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Title: TooConservative claims that "Nearly all of the Truthers were originally Dim liberals"
Source:
TOS2
URL Source: http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=284970
Published: Mar 5, 2010
Author: TooConservative
Post Date: 2010-03-05 12:00:55 by F.A. Hayek Fan
Keywords: None
Views: 668
Comments: 113
#8. To: Gatlin (#6) One article described Bedell as an "obsessed libertarian" ... but neglected to say what was meant by "obsessed." Nearly all of the Truthers were originally Dim liberals and Bush-haters. Not dissimilar to the IRS plane-bomber. They then tried to use Ron Paul's campaign as their own political vehicle even though they had little success in recruiting the RP folk to their cause. This is when some of them started calling themselves libertarians. They have persisted in this long after Ron Paul repudiated Trutherism across the board. You can see why I keep saying that the Tea Parties need to repel boarders (Birchers, Birthers, Truthers, etc.) who demand that they be allowed to use Tea Party events to promote their own agenda. Too Conservative posted on 2010-03-05 11:48:37 ET Reply Trace
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I'm not a so-called truther and never have been, however this statement is as wrong as rain.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
I am a "questioner" and a truther because I don't believe the government fairytale ... and I'm also conservative.
The World is being held hostage by an international terrorist organization best described as INTERNATIONAL (JEWISH) BANKERS. Their willing accomplices in government and media should swing from the rope just like the banking elites.
I do not believe it either, however I do not consider myself a truther because I do not waste my time worrying about it. Nothing can be proved and even if it could it would be ignored by the media, the government and the average voter. I consider it a waste of time to argue about it. I am content in knowing that the government was behind it and others can believe what they want. I am a classical liberal who has never voted for a Democan and only voted for a Republicrat twice - once for Reagen and once for Ron Paul in the Republican Primary.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
oh, really? not in my experience. i can't think of any Truther i know who was ever a "dim liberal." Constitutional Truthseekers would be a more accurate label. it's amazing how the word truth(er) is being redefined as something bad. how wicked people are who dare to question the government and who seek truth. what a sick, evil culture this is. Edit: i just love how you and others are making 9/11 a Republican/Democrat issue. it's not. it's a truth versus lies issue.
I'm so conservative that i haven't voted since 72. I also hate the left/right paradigm because it divides the people unnecessarily and allows the perps to retain power.
The World is being held hostage by an international terrorist organization best described as INTERNATIONAL (JEWISH) BANKERS. Their willing accomplices in government and media should swing from the rope just like the banking elites.
TooConservative really ought to, for sake of truth in advertising, change its handle to "TooNeoTrotskyConservative". What part of evidence does this creature not get? The evidence presented by the official Government Cover Story for 911 does not square with easily available evidence in the public record. The very minimum one can conclude is that the official fairy tale is not true. Given the extent of time, the continued withholding of the Pentagon Surveillance Videos, and the repeated changes in the explanations to try and account for the contradictions it can only be concluded that it is willfully and intentionally not true. I just love the term "Bush Haters" to describe anyone who points out the serial dishonesty and mass murder of the Bush Junta. Hate? No. The facts, for anyone willing to look at them honestly and objectively, clearly demonstrate that Bush lied, and lied repeatedly. Those lies resulted in the looting of the American Treasury, the unnecessary deaths of thousands of American kids sent off to fight his criminal wars, and the deaths of millions of innocents in Afghanistan and Iran. (Klinton too was guilty of mass murder in Kosovo - just to give equal time.) My record is clear and consistent as a Paleocon/Paleolibertarian and is an open book going back years. Where this moron gets off calling anyone willing to objectively look at what story the facts tell rather than regurgitating propaganda a ((((shudder))))) "lib'rul" is the height of dishonesty. So, let us name TooNeoConservative for what it is: A moron incapable of observing obvious facts or a willing liar. It IS one or the other.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
In the past some of the greatest minds have sought the truth, Aristotle, Newton, etc. and have made huge advances for man kind. Since 911, those who seek the truth are demonized, mocked and ridiculed... things that make you go......................hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
I volunteered extensively for the Paul campaign in the Springfield, MO area and spent many an hour listening to Paul supporters (almost all Republicrats, Independents, and Libertarians) discuss 9/11 while stuffing door bags. While not all were die hard truthers, not a one of us believed the government and almost to a man we all believed that the government was involved in some way, shape or form. As someone who claims to be a Ron Paul supporter, I really do not understand the desire to slime fellow supporters just because you disagree with their beliefs.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
I think people are capable of thinking about the events of 9-11 regardless of their political leanings. Frankly, I think it's a stupid suggestion.
The World is being held hostage by an international terrorist organization best described as INTERNATIONAL (JEWISH) BANKERS. Their willing accomplices in government and media should swing from the rope just like the banking elites.
well said.
GMTA. see my post above. ;)
This would gut the Tea Party movement, leaving a handful of neocons wandering around eating their lox and bagels.
_________________________________________________________________________ oh, really? not in my experience. i can't think of any Truther i know who was ever a "dim liberal." Constitutional Truthseekers would be a more accurate label. it's amazing how the word truth(er) is being redefined as something bad. how wicked people are who dare to question the government and who seek truth. what a sick, evil culture this is. Whenever I see someone use the planted PsyOp/Negative PR term "truther" (an intentional diminuitive used to degrade someone for seeking a true explanation for 911 that makes sense and squares with the easily available facts), or the term "Bush Hater" for that criminal "occupant" of the White House, it immediately classifies them as one of two things: 1. A moron incapable of observing the obvious. 2. Intellectually dishonest either because they are unwilling to decide based on facts and prefer the comfort of a propaganda fairy tale or because they are in the employ of someone who finds the truth "inconvenient" or dangerous. There really are no other choices. When such an entity feels the need to degrade others by telling lies, and casting aspersions it demonstrates one thing and one thing clearly: D-I-S-H-O-N-E-S-T-Y.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
I guess that movement now boils down to the few remaining globalists/Neos on LP & FReeperville and Sarah Palin.
I reject the word outright. I look upon Bush and his party with contempt, not hate. I hate no man. I do not see how any self-proclaimed conservative Republican can feel anything but contempt by the actions of Bush and the Republican party. The actions of Bush and his party is a textbook example of betrayal. Bush-hater is just another way to slime those who refuse to toe the line of the two-party fraud.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
If you've ever posted on a liberal or Dem forum as I have (DU, from which I was banned in 2005, three years after being banned from FR), you'll already know that, because of the inevitable connections to Israel which come up, the moderators do NOT allow Truther discussions for very long. I believe I was banned from that Dem forum because I used the Mossad motto "By way of deception, thou shalt do war" in reference to the 7-7-2005 London Subway bombings. I didn't even point out it WAS the Mossad motto, but I guess it struck a nerve. The site is based in NYC and run by Jews. Very few sites really allow for free speech. This is one of the few I've found that does.
