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Title: 9/11: PENTAGON AIRCRAFT HIJACK IMPOSSIBLE (FLIGHT DECK DOOR CLOSED FOR ENTIRE FLIGHT)
Source:
pilotsfor911truth.org
URL Source: http://pilotsfor911truth.org/american_77_hijack_impossible.html
Published: Nov 27, 2009
Author: unk
Post Date: 2009-11-27 21:43:30 by rack42
Keywords: 911, pentagon, flight 77
Views: 1952
Comments: 118
(PilotsFor911Truth.org) - Newly decoded data provided by an independent researcher and computer programmer from Australia exposes alarming evidence that the reported hijacking aboard American Airlines Flight 77 was impossible to have existed. A data parameter labeled "FLT DECK DOOR", cross checks with previously decoded data obtained by Pilots For 9/11 Truth from the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) through the Freedom Of Information Act. On the morning of September 11, 2001, American Airlines Flight 77 departed Dulles International Airport bound for Los Angeles at 8:20 am Eastern Time. According to reports and data, a hijacking took place between 08:50:54 and 08:54:11[1] in which the hijackers allegedly crashed the aircraft into the Pentagon at 09:37:45. Reported by CNN, according to Ted Olson, wife Barbara Olson had called him from the reported flight stating, "...all passengers and flight personnel, including the pilots, were herded to the back of the plane by armed hijackers..."[2]. However, according to Flight Data provided by the NTSB, the Flight Deck Door was never opened in flight. How were the hijackers able to gain access to the cockpit, remove the pilots, and navigate the aircraft to the Pentagon if the Flight Deck Door remained closed?[3] Founded in August 2006, Pilots For 9/11 Truth is a growing organization of aviation professionals from around the globe. The organization has analyzed Data provided by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) for the Pentagon Attack, the events in Shanksville, PA and the World Trade Center attack. The data does not support the government story. The NTSB/FBI refuse to comment. Pilots For 9/11 Truth do not offer theory or point blame at this point in time. However, there is a growing mountain of conflicting information and data in which government agencies and officials along with Mainstream Media refuse to acknowledge. Pilots For 9/11 Truth Core member list continues to grow. == [3] Right click and save target as here to download csv file with "FLT DECK DOOR" parameter.
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#60. To: bluegrass (#57)
sure one could, thing is those controlling the courts aren't open for the truth.
recall I said there were 52 people taken as witesses???? I cannot recall how many were turned away for one of two reasons, they were in general agreement with the majority, or they were so far out of agreement, the investigators passed on their credibility.
Not true. No theory is valid unless it accounts for ALL of the data. Conversely if it does not account for all the data then it is not valid. There are literally hundreds of outpoints many of which are not in dispute, but merely ignored and avoided. There are in fact so many outpoints and flat contradictions that as much as I have read on the subject it is difficult to remember the details of each and every one - and I have a very good memory. 1. No proven mechanism has ever been given in the Official Conspiracy theory to account for the collapse of WTC 7. The last was so risible that it was laughed at 'round the world. Everywhere except in the controlled Amurkin' Media. 2. No mechanism has ever been proposed, in the Official Conspiracy Theory®, to account for the recovery of molten metal as much as 8 weeks after the collapse of the towers. 3. No credible explanation has ever been given, in the Official Conspiracy Theory®, to account for the stand down of the most sophisticated air defense system on the planet i.e., NORAD. No one in the Military Chain of Command has ever been charged, prosecuted, or in any way condemned or reprimanded for this failure. The lame excuse was given that they had turned off the transponders (which known incompetent pilots would first have to find and know how to shut them down) but that would not take them off Radar. It would merely eliminate the transmission of their identification. I've operated Radar, am a trained electronics technician, and I can tell you with absolutely certainty that, that explanation is complete and utter bullshit. 4. All pilots are taught a 4 digit emergency hijack code. It takes about 3 seconds to send it. Not one of the 4 aircraft transmitted that code. 5. Multiple Cell Phone Calls were alleged to have been made by low wattage cell phones, through signal attenauting skin of the aircraft, at ten thousand feet, doing 500 miles per hour. The technology to do that was not available at that time. The story has since morphed to "they used the plane's phone" to cover up that impossibility. 6. None of the hijackers was a qualified pilot. In fact they were known incompetents one of which was denied rental of a single engine Cessna because the guy checking him out did not trust his ability to competently handle the plane. 7. How did the FBI know where every video camera that could photograph the approach of the Pentagon Plane? How did they know it quickly enough to have confiscated all 32 tapes by late afternoon on the day of 911? 8. Several of the hijackers were trained at U.S. Military bases. ??? I could go on, but there seems no point. You have a conclusion which no amount of fact will sway.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
OI... I see none of the points that are pertinent. Number 5 is the most obvious. Most every day I place calls from inside my auto, to a tower that is NOT LOS. (Line of sight).
