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Religion
See other Religion Articles

Title: BREAKING LOOSE
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://slickaz.tripod.com/play/breaking.html
Published: Mar 23, 2012
Author: m
Post Date: 2012-03-23 14:09:55 by PSUSA2
Keywords: None
Views: 420
Comments: 23

by Nate Leved


So, here you are now, a bit older and a bit wiser. You
are smarter than you were a while ago, and you are harder
to kid. In fact, any more, you don't even kid yourself.
People who snoop around Atheistic and Satanic web sites
are usually motivated by some pretty simple reasons like
those that follow:



REASONS


Life is full of choices, and you need to make yours pretty quick. Well, here is the scoop, Mary Ann. In this world, there are masters and slaves. You are either one or the other, as there isn't much in between. Here is a little test to make you think: if you run your own business, you are a master. If you work for somebody else, then you are a slave. If you buy stuff with cash, you are a master. If you depend upon credit to live, then you are a slave. If you go out and grab what you want when you want it, then you are a master.. If you must attend some kind of a group or church to fulfill your social needs, then you are a slave. So what are you? Are you a master or a slave? Come on now, be honest with yourself. The web isn't advanced enough to read your thoughts quite yet. No one will know but you. But, you need to know. You need to know for your own good. You need to come to terms with yourself.

All right, steady down there. Atheists and Satanists are realists. They have to be realists as there is no "warm-fuzzy" to turn to when the wind blows cold. These people have come to the realization through a series of events that there ain't no loving God up in the sky, Lord in de sky. Their spouse died of cancer in spite of all that praying and pleading. They got laid off just like everybody else when the corporation decided to tighten it's belt. Their kid turned out to be a real problem, and they couldn't deal with it. The mortgage company repossessed their house when they couldn't make the payments, and yes, their puppy kept on peeing on their carpet even when it grew up to be a Great Dane.

Last week at the local Pentecostal church, the pastor was preaching up a storm about healing and giving money to God. People were talking in tongues and the organ was blaring. People were lined up along the rail, and when the preacher put his hand upon their forehead they fell over backwards and kicked and quivered. Then just when things were going good, the double doors flapped open, and in rolls this kid in a wheel chair who wants God to heal him. He's got MS and has been in that wheelchair for a bunch of years and wants out. That's when the fun began.

The preacher tried to ignore the kid, but the little fellow kept following the preacher up and down the rail, rolling first here and then there, calling me, me, me. Finally, the preacher grew embarrassed and went through the motions of trying to heal the kid in order to satisfy his congregation. This time, the preacher even spoke in tongues, but the kid didn't get up and walk. He didn't do it then or any other time. He'd been coming faithfully for weeks to this three-ring circus, but it didn't matter, he had MS and that was that.

Sure, you'd seen it all before, deaf people, blind people, lame people-- all turned away with no noticeable improvement in their condition no matter how many times they came before the Lord. Surely, God couldn't hate everyone? Could He? Then there are all of those people who died right on schedule just like the doctor said they would, leaving their families alone and sometimes destitute. Oh, and yes, there were all those cute little kids whose deaths devastated their parents when no one could figure out why God needed those kids more than their families.

You know what's happened, don't you? You have finally had your fill of lying, cheating mysticism. Yes, you've got a belly full of politics and excuses. I'll bet that you are one of those people who take charge of your own life and are looking for more of your own kind. You might have been raised with a subjective mentality, by near slaves who were the sons and daughters of slaves, but you are starting to see the great lie for what it is. You are sick and tired of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ with no bullshit. That's the church where the blind don't see, the lame don't walk, the deaf don't hear and the dead stay where they belong.

You see, the establishment and the church are on power trips, and they are about milking the herds of human cattle for all they are worth as long as they are willing to believe all that is told them by authority figures of one sort or another. Fear of the unknown is a powerful tool for managing the masses. The strongest playing card in the deck for preachers is the fear of death. Not only that, but they have added more uncertainty to the amalgam of fear. They want you to worry about what is going to happen after you die. That is a great way to garner money from the flocks. That's why people give to the churches. They are buying off God.