“I would give no thought of what the world might say of me, if I could only transmit to posterity the reputation of an honest man.” - Sam Houston
Perhaps you would like to explain how these leading 9/11 Truthers are and have always been conservatives. Other conspiracy theories are of the more rubber room variety: i.e. the “no planers” who suggest that no commercial aircraft could penetrate the steel of the Trade Center towers and that missiles surrounded by holograms were used in a trick that would likely force Criss Angel into a jealous retirement (and not a moment too soon). Then there are those of an anti-Semitic mindset who think it was a Jewish conspiracy, believing – based on completely false information – that 4,000 Jewish people didn’t show up to work at WTC that day because they were somehow tipped off, maybe in a newsletter. Most 9/11 conspiracy theories have been debunked to the point where there is hardly any bunk left to take out. (Click here and here for two of the best). Even Noam Chomsky, who could find a fascist plot afoot in Dora the Explorer, had this to say on 9/11 conspiracy theories: I think the Bush administration would have had to be utterly insane to try anything like what is alleged, for their own narrow interests, and do not think that serious evidence has been provided to support claims about actions that would not only be outlandish, for their own interests, but that have no remote historical parallel. And Matt Taibbi of Rolling Stone offers the following concise review of a popular online documentary that is a favorite of 9/11 conspiracy theorists: “Every time one of those Loose Change dickwads opens his mouth, a Republican somewhere picks up five votes.” The world we live in – where Bono is asked to do more at a G-8 summit than stay away from it – is one where celebrities have the power to propagate half-baked conspiracy theories, and fans, waylaid by the combined assault of celebrity-dom and the internet on common sense, lap it up. Celebrities may not have an ever-loving clue about the temperature at which steel loses its structural integrity, but their fame will somehow give them the green light to publicly disagree with a professional association of engineers and reckon out loud, “Nah, they just could not have fallen that way. The physics just don’t add up.” We started this blog with a quote by Bill Maher, undoubtedly a celebrity, but after watching the excellent Religulous, we put him in the camp of comedians with more to offer than jokes about misplaced socks like George Carlin, or Lenny Bruce before he went insane. Organizers at public events that these 10 celebrities are attending may want to be near a plug so they can pull it once they get on the topic of 9/11 — or at least have some air freshener on hand to help mask the heady bouquet of bullshit in the air. Here then are The Top 10 9/11 Celebrity Conspiracy Theory Nutjobs! .. Don’t we all. In England, most people would agree that these two are a pair of pratts before hearing the surname. Spencer and Heidi, best known for their turn on the self-indulgent rich kid zoo called The Hills, prove the danger of giving a broadband internet connection to people with basic literacy skills and the inability to think critically. Their “non-stop” research on the internet combined with Jones’ conspiracy video led them not only to believe that 9/11 was an inside job, but the toe-headed pair were also clued into the fact that a secret plot to install chips in people is fulfilling biblical prophecy — Heidi: “My body belongs to Jesus Christ. I am a disciple of Jesus, and I will speak out to Christians … this chip is the end of humanity.” — and, continuing on in that vein of the oxygen-deprived religious nutcase, that birth control pills are actually just turds from Satan’s rabbit — “most women are suicidal sometimes on it.” Crazy conspiracy theorist right up there with those getting signals from the mothership via the beer fridge? Not so, says Heidi. “Conspiracy is a word they’ve created to make people sound crazy, but that’s not what God says,” she says. “You can persecute us, you can say whatever you want. ” And, unfortunately, the same holds true for these two. Woody Harrelson has gone from wiping down the bar at Cheers to serving as the poster boy for every sort of liberal/hippy cause imaginable, including good ones like legalizing marijuana. Woody has the rare and odd distinction of being not only the propagator of a popular conspiracy theory, but the son of a subject of a major one. His father, Charles Harrelson, was widely thought by conspiracy theorists to have been one of the “Three Tramps” seen in a box car behind Dealey Plaza after JFK was assassinated. The elder Harrelson first denied then boasted about his role in JFK’s murder, though — like the claims of a government turning against its own people on 9/11 — no solid supporting evidence was ever found to place him in Dallas that day. This quote by Mos Def — who undeniably turned in the best performance ever by an American hip-hop star in a British science-fiction comedy film — must have at least partially inspired the quote at the top of this blog. Mos Def made this statement amid a litany of craziness that included him stating that the moon landing was faked on an episode of Real Time With Bill Maher. Willie Nelson is one of the greatest country music songwriters of all time, a man who did his best to get out of paying taxes for as long as possible, and the face of fun old guy pot smoking… It is hard to find a cooler person than Willie Nelson. But his 9/11 conspiracy theory, predicated as it is on his having seen a building being blown up in Vegas, is like that idea for a novel you scribble down while higher than an eagle with a rocket up its ass – it seems brilliant while one’s burning, but is best binned and forgotten by the time you get off the couch. For those who ‘blinked’ and missed Blink 182’s one hit song, they were part of the skate punk movement, the founders of which are now in their mid-30s and probably wear all sorts of padding to stave off injury in the event of a fall. DeLonge takes Willie’s controlled demolition theory a step further, by saying — with the certainty only someone who knows exactly nothing about what he’s talking about can muster — that the 9/11 hijackers would not have been skilled enough as pilots to stage the attacks. Salon.com in an Ask The Pilot article addressing 9/11 questions, quoted someone who did fly planes for living as saying:”…Striking the Pentagon, or navigating along the Hudson River to Manhattan on a cloudless morning, with the sole intention of steering head-on into a building, did not require a mastery of airmanship.” DeLonge went for the low-hanging fruit by playing on everybody who isn’t peculiar’s dislike for Dick Cheney when he said the the then-vice president “knew that the planes [were] coming in and he capped the order to leave it alone so it could hit.” Blink 182 times if you believe: a) a conspiracy this big could ever have come off without someone spilling the beans and providing definitive proof of said beans and b) that the tongues of everyone who knew anything about said conspiracy would still be capable of wagging and not be, say, out of their heads. 5) Marion Cotillard: “We see other towers of the same kind being hit by planes. Are they burned? There was a tower, I believe it was in Spain, which burnt for 24 hours. It never collapsed. None of these towers collapsed. And there [in NY], in a few minutes, the whole thing collapsed.” It pains us to cast aspersions on a hot French actress who undoubtedly sounded very sexy while saying these crazy things, but, in addition to the above, Marion Cotillard — Oscar winner, 2008 –offered what is likely THE craziest reason anyone has come up with to explain why the US blew up the towers: it was to avoid all that pesky upkeep! “It was a money sucker because they were finished, it seems to me, by 1973, and to re-cable all that, to bring up-to-date all the technology and everything, it was a lot more expensive, that work, than destroying them.” (Trade Center official getting an estimate on renovations prior to 9/11): “How much? And the re-cabling? You sure you didn’t add just add an extra zero there? What are you guys, union? Screw that noise. Let’s blow it up.” We reckon even the no planers would be saying, “What the hell is she going on about?” at this point. Jesse Ventura used to dress up in a feather boa and tights and stage pre-determined wrestling matches, but the suspension of disbelief required during his wrestling days pales compared to that needed to buy his 9/11 theories. Ventura, in Alex Jones’ video, is said to have ‘moved to Mexico to escape fascism’ (and in this picture looks like Sean Connery in Zardoz). Rosie O’Donnell is a one woman argument for upgrading basic cable and was a former host of The View, the TV equivalent of an induced coma. O’Donnell, no stranger to having a outsize gob and sticking her foot in it (it’s actually large enough to accommodate both of Shaquille O’Neal’s size 23s), took Jesse the Body’s contention one step with her claim that fire had never melted steel prior to 9/11. As Jonah Goldberg of the National Review wrote: “This, of course, came as news to steelworkers, blacksmiths, firefighters, manufacturers of samurai swords, and other fools who hadn’t realized that steel is forged in magic furnaces using dragon breath and pixie dust.” Janeane Garofalo is the world’s third most famous hairy, squat, Sicilian American after Rachael Ray and Danny De Vito, but neither as unintentionally or intentionally funny, respectively, as either (actually, De Vito was unexpectedly funny on a show nobody associates with humor of any kind whatsoever, The View). First Rosie, now Janeane, when did all the wisecracking supporting actresses in early 90s comedies turn into such vocal moon-howlers? Charlie Sheen, star of Two and a Half Men (and one quarter wit), is the bull goose loony of the celebrity truther movement. In better days, Charlie Sheen made headlines the honest way: he earned them by being one of the most debauched individuals in Hollywood, no small feat. These days, when he’s not exchanging bon mots with the husky kid from Fraser, Sheen works overtime in his role as celebrity spokesman for the truther movement. In a bizarre, and from a mental health standpoint, troubling, move, Sheen wrote a script of a fictional conversation between himself and Barack Obama, which, along with his 9/11 walk in wonderland also included the even fiction — that Obama likes and watches Two and a Half Men. He also compiled a video message to Obama. The video concerns the alleged cover up involving real estate mogul Larry Silverstein’s infamous ‘pull it’ remark, which, if you are living proof that gray matter consists mostly of fatty tissue, you construe as an order to demolish building 7 (because naturally as a multi billionaire you’d be motivated to collect on the world’s largest ever ‘insure-and-burn’ and then ruin everything by accidentally blurting out your clandestine plan on national TV).
TooConservative was looking to slime, nothing more, nothing less.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
All of these groups and their websites, virtually without exception, use the words "9/11" and "Truth" in their names. What are we supposed to call them?
I think we're arguing labels here. Please give me an idea of five (5) current conservatives. Thanks.
Actually, it would leave you with the old Perot voter demographic. That is pretty much what the Tea folk are with a splash of constitutionalism tossed in. The number of parallels between the Perot people and this Tea bunch is pretty extensive when you start to list them. I've said this consistently and made few friends with this statement of the obvious. Yet if you tossed in some big-eared midget ranting about some giant sucking sound, I think everyone would find it undeniable.
There are leaders, and there are followers. Those that don't question, well, can't be considered more than a follower.
"The all Father wove the skein of your life a long time ago. Go and hide in a hole if you wish, but you won't live one instant longer. Your fate is fixed. Fear profits a man nothing". Herger the Joyous
How about any five nationally known Republicans or writers at Republican thinktanks or publications? There. That would be thousands for you to choose from, not just five. I don't think you can even find one, let alone five. For that matter, I don't think you can find them among the libertarian folk at LRC.
I hear ya' No answer :P
What are we supposed to call them? You are avoiding the point. Applying a diminuitive label to a group or cause is effectively an Argumentum Ad Hominem attack to disparage the viewpoint without actually disproving anything. It is nothing more than a sophisticated form of name calling aimed at discrediting without having to actually address inconvenient things like the hundreds of contradictions between easily observable facts and the official fairy tale. It also is an attempt to sidestep the proven evidence that there physical anomalies which can, and have been, be shown to exist between the "Official Fairy Tale" and the cold hard evidence. Your choice of language is up to you. You may, if you wish, regurgitate planted terms invented to establish a blanket Argumentum Ad Hominem or you may actually look at the easily available facts and decide based upon the weight of evidence. However, it would appear you have already made a decision to be a regurgitator rather than an honest seeker of truth.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Not believing the official version or thinking the investigation was cut short isn't the same thing. A doubter or a cynic is not really a Truther (or whatever it is you guys call yourselves if the word Truther is so offensive).
