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Title: Upon further review Joe Paterno rose to the occasion while everyone else sunk.
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://tominpaine.blogspot.com/2011 ... eview-joe-paterno-rose-to.html
Published: Nov 29, 2011
Author: Marc Rubin
Post Date: 2011-11-29 15:14:37 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 787
Comments: 109

Two major events have occurred since the firing of Joe Paterno which prove that the news media are not only incompetent and dishonest but hypocritical beyond anything anyone would have thought possible.

And both revelations are about as damning as could be imagined both against ESPN, whose commentators condemnation of Paterno and demands for his firing were some of the loudest, and the school officials at Central Mountain high school, where Sandusky's Victim One went to school.

The first revelation concerns the molestation charges against Syracuse assistant coach Bernie Fine.One of Fine's accusers secretly tape recorded a phone conversation he had with Fine's wife in 2002 in which the sexual contact with Fine was discussed and where Fine's wife admitted she knew everything her husband had been doing. Fine's accuser says he took the tape to the Syracuse Post Standard in 2002 along with his allegations against Fine and played the audio tape for them. The newspaper declined to report the allegations saying that, even with the tape they wanted more corroborating evidence before they would report it. In other words the Syracuse Post Standard gave more of the benefit of the doubt to an accused child molester than the news media in general gave to Joe Paterno, a man with a polished solid gold reputation for 60 years. And there has been no outcry by any of the sanctimonious self-serving members of the media who railed against Joe Paterno focused on the Post Standard for "having knowledge of" sexual abuse and not reporting it.

It gets a lot worse. It has also been revealed that the victim took the same audio tape to ESPN more than ten years ago with his allegations against Fine and played the tape for them, No one at ESPN did a thing. any child protective agency. They did nothing. For ten years.

This is the same ESPN whose commentators called for Joe Paterno's firing immediately for, in their factually challenged hypocritical world, "not going to the authorities". The same ESPN whose commentators said Joe Paterno going to the administrative head of campus police the next day with McQueary's non-specific report wasn't enough. The same ESPN who accused Joe Paterno without a shred of proof, of being aware of child sexual abuse and "not doing enough". The same ESPN that had an audio tape confirming from the mouth of the abuser's own wife, the sexual abuse of a ball boy at Syracuse university. And did nothing.

And are the same sanctimonious self-righteous group of journalists insisting that anyone at ESPN who had been aware of those tapes for the last ten years and who is still with ESPN be fired? No. Of course not.

We now know that the same media types both on television and in print who smeared Joe Paterno on their front pages with the word "Shame", without a shred of proof, did absolutely nothing when put in Paterno's shoes.

Unfortunately the second set of revelations makes it even worse for the media

New revelations were made by the mother of Sandsusky's Victim One that will forever shame even further everyone in the news media who attacked Paterno as well as the trustees of Penn State who buckled under the pressure exerted by the media mob and threw Paterno over the side to quiet them down.

Keep in mind that the fictional narrative by the press in their attack on Paterno, their reason for demanding he be fired was that he had knowledge of sexual abuse and didn't do enough when it came to reporting it, ( something that has already been proved to be a factual lie).

According to the mother, in a piece that can be read here, the principal of the high school her son attended, Karen Probst, was present in 2002 when her son openly accused Sandusky of molesting him and not only did the the school principle do nothing, according to the mother the principle actually tried to talk her and her son out of reporting it.

Additionally, according to the mother, Steve Turchetta, the boy's high school coach in 2002, repeatedly allowed Sandusky to come to the school and take the boy out of school not only without parental consent but without even any parental notification. And Turchetta continued to allow Sandusky to take the boy out of school even after the mother found out and protested.

The mother states that eventually there was a meeting at the school after the boy had told all to a school counselor and had gotten so emotional they finally believed him. At that meeting the mother states that when she insisted they go to the police, the school officials tried to talk her out of it. They told her to think about it and think about what the accusations could do to her family.

All of this information was available at any time any real journalist wanted to take the time to actually investigate and learn the facts. But all of them, like Sean Gregory at Time Magazine, Andy Staples at Sports Illustrated and just about everyone at ESPN except Lou Holtz, were too busy smearing Paterno to bother. It was Paterno they went after. Because it was Joe Paterno's picture that sold newspapers and got web hits, not Karen Probst's.It was going after Paterno that made the very small and sanctimonious feel very big.

The irony is, that in the end, Joe Paterno did more and with less knowledge, and did it faster than anyone connected to either the Sandusky allegations or the Bernie Fine allegations, all of whom had more knowledge that he did.

And isn't it ironic ( or perhaps par for the course) that ESPN, whose commentators like Jay Bailes and others were some of the most vocal for saying Paterno didn't do enough, had an audio tape that contained an admission of the sexual abuse of a Syracuse ball boy for ten years and did nothing.

So what will ESPN do now? Will they accuse themselves of "not doing enough"? Will they accuse themselves of allowing a sexual predator to remain free? Will there be any media condemnation by others of ESPN?Anyone hear any media condemnation? Anyone demanding people at ESPN be fired? Or will they all hide under their sheets?

So now class lets review the facts: Joe Paterno the day after getting a non-specific non detailed sanitized version of events from McQueary went to the administrative head of the Penn State campus police with Mc Queary's allegations against a man he knew and worked with closely for 26 years, without hesitating or calling Sandusky to get his side of the story. Karen Probst, Victim One's high school principle, Steve Turchetta his high school coach, the school's assistant principle, the school guidance counselor, Ray Gricar, the DA at the time who declined to prosecute, the Syracuse Post-Standard, and ESPN all had specific allegations and in the case of the Fine, a tape recorded admission of child sexual abuse and did absolutely nothing for years. These are some of the people who yelled the loudest about Joe Paterno and moral responsibility. These are some of the people who demanded Joe Paterno be fired for not doing more.

