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Title: Everyone who believes that those who trust the government and believe it's wacky conspiracy theories are the biggest KOOKS of all, here's your thread
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me
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Published: Jul 11, 2010
Author: me
Post Date: 2010-07-11 17:14:00 by James Deffenbach
Keywords: None
Views: 947
Comments: 52
Poster Comment: Just something I have been noticing lately. Seems to be more talk from a certain quarter about how the government's official conspiracy theory™ in regards to the events of 9/11 are not only true but that anyone who doesn't toe the government line is a KOOK. And a lot of gibberish about Peak Oil and Global Warming. Anyone else notice there is a bit more of that than usual?
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#12. To: Kamala (#9)
The government is more to be feared than foreign terrorists. The odds of any individual being harmed by a foreign terrorist is probably pretty close to zero. The government has done more harm than the terrorists have in their alleged efforts to "keep us safe." Taking away our right to be left alone absent any action justifying it is more harm than 99% of us will ever see from any "terrorist."
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. Maybe more like 99.999%.
IMO it isn't. Saying people are lying is not enough. You have to figure out how they are lying to you, and what the lies are. If anyone believes the .gov 9/11 fairy tales, that's their business. But to refute it, you need to know what to refute. And what good does it do to refute them? IT's like arguing over religion. I learned that the hard way when I refute the doctrine of "eternal torture in hell". They can't refute the proof, so they get pissed off and call me many names. Nothing gets resolved. I also know that we don't have anything near the full story. We could be wrong on some things too. Plus, too many try and fill in the missing pieces with BS. I personally get tired of talking and reading about 9/11. BTDT and sick of it.
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files Live free or There is a simple remedy for that--stop talking about it and reading about it if you are tired of it.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. Yeah, I erred on the side of being generous/conservative with my estimate.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. There is a simple remedy for that--stop talking about it and reading about it if you are tired of it. Last I knew reading and participating in 911 discussions was, correct me if I am wrong, NOT mandatory. Hey christine are 911 threads mandatory participation?
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
that could explain why his goofenheimer thoughts bounce back and forth like a pong graphic in his otherwise feces impacted cranium.
for the likes of the liar movement they are in fact mandatory least the discussion stray too far from the official fairy tale. as it is now only the totally moronic village idiots believe the conspiracy theory put forth by baalzabush and company and their numbers are dwindling daily which is a good thing. of all the posters here there are but a handful of the goofenheimers making up the membership of the liar movement.
Wait a minute.... you mean they're not mandatory?! Oh, fer Kerise sake.....
I knew that would get under some peoples skin here. I probably shouldn't have written that. The way things work around here with some people, I should have known that would be the focus when it wasn't meant to be. The only reason I can think of that would piss people off is the thought of someone reading and believing what the opposition says about 9/11, so people fight it out. That's a burden I don't want to carry anymore. I'm not responsible for what others know and believe about 9/11. If you want to carry that responsibility on your shoulders, be my guest. And the other points you ignore? You say you don't learn anything from liars. If you're being lied to, you need to know what, and how, you're being lied to. To do that you need to know what you are talking about. That required knowledge. And at best, our 9/11 knowledge is incomplete. Confine yourself to what you know and can prove and you do OK. Make shit up, intentionally or not, and you do more harm than good. .
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files Live free or Ding! We have a winner!
But for many of us, it is not entirely clear from whom we most need protection.
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#13. To: James Deffenbach, Kamala (#12)
Taking away our right to be left alone absent any action justifying it is more harm than 99% of us will ever see from any "terrorist."
“It has been said, 'time heals all wounds.' I do not agree. The wounds remain. In time, the mind, protecting its sanity, covers them with scar tissue and the pain lessens, but it is never gone.” ~ Rose F. Kennedy
#14. To: James Deffenbach (#8)
Hard to learn anything from people who are lying to you.
CHIMPOUT!
die kill ~~ Me
God is a separatist. That's good enough for me.
#15. To: PSUSA (#14)
I personally get tired of talking and reading about 9/11.
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#16. To: wudidiz (#13)
Maybe more like 99.999%.
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#17. To: James Deffenbach, PSUSA, christine, wudidiz, all (#15)
I personally get tired of talking and reading about 9/11.
