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Title: Marriage Sinks to New Low, Recession Blamed…
Source:
SpearHead
URL Source: http://www.the-spearhead.com/2010/0 ... s-to-new-low-recession-blamed/
Published: Oct 5, 2010
Author: W.F. Price
Post Date: 2010-10-05 14:21:34 by Lysander_Spooner
Keywords: None
Views: 385
Comments: 45
Marriage Sinks to New Low, Recession Blamed… by W.F. Price on September 28, 2010 Recently released Census Bureau figures reveal that in 2009 the proportion of married Americans fell lower than ever, dropping 5% in the last 9 years alone. Compared to 57% in 2000, today only 52% of all adults are married. The institution of marriage is crumbling under a combined feminist and federal assault, which has legislated it into something that is roughly the opposite of what it used to be. Pointing to the recession as the primary reason for the death of marriage is entirely off the mark. The decline of marriage has been ongoing since at least the early 1970s, when no-fault divorce created an explosion of divorces and started to make men more reluctant to tie the knot. Spearhead contributor Charles Martel wrote a piece on the decline of the marriage rate that suggests that if current trends continue, marriage will cease to exist within roughly twenty years. In the earlier days of the decline, men were generally blamed, but perhaps the recession provides an even more convenient excuse. Or, maybe, those who still support the institution are simply holding out in the impossible hope that the trend will turn around when times are better. They are deluding themselves. As long as marriage remains an institution designed to suck the lifeblood out of men for the benefit of lawyers, the government and women, it will continue to weaken until it meets its well-deserved demise.
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#1. To: Lysander_Spooner (#0)
He get's it. There's nothing more to add, really. .
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files The second dumbest creature on the face of the earth is the one who cannot recognize its enemies. The most stupid of all is the one who will defend and collaborate with the very enemies that are destroying it and its own kind. -Ben Klassen
Sure there is. Marriage and the family have been under attack since the cultural revolution started in this country. It began with no-fault divorce and has been gaining force with the so-called woman's movement and queer movement. Lawyers and those running them have crafted the judicial system they want to a) destroy the family and b) loot the nation and prevent those getting screwed from doing anything to protect themselves. Don't blame marriage.
I fully support people not going to the state for permission to marry. Marriage is one of two institutions from God, and the state has no business trying to make money by licensing it. eff the state.
Although I do agree with you in principle, marriage has been essentially outlawed in this country. When you get a 'marriage license' you are essentially agreeing to be placed under the juridiction of the so- called 'Family Court' and agree that they will decide to divide your assets and allow or disallow you to see your children, it is essentially a 'civil union', with the 'civil' authorities dictating the outcome. Of course the 'civil authorities' are far from 'civil', and actually encourage and incentivize the destruction of your family, hardly 'civil' in my opinion. Men having suffered the brunt of the abuse and violence of the 'system' are opting out, and for good cause. I am one of them in spirit and action. I will not sign a so-called 'marriage license'. There is a movement toward co- habitation agreements, actually becoming more popular than pre-nuptials. The State has killed 'marriage', people are circumventing it by making their own agreements. The divorce industry is dying a slow, but justifiable death, and good riddance to all you blood sucking thieves, leeches and vultures who profit from the destruction of families, and fromthe abuse and violence purpetrated upon mostly innocent men, children and some women. Peace.
I dont blame something neutral like marriage. I blame the mercenary women for taking advantage of what the courts have set up for them, and I really blame the men for letting themselves be suckered into it because because they are "in love", and it is expected of them by society and relatives to be married, even though the men know the risks are huge and the odds are stacked against them. Getting married is the dumbest thing a man can do, imo, and it looks like men are finally wising up. .