People are angry about what happened to Paterno. They should be angrier now and should demand not only the restoration of Paterno's reputation, they should demand retributions.

Journalists to be fired. Journalists who accused Paterno without any proof. And anyone who had knowledge of the events involving Sandusky and Fine. And that includes journalists.

There should be demands that Sean Gregory at Time Magazine who wrote that Joe Paterno "knew a ten year old boy was being raped in a shower and didn't report it to authorities" with no evidence to substantiate it be fired. So should his editor for allowing Gregory's dishonest report to be printed. So should an ESPN columnist named Jemele Hill who wrote his own dishonest column about Paterno. Anyone at ESPN with knowledge of the Bernie Fine tape should be suspended or fired. The two senators in Pennsylvania, Democrat Bob Casey and Republican Pat Toomey should be eviscerated, their offices deluged with phone calls for withdrawing their sponsorship of Paterno for the Medal of Freedom without any facts, just acting like spineless politicians reacting to the mob . And last but not least every trustee at Penn State who voted to fire Joe Paterno, which is all of them, should resign. They are the people who disgraced Penn State, not Joe Paterno.

The Penn State trustees made a mockery of every value that a university tries to instill in its students and proved, ironically that the trustees can't be trusted. They should all in good conscience, resign. If not their resignations should be demanded since it was they, not Joe Paterno who betrayed the values of Penn State,denying Paterno any form of due process and capitulating to a dishonest incompetent mob of journalists.

The day after Paterno was fired, students at Penn State demonstrated and demonstrated angrily. They knew, as college students tend to know, that a gross injustice had been done to Joe Paterno and they were motivated by something that the Penn State trustees and those in the news media either lost a long time ago or never had in the first place -- ideals.

The students at Penn State saw that the ideals preached at Penn State were trampled on by a mob of out of control self-serving journalists and a spineless collection of trustees. And they were justifiably angry. They knew a gross injustice had been done. The factually challenged Stuart Scott, reporting on the demonstrations for ESPN said of the demonstrators, "Don't they get it"? Here is a flash to Stuart Scott and the rest of the news media. They got it. You didn't.

When Paterno was given the sanitized version of the event in the shower by McQueary he went straight to the administrative head of campus police, the police agency that had the jurisdiction over any crime committed on the campus of Penn State. Joe Paterno went to the proper authority, he went immediately and he went as high as he could go. The news media, the Penn State trustees, the politicians, ESPN and everyone else who attacked Joe Paterno, given the opportunity, went as low as they could go. They will be remembered for it. And they should all lose their jobs. But before they go, they owe Joe Paterno one big apology.

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#1. To: christine (#0)

Joe Paterno went to the proper authority, he went immediately and he went as high as he could go.

Nice to see Marc Rubin carrying Joe Paterno's water.

The articles author, Marc Rubin, is a lying MF'er. Joe Paterno knew the game was rigged when Sandusky THE JEW wasn't arrested within a couple of days Joe snitching on him. A man gets arrested for watching child-porn on an airplane but Sandusky THE JEW keeps creeping around the Penn State campus for years and years?? No, Paterno should have gone to the police department after Penn State DID NOTHING. Joe Paterno should be flogged to death, along with all the other accomplices in this multi-year crime-spree by Sandusky THE JEW.

“With the exception of Whites, the rule among the peoples of the world, whether residing in their homelands or settled in Western democracies, is ethnocentrism and moral particularism: they stick together and good means what is good for their ethnic group."
-Alex Kurtagic

X-15  posted on  2011-11-29   15:53:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: christine (#0)

There are no reporters today; there are only reactors.

Break the Conventions - Keep the Commandments - G.K.Chesterson

Lod  posted on  2011-11-29   15:56:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: christine, 4um (#0)

It was going after Paterno that made the very small and sanctimonious feel very big.

My he sure does sound "sanctimonious"!

So that is why this story made me want to throw up things I'd eaten last month. It was so I could feel "very big".

Paterno for pope! We need such a holy righteous man in the vatican! What a wonderful man he is. So wonderful. The salt of the Earth he is. A true beacon lighting the way for humanity. He'll get rid of those pedo priests! He'll call security on them! Maybe. Unless that priest is a football coach, and/or brings in lots of money.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2011-11-29   15:57:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: PSUSA2 (#3)

Paterno for pope! We need such a holy righteous man in the vatican! What a wonderful man he is. So wonderful.

He went to the top of the campus police who have jurisdiction over what happens on campus. What more did you expect him to do, and why aren't you as upset over the lack of ANY reporting by the ESPN staff and those at the newspaper who were made aware of abuse, along with the lack of ANY effort by the high school principle who was informed of the rape of one of his students?

I would also have to wonder about why the guy who made the tape, in that HE didn't report the situation straight to the police...


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   16:01:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: All (#2)

Don't campus cops have the responsibility/duty to report allegations of felony offenses to either the city cops or the county sheriff, or both?

Break the Conventions - Keep the Commandments - G.K.Chesterson

Lod  posted on  2011-11-29   16:07:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Lod (#5)

Don't campus cops have the responsibility/duty to report allegations of felony offenses to either the city cops or the county sheriff, or both?

They had to have know about it in '98. If the D.A. Gricar knew, then the cops did too.

formerly GJones.

InsideJob  posted on  2011-11-29   16:17:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: PSUSA2 (#3) (Edited)

It was going after Paterno that made the very small and sanctimonious feel very big.

I see the sanctimonious are still going after Joe Paterno. We see evidence of the news organizations and even law enforcement getting a pass. None of you even mention the shortcomings and refusals to do their job. You are still putting the blame on Paterno. They are the ones who help this predator to continue molesting and harming other young boys.

