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All is Vanity
See other All is Vanity Articles

Title: Left Behind Culturally
Source: LewRockwell
URL Source: [None]
Published: Jun 6, 2010
Author: Gary North
Post Date: 2010-06-06 15:16:12 by Turtle
Keywords: None
Views: 506
Comments: 20

I have just previewed a videotape of a new movie, which will be released on February 2: "Left Behind." The best I can say for it is this:

"Two thumbs off!" (See Judges 1:6.) "Left Behind" is based on an astoundingly successful fundamentalist publishing venture, a series of novels known collectively as Left Behind. At last count, there were eight volumes in this series. This series has generated sales totaling approximately a quarter of a billion dollars in just five years. Big money. Big audience. Big hopes for a very small movie producer.

The series is co-authored by Rev. Tim LaHaye, husband of Beverly LaHaye, who runs the Christian activist organization, Concerned Women of America.

The series is premised on a theological assumption, namely, that Chapter 13 of the Gospel of Matthew must not be taken literally. This is the passage, more than any other in the New Testament, that deals with the Kingdom of God in history. It contains several of Jesus' parables, including the one that deals with the wheat and the tares. This is the parable where the field workers come to the field's owner and tell him that an enemy has seeded the wheat field with tares – a worthless crop. Should they dig up the tares?

But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn (Matthew 13:29-30). Jesus' disciples came to Him after the crowd had left, and asked what this parable meant.

He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear (Matthew 13:37-43). Jesus was quite clear: there will be no corporate separation of sinners and saints in history. Only at the end of time will the corporate separation take place: sheep and goats, wheat and tares, saved and lost, covenant-keepers and covenant-breakers. Until then, the separation remains confessional and institutional, not physical and corporate.

Until 1830, the Christian church universally taught this doctrine of temporal non-separation. In 1830, a tiny English Protestant sect known as the Irvingites proclaimed a new doctrine. The church will escape the prophesied future tribulation by being removed from history. The church will be pulled into heaven at an event that is today referred to as "the Rapture."

Two preliminary observations are in order. First, the word "rapture" does not appear in either New Testament Greek or the King James Bible. Second, with respect to the doctrine of the Great Tribulation, significant segments of the church have understood this to refer to the Roman imperial army's burning of the Temple and sacking of the city of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. (See David Chilton's book, The Great Tribulation.)

The Irvingites' idea was immediately adopted by John Nelson Darby, a leader of the small British sect known as the Plymouth Brethren. Darby brought this doctrine to the United States. Decades later, in the 1880's, it finally began to spread among American fundamentalists, especially those who were upset by the appearance of what soon became known as the Social Gospel, which identified the kingdom of God with the Progressive movement. The Social Gospel's defenders secularized the older postmillennialism of the Puritans and American Presbyterians, concluding that the interventionist State will progressively manifest the political aspect of the kingdom of God in history.

Fundamentalists rejected such a notion, but offered in its place the Irving-Darby doctrine: the pre-tribulational, pre-millennial Rapture. The Rapture will take place 1,007 years prior to the final judgment, seven years prior to the bodily return of Jesus to set up an international Christian bureaucracy to run the world. This thousand-year era will be known as the millennial kingdom of God. Jesus will therefore return pre-millennially.

What was new in this premillennial outline was the doctrine that Christ will remove the church from the world 3.5 years prior to the great tribulation period, which will last for another 3.5 years. Seven years after the Rapture, He will return to set up His earthly kingdom. Traditional premillennialism, which has a long history, had previously taught that Christ will return after the great tribulation of His church. There will be no period in history where there is not continuity for His church.

So, Jesus will come secretly to rapture his church into heaven. Then the antichrist will set up an international government to rule the world. Three and a half years after the Rapture, the antichrist's army will surround Jerusalem and kill (approximately) two-thirds of the Jews. (There are three big statistical problems with this prophecy: New York City, West Los Angeles, and Miami Beach.)