#18. To: Eric Stratton (#2)
computer counted ballots are ballots that have been counted in secret, and with all probability not the way one voted.
#19. To: Original_Intent (#17)
computer counted ballots are ballots that have been counted in secret, and with all probability not the way one voted.
#20. To: Original_Intent, James Deffenbach, PSUSA, christine, all, *9-11* (#17)
Last I knew reading and participating in 911 discussions was, correct me if I am wrong, NOT mandatory.
“It has been said, 'time heals all wounds.' I do not agree. The wounds remain. In time, the mind, protecting its sanity, covers them with scar tissue and the pain lessens, but it is never gone.” ~ Rose F. Kennedy
#21. To: James Deffenbach (#15)
There is a simple remedy for that--stop talking about it and reading about it if you are tired of it.
CHIMPOUT!
die kill ~~ Me
God is a separatist. That's good enough for me.
#22. To: Kamala (#9)
NIST left us with only some vague statements about a few sagging floors suddenly destroying two hundred super-strong perimeter columns and forty core columns. But since sagging floors do not weigh more than non-sagging floors, it is difficult to see how this might occur, especially so uniformly.
Waiting too late to oppose tyranny has always led to bloodshed.
Hair Extensions Five Towns Merrick Manhasset Roslyn Massapequa Amityville Wantagh Farmingdale East Meadow Long Island, NY
#23. To: Kamala (#9)
As long as Israel remains at war with its neighbors and allowed to take land from them by armed force(with American help) and as long as the Israeli lobby controls America's national elections we'll keep getting these kinds of fabrications from the government.
#24. To: Original_Intent, christine (#17)
Hey christine are 911 threads mandatory participation? LOL! Yeah, I think we need a ruling on that. I thought it was ok to talk about it if we wanted to but was not a requirement. What say you, christine?
Last I knew reading and participating in 911 discussions was, correct me if I am wrong, NOT mandatory.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end.
Lord Acton
He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic.
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#25. To: James Deffenbach, Turtle (#24) (Edited)
I am so glad I saw that. I think it's funny to see someone shoot himself in the foot. All I said is that I was tired of talking about it. So I don't talk about it. I made other points. So if I wanted to make something a requirement, I'd mandate that no 9/11 discussions would take place here, wouldn't I? Did I hint at any such thing? You amuse me, boy. You can argue about 9/11 until your face turns blue, and it won't do any good. That happened almost 9 years ago and "truthers" still can't agree on what really happened. We all have our own ideas. And if we all have our own ideas, it stands to reason that some of us are wrong. Maybe I am, maybe you are, who the hell knows? So Turtle, I know what you mean. It's hard to reason with someone with limited intelligence and no reading comprehension skills. My one little comment was latched onto, and they still didn't understand it. That's hilarious! And they presume to tell others about something they don't completely understand themselves. We disagree on 9/11. but you're OTHERWISE an intelligent person ;) .
LOL! Yeah, I think we need a ruling on that. I thought it was ok to talk about it if we wanted to but was not a requirement. What say you, christine?
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files
CHIMPOUT!
Live free or die kill ~~ Me
God is a separatist. That's good enough for me.
#26. To: PSUSA (#25)
Likewise. You amuse me too, at least once in a while. Although I doubt it is always intentional.
You amuse me, boy.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end.
Lord Acton
He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic.
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#27. To: Eric Stratton (#2) (Edited)
Hey Six Percenter flockwit! How come you can post so freely on this site if you know so much about the gubmint plots? According to you, they killed thousands of Americans on 911, but you're free to post all manner of charges and links purporting to show the connections, without even an interruption in service, a threatening email or phone call, much less a knock on your front door? Maybe it's because they see your 911 CT's as a freakshow and distraction of 94% of the general population from the real issues. "Mission accomplished," false flag op.
