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Title: Flight 77 Cockpit Door Never Opened During 9/11 “Hijack”
Source:
Rock Creek Free Press
URL Source: http://rockcreekfreepress.tumblr.com/post/285492999/flt77fdr
Published: Dec 15, 2009
Author: Sheila Casey
Post Date: 2010-07-14 02:07:35 by FormerLurker
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Keywords: Flight 77, 9/11, Black Box
Views: 29110
Comments: 913
Flight 77 Cockpit Door Never Opened During 9/11 “Hijack"
By Sheila Casey / Rock Creek Free Press
Pilots for 9/11 Truth has reported that the data stream from the flight data recorder (FDR) for American Airlines flight 77, which allegedly struck the Pentagon on 9/11, shows that the cockpit door never opened during the entire 90 minute flight. The data was provided by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), which has refused to comment.
The FDR is one of two “black boxes” in every commercial airliner, which are used after accidents to help determine the cause of a crash. One black box records flight data, the other records voice data (everything said in the cockpit during the flight). With those two sets of data, NTSB investigators can usually piece together the events that led to a crash. The status of the door to the cockpit is checked every four seconds throughout a flight and relayed as a simple 0 or 1, where 0=closed and 1=open, with approximately 1,300 door status checks performed during AA77’s 90 minute flight. Every one of those door status checks shows as a 0, indicating that the door to the cockpit never opened during the entire flight.
Accident investigators monitor the cockpit door with the FDR because it may yield clues to pilot error in a crash. The FDR begins recording once the pilots are in their seats and readying for takeoff, and the plane cannot take off unless the FDR is working.
The official story about flight 77 is that five Muslim terrorists brandishing box cutters forced their way into the cockpit and herded two pilots, four flight attendants and all the passengers to the back of the plane. This story came into being via Ted Olson, US Solicitor General, who told CNN — that he received two phone calls from his wife Barbara Olson, a passenger on the doomed flight. Ted Olson’s story changed several times. Sometimes he claimed that the calls from his wife were made from seat back phones, other times that she used her cell phone.
According to American Airlines customer service, the American Airlines maintenance manual for that aircraft, and American Airlines Captain Ralph Kolstad, seatback phones on 757s had been deactivated prior to 9/11/01. (They were later removed entirely, as they never worked well.)
Barbara Olson couldn’t have used a cell phone either: numerous 9/11 researchers, most notably David Ray Griffin, have pointed out that cell phones did not work on airplanes on 9/11. The speed and altitude of a commercial airliner both present overwhelming obstacles to a cell phone’s need to lock onto a cell tower and then hand off to another tower in a new location.
It was the FBI that revealed the evidence that decisively disproves Ted Olson’s story. In the Zacarias Moussaoui trial in 2006, the FBI presented a report on the cell phone calls from all four 9/11 flights. Their report on AA77 shows that there was only one phone call from Barbara Olson, but that it was an unconnected call lasting zero seconds. So Ted Olson either lied about receiving calls from his wife or was deceived into believing he received calls from her.
According to the UK Telegraph, Barbara Olson delayed her flight on 9/11 so that she could have breakfast with her husband on his birthday. That delay put her on the doomed flight. Ted Olson remarried in 2006 to tax attorney Lady Booth, whom he reportedly met the year after Barbara died.
There are numerous oddities and contradictions about AA77’s black boxes.
The government claims that the voice data recorder was damaged during the crash and that no usable data was retrieved from it. If true, this would be the first time in aviation history that a solid-state data recorder was destroyed during a crash.
While it was widely reported in the media that the FDR for AA77 was found at 4 am on September 14, 2001, the file containing the FDR data was dated over four hours earlier. In other words, we are asked to believe that the data from the FDR was downloaded prior to the FDR being found.
Researcher Aidan Monagahan has established that the NTSB does not have either serial or part numbers for the FDRs from AA77. The NTSB’s own handbook indicates that the part number and serial number of the FDR are required for data readout of the FDR. The NTSB did not have this information, giving us another reason to question how the FDR data was created.
