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Title: WikiLeaks Reveals Al Qaeda Boss Was Seen at Village Meetings - Despite CIA Claims They Were Clueless
Source:
Daily Mail Online
URL Source: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art ... den-seen-village-meetings.html
Published: Jul 28, 2010
Author: Mail Foreign Service
Post Date: 2010-07-28 15:17:40 by AGAviator
Keywords: None
Views: 4924
Comments: 280
Glimpses of Bin Laden: Now WikiLeaks reveals Al Qaeda boss was seen at village meetings - despite CIA claims that they were clueless By Mail Foreign Service Last updated at 10:16 AM on 27th July 2010 Bin Laden spotted in meeting with Taliban chief in 2006 'Spotted': Among 91,000 leaked U.S. documents are claims that Osama Bin Laden was last seen in 2006 The claims are among 91,000 U.S. military records obtained by whistleblowing website WikiLeaks. Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, said last month that there have been no firm leads on Bin Laden's whereabouts since the 'early 2000s'. But a 'threat report' from the International Security Assistance Force regional command (north) on suicide bombers in August 2006 suggested Bin Laden had been attending regular meetings in villages on the border between Pakistan and Afghanistan. It said: 'Reportedly a high-level meeting was held where six suicide bombers were given orders for an operation in northern Afghanistan. These meetings take place once every month.' According to the Guardian, which has received the documents, the report went on: 'The top four people in these meetings are Mullah Omar [the Taliban leader], Osama Bin Laden, Mullah Dadullah and Mullah [Baradar].' If true, it could mean forces came close to having the opportunity to wipe out the senior leadership of the Afghan insurgency that has so far claimed the lives of 320 British soldiers. The war logs also show that Bin Laden had a hand in a plot to poison coalition forces by adding a powder to food and drink consumed by troops as they passed through villages. Toll: An Afghan girl in hospital in Helmand after being injured by coalition forces in an air strike in 2007 These documents also suggest coalition forces have killed hundreds of civilians in so-called 'blue on white' incidents which were never reported. The leak is said to be U.S. Army intelligence expert Bradley Manning, 22, who boasted he had downloaded hundreds of thousands of documents, according to computer hacker Adrian Lamo. The 22-year-old, pictured above, is said to have contacted Lamo out of the blue and then claimed he had saved high-security files onto CDs, ready to hand to Wikileaks, while pretending to listen to Lady Gaga. 'Hillary Clinton and several thousand diplomats around the world are going to have a heart attack when they wake up one morning and find an entire repository of classified foreign policy is available, in searchable format, to the public,' he apparently told Mr Lamo. The hacker got in touch with the U.S. military and later met with them in Starbucks to hand over a printout of his conversations with Manning. Manning has already been charged over a separate leak of a classified helicopter cockpit video earlier this month. It showed U.S. soldiers laughing as they gunned down Afghan civilians and two journalists in a firefight in Baghdad in 2007. He was picked up in Iraq, where he was working. Manning is said to be locked up in a military prison after being shipped across the border to Kuwait. He faces trial by court martial and, if found guilty, a heavy jail sentence. Mr Lamo believes Manning did not work alone, saying he did not have ‘the technological expertise’ to carry out the gathering and leaking of the documents. 