The world of business is little different. They want you to think that if you don't swallow their line of corporate hogwash, you would surely die or spend your days flipping burgers at the neighborhood fast-food joint. Humbug. There are nine hundred and forty-seven ways that you could make a living without working for someone else. Just open up the Yellow pages and look at all the possibilities. There are several on each page. Clowns who repair holes in drywall, hang wallpaper and paint houses very likely make as much or more than you do in your corporate dungeon. The guy who sprays my weeds makes about a hundred bucks an hour, and I have to hassle him for two or three weeks just to get him to come by and squirt the yard. I've sat in my office talking to guys who brag about making 60 or 80 K a year and are in fear of losing their jobs. Hell, If I haven't made that much in the first quarter, I take stock of myself.

Relationships are just as bad. Here you are, living a life you hate in an environment that sucks, and you are trapped. No, you are not trapped. You can throw the whole damned thing down and walk off and do something else. Does your husband abuse you? Does your wife make your life miserable with her constant belly- aching? What in the Hell are you doing there? Do you like pain and suffering? Well, if you do, then you are on the wrong web site. Try sadomasochism instead.

Anyway, to be a true Atheist or Satanist is anything but a subjective venture. Like I said, true Satanists are intelligent people who have had their fill of society's fables. They are ready to move on to something more interesting. Satanists are able people who maintain themselves and make their own decisions. Oh yes, and if they screw up, they suffer their own consequences. In other words, we take responsibility for our own actions as there ain't no handy Jesus to forgive our sins. But then again, we have no sins and no guilt either, as we live our lives in a responsible manner, asking no quarter and giving none.

Well congratulations to you, as you've read this far! Now, read the rest of the files, switch over to the "Devil's Hole" and read those files. Then, if you still are interested in becoming a Satanist, then read the material on "Church Lucifer". Surviving that, read the files on the "Children of the Black Rose." Yes, there is a spiritual side to Satanism, though most are unaware of it. The Luciferian Church is a Gnostic religion where it's advocates become aware through the process of "The Knowing". You'd be surprised at how many of us there are around the world. After all, we've been around a long, long, time. My own group's records go back over Seven thousand years, but the knowledge goes back further than that, much further back.

That's why we don't take these modern religions and their vain threats of hell and damnation very seriously. They are the new kids on the block, and really, what are they going to do to us? We were here long before they came, and we will be here long after they go. They are already failing, their people falling away from lack of interest and repeated failure to find benefit and workable answers from attendance. "You can fool some of the people some of the time, all of the people some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time." But what about salvation? Well, what about it? Who do you need to be saved from? Right!

However, there is a new day coming, free of mysticism and deceit, Church Lucifer is the Church of the coming age. It is rising up strong, and people are eager to learn and grow and do and become. You just watch. Satanism will win the hearts and minds of the people and eventually become the predominant religion of Planet Earth. You are just one of many who are already looking for alternative social structures. So, are you a master or a slave? The religion of the opposition requires you to be a slave and to maintain a submissive attitude. Can you accept that? Or would you rather go on lying to yourself?

The other day, a guy e-mailed me and said that he was a born- again Christian. Next he asked me what I could offer him.. Well, I told him the same thing that I'll tell you. I offered him his self respect and a parking place in Hell.

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#1. To: PSUSA2 (#0)

lol....why are you so desperate for validation? It's funny when you think about it because people join churches for a sense of community and you have left one for another but remain desperate for community. Hence, your virtual quest. Fear not, the church of ego is massive but rarely is there room for more than one at the alter at any given time. It's also funny that you find this sermon to the ego so inspiring as to share it with the lot of us. : )

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-23   14:36:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: abraxas (#1)

Of course it's inspiring!

That people join churches for as you say a "sense of community" shows how far these churches have fallen. They don't even believe their own bullshit anymore.

For all intents and purposes, xtianity has already been destroyed. I find that to be most inspirational.

As for my own 'validation", I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks. I jsut do it because I want to do it. And chances are, I'll keep on doing it.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-03-23   15:02:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: PSUSA2 (#2)

Who cares about this shit?