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files The second dumbest creature on the face of the earth is the one who cannot recognize its enemies. The most stupid of all is the one who will defend and collaborate with the very enemies that are destroying it and its own kind. -Ben Klassen
What? Marriage isn't a 50/50 type of deal and committment anymore? It's all the ebil women who are to blame and men are just "victims" in marriage. Women get the lifeblood sucked out of them too......especially if they had assets prior to marriage.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Many women are wising up too. They are learning that holding a full time job to contribute to the family finances, coming home, cooking, cleaning, doing the laundry, getting the kids to bed, is no bargain. At one time a marriage was simply recorded in the family bible and the state had no business sticking it's nose into the matter. When one or both parties "gave up," they simply left the union. Marriage is no picnic for either men or women. It is hard work for both. The Feminist movement was responsible for causing a lot of hostility between men and women.
I want either less corruption or more opportunity to participate in it. Ashleigh Brilliant
Quote modified by me. Frankly they can be as hostile as they want to be. I can be rather hostile right back at them. It's a battle that they don't win. .
Click for Privacy and Preparedness files The second dumbest creature on the face of the earth is the one who cannot recognize its enemies. The most stupid of all is the one who will defend and collaborate with the very enemies that are destroying it and its own kind. -Ben Klassen
Well, there is little good to come of this.
"Satan / Cheney in "08" Well crap, I thought I was making a funny comment. I love women, anything I post about these unusual creatures is in praise. Or satire.
"Satan / Cheney in "08" While that can be true it is likely about 98% males getting the hose job and 2% of the females. Theft is theft and the 'Divorce Racket' is clearly biased against the productive male. A few females also get a taste of the bitterness. I for one would never 'do it' again, and I know lots of males who feel the exact same way. Feminists and greedy lawyers/judges have stacke deck, and we are not playing the game. So-called 'marriage' is dying a justifiable death in my view. Peace.
I disagree, they don't call it a 'Correction' for no reason.
That is exactly what happens.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
Might I add, the children are also casualties in this and suffer 100% of the time. I think it is abhorent, it is unbelievable what they must go through so that the wimmins can get their 'liberation', bought and paid for by a man in most cases, and the greed and frank malfeasance of the so-called 'legal system'.
I have never ceased to be amazed at the number of women who think it is okay raise children by themselves, without a father, or to decide whether a fetus is human or not (if I want it, it's human; if I don't want it, it's okay to abort it). There are all the other problems I need not address, since everyone knows what they are. I know quite a few unmarried/divorced middle-aged women. And they are bitter and hateful.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
Where is the personal responsibility? At least I can admit that I wouldn't have been hosed if I had a pre-nup. It's not theft when people don't protect their assets. And, although it was a rough learning experience, I'm not bitter at all. I will simply be better educated and prepared if I do it again. This victim mentality doesn't work for me.....
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
I will simply be better educated and prepared if I do it again. Yes it likely does. My guess is you are a woman? If you support the present system it based entirely on women being the victim. Pre-nups aren't worth the paper they are written on, just another way lawyers fleece the unsuspecting and the uninformed, and usually men pay for these. The judge will flap his lips with some comment to the effect: "The pre-nup is null and void because it is not in the interests of society". Then proceeds to toss it in the circular file. As far as doing it again, good luck with that, marginal males seem to be the only ones getting married these day, and even their numbers are declining. Please see my post today of the Death of Marriage. I for one will never 'do it' again. My sons, both 21, are wise to the system and it seems as most of their male piers are also. Mean while, the girls their age for the most part have a strategic plan of wearing slut gear, getting tossed around from guy to guy, while dreaming of marrying a rich guy, and going shopping on his credit card the rest of their lives. It would be funny if it wern't so tragic. Peace.
