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Title: How Not To Argue That We’re Running Out Of Oil
Source:
Council on Foreign Relations
URL Source: http://blogs.cfr.org/levi/2012/01/2 ... -that-were-running-out-of-oil/
Published: Jan 28, 2012
Author: Michael Levi
Post Date: 2012-01-28 12:06:03 by lead.and.lag
Keywords: None
Views: 3848
Comments: 257
you can read this article here at the CFR site. the author, Michael Levi, is the David M. Rubenstein Senior Fellow for Energy and the Environment at the CFR, and his artticle is a mixture of disinformation, bad metaphors, and haywire logic. his argument, although it's kinda hard to pin down, seems to be: party on, dudes, and dont worry about oil. my comments, which are languishing, and most likey will die, in "awaiting moderation" limbo, go like this... does this mean that the PNAC/AEI/exxon people didnt have to do 9/11 in response to peak oil? 3000 american lives, countless lives elsewhere… wasted, because nobody saw shale oil coming. what a tragedy." and... http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/1215/pnacprogress6272011.jpg this article is being discussed at theoildrum, despite attempts to derail it to a discussion of newt's moonbase scheme. "oh, man…
"here’s a map PNAC’s efforts in response to their misperceptions of peak oil.
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#62. To: PSUSA2, wudidiz (#53)
People assume, wrongly, that the operations are solely and only for money. The Alpha Psychotics have more money than they could ever spend rationally. What they are interested in is power and total control. Illusion? LOL! Yeah, it's all a huge conspiracy. Everyone is in on it. And WTF is an "alpha psychotic"? You just made that term up. Trying to sound smart again, I see. You fail, again. But it would make a great band name. I am glad to see you are as amused as if you were in your right mind. Common disinformation ploy - try to ridicule a contention you cannot disprove by inflating it and turning it into a Strawman Argument. Because a lot of people believe something does not mean they are conspirators and neither does it make it true. Commonly held false truths are easy to propagate as you so ably demonstrate. Hitler had a name for as did Joseph Goebbels i.e., "the big lie". Repeat a lie often enough and people begin to believe it. As well commonly held theories fall under the weight of accumulated contradictory observations. For example And so Dead Dinosaurs was the latest and greatest theory of oil creation at the end of the 19th Century. So, one can most reasonably conclude that what we are seeing in the continued belief in a decrepit theory is as Thomas Kuhn pointed out in "The Structure of Scientific Revolutions" that the old school will hold onto discredited theories unto death since they could not possibly have spent their entire life forwarding a now disproven theory. That others, with baser motives, have simply sought to further the conventional wisdom because it accrued to their benefit and the benefit of their plans is nothing new, and it does not require more than a handful to continue to propagate the lie. The late Arthur C. Clarke summarized it thusly: CLARKE'S LAW OF REVOLUTIONARY IDEAS: As for the term "Alpha Psychotic" - yes it is of my own coinage. Rather apt I think. It fits our top dog Psychotics to a "t". Oh, and I didn't "just" invent it - I've been using it for several years now. As for your usual lame attempt to attack me: My grandfather had that book. I wish I had a hard copy. The net will have to do for now.