A people that would and could throw the bums out in the voting booth never has to. - Prefrontal Vortex

randge  posted on  2012-03-23   15:40:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: PSUSA2 (#2)

xtianity has already been destroyed.

From my POV, Christianity was never intended to be a religion but it was made so and politicized as such not long after arrival.

Come now, dear, we both know that you absolutely, positively DO give a fuck what others think and you desire to share what you think so that you can receive that validation for what you deem to be an "edgy" and "unique" choice in religion. But really you have merely traded one master for another. : )

Here's a thought......if there were no humans, would there still be Satan? lol

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-23   15:42:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: abraxas (#4)

no, I don't care. Not like you think.

At least I care as much as others posting their articles. Otherwise, no one would ever post anything, including you. But as far as agreeing with me, I don't care. I know that most people don't agree. But then again, most people are idiots.

Anytime I agree with the majority, or the majority agrees with me, I know I am on the wrong track.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-03-23   15:52:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: PSUSA2 (#5)

Anytime I agree with the majority, or the majority agrees with me, I know I am on the wrong track.

The article has an obvious emphasis on seeking a majority. How is it that you missed that?

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-23   15:54:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: PSUSA2 (#5)

Anytime I agree with the majority, or the majority agrees with me, I know I am on the wrong track.

From the article: Satanism will win the hearts and minds of the people and eventually become the predominant religion of Planet Earth. lol

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-23   15:58:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: abraxas (#6) (Edited)

A worldwide majority has already been attained. xtianity is not a worldwide majority religion, and it shrinks daily. Not so here in the US. at least not yet. We're on the cutting edge...

It will be nice to be in the majority for once. That's because the current majority is facing destruction (read: premature yet timely death). You know, the kinds of topics people post here and elsewhere? It's not just mental masturbation; this shit's for real. It's just a matter of when, not if.

They're doing it to themselves, because they're fucking morons that cant think any further ahead than the noses on their faces.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-03-23   16:11:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: PSUSA2 (#8)

A worldwide majority has already been attained. xtianity is not a worldwide majority religion, and it shrinks daily.

We're on the cutting edge...

is facing destruction (read: premature yet timely death)

lol.....Christianity has NEVER been the worldwide majority. It had a long way to go to even catch up to Hinduism.

You're the majority....which you just stated was your indication that you're on the wrong track. LOL! You think you're "Breaking Loose" when really you are binding to what is predominant today. Yet you think joining the majority sets you apart from the herd and is "cutting edge".

Death is a natural part of life and something new evolves from the cycle. Who determines premature? However, as your article states your religion taking majority status isn't offering something new but rather something old and rather unoriginal that will go the way of the others one day. You cling to what is transient as the others you chastise do. You trade one master for another, yet do not see that you remain a slave.

If there were no humans, would Satan exist? lol

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-23   16:24:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: abraxas (#9)

If there were no humans, would Satan exist? lol

Satan(ism) is a state of mind.

Perhaps you will be proven right? Time will tell.

"Breaking Loose" when really you are binding to what is predominant today.

That makes no sense at all.

What's predominant today is being one of the herd. Some are part of large herds, others part of smaller herds. But, they are still herding creatures. Satanism is not a herd religion. It's as different as each individual, but with some general principles in common, namely choosing for ourselves what we want.

It had a long way to go to even catch up to Hinduism

Haven't you heard? Hindus are Satanists. Anyone not a xtian is a satanist. At least the xtians say so...

They're outnumbered by the muslims too.

Poor jesus, such a failure. lol. A real chip off the block, like father like son, etc.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-03-23   16:44:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: PSUSA2 (#10)

What's predominant today is being one of the herd. Some are part of large herds, others part of smaller herds. But, they are still herding creatures. Satanism is not a herd religion. It's as different as each individual, but with some general principles in common, namely choosing for ourselves what we want.....

"do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law"? [satan's herd religion.]

i'll stick with Jesus' little herd, thank you just the same.

....strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. bible.cc/matthew/7-14.htm

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. bible.cc/matthew/7-13.htm

The other day, a guy e-mailed me and said that he was a born- again Christian. Next he asked me what I could offer him.. Well, I told him the same thing that I'll tell you. I offered him his self respect and a parking place in Hell.

you and the Pharisees will make good hellmates.

"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2012-03-23   17:00:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: PSUSA2 (#10)

"Breaking Loose" when really you are binding to what is predominant today. That makes no sense at all.

What's predominant today is being one of the herd.

namely choosing for ourselves what we want.

Title of the article.......contradiction because you aren't breaking loose but joining the (predominant) majority way of thinking to "choose" ego for yourself, which has been a choice as long as humans have been on Earth. So "cutting edge" that choosing ego for yourself.

According to you and your article YOUR HERD IS THE BIGGEST! LOL! Hence, majority status. You have left one herd, the smaller herd, for another larger herd, yet you deem this "cutting edge" and original.

Yeah, that choosing for yourself is truly a major LEAP from the herd. Wait, that IS your herd. No wonder it's the majority. Have you considered it has ALWAYS been the majority, but you didn't realize it? LOL!

What if there were NO religions for you to run to when you tire of one? You run from Christianity to Satanism and think you are "breaking free" when you are really just picking a new master to serve. You choose ego for yourself~old as humanity that one, the very least "cutting edge" you could possibly find.

I've studied all the major religions and common threads run through the lot of them......your Satan is just one of these threads, but carry on with deeming yourself "cutting edge" because I do find it funny. Choosing ego is new, as least for you! : )

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-23   17:03:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: abraxas (#12)

According to you and your article YOUR HERD IS THE BIGGEST!

I didn't write the article. I can't think of too many articles I (or anyone else) posted that I totally agree with, except for teh articles i write myself. But there are imo good points in the article.

Is "our" herd the biggest? Hell no. First of all, it's individuals, not a herd. 2nd of all, most people are a part of a herd. The care more about agreeing with other members of their own herd than they care about what's best for themselves, and more importantly just thinking for themselves. They submit just like slaves submit.

On this board, I can probably count the number of true freethinkers on one hand and still make a usable fist. That's true here and in RL.

What if there were NO religions for you to run to when you tire of one? You run from Christianity to Satanism and think you are "breaking free" when you are really just picking a new master to serve.

Now you're just being silly.

There is no master in satanism except the satanist. It's about self-advancement and not about group advancement. But the only way any group can advance is if its individuals advance. That is how I see it.

For studying the worlds religions, you sure didn't learn much about satanism.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-03-23   17:31:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: PSUSA2 (#0)

my Xian programming kicked in full measure as I reached the word/name/whatever of this satan concept - there were years I could not repeat the word out loud due to the superstitions hard wired in

I've believed most my life though, that there is a difference tween the concepts of satan and Lucifer - the former being a creation of the Xians, the latter a phenomenon that existed long before their monster began teaching humanity blood sacrifices and genocide .... not being a card carrying scholar with pedigree from approved schools, I can not debate that ...

in one chat where a bible scholar spent her nights beating on anyone who does not have the entire book memorized, I asked a simple question, "What was Lucifer's crime?" What made their lil god hate and fear a concept so terribly that it will kill anyone who follows it?

she was stumped. I was amazed along with others ... if there was any specidic crime in that bible that could be blamed on Lucifer, she would have found it just to keep her reputation as one of her god's favorite kids ... over a dozen years having her slap me around in chats with her bible, but that night, nothing

only crime I find in history is not bowing down to this god and telling it how great it is above all others

this is a curious post to find here, not expected at all that I would be able to express these kinda thoughts on a political forum ... as for the herd mentality concept? I do know there is a sense of comfort to be alone in widernss for years, perhaps lifetimes, finally reaching the point where walking alone and ignoring the ego of the Xtian monster is more fitting than being part of some club, and then having a doorway appear, peek in, and find others to party with, or at least not try to 'save' you

from what little I can gather form the history someone didn't get around to destroying - Lightbeing (which became synominous with Lucifer) is a concept that predates Xtianity - it's touched on briefly in their lil handbook, but then transformmed into their satan feller and made into a bad guy

since we have scholars here and I'm certain this reply will tweek one of their noses .... hold yurself back from judging my choices and try to answer the question, what was Lucifers crime? ....