And they end up 50 years told, living in an apartment with their cats, and wondering why no guy has asked them out in three years. I've seen this more than once.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
I disagree. Plus, it's different in each state. If you live in a fault state, it's best to understand what this means and act accordingly. I live in a no fault state so none of the issues that led to divorce are addressed by the court, only the splitting of assets and custody issues. My ex-husband filed a motion right away, created massive legal costs. His attorney was as you described, but that was HIS CHOICE. He could have opted for an attorney that has a good track record in settling, not litigating. Again, HIS CHOICE. Perhaps, you opted for such an attorney as well. Pre-nups do not protect what is acquired DURING marriage, only what one has acquired PRIOR to marriage. Many people do not understand this. Most pre-nups
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
In mother-only families, children tend to experience short-and long-term economic and psychological disadvantages; higher absentee rates at school, lower levels of education, and higher dropout rates (with boys more negatively affected than girls); and more delinquent activity, including alcohol and drug addiction. Source URL: family.jrank.org/pages/15...-Parent-Families-Effects- on-Children.html
My post got cut off..... Most pre-nups are air tight. In fact, less than 1% of pre-nups get thrown out in court. The scenario you presented is often stated by those who did not have a pre-nup in place prior to marriage. But, it's not how it is played out in court.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Turtle, on another thread you were claiming fathers could raise children without mothers and do so much better. You share this same amazingly idiotic mind-set with these women.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Throughout history, nature has always been considered femal.e and civilization, male. When civilization goes, we return to nature and the female -- we act like animals living in grass huts. Even Camille Paglia, a lesbian feminist with no axe to grind when it comes to men, understands this.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
I have never ceased to be amazed at the number of women who think it is okay raise children by themselves, without a father, Turtle, on another thread you were claiming fathers could raise children without mothers and do so much better. You share this same amazingly idiotic mind-set with these women. No, history has shown men can raise children by themselves far better than women can raise them by themselves. There are huge differences between men and women. For one thing, without men there is no civilization.l
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
Show me the history on this. Put up the research to validate your opinion.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
2. My ex-husband filed a motion right away, created massive legal costs. His attorney was as you described, but that was HIS CHOICE. He could have opted for an attorney that has a good track record in settling, not litigating. Again, HIS CHOICE. Perhaps, you opted for such an attorney as well. 3.Pre-nups do not protect what is acquired DURING marriage, only what one has acquired PRIOR to marriage. Many people do not understand this. 1. As of October 2010, all states allow no-fault divorce [4] Source URL:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-fault_divorce 2. The DR Court system incentivives these type of behaviors, it is litigation, it is adversarial by its nature. Most of the massive legal costs are created by the actions of women. It is a fact that 75% of divorces are initiated by women. In my case I fired 10 attornies, one robbed me of $10,000, they were all louses, and crooks. Hers was the worst crook. In the end I represented myself and won full custody of my sons. She started the war, I finished it. 3.Pre-nups are routinely thrown out of court, they are not worth the paper they are written on and do not protect anyone.
Do you have a source for this 'fact'. Everyone I have know in my personal life who had a pre-nup and divorced were sorry they spent the money on something that ended up in the trash.
That is something I have never understood.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
"Father-Child Reunion" by William Farrell. The book that claims single fathers are superior to single mothers on almost every measurable scale: Farrell has marshaled data to show that single fathers raise children who are, among other things, more empathetic, less violent, less likely to become teenage parents and perform better in school than children raised by single mothers. He even claims that girls raised by single fathers have more orgasms than those raised by single mothers. URL source: http://www.warrenfarrell.com/
I wasn't aware of the recent turn to no-fault everywhere. CA should see a rise in divorces just from this change. I agree it can be very difficult to find a good attorney.....an honest one is even harder to find. I was fortunate as I worked in a law firm for years. It's actually 65% of divorces that are initiated by women. However, statistics clearly indicate that people do marry again....despite an even highter risk of divorce than the first marriage. 75% of all divorced people re-marry, half of them within three years. 65% of all second marriages fail.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
It rather easy. Their actions are incentivized by the "Divorce Industry". They buy into the notion that they will be 'liberated' from 'the man' and he will have to pay for it too. Happy days for them. Sad fact is most do worse economically, emotionally, and socially especially if children are involved.
