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Title: The Civil War Begins - Arizona threatens to cut off power to Los Angeles over immigration law boycott
Source:
www.abc15.com
URL Source: http://www.abc15.com/content/financ ... on/RBINaWwt1kOaUTJxnHs5Xg.cspx
Published: May 19, 2010
Author: by: Dave Biscobing
Post Date: 2010-05-19 08:46:23 by Mind_Virus
Keywords: None
Views: 2010
Comments: 139
Arizona energy official calls L.A.'s bluff on total boycott Reported by: Dave Biscobing Email: dbiscobing@abc15.com Last Update: 5/18 11:16 pm PHOENIX -- Last week, Los Angeles officially boycotted Arizona to send a message about the state's new immigration law. Now, the Arizona Corporation Commission is sending back a message of their own. On Tuesday, Commissioner Gary Pierce wrote a letter to the Los Angeles Mayor and City Council. He said the intention was to "call them out," and see if they are committed to truly cut off all Arizona resources. "I don't think they thought this through," Pierce said. "There are consequences that involve energy." Across Arizona, Los Angeles gets 25 percent of its power from three plants, including the Palo Verde Nuclear Station. The state can't literally pull the plug as the city owns the power. But if tough-talking Los Angeles officials really decide to go through with this boycott fully, then they will have to go without this electricity. "You can't call a boycott on the candy store and then pick and choose the candy you really want," Pierce said. "You either boycott or you don't." However, Los Angeles councilmembers have been perhaps the most outspoken about Senate Bill 1070. "We want them to be the last state to do this," Councilmember Janice Hahn said after the city first threatened boycotts. "We think we have a lot of leverage over that state." "This is not a paper resolution. It is real," added Councilmember Ed Reyes after the boycott was approved. When the Los Angeles City Council made their vote, they were given a report that contained information about the city's contracts with Arizona. It did not include agreements about water and power. "I think this boycott is going to backfire," Pierce said. "And they are just going to want it to go away." After the letter was sent, the Arizona Corporation Commission said by the end of the day, they received dozens of calls and more than 100 emails in support from officials of 18 different states.
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#67. To: SonOfLiberty (#66)
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
Yes. It's a tool to use for immediate dehydrating of things you can buy from the store (veges/fruits and some jerky). You can put through tons of produce in one of those very quickly, seal it in vacuum bags and if you do it enough, be good for a year or at least a couple of months. Since time is of the essence, it seems like the best tool for the job. After electricity goes out, you can fall back on either canning, or construct a no electricity dehydrator out of wood, mesh screen and a decent sized window (assuming you have a hand drill and saws). Of course you could just lay the stuff out on the back porch in the sun, but I have something of an issue letting swarms of flies defecate all over drying food. Rice is a semi-poor storage staple, it will last you a year tops unless you freeze dry it and #10 can it. Whole kernel wheat and beans on the other hand, will keep you in bread and beans for a long time (don't forget to hold back lots of salt as well, which stores indefinitely). Ensure that if you have whole grain anything, that you have a good hand grinder. No matter what you choose though, if it is bulk stuff like grains/rice/beans, ensure that you kill any critter eggs in it before you store it in oxygen free mylar bags (stuffed inside 5 gallon buckets). It's an easy thing to do, get some dry ice, put a 5-6 gallon mylar bag in a 5 gallon bucket, fill it half way with the staple, throw in a chunk of dry ice, fill the rest of the way with the staple, throw in another chunk of dry ice, and put the lid on the bucket loosely, let the air bleed out. Seal the bucket after that and let the CO2 kill all the critter eggs. Seal the bag with a household iron after throwing a desiccant inside and you're good for 5-7 years most of the time (and probably a year after you open it).
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
All grain contains critter eggs, Eric. Even milling flour doesn't destroy them. Keep a bag of flour long enough and you will see teeny mealy bug worms spawning in it, even if you've kept it sealed.
I see psyops everywhere.
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
Processors work under the assumption that you aren't going to store the product long term, so you can't count on there NOT being critter eggs in the product. It's always best to be safe and debug everything from a dry goods/grain perspective. Last thing you want is to have your last 50 pounds of rice, that you need to keep you family alive just long enough to let garden produce come in, be full of worms. The cost of dry ice is nominal and it only takes a few minutes per batch. I'm not terribly thrilled with those. I mean yes, they work great for normal home use in normal times, especially to help prevent freezer burn and extend freezer life, or to seal stuff for camping. But ultimately plastic lets air and light in, and the food WILL degrade. The machines they sell in the store, IMHO, are good for normal "good" times use only, not long term storage. http://www.usaemergencysupply.com is where I buy my bags and desiccants. Good prices, extremely fast shipping. I normally get the non-resealable ones for the 5-6 gallon bags, quite a few non-resealable ones for 1-2 gallon bags, and then a bundle of resealable ones for everyday use after you'd open a non-resealable. You bet! Squeeze out air (carefully), throw in a handful of dessicants, lay the edge of the bag on a 2x4 piece of wood, iron it shut, throw the bag in a 5 gallon plastic bucket, label the bucket, seal it, you're good for 5-7 years.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
Yep, the things in the eggs are living, and without air seeping through the egg shell, they can't breath and die. I've heard people deep freezing them as well, but I'm not certain that would work well, don't use that method myself. Figure nature already has natural "deep freezes" that bugs always seem to survive.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
From everything I've read, this is supposed to be effective. The CO2 storage procedure is on my program the next couple of weeks, Eric.
