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Religion
See other Religion Articles

Title: Former Lesbian Couple Battles Over Child Custody
Source: The New American
URL Source: http://www.thenewamerican.com/index ... ple-battles-over-child-custody
Published: Dec 31, 2009
Author: Rebecca Terrell
Post Date: 2009-12-31 17:13:22 by farmfriend
Keywords: None
Views: 2305
Comments: 157

Former Lesbian Couple Battles Over Child Custody

Written by Rebecca Terrell
Thursday, 31 December 2009 01:00

A seven-year-old girl stands in the crosshairs of a bizarre custody battle between former lesbian domestic partners Lisa Miller and Janet Jenkins. The Wall Street Journal reports that Miller is the child's biological mother and conceived her by artificial insemination while living with Jenkins in Vermont, where they were joined in a civil union in 2001. Miller became a Christian in 2003, renounced the homosexual lifestyle, and moved to Virginia with her then-infant daughter, Isabella Miller-Jenkins.

Jenkins sued for unsupervised visitation, which Vermont Judge William Cohen granted after dissolving the civil union, but Miller refused to comply with the court order. She said allowing Isabella to spend time unsupervised with Jenkins would violate her Christian principles. Miller appealed the visitation order to courts in Vermont and Virginia. The VermontTimes Argus reports that Miller's attorneys argued that Isabella has not lived with Jenkins since she was a baby. A doctor who testified in the case said the change could "induce devastating trauma." Miller also expressed concern that Jenkins refuses to take Isabella to church. Jenkins' attorneys denied these claims.

Miller's appeals in both states were unsuccessful, but she remained in contempt. As a result, in November the court awarded Jenkins sole custody. According to the Wall Street Journal, an attorney for Jenkins claimed, "It is Ms. Jenkins' intent when she has custody of Isabella to allow as liberal contact as is possible with her other mother."

Miller tried to delay the transfer, set for January 1, but the court denied that request, too. Now, Miller and Isabella are missing. ABC News reports that no one has seen or heard from either of them since November 20, not even Miller's attorneys.

Under Vermont law, Jenkins is one of Isabella's legally recognized parents. She filed a missing person report on Wednesday since she does not know the whereabouts of her daughter. Her attorney Sarah Star said Jenkins is concerned about Isabella's safety and about Miller's mental stability. ABC News also quoted a professor of constitutional law at Vermont Law School who explained that if the transfer does not take place January 1, the court will likely issue a warrant for Miller's arrest.

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#102. To: FormerLurker (#99)

Read the article again abraxas. It was the jilted lesbain who initiated the court battle, not the mother.

You read it again. The court decision was part of the initial splitting of the sheets:

Jenkins sued for unsupervised visitation, which Vermont Judge William Cohen granted after dissolving the civil union, but Miller refused to comply with the court order.

When you file your motion and go through the divorce courts, it is customary to determine child custody and visitation at that time.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   16:37:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#103. To: A K A Stone (#101)

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the BLESSINGS of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Your point?

This is referring to a blessing of liberty and prosperity. However, you think liberty only applies to some of the people some of the time when you deem that interpretation of liberty to be in line with your interpretation of morality.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   16:39:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#104. To: A K A Stone (#98)

Hey you stupid fuck. THEY WERE NEVER MARRIED. Dumbass.

lol......your panties are so tightly knotted. Civil unions in Vermont. So touchy about symantics.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   16:40:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#105. To: abraxas (#94) (Edited)

Are you saying that parents do not bond with a child who is two and under?

I'm not looking at the bond this other woman may have felt towards the little girl, but that of whatever bond the little girl may have felt towards this woman. I'd say it's probably a safe bet that the girl bonded with her natural mother rather than this other woman who was just "playing" mommy.

What is this "just a friend of her mom" crap? The two women were married, made a nursery together, changed diapers together, got up 2 am for feedings, ooohed and aaahhhed of over the first smile, first crawling, first steps.

How do YOU know this other woman did all that? Maybe she didn't give two shits about the kid, ignored her, mistreated her, and that might be why the girl's real mother left.

Or she MIGHT have been as you say, thing is, the girl is SEVEN YEARS OLD at this point, and should not be forced to live with a woman who is NOT related to her in any way, especially one who MAY want her for unsavory sexual delights.