'I believe somebody would have had to have been of assistance to him,’ he said. They include claims that 16 children were among those shot or bombed in error The leaked military logs also reveal how a secret 'black' unit of crack special forces hunt down Taliban leaders for 'kill or capture' without trial - and voice concerns that Pakistani intelligence and Iran are supporting the insurgents. Downing Street said it 'would lament all unauthorised releases of classified material' and the White House condemned the ' irresponsible' leak of the files. And military and intelligence experts warned yesterday that the leaks could imperil the lives of British forces in Afghanistan. Colonel Stuart Tootal, who in 2006 commanded 3rd Battalion Parachute Regiment in Helmand Province - where more than 320 UK soldiers have been killed - said the information 'could impact on the security of our soldiers'. He insisted Nato forces now put a 'huge emphasis' on avoiding civilian casualties. Tory MP Patrick Mercer, a former Army captain, said: 'Although much of this information is in the public domain, the details are particularly damaging to the credibility of the coalition. 'Our enemies will be quick to exploit the propaganda element of it. 'If there are details of operational matters - locations, equipment, troops movements, resources - then soldiers' lives could be placed at risk.' Details of the secret files, detailing military operations between 2004 and 2009, were published yesterday by the Guardian, New York times and Germany's Der Spiegel while more than 75,000 records were made available on the WikiLeaks website. The files list 144 incidents involving Afghan civilian casualties, in which 195 died and 174 were injured. They detail coalition forces - fearful of suicide bombers - shooting unarmed drivers and civilian motorcyclists, and record an incident when French troops opened fire at a bus full of children because it came too close to a military convoy. Other leaked documents record a U.S. patrol machine-gunning a bus, killing or wounding 15 passengers, and Polish troops mortaring a village, killing a wedding party including a pregnant woman. They reveal details of undercover operations by a U.S. special forces unit named task Force 373, formed to hunt down and kill or capture taliban and Al Qaeda commanders. According to Julian Assange, the founder of the website, the files contain details of 'thousands' of potential war crimes. At a press conference in London, he defended his decision to publish the files and claimed the high level of civilian casualties reported was in fact lower than the true figure because military personnel 'downplayed' the number or reported them as insurgent deaths. Mr Assange said: 'We have tried hard to make sure that this material does not put innocents at harm. 'All the material is over seven months old so it is of no current operational consequence, even though it may be of very significant investigative consequence. 'The revelation of abuse by the U.S. and coalition forces may cause Afghans to be upset, and rightly so. ‘If governments don't like populations being upset, they should treat them better, not conceal abuses.' Professor Malcolm Chalmers, a defence expert at the Royal United Services Institute think tank, said that the leaks could undermine already faltering public support for the war. Read more: Bin Laden Seen Village Meetings Poster Comment: There has never been any proof that Bin Laden has died or been killed. He has repeatedly been reported to be in a very rugged area surrounded by people fiercely loyal to him. OBL is not and has never been in direct command of operations. He sees himself as someone providing motivation and logistical support to people actually carrying out day to day operations.
Al Qaeda boss 'had hand' in plot to poison UK troops
Secret files claim British soldiers shot 16 children
Military experts: leaks could put our troops in peril
Taliban missile brought down Chinook helicopter Secret files leaked about the war in Afghanistan have revealed tantalising glimpses of Osama Bin Laden despite public CIA claims that they are clueless as to the whereabouts of the Al Qaeda boss.
IS THIS SOLDIER BEHIND LEAKS? This fresh-faced soldier could be responsible for leaking a massive file of secret military documents revealing chilling details of the Afghanistan war and civilian deaths.
