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Title: Two Wars and We Don't Feel a Draft - The benefits of a volunteer military
Source:
Reason Magazine
URL Source: http://reason.com/archives/2010/10/18/two-wars-and-we-dont-feel-a-dr
Published: Oct 18, 2010
Author: Steve Chapman
Post Date: 2010-10-19 18:59:33 by F.A. Hayek Fan
Keywords: None
Views: 460
Comments: 31
In war as in life, what doesn't happen is often as significant as what does. The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, with their setbacks, victories, and casualties, have many things in common with past American wars. But there is one big thing missing this time: the draft. Hendrik Hertzberg noted recently in The New Yorker magazine that "for the first time in a century, America is fighting a long war—indeed, two long wars, each longer than our participation in both World Wars put together—without conscription." A few decades ago, the draft was a requirement for any major military undertaking. No one would have dreamed of fighting the Germans and Japanese, or the North Koreans and Chinese, without calling up young men for mandatory service. Not until the waning years of the Vietnam War did the nation elect to rely entirely on volunteers. It was a controversial step, and one whose durability was very much in doubt. But in the intervening decades, the draft has gone from being indispensable to being unthinkable. Even the extraordinary demands of two difficult wars have not induced a reconsideration. That change represents a sort of throwback to the early days of the republic. When President James Madison proposed conscription for the War of 1812, New Hampshire's Daniel Webster rose on the House floor in eloquent opposition. "Where is it written in the Constitution, in what article or section is it contained, that you may take children from their parents, and parents from their children, and compel them to fight the battles of any war in which the folly or wickedness of government may engage it?" he demanded. That was the end of that idea, until the Civil War. It's true that legislation to restore the draft has been introduced repeatedly by Rep. Charles Rangel (D-N.Y.), but without the slightest expectation that Congress would take him up on it. There is simply no sentiment in either party in favor of the idea. It's not just that no one wants to bring back the bitter divisions and organized resistance the draft produced in the 1960s. It's also that we have established the clear superiority of a military composed of men and women who choose to serve. David Henderson, an economist who teaches at the Naval Postgraduate School in Monterey, Calif., says he sometimes asks his students, all officers, how many favor a return to conscription. "It's been zero for the last 15 years," he says. The common view is, "Why would I want people under me who don't want to be there?" No one would imagine you could run a private business with employees who are forced to take jobs there against their will. Imagine the difficulty of motivating them. Yet we used to run the Army that way. Back then, it was accepted wisdom that the draft was a more economical way of fighting a war, since soldiers didn't have to be paid much. But that belief was grossly mistaken. The first reason is that the draft doesn't reduce the cost of carrying on a war. It merely shifts it from taxpayers at large to able-bodied males, a saving for the federal budget but an enormous burden on conscripts. That's why the journalist Nicholas von Hoffman once urged, "Draft old men's money, not young men's bodies." Another is that it's a colossal waste to cycle large numbers of people, many of them poorly suited to military service, through the ranks for a couple of years just so they can bail out at the first opportunity. The all-volunteer force provides a far bigger return on training dollars, while enlisting men and women who want to do what soldiers do—including combat. There is no doubt that the current wars have put exceptional burdens on the active duty force as well as reservists—burdens far greater than they expected when they signed up. But future soldiers will have no illusions about what to expect, and they will adjust their choices to fit the new reality. Thanks to the abolition of the draft, if Americans want to keep making such heavy demands on the military, they will have to pay generously enough to get people to enlist and re-enlist. It was once a novel experiment: fielding a force to protect freedom without grossly violating freedom by dragooning young men to serve. But it's worked so well we've almost forgotten there's an alternative.
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#1. To: All (#0)
(Edited)
I disagree. There is no other alternative, at least not if the two party fraud want to continue the two wars they are profiting from. If there were a draft over these bullshit wars, then the American people would be up in arms and the scum in Washington DC well know it. Therefore, no draft. The American people don't give a shit about these wars one way or the other right now because they do not think it affects them. They don't care about their loss of liberties or about the effect it is having on the economy. Their thinking is that "it ain't their kids coming home in body bags" or "they volunteered, no one forced them," In other words, "it sucks to be them, what's on TV tonight?". I don't know how many times I've read these type of sentiments from so-called conservative "patriots" on TOS1 and TOS2.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
TOS1 & TOS2 is where you should be spending your time. You'd be a perfect match with those freaks.
You are the parasite who spent his entire adult life working for that which he claims to hate. You are the one who receives a retirement check from that which he claims to hate. You are the one allow that which you claim to hate to pay your medical bills. LOL! LOSER! No, I'd say that those sites fit you much more than me you government worshiping POS.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
There two words that fit together... DRAFT AND CHINESE... There will be a draft and as usual, the unwashed masses will fight the war. That has never changed.