"alpha psychotic". lol "alpha psychotic" "alpha psychotic" Then there's smallpox. Tetanus. And more. But I know that in your world, it's all not just one huge conspiracy, it's many huge conspiracies. Everyone is against you, in your own little world. They are all out to get you. That person you pass on the street? He's looking for a way to kill you. And that person on the other side of the street, window shopping, is really looking at you. Because he knows that You Are Onto Them and You Must Go. ROFLMFAO You are so delightfully transparent. If you ever have an original thought be kind to it - it's a long way from home. Twenty-Five Ways To Suppress Truth: The Rules of Disinformation That just goes to show that you don't learn. Do you know that there is a difference between psychotics and psychopaths/sociopaths? No? Well, now you know. Please make a note of it. I don't want to have to repeat myself. So not only did you make up the term, you make up an inaccurate term. That was pretty stupid of you. Now, about those vaccines? I don't give a fuck what Clark says about anything. That is a blatant yet wordy attempt to distract. I guess you think that your ideas are "revolutionary" ideas that will be accepted as truth. Not likely. About those vaccines? What sayest thou? -------------------------------------------------------- Why should things change now? After all you have your stock talking points that you repeat, in different forms, over, and over, and over, and over again. But at least you are consistent - consistently wrong. Did you know that there is a difference between black and white? I believe I used the term Psychotic - however the behavior of the Alpha Psychotic Banksters, Psychiatrists, and many of their minions (not mentioning anyone in particular mind you) are also sociopathic in their behavior. However, Psychiatric terms are often vague and subjective labels which blend one into another. So, in the case of our Vearless Leahders both terms are descriptive of their behavior as their sociopathy flows out of their psychosis. They could also be named megalomaniacs as well, or if you prefer simpler teminology - monsters - wannabe Hannibal Lectres. As for vaccines: http://www.naturalnews.com/News_000647_Bayer_vaccines_HIV.html Once again your talking points book has betrayed you: I can see that you still don't know what you are talking about. Perhaps you should just call them "strange". I bet you know what that means. If not, let me know and I'll try and explain it to you. http://www.naturalnews.com/News_000647_Bayer_vaccines_HIV.html Blah blah blah. I already said that I don't know of any 100% safe medical procedures. Even placebos have a risk of choking on the tablets. So you take the tiny number medical hard cases and try to turn them into huge typical examples. You're not alone, others do that too, when they have an agenda they are pushing. I'd say that chances are, you're alive today because of these evil vaccines. -------------------------------------------------------- I am obviously more cynical than you, I have a problem with the word "sometimes". PSUSA2 believes what the MSM tells it and any other theory or explanation is a CT. This creature wants us to be like it and have ultimate trust in the PTB. The quotes about the "winners of wars write the history books" and "unquestioning respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth" (Albert Einstein) are unknown or make no sense to this bizarre creature of unlimited trust. It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere. Voltaire An ideal form of government is democracy tempered with assassination. Voltaire
When I page through the book I am amazed at the projects kids of that day and age built. My dad built a sailing ship with cannons and such from scratch by using the very limited guideline of this book when he was thirteen. It was written for kids of that age range, yet kids that age today would have trouble reading it I suspect. It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere. Voltaire An ideal form of government is democracy tempered with assassination. Voltaire
Again, I must thank you for an exceptional belly laugh on that one :) It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere. Voltaire An ideal form of government is democracy tempered with assassination. Voltaire
Stick around for a while, kid. You'll learn. I make allowances for ignorance. The "alternative" media is just as screwed up as the MSM. Trust them if you want. But that would be foolish. Ignorance is forgivable, foolishness isn't. You seem to respect the "alternative" medias authority too much. -------------------------------------------------------- Trust me I don't (pun intended) “Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.” Buddha It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere. Voltaire An ideal form of government is democracy tempered with assassination. Voltaire
No one here has ever contended that there are any 100% safe procedures. However, the question was the efficacy and safety of vaccines, and there is a growing body of evidence which strongly suggests that they have been misrepresented by people with other agendas such as greed, and reducing the population. This IS science. Either the evidence is there to support them, and to discredit the evidence against or there is not. Given that the increasing body of evidence supports my position from a factual, empirical and clinical, point of view all you can do is your usual sputter and throw hissy fits attempting to distract from the fact that you cannot support your position and that it is nothing more than cut and paste arguments, with a little gratuitous nastiness thrown in, from your talking points. You don't think you regurgitate, and it beginning to smell awfully bad. And your evidence and support for this unsupported assertion is? I didn't think so. You say lots of things without anything to back them. So, this one is different from the last 10,000 how? You can gnash your teeth and stamp your feet all you want. Please feel free. I believe in freedom - even in your right to spout the same repetitive unsupported illogic over, and over, and over, and over, and over again. However, one definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result. You are most welcome. We aims ta' please. Buddha One of the most sublime (whatever that means) paragraphs man has written. I guess sitting in caves and doing nothing but thinking, even mortal men can come up with some pretty deep stuff from time to time..... It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere. Voltaire An ideal form of government is democracy tempered with assassination. Voltaire
Methane and other hydrocarbons occur naturally within the earth and other planets. You can't tell me dinosaurs used to roam around on Jupiter. I guess sitting in caves and doing nothing but thinking, even mortal men can come up with some pretty deep stuff from time to time..... Siddhartha Gutahma (sp) was not that man. In his adult years he with lived and observed humanity. And an appropriate sexual dimension to his upbringing. In his youth he was behind royal walls and given an education. He, in my view of things, was the essence of a man who showed us a better way, after the usual man or women was receptive to the new message. POV. USA did not allow voting to women till 100 YO. Unmitigated bullshit. Vaccines are common. Why are we not dropping like flies in a blizzard? I'll tell you why. It is because the danger is minimal, next to the risk of contracting these diseases. That's why. There is no such evidence that you claim. None. All you have are the ravings of idiots. And believing them makes you an idiot. I bet you have had the advantage of being vaccinated. You got yours but if you got your way, everyone else would be SOL. It's evident that you want them to die of these diseases. There is no other way to put it. It is you that is the psychopath. You would deny others the protection that you enjoy. I told you I had you pegged. You're a psychopath. -------------------------------------------------------- You may be right. I'm not a geologist, or a chemist, and unlike some others, I do not play one on 4um. So, tell me, chemist/geologist/astronomer. Tell me if other planets methane and other hydrocarbons = oil. I guess you know, don't you? You claim to. So explain it to me. -------------------------------------------------------- I for one, likes the freedom of expression here.