Structural engineer Allyn Kilsheimer claimed that he personally found AA77’s black box on 9/11. But in the Popular Mechanics book Debunking 9/11 Myths, Kilsheimer is quoted as saying, “I stood on a pile of debris that we later found contained the black box 70;”
Kilsheimer’s story changes again in August 2007 in a piece done by the History Channel, “The 9/11 Conspiracies,” where he claims “I tripped over something; it was the black box.”
In earlier work, Pilots for 9/11 Truth (P4T) has determined that the same data set provided by the NTSB shows the plane too high to hit the Pentagon, based on an altimeter that uses air pressure to calibrate altitude.
As reported in the April 2009 Rock Creek Free Press, Citizen Investigation Team, citizen journalists from southern California, has collected evidence from 14 eyewitnesses that shows that the plane seen that morning near the Pentagon did not hit the building, but flew over it at the moment explosives detonated in the Pentagon, leading observers to conclude that the plane had crashed into the Pentagon.
Questions about what happened at the Pentagon have intrigued 9/11 researchers for years, beginning with photos from the alleged crash scene which do not show the wreckage of a plane.
This new evidence, showing that the cockpit door never opened during flight, is another nail in the coffin of the official story about flight 77. Clearly, if the cockpit door never opened, then hijackers did not storm the cockpit and herd the pilots to the back of the plane. The data, which originated from the government, does not support the government’s story.
Why would the government release data which contradicts its own version of events? It is possible they were just sloppy, or that they never anticipated that anyone would parse the data as carefully as Pilots for 9/11 Truth have. They may have also felt secure, that regardless of what damning revelations were contained in the FDR data, no mainstream media outlet would give them ink or air time, keeping the official story intact for the vast majority of Americans who receive their news from mainstream sources.
Rob Balsamo, founder of Pilots for 9/11 Truth, stated: “We have not located any independently verified data which confirms the government’s story. The FBI and NTSB refuse to comment.” Founded in August 2006, Pilots For 9/11 Truth is an organization of aviation professionals from around the globe who are investigating the government’s claims about the attacks of 9/11.
Sheila Casey is a DC based journalist. Her work has appeared in The Denver Post, Reuters, Chicago Sun-Times, Dissident Voice and Common Dreams.
Poster Comment:
Here's a link to the Pilots for 9/11 Truth articles on the matter. 9/11: PENTAGON AIRCRAFT HIJACK IMPOSSIBLE
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#121. To: noone222 (#6)
(Edited)
But they had box cutters. They were all so scared of those box cutters that they forgot that they had more powerful weapons. I highly doubt there was any plane hijacked that day. And I am fairly certain no plane whatsoever struck the Pentagon.
God is always good!
What are they, then, bamboo?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Are you going to fill up this thread with SPAM from your fellow loons who decided they'd plaster their idiotic bullshit on YouTube? The discussion here was about the state of the "FLT DECK DOOR" data field on Flight 77's flight data recorder, not a parade of every KOOK version of the government conspiracy theory that not even the GOVERNMENT has tried to foist on the American People. If you have points to make or facts to talk about, do it, but stop SPAMMING this thread.
The external panels were NOT the exterior support columns. THESE are what the support columns looked like. What your pal shows are the external PANELS placed ON the columns for aesthetic purposes. 6% huh? you better hope so.
God is always good!
SOME sort of aircraft struck the Pentagon, but I highly doubt it was Flight 77.
It's not certain that those parts are from a 757. Where's the wreckage stored, and where's the forensic analysis?
huh? anyone here capable of translating this to English?
God is always good!
As it is, it's close to physically impossible for a 757 to fly less than 60 feet off the ground at 400+ mph, yet for the official story to be true, we are to believe Flight 77 somehow flew level at 20 feet off the ground at 530+ mph, with a "pilot" at the wheel who couldn't even fly a small single engine Cessna. You'd think people would see that as a HUGE red flag in terms of the "official story" being even remotely possible, yet it's apparent that you don't have the slightest amount of concern over it. It's obvious you aren't here to discuss anything, your mission here is to disrupt and to discredit.
I don't think so. The anti-aircraft weapons all around it would have been activated, no plane could have struck it. Also, there is no evidence any plane struck it. A bomb is a much more likely, with scattered plane parts thrown around in the mix to make it at least plausible that a plane could have struck it. Of course a bomb going off at the Pentagon means it definitely was an inside job, so that will never be revealed officially.