AGAviator, who's probably some ex-Special Ops guy
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One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work. Noam Chomsky
#28. To: AGAviator, All (#27)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
#29. To: AGAviator (#27)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
#30. To: IRTorqued, FormerLurker, christine, wudidiz, farmfriend, CadetD, James Deffenbach, Kamala, Deacon Benjamin, HOUNDDAWG, bluegrass, HighLairEon, HAPPY2BME-4UM, all (#19)
Nicely put and agreed. One could easily extend this to other topics upon which you will have the rabid skeptics who believe it is a criminal act for anyone to believe anything with which they disagree - the swallowers of "The Less Than Amazing Randi" and the Septical Enquirer crowd are some of the more virulent, as well as the fanatical atheists who think it is a sin to have spiritual beliefs. They all tend to conform to a set of behaviors that are common among them (of course some of them are fanatical upon more than one topic but they tend to follow the same pattern regardless of the topic). 1. They lie. Often such posters will misrepresent information, say something does not exist when they know it does, deny the existence of a conclusion that logically follows from the data, inflate the relative importance of a less than major point and then use the disproof of their strawman as implying that all other data on the subject has therefore been disproved. They will also state their personal opinion acting as though it is proven solid fact when in reality it is just their opinion. 2. They speak derogatorily to other posters who hold a contrary view usually using terms like "kook", "conspiracy theorist", "fruitcake", "moonbat", "crackpot", "head case", "whack job", lunatic, etc., .... Generally they seem to want to degrade other posters for believing "wrongly" or are Paid to do so (wrong being any deviation from their dogma or what their "marching orders"/Talking Points dictates). 3. They are anti-conspiratorial - except when the government says so. They deny the existence of any possible conspiracy despite centuries of history that show that in the real world conspiracies are not only real but are quite common. For example John Gotti can conspire to commit multiple crimes and murders, or Michael Millken can conspire to commit financial fraud, but it is absolutely positively completely impossible for the government to conspire to anything because they can't keep a secret and everyone would know. That of course despite multiple instances of such e.g., FDR conspiring to withhold the knowledge that a Japanese Battle Fleet was about to attack Pearl Harbor, and then Court Martialing the men from which he withheld the information. No, despite multiple instances that are quite eminently provable it is absolutely positively impossible for something to be different than what the government says and the government doesn't engage in conspiracies. In the event information is produced showing the government has conspired to commit felonious activities contrary to the public interest all information or data showing that is ignored, derided, and any person presenting it is villified as in "2." above because it is absolutely positively impossible for something to be different than what the government says and the government doesn't engage in conspiracies. The liar class really breaks down into more than one category: Paid Operatives: Public Relations Operatives (Agencies actually advertise for these positions and their client can be anyone who is willing to pay), Government Agency Operatives (CENTCOM has publicly stated their intent to catapult the propaganda on blogs and forums), and of course we know the Israel Contingent, both paid and unpaid, is constantly active attacking anyone who points out any of Israel's numerous war crimes and genocidal activites. I would not be surprised if some NGO's have paid posters as well. Useful Idiots: A good example would be the Israel Supporters who are more than willing to catapult the propaganda for free. There is, or used to be, an online manual that you could download as pdf that was created by the Israeli Government for just that purpose. This also includes Political Party Loyalists - "Party Uber Alles" - who think whatever is good for the party is automatically good for the country. So, any issue they see as disadvantageous for the party is attacked with the ferocity of a rabid dog. This would include the "Bushbots" and "O'bots" who are both equally stupid and reprehensible. They are equally energetic in pushing whatever the current "Party Lyin'" is e.g., Saddam has "scary scary Weapons of Mass Destruction", and then when they are not found it's because Saddam dedicated all of his transport system to ship them out of the country in the last 3 days before the U.S. attack - while never really being able to explain why he would take such a stupid action. The flip side would be the O'bots who are absolutely certain that the health care bill they've never read is going to be the answer to the question no one but they have been asking. Again both the Bushbots and O'bots will lie with gay abandon because for them the ends justifies the means. The "Skeptics" (which are mostly not skeptics but advocates for a particular viewpoint)" Such would include the Atheists, Darwinists, the followers of the "Less than Amazing Randi", "Skeptical Enquirer", etc., .... All of whom are highly intolerant of any viewpoint other than their own, will attack with great ferocity any piece of data, no matter how valid, which throws their unscientific views into question and are perfectly willing to spend hours and days telling you how stupid you are for not immediately apologizing for existing and accepting their dogma. The single issue poster who has one and only one main "hobby horse" and is willing to extol it at great length whether it be their racist point of view, atheism, Israel Worship, etc., .... These actually fall into one of the general categories above as well. I could break it down into finer distinctions but that gives more than enough for a general idea.
