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Title: American troops in Afghanistan losing heart, say army chaplains
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URL Source: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/ne ... Afghanistan/article6865359.ece
Published: Oct 8, 2009
Author: Martin Fletcher
Post Date: 2009-10-08 09:57:15 by Horse
Keywords: None
Views: 7907
Comments: 240
American soldiers serving in Afghanistan are depressed and deeply disillusioned, according to the chaplains of two US battalions that have spent nine months on the front line in the war against the Taleban. Many feel that they are risking their lives — and that colleagues have died — for a futile mission and an Afghan population that does nothing to help them, the chaplains told The Times in their makeshift chapel on this fortress-like base in a dusty, brown valley southwest of Kabul. “The many soldiers who come to see us have a sense of futility and anger about being here. They are really in a state of depression and despair and just want to get back to their families,” said Captain Jeff Masengale, of the 10th Mountain Division’s 2-87 Infantry Battalion. “They feel they are risking their lives for progress that’s hard to discern,” said Captain Sam Rico, of the Division’s 4-25 Field Artillery Battalion. “They are tired, strained, confused and just want to get through.” The chaplains said that they were speaking out because the men could not. The base is not, it has to be said, obviously downcast, and many troops do not share the chaplains’ assessment. The soldiers are, by nature and training, upbeat, driven by a strong sense of duty, and they do their jobs as best they can. Re-enlistment rates are surprisingly good for the 2-87, though poor for the 4-25. Several men approached by The Times, however, readily admitted that their morale had slumped. “We’re lost — that’s how I feel. I’m not exactly sure why we’re here,” said Specialist Raquime Mercer, 20, whose closest friend was shot dead by a renegade Afghan policeman last Friday. “I need a clear-cut purpose if I’m going to get hurt out here or if I’m going to die.” Sergeant Christopher Hughes, 37, from Detroit, has lost six colleagues and survived two roadside bombs. Asked if the mission was worthwhile, he replied: “If I knew exactly what the mission was, probably so, but I don’t.” The only soldiers who thought it was going well “work in an office, not on the ground”. In his opinion “the whole country is going to s***”. The battalion’s 1,500 soldiers are nine months in to a year-long deployment that has proved extraordinarily tough. Their goal was to secure the mountainous Wardak province and then to win the people’s allegiance through development and good governance. They have, instead, found themselves locked in an increasingly vicious battle with the Taleban. They have been targeted by at least 300 roadside bombs, about 180 of which have exploded. Nineteen men have been killed in action, with another committing suicide. About a hundred have been flown home with amputations, severe burns and other injuries likely to cause permanent disability, and many of those have not been replaced. More than two dozen mine-resistant, ambush-protected vehicles (MRAPs) have been knocked out of action. Living conditions are good — abundant food, air-conditioned tents, hot water, free internet — but most of the men are on their second, third or fourth tours of Afghanistan and Iraq, with barely a year between each. Staff Sergeant Erika Cheney, Airborne’s mental health specialist, expressed concern about their mental state — especially those in scattered outposts — and believes that many have mild post traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). “They’re tired, frustrated, scared. A lot of them are afraid to go out but will still go,” she said. Lieutenant Peter Hjelmstad, 2-87’s Medical Platoon Leader, said sleeplessness and anger attacks were common. A dozen men have been confined to desk jobs because they can no longer handle missions outside the base. One long-serving officer who has lost three friends this tour said he sometimes returned to his room at night and cried, or played war games on his laptop. “It’s a release. It’s a method of coping.” He has nightmares and sleeps little, and it does not help that the base is frequently shaken by outgoing artillery fire. He was briefly overcome as he recalled how, when a lorry backfired during his most recent home leave, he grabbed his young son and dived between two parked cars. The chaplains said soldiers were seeking their help in unprecedented numbers. “Everyone you meet is just down, and you meet them everywhere — in the weight room, dining