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Title: Obama: Jail Time for Those without Health Insurance
Source:
ABC
URL Source: http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalp ... out-health-care-insurance.html
Published: Nov 10, 2009
Author: Sunlen Miller
Post Date: 2009-11-10 10:37:57 by noone222
Keywords: None
Views: 1155
Comments: 105
Political Punch Interview with the President: Jail Time for Those without Health Care Insurance? November 09, 2009 6:30 PM During an exclusive interview with ABC News’ Jake Tapper today, President Obama said that penalties are appropriate for people who try to “free ride” the health care system but stopped short of endorsing the threat of jail time for those who refuse to pay a fine for not having insurance. “What I think is appropriate is that in the same way that everybody has to get auto insurance and if you don't, you're subject to some penalty, that in this situation, if you have the ability to buy insurance, it's affordable and you choose not to do so, forcing you and me and everybody else to subsidize you, you know, there's a thousand dollar hidden tax that families all across America are -- are burdened by because of the fact that people don't have health insurance, you know, there's nothing wrong with a penalty.” Under the House bill those who can afford to buy insurance and don’t’ pay a fine. If the refuse to pay that fine there’s a threat – as with a lot of tax fines – of jail time. The Senate removed that provision in the Senate Finance Committee. Mr. Obama said penalties have to be high enough for people to not game the system, but it’s also important to not be “so punitive” that people who are having a hard time find themselves suddenly worse off, thus why hardship exemptions have been built in the legislation. “I think the general broad principle is simply that people who are paying for their health insurance aren't subsidizing folks who simply choose not to until they get sick and then suddenly they expect free health insurance. That's -- that's basic concept of responsibility that I think most Americans abide by,” Mr. Obama said, “penalties are appropriate for people who try to free ride the system and force others to pay for their health insurance.” The President said that he didn’t think the question over the appropriateness of possible jail time is the “biggest question” the House and Senate are facing right now. Read more from Jake Tapper’s interview with President Obama HERE. -Sunlen Miller
Poster Comment: Comparing Health Insurance to Car Insurance implies that like driving, living is a "privilege" ...
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#56. To: Jethro Tull (#14)
the feds having the "dope", health records, and financial info on every single citizen in this country. So, what happens next.? To anyone who takes anti anxiety meds, psychotropics, etc, = good bye guns. Everyone will be chipped by mandate, for their protection and to insure quality care.
SPAMerica, a nation of spineless, gutless, mindless, self-absorbed, internet litterbugs.
It's our nanny-state, welfare-warfare state in action.
I understand that you loaned Methusela's family the cash for his birth.
SPAMerica, a nation of spineless, gutless, mindless, self-absorbed, internet litterbugs.
If the working people accept this communist nonsense they deserve it.
SPAMerica, a nation of spineless, gutless, mindless, self-absorbed, internet litterbugs.
It's (past) time to shoot the collectors. After about 25 of them die ... they'll re-think things. Even communists bleed red ! Fuck em, when do we say we've had enough of their shit.
SPAMerica, a nation of spineless, gutless, mindless, self-absorbed, internet litterbugs.
Do you mean like Congesswoman Loretta Sanchez (nee Brixley)?
A trillion here, a trillion there, soon you're not talking real money
Paste a link to the actual section of the bill that say's that. Any fine can and will be escalated to jail time and even a death sentence if you refuse to pay. That's just the way it is when you live in a totalitarian state.
Obama's health care plan shall be written by a committee whose head says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it, signed by a president who smokes and has no birth certificate, funded by a treasury chief who did not pay his taxes, overseen by a surgeon general who is overweight and financed by a country that is nearly broke. What could possibly go wrong? - buckeroo You don't really think the alphabet agencies keep you safe from anything, do you?