A major psychological reason why American fundamentalists support the State of Israel is this: the doctrine of the pre-tribulation Rapture teaches that the future persecution of the saints will be the persecution of Jews in Israel, not Christians. Christians by then will have flown the coop. (I have discussed this motivation in an earlier essay.)

"Left Behind" is based on Darby's Rapture doctrine. It identifies the bad guys – central bankers and the United Nations (hard to argue with that!) – and the good guys: irrelevant Christians, who depart from the film rather early, leaving behind empty piles of clothing. This leaves only clueless non-Christians to carry the dramatic weight of the movie. But without the Soviet Union or Saddam Hussein, and with too many nations in the European Union to fit the traditional fundamentalist prophecy of a ten-nation alliance against Israel, the screenwriter was hard-pressed to squeeze much drama out of it.

A Muted Trumpet

The movie's first scene after the Rapture has taken place occurs on a transatlantic air flight. A lady asks a stewardess if the stewardess can look for her husband. "I think he's naked." She points to a pile of clothes on the seat next to her. The lady is elderly. So, presumably, is her husband. (This is a family film, after all.) But others on the plane are also missing. Where are they? They're gone! On flights all over the skies, they're gone. The rest of the people in the film have been . . . left behind!

Nobody knows why. In the movie, it's a huge mystery, even a national security issue. The movie spends the next thirty minutes with characters wandering around saying, "Where did they go?"

The problem here, for both the screenwriter and fundamentalist theologians, is the trumpet. We are told later in the movie that the New Testament says this:

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17). In another epistle, Paul wrote: "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed" (I Corinthians 15:52). The trumpet is prominent in both passages. This is because both passages refer to the same event: the end of history (the real one, not Francis Fukuyama's) and the final judgment.

So, why didn't anyone in the movie hear the trumpet? Because the movie is about the secret Rapture. This is what fundamentalists call this hypothetical future event: the secret Rapture. Every Christian on earth will disappear in the twinkling of an eye, leaving behind piles of off-the-rack suits, but nobody who is left behind will have heard the trumpet. They will have trouble figuring out just what has happened.

I ask the screenwriter and the theologians: Where was that mighty trumpet sound? When it comes to the next cataclysmic eschatological event of history, I ask this: Louis Armstrong, where are you now that we need you?

Here's Not Looking at You, Kids

In the movie, the world goes on. All the Christians are gone, but airlines still fly, power companies still operate, banks stay open, and the TV still blares. The only things missing on-screen are Oprah and Montel interviewing family members left behind, and Rosie O'Donnell arguing that this tragedy would never have happened if there had been effective gun control laws.

The whole social system still works. The infrastructure is intact. ("When I hear the word infrastructure, I reach for my gun." – Ruben Alvarado.) The world has just lost the true – really, truly true – members of its largest religion, and everything still runs just fine. No problem! I mean, even the life insurance companies are still in business.

I suppose that Sunday morning TV programming of local preachers and televangelists would be taped re-runs, but the movie leaves this an open question. One of the characters left behind is a local fundamentalist pastor, who is very, very chagrined.

I wish all this were a spoof, but it isn't. This movie faithfully represents dramatically a central tenet of American fundamentalism: Christianity is socially irrelevant.

In every field, Christians are today understood by fundamentalists as offering nothing of real importance culturally. The world can get along just fine without Christians. In education, science, technology, the professions, and entertainment – above all, entertainment – Christians are assumed by fundamentalists to be irrelevant or at least marginal, and necessarily so. This is indicated by their view of the seven-year interval between the Rapture and Christ's Second Coming to set up His bureaucratic earthly kingdom. The absence of Christians will not be noticed after the Rapture because they are barely noticed today.

The only evidence in the movie that the absence of Christians will make a visible difference is in the number of auto accidents. Cars went out of control when their drivers were issued the Great Summons from the sky. Yet even here, the screenwriter does not have anyone say this. It is merely implied by a street full of banged-up cars.

There are no airplane crashes on-screen. Why not? Is it because the screenwriter assumed that Christians are not well-educated enough to be pilots? Or is this movie a subtle ad for El Al Airlines?