facility, getting mail,” said Captain Rico. Even “hard men” were coming to their tent chapel and breaking down. The men are frustrated by the lack of obvious purpose or progress. “The soldiers’ biggest question is: what can we do to make this war stop. Catch one person? Assault one objective? Soldiers want definite answers, other than to stop the Taleban, because that almost seems impossible. It’s hard to catch someone you can’t see,” said Specialist Mercer. “It’s a very frustrating mission,” said Lieutenant Hjelmstad. “The average soldier sees a friend blown up and his instinct is to retaliate or believe it’s for something [worthwhile], but it’s not like other wars where your buddy died but they took the hill. There’s no tangible reward for the sacrifice. It’s hard to say Wardak is better than when we got here.” Captain Masengale, a soldier for 12 years before he became a chaplain, said: “We want to believe in a cause but we don’t know what that cause is.” The soldiers are angry that colleagues are losing their lives while trying to help a population that will not help them. “You give them all the humanitarian assistance that they want and they’re still going to lie to you. They’ll tell you there’s no Taleban anywhere in the area and as soon as you roll away, ten feet from their house, you get shot at again,” said Specialist Eric Petty, from Georgia. Captain Rico told of the disgust of a medic who was asked to treat an insurgent shortly after pulling a colleague’s charred corpse from a bombed vehicle. The soldiers complain that rules of engagement designed to minimise civilian casualties mean that they fight with one arm tied behind their backs. “They’re a joke,” said one. “You get shot at but can do nothing about it. You have to see the person with the weapon. It’s not enough to know which house the shooting’s coming from.” The soldiers joke that their Isaf arm badges stand not for International Security Assistance Force but “I Suck At Fighting” or “I Support Afghan Farmers”. To compound matters, soldiers are mainly being killed not in combat but on routine journeys, by roadside bombs planted by an invisible enemy. “That’s very demoralising,” said Captain Masengale. The constant deployments are, meanwhile, playing havoc with the soldiers’ private lives. “They’re killing families,” he said. “Divorces are skyrocketing. PTSD is off the scale. There have been hundreds of injuries that send soldiers home and affect families for the rest of their lives.” The chaplains said that many soldiers had lost their desire to help Afghanistan. “All they want to do is make it home alive and go back to their wives and children and visit the families who have lost husbands and fathers over here. It comes down to just surviving,” said Captain Masengale. “If we make it back with ten toes and ten fingers the mission is successful,” Sergeant Hughes said. “You carry on for the guys to your left or right,” added Specialist Mercer. The chaplains have themselves struggled to cope with so much distress. “We have to encourage them, strengthen them and send them out again. No one comes in and says, ‘I’ve had a great day on a mission’. It’s all pain,” said Captain Masengale. “The only way we’ve been able to make it is having each other.” Lieutenant-Colonel Kimo Gallahue, 2-87’s commanding officer, denied that his men were demoralised, and insisted they had achieved a great deal over the past nine months. A triathlete and former rugby player, he admitted pushing his men hard, but argued that taking the fight to the enemy was the best form of defence. He said the security situation had worsened because the insurgents had chosen to fight in Wardak province, not abandon it. He said, however, that the situation would have been catastrophic without his men. They had managed to keep open the key Kabul-to-Kandahar highway which dissects Wardak, and prevent the province becoming a launch pad for attacks on the capital, which is barely 20 miles from its border. Above all, Colonel Gallahue argued that counter-insurgency — winning the allegiance of the indigenous population through security, development and good governance — was a long and laborious process that could not be completed in a year. “These 12 months have been, for me, laying the groundwork for future success,” he said. At morning service on Sunday, the two chaplains sought to boost the spirits of their flock with uplifting hymns, accompanied by video footage of beautiful lakes, oceans and rivers. Captain Rico offered a particularly apposite reading from Corinthians: “We are afflicted in every way but not crushed; perplexed but not driven to despair; persecuted but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed.”