At ten thousand feet? You drive your car at ten thousand feet with no windows and at 500 mph? Fast enough to not make the necessary handshake to establish the connection before you are out of range of the tower? The experiment has been run using a light plane traveling less than 200 mph and using the technology extant at the time it cannot be duplicated. And you may not see the tower but it IS there. They've gotten pretty good at camouflaging them because people start objecting when they learn about the increased cancer rates near cell towers.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
That is of no consequence. Way back when I was a pup in the Air force, we carried hand held VHF radios as part of our survival gear. They worked very well. Altitude was of no consequence nor was speed. All of that is irrelevant and totally misleading.
OI: I flew many miles prior to 9/11 and did a heluva lot of calling on my cell phone. Rarely did I find I could NOT call ... Therefore, I have to assume that the technology available at the time allowed for "low wattage cell phones, through signal attenuating skin of the aircraft, at ten thousand feet, doing 500 miles per hour". I am not an expert in any of this, but am able to use common sense when all else fails! (Which, with age, is occurring more and more on a daily basis!)
I just talked a pilot friend of mine, one who believes attack was a missile. He thinks this is a non issue being used to give truthers a black eye. He says: So I looked up the default. The default if a parameter is not used is 0 So not only is this a static parameter, it shows closed for more than 50 continuous flight hours over the previous 12 flights. In 1997 model of the 757, this parameter was finally implemented 1991 - 757-1,2 model airframe, 1997 757-3 model where this is a valid parameter there are many parameters that produce no change of binary states or produce any data. The FDAU(box that collects all the data and streams it to the FDR) has the capability to collects hundreds, even thousands of parameters in new versions; the FAA mandates 70. All this will do is give people who know that 9/11 was staged a black eye "The only thing better than a Federal Reserve audit would be a Federal Reserve autopsy."
Well thanks for your opinion and that of others.
...with the power of conviction, there is no sacrifice.
It all comes down to this: the data shows that nobody entered the cockpit of AA77. What is so difficult to uderstand about that? Does someone what to bitch that the NTSB faked the recordings? Because, I'm more inclined to that proposition. Why? Because I can't entertain how an airplane of the size of the AA77 can "destruct" into practicaly nothing, yet there is DNA available. Doesn't make sense.
...with the power of conviction, there is no sacrifice.
I'm all ears.
...with the power of conviction, there is no sacrifice.
You are correct. Your comment is irrelevant and totally misleading. VHF operates in a totally different and much lower frequency band that carries much further and at higher power. Your handheld's output was probably in the range of 2 or 3 watss. The Cell Phone technology in use on 911 has an output measured in milliwatts. Cell Phones operate in the microwave range (much higher frequency) which is strictly short range (a few miles) which is why towers have to be positioned all over the place. {FYI - the bands go VHF (Very High Frequency - AM Radio), UHF (Ultra High Frequency - FM Radio), and then you enter the Microwave Band} Again you are using a Strawman Argument and committing an additional logical fallzcy known as the False Analogy. I could dissect it and refute on other points, such as the need to make the electronic handshake, as well but don't wish to hurt my head any more. Bzzzzzzzzzzt! Play Again?
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
Our handhelds were VHF/UHF. All at VHF and above are LOS communications. If you can see them, you can communicate. This altitude and speed thing is totally erroneous.
