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Title: Tea Party Becomes the 'Vote Our Way or We Shoot You' Party
Source:
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URL Source: http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/ ... r_way_or_we_shoot_you%27_party
Published: Jan 17, 2010
Author: posted by Devilstower , Daily Kos
Post Date: 2010-01-17 00:37:18 by Ferret Mike
Keywords: None
Views: 1190
Comments: 86
"We can go to the soap box, the ballot box, or we can go to the jury box. And hopefully we won't have to go to the bullet box." Hey, the Tea Party "movement" isn't about violence, or racism, or any of that stuff. It's about calling the health care bill Nazi-inspired and reminding people that Barack Obama is an Indonesian Muslim. Oh, and remember to vote our way or we shoot you. On-Point Host, Tom Ashbrook: Joining us from Royal Oak, Michigan, is Jeffrey McQueen, founder of USRevolution2.com, which has created a modified American flag to serve as a symbol for the Tea Party movement. He has been protesting government involvement in the auto industry at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit this week. ... Ashbrook: if the Tea Party works out for you, to your vision, what will we see in ten years? McQueen: Well I hope across America no politician will travel this country without seeing this flag so they're reminded of who they work for. Ashbrook: How about the American flag? That's not good enough? You know, the stars and stripes? McQueen: This flag has never been meant to replace the national flag. This flag has a specific purpose and it's time has come. To show the politicians and the media that we're ready for a second American revolution. And with that, you know, in America we have a choice of four boxes for political change. We can go to the soap box, the ballot box, or we can go to the jury box. And hopefully we won't have to go to the bullet box. Ashbrook: Bullet box? Are you talking about armed revolution? McQueen: Have you seen the ammunition sales the last twelve months? So remember, folks, health care for the poor? That's Nazi BS! True American heroes take up arms to overthrow democratic elections. Got it? And of course, this isn't the first time that conservatives have raised the idea of using the bullet box to undo the results of those pesky elections. So vote conservative and all is well. Screw it up at the ballot box, and that'll have to get rec-t-fied by my leetle friend here. Got it?
Catherine Crabill, a Republican nominee for Virginia House of Delegates: We have a chance to fight this battle at the ballot box before we have to resort to the bullet box. I am glad for all of us who enjoy the use of firearms for hunting, but make no mistake, that was not the intent of the Founding Fathers. Our second amendment right was to guard against tyranny.
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#47. To: Ferret Mike (#0)
Heh! It's the liberal morons who are always chanting: "No justice, no peace" as they demand another increase in entitlements.
Have you ever considered taking a course in American history?
You very well could be correct, but if the legislative game changes, he is going to have a hard time not responding to criticism from the fold to move into showing more aggressive leadership and less finesse as a manager of his agenda through Congress. Personally I prefer the House's health care bill, and this all does not make much sense unless there is a single payer option to this, and more help for lower income families in getting health insurance. Myself, I have the Veteran's Administration giving me my health care. I am having a broken dental bridge replaced at no cost to me, and when I got helped in falling from that Incense Cedar so many years ago, they paid for all the rehab care I got to restore dexterity and function to my arms. The big beneficiaries of my subsidized health care are Earth Island Institute and Sea Sheppard, the folks working to save dolphins and whales. I have been able to donate lots of time and money to the cause because I am spared these expenses. I am hoping the Democratic candidate can pull a win out of her not very competent butt, but if that does not happen and she loses, I never begrudge the system a more worthy candidate. As I said, he really won't have proved himself until he wins a full term of his own, and a win by him could actually hurt the GOP's traction this midterm election. It will be interesting to watch how this plays out. Your views - while I do not concur with many of them I find well thought out and interesting to ponder, though I hope you are wrong on many of your points about this POTUS.