for the likes of the liar movement they are in fact mandatory least the discussion stray too far from the official fairy tale. as it is now only the totally moronic village idiots believe the conspiracy theory put forth by baalzabush and company and their numbers are dwindling daily which is a good thing. of all the posters here there are but a handful of the goofenheimers making up the membership of the liar movement.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
#31. To: Original_Intent (#30) (Edited)
They all tend to conform to a set of behaviors that are common among them (of course some of them are fanatical upon more than one topic but they tend to follow the same pattern regardless of the topic). +5 Nice breakdown of the kinds of trolls, sayanim and assorted cyberspace ass-wipers among us. How predictably conforming are the pretenders to the "skeptical" mindset! Carry on...
Nicely put and agreed. One could easily extend this to other topics upon which you will have the rabid skeptics who believe it is a criminal act for anyone to believe anything with which they disagree - the swallowers of "The Less Than Amazing Randi" and the Septical Enquirer crowd are some of the more virulent, as well as the fanatical atheists who think it is a sin to have spiritual beliefs.
Anger? as a first reaction to get your a$$ moving, once you see through the Media Matrix and set yourself free from your lifelong mind control collar. Sustainable? not enough to screen your intention to be free from the Talosians, who can’t read primitive emotions but know what you watch on cable/sat, read on the Internet and eat. Our ultimate weapon is laughter and amused detachment at the folly of the would-be emperors. Fear mongers HATE it when the FEAR card doesn’t work. The humiliation of being seen as merely a naked ape is THEIR big fear. Laugh the bastards off the stage! Tell your friends that we can build a real civilization from the ruins of the totalitarian game!
#32. To: Original_Intent (#30)
2. They speak derogatorily to other posters who hold a contrary view usually using terms like "kook", "conspiracy theorist", "fruitcake", "moonbat", "crackpot", "head case", "whack job", lunatic, etc., .... Generally they seem to want to degrade other posters for believing "wrongly" or are Paid to do so (wrong being any deviation from their dogma or what their "marching orders"/Talking Points dictates). ==================================================== Sums up FreeRepublic.com and LibertyPost.org to a T.
1. They lie. Often such posters will misrepresent information, say something does not exist when they know it does, deny the existence of a conclusion that logically follows from the data, inflate the relative importance of a less than major point and then use the disproof of their strawman as implying that all other data on the subject has therefore been disproved. They will also state their personal opinion acting as though it is proven solid fact when in reality it is just their opinion.
U.S. Constitution - Article IV, Section 4: NO BORDERS + NO LAWS = NO COUNTRY
#33. To: Eric Stratton, Original_Intent, farmfriend, christine, abraxas (#1)
================================================ I just got a notice my property taxes went up 7%, yet the actual value of my property DEVALUED 20%. Is THIS happening all across the country? WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE? U.S. NATIONAL DEBT CLOCK - MIND BOGGLING - SEE THE NATIONAL DEBT CLOCK IN ACTION
I'll add too that we should all pay more taxes since the FedGov is doing all that it can to truly help things towards the positive, and that everyone that owns or works for the Fed is 100% honest.