That's a sad commentary if you think that dad's can't get action for their parental rights in court.

In interstate matters, women can kidnap children to other states and there is not ONE thing the government will do to recover them, well not in USUAL cases that is...

"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-01-01   16:43:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#106. To: abraxas (#102)

When you file your motion and go through the divorce courts, it is customary to determine child custody and visitation at that time.

Hence why there should NOT be gay marriage or gay adoption.

"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-01-01   16:45:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#107. To: abraxas (#103)

Your point?

Blessings come from God. We can't be blessed as a nation when we violate Gods Laws. Ever heard of Sodom and Gomorrah?

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   16:47:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#108. To: FormerLurker (#105)

How do YOU know this other woman did all that? Maybe she didn't give two shits about the kid, ignored her, mistreated her, and that might be why the girl's real mother left.

That would have come out in court and the court would have decided for mommy on the run. The court found the ex-wife to be FIT to parent. Mommy on the run had no case other than "newly minted Christian" which didn't get her too far.You simply do not have any evidence to substantiate your opinions, yet you keep making them over and over again to the giddy delight of AKA Stone.

Lucky you to have a new admirer.: P

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   16:48:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#109. To: FormerLurker (#106)

Hence why there should NOT be gay marriage or gay adoption.

There will never be gay marriage. Even if the govt says there is.

Also...Gays shouldn't even be allowed to be near kids (teachers) or look at them.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   16:49:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#110. To: abraxas (#102)

You read it again. The court decision was part of the initial splitting of the sheets:

Jenkins sued for unsupervised visitation

And Jenkins did not HAVE to SUE for UNSUPERVISED visitation. Apparently there was already some concern on the part of the child's mother if Jenkins had to ask for UNSUPERVISED visitation.

What it comes down to is a lesbain wants this kid, and you feel the need to support her actions and allow her to do whatever she wants with the child, to hell with the kid's life or dreams.

"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-01-01   16:49:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#111. To: abraxas (#108)

over again to the giddy delight of AKA Stone.

When referring to me get it right. There are spaces between the K and the A's. Thank You in advance.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   16:50:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#112. To: abraxas (#108)

The court found the ex-wife to be FIT to parent.

Do you have transcripts? Do you have the reports from whatever agency may have investigated? I've seen courts hand kids off to EXTREMELY unfit parents, so you have ZERO idea of how fit this other woman is, you are just stating your opinions or hunches as if they were facts.

"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-01-01   16:51:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#113. To: A K A Stone (#107)

Blessings come from God. We can't be blessed as a nation when we violate Gods Laws. Ever heard of Sodom and Gomorrah?

Why don't you read the Sermon on the Mount? That would be much more relevant to what is expected of you as a Christian than the Old Testement story of Sodom and Gomorrah.

This is the words of your savior, which you rarely seem to apply to real life. Go read.

"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you...." Sayeth your Savior.

Work on being a better Christian yourself before you attempt to teach anybody else the way.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   16:56:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#114. To: A K A Stone (#111)

When referring to me get it right. There are spaces between the K and the A's. Thank You in advance.

lol........this will be at the top of my priorty list.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   16:58:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#115. To: abraxas (#113)

"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you...." Sayeth your Savior.

What did he say about harming children?

Didn't think you would quote that one.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   16:58:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#116. To: abraxas (#114)

lol........this will be at the top of my priorty list.

Thank you. Appreciated.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   16:59:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#117. To: abraxas (#84)

Yes, I'm a parent.

I'm arriving late, obviously.

But, thank you for that revelation.

Now how about a couple of more?

What is your gender?

What is your sexual preference?

What is your occupation?

Turning and turning in the widening gyre The falcon cannot hear the falconer; Things fall apart; the center cannot hold; Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world, The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere The ceremony of innocence is drowned; The best lack all conviction, while the worst Are full of passionate intensity. .... Yeats

iconoclast  posted on  2010-01-01   17:03:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#118. To: A K A Stone (#115)

What did he say about harming children?

I still haven't seen an iota of evidence of harming children.......other than making her a fugative.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   17:04:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#119. To: iconoclast (#117)

What is your gender?

