifey attended some gathering of theirs) it fell by the wayside. When they wanted the investigation into 9/11 to go nowhere they tried to seat Kissinger in the chair. Now they want the status quo to remain unchanged so they sent Dick Armey in to try and lead the uprising so he could walk the unsuspecting hopefuls in circles and then eventually off the nearest cliff of public indifference. Just as when Speaker Dennis Hastert slyly stated that if Bush was re-elected they were going to abolish the income tax, and when Sen. Richard Lugar was testing the presidential waters he said his platform was to be the "abolish the income tax" platform, whenever an ordinary garden variety blue suited PUB hints at abolishing the code/tax or otherwise dethroning some powerful forces you can be sure that he's simply using it as bait, and that none would ever dream of it any more than they'd attempt to limit the powers of their own offices in general and incumbents in particular. Needless to say after Bush's 2nd win there was no more talk of tax relief for working stiffs. In fact Bush actually tried to abolish capital gains and corporate taxes completely and just make it a payroll withholding "federal air tax"! (In exchange for permanent tax relief corporations would be required to collect the tax from all of their employees! Many such as Chase Bank do that already and that's the way they want things to be-the corporate profits/capital gains tax should be a tax for the privilege of slaving for corporations, with the officers' bonuses and golden parachutes being exempt of course) And, after Lugar returned to the senate the burning issue of tax relief for long suffering middle class wage earners never got a moment's time in his office. As a US Senator he could still educate and campaign like Hell against the evils of the income tax, but if it wasn't serving as bait for his presidential run then touching it for our benefit just wasn't a priority for him or any other MC. You can be sure that Dick Armey is available for "inside the wire wrecking crew duty" whenever the powers need a dutiful functionary to kill a movement through simple lack of charismatic leadership or inspiration. Planting his flag is probably what Armey was sent in to do. The last time he killed a movement that had great potential and in the process he never made a single noteworthy soundbite that could be used to damage the FED or their beloved tribute tax.
...R. Armey, et al, might be trying to plant their flag in front of the parade, but IMO the true leadership hasn't yet bubbled up.
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#99. To: HOUNDDAWG (#98)
Ah, but there is no "leadership vacuum" to be filled here. That's one of the nice things about this. Everybody is pissed, as individuals, without being directed or cajoled by some strongman thug to be so. Armey could show up with a bullhorn and I guarantee you most would boo him. He's a sell out and we all know it. It's ok to succeed once in a while without it being a plot or the design of some larger nefarious force. I think we're so used to not succeeding that we have no idea how to act when it happens from time to time. :)
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
#100. To: Rhino369, christine (#76)
An establishment republican. Who until Obama got elected didn't give a shit about liberty. You are proving my point. Sad but true. Bachmann began mouthing all the right phrases along with the rest who have no history as supporters of liberty, rolling back big govt, restoring that which was taken through signing statements and AG opinions, etc. Now, if Ron Paul can make her a true believer, then great. But, unless she's willing to abandon the main party and join Paul and his caucus (thereby alienating leadership which is always precarious especially for a newbie) then she won't excite me. To her credit the Minn Republican Caucus removed Bachmann from her leadership position. "Bachmann cited "philosophical differences" with (Minn Republican Senator and minority leader) Dick Day as the reason for her ouster." So, Bachmann may in fact have the right stuff and it's just too soon to say if she's bought and paid for. It's not too soon to note that even as a state rep she was eligible to join The Republican Liberty Caucus but, as far as I know she still hasn't signed up.
and, let me remind folks that he's doing an event with Michelle Bachmann.