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#235. To: FormerLurker (#233)
No they aren't two different people. Run your claims by someone who identifies people professionally, not amateur photo doctors.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well imagine that. A criminal prosecution that doesn't issue general public press releases of all the evidence it has prior to the trial. So (1) As not to tip off the defense prior to pretrial discovery and conferences, and (2) The defense in a trial cannot claim the trial was prejudiced by publicity of evidence before the jury was selected and seated. That can be characterized in one common colloquialism. It doesn't cut it. There were a multiplicity of photographs of the site published in an attempt to convince the Sheeple that the government fairy tale was really for really true. Withholding that one photograph for trial is simply nonsense and you are attempting to explain it, it's questionable provenance, and convenient arrival away. Just as you try to explain away every other bit of evidence contrary to the "Official Fairy Tale™". And so what is your excuse for, 9 YEARS AFTER THE FACT, the 32 surveillance videos from surrounding sites seized the very afternoon of 911 by the FBI without a warrant, still being kept buried under layers of deep secrecy(and how did they know where EVERY ONE was so quickly? Advance planning?). Under what rationale are the 32 illegally seized videos still being withheld NINE YEARS AFTER THE EVENT? Because they might be needed in a court case? I wonder who the defendants would be if those videos were allowed to see the light of day? Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the illegally seized videos being kept buried behind a wall of secrecy? Because they do not corroborate the "Official Fairy Tale™"? I don't pretend to know the answer. However, I do know with utter cold certainty that if those videos did support the "Official Fairy Tale™" that they would have been splashed repeatedly across every television screen in the nation. I also have noted your repeated attempts to avoid addressing these key and central questions. My patience with your repeated lying, spinning, and attempts to offer preposterous excuses for data standing in direct contradiction of the "Official Conspiracy Theory™©®" is long since exhausted. It is become quite clear that you are operating from an agenda, and that agenda is other than the truth. If you really are a citizen of this nation, which I question given that Israeli Intelligence runs the kind of disinformation operation you are part of as well, you are a quisling, guilty of high treason, and if military standing in direct defiance and discredit to your given oath.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
They were all returned (untouched or edited) after official government analysis. You are using eight year old gossip/rumour/BS/hacked crap as a matter of fact.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
Horseshit. Your citation of proof is? The videos have NEVER been returned and FOIA requests for them have been turned down citing that wonderful catch all to bury inconvenient evidence "national security". Please explain why evidence which could prove or disprove the "Official Conspiracy Theory™" is still being held deeply buried NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT? What interest of "national security" is served? Proof that 911 was an inside job conducted with malice aforethought by elements within our own government and military apparatus? I'm sure that those responsible would consider it a security matter as firm proof of complicity guarantees them their own personalized piece of rope.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Sorry charlie... you made the original claim: Prove your allegation. But, of course, we shall see no FACTS, no EVIDENCE, no WITNESSES ... just gossip/rumour and your attempt at eloquent and continuous polysyllabic ramblings.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
BOVINE EXCREMENT!!!!!!!!!!!
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Prove yours. Show us the tapes.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Horseshit. You asserted that ALL of the videos have been released. PROVE IT. It has not occurred and you were L-Y-I-N-G when you said they had.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
You smote Aggravator a terrible blow, Dawg. That was great.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. Who would that be praytell? Buck of the loose screw perhaps?
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. That isn't true at all. I actually indicated that material by private or individual witnesses that was reviewed by official government bodies was released both untouched and unedited. But again, you are playing dumb (as is typical) ... YOU made the allegation: Prove the assertion.... other than some website that has not updated any of its data for eight years.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
O_I: That had to have left a mark. It would have left terrible marks if he was sentient. Fortunately for him that isn't the case.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. PROVE IT. It has not occurred and you were L-Y-I-N-G when you said they had. You don't think it bothers him to lie, do you?
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. deleted
The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.
Feel free to tell that to the dozen plus defense attorneys who took guilty pleas intead of more serious charges like being accomplices to mass murders. Or if you don't trust the defense attorneys, go to pro bono legal groups defending "innocent" people from miscarriages of justice. I guarantee you nobody will come near these cases because they have convincing evidence admitted by the defendants that they did in fact aid and abet hijackers with violating US immigration laws, albeit without knowing the ultimate purpose of what the pilot trainee/hijackers wanted to do which was murder thousands of Americans at the instigation of Osama Bin Laden.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Maybe they should called a Mexican lawyer, I hear they do pretty well in getting their clients off the hook.
Anyways, where are those videos?