Yes, I am being sarcastic, but for a reason. The doctrine of the premillennial, pre-tribulation Rapture has gutted fundamentalism culturally for well over a century. What Christian wants to pay the personal sacrificial price that gaining influence requires, when he also expects the church to be removed from the world in the very near future? After all, the antichrist will inherit everything. Covenant-breakers will become the heirs of the capital of covenant-keepers. Why sacrifice today to build up an inheritance for God's enemies?

The Bible teaches that "a good man leaveth an inheritance to his children's children: and the wealth of the sinner is laid up for the just" (Proverbs 13:22). The Rapture doctrine teaches that the wealth of the just is laid up for the sinner. So, why spend a lifetime of above-average effort and risk-taking in order to lay up an inheritance that will be confiscated by the sinners left behind?

A radical present-orientation afflicts Protestant fundamentalists. In 1970, Edward Banfield identified the primary origin of lower-class culture as its present-orientation. (See the original edition of his book, The Unheavenly City.) It is not a person's income but rather his time-perspective that best identifies his class position. Fundamentalists, by this definition, are lower class.

A person who has no faith in the long-term earthly future of his legacy is unlike to save, work long hours to build a business, advance his education, or do anything else that involves long-term sacrifice, other than foreign missions. Ludwig von Mises argued that people with high time-preference (low future-orientation) pay high interest rates to borrow money, and will not save unless they are offered high interest rates by borrowers. Cultures that are high time-preference societies experience low capital formation and therefore low economic growth, he said. They are unwilling to pay for it. They get what they pay for.

The result, artistically, is "Left Behind."

Conclusion

I end this essay with a Bible verse. It should be applied in more senses than one.

For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle? (I Corinthians 14:8)

Culturally, intellectually, and politically, American fundamentalists have been left behind. They have done their best to leave behind nothing of cultural value. They are committed theologically to cultural irrelevance, as I have explained in Chapter 5 of my book, Rapture Fever. Culturally, they have sounded an uncertain trumpet. They need a lot more Louis Armstrong, figuratively speaking.


Poster Comment:

This is from 2001 but is still relevant today.

"Fundamentalists, by this definition, are lower class."

That's the problem in one sentence.

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#1. To: Turtle (#0)

"Fundamentalists, by this definition, are lower class."

They wouldn't be a lower class if they would have joined the class to start with. Where are their great inventions? What have they created other than small communities who shun the rest of the world?

Ragin1  posted on  2010-06-06   15:37:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Turtle (#0)

In every field, Christians are today understood by fundamentalists as offering nothing of real importance culturally. The world can get along just fine without Christians. In education, science, technology, the professions, and entertainment – above all, entertainment – Christians are assumed by fundamentalists to be irrelevant or at least marginal, and necessarily so. This is indicated by their view of the seven-year interval between the Rapture and Christ's Second Coming to set up His bureaucratic earthly kingdom. The absence of Christians will not be noticed after the Rapture because they are barely noticed today.

Therein lies the fundamental kernel that underlies the PsyOp at play. By neutralizing Christians, freezing them in inaction, the Banksters have an open field. It is the fundamental decency of Christian morality which stands in their way. "Do unto others ..." is a Christian concept (and other religions as well e.g., Buddhism) and one that permeates American Culture. The problem with such a philosophy is that it runs counter to the implacable hatred which the Banksters, and their pet Psychiatrists, hold for humanity. If one imposes a moral philosophy requiring consideration of ones neighbor then their predatory behavior, wanton murder, theft, and war are deligitimized and made unacceptable.

Tim LaHaye has been tied to Sun Myung Moon who is in turn tied to the Korean CIA. The KCIA has tight relations with the American CIA thus putting into play the likelihood that Tim LaHaye is tied to the American CIA, its Psychiatrists, and their large scale social control and manipulation programs. And thus the fundamentalists who believe in the "Rapture" are one of their tools for keeping Christians inactive in society. The infiltration of the Catholic Church with Homo Predators can also be traced to Psychiatry and Psychology (not that it did not predate it in some cases but it was not as prevalent) by using Psychologists to screen young men entering the Priesthood (and this has been documented in a book whose title I forget - but I listened to the author being interviewed on a local radio program and he made a strong case). Since mainstream Psychiatry and Psychology regard strong religious beliefs as a disease and homosexuality as "normal" (Note: Psychiatrists have the highest conviction rate for predatory sexual behavior of all M.D. groups.) it follows that they downchecked devout young men and upchecked queers. Thus the current crisis in Catholicism over predatory queer Priests.