God is always good!
(1) Just how many conspiracies are you Six Percenters going to claim are being managed with zero defections? Just a wee bit more complicated than mindlessly repeating "911 was an inside job, 911 was an inside job, 911 is an inside job" over and over.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- They'd only fire those off if they really wanted to stop the attack from happening, which they apparently didn't.
Wrong. The discussion was whether Flight 77 was hijacked and crashed into the Pentagon. It was. All your subsequent off topic remarks about "prove the cabin doors were opened" after the NTSB explicitly says it has no such information, and "there were no cell phone calls made from the airplanes" are simply attempts to get rid of any evidence that undercuts your religious belief.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Are you the same person who was here earlier today posting under the AGAviator account? At least THAT person wasn't a TOTAL and COMPLETE idiot, unlike you. I posted this thread, the article is about the flight data recorder data from Flight 77 you goddamn moron. Read the article you fool. FLIGHT 77 is the aircraft that is alleged to have hit the Pentagon, Flight 11 is the flight that is alleged to have hit the North World Trade Center tower. Are you drunk, or are you some kid using his daddy's computer?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looks like this fool doesn't even know what plane was supposed to hit what target. READ THE HEADING OF THIS THREAD.
For the fourth time. Where's even 10 frames showing people planting evidence into the Pentagon, including both landing gear parts and fuselage shreds? Where's any evidence for any other CT, other than cherry picking and selectively quoting sources that are not your own? You said you can make a better video yourself than the ones I've linked to. So do it, put up or shut up.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The more you spam this thread, the more you prove yourself to be here to disrupt this forum. I've seen incompetent disinfo agents in my day, but you take the prize as THE most incompetent imbecille I've ran into. Doesn't that make you feel special?
Seriously, still trying to debunk the controlled demolition of the towers? That is akin to debunking the laws of physics, good luck with that.
God is always good!
Are you talking to yourself here?
For all I know, the images you posted of the guys with suits running around holding foil like objects WERE planting evidence. That or some of it was sprinkled by the C-130 seen by more than just a handful of witnessess that day soon after the attack. Again, where are the images of the wreckage being collected into trucks? Where is the wreckage being stored? Where is the forensic analysis of that wreckage? Where are the video tapes confiscated by the FBI?
Oh, and HOW could you FORGET that it was FLIGHT 77 which is alleged to have struck the Pentagon, not FLIGHT 11?
Ah, I see that you edited and fixed your error. Too bad you won't admit it though, eh?
Your failure to rebut any of the information I post, other than deny, deny, deny, along with your choosing unending personal thrusts in your minimal content responses, shows your inability to deal with reality and your insane religious like belief. Of "The Mother of All Conspiracies," something you can't define and whose detailed workings you can't explain. You've had 8 years to make your cases. You remain a fringe group not quoted by anybody of any importance, zero elected officals, zero court cases getting past initial requests by defendants for dismissal. More people believe in Elvis sightings and UFO abductions than believe in "The 911 attacks were an inside job." Deal with it.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You've posted NOTHING of substance, you've simply spammed this thread with NO idea of what was in half the videos you posted, and simply repeat the same crap like a broken record. I've given you facts and links, and have raised questions which you can not and/or will not answer. You sink to gutter league tactics when all else fails, bringing up Elvis and UFOS, seeing how much shit you can toss that you hope will stick. That you CAN'T realistically refute the premise of this article is obvious, and you need to pull out every trick in the book in order to tell your bosses that you did your work. It's apparent that you work for somebody. That somebody is obviously an enemy of the United States, and is complicit in the 9/11 attacks.
I can change it to something else, to give you something more to rant, fulminate, and make off topic remarks for hours on end upon based on denial, nit picking and other trivialities. My focus is on talking about all the 4 911 flights being hijacked and crashed by OBL trainees, not materialized from the ether by shapeshifting reptiles or BushOps cybroids. And talking about the many rebuttals available to counter claims that all anti- twoofer evidence is fabricated in unknown ways, by the same people who are losing control of the very conflict they're alleged to have wanted from all their conspiratorial activities.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So?
Now that's the TWOOF ! It's apparent that you work for somebody. That somebody is obviously an enemy of the United States, and is complicit in the 9/11 attacks. Wanna guess this parasites ethnicity ???
Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces
I've repeatedly demonstrated the USG says it has no information about cabin doors, and over 35 total onboard phone and cell phone calls have been logged from the 4 hijacked 911 airplanes on that date, discussing hijackers, seat numbers, and aircraft crew and passenger status. The fact you keep yelling and screaming about your non-existent "proof" the doors weren't opened, when the US GOV says it has no information about door activity, and the messages of calls indicate they were, demonstrates a fixation bordering on neuroticity.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- They'll say anything other than admit the doors weren't opened.
(AGAviator) I've repeatedly demonstrated the USG says it has no information about cabin doors, and over 35 total onboard phone and cell phone calls have been logged from the 4 hijacked 911 airplanes on that date, discussing hijackers, seat numbers, and aircraft crew and passenger status. The fact you keep yelling and screaming about your non-existent "proof" the doors weren't opened, when the US GOV says it has no information about door activity, and the messages of calls indicate they were, demonstrates a fixation bordering on neuroticity. They'll say anything other than admit the doors weren't opened.
Alleged calls. I haven't seen any comment from you on why there's no engine- noise in the background of those supposed phone calls from planes. Would you care to comment on the strange stuff in this video recently released from the Pentagon that was aired on the "MSM" news:
------- "They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
Here's another new-release from the Pentagon:
------- "They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
I may have to take a trip to DC and do some measuring one of these days. There is a way to calculate the approximate size of the alleged "plane" based on the distance from the camera and the focal length of the lens used on it, which appears to be about 4mm to me.
All of that being said, isn't it a bit ridiculous for a commercial jet that was known to be hijacked for an hour and a half to be left alone to hit the Pentagon ?
#122. To: FormerLurker (#119)
an even bigger liar than you are. He is claiming that the outside panels on the WTC towers were actually steel columns, and that they are proof that the "steel columns were buckling from the heat of the fire".
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#123. To: AGAviator (#118)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#124. To: AGAviator (#122)
(Edited)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#125. To: AGAviator (#108)
#126. To: RickyJ (#121)
I highly doubt there was any plane hijacked that day. And I am fairly certain no plane whatsoever struck the Pentagon.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#127. To: AGAviator (#120)
Then explain why you ignore the jet engine parts, and scorched 757 strut and landing gear parts, in the same video.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#128. To: AGAviator (#108)
even though the war the conspiracies are supposed to be done for, is lurching towards stagnation, failure, and possibly even world wide defeat.
#129. To: AGAviator (#106)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#130. To: FormerLurker (#126)
SOME sort of aircraft struck the Pentagon, but I highly doubt it was Flight 77.
#131. To: RickyJ (#128)
(2) Even though the war the conspiracies are supposed to be done for?
(3) Is lurching towards stagnation, failure, and possibly even world wide defeat.
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#132. To: RickyJ (#130)
The anti-aircraft weapons all around it would have been activated, no plane could have struck it
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#133. To: AGAviator (#131)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#134. To: FormerLurker (#123)
(Edited)
The discussion here was about the state of the "FLT DECK DOOR" data field on Flight 77's flight data recorder, not a parade
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#135. To: AGAviator, RickyJ, Original_Intent, Artisan, Eric Stratton, christine (#134)
The discussion was whether Flight 11 was hijacked and crashed into the Pentagon. It was.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#136. To: FormerLurker (#133)
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#137. To: AGAviator, ALL (#134)
The discussion was whether Flight 11 was hijacked and crashed into the Pentagon. It was.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#138. To: FormerLurker (#135)
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#139. To: AGAviator (#136)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#140. To: AGAviator (#136)
#141. To: AGAviator (#138)
Where's any evidence for any other CT, other than cherry picking and selectively quoting sources that are not your own?
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#142. To: AGAviator (#138)
Where's even 10 frames showing people planting evidence into the Pentagon, including both landing gear parts and fuselage shreds?
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#143. To: AGAviator (#138)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#144. To: AGAviator (#134)
The discussion was whether Flight 77 was hijacked and crashed into the Pentagon. It was.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#145. To: FormerLurker (#139)
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#146. To: AGAviator (#145)
Your failure to rebut any of the information I post
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#147. To: FormerLurker (#144)
Ah, I see that you edited and fixed your error.