Apparently many of you still don't get it. Our sons went to Slippery Rock University and the campus police were the law on campus. They carry firearms, handcuffs, tasers, night sticks, and pepper spray. When needed, they call in the boro police and or the Pennsylvania Police to help in any situation that demands it. Paterno did the right thing and as the writer says, he did his job and he did it right away. All the others failed the molested children including the present Governor who had knowledge of the molestations when he was PA attorney general. He was one of the loudest calling for Paterno's hide. I'm sure he did so to deflect any guilt on his part.

If this is investigated properly, there are many who are complicit in these molestations by their failure to act quickly and properly. They made Joe Paterno one of the victims! The writer got it spot on. Too bad you and others can't see it.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   16:28:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: FormerLurker (#4)

He went to the top of the campus police who have jurisdiction over what happens on campus. What more did you expect him to do,

If that is true, then why not call the real police. If local police didn't have jurisdiction, I'm sure that the state police did.

and why aren't you as upset over the lack of ANY reporting by the ESPN staff and those at the newspaper who were made aware of abuse, along with the lack of ANY effort by the high school principle who was informed of the rape of one of his students?

I remember when I was a kid I'd try that excuse on my mom. It didn't work. She'd say "If so and so jumped off a cliff, would you follow?". I'd say "so and so's body would cushion my fall". Then I'd get sent to my room.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2011-11-29   16:30:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: christine (#0)

it never fucking ends with Denial State and their precious joe pathetic football program. joe pa knew damn good and well what was going on probably much further back than '98 when he shitcanned jerry's high flying at the time coaching career.

they should flood 'happy' valley and create a tourist attraction. ridiculous.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   16:32:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: All (#9) (Edited)

from the coaches to the fans to the admin to the campus cops to the boosters. Pe## State sucks. to the prosecutors to the governor to God knows where else. Pennsylvania sucks.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   16:35:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: ambi (#7)

We see evidence of the news organizations and even law enforcement getting a pass. None of you even mention the shortcomings and refusals to do their job.

Oh really? Perhaps not on this thread. But not on other threads.

If this is investigated properly, there are many who are complicit in these molestations by their failure to act quickly and properly. They made Joe Paterno one of the victims!

Poor poor joe. Although he knew, and therefore was complicit, it is an illustrious football career, flushed like yesterdays meal down the Toilet of Life. Oh the tragedy! A football legacy destroyed!

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2011-11-29   16:37:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Lod (#5) (Edited)

Don't campus cops have the responsibility/duty to report allegations of felony offenses to either the city cops or the county sheriff, or both?

.yes they do and to the state police and child welfare services. Joe Paterno was the only one who did what he was supposed to do and he did it immediately. It appears the coverup was started even before Paterno knew anything and you can be sure it was the higherups that took a few years to put their plan of damage control in place and make Paterno a victim along with the molested boys.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   16:38:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: ambi (#12)

disgusting


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   16:40:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: InsideJob (#6)

If the D.A. Gricar knew, then the cops did too.

Doh.

(Beating my head with hammer.)

Thanks.

Break the Conventions - Keep the Commandments - G.K.Chesterson

Lod  posted on  2011-11-29   16:44:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: PSUSA2 (#11)

Poor poor joe. Although he knew, and therefore was complicit, it is an illustrious football career, flushed like yesterdays meal down the Toilet of Life. Oh the tragedy! A football legacy destroyed!

Your attempt at humor should be posted on a thread dealing with humor. But since you aren't that funny, maybe you should just be silent on this issue until it is properly concluded.

Still nothing from you but Paterno bashing. You give all the others a pass. Did Paterno and one of his Nittany Lions reams beat your school in a game; a bowl? That would explain your blind obsession of blaming only Paterno. ...........small minds............

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   16:45:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: ambi (#15)

no more sweeping this under. we're going to press for every single bastard cockroach to be exposed in the light of truth that's on board the PE## STATE train. and hopefully expose more and more pedos/pedo rings. fuck'em to hell.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   16:47:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: All (#16)

people of right mind can look into this superficially and see what a cluster fuck those defending the indefensible are mired in. i say the deniers might be abuse victims or abusers. more investigation might be necessary.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   16:50:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: X-15 (#1)

this is ALL just a BIG CONSPIRACY against penn state and joe paterno. /supersarcasm

they should have immediately cancelled their season and fired everyone around.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   16:54:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: ambi (#15)

Your attempt at humor should be posted on a thread dealing with humor. But since you aren't that funny, maybe you should just be silent on this issue until it is properly concluded.

I dont find one single thing to be "funny" about this entire situation. I'm just a sarcastic prick sometimes, or most times.

You give all the others a pass.

No I don't.

Did Paterno and one of his Nittany Lions reams beat your school in a game; a bowl? That would explain your blind obsession of blaming only Paterno. ...........small minds............

Yeah. And you're a Pedd State fan? Alumni? Professor? Football coach? Player?

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2011-11-29   16:55:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: All (#18)

let the players transfer out with immediate eligibility.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   16:56:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Rotara (#9)

it never fucking ends with Denial State and their precious joe pathetic football program. joe pa knew damn good and well what was going on probably much further back than '98 when he shitcanned jerry's high flying at the time coaching career.