U.S. Constitution - Article IV, Section 4: NO BORDERS + NO LAWS = NO COUNTRY
#34. To: HAPPY2BME-4UM, Eric Stratton, Original_Intent, christine, abraxas (#33)
Not in California. We have this thing they keep trying to get rid of called Prop 13. The most significant portion of the act is the first paragraph, which capped the tax rate for real estate: The proposition lowered property taxes by rolling back property values to their 1975 value and restricted annual increases in assessed value of real property to an inflation factor, not to exceed 2% per year. It also prohibited reassessment of a new base year value except upon (a) change in ownership or (b) completion of new construction. In addition to lowering property taxes, the initiative also contained language requiring a two-thirds majority in both legislative houses for future increases in all state tax rates or amounts of revenue collected, including income tax rates. It also requires a two-thirds vote majority in local elections for local governments wishing to raise special taxes. Proposition 13 received an enormous amount of publicity, not only in California, but throughout the United States.[2] Passage of the initiative presaged a "taxpayer revolt" throughout the country that is sometimes thought to have contributed to the election of Ronald Reagan to the presidency in 1980. However, of 30 anti-tax ballot measures that year, only 13 passed.[3] A large contributor to Proposition 13 was the sentiment that older Californians should not be priced out of their homes through high taxes.[4] The proposition has been called the "third rail" (meaning "untouchable subject") of California politics and it is not politically popular for Sacramento lawmakers to attempt to change it.[4] Howard Jarvis and Paul Gann were the most vocal and visible backers of Proposition 13. Officially titled the "People's Initiative to Limit Property Taxation," and popularly known as the "Jarvis-Gann Amendment," Proposition 13 was placed on the ballot through the California ballot initiative process, a provision of the California constitution which allows a proposed law or constitutional amendment to be placed before the voters if backers collect a sufficient number of signatures on a petition. Proposition 13 passed with almost 65% of those who voted in favor and with the participation of nearly 70% of registered voters. After passage, it became article 13A of the California state constitution. Under Proposition 13, the annual real estate tax on a parcel of property is limited to 1% of its assessed value. This "assessed value," may be increased only by a maximum of 2% per year, until and unless the property undergoes a change in ownership. At the time of the change in ownership the low assessed value may be reassessed to full current market value which will produce a new base year value for the property, but future assessments are likewise restricted to the 2% annual maximum increase of the new base year value. If the property's market value increases rapidly (values of many detached dwellings in California appreciated at annual rates averaging more than 10% in the decade ending in 2005) [6] or if inflation exceeds 2%, [7][8] the differential between the owner's taxes and the taxes a new owner would have to pay can become quite large. The property may be reassessed under certain conditions other than a change in ownership, such as when additions or new construction occur. The assessed value is also subject to reduction if the market value of the property declines below its assessed value, for example, during a real estate slump. Reductions in property valuation were not provided for in Proposition 13 itself, but were made possible by the passage of Proposition 8 (SCA No. 67) in 1978 which amended Proposition 13. Such a real estate slump and downward reassessments occurred in 2009 when the State Board of Equalization announced an estimated broad scale reduction in property tax base year values due to negative inflation. [9] [10] Property tax in California is an Ad valorem tax meaning that the tax assessed (generally) rises and falls with the value of the property.Is THIS happening all across the country?
Proposition 13 (officially titled the People's Initiative to Limit Property Taxation) was an amendment of the Constitution of California enacted in 1978, by means of the initiative process. It was approved by California voters on June 6, 1978. It was upheld as constitutional by the United States Supreme Court in the case of Nordlinger v. Hahn, 505 U.S. 1 (1992). Proposition 13 is embodied in Article 13A of the Constitution of the State of California[1].
Section 1. (a) The maximum amount of any ad valorem tax on real property shall not exceed one percent (1%) of the full cash value of such property. The one percent (1%) tax to be collected by the counties and apportioned according to law to the districts within the counties.
Name calling is juvenile.
#35. To: HAPPY2BME-4UM (#33)
yes!
Is THIS happening all across the country?
#36. To: Kamala (#9)
and then there's this:
#37. To: Original_Intent (#17)
no, but Alex Jones ones are. ;P
#38. To: IRTorqued (#19)
i agree completely.
for the likes of the liar movement they are in fact mandatory least the discussion stray too far from the official fairy tale. as it is now only the totally moronic village idiots believe the conspiracy theory put forth by baalzabush and company
#39. To: christine (#37)
LOL! 
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
#40. To: HighLairEon (#31)
Thanks. I think the S(k)eptics are the ones I personally find most annoying. With pretensions to following "holy science" they treat science as an "absolute" and dogma when the Scientific Method is a tool for discovering new knowledge. Not only that their mother dresses them funny.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
#41. To: christine (#37)
Anymore I just mentioned to anyone that brings up 911, that over 50% of the 911 families want/support a new independent investigation and don't support the Feds conspiracy theory.
Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
#42. To: Kamala (#41)
Mark Anyone that accepts the minimal investigation conducted by insiders with an agenda regarding the 3000 murders (and resultant military deaths) that the govt says were committed by A-RABS that made three skyscrapers disintegrate IS TOO FUCKING STUPID TO TALK TO
Anymore I just mentioned to anyone that brings up 911, that over 50% of the 911 families want/support a new independent investigation and don't support the Feds conspiracy theory.
Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces
#43. To: Critter (#22)
The real vague statement by NIST with absolutely zero evidence is the entire removal of 80,000 square feet of SFRM in each tower.
Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
#44. To: HAPPY2BME-4UM (#33)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
#45. To: christine (#36)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
#46. To: noone222 (#42)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
#47. To: Kamala (#43)
You need to use BeALoser math for that. Since the ten thousand gallons of jet fuel had the same amount of energy as 20 tons of TNT, and the plane weighed enough to fill 2,000,000 shot gun shells it was like 10,000 mexican drug lords running around blasting off the SFRM with 200 shells each. Silly you.
the entire removal of 80,000 square feet of SFRM in each tower.
Waiting too late to oppose tyranny has always led to bloodshed.
Hair Extensions Five Towns Merrick Manhasset Roslyn Massapequa Amityville Wantagh Farmingdale East Meadow Long Island, NY
#48. To: Eric Stratton (#45)
I'm trying to figure out why the FedGov would declassify that. Mistake? It's not the kind of thing you'd want out there if you were them "Oops! This link appears to be broken." Could you repost it, please? TIA
BTW, on that first link, upon clicking on it, it takes you to a page with a "declassified" document, ... are you sure that's real?
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#49. To: Kamala (#43) (Edited)
The buildings were under inspections periodically. Fireproofing would be removed to do the inspections. That doesn't mean it wasn't ever reapplied afterwards. What the NIST report inadvertently verifies is that holes were drilled into the steel in some places for such inspections from time to time. Explosives could have been inserted then unsuspiciously as routine building inspections and the insert points covered over by various methods: putty, new metal weldings, fireproofing, etc. Edit to add Ref. pg 173 of 275 here: http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/NISTNCSTAR1-1.pdf Visual inspection was to be supplemented by the use of simple hand tools, measurements, and recording techniques, as required. Loose, cracked, or rust- stained spray-on fireproofing and concrete or masonry encasement covering structural steel members and connections was to be removed prior to examining the steel. After inspection, any removed fireproofing had to be properly replaced. Also, where it was necessary to drill a hole through a structural steel element to provide access for a borescope or any other device for inspection, the access hole was to be sealed with weld metal, body putty, or caulking, as appropriate. Periodic inspection of WTC 1 and WTC 2 was to be carried out on the following components at various time intervals: [end excerpt]
The real vague statement by NIST with absolutely zero evidence is the entire removal of 80,000 square feet of SFRM in each tower.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#50. To: All (#49) (Edited)
Pgs. 173 & 174 Cont.: http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/NISTNCSTAR1-1.pdf Periodic inspection of WTC 1 and WTC 2 was to be carried out on the following components at various time intervals: 1. TV antenna mast on the top of WTC 1. This program consisted of four parts: (a) inspection of the structural steel elements in the antenna, (b) inspection of the high tensile bolts and studs, (c) inspection of the weatherproof enclosure, and (4) inspection of the radomes. Inspection of these components was to be performed on a “continuing basis,” as weather and operational restrictions permitted. A complete inspection of the mast structure within the weatherproof enclosure was to be performed at least once a year; the other components were to be inspected at least once every 3 years. 2. Exterior roof and wall elements. Every year, the exterior roof and wall elements were to be inspected for signs of water intrusion. Roof leakage was to be ascertained from an examination of the spaces immediately below the roof areas. Wall leakage was to be determined from signs of water staining on interior finishes. 3. Room occupancies. An inspection of room occupancies and uses throughout both towers was to be performed on an annual basis to verify that design live load was not exceeded. 4. Accessible column envelopes, including fireproofing. Every 2nd year, accessible columns were to be inspected for bowing or deviation from plumb. Also, fireproofing was to be examined for signs of rust or cracking. Inspection for lateral displacement or rotation of columns in elevator shafts, where the columns were braced on only one axis by connecting beams or concrete slabs, was required. 5. Fireproofing and masonry partitions on diagonal bracing and transfer trusses. Fireproofing and masonry partitions enclosing the diagonal bracing on exterior column lines Chapter 8 Draft for Public Comment 114 NIST NCSTAR 1-1, WTC Investigation in both towers below the Service Level Floor and the transfer trusses below floor 1 in WTC 2 under exterior and core columns were to be inspected every 2nd year for cracking, stains, and other possible signs of structural distress. 