HORSESHIT! 8 Traits of the Disinformationalist Virtually everything about their presentation implies their authority and expert knowledge in the matter without any further justification for credibility. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, they're not on this website, and they're not on my PC. So if they're important to you, go find them by some other method than addressing your missives to me.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Prove the assertion.... other than some website that has not updated any of its data for eight years. Ta-ha!!!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- BOVINE EXCREMENT!!!!!!!!!!! Here is a good summary: The Suppression of Video Footage of the Pentagon Attack Here is the text of the article: The Suppression of Video Footage of the Pentagon Attack It is striking that there is neither video footage nor any photographic evidence in the public domain showing a jetliner approaching or crashing into the Pentagon. As of May, 2006, the only video footage of the crash that has been released are clips from two Pentagon security cameras north of the crash site, one the source of 5 frames leaked in 2002. With the release of the two video clips, the Pentagon claims to have supplied all of the footage it has of the attack. Although the number and positions of security cameras monitoring the Pentagon is not public knowledge, it seems unlikely that only two security cameras captured the attack. Isn't it reasonable to assume that there were dozens, if not hundreds, of security cameras ringing the huge building that is the heart of the United States military establishment? Videos Outside the Pentagon Seized The Sheraton National Hotel may be the hotel from which the FBI seized a CCTV recording. Not only has the government refused to release footage that would clearly show how the Pentagon was attacked, it has also seized footage not belonging to the military. The FBI confiscated video recordings from several private businesses near the Pentagon in the immediate aftermath of the attack. Those recordings, if they still exist, might provide decisive evidence about the attack. * The FBI visited a hotel near the Pentagon to confiscate film from a security camera which some hotel employees had been watching in horror shortly after the attack. The FBI denied that the footage captured the attack. 1 * The FBI visited the Citgo gas station southwest of the Pentagon within minutes of the attack to confiscate film that may have captured the attack. According to Jose Velasquez, who was working at the gas station at the time of the attack, the station's security cameras would have captured the attack. 2 The NEXCOMM/CITGO gas station is just under the flightpath of the aircraft involved in the Pentagon attack. In addition it is likely there is other video footage that was either destroyed or is being withheld, given that the trajectory of the attack plane took it low over a large part of Arlington, Virginia. Lawsuits to Obtain Videos At least two plaintiffs have attempted to obtain videos seized by the FBI, using the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA). The first, documented at Flight77.info, began with a request to the FBI in October of 2004. The second, undertaken by the Judicial Watch, Inc. began with a request to the Department of Defense (DOD) in December of 2004. Following is a timeline of the requests and subsequent lawsuits. Entries relating to the second case are distinguished with dates colored gray. * October 14, 2004: Scott A. Hodes, on behalf of his client Scott Bingham, sends a request to David Hardy of the FBI requesting any videos "that may have captured the impact of Flight 77 into the Pentagon on September 11, 2001". The request letter mentions videotapes from the Citgo Gas Station and the Sheraton National Hotel. (1) Video camera recordings obtained by federal official(s) and/or law enforcement from a Nexcomm/Citgo gas station in the vicinity of the Pentagon on or about September 11, 2001. (2) Pentagon security video camera recording(s) showing Flight 77 strike and/or hit and/or crash into the Pentagon on September 11, 2001. (3) Closed Circuit Television (CCTV) video camera recording(s) obtained by any federal official(s) and/or law enforcement from the Virginia Department of Transportation ("VDOT") and/or the VDOT "Smart Traffic Center" on or about September 11, 2001. References 1. Inside the Ring, The Gertz Files, 9/21/01 [cached] "One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
I am greatly amused. Bloviator is now trying to use Twenty-Five Ways To Suppress Truth: The Rules of Disinformation as a tool to "catapult the propaganda". Of course he misapplies them and is attempting to use them to misrepresent anything which points out how he is dissembling, avoiding issues, and various other points of disinformation technique as being disinformation. So, I guess one way to dispel the fog he is trying to create is to turn on a fan for him. "One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Like what, blowhard? "It is the job of a disinfo artist to interfere with these evaluations... to at least make people think the links are weak or broken when, in truth, they are not... or to propose alternative solutions leading away from the truth. Often, by simply impeding and slowing down the process through disinformation tactics, a level of victory is assured because apathy increases with time and rhetoric." For such disinformationalists, the overall aim is to avoid discussing links in the chain of evidence which cannot be broken by truth, but at all times, to use clever deceptions or lies to make select links seem weaker than they are, create the illusion of a break, or better still, cause any who are considering the chain to be distracted in any number of ways, including the method of questioning the credentials of the presenter. Please understand that fact is fact, regardless of the source. Likewise, truth is truth, regardless of the source. This