What is your sexual preference?

What is your occupation?

Female.

My preference is men.

I don't see how my profession is relevant to this discussion.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   17:06:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#120. To: abraxas (#119)

I always thought you were a guy.

Who knew? I'm finding out a lot of people on this site are actually women. I'm surprised there isn't more online dating going on. Heheheheheh.

It's never to early to stop a tyrant, nor is it ever to late to stand against Tyranny.

TommyTheMadArtist  posted on  2010-01-01   17:10:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#121. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#120)

Who knew? I'm finding out a lot of people on this site are actually women. I'm surprised there isn't more online dating going on. Heheheheheh.

Just me.....and now you. lol We women are full of surpises.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   17:14:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#122. To: abraxas (#121)

Uh... You misunderstood. I'm a guy

It's never to early to stop a tyrant, nor is it ever to late to stand against Tyranny.

TommyTheMadArtist  posted on  2010-01-01   19:04:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#123. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#122)

Uh... You misunderstood. I'm a guy

hehehe.....I wasn't including you in that we, Tommy. That was the we that includes all the women posting on LP that you thought were men. : )

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   19:16:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#124. To: abraxas (#17)

In any other divorce, the non biological parent would have rights to the child.
Not true.
Step-parents often have no legal rights to the child.
If the biological parent is fit, and the other parent is non-biological and has not adopted the child... blood goes with blood.
Because of the mothers beliefs (newly minted is moot) she did not want her child with her former gay lover. She is the mother, it's her decision.

Of course now that she has fled with her child she will probably loose everything.

-------
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."
-Carl Sagan.

Armadillo  posted on  2010-01-01   19:38:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#125. To: abraxas (#119)

Female.
My preference is men.

WTF.
I also thought you were male.
You post like a man. ;)

Now that your secret is out... I might flirt with you.

-------
"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."
-Carl Sagan.

Armadillo  posted on  2010-01-01   19:45:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#126. To: Armadillo (#124)

Because of the mothers beliefs (newly minted is moot) she did not want her child with her former gay lover. She is the mother, it's her decision. Of course now that she has fled with her child she will probably loose everything.

Now, according the the great state that granted her wish to marry her lesbian lover, what she wants today is not as relevant has what she wanted a couple of years ago when she married her wife.

Be careful what you wish for, eh? Vermont used to be so darn great when it gave her what she wanted and now it's aweful because if doesn't grant her new wishes that support her new beliefs.

Doesn't matter that now she no longer wants the child around her former gay lover. It matters what her initial intentions were regarding this child and her ex-wife, according to the court.

Yep, she will probably loose everything.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   19:50:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#127. To: Armadillo (#125)

WTF. I also thought you were male. You post like a man. ;)

Now that your secret is out... I might flirt with you.

I must not be nagging enough on my posts. Maybe a few emotional outbursts would help. Oh, and an occasional tirade at least once a month for good measure. lol

I'm all a blush. : )

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   19:57:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#128. To: Armadillo (#124)

Not true. Step-parents often have no legal rights to the child. If the biological parent is fit, and the other parent is non-biological and has not adopted the child... blood goes with blood.

Good point. Actually, it depends on the state. In some states a woman can screw around while she is married, yet her husband is still on the hook for child support even if the baby isn't his.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   20:00:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#129. To: abraxas (#118)

What did he say about harming children?

I still haven't seen an iota of evidence of harming children.......other than making her a fugative.

Your confused. I understand there are a lot of posts.

The "he" in my comment was God.

What did God say about harming children?

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   20:12:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#130. To: abraxas (#123)

Ah... The feminine We, as opposed to the other.

No worries. Still recovering from last nights 2 beer drunken-ness.

It's never to early to stop a tyrant, nor is it ever to late to stand against Tyranny.

TommyTheMadArtist  posted on  2010-01-01   20:27:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#131. To: abraxas (#119)

I don't see how my profession is relevant to this discussion.

My guess was lawyer.

Turning and turning in the widening gyre The falcon cannot hear the falconer; Things fall apart; the center cannot hold; Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world, The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere The ceremony of innocence is drowned; The best lack all conviction, while the worst Are full of passionate intensity. .... Yeats

iconoclast  posted on  2010-01-01   22:04:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#132. To: abraxas (#121)

What....your not a dude?