The REAL reason their has been no draft is because we have invaded nation with no real armies. Do not forget these people we fight surrender to news crews. We have predator drones and laser guided missiles. They have Allah. It is a very one sided war. We are killing them
True. However, one mistake and we are in deep horsefeathers if we need grunts on the ground by the plane load.
??? come on now, we have already made plenty of mistakes. Why should we bring in more troops on planes when we can just remote control those planes to kill as many women and children as needed for the blood sacrifice from the safety and comfort office chairs ?
That's a good point, however, I still do not believe that the American people would put up with their children being forced to join the military and possibly die in a war that has nothing at all to do with our national security. It's one thing for others children to volunteer to fight and die. They just turn their mind from it without giving it serious thought. Once their mothers, fathers, children and grandchildren begin coming home in body bags however, the masses will begin to give these wars the scrutiny deserved years ago. Do not forget these people we fight surrender to news crews. I do not believe that this has happened since the first Gulf War. It is a very one sided war. We are killing them I agree.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
Go Saints.
The noblest man will marry the lowest daughter of a base family, if only she brings in money. And a lady will share her bed with a foul rich man, preferring gold to pedigree. Money is all. Good breeds with bad and race is lost. -- Theognis
The American Revolution Primary Name of Conflict Dates of Conflict News Story 1975 (May 15) "Operation Earnest Will"
Bullshit. The REAL reason is that [since South Vietnam] America has been able to afford a foreign military based upon the concept of "mercenaries." Well, the budget is isn't there anymore to provide the expenditures for far-off political gestures. And, it is about time!
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
We have been fortunate since Vietnam that all of our adventures have not morphed into major conflicts requiring large numbers of grunts on the ground. One miscalculation and we will be in a world of hurt. Should North Korea for instance move South once again, there is NO way we could stop them on the ground. Our only salvation would be to destroy the entire infrastructure of the North without the use of nuclear weapons.
GOOD! Let South Korea worry about their own borders. For about sixty years, America has been in South Korea too long.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
Indeed. It wont happen however. This government wants to maintain a foothold on the Asian mainland.
It wont happen however. This government wants to maintain a foothold on the Asian mainland. Bingo. Americans are interventionists and until that can be changed (good luck with that given our history) we will have our nose in other peoples affairs. Sad but nevertheless true.
Why did you limit your perspective to Asia? America has an entire world to conquer. "we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
If you watch MacArthurs farewell speech, he pointedly makes the remark that, "only a fool would engage in land warfare in Asia". We did, lost both times, and we are still there looking for trouble.
We did, lost both times, and we are still there looking for trouble. At the moment, the major thrust of 0bama is to carry our nation forward into the ME ... Afghanistan, to be be exact. BY GOD, THE WORLD NEEDS FREE OIL AND PIPELINES. Everyone has lost encroaching into Afghanistan. The downfall of the USSR was about the same. As a people, we have a problem in America; we think that electing "new" leaders shall change things or alter the course of the future. Yet, despite the fantastick happy smiles every election from every governing politician, the situation worsens and as a result we stand wondering what happened... Nobody admits the truth, however. And when the truth is diminished with smiles and balloons about our failures we are destined to ruin.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
This is two years olde, assessment for China. We are making war in Chinas back yard, MacArthur was right. PERSONNEL Total Population: 1,330,044,544 [2008] Population Available: 729,323,673 [2008] Fit for Military Service: 609,273,077 [2008] Reaching Military Age Annually: 20,470,412 [2008] Active Military Personnel: 2,255,000 [2008] Active Military Reserve: 800,000 [2008] Active Paramilitary Units: 3,969,000 [2008] What fools we are.
America's problems are not so much about our own military. Nope, that isn't the issue at all; the REAL issue is the way politicians have shoved upon our military leaders a pile of shit for the world's exploits since WW2. I am still shell shocked over Vietnam .... although it is considered a minor footnote in history, I still sweat at night waking up to the reality of my ass almost caught. And when I wake up, I wonder what was it all for? Just a pile of politicians and their club of associated lobbyists, that often have no standing in the art of war .... they laff it all off renewing a contract.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
And how very silly it is of people to ignore history. We both recall the days when China was called Red China. Nothing has changed since those days except that they are now more powerful. Their global ambition is being honed as we speak.
In reality it is. At any given time the military has a list of who and what is expendable, can be written off in case someone calls our bluff. No one but a fool would be on the Asian mainland with 35,000 grunts. In case of major ground war, those people would be written off. Our cupboard is bare and empty. Also one must consider the military and government as one unit as did Eisenhower, one is the brain, the other is the muscle General butler spoke about.
They are patient people, no hurry. They have no worries. They are the worlds strongest country financially, strongest military (via manpower), there is little civil unrest, as they rule with an iron fist. No one is going to invade their country. NO ONE. They have everything going their way, so there is no reason to hurry.