I see psyops everywhere.
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
You only leave it ajar for a minute or two, enough to let the oxygen out from CO2 pressure, then you seal it up and let it stand a while (I do an hour, but I'm rather paranoid sometimes about bugs in food). After that, unseal, pour into bag, throw in desiccants, iron it shut, put bucket lid back on, label, you're golden.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
They do in mine. I have the 5 gallon orange buckets/lids I get from Home Depot for like $4.00 each, sturdy enough. The bucket only serves to provide hard walled protection around the mylar bags, and also to provide a place to de-bug product, nothing more.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
Don't get me wrong, some great info here for those who want to save a buck, but this isn't about survival, IMO. I went thru this heavily when I was convinced the earth was going to end when the clocks struck midnight, 010100. IMO, if people are hungry, and signs of food exist in your home, garden, roof or tub, you will have your hands full, regardless of which side anyone is on. Again, no offense intended, I'm simply saying people eat each other when confronted with true survival.
Sorry, I wasn't clear. Debug first, then put a bag in a bucket and pour the debugged product into the bag. Seal. The bags must be stored in the buckets, as mylar is highly susceptible to having holes poked into it. A bucket per 5-6 gallon bag is what you'll ultimately want. :) Some people debug right in the mylar (mylar in bucket, product in bag, debug, seal, close bucket lid, done).
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
I meant just you. Don't want those on "our" side robbing me blind. Ask for some food and I'll give what I can. Steal at midnight and ten to one you won't even hear the shot. :) When it gets to the point of roaming bands of cannibals, I suspect we'll already be at our farm out in the country. Folks out there are already more or less self sufficient and we already know most of them well. Bands of cannibal zombies don't stand a chance against a town full of well armed well fed sharp shooting country boys.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
Depends on what you have in it and how your family eats honestly. High calorie, high nutrition items like grains and beans can go quite a while if you're frugal. You'll need to implement and follow dietary regimens that you probably aren't used to right now. If you can manage to secure some meat or if you pressure can meat now, that will really help pack on the calories and extend the usefulness of a bucket exponentially. Don't ration food so much in an emergency that you have no energy to get more once it runs out. If you can get 2000 calories per day in, you're set. The best way to know is to try "the way" for a while and see how it pans out. You'll need to know how to make the things from the grains and beans that keep everybody interested in eating. Starving, believe it or not, sometimes doesn't induce people to eat if what they have to eat they find distasteful (strange but true). Rotate through a bucket and unseasoned meat and plain veges for a while, see how long it lasts, what spices you really wanted and what you ran out of first, etc, to give you a baseline. Beans? Whatever you like really, they're all pretty damned good for you. They lose nutritional value fast though through age, so ensure that once you decide you get them stored and out of oxygen fast. We like pinto and navy beans.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
I understand, and as I said earlier in this thread, I'll personally be fertilizer for your garden before the very hungry hordes come - and come they will. So I'm not your potential problem. My investment in lead was never intended to defend a pea patch. Nothing personal, but should this end time survival scenario actually come, I'll be the lucky one having chosen to depart on my terms, early on.
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
I can't remember what thread it was on and I should have saved it when I saw it, but I believe it was you who mentioned a certain grain to grown in the garden. I believe it began with an "a". Thanks for your help.
"What began in Russia will end in America."- 1930, Elder Ignatius of Harbin, Manchuria.
My fruits are doing pretty well. Have to work on the Raspberries. They are in year two and will produce some fruit, but they should be further along and they are. I didn't handle the drainage and soil right the first go-round. So when I fix it over the next couple weeks, they should do much better late this season and especially next. I have four Blueberry bushes, but these are only the 2-4 foot variety and will produce fruit only once a season starting in a few weeks. I need at least two more of the type that grows 4-6 feet and produces twice a year. I'm near a local nursery that has some. My strawberries have done very well. 6 plants have become 18 and they are producing good fruit now. I've discovered you don't need many strawberry plants to wind up with a lot. They send out runners and sprout up new plants throughout the growing season. I'm lucky enough to have a mature self-pollinating Red Delicious. I've paired it with a Gala that is in year two and I am letting it fruit this year.