Obama's health care plan shall be written by a committee whose head says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it, signed by a president who smokes and has no birth certificate, funded by a treasury chief who did not pay his taxes, overseen by a surgeon general who is overweight and financed by a country that is nearly broke. What could possibly go wrong? - buckeroo They are by far not perfect but have done a reasonably good job. My wife is a veterinarian who worked for a while with the state as a animal/meat inspector- on farms and meat packing plants. She had farms and meat packing plants shut down until they cleaned up their act. Stuff that would make you puke or at least turn you into a vegitarian over night if you knew what these farms were doing. I would rather trust the USDA than some take the 3rd worlds countriesI.e. mexico word that their produce or meat is safe.
Funny thing. Back when I was born, when my parents didn't have insurance, they paid for it out of pocket. Guess who paid for my birth? My parents did. If they had insurance, and were paying their premiums back then, do you know who would have been paying for it? My PARENTS. Not you, not some other jackass, but the people who brought me into this world. You people with your overdeveloped sense of entitlement and importance, need a wake up call. You didn't subsidize anyone but your Insurance Company's employees.
Better to be hated for what you are, than loved for what you are not.
Nobody should have to pay for another person's kids' education. Greater good? The greater good would be for those who bring children into this world, be responsible for their education and upbringing. Parents these days put their kids on Autopilot between public schools, and television and they wonder why kids today have no sense of right and wrong, or the ability to work for anything.
Better to be hated for what you are, than loved for what you are not.
Open Season on World Kommunists in America is fast approaching. Call me krazy, but I can NOT wait. It's WAY past time for the trash like the booshes, klintons, obamas and all their superiors to start PAYING UP. BANG !
Parents these days put their kids on Autopilot between public schools, and television and they wonder why kids today have no sense of right and wrong, or the ability to work for anything. Well said, and Amen. Personal, and familial responsibility, are like some words from an unknown language these days.
You don't really think the alphabet agencies keep you safe from anything, do you They are by far not perfect but have done a reasonably good job. LOL you are very predictable if nothing else...
Excellent analysis Tommy. Poor teachers work like dogs and continually get the blame for what parents fail to do for their children. Can't get them to do the work in school. They have to deal with all those kids who failed the year before but were sent to the next grade so that they wouldn't have any emotional issues. In school today, kids have no skin in the game. Why do the work if your going to sail on anyway? There are no consequences, save for the teachers who know the kid will continue to fail because they don't have the skill set necessary to move onward and upward. They take the heat when the kids are failing, even when they warned that sending them on would lead to more failure.
Because it will keep bc's insurance rates down.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
Ha, did not. I got to my place in life because people ahead of me in time did their share.
They are by far not perfect but have done a reasonably good job. My wife is a veterinarian who worked for a while with the state as a animal/meat inspector- on farms and meat packing plants. She had farms and meat packing plants shut down until they cleaned up their act. Stuff that would make you puke or at least turn you into a vegitarian over night if you knew what these farms were doing. I would rather trust the USDA than some take the 3rd worlds countriesI.e. mexico word that their produce or meat is safe. I guess that explains why the USDA FORBADE Small Independent Packers who wanted to ensure safety as a competitive advantage from testing EVERY animal for CJD/Mad Cow? The USDA threatened them with shut down and legal action if they did it. Your comparison to 3rd World Countries is a Strawman and irrelevant to determining whether Feral Goobermunt Agencies actually do the job they claim they do. Think about that. The Meat Packers wanted to EXCEED the USDA Standard and the USDA threatened to shut them down if they did. Does that mean they are doing a good job? Gee, I wonder why they threatened them for wanting to EXCEED the standard miniscule amount of testing done? Yeah, the FDA looooooooooooooovvvvvvvvvvvvvvvves you. They just give me warm fuzzies. I have listened to USDA Inspectors talk about how they are hamstrung by their superiors, how some are "paid off", and how some large Packers will run a "Hurdy Gurdy" during their inspection, which they knew was coming, and then go back to their standard slovenly unwholesome practices after the inspection. Like virtually all so-called regulatory agencies the USDA works first to protect the big players, not the consumer, in the industries they supervise. Our government is among the most corrupt on the planet at this stage of the game. They are just better at hiding it and have a compliant controlled presstitute corpse which will not report on it - because they depend on advertising revenue from the same people. The CIA is the largest Drug Importer in America and Wall Street depends upon the laundering of drug money running into the hundreds of billions. Spare me. "An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
You people with your overdeveloped sense of entitlement and importance, need a wake up call. You didn't subsidize anyone but your Insurance Company's employees. Thank you for your generous and most kind and considerate words. It is well that I do not use vulgar, obscene nor profane language.