Just answer the question. If "Truther" is so damned offensive, what are we supposed to call you? You all call yourselves Truthers among yourselves. I know it. You can't deny it. So you try to deflect this.
So because they are celebrities they are "leading 9/11 Truthers?" Poor logic. They don't lead anything. And just why are you so fascinated by TOS1 anyway? I didn't post anything about TOS1. I posted about your comments on TOS2. I posted them here because the majority of the people on this site are those you call truthers and with the exception of Ferret Mike, I am not aware of any of them being liberal dims, former or otherwise. Also, as I have stated, there wasn't a single person volunteering for the Ron Paul campaign who believed the government and none of us were liberal democans. And where are the conservatives/Republicans who were leading members of the early 9/11 Truth movement? I'm not a truther so I couldn't tell you. However, plain common sense would tell you that if you were a Republican or conservative leader who stood up and stated that they did not believe the events arond 9/11 they wouldn't be leaders now would they. Just like we know that there are tons of conservatives and republican leaders who do not believe in the WOD but are too afraid to say it in public. For that matter, where are any conservatives or Republicans now who subscribe to Truther theories? There were tons of them volunteering for Ron Paul during the primaries.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
No answer :P :)
Let me guess, what is the opposite of a truther? A Liar or maybe a cover-upper?
I reject the word outright. I look upon Bush and his party with contempt, not hate. I hate no man. I do not see how any self-proclaimed conservative Republican can feel anything but contempt by the actions of Bush and the Republican party. The actions of Bush and his party is a textbook example of betrayal. Bush-hater is just another way to slime those who refuse to toe the line of the two-party fraud. Love here is intended in the ironical sense. As you I hate no one and will not succumb to the vice of hate, as it is counterproductive coloring every thought and move with negative emotion. That is true, but it is even more insidious as it is meant to intimidate people from criticizing the obvious and repeated dishonesties and murders. And the Bush mal-Administration was one of the most wantonly murderous regimes since Adolf Hitler. To attempt to color it any other way is to stand in defense of mass murder perpetrated by a deranged mind.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Well, almost everyone except a few diehard Libertarians who supported RP ended up as a Republican so they could vote for him in the 2008 primary. I'm talking about people who had a long history of voting Republican. Your list will get short. Or non-existent. This is why I say you have to go back to the early years of the movement-which-seeks-the-truth-about-9/11 (just don't call them Truthers for god's sake).
since neocon jews are israel-firsters, warmongers, liars, and terrorists, you got some catching up to do in your branding efforts, dont you?
A falser? Seems like a conversational distraction, not an argument or a point to debate. But that's just me.
That is good.
what should we call people like the PNACers, who confessed they needed a new pearl harbor, and were in position to make their new pearl harbor happen on 9/11? what should we call the dancing israelis, who were overjoyed when they saw their mission was such a success? what should we call netanyahu, who thought the 9/11 operation was such a good idea?
Just answer the question. If "Truther" is so damned offensive, what are we supposed to call you? You all call yourselves Truthers among yourselves. I know it. You can't deny it. So you try to deflect this. Context and intent is everything - which you should know. A term used ironically and a term used disparagingly have obvious and opposite meanings - to the discerning. It is in fact you who is evading the point in that your usage of the term was clearly and obviously meant as a disparagement. I do not use the term "truther" except in jest, but I generally eschew its use altogether as I do not disparage people who are only seeking an honest accounting of facts and an explanation which accomodates them. You obviously wish to avoid the facts and to damn by use of disparaging terms. You show yourself to be at least intellectually dishonest and unwilling to take any viewpoint other than the "Party Lyin'".
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
what should we call the dancing israelis, who were overjoyed when they saw their mission was such a success? what should we call netanyahu, who thought the 9/11 operation was such a good idea? Jew bastards.
I don't call myself anything in regards to 9/11. No matter how far back you go on this site you cannot find me commenting on a 9/11 thread. I don't waste my time and I've already stated the reason why. Besides that, it's not the truther label that is the problem, it's your completely baseless smear that those who ARE truthers are liberal democrats. This site is filled with those you call truthers. To smear them as liberal democrats is a lie. What's next, smiling anti-war conservatives as liberals?
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
You miss my whole point of posting your comment. It has nothing to do with the word truther and everything to do with your sliming of an entire group of people who in my experience are made up of people from all political ideologies. As for hard core Libertarians, I held my nose and voted for Chuck Baldwin, even though I am against the pro-WOD stance of his party. I believed and still believe that Bob Barr was a Republicrat plant put in to draw votes away from Dr. Paul.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
A term used ironically and a term used disparagingly have obvious and opposite meanings - to the discerning. It is in fact you who is evading the point in that your usage of the term was clearly and obviously meant as a disparagement. I do not use the term "truther" except in jest, but I generally eschew its use altogether as I do not disparage people who are only seeking an honest accounting of facts and an explanation which accomodates them. You obviously wish to avoid the facts and to damn by use of disparaging terms. You show yourself to be at least intellectually dishonest and unwilling to take any viewpoint other than the "Party Lyin'". My goodness, what a lot of keystrokes to avoid answering a simple question.
SOME and ALL have distinct and different meanings. Is Dr. Stephen Jones a liberal? Is Alex Jones a liberal? Are ALL the 1,000 plus members of Architects and Engineers for 911 Truth Liberals. Some of the earliest voices, mine among them, were so far from the left as to make your blanket assertion uncredible. Citing a few names in a contrived hit piece which was designed, obviously, to make mental associations which, however valid, are not representative of the full spectrum of those seeking the truth about what really occurred on 911. What we do know is that the observed physical data is not adequately explained by the "Official Fairy Tale®". All you of the Anti-Truth movement seek to do is to divert the debate away from the facts and make it one of personalities. Facts do not have personalities. They are either true or false. Are true or false terms exclusive to liberals? Are we then to accept that a "good conservative" is one who blindly believes whatever cover story is put out regardless of the numbers of contradictions? Last I checked blind obedience and slack jawed credulousity were not listed among the conservative virtues.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
what are we supposed to call radical jews who figure they have to wreck the world so they can implement their "tikkun olam" ---aka, repairing the world to radical jewish specifications?
There are other sub-groups of that larger movement of Those Who Must Not Be Called Truthers. For instance, this site might show very little interest in the topic were it not possible to speculate that Mossad was behind 9/11. And there are also many liberals (including some Jews) who are anti-Zionist as well. But speaking of the aggregate of this unnameable group and its origins, I stand by my original statement.
what are we supposed to call spoiled israeli mama's boys, who are threatening to throw a temper tantrum, hold their breath, turn blue, and nuke the motherfucking world if they arent allowed to exterminate palestinians?
Again your argument does not dispute a single, fact, observation, or criticism of the Truth Movement. Your entire argument rests solely and only on Logical Fallacies such as Argumentum Ad Hominem, Red Herring, Strawman Argument, and Guilt by Association. Anyone checking the listed references will find that there is TRUTH in what I have writ. Your argument is insubstantial and amounts to nothing more than name calling coupled with an attempt to keep people from asking questions, getting the data for themselves, and deciding their position based upon that data. In short I can find no honesty or truth in you.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Citing a few names in a contrived hit piece which was designed, obviously, to make mental associations which, however valid, are not representative of the full spectrum of those seeking the truth about what really occurred on 911. 9/11 Truthers started at a 2002 anti-Bush rally in San Francisco. The movement spread to other cities from there, largely as a result of websites and videos circulated of that event. This is quite distinct from, for instance, the spread of groups who were interested in the Waco massacre which was very much a movement on the Right.
So you now assert that "Truthers" are supposed to be officially known as "The Truth Movement"? Is that just your name for it or do you have unanimous agreement among the rest of "The Truth Movement"?
what are we supposed to call radical mommies' boys jews who've exploited their holyhoax persecution myth until they're exempt from criticism, and so have become the grownup equivalent of four-year-old kids turned loose without supervision in a candy store?
I don't care.
You are welcome to your preconceived notions but you have no facts to back them up, your celebrity truthers article notwithstanding.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
Again you move into logical evasion never once addressing any point of fact but seeking only to keep the questioning upon one of disparaging terms. You may choose freely your own words, but be it known that I am well versed in the ways of the liar and you will not divert me from pointing out the ways in which you are lying and evading. I think we have played this little game long enough to ask the obvious question. So, are you a Hasbara or Government Employee?
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
what are we supposed to call the gang of international financial thugs whose main preoccupation at the moment is the looting of america? what are we supposed to call the israel-first terrorists who think they're entitled to kill millions of people to ensure the survival of their thuggish state, a state that was founded in lies, terrorism and injustice?
Not an employee of the government or this Hasbara (whoever they are).
My goodness. I think I struck a nerve, judging by all those posts you've made.
Not an employee of the government or this Hasbara (whoever they are). nope. you're just another jewish mama's boy, spoiled to the point that you think you're entitled to rule the world, and convinced that it would be a good thing to blow up the world if you dont get your way.
