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9/11
See other 9/11 Articles

Title: 9/11 demolition theory challenged
Source: BBC
URL Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6987965.stm
Published: Sep 11, 2007
Author: staff
Post Date: 2010-07-17 17:31:29 by buckeroo
Ping List: *4um PSY-OP Club*     Subscribe to *4um PSY-OP Club*
Keywords: None
Views: 24136
Comments: 1209

An analysis of the World Trade Center collapse has challenged a conspiracy theory surrounding the 9/11 attacks.

The study by a Cambridge University engineer demonstrates that once the collapse of the twin towers began, it was destined to be rapid and total.

One of many conspiracy theories proposes that the buildings came down in a manner consistent with a "controlled demolition".

The study suggests a different explanation for how the towers fell.

Over 2,800 people were killed in the devastating attacks on New York.

After reviewing television footage of the Trade Center's destruction, engineers had proposed the idea of "progressive collapse" to explain the way the twin towers disintegrated on 11 September 2001.

This mode of structural failure describes the way the building fell straight down rather than toppling, with each successive floor crushing the one beneath (an effect called "pancaking").

Resistance to collapse

Dr Keith Seffen set out to test mathematically whether this chain reaction really could explain what happened in Lower Manhattan six years ago. The findings are to be published in the Journal of Engineering Mechanics.

Previous studies have tended to focus on the initial stages of collapse, showing that there was an initial, localised failure around the aircraft impact zones, and that this probably led to the progressive collapse of both structures.

Man stands amid rubble of the World Trade Center, AFP/Getty Once the collapse began, it was destined to be "rapid and total" In other words, the damaged parts of the tower were bound to fall down, but it was not clear why the undamaged building should have offered little resistance to these falling parts.

"The initiation part has been quantified by many people; but no one had put numbers on the progressive collapse," Dr Seffen told the BBC News website.

Dr Seffen was able to calculate the "residual capacity" of the undamaged building: that is, simply speaking, the ability of the undamaged structure to resist or comply with collapse.

His calculations suggest the residual capacity of the north and south towers was limited, and that once the collapse was set in motion, it would take only nine seconds for the building to go down.

This is just a little longer than a free-falling coin, dropped from the top of either tower, would take to reach the ground.

'Fair assumption'

The University of Cambridge engineer said his results therefore suggested progressive collapse was "a fair assumption in terms of how the building fell".

"One thing that confounded engineers was how falling parts of the structure ploughed through undamaged building beneath and brought the towers down so quickly," said Dr Seffen.

The south tower of the World Trade Center collapses, AP Conspiracy theorists see evidence of a "controlled detonation" He added that his calculations showed this was a "very ordinary thing to happen" and that no other intervention, such as explosive charges laid inside the building, was needed to explain the behaviour of the buildings.

The controlled detonation idea, espoused on several internet websites, asserts that the manner of collapse is consistent with synchronised rows of explosives going off inside the World Trade Center.

This would have generated a demolition wave that explained the speed, uniformity and similarity between the collapses of both towers.

Conspiracy theorists assert that these explosive "squibs" can actually be seen going off in photos and video footage of the collapse. These appear as ejections of gas and debris from the sides of the building, well below the descending rubble.

Other observers say this could be explained by debris falling down lift shafts and impacting on lower floors during the collapse.

Dr Seffen's research could help inform future building design. Subscribe to *4um PSY-OP Club*

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#768. To: buckeroo (#766)

Not true... genius. Only the publick OS's perform that function.

Name me a modern day real-time operating system which does NOT implement the OSI model.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   20:49:23 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#769. To: buckeroo (#713)
(Edited)

Do you have any details about the demolition theory of the WTC beyond mere Internet speculation,innuendo, crap, BS, hear-say, who-dunnit based on a conspiracy website

Somehow ***they*** got TCP/IP and HTTP to ignite between 10 and 100 tons of nanothermite without leaving a trace.

Maybe we've been asking them to provide proof from the wrong places. Instead of wanting the slightest shred of det cord, or detonators, or appropriate amounts of barium nitrate in the debris and residue, perhaps a stack dump of "their" supercomputers will provide the evidence we're all seeking....

MUAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky

AGAviator  posted on  2010-07-21   20:49:46 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#770. To: FormerLurker (#768)

My RT kernal. I deliver some of the fastest response times under the Sun.... it is proprietary.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   20:50:37 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#771. To: AGAviator, FormerLurker (#769)

Somehow ***they*** got TCP/IP and HTTP to ignite between 10 and 100 tons of nanothermite without leaving a trace.

And another spin-o-machine by FL ... right now.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   20:52:50 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#772. To: AGAviator (#769)

10 and 100 tons of nanothermite without leaving a trace.

It wasn't that much, and it did leave plenty of traces.

God is always good!

RickyJ  posted on  2010-07-21   20:53:17 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#773. To: buckeroo (#765)

In common publick computers (ISA, PCI, ePCI, cPCI, VME etc,) determines the LEVEL of the interrupt from a device and the device driver determines its associated scheduling within the OS.

Did they teach you how to spell in college? An occasional mistake is nothing to really hammer you about, but you continuously spell the word "public" as "publick". Are you a US citizen, and is English your first language?

You forgot to list PCIe(PCI Express), which is the modern replacement for PCI.

Anyways, VME based architecture usually isn't a PUBLIC computer, it's usually used in military applications, medical equipment, or space based systems.

And yes, VxWorks is one of the preferred operating systems for that sort of hardware. Did you know that VxWorks ALSO implements the OSI model?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   20:55:40 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#774. To: FormerLurker (#767)

did you know that MS Windows based PC's can handle GIGABITS of data per second over the standard OSI layers as implemented within the operating system?

Sure... but that isn't REAL-TIME, Sherlock....

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   20:55:54 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#775. To: buckeroo (#771)

And another spin-o-machine by FL ... right now.

Uh huh, just keep patting yourself on the back there bucko.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   20:56:16 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#776. To: FormerLurker (#773)

And yes, VxWorks is one of the preferred operating systems for that sort of hardware.

WOW... where are your credentials? What about LynxOS?

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   20:57:02 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#777. To: buckeroo (#774)

Sure... but that isn't REAL-TIME, Sherlock....

REAL-TIME systems are not used for graphics work there bucko, at least not if the graphics work is the primary concern. If you were talking about military applications and what-not, in regards to monitoring critical parameters, but then again those things STILL utilize the OSI model.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   20:58:17 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#778. To: FormerLurker (#775)

Uh huh, just keep patting yourself on the back there bucko.

No ... FL... you have driven this thread into the ground... you report nothing based on fact... you have lied to me several times. And you have admitted the same.

But WAIT... THERE IS SO MUCH MUCH MORE! You have yet to provide any FACT or evidence about demolitions on 9/11. You have failed 4um. You lose, pal.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:00:30 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#779. To: buckeroo (#776)

WOW... where are your credentials? What about LynxOS?

Never worked with LynxOS, have worked with VxWorks.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:01:02 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#780. To: buckeroo (#778)

you have lied to me several times.

Oh yeah? Where? Point it out.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:01:27 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#781. To: FormerLurker (#777)

REAL-TIME systems are not used for graphics work there bucko, at least not if the graphics work is the primary concern.

ROTFL ... where did you dredge this idea up? On the Internet or between your butt cheeks?

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:01:35 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#782. To: FormerLurker (#780)

Eagan as example. I never mentioned the guy until you brought him up.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:02:32 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#783. To: buckeroo (#778)

You have yet to provide any FACT or evidence about demolitions on 9/11.

As I've stated numerous times, I've explained how it's impossible for the towers to have collapsed WITHOUT demolitions of some type.

Try again, clown.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:02:36 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#784. To: buckeroo (#782)

Eagan as example. I never mentioned the guy until you brought him up.

It was Eager buttnuts, and you most certainly did pat your pal's ass each time he brought him up.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:03:31 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#785. To: buckeroo (#782)

Eagan as example. I never mentioned the guy until you brought him up.