And they aren't weakened culturally by the failed multicultural agenda. We're a laughingstock.
It is strange how Congress erects an unforgettable statue or tribute at taxpayer expense while those that sacrificed their own lives receive a coffin, correct?
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
Yes.
The disparity (or otherwise comic_relief) about Congress is about those that pretend to honour this nation because they have some sort of upbringing that commands attention. Meanwhile, those same Congresscritters are happy and content to pose our BEST into a battlefield for nothingmore than a quip from the CIA. Yet, nothing has changed other than America is drowned in more debt, sorrow and grief.
"we ought to lay off the criticism" -- Pinguinite, circa 2010-05-26 22:17:22 ET
The only thing more disgusting than to support a draft to win a war, is to support a draft to lose a war.
Your comment has nothing whatsoever to do with the contents of the article. It's obvious you didn't read it.
"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Director, CIA 1973–1976 Nothing in the State, everything outside the State, everything against the State - Jan Lester, Escape From Leviathan "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that justifies it." - Frederic Bastiat Good order results spontaneously when things are let alone. - Zhuangzi
It was once a novel experiment: fielding a force to protect freedom without grossly violating freedom by dragooning young men to serve. But it's worked so well we've almost forgotten there's an alternative.
#2. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#1)
I don't know how many times I've read these type of sentiments from so-called conservative "patriots" on TOS1 and TOS2.
#3. To: LACUMO (#2)
TOS1 & TOS2 is where you should be spending your time. You'd be a perfect match with those freaks.
#4. To: LACUMO (#2)
or the North Koreans and Chinese,
#5. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
#6. To: titorite (#5)
It is a very one sided war. We are killing them
#7. To: Cynicom (#6)
However, one mistake and we are in deep horsefeathers if we need grunts on the ground by the plane load.
#8. To: titorite (#5)
The REAL reason their has been no draft is because we have invaded nation with no real armies.
#9. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#3)
#10. To: Cynicom (#6)
War is American as apple pie, unfortunately. Subtract out our Revolution, the War of 1812 and the Civil War (from a Southern perspective) and they were all a waste. In my lifetime, we've been involved in more than 20 wars, excluding the Cold War. Such a foreign policy won't be voted away in one fell swoop. Elections, at best, influence domestic policy.
1775-1783
The Indian Wars
1775-1890
Shay's Rebellion
1786-1787
Rebellion
Anti-(state)Government Rebels vs. Massachusetts
The Whiskey Rebellion
1794
Rebellion
Anti-Tax Rebels in Western Pennsylvania
Quasi-War With France
1798-1800
Inter-State (Naval) War
France
Fries's Rebellion "The Hot Water War"
1799
Rebellion
Anti-Tax Rebels in Pennsylvania
The Barbary Wars
1800-1815
Inter-State War
The Barbary States
(Tripoli, Algiers & Morocco)
The War of 1812
1812-1815
Inter-State War
Great Britain
The Growing & Troubled Republic
(U.S. Involvement Only)
Type of Conflict Primary Opponent(s)
of the United States
Mexican-American War
1846-1848
Inter-State War
Mexico
U.S. Slave Rebellions
1800-1865
Slave Rebellions
Various Slave groups
"Bleeding Kansas"
1855-1860
Civil War (state of Kansas)
Pro-Slavery vs. Anti-Slavery Kansans
Brown's Raid on Harper's Ferry
1859
Rebellion
Anti-Slavery Rebels (Led by John Brown)
United States Civil War
1861-1865
Civil War
United States (The North)
vs.
The Confederate States (The South)
U.S. Intervention in Hawaiian Revolution
1893
Internal Rebellion & Foreign Intervention
The Spanish-American War
1898
Inter-State War
U.S. Intervention in Samoan Civil War
1898-1899
Civil War & Foreign Intervention
U.S.-Philippine War
1899-1902
Colonial War, War of Imperialism
Boxer Rebellion
1900
Internal Rebellion & Foreign Intervention
Chinese Government & "Boxer" Rebels
The Moro Wars
1901-1913
Colonial Wars
Philippine Muslim Rebels
U.S. Intervention in Panamanian Revolution
1903
Secessionist Revolution & Foreign Intervention
Colombia
The Banana Wars
1909-1933
Civil Wars & Foreign Intervention
Various Rebel Groups In Central America
U.S. Occupation of Vera Cruz
1914
Inter-State War
Mexico
Pershing's Raid Into Mexico
1916-1917
Inter-State, Border War
Mexican Government & Mexican Rebels ("Bandits")
World War I
1917-1918 (American involvement only)
Inter-State War
Germany
Allied Intervention in Russian Civil War
1919-1921
Civil War & Foreign Intervention
Russian Bolshevik (Soviet) Government
World War II
1941-1945 (American involvement only)
Inter-State War
Germany, Japan & Italy
The Cold War
1945-1991
Global Inter-State Cold War
The Soviet Union & Communist China
The Korean War
1950-1953
Inter-State War
North Korea & China
The Second Indochina War "Vietnam War"
1956-1975
Civil War, Inter-State War
North Vietnam & South Vietnamese "Viet Cong" Rebels
U.S. Intervention in Lebanon
1958
Civil War & Foreign Intervention
No real foe for U.S. Troops landed to support Lebanon Gov.