Not an employee of the government or this Hasbara (whoever they are). Although any denials you make at this point no longer have any credibility since your entire quiver consists of logical fallacies there are, of course, other possibilities: You could be a "hired gun" for a PR Agency on a contract. A pathological liar. Or slack jawed and credulous. Whatever the case you have been tried in the balance and found wanting. And whatever the case you are not, as you would like to misrepresent, an objective poster. You have an agenda, and that agenda does not include a pursuit of the truth.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
What makes your posts so hilarious is that you're so sincere. LOL.
Be that as it may it wasn't just liberals. Conservatives were being zotted from TOS1 for not believing the government line and Bushbots like Becket Saunders and others on TOS2 were calling for the arrest and imprisonment of those conservatives, independents and libertarians who dared ask questions during this very same time frame.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
What makes your posts so insincere is your total avoidance of all substance and focus upon personalities. A prime hallmark and identifier of the hired gun poster.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
dont you think there's something drastically haywire with a belief system that produces people who laugh out loud about israeli threats to nuke millions of people?
What you are doing by trying to associate truthers with the Democans is no different than fifty yard line/pudlick trying to associate Ron Paul supporters with John Bedell and Joe Stack.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
As near as I can recall I was in San Francisco once - to change flights returning from an overseas assignment - I was in uniform at the time. That would have been during the 80's. Among the first to question 911 were simply those who observed that the official explanation did not square with the observed phenomena. Most liberals were afraid to speak out since they had just received a drubbing at the polls. So, most of the early voices which came, as early as the first week or two following the 911 PsyOp, were libertarians and honest conservatives. That was followed by a parade of disinformation pieces, such as the NOVA piece, purporting to prove the government hypothesis - such disinformation being discredited rapidly on such well known "liberal" hot beds as Liberty Forum, and TOS2 when it was still an open forum. Some of the strongest voices against the Bush Wars came from conservatives and libertarians. The attempt to classify them as "liberals" is at best disinformation.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
That is because the shill's masters are worried about both. Either could be their undoing and both are working strongly toward that. The truth is their enemy just as it is our friend.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
That was followed by a parade of disinformation pieces, such as the NOVA piece, purporting to prove the government hypothesis - such disinformation being discredited rapidly on such well known "liberal" hot beds as Liberty Forum, and TOS2 when it was still an open forum. Some of the strongest voices against the Bush Wars came from conservatives and libertarians. That is my recollection as well. The attempt to classify them as "liberals" is at best disinformation. I enjoy many of Too Conservatives posts. I believe that s/he has made some really good points in several different areas. However, I believe that s/he is way off on this subject.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
The term NeoCon fits you just fine.
I don't believe that TC is any type of shill, government or otherwise. I just believe that s/he is way off base on this subject.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
so that would make you an independent contractor for the liar movement.
Yes, somewhere on the entry ramp to the parking lot.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
Careful. That is exactly the kind of thing always said by "Them". LOL.
i got to admit that it's a good thing that you drop in from time to time, so we can expose you and the likely causes of your problem. it seems to me, though, that you are reasonably intelligent, and so your persistence, even after your haywireness is pointed out to you, demonstrates something other than a search for truth. which leads us to the unavoidable conclusion that you're a propagandist of some sort or another, or you're deranged.
it could be that a radical jewish belief system, instilled and reinforced by fanatical jewish mothers, produces psychosis in people of weak character, of which you might be an example. see where i'm coming from?
I liked it better a few posts back when I was supposed to be a Jew infiltrator or a paid agent of international Jewy mischief.
see where i'm coming from? I think most sane people can see exactly where you're coming from.
yup. you are apparently afflicted with... a belief system instilled and reinforced by fanatical mothers that think the sun rises and sets on their sons... a belief that the holyhoax persecution myth renders jews exempt from criticism.
i haven't myself, but i've certainly heard about the left gatekeepers. KOS is the same. 9/11 discussion is forbidden.
I never apologize for my liberal belief system; I come by it honestly. I am concerned about finding the truth and started looking at the inside job beliefs to learn how to debunk them. I can't, 9-11 was an inside job, and many evil and nasty things are happening in this country and the world. When I was a token liberal in the early days of Fre Republic when there was such a thing there, I often heard how I was working an agenda given to me by others. That always amused me as I have always been a political animal and am my own man politically. I am a former Democrat, and from an extremely liberal city and live in the counter-culture enclave here. I don't agree with many things many people here believe in and support, but I stay because people are onto the truth, and there are too few whe care to stay true to the truth. As long as this forum is a valuble asset in finding out the truth on 9-11, I appreciate and support this place. .....Hey! How the heck did I get on this soapbox? ;-D (I hate it when I don't see myself climbing up on those things.)
I think you have mommy issues.
As are pro-gun or pro-life posts generally.
do israelis have the right to kill as many people as possible when their state finally expires from thuggishness? do neocons have the right to do nuke first-strikes on china and russia? did europeans have the right to move to palestine and terrorize the natives from their land? does israel have the right to continue to terrorize the natives of palestine in continuing attempts to steal more land? if so, what "right" would that be? might makes right? is "might makes right" a psychopathic belief? if israelis and radical jews believe that "might makes right", how did they come to acquire that belief?
I dunno. Yes. No. Maybe.
If the term "truther" is meant to indicate someone who actively seeks the truth and wants to know what it is, however painful or hard it may be, then I don't mind being called a "truther." I think it is kinda ridiculous to label people with that and use it as a smear. The alternative is liar and I would much rather be called a truther than a liar. And if "truther" is a term meant solely for people who don't believe the government's insane conspiracy theory about the events of 9/11 I will still accept being called a truther. Because their conspiracy theory, that we were attacked by a bunch of Arab cave dwellers who hate us because of our freedom, is the wackiest of all. I said at the time that if they indeed hated us for our freedom they have been lied to and a lot! And they should start loving us pretty soon.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. if you dont know it's flat out wrong to terrorize people from their land, threaten to kill millions of people if you dont get your way, and attempt to terrorize the world into submission by threatening nuke first strikes on two of the world's most powerful countries, then you must be a psychopath. i guess i can rest my case, cant i?
Whatever.
That is just more mindless blabber …. Yada…. Yada …. Yada! Looking for the truth is not political. Truthers do not share a common political ideology - you cannot put them all in the same box.
I'm just waiting for someone to list any Republicans or conservatives who are leaders in the "Movement Once Known As Truthers". That's because they were all libs and Lefties.
Bush was then the government in power - now the Truthers are questioning the current government in power. The Truthers are anti the government on the 9/11 issue. Truthers are NOT political!
That's because they were all libs and Lefties. No prominent Republicans or Democrats are Truthers. If you are a prominent political person you must back the government line on 9/11 (i.e., the Jewish line). 9/11 Truth is not political - it is for every America of all stripes to question! You wanting to make it ideological are doing a disservice to the truth about 9/11 and thus to America itself.
Frankly, I don't give a rats ass about the political party of the architects, engineers and physicists who dispute the goobermint story. However, Richard Gage sure walks, talks and acts like a conservative........ Here's an article re: Conservatives for 911 Truth Leading Conservatives: 9/11 Cover-Up Is questioning the government's version of what happened on 9/11 a traitorous activity? Is it something cooked up by liberals and the Democrat party to weaken the conservative movement or to undermine the President's ability to lead the country in this dangerous time? Well, let's see what leading conservatives have to say: Current Republican Congressman states that "we see the [9/11] investigations that have been done so far as more or less cover-up and no real explanation of what went on" Former U.S. Republican Congressman and senior member of the House Armed Services Committee, who served six years as the Chairman of the Military Research and Development Subcommittee, has shown that the U.S. tracked hijackers before 9/11, is open to hearing information about explosives in the Twin Towers, and is open to the possibility that 9/11 was an inside job Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense under President Ronald Reagan said that the official story of 9/11 is "the dog that doesn't hunt" (if you suspect he is a closet liberal, take a look at his bio) Former high-ranking Reagan official and very influential conservative finds "massive evidence that the 9/11 Commission Report is a hoax" Former Air Force Colonel and Pentagon official, who was part of the influential Office of Special Plans, and who was at the Pentagon on 9/11 does not believe the official story regarding 9/11 (see also this essay) Former Chairman of the Conservative National Committee in Washington DC, former Executive Editor of Conservative Digest, and former U.S. Marine Corps fighter pilot questions many aspects of the government's version of 9/11 Former Governor of Minnesota questions the government's version of 9/11, including the collapse of the Twin Towers Conservative Arizona State Senator questions 9/11 In addition, the following high-level military and intelligence personnel have also questioned 9/11 (it is not clear whether or not they are conservatives; but their credentials are impressive): Retired Lieutenant Colonel who served 21 years in the U.S. Marine Corps, a fighter pilot who flew over 300 combat missions, questions the official version of 9/11 and said "This isn't about party, it isn't about Bush Bashing. It's about our country, our constitution, and our future...Your countrymen have been murdered and the more you delve into it the more it looks as though they were murdered by our government, who used it as an excuse to murder other people thousands of miles away." Former 20-year Marine Corps infantry and intelligence officer, the second- ranking civilian in U.S. Marine Corps Intelligence, and former CIA clandestine services case officer stated that "9/11 was at a minimum allowed to happen as a pretext for war", and it was probably an inside job (see Customer Review dated October 7, 2006) Former FBI translator, who the Department of Justice's Inspector General and several senators have called extremely credible (free subscription required), said "If they were to do real investigations we would see several significant high level criminal prosecutions in this country. And that is something that they are not going to let out. And, believe me; they will do everything to cover this up". She also is leaning towards the conclusion that 9/11 was an inside job Former director of the U.S. "Star Wars" space defense program in both Republican and Democratic administrations, who was a senior air force colonel who flew 101 combat missions believes that the military was intentionally disabled on 9/11 in order to allow the attacks to succeed (see also this statement) High-ranking general and the former chief of NATO (in Danish; hint -- he mentions bombs in the Twin Towers) Why are you posting crap about the opinions of "stars" in Hollywierd? As if that has anything to do with the research.......do you consult what the "stars" think about all issues? Do you know the difference between having an opinion and doing research on an issue? Are these folks conservative enough for you?