Why did you wait to accuse Paterno now? Just think, you may have save some boys from being molested. This is not a humor thread. They like humor on tos and lp. Here we try and show some intelligence. According to you and some others on here, Joe Paterno is being tried while Sandusky is running loose and possibably still molesting other boys. What a sleuth you are!.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   16:57:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: Rotara (#10)

Pennsylvania sucks.

by that logic, so do all 50 states. you know as well as i that child abuse and exploitation is a systemic problem. you better believe that there are plenty of peds shaking in their shoes hoping their victims don't come forth..and i believe Freeh has been hired to protect the biggest perps in this one.

christine  posted on  2011-11-29   16:57:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: PSUSA2 (#19)

thank God my up and down team, Nebraska, went into this child raping valley and WON right at the height of the bubble bursting. i applaud my guys for going into that SHIT storm and getting a tough tough win. we were 'the team playing at PSU'. ! PE## STATE wanted to literally march the game ball to joePed's house had they beat us. WIN FOR JOE ! yikes


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:00:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Rotara (#18)

they should have immediately cancelled their season and fired everyone around.

why should the current innocent athletes, students, etc be punished for something they had nothing whatsoever to do with?

christine  posted on  2011-11-29   17:01:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: christine (#22)

they're all pretty bad. right now though pennsylvania's long held lack of concern over pedofilia versus their football god makes them the mark for '11 and '12.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:01:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: christine (#24)

the sins of their community i guess.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:02:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: christine (#24)

why should the current innocent athletes, students, etc be punished for something they had nothing whatsoever to do with?

the student athletes should be able to continue on with no other repercussions. just not at the pe## state football temple. the house joe built and destroyed.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:04:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: All (#25)

right now though pennsylvania's long held lack of concern over pedofilia versus their football god makes them the mark for '11 and '12.

pennsylvania law looks like NAMBLA wrote it.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:05:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: PSUSA2 (#19)

Yeah. And you're a Pedd State fan? Alumni? Professor? Football coach? Player?

I'm just a housewife and could care less about football. I am however, skeptical of the kangaroo court that has been used against Paterno before the criminal Sandusky has not had his day in court and answer to the charges. We see all the time the quick vindictiveness like the 9-11 official coverup that led us into Iraq and an on going 10 year war and Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11. I bet you were one of those who went around screaming the towelheads did it. I guess you believe the governments take on 9-11. Just remember, first comes damage control, then the phony coverup, then the finger pointing, and then somebody gets thrown under the bus. They by-passed the other things and just threw Paterno under the bus. Sandusky is still free!

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   17:10:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: Rotara (#23)

we were 'the team playing at PSU'.

What's this we? You weren't playing in that game. You were only one of the retards cheering on Nebraska.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   17:13:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: ambi (#30)

fuck you ya dumb bitch.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:15:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: christine, Rotara (#24)

they should have immediately cancelled their season and fired everyone around.

why should the current innocent athletes, students, etc be punished for something they had nothing whatsoever to do with?

christine, your answer is a correct answer. Unfortunately you are replying to a moron who can't understand logic.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   17:16:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: ambi (#32)

you're so fucking stupid or naive i'm finding it hard to believe you access the world wide web without help.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:18:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: Rotara (#31)

fuck you ya dumb bitch.

The truth rattled ya huh??????

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   17:19:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: ambi (#34)

truth? truth ? you wouldn't know the truth if it ate you up. you're so pathetic i'm going to filter your shit from my screen.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   17:24:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: Rotara (#35)

truth? truth ? you wouldn't know the truth if it ate you up. you're so pathetic i'm going to filter your shit from my screen.

Do you mind if I call you Herb Cain? He's having aterrible time denying his affairs. You are having a tough time with the truth!

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   17:30:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: christine, rotara, ambi, FormerLurker, Eric Stratton, all (#0)

Once you run this article through the bullshit filter what you wind up with is:

Joe Paterno may have been less guilty than others. NOT Joe Paterno was not guilty.

Big difference that. Kind of on the order of being "a little bit pregnant" or "kinda' dead". It is a matter of degree of guilt not a degree of innocence.

That others knew also does not exculpate him. It means that others are equally, if not more, guilty of moral, if not legal, cowardice.

Methinks the apologists are getting desperate.

And my own speculation on why Paterno was hung out to dry so fast was that it was becoming apparent that there was no way to keep the crime from going public and it was an attempt to DIVERT away from the other guilty parties - particularly wealthy and well connected donors Peds.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   17:54:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: christine, Rotara, ambi, all (#24)

they should have immediately cancelled their season and fired everyone around.

why should the current innocent athletes, students, etc be punished for something they had nothing whatsoever to do with?

While it is unfortunate that the innocent will suffer some pain this was an institutional failure with wide participation in the cover-up at the school. It is fitting that the School, not necessarily the students and athletes, be held to account.

The nature of the crime suggests at least some of the punishment. The cover-up was as much to protect the school and Fu'boll program as it was to protect the filthy stinking degenerate Peds who committed the physical crimes. Not all of the crimes here were physical but also stemmed from moral cowardice and an unwillingness to do what was right.

There are remedies that could be applied for the athletes and students:

1. Allow the athletes to transfer to another school without loss of eligibility and even restoring this year's eligibility.

2. A refund to those students who choose the option of receiving a FULL refund of all tuition and fees.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   18:02:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Original_Intent (#38)

that would be fair.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:12:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Original_Intent (#37)

Joe Paterno may have been less guilty than others. NOT Joe Paterno was not guilty.

Paterno reported the crime as soon as he was made aware of it. What else did you expect him to do?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   18:24:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Rotara (#39)

I suspect that if option 2 were offered that Pe** State would suffer a great loss of students, perhaps as much as half the student body among the lower classes of Freshman and Sophomores.

Option 1 is more problematic in that a lot of the Student Semi-Pro Athletes might stay because it would not be worth their while and they would not be guaranteed, in most cases, a scholarship.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   18:25:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: christine (#22)

and i believe Freeh has been hired to protect the biggest perps in this one.

i definitely agree with that.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:28:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: FormerLurker (#40)

Joe Paterno may have been less guilty than others. NOT Joe Paterno was not guilty.

Paterno reported the crime as soon as he was made aware of it. What else did you expect him to do?