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#101. To: SonOfLiberty, Rhino369, christine, Original_Intent, Lod (#99)
It's ok to succeed once in a while without it being a plot or the design of some larger nefarious force. I think we're so used to not succeeding that we have no idea how to act when it happens from time to time. :) Right. It's actually a good thing that none of the usual suspects can slither in and derail the movement. The down side is, once they're all marched out and it's time to do something, without leadership to limit the platform to reasonable goals it could end up like a Libertarian National Convention. (There was a time when I had hope-filled daydreams about the Libertarian movement. I was much younger and smarter then) But now I can sum up their conventions in two words: cluster coitus Unless a single, meaningful idea can be used to galvanize numerous factions (many of which are inflexible and won't give an inch on their principles or priorities) it'll end up like all the others that had potential but ultimately failed.
Ah, but there is no "leadership vacuum" to be filled here. That's one of the nice things about this. Everybody is pissed, as individuals, without being directed or cajoled by some strongman thug to be so. Armey could show up with a bullhorn and I guarantee you most would boo him. He's a sell out and we all know it.
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#102. To: HOUNDDAWG (#101)
Here's the "leader" taking his due credit in an email. (Always remember that nature abhors a vacuum). Dick Armey, FreedomWorks" Reply-To: "Dick Armey, FreedomWorks" Subject: We Did It Date: Mon 09/14/09 06:42 PM Dear Friend, The 9-12 March on Washington has concluded and by any measure it was nothing short of an historic success for the limited government movement. The debate over how many people were actually there is now raging from one extreme to another. Some media reports have gone as high as 2 million, while liberal pundits like David Schuster have thrown out insulting low estimates under 50,000. I believe the truth is that our crowd actually approached 1 million, but you can judge for yourself as coverage of the March will air on CSPAN again tonight at 8 pm EST. No matter the actual number, the 9-12 March on Washington was far and away the largest gathering of limited government conservative activists in history and I want to thank you for helping to make it so. Whether you were there or not, your support was key – your contribution, attendance at a local taxpayer protest in your own community, or your presence in DC is being felt today by the politicians here in the Nation’s Capital. Some may not admit it publicly, but I promise you that even the likes of Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, and Barrack Obama himself now know the power that our side represents. We are all exhausted, but it’s imperative that we keep telling the stories, and sharing the images, and connecting the people from all 50 states who spoke with one voice to petition their government. After all, we all worked so hard to send the message to our elected officials: “Silent No More.” To help document this monumental event, over the next few weeks, FreedomWorks will be putting together an online archive of the 9/12 March on Washington. However, if this project is going to be successful, we need your help! Here is how you can help: Tell us your story. If you were at the March, watched it from home, or participated in one of the hundreds of other local taxpayer rallies that took place all over the country, we want to hear from you! Simply email your story to 912dc.org@gmail.com, and don’t forget to include your name (we’ll only publish your first name), age, and location! We will also be sure to get a hard copy hand-delivered to your Senators and Congressman. Send us your pictures and video. Did you take photos or video at the DC March or your local event? If so, we’d like to post them on our archive. To do this, all you need to do is upload your photos to Flickr.com, and videos to YouTube.com, then include the tag “912dc” before saving them. If you have too many photos, or your video is too large, you can mail a CD or DVD to: FreedomWorks, 601 Pennsylvania Ave, NW, North Building, Suite 700, Washington, DC 20004. We need your help to get ready for the coming battles. The health care debate continues to rage and we expect the Left to continue their push for cap and trade and other items on the big government wish-list through the end of this year. We are working to build an infrastructure capable of conducting targeted research and issuing rapid-response calls to action that will make the difference in these fights. In addition, our political battle plan for 2010 is already starting to come together. To give you a sneak preview, this includes another major event in Washington, D.C. and playing in the most high-profile Congressional mid-term races. All of this of course will take significant resources, but that’s what it is going to take to give limited government activists like you the necessary tools to affect change. Click here to support FreedomWorks with your generous contribution. I think back to 1994. Then, true limited government conservatives saw the dawn of a new era where fiscal conservatives rose to power on the shoulders of the Contract with America and “threw the bums out.” While conservatives in Congress ultimately lost their way and thus the support of the voters, I believe that thanks to the grassroots uprising we are seeing now that lawmakers are getting the message and that 2010 could look a lot like 1994, if we keep it up. So while I again congratulate you on the success of 9-12, I remind you that the battle goes on. We can take our government back, but as abolitionist Wendell Phillips famously said, “eternal vigilance is the price of liberty.” FreedomWorks, Dick Armey P.S. Now is no time to rest on our success. Now is no time to slow down. This past Saturday on 9-12, our side came together like never before, but we have to continue building the momentum to be ready for the fights this year and beyond. Please join us and invest in freedom!