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
You list the usual has-beens that have many motives for participating or making statements like these. None of them are among the original leaders of the 9/11 movement.
Excellent 'tube abraxas. Since TooConservative wasn't able to identify even one "conservative" by name to me earlier in this thread, I'm going to assume Richard Gage is one based on his dress, education and manor.
Lt. Col. Robert Bowman, PhD “A lot of these pieces of information, taken together, prove that the official story, the official conspiracy theory of 9/11 is a bunch of hogwash. It’s impossible,” said Lt. Col. Robert Bowman, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret).1 With doctoral degrees in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering, Col. Bowman served as Director of Advanced Space Programs Development under Presidents Gerald Ford and Jimmy Carter. “There’s a second group of facts having to do with the cover up,” continued Col. Bowman. “Taken together these things prove that high levels of our government don’t want us to know what happened and who’s responsible. Who gained from 9/11? Who covered up crucial information about 9/11? And who put out the patently false stories about 9/11 in the first place? When you take those three things together, I think the case is pretty clear that it’s highly placed individuals in the administration with all roads passing through Dick Cheney.” Regarding the failure of NORAD to intercept the four hijacked planes on 9/11, Col. Bowman said, “I'm an old interceptor pilot. I know the drill. I've done it. I know how long it takes. I know the rules. … Critics of the government story on 9/11 have said: ‘Well, they knew about this, and they did nothing’. That's not true. If our government had done nothing that day and let normal procedure be followed, those planes, wherever they were, would have been intercepted, the Twin Towers would still be standing and thousands of dead Americans would still be alive.” 2 During his 22-year Air Force career, Col. Bowman also served as the Head of the Department of Aeronautical Engineering and Assistant Dean at the U.S. Air Force Institute of Technology. He also flew over 100 combat missions in Viet Nam as a fighter pilot. Lt. Jeff Dahlstrom Former U.S. Air Force pilot Lt. Jeff Dahlstrom wrote in a 2007 statement to this author, “When 9/11 occurred I bought the entire government and mainstream media story line. I was a lifelong conservative Republican that voted for Bush/Cheney, twice. Curiosity about JFK’s death, after a late night TV re-run of Oliver Stone’s movie, got me started researching and digging for the truth about his assassins. “My research led me to a much more important and timely question: the mystery of what really did happen on 9/11. Everything that seemed real, turned out to be false. The US government and the news media, once again, were lying to the world about the real terrorists and the public murder of 2,972 innocents on 9/11. Capt. Daniel Davis Capt. Daniel Davis is a former U.S. Army Air Defense Officer and NORAD Tac Director. After his military service, Capt. Davis served for 15 years as a Senior Manager at General Electric Turbine (jet) Engine Division and then devoted an additional 15 years as founder and CEO of Turbine Technology Services Corp., a turbine (jet engine) services and maintenance company. In a statement to this author, Capt. Davis wrote, “As a former General Electric Turbine engineering specialist and manager and then CEO of a turbine engineering company, I can guarantee that none of the high tech, high temperature alloy engines on any of the four planes that crashed on 9/11 would be completely destroyed, burned, shattered or melted in any crash or fire. Wrecked, yes, but not destroyed. Where are all of those engines, particularly at the Pentagon? If jet powered aircraft crashed on 9/11, those engines, plus wings and tail assembly, would be there.” Major Jon I. Fox is a former U.S. Marine Corps fighter pilot and a retired commercial airline pilot for Continental Airlines with a 35-year commercial aviation career. In 2007, in support of the Architects and Engineers petition to reinvestigate 9/113, he wrote, “On hearing the military (NORAD/NEAD) excuses for no intercepts on 9/11/2001, I knew from personal experience that they were lying. I then began re-checking other evidence and found mostly more lies from the ‘official spokesmen’. Jet fuel fires at atmospheric pressure do not get hot enough to weaken steel. Structures do not collapse through themselves in free fall time with only gravity as the powering force.” 4 Capt. Daniel Davis Commander Ralph Kolstad Retired U.S. Navy ‘Top Gun’ pilot Commander Ralph Kolstad started questioning the official account of 9/11 within days of the event. In a statement to this author, he wrote, “It just didn’t make any sense to me,” he said. And now six years after 9/11 he says, “When one starts using his own mind, and not what one was told, there is very little to believe in the official story.” 5 Commander Kolstad was a top-rated fighter pilot during his 20-year Navy career. Early in his career, he was accorded the honor of being selected to participate in the Navy’s ‘Top Gun’ air combat school, officially known as the U.S. Navy Fighter Weapons School. The Tom Cruise movie “Top Gun” reflects the experience of the young Navy pilots at the school. Eleven years later, Commander Kolstad was further honored by being selected to become a ‘Top Gun’ adversary instructor. Commander Kolstad had a second career after his 20 years of Navy active and reserve service and served as a commercial airline pilot for 27 years, flying for American Airlines and other domestic and international carriers. He flew Boeing 727, 757 and 767, McDonnell Douglas MD-80, and Fokker F-100 airliners. He has flown a total of over 23,000 hours in his career. Commander Kolstad is especially critical of the account of American Airlines Flight 77 that allegedly crashed into the Pentagon. He says, “At the Pentagon, the pilot of the Boeing 757 did quite a feat of flying. I have 6,000 hours of flight time in Boeing 757’s and 767’s and I could not have flown it the way the flight path was described.” Commander Kolstad adds, “I was also a Navy fighter pilot and Air Combat Instructor and have experience flying low altitude, high speed aircraft. I could not have done what these beginners did. Something stinks to high heaven!” Lt. Col. Karen Kwiatkowski, PhD A Pentagon eye-witness and a former member of the staff of the Director of the National Security Agency, Lt. Col. Karen Kwiatkowski, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret), is a severe critic of the official account of 9/11. A contributing author to the 2006 book 9/11 and American Empire: Intellectuals Speak Out, she wrote, “I believe the [9/11] Commission failed to deeply examine the topic at hand, failed to apply scientific rigor to its assessment of events leading up to and including 9/11, failed to produce a believable and unbiased summary of what happened, failed to fully examine why it happened, and even failed to include a set of unanswered questions for future research.” She continued, “It is as a scientist that I have the most trouble with the official government conspiracy theory, mainly because it does not satisfy the rules of probability or physics. The collapses of the World Trade Center buildings clearly violate the laws of probability and physics.” Lt. Col. Shelton Lankford Lt. Col. Shelton Lankford, U.S. Marine Corps (ret), an attack pilot with over 300 combat missions, wrote in 2007 to the Michigan Daily,9 “Our government has been hijacked by means of a ‘new Pearl Harbor’ and a lot of otherwise good and decent people who are gullible enough to think that the first three steel-framed buildings in history fall down because they have some fires that the fire fighter on the scene said could be knocked down with a couple of hoses and through which people walked before they were Lt. Col. Shelton Lankford Lt. Col. Karen Kwiatkowski, PhD - 5 - photographed looking out the holes10 where the plane hit. One of these, Building 7, was never hit by a plane and even NIST is ashamed to advance a reason for its collapse. And, miracle of miracles, these three buildings just happened to be leased and insured by the same guy who is on tape11 saying they decided to ‘PULL’ the last one to fall.” During his 20 year military career, Col. Lankford's decorations include the Distinguished Flying Cross, and 32 awards of the Air Medal. In a statement to this author, Col. Lankford wrote, “September 11, 2001 seems destined to be the watershed event of our lives and the greatest test for our democracy in our lifetimes. The evidence of government complicity in the lead-up to the events, the failure to respond during the event, and the astounding lack of any meaningful investigation afterwards, as well as the ignoring of evidence turned up by others that renders the official explanation impossible, may signal the end of the American experiment. It has been used to justify all manners of measures to legalize repression at home and as a pretext for behaving as an aggressive empire abroad. Until we demand an independent, honest, and thorough investigation and accountability for those whose action and inaction led to those events and the cover-up, our republic and our Constitution remain in the gravest danger.” Lt. Col. Jeff Latas Another harsh critic of the official account of 9/11 is Lt. Col. Jeff Latas, U.S. Air Force (ret). A former combat fighter pilot, Col. Latas is currently a commercial airline pilot. Col. Latas is a member of Pilots for 9/11 Truth. In 2007 he was interviewed by the group’s founder, commercial airline pilot, Rob Balsamo,12 regarding the group’s documentary video, Pandora's Black Box, Chapter 2, Flight of American 77,13 which focuses on the 9/11 Commission's account of the impact of Flight 77 at the Pentagon and discrepancies with the data from the Flight Data Recorder alleged by the NTSB to be from Flight 77. In the interview, Col. Latas said, “After I did my