Poster Comment: “The many soldiers who come to see us have a sense of futility and anger about being here. They are really in a state of depression and despair and just want to get back to their families,” ...“They feel they are risking their lives for progress that’s hard to discern,”... “They are tired, strained, confused and just want to get through.”...“We’re lost — that’s how I feel. I’m not exactly sure why we’re here,” ...“I need a clear-cut purpose if I’m going to get hurt out here or if I’m going to die.”...Sergeant Christopher Hughes, 37, from Detroit, has lost six colleagues and survived two roadside bombs. Asked if the mission was worthwhile, he replied: “If I knew exactly what the mission was, probably so, but I don’t.”...sleeplessness and anger attacks were common....The men are frustrated by the lack of obvious purpose or progress....“We want to believe in a cause but we don’t know what that cause is.”...To compound matters, soldiers are mainly being killed not in combat but on routine journeys, by roadside bombs planted by an invisible enemy....“Divorces are skyrocketing. PTSD is off the scale. There have been hundreds of injuries that send soldiers home and affect families for the rest of their lives.”...“All they want to do is make it home alive and go back to their wives and children and visit the families who have lost husbands and fathers over here. It comes down to just surviving,”...He said the security situation had worsened because the insurgents had chosen to fight in Wardak province, not abandon it...two chaplains sought to boost the spirits of their flock with uplifting hymns, accompanied by video footage of beautiful lakes, oceans and rivers.
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#92. To: Cynicom (#89)
Which photo my friend ?
bump
The Afghan foto on this thread of the black soldier.
The flag?
Aye, the flag...oy vey, goyim gone bad. (To the tune: Bad Boyz) "Bad goy, bad goy, whattzu gonna do, whattzu gonna do when the truth rings true..."
Post 28
Do you mean the flag on the sleeve of the soldier in #95?
POST 28 THE BLACK SOLDIER.
Are you looking at the american flag?
Affirmative.
It is unfair to blame Obama for this. He got stuck with two no-win wars from the Bush Admistration --- and lots of Republican shrapnel about how evil it would be to "cut and run". Additionally, we do owe something to our allies in the coalition for joining with us, and we owe something to the civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan for wrecking what little they had. So Obama is wrestling with an octopus; how to end the war without being called names for it. (I used the octopus metaphor because I thought the more appropriate reference to Uncle Remus' tar baby would be seen as racially insensitive.)
Wrong. If you re read his talks before he became president, he stated many times that Afghanistan would be his point of interest in fighting "terror". Afghan is his burden.
Do you recall the Pueblo years ago in North Korea???? Many people overlooked that in the first photo, two enlisted men had their hands on their knees and were giving the upside down finger to the Koreans??? You're switching from one conspiracy theory to the next too quickly for me to follow. Are you saying the soldier was sending a secret message or that the photographer was staging a phony scene of a soldier praying? Pick one conspiracy and stick with it. I don't see exactly where there is any real propaganda payoff with a Brit audience one way or the other and this story will have very limited impact in the States either way.
If you're off into the world of secret handshakes, you've lost me.
Sorry to confuse, I can see you were never in the photo analysis business. When I used the term "staged" I did not mean to infer "phony". It was put together for maximum effect, what they did was heroic in my book, God bless them for it. Way more than we talkers will ever do to stop this madness. Now, the article without the photograph would have gotten little attention. These gentlemen knew they were risking their military careers in speaking up. In doing so, they wanted maximum gain for the risk. It was the only way to go and I would have done the same. It was a masterful presentation. So good that if one takes time, there are many messages there, intended or not, that they wished conveyed, and convey it did. Does that help or not????
Okay. What do you think the chances were that ANY American MSM would have carried the story and the photos???? I would say nil and to back that up, we saw negative coverage AFTER the story broke. It was NEVER intended for Brit consumption, it was their only safe outlet. They evidently had a friend in the Times people present. I would say they used the ONLY possible outlet. would you or I have trusted American MSM on the ground there??? I would not.