Exhibit some of that alleged great character when it became apparent that it was being covered up. Like I said it is a matter of degree not guilt or innocence. Yes he did the right thing in reporting it, but left unsaid and unmentioned is how long was he aware before he was forced to even report it? McQueary's report forced the issue. That does not mean he was not already aware. As well when it became apparent that the school would do nothing then it was his moral duty to use his pulpit, which was a powerful one, to make it public. Of course that would have realistically required great courage and moral fortitude. In other words he flunked the test.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   18:31:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: Original_Intent (#41)

99% of psu scholarship football athletes would have one next season too imo.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:32:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: Rotara (#44)

99% of psu scholarship football athletes would have one next season too imo.

That's difficult to say. This affair has such a big foul odor associated with it that other schools, who have their own skeletons, might be reluctant. Data insufficient to guess any further.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   18:37:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: Original_Intent (#43)

In other words he flunked the test.

Epic Fail


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:41:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: Original Intent, All (#41)

Why is it that the knee jerk reactions happen first?

We should all be appalled that Sandusky is running loose thanks to the jewish judge who volunteered and donated to the Second Mile. The average molester is usually arrested upon learning of his/her molestations and incarcerated until trial.

It is easy for us to prejudge and render our opinions as to what should or not be done. Up rooting students who are innocent of any wrong doing makes them victims too. Lets get Sandusky in the courtroom and go forward from there.

The football coach orchestrated the coverup and now has paid the price. /sarcasm

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   18:43:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: Original_Intent (#45)

no one blames the players. these are good smart college student athletes on scholarship at a B1G schoool. i would bet 1,000 colones that 99% of the schol. FBallers there would get a full ride SOMEWHERE by June or July. seriously.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:43:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: ambi (#47)

We should all be appalled that Sandusky is running loose thanks to the jewish judge who volunteered and donated to the Second Mile.

Sandusky: JEW

Graham Spanier/Penn State President: JEW

The Red Sea pedestrians cover for each other like no other race does when evil is afoot.

“With the exception of Whites, the rule among the peoples of the world, whether residing in their homelands or settled in Western democracies, is ethnocentrism and moral particularism: they stick together and good means what is good for their ethnic group."
-Alex Kurtagic

X-15  posted on  2011-11-29   18:46:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: Original_Intent (#43)

You are making an asssumption that he knew about it well before he reported it. As a coach of college age football players, what makes you so sure he knew about the lurid dealings of those at the school who were busy buggering young adolescent boys?

So what about McQueary, how long did HE wait to report it? Oh that's right, he DIDN'T report it, he just mentioned it to Paterno in passing, years after the fact. How was Paterno to know for sure McQueary wasn't just making it up?

In my opinion Paterno did the only thing a responsbile person could do, and that is to report it to the police. It wasn't his job to investigate or go to the news media.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   18:47:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: FormerLurker (#50)

You are making an asssumption that he knew about it well before he reported it. As a coach of college age football players, what makes you so sure he knew about the lurid dealings of those at the school who were busy buggering young adolescent boys?

what happened to sandusky's prospering coaching career in '98; when, as the heir apparent to joe Pe##, it tanked into oblivion ?


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:50:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: All (#51)

i believe the truth of this coverup starts in the 70s. this spans 5 decades i'm afraid.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:51:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: Rotara (#51)

what happened to sandusky's prospering coaching career in '98; when, as the heir apparent to joe Pe##, it tanked into oblivion ?

Don't know. Do you?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   18:52:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: All (#52)

anyone know the dates peculiar to Gricar/non-indictment/disappearance/death and sandusky's sudden retirement in 98-99 to full time boy buggering ?


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:54:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: FormerLurker, Jethro Tull (#53)

Don't know. Do you?

it ended abruptly and without real explanation. strange is being kind.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   18:55:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: FormerLurker (#50)

In my opinion Paterno did the only thing a responsbile person could do, and that is to report it to the police. It wasn't his job to investigate or go to the news media.

But it was. It happened under his aegis. Fair or not fair as you see it, but it happened on his watch. When it became apparent that the school would do nothing a morally courageous man would have demanded action.

Also, recall that McQueary's report was in 2002 and Sandusky was first investigated in 1998 and (likely forced) retired in '99.

And no, with the information currently available to the public one cannot say with certainty that Paterno had any knowledge before '98, but the taint is still there.

Whatever the case he is not going to be prosecuted, but will be forever tainted. Remember, the Conference saw fit to remove his name from the Conference Trophy.

It is likely we will never know for sure when he first received knowledge of the state of affairs, but I believe history will judge that he did less than he could have to bring this to an end permanently.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   18:56:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: Rotara, Jethro Tull, *The hook-nosed Jew* (#18) (Edited)

(edit - this goes on constantly. And people say that Catholic priests are the big pedo's?? The jews are ten times worse!)

Brooklyn DA claims record number of child sex-abuse charges vs. haredim

November 28, 2011

NEW YORK (JTA) – The Brooklyn District Attorney's Office says it has charged 89 men in the borough's haredi Orthodox communities with child sex abuse -- a threefold increase over a two-year span.

However, the Forward reported that Brooklyn DA Charles Hynes declined to provide any details about the cases, making the number of arrests impossible to verify. His spokesman, Jerry Schmetterer, gave the figures to the newspaper in mid-November.

The numbers reflect the number of haredi Orthodox men charged with sexual abuse since October 2009.

In an e-mail to The Forward in late October, Schmetterer said his office was not prepared to discuss the cases at the time. "Perhaps towards the end of November,” he wrote.

In 2009, the Brooklyn District Attorney's Office said it had arrested 26 haredi Orthodox men in the borough for sexual abuse over the previous two years.

Hynes had come under fire for allegedly neglecting sexual abuse cases in Brooklyn’s haredi communities. Sexual abuse survivors and their advocates say that Hynes has been lax on the issue because he is afraid of political retaliation from Orthodox voters.

Ben Hirsch, president of Survivors for Justice, told The Forward, “We deserve public notice of the arrest and conviction of Orthodox sex offenders, not culturally sensitive policies that keep these cases from the public, thereby placing children in danger.”