This was why, until the early 20th century, in a divorce, the children were given to the father. Women have been conned by feminism into not understanding what men really are.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
True. If I were starting a business, and essentially so-called 'marriage' is nothing more than a civil union, a business deal, there is no way I would invest my time, energy, property and money on something that has a 65% failure rate. An endeavor if it doesn't work out because my partner wants to be 'liberated', who can leave for "no reason/no fault", steal half the assets at a minimum, and dictate to me when I can and can't interact with my employees, oops I meant children( I hope you catch my drift), is just not attractive or wise for most but the most marginal of men.
Again, this varies from state to state. But there are general guidlelines to make the pre-nup air-tight. This would be for pre-nups to be drafted in a timely manner, meaning several months prior to the wedding, both parties are represented by an individual attorney, not the same attorney, and the interests of both parties are represented in the document. Lastly, the parties need to honestly disclose all assets in the document. The most common reason that pre-nups are tossed out is due to FAILURE TO DISCLOSE all assets within the document. This isn't failure of the document, but failure of the party to be honest in content.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
His book is in promotion of equal parenting, not claiming that fathers are superior to mothers or that mothers aren't necessary. Like this insight: •"If we want fathers equally involved, we won’t be talking about women’s reproductive rights and men’s reproductive responsibilities, we’ll be speaking equally about what I call both sexes (Speaking more about rights than responsibilities is the sign of being not an adult but an adolescent, someone who wants the right to the car while you pay for the gas, insurance and repairs.)" Here is the real premise of the book, of which I fully agree by the way: Father and Child Reunion's findings include some 26 ways in which children of
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
Cut off again: Premise of Farrell Book: Father and Child Reunion's findings include some 26 ways in which children of divorce do better when three conditions prevail: equally-shared parenting (or joint custody); close parental proximity; and no bad-mouthing.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
I'm not buying it. In todays environment I would need a small fortune in gold as ransom from my partner in civil union to sign. Say like $1,000,000 in gold bullion to even begin to think about it. The system is not only broke, it is immoral and down right evil.
And in what percentage of divorces does that happen?
Not often enough. It happens when people put their children first. I don't even have any family in this area, I stay here so my kids can have a close relationship with their father. We call each other on every infraction. We keep rules in place from one house to the other and punishment goes from house to house. We NEVER fight over holidays or week-ends or adjusting the schedule to best benefit the girls. We drop the girls off every other day. I NEVER bad mouth him and my girls. I always put my daughters first, Lysander. He will always be my girls' daddy, despite his cheating on me while I was pregnant.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
lol.....the most air-tight pre-nups are made for folks who really don't have a lot in the first place--a few houses, a business, retirement. It often reduces the costs of litigation a great deal because it places many assets off the table and there is no haggling over them. If the partner to be doesn't want to sign, then that's probably not the right partner, IMHO. I say both parties should keep what they had. : )
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
I believe it was Samuel Johnson who said, "Nature gives women so much power the law wisely gives them little." So many women today are so deluded with the belief in their "rights" they don't realize there will be a backlash.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
You obviously 'believe' in the so-called 'family court system', I do not. It is a sham, and criminal. It is indefensible and should be dismantled. It will be by attrition, by those like me who refuse to enter into so-called 'marriage', when in fact what we are signing away are our rights as parents and rights to our property. This "system" will not stand.
The more people stay out of the "justice" system, the better it is for all involved.
"If ever this vast country is brought under a single government, it will be one of the most extensive corruption, indifferent and incapable of a wholesome care over so wide a spread of surface. This will not be borne, and you will have to choose between reform and revolution. If I know the spirit of this country, the one or the other is inevitable." - Thomas Jefferson
I'm a pragmatist Lysander. The best defense is still a good offense.
"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays, Father of Public Relations
The best offense is a good defense. For most men, and women who are productive economically, it makes no sense to 'marry', it is utter nonsense, and perhaps the best defense.
As long as marriage remains an institution designed to suck the lifeblood out of men for the benefit of lawyers, the government and women, it will continue to weaken until it meets its well-deserved demise.