You set a high standard here, sir. I hope to live up to it some day.
Thank you. There are times that intemperate young men test the souls of their very elders.
I don't use vulgar words anymore. I think the word Jackass adequately describes your attitude. Do you honestly believe you have subsidized other people with your insurance payments? Here's a quick and easy lesson as to how the Insurance Industry actually works. The premiums you pay, do not subsidize other people in the event of an accident, or emergency. In fact, they don't even pay YOUR bills. The money you pay the Insurance Company funds their employees, their day to day operations, and the proceeds are then put in a fund that they use to make quick short term, high risk investments that pay them large dividends. This money is then used to pay for catastrophic event coverage should you have a heart attack, car accident, or whatever operation du jour you need. They, like every other major finance institution play fast and loose with the money on their investments. If they took only premiums, and hedged that against the lives and health of the individuals they insured, I can tell you every insurance company would go bankrupt. Kind of like how AIG went bankrupt. When the stock market tanks, so do insurance company profits, unless they bet short on certain stocks. Kind of like how some companies did really well with put options on 9-11, and some did not. Kind of like how some insurance companies diversified their holdings into the housing market, and then found themselves losing everything because people could no longer pay their mortgages. Who do you think covered those mortgages, and what money did they use? Health Insurance, car insurance, life insurance, Home insurance, renter's insurance, and any other kind of insurance you can imagine are not directly funded by the premiums you pay. What you are doing, is giving the insurance company free money to invest, for them to profit, for the promise of them paying your bills should something happen. Either way, you aren't paying anyone's way, no matter how much you think you do.
Better to be hated for what you are, than loved for what you are not.
I called my two worthless Texas senators (John Cornyn and Kay Hutchison) and told their offices in D.C. and Dallas that I would not participate in this pernicious Nazi-esque mandate, that I would go to court and then go underground like a goddamned illegal mexican upon conviction. I told them that I wouldn't be the only one and that they were sitting on a lit powder-keg and that they'd better get on the stick and use parliamentarian rules to defeat this legislation. I got the standard response "They're voting against it!!" to which I replied that I can train a monkey to vote against the Demonrats, what the hell good are my senators if that's all they can do?? I hope America explodes in a glorious revolution that will restore the government to its' original role while simultaneously resulting in the death of tens of thousands of FedGov employees, it has come to that point with this legislation and current Congress.
_________________________________________________________________________ Wrong. Not the way Obamacare will work. The Utopians want everyone to be on an an "equal"plane. So Madame DeFarge and Obumski have decided not to let insurance premiums be affected by evil capitalist thingies like actuarial risk factors - age is one example. You see, The Utopians are way far smarter than actuaries = they've got their law degrees and diversity training and tree hugging immersion diplomas so they know best. Also, the option to purchase cheap high deductible catastrophic PPO insurance plans is pretty much a thing of the past 'cause we grass eaters can only purchase insurance plans that are approved by the Secty of Health, and you can be sure that those approved plans are gatekeeper HMO's that cover lots of preventative sh*t like annual exams and vaccinations and flu shots and are front end loaded to cover pregnancy and delivery and pediatrics but skimp on cancer treatment and heart bypass surgery for folks age 40 and up. Tax saving HSA's/FSA's are also de facto kaputz in the future. We can't have grass eaters saving on income tax can we? I posted a couple of articles on Obamacare the past few days that you might want to peruse. a. online.wsj.com/article/SB...tml#articleTabs%3Darticle "Effort to