Heh, I considered, took, and passed Advanced Perception American History in high school and at the University of Oregon. Though I have learned most of what I know from what reading and studying of this topic I have done on my own. ;-)
Are you out of your mind? How much more help do lower income families need than SCHIP, Medicaid, Medicare, and HSA's? Why should middle income citizens get screwed having to pay higher income tax and higher health insurance premiums for mediocre plans all so "lower income families can get more help". Everyone is tired of hearing that Dem Party refrain. Why don't Dem Party voters give more $ out of their wallets to support charities if they feel so concerned about "lower income families." The fact is I read of a study that looked at charitable giving by Dems and GOP and red state GOP voters were far and away the most generous in charitable donations. Dem voters like you talk the talk but don't walk the walk - Dem voters expect everyone else to collectively "give" because they themselves are too cheap to "give" as individuals.
I guess my question for you is this. Do you honestly believe that health care is a right? An inalienable human right? Because if you do, then you must also believe that Slavery is good. That is what this bill makes us ALL. Slaves. So if you want your slavery, find someone to be your master. I have no want of a master, nor have I desire to be the property of anyone else. I just paid $5500.00 in my own expenses for a Kidney Stone, out of pocket. Without having health insurance. I'd prefer to keep it that way, because by working for myself, and paying my own way, my ability to take care of my family, as well as my own interests has saved my neighbors and other taxpayers from having to pay for it.
It is better to be hated for what you are, than loved for what you are not. - Tommy The Mad Artist.
And yet, given the circumstances of the very birth of the American nation, you claim that calling for armed insurrection when the ruling government becomes tyrannical is un-American. That's a pretty sad commentary on the quality of education at U of O. There's a man you've probably never heard of called Thomas Paine. He wrote a piece called "Common Sense" that you'll be interested to discover. Check here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_S ense_ Most people would consider Thomas Paine a rather American character.
that's because most D voters are the recipients of government largesse. they want the haves to support the have nots.
Why should middle income citizens get screwed having to pay higher income tax and higher health insurance premiums for mediocre plans all so "lower income families can get more help". Everyone is tired of hearing that Dem Party refrain. Why don't Dem Party voters give more $ out of their wallets to support charities if they feel so concerned about "lower income families." The fact is I read of a study that looked at charitable giving by Dems and GOP and red state GOP voters were far and away the most generous in charitable donations. Dem voters like you talk the talk but don't walk the walk - Dem voters expect everyone else to collectively "give" because they themselves are too cheap to "give" as individuals. B-U-M-P
lol.....one would only get this defensive about the article if they had something vested in it, Mike. Okay, so you feel the need to defend Daily KOS. Knock yourself out. I just asked you some simple questions about why you posted it and what your intent was, nothing more nothing less. My prurient interest? Whine? Give me a break. No control issues with me, just attempting to figure out where you are coming from. I'll not waste my time with such a stupid fishing expedition in the future. We both know how defensive you are about any person daring to call Daily KOS commentary butt wipe. Feel? I don't feel anything about this article. It is you who feels too much, no need to project.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Yes, I am familiar with Thomas Paine. Now run along and have a nice insurrection, and if I disagree with you that one is called for, so it goes. By the way Buzz, Tomas Paine pissed most Americans off because of his criticisms and ridicule of Christianity. Was he right on in that opinion too? You do know that only six people showed up to his funeral because of this I hope.
It is you making this tempest in a teapot, not me. Frankly, your question was just dumb. And the article source den mother routine is an old one, so why should I have patience with you playing it?
The bridge is for a service related injury resulting in a tooth loss, I am paying for the teeth cleaning and other dental work being done at the same time out of pocket. I don't feel guilty having the VA pay for a new bridge, as it is in regard to something the Army has responsibility for.
I don't consider the VA to be a form of slavery for the Tax Payer, as our taxes go to pay for the benefits of those who have given their time to protect this nation. What I consider to be slavery, is when a government tells me that I MUST buy insurance at an outrageous price, or be imprisoned. I consider that a form of slavery, which you obviously are in favor of, since you completely dodged my question for you. Way to go Mike. Can fight for your country, but roll over for big government's slavery plan to make you the lapdog of an insurance company.