“With the exception of Whites, the rule among the peoples of the world, whether residing in their homelands or settled in Western democracies, is ethnocentrism and moral particularism: they stick together and good means what is good for their ethnic group."
-Alex Kurtagic

X-15  posted on  2011-11-29   18:56:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: FormerLurker (#40)

Paterno reported the crime as soon as he was made aware of it. What else did you expect him to do?

I guess they expected Joe Paterno to grab a shotgun and blast Sandusky. The cops didn't do anything, the PA attorney General didn't do anything for 3 years, and a DA didn't do anything and it cost him his life. Maybe Paterno should have gone on national tv and told the nation about this and repeated what he was told which would have been hearsay. That appears how the LEO's on campus treated it. No wonder people shy away when someone is in distress. Try and help and end up a victim too!

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   18:57:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: ambi (#47)

The football coach orchestrated the coverup and now has paid the price

I have never claimed that he orchestrated it, and you should know that. What he is guilty of is not ensuring that it ceased in and around the Pe** State Playrooms.

As is clear from the undeniable facts he kept his lip zipped, publicly, and did not ensure that the local authorities, or State, were fully informed.

What I am contending, which is supported by the facts, is that he participated, at least passively, in the cover up.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:01:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: Original_Intent (#59)

what did edmund burke say ? i don't even know if it applies here. probably not.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   19:04:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: Original_Intent (#56)

And no, with the information currently available to the public one cannot say with certainty that Paterno had any knowledge before '98, but the taint is still there.

There used to be a concept in this much overhyped "Land of the Free", that a person was innocent till proven guilty.

No so anymore, especially when involving such riveting issues as boy buggering, which he very well may never have known about nor been involved in.

But the real perps walk, and those who DID know early on are given a pass as if it's not THEIR fault, it's the head coaches fault since he "should" have known.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:06:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: FormerLurker (#61)

what ignorant horseshit.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   19:08:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#63. To: FormerLurker (#50)

You are making an asssumption that he knew about it well before he reported it. As a coach of college age football players, what makes you so sure he knew about the lurid dealings of those at the school who were busy buggering young adolescent boys?

What's wrong with you. A major college football coach has plenty of time to go running off to the media and police with 3/4/5 year old info like what McQueary told him. /sarcasm

The retards are having fun with this.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   19:09:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#64. To: Rotara (#60)

what did edmund burke say ? i don't even know if it applies here. probably not.

Oh, I think it most definitely applies.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." ~ Edmund Burke

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:09:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#65. To: Original_Intent (#64)

thanks. spot on. however, what kind of men we're dealing with here is yet to be determined imo. Burke was a fine, fine man btw.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   19:11:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: ambi (#58)

No wonder people shy away when someone is in distress. Try and help and end up a victim too!

Exactly. New Yorkers seem to have learned that lesson a LONG time ago.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:11:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#67. To: ambi (#58)

a DA didn't do anything and it cost him his life

I haven't been following this story that closely. Has there been a missing person's investigation of this DA? Why didn't they launch a nationwide search for the guy when he disappeared into thin air?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:12:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#68. To: X-15 (#57)

question: did sandusky convert to methodism from the talmud because i can't tell. i have him down as methodist. fwiw


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   19:13:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: FormerLurker (#61)

There used to be a concept in this much overhyped "Land of the Free", that a person was innocent till proven guilty.

That is a legal fiction presumed in a courtroom in order to provide for a fair trial.

No one ever said life is fair, and there is no law requiring it to be. Each individual has for themselves the right, and even obligation, to arrive at their own personal judgment.

But the real perps walk, and those who DID know early on are given a pass as if it's not THEIR fault, it's the head coaches fault since he "should" have known.

You are presuming a false premise. It is clearly in evidence that he "did" know. No we cannot say exactly when, but we do know it was at least as early as 1998 and that a predatory pedophile was allowed to roam free and molest boys because people such as Joe Paterno did not have the courage to raise all holy hell.

It would seem Pe** State's unofficial motto is: "Don't rock the boat."

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:16:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#70. To: ambi (#63)

A major college football coach has plenty of time to go running off to the media and police with 3/4/5 year old info like what McQueary told him.

Yeah, so what if he get's his ass sued to hell for "slander and libel" over something someone told him years after the fact, something he had no idea of whether it was true or not.

Perhaps this whole "report" was given him for the sole purpose of implicating him and forcing him to step down, as has happened since the prime focus of the media has been Paterno and his "failure to report", which is a huge lie since he DID report it.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:17:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#71. To: Rotara, christine (#68)

question: did sandusky convert to methodism from the talmud because i can't tell. i have him down as methodist. fwiw

christine made a post that he was Jewish, but I do not know the source for that.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:17:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: Original_Intent (#69)

It is clearly in evidence that he "did" know.

Can you provide a link to that information, since I don't recall ever reading that Joe Paterno was aware of child rape occuring at the school prior to his being told about it by McQueary.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:19:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#73. To: FormerLurker, ambi, Rotara (#70)

Perhaps this whole "report" was given him for the sole purpose of implicating him and forcing him to step down, as has happened since the prime focus of the media has been Paterno and his "failure to report", which is a huge lie since he DID report it.

As I mentioned earlier I believe Paterno, whatever his debatable failings, has been made a focus to divert attention from the other likely Peds being serviced through the Ped Sandusky.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:21:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#74. To: X-15 (#57)

NEW YORK (JTA) – The Brooklyn District Attorney's Office says it has charged 89 men in the borough's haredi Orthodox communities with child sex abuse -- a threefold increase over a two-year span.

Perhaps it has something to do with their religious practice involving circumcision, using a mohel to suck the penis of the baby boy during the procedure...


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:23:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#75. To: FormerLurker (#72)

It is clearly in evidence that he "did" know.