OI: I flew many miles prior to 9/11 and did a heluva lot of calling on my cell phone. Rarely did I find I could NOT call ... Therefore, I have to assume that the technology available at the time allowed for "low wattage cell phones, through signal attenuating skin of the aircraft, at ten thousand feet, doing 500 miles per hour". I am not an expert in any of this, but am able to use common sense when all else fails! (Which, with age, is occurring more and more on a daily basis!) Here I have to rely on the work of others so there is margin for error. In the experimental data I saw the point was not that it could not be done at all but that the liklihood of making a connection was low and that the connection if made would be unreliable. I don't know what kind of phone you were using, it's power output, nor the exact circumstances of your call(s), but the point is that there were multiple calls for several minutes and the technology at that time did not support those kinds of calls. However, this is one of those points upon which we could go round and round for some time which is why I suspect Cyni fixed on it because it was the only point where he could create a cloud of confusion.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
Uhhhhhhhhh.
Again, you compare apples and oranges. The technology is NOT the same, and operates with a different set of parameters and restrictions. However, I am through trying to educate you on the technology. Suffice to say you have made clear you do not understand how a cell phone operates or the protocols required for a call to connect and go through. Even the goobermunt has tried changing their story to say it was done on the Plane's Phone so I don't see what your are quibbling about. If you believe the goobermunt's hurdy gurdy you should be correcting me by telling me it was done on the Plane Phone - despite all prior claims in the Official Conspiracy Theory®.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
The technology of radio/tv has never changed. Never. Equipment available changes basic tech never does. Air speed and altitude are examples of misinformation leading to confusion.
He is wise to be wary as there have been multiple threads of planted disinfo to obscure and create confusion. And also to get people to bite on a false line to then later set up a "gotcha". I don't know what hit the Pentagram, whether a Cruise Missle or a smaller jet painted to look like an AA plane from a distance, all I do know is that the actual physical evidence is incompatible with the official Cover Legend.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
And neither has the physics. The higher the frequency, the shorter the range, and the more line of sight it becomes. (Hint - think Inverse Cube Law). However, you do not understand the protocols of how a cell phone connects with a cell tower. Radio is only analogous up to a point. To make a connection with a cell tower to complete a call the phone transmits a coded signal which is then received by the cell tower, which then transmits back a validating signal establishing a connection. It is more analogous to the way a modem operates rather than an omnidirectional radio transmission, at a much lower frequecy and much higher power, which you tried using for an analogy. Again you talking apples and oranges.
"An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't. ~ Anatole France
Cynicom is a paid dis-info artist. His style and questions are just like all of the rest of the .gov losers trying to cover for the CIA/Mossad false flag event of 9/11. Don't believe him for a second when he tries to claim otherwise. I have seen many like him on many different forums to not know when I am dealing with one of their ilk. Not worth wasting breath or type on. He is here for one reason only, disinfo.
God is always good!
I don't think so.
I actually tried this on take-off once. The output of a cell phone is so weak - I think it's less than a quarter of a watt - you loss signal at about 500 feet. After the aircraft reaches 1500 feet or so, forget about it. Your phone doesn't have the strength to manage the handoff from cell to cell which it manages to do in an automobile traveling along the surface, but not aloft at any appreciable altitude. You might be able to maintain service flying an ultralight, but not as a passenger on an airliner.
Hello? Have all forgot that this started with "Hari H. NEVER OPENED THE COCKPIT DOOR" evidence from the NTSB? Someone please explain that, OK? And if Hanjour didn't pilot AA77 into the Pentagon, then who did?
...with the power of conviction, there is no sacrifice.
The very reason I refuse to take part in discussions that are nothing more than a waste of time. We can't find the originators until we get the power to have a REAL investigation of the event. We can't get that power until we can adequately convince enough Americans that 9/11 was indeed an inside and or mossad job. In order to bring people over to our side, we need strong evidence supporting our position, therefore discussing stuff like this is vital. This is another strong piece of evidence that the official fairy tale is just that, a fairy tale.