#103. To: mininggold (#102)
Excellent find! I love this: _____________________________ "I think back to 1994. Then, true limited government conservatives saw the dawn of a new era where fiscal conservatives rose to power on the shoulders of the Contract with America and “threw the bums out.” While conservatives in Congress ultimately lost their way and thus the support of the voters, I believe that thanks to the grassroots uprising we are seeing now that lawmakers are getting the message and that 2010 could look a lot like 1994, if we keep it up." ______________________ Yeah, let's make sure it fizzles out just like 1994 and when The Young Turks, 72 GOP freshmen shut down the govt in 1995 and their own including Armey turned on them. _______________________ mininggold wrote: "Here's the "leader" taking his due credit in an email. (Always remember that nature abhors a vacuum)." Well said my friend. You're quickly earning a rep as an astute political observer/activist.
I think back to 1994. Then, true limited government conservatives saw the dawn of a new era where fiscal conservatives rose to power on the shoulders of the Contract with America and “threw the bums out.” While conservatives in Congress ultimately lost their way and thus the support of the voters, I believe that thanks to the grassroots uprising we are seeing now that lawmakers are getting the message and that 2010 could look a lot like 1994, if we keep it up.
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#104. To: Rhino369 (#97)
You need to open your eyes, they're everywhere Lets start with appointing a radical wetback to the SCOUS AND Turning our banking system over to Goldman Sachs & The Boys i.e. letting the Intercontinental Exchange (ICE) become a member of the Fed and clearing credit default swaps (CDS) in a non transparent way Lets look at what he has planned: Socialized medicine I could go on and on.
In fact I'm hard pressed to find any significant changes between the administrations. Care to share any?
More gun control
Higher taxes
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#105. To: HOUNDDAWG (#100)
agreed and the same goes for Palin...
Now, if Ron Paul can make her a true believer, then great. But, unless she's willing to abandon the main party and join Paul and his caucus (thereby alienating leadership which is always precarious especially for a newbie) then she won't excite me.
#106. To: HOUNDDAWG, Esso (#98)
Lugar was once widely referred to as Richard Nixon's Favorite Mayor. I don't care about any of that, he's a f*****g globalist and would be voted out of office if people had any sense, which they don't.
In 2007, the FBI reported on concern about white supremacists recruiting soldiers, saying "hundreds" of neo-Nazis were in the active military. But in April, a Department of Homeland Security report on extremism that reiterated much the same point was widely criticized by veterans groups and some conservative politicians as being unpatriotic, leading the Justice Department to retract the DHS report. Critics acknowledge that extremism in the Army is a touchy political subject.
#107. To: Flintlock (#104)
No different than appointing two white statists. I specifically mentioned this. Obama's public option is comparable in scope to Bush's medicare prescription drug plan. And Medicare is socialized medicine, quite literally in the prescription drug plans case. Obama hasn't tried to increase gun control. Obama cut taxes, and didn't even follow through on his upper class tax increase he promised during the campaign. Go on? How about you start.
Lets start with appointing a radical wetback to the SCOUS
Socialized medicine
More gun control
Higher taxes
I could go on and on.
#108. To: Rhino369 (#107)
A deer, a female deer?
No different than appointing two white statists.
In 2007, the FBI reported on concern about white supremacists recruiting soldiers, saying "hundreds" of neo-Nazis were in the active military. But in April, a Department of Homeland Security report on extremism that reiterated much the same point was widely criticized by veterans groups and some conservative politicians as being unpatriotic, leading the Justice Department to retract the DHS report. Critics acknowledge that extremism in the Army is a touchy political subject.