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#148. To: AGAviator, FOrmerLurker (#145)
You've had 8 years to make your cases. You remain a fringe group not quoted by anybody of any importance, zero elected officals, zero court cases getting past initial requests by defendants for dismissal.
“It has been said, 'time heals all wounds.' I do not agree. The wounds remain. In time, the mind, protecting its sanity, covers them with scar tissue and the pain lessens, but it is never gone.” ~ Rose F. Kennedy
#149. To: FormerLurker, AGRAviator (#146)
You sink to gutter league tactics when all else fails, bringing up Elvis and UFOS, seeing how much shit you can toss that you hope will stick.
#150. To: FormerLurker (#146)
That you CAN'T realistically refute the premise of this article is obvious
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#151. To: HOUNDDAWG, FormerLurker, Original_Intent, abraxas, HAPPY2BME-4UM, Twenty Twelve, Horse, Lod, christine (#97)
Hey, according to the official fairie tale high rise construction is based on many false engineering principles, even though no major changes have been adopted since 9/11. So, they may claim that FDRs sometimes glitch even though no changes will be made to them, either.
“It has been said, 'time heals all wounds.' I do not agree. The wounds remain. In time, the mind, protecting its sanity, covers them with scar tissue and the pain lessens, but it is never gone.” ~ Rose F. Kennedy
#152. To: HOUNDDAWG, FormerLurker, Original_Intent, abraxas, HAPPY2BME-4UM, Twenty Twelve, Horse, Lod, christine, AGAviator (#150)
(FormerLurker) That you CAN'T realistically refute the premise of this article is obvious
“It has been said, 'time heals all wounds.' I do not agree. The wounds remain. In time, the mind, protecting its sanity, covers them with scar tissue and the pain lessens, but it is never gone.” ~ Rose F. Kennedy
#153. To: AGAviator (#150)
(Edited)
over 35 total onboard phone and cell phone calls have been logged from the 4 hijacked 911 airplanes on that date, discussing hijackers, seat numbers, and aircraft crew and passenger status.
#154. To: AGAviator (#150)
#155. To: GreyLmist (#153)
Waiting too late to oppose tyranny has always led to bloodshed.
Hair Extensions Five Towns Merrick Manhasset Roslyn Massapequa Amityville Wantagh Farmingdale East Meadow Long Island, NY
#156. To: Critter (#155)
I'd be interested in your research. Please flag me to your calculations if you undertake that project.
There is a way to calculate the approximate size of the alleged "plane" based on the distance from the camera and the focal length of the lens used on it, which appears to be about 4mm to me.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#157. To: GreyLmist (#154)
A little cutting, scaling and pasting: 
Tail section visible in this frame. 
We should see a whole bunch more plane visible behind gate control.
Waiting too late to oppose tyranny has always led to bloodshed.
Hair Extensions Five Towns Merrick Manhasset Roslyn Massapequa Amityville Wantagh Farmingdale East Meadow Long Island, NY
#158. To: Critter (#157)
Wow. That was fast. Intriguing.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#159. To: GreyLmist (#158)
Just tinkering. :)
Waiting too late to oppose tyranny has always led to bloodshed.
Hair Extensions Five Towns Merrick Manhasset Roslyn Massapequa Amityville Wantagh Farmingdale East Meadow Long Island, NY
#160. To: GreyLmist (#158)
Tonight or tomorrow morning, I'll shrink my plane a bit more so tail section in video is visible around the tail on mine, and see what it looks like then. I'll also surf up some images of missiles...
Waiting too late to oppose tyranny has always led to bloodshed.
Hair Extensions Five Towns Merrick Manhasset Roslyn Massapequa Amityville Wantagh Farmingdale East Meadow Long Island, NY
#161. To: GreyLmist (#153)
Judicial Watch video #1 shows the plane at 1:27, and then at the next frame #129 the crash has already taken place. Judicial Watch Video #2 shows the plane tail above at 0:26 above the tan pylon with the body being obscured by the pylon but trailing a white smoke spiral below and to the right of the tail and pylon.
Would you care to comment on the strange stuff in this video recently released from the Pentagon that was aired on the "MSM" news:
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One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
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