Oh and BTW, I did later say that I was mistaken in that you PERSONALLY didn't mention him. Now show me where YOU'VE made any sort of corrections to your comments, or retracted any of your false claims.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:04:45 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#786. To: FormerLurker (#780)

Oh yeah? Where? Point it out.

You lied about the time of the collapses (9.22) which in REALITY were far greater than freefall speed, even your own calculations were inconsiderate of truth about the moment of impact.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:05:33 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#787. To: FormerLurker (#785)

I did later say that I was mistaken in that you PERSONALLY didn't mention him.

I know, you have already submitted that fact... which I shove in your face again.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:06:27 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#788. To: buckeroo (#781)

OTFL ... where did you dredge this idea up? On the Internet or between your butt cheeks?

Provide me a reason why you'd need real-time communications beyond what an OS such as Windows XP would provide, say in terms of a CAD system, or even video conferencing.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:06:44 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#789. To: buckeroo (#786)

You lied about the time of the collapses (9.22) which in REALITY were far greater than freefall speed, even your own calculations were inconsiderate of truth about the moment of impact.

So FIFTEEN SECONDS is FAR GREATER than NINE POINT TWO TWO SECONDS?

Are where do you get this "your calculations were inconsiderate of truth about the moment of impact" crap from?

Link the post, or retract your lie.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:08:42 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#790. To: FormerLurker (#785)

Look, get your facts straight. Come back when you decide to use the spin-o-machine again or better yet, tell us who what when where how and why the demolitions .... I notice your heckling pals are on the sidelines... because you can't even discuss the same shit you post unless it is with a fork-tongue.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:10:43 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#791. To: buckeroo (#786)

You lied about the time of the collapses (9.22)

BTW idiot, 9.22 seconds is the FREE FALL time of the North Tower. I NEVER said it took 9.22 seconds for the tower to collapse.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:11:24 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#792. To: FormerLurker (#789)

So FIFTEEN SECONDS is FAR GREATER than NINE POINT TWO TWO SECONDS?

yes...

Proof that the WTC towers did not collapse at freefall.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:11:45 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#793. To: buckeroo (#790)

Look, get your facts straight.

I've done nothing BUT post straight facts. Now what "facts" have you presented, other than your uneducated claims that the top of a building hits the ground at the same time a lower piece of it would if both started falling at the same time.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:13:24 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#794. To: buckeroo, ALL (#792)

Proof that the WTC towers did not collapse at freefall.

Neither I nor anyone else here claimed that it did. We have said it collapsed at CLOSE to or NEAR free fall speed.

You and your pal have made MANY false claims ACCUSING people here of saying they fell at free fall speed, which further proves the degree of your honesty.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:16:37 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#795. To: FormerLurker (#793)

I never said that, you did.

The moment of collapse occurred at each building from the moment of force at the 81st and 96th floors. This means the collapse is calculated where the terrorists crashed into the buildings not the top as you repeatedly claim.... your argument is bogus... you lifted it off some fucked-upped website, no doubt.

No one in serious educational or academic, technical, government circles look at your 9.22 calculation as anything more than a laff-a-minute similar to your spin-o-shit.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:21:44 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#796. To: FormerLurker (#794)

You and your pal have made MANY false claims ACCUSING people here of saying they fell at free fall speed

Are you out of your freaking gourd? Neither AG nor myself claim the buildings fell at freefall speeds. You have denied the whole point of this thread.

If the WTC buildings fell at freefall time, it would indicate that hanky-panky was at play by someone as controlled demolitions ensure a fast rate of collapse as the flooring underneath is dismissed progressively permitting a minimum of time.

Instead, it is proven on this thread the center of mass collapsed about the floors onto the lower floors from the IMPACT of jet aircraft!

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:31:39 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#797. To: buckeroo, ALL (#795)

I never said that, you did.

The moment of collapse occurred at each building from the moment of force at the 81st and 96th floors. This means the collapse is calculated where the terrorists crashed into the buildings not the top as you repeatedly claim

WOW. You are saying it RIGHT HERE.