Many Jews are taught to hate Christians merely for being Christians and since Christianity, and most major religions, are antithetical in their philosophy to the psychotic evil of the Banksters and most Mainstream Psychiatrists. So, it is likely that Jews were chosen as the antithesis card because of the cultural insularity and hostility to other religious beliefs - particularly Christianity. Thus as a socially insular group with hostile beliefs they are played off against Christians and promoted into governmental control positions to combat Christianity. The differences are then inflamed and promoted, via fear and petty jealousies, to create a group able and willing to execute their neighbor for no other reason than those transient and insubstantial hatreds. Part of the problem though is that their numbers are too small to be able to apply force outright and so must be placed in positions of control and authority to amplify the affect. Thus you get the disproportionate placement in high office and groups such as the ACLU and ADL attacking any public expression of Christian religiousity. After all, again, it is the Christian viewpoint of charity and brotherly love that they wish to kill as that militates against the precept of perpetual war (for profit) for perpetual peace. It also means that devout Christians would be unlikely to participate in mass kill off programs as their moral philosophy would be absolutely contrary. However, a small manipulated group whose fears and hatreds have been inflamed and nurtured over generations fits the bill perfectly. Of course, like the Nazi Brownshirts they resemble, they, in the end, would be "liquidated" as well as being too dangerous to keep around.

"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator

Original_Intent  posted on  2010-06-06   16:23:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Original_Intent (#2)

The bankers certainly had a part. But the guiltiest of all would be Christ himself. "Turn the other cheek", and "Render unto Caesar", have got to have the most twisted interpretations of all time.

Ragin1  posted on  2010-06-06   16:34:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Turtle (#0)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

"You've got to put right and wrong above legal and illegal. Because when tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty; and it is not rebellion at all, it is submission to the higher law that our government is in rebellion to. We're not the rebels, they're the rebels."

Eric Stratton  posted on  2010-06-06   18:08:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Turtle (#0)

This series has generated sales totaling approximately a quarter of a billion dollars in just five years. Big money.

Where is the money going - to feed the poor - like Jesus would do?

Perverting Jesus' words is an virtual attack on Him!

p.s. I bet that the money is in the hands of the big bankers that they claim to hate!

your_neighbor  posted on  2010-06-06   19:22:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: your_neighbor (#5)

It's difficult to respond to such blatant hostility, but I'm not a timid soul. So many heresies, so little time. Jesus warned His follower's against 'casting pearls before swine', but here goes Porkies.

First, actual copies of sermons made by Polycarp, a Bishop and Early Church Father who wrote extensively about the great catching away, or the 'raptur' in latin. Those doctrines have existed since Jesus first introduced them. Over 2200 verses of scripture OT and NT support the concept of the Rapture.

One third of the Holy Bible addresses issues of prophecy, over 300 prophecies about Jesus have come true so far. That's (100%) to date.

Even this sort of harrassment and hate filled chatter, complete with demeaning comments about the intelligence of Christian's in general was prophetized by Jesus long ago. Scoffer's and lover's of themselves shall abound in the Last Day's.

FYI, the most brilliant researchers in the fields of advanced genetics, physics and cosmology have become Christian converts, because their work itself testifies to the glory of God. They have been forced to admit the reality of God, because nothing else can possibly explain why the universe and it's creatures are 'so terribly and wonderfully made' The most successful scientists, builders and businessmen in the world are Christian's.