"What began in Russia will end in America."- 1930, Elder Ignatius of Harbin, Manchuria.
Good for you! I'm hankering for some berry fruit, bad. We have 2 x 6 foot mid-late summer blueberries, and 2 x 4 foot early summer blueberries. Wish we didn't have to wait forever for them to produce.
MapQuest really needs to start their directions on #5. Pretty sure I know how to get out of my neighborhood.
I saw a guy out here grow a metric assload of potatoes in a small suburban backyard using stacked discarded tires...same idea...fill/grow/fill/grow...then he'd just peel off a tire when he wanted some spuds. Those tires were stacked over four feet tall with potatoes growing all the way down.
Yup, I'm familiar with the tactic, and it does work quite well. Not very purdy but very functional.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Talk about topic drift. LOL Not a complaint, just saying...
"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." Depending upon your zone that is possible - but mainly in the south. For more production Legend or Rubel would be a good choice. Both produce a smaller wild-like blueberry. Rubel in particular, which was originally a selection from the wild, is prized for its flavor and is considered by many to be the best pie blueberry. Rubel reaches 6 to 8 feet at maturity and will produce as much as 15 pounds per plant. As a side note - Raintree Nursery is having their annual clearance and has some good buys on berries.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
There was a show on PBS a few days ago about growing gardens in junk. Or was it garbage?
“have your last check be made to the undertaker, and have it bounce. ” - Lod
Thhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhppppppp! "One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
LOL
"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them. To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." Could be either - people make planters out of the strangest things - such as old toilet bowls.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
And you want to root those runners and expand. Strawberries reach their peak production and then produce good for about 3 years and then begin to decline after that and so those rooted runners are your future production. Once the nodes on the runners have rooted you can snip the runner, dig out a goodly sized root ball and move them to where you need or want them.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
HUNNERT!!!!!!!
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Yep. Will do. That's how my original six became 18 and truth be told, it was/is more than that. I have let a small patch have it and do whatever it wants. I decided I wanted a managed section and another for the critters. Was not aware of their relatively short life span- thank you. I'm in Asheville, zones 6a and 7a.
"What began in Russia will end in America."- 1930, Elder Ignatius of Harbin, Manchuria.
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
If you're so inclined and can find land where you can set aside 1/4 acre or so, crops like wheat or barley would be advisable too, unless you dislike bread, beer, pastries and cake. :) One Apple I know of, Queen Cox, is self fertile. I know Raintree Nursery sells them both at the store and on line. I wish I had room for grains. Amaranth is another good one - I like the flavor and it is the only grain that contains all essential amino acids. By using trees on the extra-dwarfing Emla 27 Rootstock apple trees can be kept to a very manageable 6 feet high with a 6 to 8 foot spacing thus making it possible to have a small orchard in a small space. There are also dwarf cherries that are self fertile. Pears require a little more room, as there is no mini-dwarf rootstock, and on the available dwarfing rootstock will reach 12 to 14 feet. Still manageable though. The mini-dwarf apple trees can be grown in a 65 gallon SmartPot. The SmartPots were originally developed for tree growers but are also very useful for container gardening - particularly in containing plants that will expand and get unruly like Raspberries and Blackberries. I have my Raspberries in 25 gallon SmartPots.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Blueberries grown in SmartPots are very low maintenance. Mostly watering, fertilizing, and a little, and I do mean little, weeding. 5 bushes in containers, once set up, should take no more than ten minutes a day if that. For hardy half high bushes I would reccomend a 15 or 20 gallon, and for larger varieties a 20 or 25 gallon. I have 2 half high bushes in 15 gallon pots, and 2 Little Giants, and a Rubel in 20's. If I had to all of them could probably fit in a 5'x7' plot. The main things to know about blueberries is that they require a very acid soil PH 4.5 to 5.0 and that you need at least 2 varieties for cross pollination and maximum fruit production. If I was limited to two - in your climate zone I would reccomend 1 Rubel and 1 Little Giant. Both produce a nice "wild-like" berrie and at full growth produce about 15 pounds per plant per year. Acidifying the soil is easy to accomplish by adding about a cup of horticultural sulfur to the soil mix, distributed throughout as you fill them, for the pots. Since the sulfur takes about a year to fully lower the PH you definitely need a high acid fertilizer the first year. I used "Happy Frog" for acid loving plants and they are thriving. I also supplement with Algoflash All Purpose and a little liquid calcium. Blueberries like extra nitrogen when fruiting so a high nitrogen fertilizer helps to maximize fruit production. Raspberries also like a slightly acid soil but more around PH 5.5 to 6.0. Same on the nitrogen. Strawberries prefer a more neutral soil but also want extra nitrogen for best fruiting.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Oh, Strawberries will continue to produce beyond that, but it is just that they peak out and then get "tired" producing progressively fewer berries each year. Raspberries will do the same at about the 12 year mark. Blueberries will still be producing when your grandchildren have children as they are known to last at least 50 to 60 years.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
All grain contains critter eggs, Eric. Even milling flour doesn't destroy them. Keep a bag of flour long enough and you will see teeny mealy bug worms spawning in it, even if you've kept it sealed. That reminds me of a sealed box of Quaker Oats that I opened up and then immediately trashed. It was disgusting the damn bugs had webs and probably 2 generations of the bastards in there.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
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The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one. "You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."