Can you provide a link to that information, since I don't recall ever reading that Joe Paterno was aware of child rape occuring at the school prior to his being told about it by McQueary.

There was an investigation by the DA in 1998, and Sandusky "retired" at age 55 in 1999 despite being the heir apparent to the Head Coach position. Despite his reputation as a coach no other school would touch him. No, you can quibble all you wish but it is clear from circumstance that there is no way he could not have known.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:24:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#76. To: Original_Intent (#73)

I believe Paterno, whatever his debatable failings, has been made a focus to divert attention from the other likely Peds being serviced through the Ped Sandusky

Sort of how Monica Lewinsky was made the focus of the Clinton Impeachment, while ignoring the treason behind Chinese campaign money in exchange for top secret US technology, as well as the murder of Vince Foster and the false flag at OKC.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:26:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#77. To: Original_Intent (#59)

What I am contending, which is supported by the facts, is that he participated, at least passively, in the cover up.

No! What you are contending is not supported by the facts. There haven't been any facts brought out yet; only innuendos. The only facts brought out have been that a DA disappeared, the former PA attorney general and now PA governor did nothing when he first learned of the molestations and the PA state police only had one investigator working on this for over 3 years. Did any of them other than the disappeared DA get thrown under the bus. No! Only Paterno.

I can understand many of you getting a woodie going after a good looking lady, but getting a woodie and keeping it for 82 year old Joe Paterno makes me wonder about you.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   19:26:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#78. To: Original_Intent (#75)

No, you can quibble all you wish but it is clear from circumstance that there is no way he could not have known.

He may have been kept out of the loop, for reasons such as making him a scapegoat later on.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2011-11-29   19:27:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#79. To: ambi (#77)

I can understand many of you getting a woodie going after a good looking lady, but getting a woodie and keeping it for 82 year old Joe Paterno makes me wonder about you.

There is no need for ad hominem attacks. The facts are clear and how you choose to judge them, or avoid them, is your business.

Have I at any time personally attacked you in this thread?

When you have to resort to personal attacks then you are admitting that you have NO FACTS which support your position.

So, be it. You condemn yourself and discredit your arguments by your own words.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:33:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#80. To: Rotara (#68) (Edited)

He's a jew hiding in a church. The internet is being scrubbed and the new meme is "Although his name sounds Jewish, He Ain't One Of Us!". My recent bookmark on an older story that details his true heritage is 404'd as of today.

Bernie Fine/Syracuse coach and Graham Spanier/Penn State Pres. are still Jewish until the internet is scrubbed clean of that evidence.

“With the exception of Whites, the rule among the peoples of the world, whether residing in their homelands or settled in Western democracies, is ethnocentrism and moral particularism: they stick together and good means what is good for their ethnic group."
-Alex Kurtagic

X-15  posted on  2011-11-29   19:33:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#81. To: Original_Intent (#69)

It is clearly in evidence that he "did" know.

Ok Perry show us the evidence, not heresay or speculation. And what is the source? Did Joe Paterno confess? Was there a trial?

On a scale of 1 to 10, I have you at minus6 and droping fast. The only thing my husband says is lower is whale sh*t.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   19:34:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#82. To: FormerLurker (#78)

As you wish. We appear to be at loggerheads on this point and since we have both made our case I think I'll bow out.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:35:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#83. To: ambi (#81)

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   19:37:52 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#84. To: X-15 (#80)

wow. alright then. i think we can well most of us see where this is going. what a mess not so happy valley is in. and spanier was chanc. at Nebraska on the heels of Franklin. i want to figger out who knew what and when.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   19:40:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#85. To: Rotara (#31)

fuck you ya dumb bitch.

Now that's spot on ! (And, about time too !)

"Anyone intent upon achieving "smaller government" should consider quitting the current fraud."

noone222  posted on  2011-11-29   19:43:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#86. To: Original_Intent (#79) (Edited)

The facts are clear and how you choose to judge them, or avoid them, is your business.

The facts,innuendos.are clear and how you choose to judge them, or avoid them, is your business.

I keep asking you for the facts and apparently they are only in your minds eye. Has there been a trial. ans. NO! Did someone confess? ans. NO!

When you keep stating the facts say Paterno is guilty and you won't post them proves you are living a lie. Facts Please!!!

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   19:43:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#87. To: ambi (#81)

ambi, please read post #1 up at the top for my thoughts on Joe Paterno. He can't dodge this one, Sandusky was still creeping around the campus and all the coaching staff knew what was going on all these years, don't think that tongues don't wag on a college campus.

“With the exception of Whites, the rule among the peoples of the world, whether residing in their homelands or settled in Western democracies, is ethnocentrism and moral particularism: they stick together and good means what is good for their ethnic group."
-Alex Kurtagic

X-15  posted on  2011-11-29   19:46:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#88. To: X-15 (#87)

ambi, please read post #1

I already did and that is only your opinion. Nothing has transpired to make your innuendo a "true" fact. Any armchair quarterbacking is usually after the game is played. This game isn't finished yet! Sometimes speculators come up short.

ambi  posted on  2011-11-29   19:53:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#89. To: Original_Intent (#69)

hear no speak no see no people. the worst kind imo.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   20:15:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#90. To: Original_Intent (#69)

as a former coach, player, scout and consultant i can tell you that my colleagues and i to a man / woman agree it's a significant certainty that almost if not every single coach on staff there knew what 2nd mile jerry was all about. but it goes WAY off campus and the scope goes maybe to the top of some power structures.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   20:20:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#91. To: noone222 (#85)

Now that's spot on ! (And, about time too !)