It does get wild, sometimes. I like it too.
-------------------------------------------------------- I do to, it is especially entertaining to read the mad ravings of the shills that are attracted here. It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere. Voltaire An ideal form of government is democracy tempered with assassination. Voltaire
LOGICAL FALLACY ALERT! LOGICAL FALLACY ALERT! WARNING! WARNING! LOGICAL FALLACY ALERT! As well your two statements are not logically connected i.e., one does not imply the other nor does either support the other. The statement "Vaccines are common" proves nothing. It is an assertion of a fact which can be true or not true but in and of itself it proves nothing as regards the efficacy of vaccines. Example: "Rain is common. Why are we not all drowning?" The preceding illustrates the fallacy of the alleged argument. The second statement is fallacious as it begs the question and includes an implied premise which is false. The implied effect is, by implication, limited only to death as a consequential adverse side effect of toxic vaccines when there is in fact quite a few other observed side effects and the side effects are dependent upon the vaccine and whatever contaminants may be included in the vaccine. For example Mercury used as a preservative may not cause immediate death but the effects of Mercury poisoning are well known - brain damage being one of the primary effects - which is where the term "Mad as Hatter" comes from as felt hats were, in prior days, blocked using mercury as a wetting agent and over time Hatters acquired sufficient brain damage to make them appear quite mad to others. Kidney disease is a noted side effect of Flu Vaccines and yet is not immediately deadly, but in the long run it degrades quality of life and will shorten a person's life. Not all vaccine side effects are immediately deadly and neither have the manufacturers done any long term studies. It is just "show me the money". Vaccines are big business and the numbers of vaccines "reccomended" has increased almost exponentially. As well many vaccines are given to babies who do not yet have a developed immune system and thus the immunological reaction that the vaccine is supposed to create, based upon the immunological response, is physically impossible. One that has received a lot of attention over the last few years, because of the numbers of deaths and neurological disorders following and consequent to administration of the HPV Vaccine (Gardasil) has been very marked and noted despite attempts to cover it up. The last count I was aware of 47 girls had died following the administration of the Gardasil vaccine and an unknown number of others have suffered severe neurological problems. The upshot is that your implied premise that the only adverse outcome is death is proven to be the fallacious assumption it is. The following article provides a lot more background in support of my arguments: (NaturalNews) A lot happened in the vaccine industry in 2011 -- a year of accelerating change and increased awareness among the people. One of the big realizations that hit home in 2011 is that vaccines are far more dangerous than most people previously thought, and even conventional scientists are starting to question the over-vaccination of infants and children. Fallacies violated: Also we have: Twenty-Five Ways To Suppress Truth: The Rules of Disinformation Again completely divorced from logic or reason. Oh, do wipe the drool from your chin it's bad for the carpet and leaves ugly stains. Again an implied premise i.e., that getting vaccinated is an advantage. That is proven by no evidence which you have provided to support your assertion. And again you resort to Argumentum Ad Hominem. Since you cannot support your foam flecked spittle laced non-arguments, which are logically false, you resort to name calling. Does your mother really wear combat boots? Again Argumentum Ad Hominem. Since there is nothing in your argument which is logically sound and contains nothing more the drooling slack jawed invective - why did you bother. Oh, I forgot - it's a paycheck. Titan has “Hundreds of Times More” Liquid Hydrocarbons Than Earth