#109. To: Dakmar (#108)
Ray- a drop of golden sun? I don't get your point though. I haven't seen the sound of music since was a kid. So I might be missing the reference.
#110. To: Rhino369 (#109)
There is no point, just watch out for their antlers, ok?
In 2007, the FBI reported on concern about white supremacists recruiting soldiers, saying "hundreds" of neo-Nazis were in the active military. But in April, a Department of Homeland Security report on extremism that reiterated much the same point was widely criticized by veterans groups and some conservative politicians as being unpatriotic, leading the Justice Department to retract the DHS report. Critics acknowledge that extremism in the Army is a touchy political subject.
#111. To: Rhino369 (#107)
I disagree, she has no business on the Court. What about those who don't want to be forced into anything? You're delusional Now you're seriously delusional...seek help I just did, but the more I banter with you, the less interested I become in your opinions, and the more convinced I become you're a common Obot shill in Libertarian clothing.
No different than appointing two white statists.
Obama's public option is comparable in scope to Bush's medicare prescription drug plan.
Obama hasn't tried to increase gun control.
Obama cut taxes
How about you start.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#112. To: Dakmar (#106)
WORD!
...he's a f*****g globalist and would be voted out of office if people had any sense, which they don't.
"I just play to the goddess of music-and I know she's dancing."__Taj Mahal
#113. To: Flintlock (#111)
Neither do Alito or Roberts. Nor any of the justices really. Obama's plan won't force anyone into anything. Obama's plan is to create an optional pubilc health insurance plan. It won't change your plan at all. Instead of resorting to insults why not show an example. That would be much more effective. No you did. You showed you don't understand the healthcare plans (I don't entirely blame you since neither side are really debating the facts), and merely restated your unsupported opinion that Sotormayor is worse than Bush nominees. You are arguing from a state of willful ignorance. There is almost no difference between what republicans actually do and what democrats actually do.
I disagree, she has no business on the Court.
What about those who don't want to be forced into anything?
You're delusional
I just did, but the more I banter with you,
#114. To: Rhino369, Flintlock (#107)
Rhino, I want you to know that I'm watching this and I see you responding accurately and truthfully point by point and Flintlock hurling insults instead of intelligent rebuttal. The simple truth is you cannot debate with facts when dealing with someone who operates on pure emotion. This is an unfortunate residual effect of BushCo's reign when all adversaries were labeled and dismissed. This was the only way they could survive and deflect the constant barrage of criticism because the truth was certainly of no use to them. There are real reasons to criticize Obama but Flintlock can only heave up those he wants to believe are real. And, asking him to prepare for a debate by having his facts straight would only anger him more and result in additional venomous ejaculations. In short, he's stoopid and out of his league. Don't cross swords with ignorance.
" real men don't take screen names like "Ovaria", "Hormonia-Hysteria" or "Clitora".l
#115. To: Rhino369 (#113)
If you believe Obama is not raising taxes or passing guns laws, you need to educate yourself. Like I said: "the more I banter with you, the less interested I become in your opinions, and the more convinced I become you're a common Obot shill in Libertarian clothing"
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#116. To: HOUNDDAWG (#114)
In short, you're an arrogant blowhard.
In short, he's stoopid and out of his league.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bike. Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole a bike and asked him to forgive me.
#117. To: Fred Mertz (#55)
Except fer the two buddies who accompanied me, I didn't see a single soul I knew, but I met a lotta really good folks. Man, Fred, that was a lotta people...nothing like our sparsely-attended rallies in the past...LOL!! I think we might just see some really good things happen in America over the upcoming few years if these people are able to make a difference at the ballot box...MUD
"Mudbot says he was there too. I didn't bump into him or anyone else I knew from over the years - too many people were there."
Devolve Power Outta the Federal Leviathan and Back to the States,
Localities, and Individuals as Prescribed in the U.S. Constitution!!
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