It is better to be hated for what you are, than loved for what you are not. - Tommy The Mad Artist.
Most people post articles to actually discuss the content, apparently that isn't your intent. Hence, I was attempting to pin point your intent.....but that was obviously a waste of time. There were several questions ignored about the article, but plenty of defense of not only the article but the source. No den mother, just attempting to see if you ACTUALLY agree with the stupid commentary. Apparently you do. You would rather post your defensive stance than cough up any substance, like I said, I won't waste my time twice. lol....you are so emotional when it comes to Daily KOS. It's like your Bible.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
but Fairy Mike is obviously a waste of time.
Whoever would return government to the "will of the people" must first return the United States to the use of CONSTITUTIONAL COINAGE as a medium of exchange and through it return the Constitution as law in the United States.
I'm not in favor of a revolution at this time. I think the end result would be worse than what we have now. I'm just pointing out your ignorance when you claim that calling for revolution is unAmerican. It is inherently American from our very founding. Yes, Paine was right about religion, and I sincerely doubt it bothered him that few people attended his funeral. After all, he was dead. Besides, he'll be remembered with respect long after you're dead, buried and forgotten, no matter how big the crowd that attends your funeral.
Well, had I understood you were talking about writings and the thinking of some of the Founding Fathers, I likely would have anwered quite differently. If but for the words of Thomas Jefferson on insurrection.
Actually, no one is to be imprisoned for not getting health insurance, they plan on increasing the tax rate for those without insurance. Not to mention I don't feel there to be a real change unless there is a single payer opion independent from insurance companies.
Since there is no bill, in which version, the House or the Senate, can this be found?
seconded. And if that causes the insurance industry to go boom, couldn't happen to a better bunch. Also, if all the countries with national Health care can do it and if it comes to pass that the US cannot - then the answer will be there for all to see - we will be proved to be a second rate republic.
"Satan / Cheney in "08" I only know from what I read in the papers (apologies to Will Rodgers). Most stories about the proposed changes planned talk about how a person's tax rate would go up if they did not have insurance. I have not read either bills, or don't think I would have the patience to in any event seeing how long they are.
I think the biggest portion of the government largesse goes to Republican voters. Certainly, in absolute dollar terms, the amount of money given to Republican Wall Streeters, Republican Military-Industrial Complex members and Republican senior citizens on Social Security and Medicare far exceeds the dollars out of the federal budget which go to the stereotypical D voters to which you refer. (Seniors were the only group which went for McCain.) I'm not saying you're wrong about the D voters. I'm just saying that if we eliminated all the D voters and their programs, there'd still be trillions of dollars being spent by the federal government each year. It really is not reversible. The moment they try to put the Wall Street/Pentagon corporate welfare bums on a diet, what's left of the economy immediately crashes and burns again.
“I would give no thought of what the world might say of me, if I could only transmit to posterity the reputation of an honest man.” - Sam Houston
Who in America should be entitled to this single payer insurance, and how should it be funded?
Well JT, we are entitled to be carted off to fight in wars provoked for reasons that are not clear decades later. If the US cannot give it's citizens something as basic as a modicum floor health care system, then we need to fire all those involved with it. The problem may well be in firing them, as so far it hasn't worked very well, and I'll point it out before you do, as it is a valid issue - the US gov appears to be rather corrupt. But the system we have is a expensive monstrosity, with insurance companies in the cat bird seat. I am pretty sure you are aware that if you have a, say, heart attack, no insurance, the bill for a few days hospitalization will be about $95,000. (this comes from a real event). If you were covered by a decent insurance plan the bill would come to about $24,000. So the guy who has no insurance is now working the rest of his life for the hospital, unless he's wealthy. And the hospital claims it's loosing money because of this, and gets support from the city, or taxpayers, of course. And the covered guy now is paying very high insurance payments because he had the gall to actually use his policy.And he can't change insurance because he has a pre existing condition. This now more represents an extortion racket than a spreading the risk over a large group, which is what insurance represents it's self to be. Attila the Hun on a triple tab of LSD couldn't come up with a less fair or productive health care system. As far as funding - we fund it now and then some with all of the corruption and stupid inefficenties that have morphed on it. Disconnecting the service from the cost was the collossial blunder made back in the 1950's when the business health insurance tax exemption was put into law.