Assist Older Voters May Raise Costs for the Young" 11/10/09 b. online.wsj.com/article/SB...0.html?mod=googlenews_wsj “What the Pelosi Health-Care Bill Really Says: Here are some important passages in the 2,000 page legislation” c.www.heritage.org/Research/HealthCare/wm2686.cfm "Government-Run Health Care Even Without the Public Option" 11/09/09 d.online.wsj.com/article/SB...6.html?mod=googlenews_wsj "The Lords of Entitlement: Every medical insurance decision will be subject to rationing by politics" 11/09/09 e. www.newsok.com/medical-ex...tom_click=pod_lead_health "Medical expense accounts could be limited to $2,500" 11/08/09
Providing a public Catastrophic Coverage Option is much different than creating an entitlement for Big Insurance and Big Pharma - which IS what this current bill is. You do not need to unconstitutionally SOCIALIZE the entire medical system to cover 8 million people. Healthcare is NOT the Feral Government's job. If it is to be addressed it should be most properly done at the State level, but you lovers of Gargantuan oppressive all encompassing Socialism always want the government to tell other people what to do for your convenience - even though time and again that venue has failed. Witness "The War on Some Drugs". Ever been in the military? I have, and for a significant amount of time - I know first hand how Socialized Hellthcare works - indifferent mediocrity to substandard, to outright incompetent. Insanity has been defined by some as doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. Hmmm? If the shoe fits ... As well one can create positive incentives to get coverage - such as making it 100% deductible from your taxes. However, that has not even been on the table. Instead we are to get 111 new bureaucracies and the use of force upon allegedly free citizens to comply with someone's neurotic fears. OI, you rock! Home run! Precisely and in a nutshell. I'm going to cut and paste what you said and send it to my friends, family, and associates. You've got logic! Madame DeFarge and Obumski both got B.S. - nothing adds up. As you say "You do not need a Howitzer to hunt gnats - you need a flyswatter."
You are right. The 8 Million only refers to "working poor" Americans who don't qualify for existing government[ie. taxpayer supported] health care through Medicaid, SCHIP, Medicare. The rest of the 46 Million uninsured are illegals and their children [30%]; and young generation XX 20's who feel immortal and want to spend $ on cars and travel and apartment furnishings; folks who qualify for Medicaid, SCHIP but can't be bothered enrolling; and those with a small business who earn around $75,000 who don't want to buy insurance because they have "other priorities." Actually, I've read that this latter group is the fastest growing group. So out of all the groups, I don't know about you, but the only one I feel any sense of responsibility towards helping as a taxpayer is the 8 Million "working poor." And that group doesn't need a $2.4 Trillion "reform" health care plan nor should it require my insurance benefits decreasing and premium costs and taxes increasing. If Fed Gov would cut fraud in Medicaid and Medicare and implement tort reform US wide and promote HSA's/FSA's in conjunction with catastrophic PPO [ top of the line] plans with higher deductibles, it's a win win for us all including the "working poor" and generation XX and upwardly mobile couples. As Original_Intent said elsewhere "You do not need a Howitzer to hunt gnats - you need a flyswatter." Here's an article for you to peruse: liberty.pacificresearch.o...facts-about-the-uninsured “Understanding all the facts about the uninsured” By Sally Pipes, Washington Examiner, 10/25/09
Do you mean like Congesswoman Loretta Sanchez (nee Brixley)? Funny!
I love it! You're on the case, X-15- good job! These somnolent, yawn, self-important, lazy, rubber stamp by party line, critters and senators need to feel heat, lotsa impassioned knowledgeable VOTER-TAXPAYER voices/faxes/emails. Even my punkass senatorass is now sending me weekly "reaching out" updates about her glorious doings in DeeCee. I think perhaps I made too much sense in my email to her - she may be worried I'm talking to other grass eaters and God knows what might come of that... Ha! But she is AWAKE...finally... We need to keep the pressure on. Politicians equate voter feedback to VOTES won or lost as the case may be.