OK, psycho, let's start from the top. #1 - Japanese children die from vaccines Yet more evidence emerges of the deadly side effects of vaccines: http://www.naturalnews.com/031616_vaccines_Japan.html "Japan halts vaccines from Pfizer, Sanofi after deaths of four children " OK, 4 kids died. Why did they die? The article doesn't say. That article doesn't say much at all. It gives a headline to catch ones initial attention, but it says almost nothing at all to explain that headline. It's just a rambling mess. But the article says this: "What's clear from all this is that vaccines are great at one thing: Population control." Clear? Only to a madman. That website is worthless. They're just as psycho as you are. It is people like you that demand population control, by refusing people vaccines. You want to be a mass murderer, but you don't want to get your hands dirty. If you're not a kike, you sure do act like one. -------------------------------------------------------- And that is supposed to prove what, exactly? It says nothing about oil. -------------------------------------------------------- I'm surprised you're defending vaccines. People such as bill gates admit that mass vaccines will reduce population & the rulers vehemently shill for them. Autism has skyrocketed.Theyre filled with poison, on purpose.Not smart to promote vaccines.
"Even to the death fight for truth, and the LORD your God will battle for you". Sirach 4:28
Where? I don't promote them, I just question the honesty of all involved when it comes to pushing their individual agendas. I don't trust the CDC and I don't trust those that try to get others to panic by using bullshit tactics. Name one medical procedure that is 100% safe. I can't think of any. People can and do quickly die from the tiniest of cuts, if the wrong bacteria get into the wound. -------------------------------------------------------- the science of vaccines itself isnt necessarily bad, but what they put in them today is. It is a eugenics plot. Thats why the establishment shills for vaccines. The gates clip is on youtube. People can get them, but should be free to decline vaccines also
"Even to the death fight for truth, and the LORD your God will battle for you". Sirach 4:28
OK I found it. Or, I found one. It is an excellent example of what I am talking about when it comes to agendas. I'll start another post on it in a few minutes.
-------------------------------------------------------- gates speech is convoluted explaining his formula but his point remains, vaccine the world and the population numbers will decline, a goal which he advocates. yet vaccines save lives? yeah right. they also admittedly sterilize people using vaccines.
"Even to the death fight for truth, and the LORD your God will battle for you". Sirach 4:28
Oil is a hydrocarbon. Methane is a precursor to oil. Wow. With logic like that, you can't possibly go wrong. Methane is a precursor to oil? Really? If you want to play chemist, you might want to do some basic research first. THen. maybe you can fake it more convincingly. THen you might be able to convince others, if they are gullible. -------------------------------------------------------- Methane is a hydrocarbon chain with just one carbon atom (CH4). Ethane has two C atoms (C2H6), propane has 3 (C3H8) and butane has 4 (C4H10). Those are all gases which derive from simple methane. Hydrocarbon chains with 5 to 18 carbon atoms are liquid, and form substances such as naphthas (5 to 7 carbon atoms), gasoline which is blended from hydrocarbons with 7 to 11 carbon atoms, kerosene (12 to 15 carbon atoms), then lubricating oils. Hydrocarbon chains containing over 20 carbon atoms form paraffin wax, tar, and asphalt. Comets are made of hydrocarbons, including tar. Dinosaurs did not hatch comets, nor did they pee oil deep into the earth for that matter. Did you even know that crude oil is just a blend of many different hydrocarbons?
But comets have plate tectonics? Did "god" put the hydrocarbons there? H and C are the 2 most common elements in the universe. But that doesn't mean oil just happens. I'll believe it when the abiotic "theory" is proven in the labs and is no longer this silly "well, if X happens with Y and Z, along with _____________ and ______________". -------------------------------------------------------- So all you need is a blender? During fractional distillation, those different compounds are separated out. That is no big secret. But that does not mean that those separate compounds were separately blended together to make oil. -------------------------------------------------------- And oh yeah, on Titan, it actually rains hydrocarbons from the sky, and there are lakes of it.