You are saying that the top of the tower will hit at a different time, dependent on where the supporting structure below it gives way.

I don't care where this "moment of force" is in terms of what initiated the fall, I am not even TALKING about the WTC collapse in terms of how long it would take to fall. I'm saying that an object dropped from the top of a building will fall at a rate which is easily calculated, and the precise amount of time it would take is ALSO easily calculated in terms of minimum time.

If an object were dropped from the top of the WTC1, it would have taken 9.22 seconds MINIMUM time for it to hit, a bit more due to air resistance.

Now for the TOP of the WTC to hit the ground, it IS a valid comparison to compare the total collapse time in terms of how long it took the TOP of the tower to hit the ground, and the amount of time it would take an object to fall through thin air dropped from the same height.

ANOTHER valid comparison would be to determine the exact amount of time it took for the damaged section itself to impact the ground, and the time it would take for an object to fall from THAT height.

Thing is, most everything turned to dust well before that part of the building got close to the ground, so it's impossible to tell how long it took for THAT part of the building to "hit", since there was nothing left of it by the time it DID reach the ground.

Only estimates of the total time are available, in terms of how long the rumble lasted, or estimates judging from the various videos on the net.

The only valid collapse time would be that which could be determined by analysis of actual raw footage, where the cadence of the video can be determined, and a close estimate of the point of complete collapse from top to bottom can be determined, then by subtracting the end time from the start time in terms of time ticks on the video, establish a total collapse time.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:37:08 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#798. To: buckeroo (#796)

Neither AG nor myself claim the buildings fell at freefall speeds.

No, but the two of you have ACCUSED everyone else here of saying that exact thing, where NOBODY here has done so.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:38:08 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#799. To: buckeroo (#796)

Instead, it is proven on this thread the center of mass collapsed about the floors onto the lower floors from the IMPACT of jet aircraft!

No, it is NOT proven. What is proven is that you are a bold-faced liar.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:38:54 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#800. To: AGAviator (#769)

Instead of wanting the slightest shred of det cord, or detonators, or appropriate amounts of barium nitrate in the debris and residue

Go ask the Chinese for that, maybe they haven't buried or otherwise destroyed all the evidence yet.

I doubt you'd find det cord or detonators within whatever was left of the buildings though, since most everything turned to dust.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:40:58 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#801. To: AGAviator, all (#796)

You and your pal [AGAviator] have made MANY false claims ACCUSING people here of saying they [WTC] fell at free fall speed

AG ... did you see how FL has vacillated his opinion.... again? He and his entire cockamamie crowd make that claim.

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:41:32 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#802. To: buckeroo, ALLL (#801)

AG ... did you see how FL has vacillated his opinion.... again? He and his entire cockamamie crowd make that claim.

You just accused me of making the claim that the towers fell at free fall speed, yet you have the balls to cry to your boyfriend that I just stated the obvious fact that is indeed what you did?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:43:59 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#803. To: FormerLurker (#799)

What is proven is that you are a bold-faced liar.

I see.. because YOU say so. Yeah, you made a post or two wherein you have called me a liar..... and you retracted them. Are you going to retract this one too?

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:44:12 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#804. To: FormerLurker (#802)

The towers DID NOT FALL AT FREE FALL SPEEDS. Is that clear?

"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET

buckeroo  posted on  2010-07-21   21:45:25 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#805. To: buckeroo (#803)

I see.. because YOU say so. Yeah, you made a post or two wherein you have called me a liar..... and you retracted them. Are you going to retract this one too?

You are lying RIGHT HERE. I NEVER retracted any statement accusing you of lying, that in itself is an outrageous lie.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:45:27 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#806. To: buckeroo (#804)

The towers DID NOT FALL AT FREE FALL SPEEDS. Is that clear?

Nobody ever said they did? So?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:45:50 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  


#807. To: buckeroo (#804)

The towers DID NOT FALL AT FREE FALL SPEEDS

The towers fell CLOSE to free fall speeds however.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2010-07-21   21:46:36 ET  [Locked]   Trace   Private Reply  



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