#2. To: PSUSA (#1)
There's nothing more to add, really.
#3. To: Brian D, PSUSA, 4 (#2)
#4. To: Brian D (#2)
#5. To: Brian D, all (#2)
Don't blame marriage.
#6. To: Lysander_Spooner (#0)
As long as marriage remains an institution designed to suck the lifeblood out of men for the benefit of lawyers, the government and women, it will continue to weaken until it meets its well-deserved demise.
#7. To: PSUSA (#5)
Getting married is the dumbest thing a man can do, imo, and it looks like men are finally wising up.
#8. To: angK (#7)
The Feminist movement was responsible for causing a lot of female hostility
between towards men because women were stupid enough to believe the O.G. feminists. So don't be shocked that there's some blowback.
#9. To: Lysander_Spooner (#0)
Marriage Sinks to New Low, Recession Blamed…
#10. To: All (#9)
#11. To: abraxas (#6)
#12. To: tom007 (#9)
#13. To: Lysander_Spooner, abraxas (#11)
While that can be true it is likely about 98% males getting the hose job and 2% of the females
#14. To: Turtle (#13)
#15. To: Lysander_Spooner (#14)
#16. To: Lysander_Spooner (#11)
Feminists and greedy lawyers/judges have stacke deck, and we are not playing the game
#17. To: abraxas (#16)
This victim mentality doesn't work for me.....
#18. To: Lysander_Spooner (#17)
wearing slut gear, getting tossed around from guy to guy, while dreaming of marrying a rich guy, and going shopping on his credit card the rest of their lives.
#19. To: Lysander_Spooner (#17)
If you support the present system it based entirely on women being the victim.
#20. To: Turtle (#15)
women who think it is okay raise children by themselves, without a father
#21. To: Lysander_Spooner (#17)
#22. To: Turtle (#15)
I have never ceased to be amazed at the number of women who think it is okay raise children by themselves, without a father,
#23. To: Lysander_Spooner (#20)
In mother-only families, children tend to experience short-and long-term economic and psychological disadvantages; higher absentee rates at school, lower levels of education, and higher dropout rates (with boys more negatively affected than girls); and more delinquent activity, including alcohol and drug addiction.
#24. To: abraxas (#22)
#25. To: Turtle (#24)
No, history has shown men can raise children by themselves far better than women can raise them by themselves.
#26. To: abraxas (#19)
1. Plus, it's different in each state. If you live in a fault state, it's best to understand what this means and act accordingly.
#27. To: abraxas (#21)
In fact, less than 1% of pre-nups get thrown out in court.
#28. To: Lysander_Spooner (#26)
It is a fact that 75% of divorces are initiated by women
#29. To: abraxas, Turtle (#25)
No, history has shown men can raise children by themselves far better than women can raise them by themselves. Show me the history on this. Put up the research to validate your opinion
#30. To: Lysander_Spooner (#26)
In my case I fired 10 attornies, one robbed me of $10,000, they were all louses, and crooks
#31. To: Turtle (#28)
#32. To: Lysander_Spooner (#29)
#33. To: abraxas (#30)
65% of all second marriages fail.
#34. To: Lysander_Spooner (#27)
#35. To: Lysander_Spooner (#29)
"Father-Child Reunion" by William Farrell.
#36. To: Lysander_Spooner (#29)
#37. To: abraxas (#34)
(Edited)
#38. To: abraxas (#36)
three conditions prevail: equally-shared parenting (or joint custody); close parental proximity; and no bad-mouthing
#39. To: Lysander_Spooner (#38)
#40. To: Lysander_Spooner (#37)
#41. To: Lysander_Spooner (#37)
In todays environment I would need a small fortune in gold as ransom from my partner in civil union to sign. Say like $1,000,000 in gold bullion to even begin to think about it.
#42. To: abraxas (#40)
(Edited)
#43. To: Lysander_Spooner, abraxas (#42)
#44. To: Lysander_Spooner (#42)
#45. To: abraxas (#44)
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