If you browse the political websites like TOS1 and TOS2, you will see the blood dancers showing their contempt for the troops by badmouthing the soldiers in this article. They only support the troops if those troops are willing to shed the blood that allows the blood dancers to dance their jig. What really amazes me though is people like Joe Snuffy on TOS2. This is a guy that claims to be a Vietnam War vet and who has on many occasion talked about the waste that war was, and yet here he is bad mouthing those soldiers who have woke up to the same realization about this war. Him and his ilk are real pieces of shit. At least in his war there was a draft and everyone theoretically had the opportunity to be sent over there. Unlike the Vietnam War, today's war sends the same soldiers over and over and over again. And yet this yahoo and those like him turn on them in a heart beat if they stand up and say enough is enough. The soldiers know that there isn't a damned soul in Afghanistan worth the life of a single soldier. It's a shame that the Joe Snuffy's of the world are so unwilling to see that.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 The purpose of the legal system is to protect the elites from the wrath of those they plunder.- Elliott Jackalope
I posted to him but he did not reply. If he is indeed a Viet vet, I do not understand him at all.
Huh? This is the Times of London. Anyway, the only mention I've seen is a sympathetic reading of the article by Shep Smith yesterday in his afternoon show. So, what, maybe a few hundred thousand Americans heard of it? Compared to millions of Britons who undoubtedly did.
You're captured their mentality pretty well. As the war rages on, the soldiers are fighting with their rifles for freedom in Af-Pak and these folks are fighting right along with their keyboards on the home front. They're almost brothers in arms really. You'd think they would start awarding a Medal of Honor to the biggest warmongers, offer Purple Hearts for those who broke a nail while typing.
How can anyone be as FULL of SHIT as you are ??
Wasn't the Kenyan selected by brain dead goofs based on a series of speeches he gave offering HOPE we'd leave Iraq? PS: We're a year into his first term and we still have 150k troops there. Do these leftist pigs love war as much as the Bushies? (Sorry for the rhetorical question).
Better, now what is at least the date/time stamp and owner of the quote? Give me that and I will be able to respond to this post of yours'. ;-)
He never said he'd act in contradiction to the advice of the commanders of our operations there. Which is why people like Cindy Sheehan never signed on with support for him to be elected. What I see by his policies in both theaters of operation is an awareness that satisfying either the Neocons or Code Pink is a sure fire route to political oblivion. I served in the U.S. Army for about nine years total. I am a firm believer that once started, disengagement from a war is more complicated and harder than starting one. If he fails to get to the point where we are out of Iraq and do not see the light at the end of the tunnel in Afghanistan, his potential to be re-elected will be compromised. That much I am happy to give you, because it is true enough. ;-)
He's acting in contradiction to the bogus peace prize he just received. Obama is every bit the murdering, blood coated thug politician Bush (43), Clinton, Bush (41), Reagan, Ford, Nixon, etc were. Wake up from your idolization of political psychotics and look at what is right and wrong.
Until people realize that the government is the enemy, that there is but one party, t he party of the ruling elite, there cannot be a change for the better in this country. Believing in and supporting the two party system is exactly what Americans have been programmed to do. Sad.
Actually, Bush was very pigheaded with his "I'm the decider and if you don't like it, tough" attitude. Obama is far more sensitive to the process of input and pro-active advocacy of peace. We agree on the point that President Obama needs to have his feet kept to the fire to remember it is the American people ultimately who have the say on whether we stay in either country militarily or not. I do want to see these troops come home and the wars ended. But I don't want a short term gain of peace to the detriment of our security in the future. If he works to satisfy the first mentioned objective while making sure the second is not ignored, he will be doing his job. The biggest worry I have is how his lack of brass in dealing with Israeli Zionists will be the pulled thread that unravels what he is trying to knit. Unless he gets on the learning curve where he realizes the depth and scope of the Israeli factor that threatens to boil things over, all he is trying to do could be for nothing.