is why criminals are allowed to testify against other criminals. Where a motive to lie may truly exist, only actual evidence that the testimony itself IS a lie renders it completely invalid. Were a known 'liar's' testimony to stand on its own without supporting fact, it might certainly be of questionable value, but if the testimony (argument) is based on verifiable or otherwise demonstrable facts, it matters not who does the presenting or what their motives are, or if they have lied in the past or even if motivated to lie in this instance -- the facts or links would and should stand or fall on their own merit and their part in the matter will merely be supportive. Moreover, particularly with respects to public forums such as newspaper letters to the editor, and Internet chat and news groups, the disinfo type has a very important role. In these forums, the principle topics of discussion are generally attempts by individuals to cause other persons to become interested in their own particular position, idea, or solution -- very much in development at the time. People often use such mediums as a sounding board and in hopes of pollination to better form their ideas. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Did you see O_I's references in post @255? They suck... he even went so far as to MAKE a thread out of proud post..... ROTFL
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
Like the eyewitness testimony of 136 people who observed the 757 airplane crash into the building isn't adequate for them. They want perfect videos from a few frame per second cameras, recording all the details of a 757 traveling at 530 MPH near the ground with perfect clarity. Then, if such videos did exist, they would say they had been fabricated...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Isn't it hillarious? They [twoofers] want a HOLLYWOOD MOVIE capturing a pile of illegal terrorists slamming a jet into a government building, with actors, directors and PERFECT SHOTS. I find it amusing.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
What are you guys smotin'? : ) Ab wants to smote with you.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
What are you guys smotin'? : ) Ab wants to smote with you. snickering
"Every Person born within the limits of the United States, and subject to their jurisdiction, is by virtue of natural law and national law a citizen of the United States. This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of persons. You want to smote too? : )
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Ab wants to smote with you. Well, DAWG was smotin' aggravator and buck and I was just complimenting him on a fine job. And you are welcome to smote them too, they deserve it.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. Yes, farmfriend can join in on the smotin'. Everyone is welcome.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. How does it feel (assuming you have any feelings) when someone throws back your same monotonous crap in your face based on fairness and applied factual rebuttal? Cat got your tongue, lad?
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
I take it you find logic monotonous? I know exactly what Bloviator is doing, as usual he is taking something and twisting it. I suspect he got tired of getting called on his logical fallacies and disinformation techniques. So, now he "thinks" he is going to twist it around and pervert valid logical points to his disinformation attacks. Ain't gonna work. A. He can't make me mad. B. He can't out think me. C. The truth is on my side so all he can do is the usual: Warp, pervert, twist, and misrepresent. In the end it is a very limited repetoire.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
Logic? Your definition of monotonous, cantankerous BS is called "LOGIC?"
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
Pretty much as I expected. You do not refute the reference you make a personal attack - Argumentum Ad Hominem and apply Rule number 9 of the Twenty-Five Ways To Suppress Truth: The Rules of Disinformation. 9. Play Dumb. No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues except with denials they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maximum effect. So, other than a stupid generalization to avoid addressing the point you sidestep it with crudity, insults, and a refusal to acknowledge the well documented evidences provided. At no point did you refute any element of the article, you merely engaged in disinformation ploys to AVOID having to address it. Now returning to your earlier false assertion: My question was (#236): Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the illegally seized videos (from 32 separate locations surrounding the Pentagon the afternoon of 911) being kept buried behind a wall of secrecy? Your response was (237): Which is now shown to be FALSE. In other words you were L-Y-I-N-G when you said they had. Unlike your attempts to put words in my mouth I have quoted your exact words. The article posted in Post #255 stands as a direct refutation of your L-I-E. You now stand branded by your own words as a L-I-A-R. There can be no doubt and as it is demonstrated by the evidence in this thread it is quite clear that you are a L-I-A-R.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
A liar and he's not just playing dumb either, that's not an act.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. One of the things I find most interesting about disinfo people is their general stupidity. Generally speaking they conduct no original thought - it is all cut and paste or the same set of disinformation gambits, such as playing dumb, over and over and over and over again. No originality, no wit, just all spin all the time.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
But maybe we should cut him some slack. He MAY be inventing a new kernel for an operating system that will make Bill Gates really take notice. He will probably out-Linux Linus Torvalds. Or maybe not.
Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end. He (Gordon Duff) also implies that forcibly removing Obama, a Constitution-hating, on-the-down-low, crackhead Communist, is an attack on America, Mom, and apple pie. I swear these military people are worse than useless. Just look around at the condition of the country and tell me if they have fulfilled their oaths to protect the nation from all enemies foreign and domestic. I'd like to cut him some slack - and then see it draped over a stout branch on the Village Oak.
"One of the least understood strategies of the world revolution now moving rapidly toward its goal is the use of mind control as a major means of obtaining the consent of the people who will be subjects of the New World Order." K.M. Heaton, The National Educator
There aren't any.... PROVE your perspective and issue with contemporary data... AND STOP USING NINE YEAR LINKS.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestThe differences in the facial features between the Dulles Airport video and the other images of Hanjour are significant, proving they are two different people.
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#236. To: AGAviator, HOUNDDAWG, wudidiz, FormerLurker, IRTorqued, Eric Stratton, HAPPY2BEME4UM, christine, Dakmar, all (#223)
(Edited)
You neglected to mention that the second photo was a picture that was released as an exhibit during the Zacarias Moussaoui terrorist trial in 2006 and never seen by any honest observers before that date.
In a related vein:
Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the Air Traffic Controllers still held under a gag order?
#237. To: Original_Intent (#236)
Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the illegally seized videos being kept buried behind a wall of secrecy?
#238. To: buckeroo, wudidiz, HOUNDDAWG, FormerLurker, christine, all (#237)
#239. To: Original_Intent (#238)
Your citation of proof is?
Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the illegally seized videos being kept buried behind a wall of secrecy?
#240. To: buckeroo, all (#237)
They were all returned (untouched or edited) after official government analysis
#241. To: buckeroo (#239)
Prove your allegation
#242. To: buckeroo (#239)
Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the illegally seized videos being kept buried behind a wall of secrecy?
#243. To: HOUNDDAWG (#215)
No, you cannot sell your crock 'o shit here because we ain't on the payroll and we ain't part of the secret homosexual pedophile cabal that is the US Government.
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#244. To: HOUNDDAWG (#219)
I'm sure that Ass Grabber is consulting with the highest authority in this matter
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#245. To: Original_Intent (#242)
Horseshit. You asserted that ALL of the videos have been released.
Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the illegally seized videos being kept buried behind a wall of secrecy?
#246. To: Original_Intent, HOUNDDAWG (#220)
HOUNDDAWG: And, speaking of you, You really are a criminal co-conspirator after the fact, aren't you?
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#247. To: Original_Intent (#242)
Horseshit. You asserted that ALL of the videos have been released.
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#248. To: Original_Intent (#236)
#249. To: FormerLurker, buckeroo, turtle (#233)
So why didn't they pull out the tapes for those trials? You know why? It's more than likely because they'd prove those people had nothing to do with the Pentagon attack.
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#250. To: AGAviator (#249)
I guarantee you nobody will come near these cases because they have convincing evidence admitted by the defendants that they did in fact aid and abet hijackers with violating US immigration laws, albeit without knowing the ultimate purpose of what the pilot trainee/hijackers wanted to do which was murder thousands of Americans at the instigation of Osama Bin Laden.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#251. To: AGAviator (#249)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#252. To: Original_Intent, buckeroo (#236)
(Edited)
That can be characterized in one common colloquialism.
(1) Avoidance. They never actually discuss issues head-on or provide constructive input, generally avoiding citation of references or credentials. Rather, they merely imply this, that, and the other.
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#253. To: FormerLurker, buckerooo (#251)
Anyways, where are those videos?
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#254. To: buckeroo (#245)
secrecy?