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#68. To: Eric Stratton (#67)
Thanks! I'll have to look into them. Still, they take electricity to operate, no?
I'm thinking just a good stock of dried rice and beans for immediate action.
#69. To: SonOfLiberty (#68)
#70. To: Eric Stratton (#69)
Would there be critter eggs in store-bought rice bags?
#71. To: randge (#70)
#72. To: Eric Stratton (#69)
Would there be critter eggs in store-bought rice bags?
I've got some of those foodsealing bags, are those good for this?
Where does one by 5-6 gal. mylar bags?
Also, will an iron seal that shut?
#73. To: Eric Stratton (#71)
#74. To: Eric Stratton (#71)
But the dry ice method will prevent that, right?
#75. To: SonOfLiberty (#72)
#76. To: randge, SonOfLiberty (#74)
#77. To: Eric Stratton (#76)
(Edited)
#78. To: SonOfLiberty (#77)
#79. To: Eric Stratton (#78)
#80. To: SonOfLiberty (#79)
#81. To: SonOfLiberty (#65)
Be nice man. If somebody was prescient enough to grow a good garden to survive on, they're on our side. Stealing would just be wrong in that case.
#82. To: Eric Stratton (#80)
#83. To: SonOfLiberty (#82)
#84. To: Jethro Tull (#81)
Don't get me wrong, some great info here for those who want to save a buck, but this isn't about survival, IMO. I went thru this heavily when I was convinced the earth was going to end when the clocks struck midnight, 010100. IMO, if people are hungry, and signs of food exist in your home, garden, roof or tub, you will have your hands full, regardless of which side anyone is on. Again, no offense intended, I'm simply saying people eat each other when confronted with true survival.
#85. To: Eric Stratton (#83)
(Edited)
How long would you say a five-gallon pail would last in terms of food supply?
#86. To: SonOfLiberty (#84)
I meant just you. Don't want those on "our" side robbing me blind
#87. To: SonOfLiberty (#85)
#88. To: Original_Intent (#31)
#89. To: SonOfLiberty, Eric Stratton (#19)
#90. To: scooter (#89)
#91. To: Original_Intent (#49)
#92. To: Samuel Gray (#91)
#93. To: Original_Intent, Samuel Gray (#92)
James Madison, Letter to James Robertson, April 20, 1831
#94. To: scooter, SonOfLiberty, Eric Stratton (#89)
I need at least two more of the type that grows 4-6 feet and produces twice a year.
#95. To: Original_Intent, Samuel Gray (#92)
#96. To: farmfriend (#93)
just saying...
#97. To: Original_Intent (#96)
James Madison, Letter to James Robertson, April 20, 1831
#98. To: Dakmar (#95)
#99. To: scooter, SonOfLiberty, Eric Stratton (#89)
My strawberries have done very well. 6 plants have become 18 and they are producing good fruit now. I've discovered you don't need many strawberry plants to wind up with a lot.
#100. To: All (#99)
#101. To: Original_Intent, SonOfLibery, Eric Stratton (#99)
#102. To: scooter (#101)
#103. To: SonOfLiberty, Eric Stratton, Scooter, all (#19)
Yes to apples, those will thrive there. Grapes too I believe, and pears and peaches. Keep in mind that most fruiting trees need at least two trees for cross pollination, otherwise you won't get any fruit.
#104. To: Eric Stratton, scooter, SonOfLiberty, all (#102)
Man, I wish I had time for blueberry/strawberry plants.
#105. To: scooter, SonOfLibery, Eric Stratton (#101)
Yep. Will do. That's how my original six became 18 and truth be told, it was/is more than that. I have let a small patch have it and do whatever it wants. I decided I wanted a managed section and another for the critters. Was not aware of their relatively short life span- thank you. I'm in Asheville, zones 6a and 7a.
#106. To: randge, Eric Stratton (#70)
Would there be critter eggs in store-bought rice bags?
#107. To: Original_Intent (#104)
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