Still hopelessly trapped in what they say, rather than what they do. My premise stands; Obama is every bit as blood soaked as any of his contemporaries. Just deal with it.
Huh?? What "policies"?? What "awareness"? The ONLY "policy" or "awareness" of B-HOE is about burying our guys in a cascade of their own blood, hanging them out to dry, and humiliating and embarrassing the US Armed Forces - the hood ornament of the U.S.A. I served in the U.S. Army for about nine years total. And that absolves you from naivete, dopey judgment, and blind faith in your so-called "leadership" from this Fraud-in-Chief?? I am a firm believer that once started, disengagement from a war is more complicated and harder than starting one. If he fails to get to the point where we are out of Iraq and do not see the light at the end of the tunnel in Afghanistan, his [0bama's] potential to be re-elected will be compromised. NO Newsflash here Sherlock - extricating ourselves from either A-Stan or I-Rock on a dime was always going to be difficult. But where's the plan?? HELLO??!! It is noted that whereas among your obvious first thoughts are with respect to the electability of your beloved co-Leftist 0bama over this debacle, mine are about the safety of our personnel and an actual of plan of operation that gets us TF out in a brisk fashion - while severely crippling the enemy to the max.
Obama is far more sensitive to the process of input and pro-active advocacy of peace. Quit trying to defend your man. Obama is a big loser. Open your eyes!
You MUST be nuts. OR hittin' the 'srooms. The biggest worry I have is how his lack of brass in dealing with Israeli Zionists will be the pulled thread that unravels what he is trying to knit. LOL - "biggest threat" is WHAT?? Yep, 'shrooms.
Obama is a big loser. Open your eyes! LOL - this frickin' guy is all but singing Tammy Wynette over B-HO's treasonous idiocy... But maybe he can't swallow and keep his eyes open at the same time.
That was certainly ONE of the reasons he was elected by the pod-people. If he were honest he should have at least run on a "I'll-Eff-the-Troops" campaign promise. Creepy treasonous Mo-Fo.
And I say I hear what you are saying and I respect your worries. But my contention is that the jury is still out on whether he is wrong in walking the centerline of the road on these wars started by Neocons. And if so, will he correct course, or will he be hit by traffic, as that is always the jeopardy of the centerline. I am willing to give him the benefit of doubt for now, and this is due to my belief system which whether I like it or not was molded by my experience in the military. Rest assured though, that if you prove to be more right then I am right now in October of 2009 as his term progresses, I won't be shy about admitting it. I never hero worship just because I vote for someone, as it is easier to win a presidency than it ever is to keep the office for a second term. Just ask Jimmy - the hostage crisis ate my brain - Carter. ;-)
Why thanks dear boy. I do indeed admire Barry Goldwater dispite any political differences I had with that great Arizona senator. Now, how on Earth did you know that? ;-D
One HUGE difference; This sadistic, treacherous SOB is actually reveling in the blood and getting off on it; The Muslim-in-Chief even may be building a Blood Altar mosque in the White House basement for all we know.
Time has run out for Obummer to prove himself. This joker is the biggest liar in history. How many more lies are you waiting for?
Of course you give the treasonous-murderous Barry Hussein the "benefit of doubt" - you and he share the same warped core "belief system."
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"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams 
#93. To: wudidiz (#91)
Yor Yevrah updates: PSDplat asks, "wtf does he [Darrel Anderson] mean, 'expose 911'?" Good question. Anderson, gung-ho when he got to Iraq, quickly learned that Saddam had nothing to do with Sept. 11. It takes a while longer to come to grips with the deeper lie that 9/11 was an inside job. Defenders of the official conspiracy theory (19 Arab hijackers) enable the inside-job perpetrators to get away with their crimes and cover-up and to continue the mother of all hate crimes, the racist, genocidal, global and ersatz "war on terror".
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#94. To: Rotara (#92)
#95. To: Cynicom, Rotara (#94)
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#96. To: Cynicom (#94)
This one:
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#97. To: Cynicom, Rotara (#89)
Did you run an inquisitive eye over the photo????