The America hating, re-educating socialists have slandered our nation's illustrious history and our sacred founders legacy. To a man, all of the Founding Father's were born again Christian's, they knew their Bible's better than most anyone alive does today. Our first documents use Bible phases liberally, just as I do. They founded 158 universities, college's and academies in the new nation primarily to train pastors for the nation's churchs. The Founder's knew all about End Times prophecy and the devil. They actually wrote our Constitution to prevent evil from seizing ultimate power. They decorated our Capitol Building's Rotunda with murals that show George Washington seated beside the Lord in heaven. It also has another mural with an exact copy of the Aztec Calender Stone, it points directly from 1775 to 2012 in 19 year steps. The Washington Monument is capped by a stone enscribed with his favorite verse, seen only by God from directly above 'glory to God' Inside the Washington Monument, each stair is inscribed with a bible verse selected by our first President. Maybe that's why the global elite have had those stairs closed down for the last 50 years. Our Founder's were great men of God, not dieist's as the commies claim.

Don't take this slack jawed hillbillies word for it, but contrary to the secular spin, Christianity is not only the largest world religion, it's also the fastest growing and more importantly, the only way home to the Father. Don't listen to me, investigate God and make your choice. Make it after serious soul searching, because you'll have to live with your decision forever.

Finally, the enormous amount of money generated by the sale of the LB series has been used to fund charities, house and feed the world's poor. I know that the authors have been wonderful stewards of what the Lord's given them. I should be so charitable in thar regard.

Stick To Disinformation  posted on  2010-06-06   23:06:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Stick To Disinformation (#6)

the great catching away, or the 'raptur' in latin.

Or just plain Bull Shit in plain English

WWGPD? - (What Would General Pinochet Do?)

Flintlock  posted on  2010-06-06   23:16:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Stick To Disinformation (#6)

Christianity is not only the largest world religion, it's also the fastest growing......

Sounds like your trying to sell something

May ODIN crush you for being the grovelling rapture monkey worm you are.

Now, back on your belly and beg!

WWGPD? - (What Would General Pinochet Do?)

Flintlock  posted on  2010-06-06   23:22:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Stick To Disinformation (#6)

The whole post

You should be hanging out at the airport handing out pamphlets

I spit in your grovelling face!!!

WWGPD? - (What Would General Pinochet Do?)

Flintlock  posted on  2010-06-06   23:24:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: Stick To Disinformation (#6)

Over 2200 verses of scripture OT and NT support the concept of the Rapture.

MORE BULL SHIT!!

Get a life wacko

WWGPD? - (What Would General Pinochet Do?)

Flintlock  posted on  2010-06-06   23:26:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Stick To Disinformation (#6)

or the 'raptur' in latin

Rapture, in the context of eschatology, is an English word derived from the Latin rapio, "caught up" as found in the Vulgate rendering of 1 Thessalonians 4:17. --wiki

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations

abraxas  posted on  2010-06-06   23:52:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Turtle, all (#0)

I wish all this were a spoof, but it isn't.

Yes it is. It's just not an intentional spoof. I read most of the books. They sucked. So it's no surprise that the movie sucks.

IMO they believe in the "rapture" because they are elitist cowards. They say, in so many words, "Fuck you! I got mine, you're going to hell!"

And, in closing, there is no such thing as "the Great Tribulation". No capital letters period. THey are added by translators, along with all punctuation. Play games with punctuation and you completely change the meaning. It's quite intentional.

.


Click for Privacy and Preparedness files
CHIMPOUT!

Live free or die kill ~~ Me
God is a separatist. That's good enough for me.

PSUSA  posted on  2010-06-07   8:33:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: aptly named, Stick To Disinformation, all (#6)

Over 2200 verses of scripture OT and NT support the concept of the Rapture.

liar liar pants on fire. Since there are so many, list some. I will not hold my breath waiting for you to do so.

To a man, all of the Founding Father's were born again Christian's,

Prove it.

Christianity is not only the largest world religion, it's also the fastest growing

Another lie.

I'll prove it. Ready? Are you sure?

Luke 18:8

18:8  I tell you that he will avenge them speedily

*. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith

on the earth?

Click on that word "when" and what do you find?