Thanks Doug.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   20:21:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#92. To: FormerLurker, ambi, Original_Intent (#72)

Victim 4 remembers Sandusky being emotionally upset after a meeting with Joe Paterno in which Paterno told Sandusky that he would not be the next head coach at Penn State and which preceded Sandusky's retirement. Sandusky told victim 4 not to tell anyone about the meeting. That meeting occurred in May 1999.

from Grand Jury Presentment under victim 4

strepsiptera  posted on  2011-11-29   20:30:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#93. To: strepsiptera (#92)

what's ~12 or 13 years amongst 'friends', eh ?

i bet 12 or 13 is the tip of the iceberg. just a hunch.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   20:37:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#94. To: strepsiptera (#92)

May '99. ok.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   20:44:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#95. To: Rotara, 4 (#55)

it ended abruptly and without real explanation. strange is being kind.

Sandusky last coached in '99, and he might have thought of himself as the head coach heir apparent, but that wasn’t what others thought. His skill at fielding top rated defenses had begun to fade in ‘95. Out of his five defensive teams ('95- '99), only one was rated as high as #14th best in the nation. This period of time coincides with PSUs entry into the B-10, and clearly he was meeting higher caliber teams, week in and week out, and not matching up well.

Regarding his post '98 relationship w/Paterno, it's my best guess that when Gricar didn't indict him, Paterno bagged him. That was no retirement. Conspicuously missing at his retirement party was Paterno himself. The '98 assault, and failed indictment, didn't prevent President Spanier from giving him a retirement package, consisting of, among other things, the title of professor emeritus, which allowed him a campus office, phone, and complete freedom to any campus facility 24x7. Sandusky's Second Mile was by then well established and again, IMO, Spanier used him and it as a money pipeline to fund his many campus projects. If nothing else is gotten from this thread, it needs to be established that the president of PSU gave Sandusky carte blanche when it came to where he could go, and who he could associate with. Paterno had no authority to ban him from any part of the campus, and as far as I know, neither man spoke to each other after the firing.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2011-11-29   20:56:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#96. To: Original_Intent, All (#37)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, 1749-1832

Eric Stratton  posted on  2011-11-29   21:05:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#97. To: ambi (#29)

I bet you were one of those who went around screaming the towelheads did it. I guess you believe the governments take on 9-11. Just remember, first comes damage control, then the phony coverup, then the finger pointing, and then somebody gets thrown under the bus. They by-passed the other things and just threw Paterno under the bus. Sandusky is still free!

Unbelievable. Where do I even start with this. I'll just say: sandusky is not "free". He is out on bail, or is it bond. I get them mixed up. I have been handcuffed twice but never arrested so I dont know much about it.

That is not freedom. He faces many serious charges. And he probably wont be the only one.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2011-11-29   21:06:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#98. To: X-15 (#80)

My recent bookmark on an older story that details his true heritage is 404'd as of today.

has to be a coincidence. if you believe in them.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   21:20:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#99. To: Rotara (#23)

PE## STATE wanted to literally march the game ball to joePed's house had they beat us. WIN FOR JOE ! yikes

I admire loyalty, but not unconditional loyalty.

It's a good thing that I was not put in charge. I'd make Dean Wormer (Animal House) look like an anarchist hippy.

It amazes me that some people think that Paterno did the right thing. You can tell by that that they have no concept of leadership and what it entails. Once he (supposedly) told the campus rent-a-cops, and they did nothing, then to save his own ass he was not about to push it any further that that. Call the real LEOs? HA fucking HA! A nuke was dropped in his lap and he was happy to just bury it.

It blew up in his face anyway and now he has to pay the price.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2011-11-29   21:21:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#100. To: Jethro Tull (#95)

Regarding his post '98 relationship w/Paterno, it's my best guess that when Gricar didn't indict him, Paterno bagged him. That was no retirement. Conspicuously missing at his retirement party was Paterno himself.f

focusing right now just on joe; what's your take today ?


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   21:28:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#101. To: PSUSA2 (#99)

It amazes me that some people think that Paterno did the right thing.

cognitive dissonance ?? i forget.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   21:30:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#102. To: Rotara (#100)

focusing right now just on joe; what's your take today ?

A flawed man, who by his own admission, wishes he did more.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2011-11-29   21:33:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#103. To: Jethro Tull (#102)

yeah.


"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

Rotara  posted on  2011-11-29   21:37:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#104. To: Original_Intent (#71)

i found one source that claimed he was a jew, then another negating it, so who knows?

christine  posted on  2011-11-29   21:57:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#105. To: ambi (#86)

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   22:06:16 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#106. To: christine (#104)

i found one source that claimed he was a jew, then another negating it, so who knows?

With his last name he may be of Jewish ancestry but not a practicing Jew. I was able to find a reference to a famous Polish Jewish Midwife named Hannah Sandusky. So, that leaves the question open as there are Jewish people with that last name.

How long ago he or his family converted is unknown without further research.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   22:13:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#107. To: PSUSA2 (#97)

He is out on bail, or is it bond.

You get bail when you post bond.

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2011-11-29   22:48:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#108. To: Rotara (#90)

as a former coach, player, scout and consultant i can tell you that my colleagues and i to a man / woman agree it's a significant certainty that almost if not every single coach on staff there knew what 2nd mile jerry was all about. but it goes WAY off campus and the scope goes maybe to the top of some power structures.

People think the speed of light is fast. Well, there is nothing faster than the speed with which a scandal or juicy tid bit circulates around a locker room. When my father died everyone in the locker room knew before I returned. One guy who I was on the outs with, and we had actually come to blows, earned my eternal thanks when another guy announced his intention to make a nasty comment about my father's death - he told him that "if you say that I'LL kick your ass" and he meant it. That circulated the locker room at greater than light speed as well.

Remember The White Rose
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2011-11-29   23:10:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#109. To: Rotara (#91)

Thanks Doug.

A well deserved applause ! And, you're most welcome.

"Anyone intent upon achieving "smaller government" should consider quitting the current fraud."

noone222  posted on  2011-11-30   16:37:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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