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   22:08:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#133. To: iconoclast (#131)

My guess was lawyer.

Well, I agree that would be relevant to this discussion. I did work for a lawfirm for years, which impacts my perspective. I tend to look at the aspects of this case without the religious dogma and view Miller as using religious dogma to make her case, which is legally weak.

A few facts are pertinent. Miller moved to Virginia and filed suit AFTER Virginia initiated a law that specifically does not recogonize civil unions. Initially, she moved from Virginia to Vermont because Vermont recognized civil unions and allowed her to marry her same sex lover.

I say the initial move and contract entered into sets precedent. The two agreed on visitation and support initially. Jenkins paid child support to Miller prior to Miller filing for sole custody rights in Virginia. Miller cashed the checks. Miller also had Jenkins help pick out the sperm donor as well as help pay for the procedure and pregnancy.

Then she had a religious "conversion" and moved to a state that had a pending law to nullify the rights of her previously entered into civil union. She promptly filed to terminate the rights of her ex-wife. A lower court agreed, but a higher court went with Jenkins on appeal.

Miller states that Jenkins hasn't seen the child in years, but this is only due to that fact that Miller refuses to comply with the court order and visitation schedule. Now, due to her contempt of court sole custody of the child has been granted to Jenkins.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   22:34:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#134. To: abraxas (#133)

You are a classic example of why not to let women vote.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   22:41:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#135. To: A K A Stone (#132)

What....your not a dude?

Not a dude. Fucking moron wasn't it?

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   22:41:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#136. To: abraxas (#133)

She promptly filed to terminate the rights of her ex-wife.

Are you kidding me you f@ck@n moron? A woman cannot have a wife. Why do you queers have to try to pervert the language. If you want to go down on women then by all means do it. But quit fucking pretending that a woman can marry a woman.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   22:43:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#137. To: A K A Stone (#134)

You are a classic example of why not to let women vote.

Why is that? Because I actually think state rights matter, unlike you who think people can hop from one state to the next to promote whatever legal case they might have pending.

Because you think that religious dogma makes a case? Oh, that's right, you think all laws are moral.......lol. All laws are connected to God, right? I think I need not present any further evidence on my case that you are not equipped with enough intelligence to determine who should be voting and who should not.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   22:46:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#138. To: abraxas (#137)

Your the moron who can't even tell me why murder and stealing is wrong.

You have made the case that you are a POS brain dead liberal and possibly a homosexual woman who goes down on little girls.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   22:48:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#139. To: A K A Stone (#136)

Are you kidding me you f@ck@n moron? A woman cannot have a wife. Why do you queers have to try to pervert the language. If you want to go down on women then by all means do it. But quit fucking pretending that a woman can marry a woman.

Oh, yes, we return again to the symantics issue. Partner in civil union.

Why are you calling me a queer, asswipe? You continue to astound me with your ignorance.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   22:49:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#140. To: A K A Stone (#138)

You have made the case that you are a POS brain dead liberal and possibly a homosexual woman who goes down on little girls.

What's your evidence of this asswipe? I'm no liberal. In fact, I am the one promoting RESPONSIBILITY for actions and contracts entered into. You, on the other hand, take the liberal argument that she doesn't have to live up to her obligations any longer because she has a new religion. What a pant load.

Maybe with all your anger toward homosexuals, it is you who are expressing your own short coming in regards to this issue. Look how emotional you get....lol. Having a tirade, spewing insults, making vulgar accusations in an attempt to piss me off (which isn't working dimwit).......it's all so Christian of you.

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-01-01   22:53:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#141. To: abraxas (#139)

Because you are likely a closeted queer. You just don't want to admit it here because of the fallout you would receive. Anyone who champtions the cause of queers like you do is very likely a queer. There is an 8 percent chance that you are not one.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   22:53:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

#142. To: abraxas (#140)

What's your evidence of this asswipe? I'm no liberal.

You are a liberal. By your support of queer "marriage" you have shown yourself to be a liberal. Quit pretending your not.

Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it - Thomas Jefferson

A K A Stone  posted on  2010-01-01   22:55:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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