own analysis of it, it's obvious that there's discrepancies between the two stories; between the 9/11 Commission and the flight data recorder information. And I think that's where we really need to focus a lot of our attention to get the help that we need in order to put pressure on government agencies to actually do a real investigation of 9/11. And not just from a security standpoint, but from even an aviation standpoint, like any accident investigation, would actually help the aviators out by finding reasons for things happening.” Capt. Eric H. May Capt. Eric H. May, U.S. Army (ret), is a former Army Intelligence Officer who also served as an inspector and interpreter for the Intermediate Nuclear Forces Treaty team. He is one of many signers of a petition14 requesting a reinvestigation of 9/11. In 2005, he wrote: “As a former Army officer, my tendency immediately after 9/11 was to rally 'round the colors and defend the country against what I then thought was an insidious, malicious all-Arab entity called Al-Qaida. Lt. Col. Jeff Latas In fact, in April of 2002, I attempted to reactivate my then-retired commission to return to serve my country in its time of peril. ... Now I view the 9/11 event as Professor David Griffin, author of The New Pearl Harbor, views it: as a matter that implies either A) passive participation by the Bush White House through a deliberate stand- down of proper defense procedures that (if followed) would have led US air assets to a quick identification and confrontation of the passenger aircraft that impacted WTC 1 and WTC 2, or worse ... B) active execution of a plot by rogue elements of government, starting with the White House itself, in creating a spectacle of destruction that would lead the United States into an invasion of the Middle East.” 15 Commander Ted Muga, U.S. Navy (ret), is a Navy aviator, who, after retirement, had a second career as a commercial airline pilot for Pan-Am. In a 2007 interview on the Alex Jones Show,16 Commander Muga stated, “The maneuver at the Pentagon was just a tight spiral coming down out of 7,000 feet. And a commercial aircraft, while they can, in fact, structurally somewhat handle that maneuver, they are very, very, very difficult. And it would take considerable training. In other words, commercial aircraft are designed for a particular purpose and that is for comfort and for passengers and it's not for military maneuvers. And while they are structurally capable of doing them, it takes some very, very talented pilots to do that. ... I just can't imagine an amateur even being able to come close to performing a maneuver of that nature. “And as far as hijacking the airplanes, once again getting back to the nature of pilots and airplanes, there is no way that a pilot would give up an airplane to hijackers. ... I mean, hell, a guy doesn't give up a TV remote control much less a complicated 757. And so to think that pilots would allow a plane to be taken over by a couple of 5 foot 7, 150 pound guys with a one-inch blade boxcutter is ridiculous. “And also in all four planes, if you remember, none of the planes ever switched on their transponder to the hijack code. There's a very, very simple code that you put in if you suspect that your plane is being hijacked. It takes literally just a split-second for you to put your hand down on the center console and flip it over. And not one of the four planes ever transponded a hijack code, which is most, most unusual. ... “Commercial airplanes are very, very complex pieces of machines. And they're designed for two pilots up there, not just two amateur pilots, but two qualified commercial pilots up there. And to think that you're going to get an amateur up into the cockpit and fly, much less navigate, it to a designated target, the probability is so low, that it's bordering on impossible.” Col. George Nelson, MBA Maj. John M. Newman, PhD, U.S. Army (ret), is the former Executive Assistant to the Director of the National Security Agency. In testimony before a 2005 Congressional briefing, he said, “It falls to me this morning to bring to your attention the story of Saeed Sheikh, whose full name is Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh, and his astonishing rise to power in Al Qaeda, his crucial role in 9/11, which is completely, utterly, missing from the 9/11 Commission report … “The 9/11 Commission which studied US intelligence and law enforcement community performance in great detail, (maybe not so much great detail, but they did), neglected to cover the community’s performance during the weeks following the attacks to determine who was responsible for them, not a word about that in the Report. Capt. Omar Pradhan, U.S. Air Force, is a former AWACS command pilot and Flight Instructor at the U.S. Air Force Academy. In a 2007 statement to this author, Capt. Pradhan wrote, “As a proud American, as a distinguished USAF E-3 AWACS Aircraft Commander (with 350+ hours of combat time logged over Afghanistan and Iraq), and as a former U.S. Air Force Academy Flight Instructor, I warmly endorse the professional inquiry and pursuit of comprehensive truth sought by the Pilots for 911 Truth organization and the PatriotsQuestion911 website.” Another senior officer questioning the official account of 9/11 is Col. Ronald D. Ray, U.S. Marine Corps (ret), Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense under President Ronald Reagan. A highly decorated Vietnam veteran (two Silver Stars, a Bronze Star and a Purple Heart), he was appointed by President George H. W. Bush to serve on the American Battle Monuments Commission (1990 – 1994), and the 1992 Presidential Commission on the Assignment of Women in the Armed Forces. He was Military Historian and Deputy Director of Field Operations for the U.S. Marine Corps Historical Center, Washington, D.C. (1990 – 1994). That's just to page 7 on this site: http://patriotsquestion911.com/Article% 20Military%20Officers%20Challenge%20911.pdf Are these highly decorated military men and women conservative enough for you? There are ten more at the link.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Prove it. First you say no conservative are "truthers" which I have proved complete bovine excrement. Read the damn link before you spew more unsubstantiated bullshit. You will find that many were the first to call BS on the goobermint story and many continue to publish articles and seek a new investigation. I'm beginning to wonder what your motives are all about. You are proven to be full of bs and you can't even bother to read documentation of conservatives who stand up for a new investigation. What are you trying to prove? Obviously, your initial post, which you couldn't even bother to put a 10 minute search into, is all about something.......but not about what conservatives who want a new investigation have to say about 911.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
I thought that was a good one too. : ) I've posted multiple names of conservative folks who call bs on 911......but now the argument is about how long they have been seeking a new investigation and something about their "motives" with not a shred of documentation to back up the smack........
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Here's 8 more conservatives who are "truthers"........... Dec. 4, 2007 - Eight Senior Republican Administration Appointees Challenge Official Account of 9/11 - “Not Possible”, “a Whitewash”, “False” featured statements by: h23; Paul Craig Roberts, PhD, former Assistant Secretary of the Treasury under President Ronald Reagan h23; Catherine Austin Fitts, former Assistant Secretary of Housing under President George H.W. Bush h23; Morgan Reynolds, PhD, former Chief Economist of the U.S. Department of Labor under current President George W. Bush h23; Col. Ronald D. Ray, U.S. Marine Corps (ret), who served as Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense under President Ronald Reagan h23; Mary Schiavo, JD, former Inspector General of the U.S. Department of Transportation under Presidents George H.W. Bush and William Clinton h23; Barbara Honegger, Special Assistant to the Chief Domestic Policy Adviser to President Ronald Reagan. White House Policy Analyst. Project Director, Anti-Discrimination Federal Law Review, U.S. Department of Justice h23; Edward Peck, Deputy Director of the White House Task Force on Terrorism under President Ronald Reagan. Former Deputy Coordinator, Covert Intelligence Programs at the U.S. State Department. Former U.S. Ambassador and Chief of Mission in Iraq h23; Morton Goulder, Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for Intelligence and Warning under Presidents Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford and Jimmy Carter http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_alan_mil_071202_seven_senior_republi.htm
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Marxists discuss 9-11 Truth
I don't think anyone would call me dim but liberal? The phrase classical liberalism is also sometimes used to refer to all forms of liberalism before the 20th century. And, after 1970, the phrase began to be used by libertarians to describe their belief in the primacy of economic freedom and minimal government. It is sometimes difficult to tell which meaning is intended in a given source. I can live with that!
"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." That would be me. I even voted for Bush the second time. I am no longer a Republican. I vote third party.
"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." The point remains: all of the leadership of the early Truther movement were libs and Lefties. None of those you mention was an original Truther. That is what started this thread. It is what this thread is about. You have not yet produced any early Truther who is/was a Republican or conservative.
A Liar or maybe a cover-upper? "Reality-Challenged"
A Liar or maybe a cover-upper? "Reality-Challenged" Borg.
"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." I love that one. And it is so right!!!
"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." Liberal firefighters?