6. Hat truss members. Every 2nd year, the hat truss members between floor 107 and the roof in the core area were to be inspected. 7. Exterior box columns and spandrel plates. Exterior box columns and spandrel plates under column trees below floor 7 were to be inspected every 4th year. Exterior aluminum covers and spray-on fireproofing were to be removed to gain access to the exterior surfaces of the box columns and spandrel plates. Both the columns and plates were to be visually inspected for bowing or distortion, cracking, and corrosion. Visual inspection was also required for accessible welds. Ultrasonic testing of full or partial penetration welds and adjacent base metal was to be performed where base metal thickness exceeded 1.5 in. The interior of the box columns was to be examined by a borescope for the presence of water and the existence of rust on the interior plate surface. This was to be accomplished by drilling an access hole in the column or the spandrel plate. The “tree” junction where the three superstructure columns merged was also to be inspected. The top surface of the horizontal diaphragm plate that capped the tapered box column just below the point where the three separate columns merged was to be examined, as was the exterior column plate between this location and the column splice at elevation +372 ft 4 in. 8. Steel floor framing over mechanical spaces. Every 4th year, the steel floor framing over mechanical spaces and other areas without suspended ceilings was to be inspected. 9. Concrete slabs, partitions, and finishes. Concrete slabs, partitions, and finishes were to be inspected every 4th year for signs of distress, which could indicate excessive structural deformation. Occasional inspections were also to be made of the structural steel framing, connections, and concrete slabs when general repairs or remodeling was done that involved removing ceilings, partitions, finishes, or other coverings. In particular, the top of the concrete slab was to be examined for cracking, spalling, and exposed or corroded top reinforcement. Where reinforcing bars were corroded and where concrete had spalled, repairs were to be made as tenant relocation permitted. ____________ Could be there's a grain of Truth in this silliness somewhere: Preplanted Explosives in WTC Twin Towers? - Get Smart 2
Periodic inspection of WTC 1 and WTC 2 was to be carried out on the following components at various time intervals:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKrUZERj1cQ Hallowed Bricks
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#51. To: GreyLmist (#48)
deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
#52. To: Eric Stratton (#51)
It worked. Northwoods -- ok, got it. Here's a similar example of Japanese government false-flagging in Manchuria, which predates and solidly corroborates the concepts of that blueprint, and which led to the occupation of China, as well as the Nanking/Nanjing Massacre: 10 false flags operations that shaped our world h ttp://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Terrorism/10_False_Flag_Operations.html 3. The Manchurian Incident The economic slump following 1929's thorough and convincing near-obliteration of Wall Street hit Japan especially hard: exports fell, unemployment rose. Japan, not being rich in natural resources, needed oil and coal to make power to run machines to produce goods to sell to other countries to make money to buy food to have enough energy. Manchuria, a province of China, had its fair share of oil and coal._After Japan decided it needed to invade Manchuria, they needed a pretext to justify the invasion. They chose to create a false flag attack on a railway close to Liutiao Lake... a big flat area that had no military value to either the Japanese or the Chinese. The main reason the spot was chosen was for its proximity (about 800 meters distant) to Chinese troops stationed at Beidaying. The Japanese press labelled the no-name site of the blast Liutiaogou, which was Japanese for "Liutiao Bridge." There was no bridge there, but the name helped convince some that the sabotage was a strategic Chinese attack._Colonel Itagaki Seishiro and Lieutenant Colonel Kanji Ishiwara ordered officers of the Shimamoto Regiment to place a bomb beneath the tracks. The original bomb failed to detonate and a replacement had to be found. Then, at 10.20pm, September 18, 1931, the tracks were blown. Surprisingly, the explosion was minor. Only one side of the rail was damaged, and the damage was so light that a train headed for Shenyang passed by only a few minutes later. But it was a good enough excuse to invade... The Japanese immediately charged the Chinese soldiers with the destruction, then invaded Manchuria. A puppet government known as Manchukuo was installed. The League of Nations investigated and in a 1932 report denied that the invasion was an act of defence, as Japan had advertised. But rather than vacate Manchuria, Japan decided to vacate the League of Nations, the precursor to the United Nations.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
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