WTF has plate tectonics have to do with hydrocarbons? Did "god" put the hydrocarbons there? Did God create space and time? Did God create H2O? Chemical building blocks permeate Creation. And they build upon themselves to form complex molecules, and eventually organisms. Let me ask you this. How do YOU think hydrocarbons are formed? Were the dinosaurs actually super smart and they built huge laboratories that turned everything including themselves into crude oil just waiting for Rockefellar and his boys to pump it out of the ground? Are you retarded? During fractional distillation, those different compounds are separated out. That is no big secret. But that does not mean that those separate compounds were separately blended together to make oil. Well no shit Sherlock. But it is still a BLEND, or a MIXTURE if you'd like. It is NOT a distinct COMPOUND which would be a unique substance in and of itself. It is simply a combination of different molecules, ie. a mixture or blend. In fact, gasoline IS a blend of different types of hydrocarbons, it isn't one specific hydrocarbon.
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestIt provides support to the illusion that oil is scarce, and provides justification for higher prices.
Yeah, it's all a huge conspiracy. Everyone is in on it.
We now know that Leakey's Lucy was just a monkey.
It was once believed that all of the planets and stars were encased in crystal and revolved around the earth - the so-called Celestial Sphere. Then it progressed to "the sun revolves around the earth". Which of these do you believe?
The French Academy was on record in the 18th Century with the firm pronouncement that "rocks don't fall from the sky". Today we call them Meteorites.
The work of Fr. Gregor Mendel, the father of modern genetics, lay dormant for a century after his death as it "could not possibly be true".
The Smithsonian Institution would not publish the achievement of the Wright Brothers at Kittyhawk for two years after the fact because they knew that powered flight was impossible. Oh, and that wasn't a conspiracy either. Like many scientific organizations they held onto a discredited theory in preference to observed facts.
Every revolutionary idea - in Science, Politics, Art or Whatever - evokes three stages of reaction.
1. "It is impossible - don't waste my time."
2. "It is possible, but it is not worth doing."
3. "I said it was a good idea all along."
#63. To: intotheabyss (#30)
The Boy Mechanic
#64. To: PSUSA2 (#59)
You simply betray your own ignorance, or the requirements of your talking points manual, by shooting off with incomplete and/or inaccurate assumptions.
5. Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule. This is also known as the primary 'attack the messenger' ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as 'kooks', 'right-wing', 'liberal', 'left-wing', 'terrorists', 'conspiracy buffs', 'radicals', 'militia', 'racists', 'religious fanatics', 'sexual deviates', and so forth. This makes others shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.
18. Emotionalize, Antagonize, and Goad Opponents. If you can't do anything else, chide and taunt your opponents and draw them into emotional responses which will tend to make them look foolish and overly motivated, and generally render their material somewhat less coherent. Not only will you avoid discussing the issues in the first instance, but even if their emotional response addresses the issue, you can further avoid the issues by then focusing on how 'sensitive they are to criticism.'
#65. To: Original_Intent (#62)
It fits our top dog Psychotics to a "t". Oh, and I didn't "just" invent it - I've been using it for several years now.
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#66. To: PSUSA2 (#65)
That just goes to show that you don't learn. Do you know that there is a difference between psychotics and psychopaths/sociopaths? No? Well, now you know. Please make a note of it. I don't want to have to repeat myself.
That just goes to show that you don't learn. Do you know that there is a difference between psychotics and psychopaths/sociopaths?
Vaccination Debate
Review: Vaccination: 100 Years of Orthodox Research Shows that Vaccines Represent a Medical Assault on the Immune System
New Proof that Flu Shots are Unnecessary and Ineffective
The Ineffectiveness of Vaccines from a Historical Perspective
Ron Paul Speaks Out Against Dangerous Vaccines
#67. To: Original_Intent (#66)
I believe I used the term Psychotic - however the behavior of the Alpha Psychotic Banksters, Psychiatrists, and many of their minions (not mentioning anyone in particular mind you) are also sociopathic in their behavior. However, Psychiatric terms are often vague and subjective labels which blend one into another. So, in the case of our Vearless Leahders both terms are descriptive of their behavior as their sociopathy flows out of their psychosis. They could also be named megalomaniacs as well, or if you prefer simpler teminology - monsters - wannabe Hannibal Lectres.
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#68. To: Bill D Berger (#60)
History has shown all too clearly that public trust in high officials is sometimes misplaced."