"Satan / Cheney in "08" I don't think people realize how much control they would give up with a federal health insurance system. I know that we are being presented with difficult choices due to runaway health care costs and an aging population. Inflation presents citizens with such ugly dilemmas. We should be addressing the root causes of inflation instead of providing universal health insurance. But this is considered "a good thing" by the Establishment and its dutiful servants. With universal health care, the government will not only be able to use the Patriot Acts to access your personal health information, they will have it right inside their own databases. We are not moving toward greater freedom with centralized health care. We are moving deeper, by leaps and bounds, into tyranny. How often do the Tea Partiers talk about the Federal Reserve? It's our main problem.
So, just to understand your argument, you're saying people like me would pick up the medical insurance tab for an alcoholic, smoker, morbidly obese, drug user, bungee jumper, motor cycle operator, skate board using (fill in any other risky behaviours) person out there, and toss in illegal aliens to boot? As part owner of their policy, do I have the right to tell them to drop the Twinkies, lose the gin & Chesterfields?
And while we're at it, illegal aliens? The third world immigrants that every other congress seems to welcome?
I fully understand the infringement government would bring in terms of our privacy. Regarding the FedRes, if you want to put a room full of curious people to sleep, give them a lecture on the Fed. Now, if you want revolution, tell them those guys in Washington are stealing our money, and want more.
Republicans do that all the time. But when it comes to obtaining free money (theft via inflation) to fight wars for Israel, big oil, and so forth — they're mum. As long as they want war, the tea partiers won't make any difference. If people aren't willing to talk about the Fed, nothing will change.
I hope we all 'get' the sugar cube analogy; place one out in your lawn on a summer evening and by morning it's black. That's what would happen the moment this government makes it EVEN EASIER to get "free" health care. Every non producer from around the globe would come to America for the last sip of milk and honey.
Imagine the third world nurses being brought here to make up for the demand. And the third world doctors. Of course medical education costs and support for American citizens to get their degrees will continue diminishing.
Have you ever tried to discuss the Fed with a group of people? I understand the importance, but the subject matter doesn't sell. Don't shoot the messengere here. Sheeple will react to hot button issues (health care) and not some esoteric subject that makes for marvelous think tank white papers.
The only important things aren't making an impact. Yes, I know.
And while this medical infrastructure is being built, we will have our care rationed. There's no way around it.
I'm reminded at this moment of Joe Wilson shouting the truth (due to illegals eventually getting amnesty in Obama's mind) and the media setting aside the issue and focusing instead on decorum. Obama lies, and the poor soul who stands up to speak the truth is called rude.
Why, everybody in America, except whitey, Citizen Tull, especially illegal aliens. By whitey, of course.
But that isn't fair, Citizen Esso. I have no more to give for government programs. I'm thinking that's why we have a new asshat in the "Dead Teddy Kennedy" seat in the Senate. All the new guy said to get elected was to say "NO" to health care. Ya' think such a radical idea might be aped by the apes?
JT - that is already the case. When the bungee jumpers show up at the hospital with a broken neck you and I pay for it. When we go to the hospital for a broken thumb.