Obama's health care plan shall be written by a committee whose head says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it, signed by a president who smokes and has no birth certificate, funded by a treasury chief who did not pay his taxes, overseen by a surgeon general who is overweight and financed by a country that is nearly broke. What could possibly go wrong? - buckeroo Then he enlisted a very tight and small group to "manage" the operation. At that point anyone else added to the operation was merely a drone that knew ONLY his own little part, nothing more. Exactly. In fact, the drones may not even have known anything about their own little part.
Obama's health care plan shall be written by a committee whose head says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it, signed by a president who smokes and has no birth certificate, funded by a treasury chief who did not pay his taxes, overseen by a surgeon general who is overweight and financed by a country that is nearly broke. What could possibly go wrong? - buckeroo Of course they have.
#1 If you suspect the government of wrongdoing, and Yukon calls you a lunatic, a conspiracy definitely exists.
Obama's health care plan shall be written by a committee whose head says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it, signed by a president who smokes and has no birth certificate, funded by a treasury chief who did not pay his taxes, overseen by a surgeon general who is overweight and financed by a country that is nearly broke. What could possibly go wrong? - buckeroo Thanks bluegrass. I almost lost track myself.
...with the power of conviction, there is no sacrifice.
It's hard to keep track. That's why do much disinfo is pumped out like bilge water day after day after day....
I'll let this go till 10:00 am EST. After that I have obligations. But I'm willing to "pick it up" after 7:00pm Jeez. How is it that so many on this forum don't "get it?" Makes me want to cry.
...with the power of conviction, there is no sacrifice.
rack, did the plane fly into the pentagon or what do you think happened ? for me, the other evidence is much more credible and important...plz tell
It's not just this forum. It's the human way. By and large, most people would rather believe what they think they know rather than think at all.
The witnesses say the plane was over here and not over there where the poles were knocked down. Some say the airliner rose away from the pentagon after the explosion.
Someone please explain that, OK? And if Hanjour didn't pilot AA77 into the Pentagon, then who did? If AA77 hit the Pentagon we would have seen the video of it by now. It didn't happen. As far as this new evidence goes, could be disinfo considering it is put out by pilots for 9/11 truth and a government agency. The government would never knowingly release data that would indicate they are responsible for 9/11. If they had a video of AA77 hitting the Pentagon we would have seen it by now. They have a video of the time period it was suppose to have hit, but no 757 hit the Pentagon in that time, that's for sure.
God is always good!
i have an earlier post that shows it is. i'll find it.
"The only thing better than a Federal Reserve audit would be a Federal Reserve autopsy."
"The only thing better than a Federal Reserve audit would be a Federal Reserve autopsy."
Thanks! Well, many of these **** for 9/11 truth groups seem to be tainted now by putting out disinfo. These groups were never needed. You don't need any professional group anywhere to see 9/11 was an inside job. Just learn basic physics and watch the towers come down. It's just that simple!
God is always good!
Well, that is very interesting and disconcerning. *sigh*
...with the power of conviction, there is no sacrifice.
Bummer. It makes sense though. Keep on kicking the fake info out until some of us just drift away in disinterest or confusion.
blue... Excellent... You are the first to express something that needed saying, and paying attention to. My very first post to this thread was posted under that very belief. We have been subjected for years to many blind alleys by "experts", both real and imagined that have led nowhere. Every time some "new" evidence surfaces, too many are too willing to accept it as the gospel. So far all are for naught. I believe it was an inside job just as you and most other people, however I will not waste my time fishing in rain barrels.
This is why I stick to what I *KNOW* and can intelligently educate people about. And there's PLENTY of that...I like now to start with Barry Jennings' eyewitness account of what happened in WTC7 (Barry was Arkancided shortly after going public).
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestWe know what happened. We can't prove, in court, who did it.
The best gun to have, is the gun you have, when you need a gun.
#61. To: Original_Intent (#58)
Thank you, you just made my point for me.
#62. To: Cynicom (#59)
Not one iota. True or false the government account still stands.
#63. To: Original_Intent (#62)
5. Multiple Cell Phone Calls were alleged to have been made by low wattage cell phones, through signal attenauting skin of the aircraft, at ten thousand feet, doing 500 miles per hour. The technology to do that was not available at that time. The story has since morphed to "they used the plane's phone" to cover up that impossibility.