#69. To: bluegrass (#63)
My grandfather had that book. I wish I had a hard copy.
#70. To: Original_Intent (#66)
Picture of cat in a birdcage
#71. To: intotheabyss (#68)
PSUSA2 believes what the MSM tells it and any other theory or explanation is a CT. This creature wants us to be like it and have ultimate trust in the PTB.
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#72. To: PSUSA2 (#71)
The "alternative" media is just as screwed up as the MSM. Trust them if you want.
#73. To: PSUSA2 (#67)
I already said that I don't know of any 100% safe medical procedures. Even placebos have a risk of choking on the tablets.
So you take the tiny number medical hard cases and try to turn them into huge typical examples. You're not alone, others do that too, when they have an agenda they are pushing.
I'd say that chances are, you're alive today because of these evil vaccines.
#74. To: intotheabyss (#70)
Again, I must thank you for an exceptional belly laugh on that one :)
#75. To: intotheabyss (#72)
“Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.”
"Satan / Cheney in "08" 
#76. To: tom007 (#75)
One of the most sublime (whatever that means) paragraphs man has written.
#77. To: lead.and.lag, PSUSA2, Original_Intent, wudidiz, All (#0)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#78. To: intotheabyss (#76)
(Edited)
One of the most sublime (whatever that means) paragraphs man has written.
"Satan / Cheney in "08"
#79. To: Original_Intent (#73)
No one here has ever contended that there are any 100% safe procedures. However, the question was the efficacy and safety of vaccines, and there is a growing body of evidence which strongly suggests that they have been misrepresented by people with other agendas such as greed, and reducing the population. This IS science. Either the evidence is there to support them, and to discredit the evidence against or there is not. Given that the increasing body of evidence supports my position from a factual, empirical and clinical, point of view
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#80. To: FormerLurker (#77)
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#81. To: PSUSA2 (#79)
"Satan / Cheney in "08"
#82. To: tom007 (#81)
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#83. To: tom007 (#81)
I for one, likes the freedom of expression here.
#84. To: PSUSA2 (#79)
Vaccines are common. Why are we not dropping like flies in a blizzard?
Red Herring
Strawman Argument
Here are the 10 biggest vaccine news stories of 2011, reported on NaturalNews.com:#1 - Japanese children die from vaccines
Yet more evidence emerges of the deadly side effects of vaccines:
http://www.naturalnews.com/031616_vaccines_Japan.html#2 - U.S. government recruits churches to push flu shots on congregation members
Take that flu shot, or you'll go to Hell! That's the new message the U.S. government is trying to pound into the heads of church pastors and priests:
http://www.naturalnews.com/034394_churches_flu_shots_vaccinations.html#3 - Top CDC vaccine scientist indicted for fraud
You probably never read this story elsewhere, but one of the CDC's top researchers was indicted for allegedly stealing vaccine research money and using it to buy fancy vehicles and a luxury home:
http://www.naturalnews.com/032216_Thorsen_fraud.html#4 - IOM admits MMR vaccines cause seizures and measles
In a groundbreaking report, the Institute of Medicine openly admitted that vaccines actually cause the very measles they claim to prevent. The mainstream media, of course, misreported this research and utterly failed to cover the real story.
http://www.naturalnews.com/033447_Institute_of_Medicine_vaccines.html#5 - CDC openly admits flu vaccines don't work
Here's news you don't see every day: The CDC openly admits that vaccine flu shots "wear off," meaning they simply do not work in the way vaccine-pushing immunologists told us they did.
http://www.naturalnews.com/032558_flu_shots_wear_off.html#6 - Merck vaccine scientist Dr. Maurice Hilleman admits vaccines contain cancer-causing viruses
The actual admission happened decades ago, but news of it only went viral in 2011 as alternative news websites like NaturalNews publicized the once-secret audio recordings revealing shocking admissions by Dr. Maurice Hilleman.
http://www.naturalnews.com/033584_Dr_Maurice_Hilleman_SV40.html#7 - HPV vaccines found contaminated with HPV!
Pretty clever, huh? Just lace the HPV vaccines with the DNA of HPV itself, and you can spread the disease to create more fear that sells more vaccines!
http://www.naturalnews.com/033585_Gardasil_contamination.html#8 - Swine flu vaccine admittedly causes neurological disorders
2011 was the year that the nation of Finland openly admitted on the record that swine flu vaccines "conclusively" cause neurological disorders. It then offered to pay the lifetime medical costs of those damaged by such vaccines.