I don't think anyone would call me dim but liberal? Classical liberalism is a political ideology that developed in the 19th century in England, Western Europe, and the Americas. It is committed to the ideal of limited government and liberty of individuals including freedom of religion, speech, press, and assembly, and free markets.[1] Notable individuals who have contributed to classical liberalism include Jean-Baptiste Say, Thomas Malthus, and David Ricardo. There was a revival of interest in classical liberalism in the 20th century led by Friedrich Hayek, Milton Friedman and other economists.[2] [3][4] The phrase classical liberalism is also sometimes used to refer to all forms of liberalism before the 20th century. And, after 1970, the phrase began to be used by libertarians to describe their belief in the primacy of economic freedom and minimal government. It is sometimes difficult to tell which meaning is intended in a given source. I can live with that! Of course nowadays Classical Liberal = Libertarian. The Israel Firsters hate Libertarians because we would cut off Israel's Welfare Check.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
oh my...i can sure relate to that one. ;)
:-)
b
what does b mean?
I hope this thread didn't catch anyone by surprise...the pantload hasbara ho- bag wasn't fooling many I surmise.
By the time the thread was done I think anyone with any wit knew we were dealing with a hasbarfa or equivalent.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
#2. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
#3. To: noone222 (#2)
I am a "questioner" and a truther because I don't believe the government fairytale ... and I'm also conservative.
#4. To: TooConservative (#0)
(Edited)
Nearly all of the Truthers were originally Dim liberals and Bush- haters
#5. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#3)
I am a classical liberal who has never voted for a Democan and only voted for a Republicrat twice - once for Reagen and once for Ron Paul in the Republican Primary.
#6. To: F.A. Hayek Fan, TooConservative, christine, Rotara, Jethro Tull, wudidiz, TwentyTwelve, Lod, Cynicom, James Deffenbach, farmfriend, CadetD, all (#0)
#7. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
Truthers
#8. To: All, Too Conservative (#0)
#9. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
#10. To: Original_Intent (#6)
I just love the term "Bush Haters" to describe anyone who points out the serial dishonesty and mass murder of the Bush Junta. Hate? No. The facts, for anyone willing to look at them honestly and objectively, clearly demonstrate that Bush lied, and lied repeatedly. Those lies resulted in the looting of the American Treasury, the unnecessary deaths of thousands of American kids sent off to fight his criminal wars, and the deaths of millions of innocents in Afghanistan and Iran. (Klinton too was guilty of mass murder in Kosovo - just to give equal time.)
#11. To: Lysander_Spooner (#7)
#12. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
You can see why I keep saying that the Tea Parties need to repel boarders (Birchers, Birthers, Truthers, etc.) who demand that they be allowed to use Tea Party events to promote their own agenda.
"This man is Jesus,” shouted one man, spilling his Guinness as Barack Obama began his inaugural address. “When will he come to Kenya to save us?”
-Schweizerische Schuetzenzeitung (Swiss Shooting Federation) April, 1941
#13. To: christine, TooConservative (#4)
Nearly all of the Truthers were originally Dim liberals and Bush-haters
#14. To: christine (#10)
#15. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
You can see why I keep saying that the Tea Parties need to repel boarders (Birchers, Birthers, Truthers, etc.)
#16. To: Original_Intent, TooConservative, christine, Rotara, Jethro Tull, wudidiz, TwentyTwelve, Lod, Cynicom, James Deffenbach, farmfriend, CadetD, all (#6)
I just love the term "Bush Haters" to describe anyone who points out the serial dishonesty and mass murder of the Bush Junta.
#17. To: christine (#4)
i can't think of any Truther i know who was ever a "dim liberal."
#18. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
And just why are you so fascinated by TOS1 anyway? Why are you so concerned that the political roots of the 9/11 conspiracy folks, every last one of them a liberal or a Leftie, should be concealed? 
10) Spencer and Heidi Pratt: (Excerpts from an appearance on the radio show of Alex Jones , himself a conspiracy theorist and the man behind “The Obama Deception” ): “We’ve been nonstop researching the Internet … for information for at least a month all day every day,” said Heidi. Spencer added: “From your [Jones'] research, it [9/11] 100 percent is [an inside job] … “I want to throw up.”
9) Woody Harrelson: “I am reading a book now called The New Pearl Harbor by David Ray Griffin. I’ve been stuck in the position of ignoring my gut — knowing things don’t stack up. Even though our government obviously took advantage of 9/11 by making it their “Reichstag”, I told myself, “Surely they weren’t involved”. After reading this book I can’t doubt that our government was at least complicit in allowing 9/11 to happen.” 
8) Mos Def: “I don’t believe it was bin Laden today. I don’t believe it was never him … I’m sorry, I’m from the projects, I know danger. I don’t feel no danger from that shit… Highly-educated people in all areas of science have spoken on the fishiness around the whole 9/11 theory.” 
7) Willie Nelson: “I saw one fall, and it was just so symmetrical, I said wait a minute. I just saw that last week at the casino in Las Vegas, and you see these implosions all the time. And the next one fell, and I said, hell, there’s another one – and they’re trying to tell me that an airplane did it, and I can’t go along with that… “What does it take for us to realize we’re having the wool pulled over our eyes one more time?” 
6) Tom DeLonge (Blink 182 singer): “We do know that the buildings came down in a fashion extremely similar to a controlled demolition of a building – we do know that expertise that is needed to fly those gigantic planes into that exact location could never have been achieved by someone that just learned how to fly a small plane.” 
4) Jesse Ventura: “How could those buildings fall at the speed of gravity – if you put a stopwatch on them both of those World Trade Center buildings were on the ground in ten seconds – how can that be? Never before in the annals of history has a fire caused a steel structure building to fall to the ground like these two did.”
3) Rosie O’Donnell: “It is impossible for a building to fall the way it fell without explosives being involved — World Trade Center 7. World Trade 1 and 2 got hit by planes. 7, miraculously, the first time in history, steel was melted by fire. It is physically impossible. 
2) Janeane Garofalo: “9/11 was an inside job!! I have come to this conclusion about that. … I think all Air America phone-in callers should open by saying, ‘9/11 was an inside job. We can all agree on that.’, then get on with their specific question or comment. We should re-condition the listening audience to accept the Truth about 9/11 as the gospel.” 
1) Charlie Sheen: “It seems to me like 19 amateurs with box cutters taking over four commercial airliners and hitting 75 percent of their targets, that feels like a conspiracy theory. It raises a lot of questions.”
And where are the conservatives/Republicans who were leading members of the early 9/11 Truth movement? For that matter, where are any conservatives or Republicans now who subscribe to Truther theories?
#19. To: noone222 (#9)
I think people are capable of thinking about the events of 9-11 regardless of their political leanings. Frankly, I think it's a stupid suggestion.
#20. To: Original_Intent (#13)
Whenever I see someone use the planted PsyOp/Negative PR term "truther" (an intentional diminuitive used to degrade someone for seeking a true explanation for 911 that makes sense and squares with the easily available facts)
#21. To: TooConservative (#18)
And where are the conservatives/Republicans who were leading members of the early 9/11 Truth movement?
#22. To: X-15 (#12)
This would gut the Tea Party movement, leaving a handful of neocons wandering around eating their lox and bagels.
#23. To: christine (#4)
oh, really? not in my experience. i can't think of any Truther i know who was ever a "dim liberal." Constitutional Truthseekers would be a more accurate label. it's amazing how the word truth(er) is being redefined as something bad. how wicked people are who dare to question the government and who seek truth. what a sick, evil culture this is.
#24. To: Jethro Tull (#21)
Please give me an idea of five (5) current conservatives.
#25. To: TooConservative (#24)
Please give me an idea of five (5) current conservatives.
#26. To: TooConservative (#20)
All of these groups and their websites, virtually without exception, use the words "9/11" and "Truth" in their names.
#27. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#8)
While not all were die hard truthers, not a one of us believed the government and almost to a man we all believed that the government was involved in some way, shape or form.
#28. To: Original_Intent (#26)
Applying a diminuitive label to a group or cause is effectively an Argumentum Ad Hominem attack to disparage the viewpoint without actually disproving anything. It is nothing more than a sophisticated form...blah-blah-blah...dissemble...distract...philosophize...complain...blah-blah-blah...
#29. To: TooConservative (#18)
#30. To: Jethro Tull (#25)
I hear ya'
#31. To: TooConservative (#27)
#32. To: F.A. Hayek Fan, TooConservative, christine, Rotara, Jethro Tull, wudidiz, TwentyTwelve, Lod, Cynicom, James Deffenbach, farmfriend, CadetD, all (#16)
I just love the term "Bush Haters" to describe anyone who points out the serial dishonesty and mass murder of the Bush Junta.
Bush-hater is just another way to slime those who refuse to toe the line of the two-party fraud.
#33. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#29)
There were tons of them volunteering for Ron Paul during the primaries.
#34. To: TooConservative (#30)
#35. To: Itistoolate (#31)
Let me guess, what is the opposite of a truther?
#36. To: TooConservative (#35)
#37. To: TooConservative (#35)
#38. To: TooConservative (#28)
Applying a diminuitive label to a group or cause is effectively an Argumentum Ad Hominem attack to disparage the viewpoint without actually disproving anything. It is nothing more than a sophisticated form...blah-blah-blah...dissemble...distract...philosophize...complain...blah-blah-blah...
#39. To: groundresonance (#37)
what should we call people like the PNACers, who confessed they needed a new pearl harbor, and were in position to make their new pearl harbor happen on 9/11?