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#255. To: abraxas, Buckmonster Fullofit, wuddiz, HOUNDDAWG, FormerLurker, IRTorqued, Dakmar, Critter, christine, AGBloviator, all (#240)
They were all returned (untouched or edited) after official government analysis
* November 3, 2004: The FBI replies to Bingham's request stating that their search "revealed no record responsive to your FOIA request".
* November 17, 2004: Hodes files an appeal of Bingham's FOIA request with the U.S Department of Justice (DOJ), citing evidence that the videotapes mentioned in the original request exist.
* December 15, 2004: Christopher J. Farrell of Judicial Watch, Inc. writes to James Hogan in the Office of Freedom of Information/Security Review of the DOD requesting that the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS), DOD, and FBI produce:
any and all agency records concerning, relating to, or reflecting the following subjects:
* March 7, 2005: The DOJ replies to Hodes' November 17 appeal, admitting that it did possess records responsive to the request but that it could release the records because such a release "could reasonably be expected to interfere with law enforcement proceedings." * January 26, 2005: The DOD advises Judicial Watch, Inc. that it possesses a videotape responsive to the December 15, 2004 request but declines to produce the videotape, citing U.S.C 552(b)(7)(A).
* March 8, 2005: Bingham's attorney files a lawsuit with the United States District Court for the District of Columbia stating that the FBI is in violation of the FOIA for "failing to adequately respond to plaintiff's FOIA request, including failing to adequately search for and release records that the plaintiff believes the agency is in possession of, and for failing to timely respond to the plaintiff's administrative appeal."
* April 18, 2005: The DOJ files a response to Bingham's March 8 lawsuit denying the plaintiff's request and asking the judge to dismiss the plaintiff's Complaint with prejudice.
* April 19, 2005: District Judge Paul L. Friedman orders the defendants to file a motion to dismiss or a motion for summary judgment in the case brought by Bingham on or before June 21, 2005.
* June 10, 2005: The DOD denies Judicial Watch's administrative appeal, claiming that the video is exempt as part of an ongoing investigation involving Zacarias Moussaoui.
* August 1, 2005: Jeffrey D. Kahn, an attorney for the DOJ's Civil Division files a 23-page MEMORANDUM OF POINTS AND AUTHORITIES IN SUPPORT OF DEFENDANT'S MOTION FOR SUMMARY JUDGMENT. Scans of the document are posted on Flight77.info.
* August 29, 2005: Hodes files a Memorandum of Points and Authorities in Support of Plaintiff's Opposition to Defendants' Motion for Summary Judgment and a STATEMENT OF FACT ON WHICH THERE EXIST A GENUINE ISSUE TO BE LITIGATED in response to the DOJ's motion for summary judgment. * September 9, 2005: Kahn files a REPLY BRIEF IN FURTHER SUPPORT OF DEFENDANT'S MOTION FOR SUMMARY JUDGMENT
* September 9, 2005: Special Agent Jacqueline Maguire of the FBI's Counterterrorism Division files a DECLARATION describing her search for records responsive to Bingham's FOIA request. Maguire admits to determining that 85 videotapes in the FBI's possession are "potentially responsive" the request, that she personally viewed 29 of the tapes, and that she located only one videotape that showed the impact of Flight 77 into the Pentagon. Maguire also refers to "one videotape taken from a closed circuit television at a Doubletree Hotel in Arlington Virginia," but states that it did not show the impact of Flight 77.
* September 26, 2005: Hodes files a request seeking "copies of 85 videotapes in the possession of the FBI described in the declaration of Special Agent Jacqueline Maguire dated September 7, 2005.
* October 20, 2005: The DOJ sends a letter to Hodes claiming that the requested material is exempt.
* October 24, 2005: Hodes appeals the DOJ's October 20 claim that its material is exempt.
* February 22, 2006: Judicial Watch, Inc. files a lawsuit in the United States District Court for the District of Columbia seeking declaratory and injunctive relief against the Department of Defense for its refusal to disclose records sought under the FOIA request.