Remember, the USA continues to absurdly claim that vaccines cause NO damage (not to anyone) and are perfectly safe for infants, children and even pregnant women!
http://www.naturalnews.com/033816_swine_flu_vaccines_neurological_disorde...#9 - Science says flu vaccines only work on 1 out of 100
Now, even the scientists can't argue with their own science, can they? Rigorous studies published in peer-reviewed medical journals reveal that flu vaccines hardly work at all and are wasted on 98.5 out of 100 people who take them.
http://www.naturalnews.com/033998_influenza_vaccines_effectiveness.html#10 - Hallmark caught distributing flu shot compliance cards to new moms
Yes, even the Hallmark card company is now pushing vaccines. Plotting alongside state agencies in Florida, Colorado and elsewhere, the company pushes out cutesy flu shot "compliance" cards that urge new moms to have their newborn babies injected with dozens of combination vaccines, complete with mercury and chemical adjuvants that cause neurological disorders:
http://www.naturalnews.com/034365_Hallmark_vaccines_newborns.html
---------------------------------------------- End of Article "There is no such evidence that you claim. None. All you have are the ravings of idiots. And believing them makes you an idiot."
Argumentum Ad Hominem
Loaded Words
2. Become incredulous and indignant. Avoid discussing key issues and instead focus on side issues which can be used show the topic as being critical of some otherwise sacrosanct group or theme. This is also known as the 'How dare you!' gambit.
3. Create rumor mongers. Avoid discussing issues by describing all charges, regardless of venue or evidence, as mere rumors and wild accusations. Other derogatory terms mutually exclusive of truth may work as well. This method which works especially well with a silent press, because the only way the public can learn of the facts are through such 'arguable rumors'. If you can associate the material with the Internet, use this fact to certify it a 'wild rumor' from a 'bunch of kids on the Internet' which can have no basis in fact.
5. Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule. This is also known as the primary 'attack the messenger' ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as 'kooks', 'right-wing', 'liberal', 'left-wing', 'terrorists', 'conspiracy buffs', 'radicals', 'militia', 'racists', 'religious fanatics', 'sexual deviates', and so forth. This makes others shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.
9. Play Dumb. No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues except with denials they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maximum effect.
"I bet you have had the advantage of being vaccinated. You got yours but if you got your way, everyone else would be SOL. It's evident that you want them to die of these diseases. There is no other way to put it. It is you that is the psychopath. You would deny others the protection that you enjoy."
"I told you I had you pegged. You're a psychopath."
#85. To: FormerLurker, BSUSATOO, PUSUSATOO, PSUSA2, wudidiz, lead.and.lag, all (#77)
#86. To: Original_Intent (#84)
(Edited)
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#87. To: Original_Intent (#85)
(Edited)
Titan has “Hundreds of Times More” Liquid Hydrocarbons Than Earth
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#88. To: PSUSA2 (#86)
#89. To: Artisan (#88)
People such as bill gates admit that mass vaccines will reduce population
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#90. To: PSUSA2 (#89)
#91. To: Artisan (#90)
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#92. To: PSUSA2 (#91)
#93. To: PSUSA2 (#80)
Tell me if other planets methane and other hydrocarbons = oil
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#94. To: FormerLurker (#93)
Oil is a hydrocarbon. Methane is a precursor to oil.
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#95. To: PSUSA2, Original_Intent (#94)
Methane is a precursor to oil? Really? If you want to play chemist, you might want to do some basic research first. THen. maybe you can fake it more convincingly. THen you might be able to convince others, if they are gullible.
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#96. To: PSUSA2 (#94)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#97. To: FormerLurker (#95)
Comets are made of hydrocarbons, including tar. Dinosaurs did not hatch comets, nor did they pee oil deep into the earth for that matter.
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#98. To: FormerLurker (#96)
Did you even know that crude oil is just a blend of many different hydrocarbons?
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll
#99. To: PSUSA2, Original_Intent (#95)
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#100. To: PSUSA2 (#97)
But comets have plate tectonics?
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
#101. To: PSUSA2 (#98)
So all you need is a blender?
"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen
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