Terrific response X-15 ... I've used up half the national forest writing letters to congress-creeps, the President, various govt. agencies, and filing court briefs attempting to work within the system. I too got the "same response" ! And, finally I went underground like a fucking illegal. I've been off the grid waiting for the fight for over 20 years and NOTHING would make me happier or prouder than to see Americans stand up on their two hind legs and tell these psychopaths to fuck -the -fuck off. Freedom loses its liberating effect when threats of incarceration accompany legislation that forces people to enter commerce against their will. This world managed to kill off billions of people over time without healthcare. The morons in DC and their wars kill off millions of people annually, on purpose. The largest purchaser of lethal weapons in the fucking universe expects us to believe they give a shit about our health. I can't stomach the hypocrisy any longer. I hope America explodes in a glorious revolution that will restore the government to its' original role while simultaneously resulting in the death of tens of thousands of FedGov employees, it has come to that point with this legislation and current Congress. Most of us have been hesitant to invite war or anarchy into our lives. However, I will not go to my grave knowing I did nothing to stop these murdering power mongers.
Doing what's right isn't always easy but it's always right.
They're going to call us all crazy ... I'm already used to it ... so much so that I'll use it as a defense ...the scum and their bodyguards are going to pay !
Doing what's right isn't always easy but it's always right.
"Hi! I'm from the government and I'm here to help you." LOL! You're killing me with your insight and common sense, OI.
And any Anglo planning on getting accepted into med school post Obamacare implementation [ which btw rewards diversity in conjunction to health care delivery] - a legal name change now is sound first strategy. Why not have a mass movement that removes their license plates from their autos, burns their Socialist Security cards, and refuses to show up on April 15th ! The perps in DC are preparing to play some real hard ball (buy insurance or go to jail), we can play hard ball too. ! I'd advise all feds to forget healthcare and invest in some good body armor.
Doing what's right isn't always easy but it's always right.
Every Revolution needs "theme" music !!!
Doing what's right isn't always easy but it's always right.
Good music. You might want to check out music by Nightwish. "Bye Bye Beautiful", is the ultimate break up song. Though, "10th Man Down" would fall in line with those songs you posted.
KNIGHTS OF CYDONIA is my favorite !!! Listen to the entire song ... it gets better as it goes !!! No Ones gonna take me alive time has come to make things right you and I must fight for our rights you and I must fight to survive !!!!
Doing what's right isn't always easy but it's always right.
This whole so called health reform should be called what it is Government Take Over of Health Care. Silly words like reform are inadequate. None of this is constitutional. It is robbery just as they stole from social security they will steel from this. How do we start to impeach and/or remove these people? We need to get their flunky judges out also.
I can recall working for this government long ago, when they steadfastly refused to participate in a group health insurance. For years we had nothing. Now they are taking over the entire industry.
Good rallying music - thanks for posting - all we're missing is a Paul Revere lead singer!
2.4 Trillion dollars. Now... Why does that number ring a bell? Oh Wait... Remember on 9-11, that the pentagon was missing something between 2.4 and 3.2 Trillion dollars? Just before the airplane crashed into the accounting department preventing the investigation to keep moving?
Better to be hated for what you are, than loved for what you are not.
It is sheer insanity that they think they can mandate that all citizens must buy a product. This is a way for them to steal the surplus. They should have had anti-trust and gouging laws against the insurance companies years ago. Within the last ten or so years the insurance companies have gone haywire. I had my husband take me off the insurance. Paying $300.00 a month for me alone with a yearly deductible that is never met leaves us paying for any and all doctor bills also. I think we start a savings account and if necessary I will opt for medical tourism if needed.
Thanks for the kind words. If you find them worthy please feel free to share as much as you would wish. I am here to promote liberty and if my writing provides any small aid in doing so I am well rewarded.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
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#57. To: sizzlerguy. all who pay their own way here (#52)
Why in the hell should straight folks have to subsidize a bunch of heroin and crackheads useless "quack" therapy.
#58. To: Cynicom (#53)
Because people like me helped pay for his birth.
#59. To: sizzlerguy (#52)
Why in the hell should straight folks have to subsidize a bunch of heroin and crackheads useless "quack" therapy.
#60. To: Pinguinite (#8)
The IRS also garnishes wages, imposes additional penalties and interest, and seizes homes, cars and businesses. Those things can destroy lives at least as much as going to jail, and often much more so.