* May 5, 2006: Judge Friedman orders the defendants to show cause on or before May 26, 2006 why their motion for summary judgment should not be denied as moot, noting that the criminal proceedings against Moussaoui have ended.
* May 16, 2006: Judicial Watch obtains two videos from the DOD, and posts them on their website. The site is down for about half of the day due to demand. * September 15, 2006: Judicial Watch announces the release of video from CITGO gas station. 3 The video consists mostly of views of the interior of the gas station and does not appear to capture the attack.
* December 2, 2006: Judicial Watch obtains a video recording from the Doubletree Hotel in Arlington. The video, which does not include a view of the Pentagon's facade, shows an explosion but does not capture an approaching jetliner. 4
2. Three Months On, Tension Lingers Near the Pentagon, Richmond Times-Dispatch, 12/11/01 [cached]
3. CITGO Gas Station Cameras Near Pentagon Evidently Did Not Capture Attack, JudicialWatch.org, 9/15/06 [cached]
4. Hotel security video shows 9/11 Pentagon blast, but no plane, CNN.com, 12/2/06 [cached]
#256. To: FormerLurker, AGBloviator, AGAviator, all (#251)
#257. To: OInk, buckeroo, turtle (#256)
Of course he misapplies them and is attempting to use them to misrepresent anything which points out how he is dissembling, avoiding issues, and various other points of
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#258. To: AGAviator (#257)
#259. To: buckeroo (#258)
(Edited)
Did you see O_I's references in post @255? They suck... he even went so far as to MAKE a thread out of proud post..... ROTFL
It is striking that there is neither video footage nor any photographic evidence in the public domain showing a jetliner approaching or crashing into the Pentagon. As of May, 2006, the only video footage of the crash that has been released are clips from two Pentagon security cameras north of the crash site, one the source of 5 frames leaked in 2002.
One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work....Noam Chomsky
#260. To: AGAviator (#259)
They want perfect videos from a few frame per second cameras, recording all the details of a 757 traveling at 530 MPH near the ground with perfect clarity.
#261. To: James Deffenbach, HOUNDDAWG (#243)
You smote Aggravator a terrible blow, Dawg. That was great.
#262. To: abraxas, James Deffenbach, HOUNDDAWG (#261)
You smote Aggravator a terrible blow, Dawg. That was great.
Senator Jacob Howard, Co-author of the citizenship clause of the 14th Amendment, 1866.
#263. To: farmfriend (#262)
#264. To: abraxas (#261)
What are you guys smotin'? : )
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#265. To: abraxas, farmfriend (#263)
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#266. To: Original_Intent, AGAviator (#256)
Bloviator is now trying to use Twenty-Five Ways To Suppress Truth: The Rules of Disinformation as a tool to "catapult the propaganda".
#267. To: buckeroo, Buckmonster Fullofit, AGBloviator, Former Lurker, James Deffenbach, abraxas, IRTorqued, wudidiz, all (#266)
#268. To: Original_Intent (#267)
I take it you find logic monotonous?
#269. To: buckeroo, Buckmonster Fullofit, AGBloviator, Former Lurker, James Deffenbach, abraxas, christine, HOUNDDAWG, IRTorqued, wudidiz, all (#258)
(Edited)
Did you see O_I's references in post @255? They suck... he even went so far as to MAKE a thread out of proud post..... ROTFL
They were all returned (untouched or edited) after official government analysis. You are using eight year old gossip/rumour/BS/hacked crap as a matter of fact.
#270. To: Original_Intent (#269)
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#271. To: James Deffenbach (#270)
#272. To: Original_Intent (#271)
Lord Acton
OsamaBinGoldstein posted on 2010-05-25 9:39:59 ET (2 images) Reply Trace
#273. To: James Deffenbach (#272)
#274. To: Original_Intent (#269)
My question was (#236): Why NINE YEARS AFTER THE FACT are the illegally seized videos (from 32 separate locations surrounding the Pentagon the afternoon of 911) being kept buried behind a wall of secrecy?
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