Dominican Intervention
1965
Civil War & Foreign Intervention
Rebels in the Dominican Republic
The Mayaguez Rescue Operation
Hostage Rescue & Inter-State Conflict
Khmer Rouge Guerrillas (the new government of Cambodia)
Iranian Hostage Rescue "Desert One" or "Operation Eagle Claw"
1980 (April 25)
Hostage Rescue & Inter-State Conflict
Iran
U.S. Libya Conflict
1981, 1986
Inter-State War
Libya
U.S. Intervention in Lebanon
1982-1984
Civil War,Foreign Intervention & Inter-State War
Syria & Various Muslim and Leftist Lebanese Militias
U.S. Invasion of Grenada
1983
Inter-State War
Marxist Grenadian Faction & Cuba
The Tanker War
1987-1988
Inter-State War
Iran
U.S. Invasion of Panama
1989
Inter-State War
Panama
Second Persian Gulf War "Operation Desert Storm"
1991
Inter-State War
Iraq
"No-Fly Zone" War
1991-2003
Inter-State War
Iraq
U.S. Intervention in Somalia
1992-1994
Civil War & Foreign Intervention
Various Somali Militias
NATO Intervention in Bosnia (Operation Deliberate Force) Summary
1994-1995
Civil War,Foreign Intervention & Inter-State War
Bosnian Serb Rebels
U.S. Occupation of Haiti
1994
Foreign Intervention
Haitian Government
U.S. Embassy bombings and strikes on Afghanistan and Sudan (The bin Laden War)
August, 1998
Terrorist Conflict
"Desert Fox" Campaign (part of U.S./Iraq Conflict)
December, 1998
Inter-State War
Iraq
Kosovo War
1999
Civil War, Foreign Intervention & Inter-State War
Yugoslavia/Serbia
Attack on the USS Cole
October 12, 2000
Terrorist Conflict
Terrorists associated with Osama bin Laden
Attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon
September 11, 2001
Terrorist Conflict
Osama bin Laden's al-Qaida organization
Afghanistan War (Operation Enduring Freedom)
October 7, 2001-Present
War against Terrorism
The Taliban and Osama bin Laden's Al-Qaida organization
Third Persian Gulf War "Operation Iraqi Freedom"
March 19, 2003-Present
Inter-State War
Iraq
#11. To: titorite (#5)
The REAL reason their [there] has been no draft is because we have invaded nation with no real armies.
#12. To: Prefrontal Vortex (#9)
(Edited)
#13. To: Jethro Tull (#10)
#14. To: Cynicom (#13)
Should North Korea for instance move South once again, there is NO way we could stop them on the ground.
#15. To: buckeroo (#14)
GOOD! Let South Korea worry about their own borders. For about sixty years, America has been in South Korea too long.
#16. To: Cynicom (#15)
Indeed.
#17. To: Cynicom (#15)
This government wants to maintain a foothold on the Asian mainland.
#18. To: buckeroo, 4 (#17)
hegemony, bump
#19. To: buckeroo (#17)
Why did you limit your perspective to Asia? America has an entire world to conquer.
#20. To: Cynicom (#19)
If you watch MacArthurs farewell speech, he pointedly makes the remark that, "only a fool would engage in land warfare in Asia".
#21. To: buckeroo, Jethro tull (#20)
with smiles and balloons about our failures we are destined to ruin.
#22. To: Cynicom (#21)
#23. To: Cynicom (#21)
(Edited)
What fools we are.
#24. To: buckeroo (#22)
America's problems are not so much about our own military.
#25. To: Jethro Tull (#23)
Their global ambition is being honed as we speak.
#26. To: Cynicom (#25)
#27. To: Cynicom (#24)
At any given time the military has a list of who and what is expendable, can be written off in case someone calls our bluff.
#28. To: buckeroo (#27)
It is strange how Congress erects an unforgettable statue or tribute at taxpayer expense while those that sacrificed their own lives receive a coffin, correct?
#29. To: Cynicom (#28)
#30. To: F.A. Hayek Fan (#0)
Two Wars and We Don't Feel a Draft - The benefits of a volunteer military
#31. To: PaulCJ (#30)
The only thing more disgusting than to support a draft to win a war, is to support a draft to lose a war.
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