687 // ara // ara // ar'-ah //

a form of 686 , denoting an interrogation to which a negative answer is presumed;

Paul didn't say that it would grow. He said it would get worse and worse. It's not Christianity that is growing.

.


Click for Privacy and Preparedness files
CHIMPOUT!

Live free or die kill ~~ Me
God is a separatist. That's good enough for me.

PSUSA  posted on  2010-06-07   8:47:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Stick To Disinformation (#6)

First, actual copies of sermons made by Polycarp, a Bishop and Early Church Father who wrote extensively about the great catching away, or the 'raptur' in latin.

Using the early church to justify their religious beliefs (i.e. tradition)is normally a Catholic/Orthodox/Oriental church tactic. Normally Protestants in general and fundy-nuts in particular dismiss these writings because they differ from their biblical interpretations. Interesting.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976

Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan

"When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat

Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi

F.A. Hayek Fan  posted on  2010-06-07   9:15:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: PSUSA, Stick To Disinformation, turtle (#12)

IMO they believe in the "rapture" because they are elitist cowards.

And they refuse to accept that they are largely responsible for the mess we're in and refuse to help with the clean up. I mean, it's all in Gawd's hands, in his time and after all Hey-Sus wants us to live like grovelling dogs in a 3d world police state so why do anything but wait for a cosmic beam-up ticket out?

If "heaven" is full of these dimwits, I want no part of it. Spending eternity with these grovelling worms would truly be hell

WWGPD? - (What Would General Pinochet Do?)

Flintlock  posted on  2010-06-07   9:22:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Flintlock (#15)

And they refuse to accept that they are largely responsible for the mess we're in and refuse to help with the clean up. I mean, it's all in Gawd's hands, in his time and after all Hey-Sus wants us to live like grovelling dogs in a 3d world police state so why do anything but wait for a cosmic beam-up ticket out?

That too. Good point. But imo it is in Gods' hands. IMO this planet was never meant to be a paradise. We're here to learn. Adversity teaches us more than having everything just handed to us on a silver platter like these fundies want. We need to fight. We were made that way. Without that struggle, people would be even more useless than they already are, myself included.

If "heaven" is full of these dimwits, I want no part of it.

IMO it is not even a factor to consider.


Click for Privacy and Preparedness files
CHIMPOUT!

Live free or die kill ~~ Me
God is a separatist. That's good enough for me.

PSUSA  posted on  2010-06-07   9:32:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Turtle (#0)

and the good guys: irrelevant Christians, who depart from the film rather early, leaving behind empty piles of clothing.

So you're telling me that once up in heaven all of the chicks will be naked?

This is a new twist! I approve!

"The more artificial taboos and restrictions there are in the world, the more the people are impoverished.... The more that laws and regulations are given prominence, the more thieves and robbers there will be." - Lao Tzu, 6th century BC

SonOfLiberty  posted on  2010-06-07   10:57:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: PSUSA (#13)

To a man, all of the Founding Father's were born again Christian's,

Prove it.

Almost every one of the Founding Fathers was a Deist: God created the world and does not interfere with it.

For it is not the wolf or any of the other beasts that would join the contest in any noble danger, but rather a good man. — Aristotle, Politics, Book IIX

Turtle  posted on  2010-06-07   11:00:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: SonOfLiberty (#17)

So you're telling me that once up in heaven all of the chicks will be naked?

This is a new twist! I approve!

I am all for the Rapture. Get rid of all the hillbillies, and I get all their belongings and other stuff.

Cool!

For it is not the wolf or any of the other beasts that would join the contest in any noble danger, but rather a good man. — Aristotle, Politics, Book IIX

Turtle  posted on  2010-06-07   11:29:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Turtle (#19)

I know many fundamentalists, and they all have college degrees and work as professionals for good money.

While I can't defend this faith, the notion that somehow they're "hillbillies" is silly. Some are, yes, but it's not a blanket statement.

"The more artificial taboos and restrictions there are in the world, the more the people are impoverished.... The more that laws and regulations are given prominence, the more thieves and robbers there will be." - Lao Tzu, 6th century BC

SonOfLiberty  posted on  2010-06-07   11:38:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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