"Satan / Cheney in "08" That wasn't the case w/my son w/ a broken foot. He thought he'd get by w.o insurance. He's making payments. So no, it isn't that way with everyone, only a certain segment of society. And again, please remind us how thier plan will be funded? I heard O say more than $500 billion would come from cutting fraud and waste from Medicare and Medicaid. Tom, he doesn't need a bill to do that, but he can't do that because the mofo reeks of dead fish. Don't ask me, ask the folks up in Mass. They voted Brown in because Coakely couldn't answer the basic questions I'm asking. The bill can't be priced because they have no idea how many people will be on it a year from now, two years from now, etc. Big government isn't the answer, and if it's forced on people who are maxed out, they are inviting trouble.
#48. To: Ferret Mike (#4)
Protest, regardless of the quarter it comes from, is as American as apple pie, but calling for armed insurrection is ignorant.
#49. To: Jethro Tull (#46)
#50. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#48)
"Have you ever considered taking a course in American history?"
#51. To: Ferret Mike (#49)
Personally I prefer the House's health care bill, and this all does not make much sense unless there is a single payer option to this, and more help for lower income families in getting health insurance.
#52. To: Ferret Mike (#49)
#53. To: Ferret Mike (#50)
Heh, I considered, took, and passed Advanced Perception American History in high school and at the University of Oregon. Though I have learned most of what I know from what reading and studying of this topic I have done on my own. ;-)
#54. To: scrapper2 (#51)
Dem voters expect everyone else to collectively "give" because they themselves are too cheap to "give" as individuals.
#55. To: scrapper2 (#51)
Are you out of your mind? How much more help do lower income families need than SCHIP, Medicaid, Medicare, and HSA's?
#56. To: Ferret Mike (#43)
#57. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#53)
#58. To: abraxas (#56)
#59. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#52)
#60. To: Ferret Mike (#59)
#61. To: Ferret Mike (#58)
#62. To: abraxas (#61)
but that was obviously a waste of time.
#63. To: Ferret Mike (#57)
(Edited)
Now run along and have a nice insurrection, and if I disagree with you that one is called for, so it goes. By the way Buzz, Tomas Paine pissed most Americans off because of his criticisms and ridicule of Christianity. Was he right on in that opinion too? You do know that only six people showed up to his funeral because of this I hope.
#64. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#63)
#65. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#60)
(Edited)
#66. To: Ferret Mike (#65)
Actually, no one is to be imprisoned for not getting health insurance, they plan on increasing the tax rate for those without insurance.
#67. To: Ferret Mike (#65)
Not to mention I don't feel there to be a real change unless there is a single payer opion independent from insurance companies.
#68. To: Jethro Tull (#66)
#69. To: christine (#54)
#70. To: tom007, Ferret Mike (#67)
#71. To: Jethro Tull (#70)
(Edited)
Who in America should be entitled to this single payer insurance, and how should it be funded?
#72. To: Jethro Tull, tom007, Ferret Mike, scrapper2, Cynicom (#70)
#73. To: tom007 (#71)
#74. To: Jethro Tull, tom007 (#73)
#75. To: Deasy (#72)
#76. To: Jethro Tull (#75)
#77. To: Deasy (#74)
#78. To: Jethro Tull (#77)
#79. To: Deasy (#76)
If people aren't willing to talk about the Fed, nothing will change.
#80. To: Jethro Tull (#79)
#81. To: Deasy (#78)
Imagine the third world nurses being brought here to make up for the demand. And the third world doctors. Of course medical education costs and support for American citizens to get their degrees will continue diminishing.
#82. To: Jethro Tull (#81)
#83. To: Jethro Tull (#70)
Who in America should be entitled to this single payer insurance...
and how should it be funded?
Mike Flaherty: Yeah, it's been there a long time. I wish I knew which corner.
My Man Godfrey (1936)
#84. To: Esso (#83)
#85. To: Jethro Tull (#73)
So, just to understand your argument, you're saying people like me would pick up the medical insurance tab for an alcoholic, smoker, morbidly obese, drug user, bungee jumper, motor cycle operator, skate board using (fill in any other risky behaviours) person out there, and toss in illegal aliens to boot?
#86. To: tom007 (#85)
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