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#98. To: wudidiz, Cynicom (#97)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#99. To: wudidiz (#97)
#100. To: Cynicom (#99)
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#101. To: wudidiz (#100)
#102. To: wudidiz (#100)
#103. To: Cynicom (#102)
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#104. To: Jethro Tull (#11)
#105. To: Shoonra (#104)
It is unfair to blame Obama for this. He got stuck with two no-win wars from the Bush Admistration
#106. To: Cynicom (#71)
When the photo is "staged" you should be.
#107. To: Liberator (#78)
#108. To: TooConservative (#106)
You're switching from one conspiracy theory to the next too quickly for me to follow. Are you saying the soldier was sending a secret message or that the photographer was staging a phony scene of a soldier praying?
#109. To: TooConservative (#106)
Pick one conspiracy and stick with it. I don't see exactly where there is any real propaganda payoff with a Brit audience one way or the other and this story will have very limited impact in the States either way.
#110. To: Horse, all (#0)
#111. To: Hayek Fan (#110)
What really amazes me though is people like Joe Snuffy on TOS2.
#112. To: Cynicom (#109)
What do you think the chances were that ANY American MSM would have carried the story and the photos???? I would say nil and to back that up, we saw negative coverage AFTER the story broke. It was NEVER intended for Brit consumption, it was their only safe outlet.
#113. To: Hayek Fan (#110)
If you browse the political websites like TOS1 and TOS2, you will see the blood dancers showing their contempt for the troops by badmouthing the soldiers in this article. They only support the troops if those troops are willing to shed the blood that allows the blood dancers to dance their jig.
#114. To: Shoonra, WEASEL MIKE, corn flake ferret (#104)
It is unfair to blame Obama for this. He got stuck with two no-win wars from the Bush Admistration --- and lots of Republican shrapnel about how evil it would be to "cut and run". Additionally, we do owe something to our allies in the coalition for joining with us, and we owe something to the civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan for wrecking what little they had. So Obama is wrestling with an octopus; how to end the war without being called names for it. (I used the octopus metaphor because I thought the more appropriate reference to Uncle Remus' tar baby would be seen as racially insensitive.)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#115. To: Rotara (#114)
#116. To: Rotara (#114)
#117. To: Jethro Tull (#115)
#118. To: Ferret Mike (#117)
He never said he'd act in contradiction to the advice of the commanders of our operations there.
#119. To: Jethro Tull (#118)
Wake up from your idolization of political psychotics and look at what is right and wrong.
#120. To: Jethro Tull (#118)
#121. To: Ferret Mike (#120)
Actually, Bush was very pigheaded with his "I'm the decider and if you don't like it, tough" attitude.
#122. To: Ferret Mike (#117)
What I see by his policies in both theaters of operation is an awareness that satisfying either the Neocons or Code Pink is a sure fire route to political oblivion.
#123. To: Ferret Mike (#120)
Actually, Bush was very pigheaded with his "I'm the decider and if you don't like it, tough" attitude.
#124. To: Ferret Mike (#120)
Obama is far more sensitive to the process of input and pro-active advocacy of peace.
#125. To: TwentyTwelve, Ferret Barry (#123)
Quit trying to defend your man.
#126. To: Jethro Tull, Rotara (#115)
Wasn't the Kenyan selected by brain dead goofs based on a series of speeches he gave offering HOPE we'd leave Iraq?
#127. To: Jethro Tull (#121)
#128. To: Liberator (#125)
"Ferret Barry"
#129. To: Jethro Tull (#121)
Obama is every bit as blood soaked as any of his contemporaries.
#130. To: Ferret Mike (#127)
I am willing to give him the benefit of doubt for now..
#131. To: Ferret Barry, Jethro Tull (#127)
I am willing to give him [Barry Hussein O] the benefit of doubt for now, and this is due to my belief system....
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