#64. To: Cynicom (#63)
Most every day I place calls from inside my auto, to a tower that is NOT LOS. (Line of sight).
Strawman Argument
#65. To: Original_Intent (#64)
At ten thousand feet?
#66. To: Original_Intent (#62)
5. Multiple Cell Phone Calls were alleged to have been made by low wattage cell phones, through signal attenauting skin of the aircraft, at ten thousand feet, doing 500 miles per hour. The technology to do that was not available at that time. The story has since morphed to "they used the plane's phone" to cover up that impossibility.
#67. To: Cynicom, rack42, Original_Intent, Lod, christine, twentytwelve, anyone else you guys can think of (#1)
THis parameter was not used for the 1991 model of the 757. There are thousands of parameters designed for a CRV but many are not used do to plane variations. Looking back at the raw data, this number has stayed zero for the previous 40 flights as well. That is impossible.
#68. To: Phant2000 (#24)
My observations agree with your's in totality.
#69. To: All (#68)
#70. To: Cynicom (#21)
But after all these years it is time we focused our efforts on finding the ...ORIGINATORS OF 9/11 AND THEIR FEW MINIONS THAT CARRIED IT OUT...
#71. To: Cynicom (#65)
Way back when I was a pup in the Air force, we carried hand held VHF radios as part of our survival gear. They worked very well. Altitude was of no consequence nor was speed. All of that is irrelevant and totally misleading.
#72. To: Original_Intent (#71)
VHF operates in a totally different and much lower frequency
#73. To: Phant2000, Cynicom (#66)
5. Multiple Cell Phone Calls were alleged to have been made by low wattage cell phones, through signal attenauting skin of the aircraft, at ten thousand feet, doing 500 miles per hour. The technology to do that was not available at that time. The story has since morphed to "they used the plane's phone" to cover up that impossibility.
#74. To: Original_Intent, Phant2000 (#73)
Here I have to rely on the work of others so there is margin for error
#75. To: Cynicom (#72)
#76. To: Original_Intent (#75)
The technology is NOT the same,
#77. To: farmfriend (#67)
I just talked a pilot friend of mine, one who believes attack was a missile. He thinks this is a non issue being used to give truthers a black eye.
#78. To: Cynicom (#76)
The technology of radio/tv has never changed. Never.
#79. To: randge (#36)
#80. To: RickyJ (#79)
"The trouble with people is not that they don't know but that they know so much that ain't so." ~ Josh Billings
#81. To: Cynicom (#76)
#82. To: all (#81)
#83. To: Phant2000, Cynicom (#22)
Do I believe the government??? Of course not. But after all these years it is time we focused our efforts on finding the ...ORIGINATORS OF 9/11 AND THEIR FEW MINIONS THAT CARRIED IT OUT...
Let me get this straight.
#84. To: Cynicom (#23)
The person that conceived this foul deed did not get his hands dirty in any way.
Let me get this straight.
#85. To: rack42 (#82)
Have all forgot that this started with "Hari H. NEVER OPENED THE COCKPIT DOOR" evidence from the NTSB?
#86. To: yukon (#48)
Top One Way to Be Sure a Government Conspiracy Exists
Let me get this straight.
#87. To: bluegrass (#85)
#88. To: rack42 (#87)
#89. To: bluegrass (#88)
#90. To: rack42 (#89)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams 
#91. To: rack42 (#89)
How is it that so many on this forum don't "get it?"
#92. To: Rotara (#90)
#93. To: rack42 (#82)
(Edited)
Hello? Have all forgot that this started with "Hari H. NEVER OPENED THE COCKPIT DOOR" evidence from the NTSB?
#94. To: RickyJ, rotara (#93)
As far as this new evidence goes, could be disinfo
#95. To: RickyJ, rotara, rack42 (#93)
#96. To: farmfriend (#95)
(Edited)
#97. To: farmfriend (#95)
post#67
#98. To: rack42, farmfriend (#97)
#99. To: bluegrass (#98)
It makes sense though. Keep on kicking the fake info out until some of us just drift away in disinterest or confusion.
#100. To: farmfriend (#67)
All this will do is give people who know that 9/11 was staged a black eye
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams
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