#40. To: TooConservative (#27)
A doubter or a cynic is not really a Truther (or whatever it is you guys call yourselves if the word Truther is so offensive).
#41. To: TooConservative (#33)
(just don't call them Truthers for god's sake).
#42. To: Original_Intent (#38)
Context and intent is everything - which you should know.
What are we supposed to call "The Group Formerly Known As Truthers"?
The Artist Formerly Known as Prince
#43. To: TooConservative, F.A. Hayek Fan, all (#18)
And just why are you so fascinated by TOS1 anyway? Why are you so concerned that the political roots of the 9/11 conspiracy folks, every last one of them a liberal or a Leftie, should be concealed?
#44. To: TooConservative (#42)
(Edited)
What are we supposed to call "The Group Formerly Known As Truthers"?
#45. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#40)
Besides that, it's not the truther label that is the problem, it's your completely baseless smear that those who ARE truthers are liberal democrats. This site is filled with those you call truthers. To smear them as liberal democrats is a lie. What's next, smiling anti-war conservatives as liberals?
#46. To: TooConservative (#42)
(Edited)
What are we supposed to call "The Group Formerly Known As Truthers"?
#47. To: TooConservative (#42)
(Edited)
#48. To: Original_Intent (#43)
Some of the earliest voices, mine among them, were so far from the left as to make your blanket assertion uncredible.
#49. To: Original_Intent (#47)
Again your argument does not dispute a single, fact, observation, or criticism of the Truth Movement.
#50. To: TooConservative (#48)
What are we supposed to call "The Group Formerly Known As Truthers"?
#51. To: groundresonance (#46)
what are we supposed to call spoiled israeli mama's boys, who are threatening to throw a temper tantrum, hold their breath, turn blue, and nuke the motherfucking world if they arent allowed to exterminate palestinians?
#52. To: TooConservative (#45)
But speaking of the aggregate of this unnameable group and its origins, I stand by my original statement.
#53. To: TooConservative (#49)
#54. To: TooConservative (#51)
What are we supposed to call "The Group Formerly Known As Truthers"?
#55. To: Original_Intent (#53)
So, are you a Hasbara or Government Employee?
#56. To: groundresonance (#54)
#57. To: TooConservative (#55)
(Edited)
So, are you a Hasbara or Government Employee?
#58. To: TooConservative (#55)
So, are you a Hasbara or Government Employee?
#59. To: Original_Intent, groundresonance (#58)
#60. To: TooConservative, Original_Intent (#48)
9/11 Truthers started at a 2002 anti-Bush rally in San Francisco. The movement spread to other cities from there, largely as a result of websites and videos circulated of that event.
#61. To: TooConservative, groundresonance (#59)
#62. To: TooConservative (#59)
(Edited)
What makes your posts so hilarious is that you're so sincere. LOL.
#63. To: All, TooConservative (#60)
#64. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#60)
#65. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#63)
What you are doing by trying to associate truthers with the Democans is no different than fifty yard line/pudlick trying to associate Ron Paul supporters with John Bedell and Joe Stack.
#66. To: Original_Intent (#64)
Among the first to question 911 were simply those who observed that the official explanation did not square with the observed phenomena. Most liberals were afraid to speak out since they had just received a drubbing at the polls. So, most of the early voices which came, as early as the first week or two following the 911 PsyOp, were libertarians and honest conservatives.
#67. To: TooConservative (#35)
A falser?
#68. To: Original_Intent (#65)
That is because the shill's masters are worried about both. Either could be their undoing and both are working strongly toward that. The truth is their enemy just as it is our friend.
#69. To: TooConservative, Original_Intent (#55)
Not an employee of the government or this Hasbara (whoever they are).
computer counted ballots are ballots that have been counted in secret, and with all probability not the way one voted.
#70. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#68)
I just believe that s/he is way off base on this subject.
#71. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
#72. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#68)
I don't believe that TC is any type of shill, government or otherwise. I just believe that s/he is way off base on this subject.
#73. To: TooConservative (#72)
#74. To: TooConservative (#72)
(Edited)
#75. To: groundresonance (#73)
which leads us to the unavoidable conclusion that you're a propagandist of some sort or another, or you're deranged.
#76. To: groundresonance (#74)
it could be that a radical jewish belief system, instilled and reinforced by fanatical jewish mothers, produces psychosis in people of weak character, of which you might be an example.
#77. To: TooConservative (#76)
(Edited)
I think most sane people can see exactly where you're coming from.
a belief system based on the conviction that non-jews are about the same caliber of creature as cattle...
hangs together, doesnt it?
#78. To: Sam Houston (#17)
If you've ever posted on a liberal or Dem forum as I have (DU, from which I was banned in 2005, three years after being banned from FR), you'll already know that, because of the inevitable connections to Israel which come up, the moderators do NOT allow Truther discussions for very long.
#79. To: christine (#4)
"i just love how you and others are making 9/11 a Republican/Democrat issue. it's not. it's a truth versus lies issue."
Toruk Makto
#80. To: groundresonance (#77)
a belief system instilled and reinforced by fanatical mothers that think the sun rises and sets on their sons...
#81. To: christine (#78)
i haven't myself, but i've certainly heard about the left gatekeepers. KOS is the same. 9/11 discussion is forbidden.
#82. To: TooConservative (#80)
I think you have mommy issues
#83. To: groundresonance (#82)
#84. To: F.A. Hayek Fan, TooConservative (#0)
Lord Acton
#85. To: TooConservative (#83)
(Edited)
I dunno
#86. To: groundresonance (#85)
#87. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
TooConservative claims that "Nearly all of the Truthers were originally Dim liberals"
#88. To: your_neighbor (#87)
#89. To: TooConservative (#48)
9/11 Truthers started at a 2002 anti-Bush rally in San Francisco.
#90. To: TooConservative (#88)
I'm just waiting for someone to list any Republicans or conservatives who are leaders in the "Movement Once Known As Truthers".
#91. To: TooConservative (#88)
#92. To: abraxas (#91)
#93. To: abraxas, TooConservative (#91)
#94. To: TooConservative (#88)
That's because they were all libs and Lefties.
#95. To: TooConservative (#92)
None of them are among the original leaders of the 9/11 movement.
#96. To: Jethro Tull (#93)
Since TooConservative wasn't able to identify even one "conservative" by name to me earlier in this thread, I'm going to assume Richard Gage is one based on his dress, education and manor.
#97. To: TooConservative (#88)
That's because they were all libs and Lefties
#98. To: TooConservative (#92)
#99. To: Original_Intent, F.A. Hayek Fan, TooConservative, christine, Rotara, Jethro Tull, wudidiz, TwentyTwelve, Lod, Cynicom, James Deffenbach, CadetD (#32)
TooConservative claims that "Nearly all of the Truthers were originally Dim liberals"
Classical liberalism is a political ideology that developed in the 19th century in England, Western Europe, and the Americas. It is committed to the ideal of limited government and liberty of individuals including freedom of religion, speech, press, and assembly, and free markets.[1] Notable individuals who have contributed to classical liberalism include Jean-Baptiste Say, Thomas Malthus, and David Ricardo. There was a revival of interest in classical liberalism in the 20th century led by Friedrich Hayek, Milton Friedman and other economists.[2] [3][4]
James Madison, Letter to James Robertson, April 20, 1831
#100. To: TooConservative (#33)
I'm talking about people who had a long history of voting Republican.
James Madison, Letter to James Robertson, April 20, 1831
#101. To: abraxas (#97)
#102. To: Itistoolate, Original_Intent, christine, farmfriend, F.A. Hayek Fan, TooConservative, all (#31)
Let me guess, what is the opposite of a truther?
"Nonsense wakes up the brain cells. And it helps develop a sense of humor, which is awfully important in this day and age" ~ Dr. Suess
#103. To: wudidiz, Itistoolate, Original_Intent, christine, F.A. Hayek Fan, TooConservative, (#102)
Let me guess, what is the opposite of a truther?
James Madison, Letter to James Robertson, April 20, 1831
#104. To: farmfriend, Original_Intent, christine, all (#103)
"Nonsense wakes up the brain cells. And it helps develop a sense of humor, which is awfully important in this day and age" ~ Dr. Suess
#105. To: wudidiz (#104)
James Madison, Letter to James Robertson, April 20, 1831
#106. To: Jethro Tull, TooConservative, all (#98)
"Nonsense wakes up the brain cells. And it helps develop a sense of humor, which is awfully important in this day and age" ~ Dr. Suess
#107. To: farmfriend F.A. Hayek Fan, TooConservative, christine, Rotara, Jethro Tull, wudidiz, TwentyTwelve, Lod, Cynicom, James Deffenbach, CadetD (#99)
TooConservative claims that "Nearly all of the Truthers were originally Dim liberals"
#108. To: wudidiz (#104)
#109. To: christine (#108)
"Nonsense wakes up the brain cells. And it helps develop a sense of humor, which is awfully important in this day and age" ~ Dr. Suess
#110. To: all (#109)
#111. To: VinnyTex (#110)
#112. To: Original_Intent (#107)
"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams 
#113. To: Rotara (#112)
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