#61. To: scrapper2 (#19)
a legal name change now is sound first strategy.
#62. To: belmontconservative (#6)
If you do not (or cannot) pay the fine, you go to jail.
Let me get this straight.
#63. To: belmontconservative (#33)
why don't they just eliminate the USDA and FDA-allow tainted foods to come in and wipe out thousands??
Let me get this straight.
#64. To: Critter (#63)
You don't really think the alphabet agencies keep you safe from anything, do you
#65. To: Cynicom (#53)
#66. To: Lod (#50)
#67. To: noone222 (#0)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams 
#68. To: TommyTheMadArtist. all (#66)
Nobody should have to pay for another person's kids' education. Greater good? The greater good would be for those who bring children into this world, be responsible for their education and upbringing.
#69. To: belmontconservative (#64)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
#70. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#66)
Parents these days put their kids on Autopilot between public schools, and television and they wonder why kids today have no sense of right and wrong, or the ability to work for anything.
#71. To: sizzlerguy, belmontconservative (#49)
Why should a single guy, in his 50s have to pay for the hospital expenses involved in the birthing of someone elses kids.?
#72. To: noone222 (#58)
Pick up the phone. They would crucify him.
#73. To: belmontconservative, Critter, Rotara, all (#64)
You don't really think the alphabet agencies keep you safe from anything, do you
"Hi! I'm from the government and I'm here to help you."
#74. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#65)
If they had insurance, and were paying their premiums back then, do you know who would have been paying for it? My PARENTS. Not you, not some other jackass, but the people who brought me into this world.
#75. To: Cynicom (#74)
#76. To: randge (#75)
You set a high standard here, sir.
#77. To: Cynicom (#74)
#78. To: noone222 (#0)
"This man is Jesus,” shouted one man, spilling his Guinness as Barack Obama began his inaugural address. “When will he come to Kenya to save us?”
-Schweizerische Schuetzenzeitung (Swiss Shooting Federation) April, 1941
#79. To: belmontconservative (#10)
What's the difference with your example? I came back from a insurnace meeting and according to the stats if all people had insurance the premiums would drop by 35-40%
#80. To: Original_Intent (#26)
(Edited)
However, most people are already covered by some form of insurance - whether public or private. It is only 8 million out of 300+ million (at least 1/3 of which are in the country illegally) who have no coverage. You do not need a Howitzer to hunt gnats - you need a flyswatter.
#81. To: belmontconservative, Original_Intent (#28)
(Edited)
There are way more than 8 million LEGALS without insurance. I have seen figures from 25 to 30 million(without the illegals) from the insurance industry...and they want to lowball the figure.
#82. To: DeaconBenjamin (#61)
(Edited)
a legal name change now is sound first strategy.
#83. To: X-15 (#78)
(Edited)
I got the standard response "They're voting against it!!" to which I replied that I can train a monkey to vote against the Demonrats, what the hell good are my senators if that's all they can do??
#84. To: X-15 (#78)
I called my two worthless Texas senators (John Cornyn and Kay Hutchison) and told their offices in D.C. and Dallas that I would not participate in this pernicious Nazi-esque mandate, that I would go to court and then go underground like a goddamned illegal mexican upon conviction. I told them that I wouldn't be the only one and that they were sitting on a lit powder-keg and that they'd better get on the stick and use parliamentarian rules to defeat this legislation. I got the standard response
#85. To: Rotara (#67)
Call me krazy, but I can NOT wait. It's WAY past time
#86. To: Original_Intent (#73)
(Edited)
Spare me.
#87. To: scrapper2 (#19)
Seriously.
#88. To: All. X-15, scrapper2, Original Intent, Rotara (#85)
#89. To: noone222 (#88)
(Edited)
#90. To: All (#88)
#91. To: ALL (#0)
#92. To: MiracleRose7 (#91)
This whole so called health reform should be called what it is Government Take Over of Health Care.
#93. To: noone222 (#88)
#94. To: scrapper2 (#81)
#95. To: Cynicom (#92)
#96. To: scrapper2 (#80)
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