~ the truth will set ya free, but only after it pisses ya off ~

Amandil  posted on  2012-03-23   18:28:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Amandil (#14) (Edited)

what was Lucifers crime?

[correction: "Lucifer wanted to exalt himself above God."]

http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/lucifer.html

"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2012-03-23   19:14:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Amandil (#14)

what was Lucifers crime? ...

I do hope you're not holding your breath waiting for an answer.

It's like asking "what crimes did the jew 'god' commit?". They don't even want to think about it, much less discuss it, even though it is in black and white in their 'good book'.

You'll get various answers on the Satan/Lucifer names. Some consider them to be the same being, some say they're different, others point out that "Lucifer" doesn't even belong in the bible that one solitary time because it is a Latin word, not a Hebrew word.

To me it basically represents the balance between light and dark. Others will agree or disagree. My own belief is subject to change. I do lean to the theistic side of Satanism though, for my own reasons.

from what little I can gather form the history someone didn't get around to destroying - Lightbeing (which became synominous with Lucifer) is a concept that predates Xtianity -

They stole many such concepts, then twisted and inverted them.

--------------------------------------------------------
Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-03-23   19:24:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#15)

he wanted to be like God.

oh, that's terrible - off with his head then

... I found reference to him refusing to bow down to this god and making a mess of plans by offering knowledge to the kinda folks many call sheep in these modern times ...

... the old testament bible (which most world strife is currently being flamed by) documents everything else it finds important - how to kill, when it's okay not to kill (disbelievers are fair game but there's something about if a woman is a virgin and good looking you can take her home with you when done destroying everything else in her village) - taught to us by an angry, jealous being who insists that Lucifer is evil


~ the truth will set ya free, but only after it pisses ya off ~

Amandil  posted on  2012-03-23   19:32:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#11)

"do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law"? [satan's herd religion.]

If you're going to quote Crowley, at least know what you are babbling about.

Do what thou will does not mean do what you want. KCHGA and True Will. google it. Or not.

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. bible.cc/matthew/7-13.htm

Hmmm.

1 Timothy 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Slight contradiction there...

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Somebody ought to tell the truth about the Bible. The preachers dare not, because they would be driven from their pulpits. Professors in colleges dare not, because they would lose their salaries. Politicians dare not. They would be defeated. Editors dare not. They would lose subscribers. Merchants dare not, because they might lose customers. Men of fashion dare not, fearing that they would lose caste. Even clerks dare not, because they might be discharged. And so I thought I would do it myself... Robert Ingersoll

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-03-23   19:33:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: Amandil, AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#17)

The solitary reference of Lucifer in Isaiah, xiv, 12 is an incorrect translation of the Hebrew word 'helel' which means a waning luminary. Isaiah is actually referring to the waning power of the king of Babylon.

The reference in Luke, x, 18 and Revelation, ix 1-11 are the two NT references that claim Lucifer and Satan are synonymous with each other. However, given the true intent and meaning of Isaiah and 'helel' the claim that Satan and Lucifer are the same falls apart.

In review of AllTheKingsHorses link on the topic, the misinterpretation of Isaiah is not even mentioned and most of the commentary and verses are in reference to Satan and Satan gets multiple references in the NT.

It should also be noted that Satan means adversary in Hebrew and first appears in Chronicles, xxi, 1 where Satan tags along with the Sons of God to have a meet and greet with God. The second Satan appearance is in Job where Satan appears as God's angel and persuades God to test poor righteous Job. In the third reference Satan stands at the right hand of a wicked man. It's not until the fourth OT reference that Satan becomes an adversary to God and is rebuked for resisting Joshua.

Then, a major shift occurs in Matthew, iv 10-11 wherein Satan is dubbed diabolus/the devil.

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-23   19:55:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: abraxas (#19)

thank you for the information ... I've avoided reading what I'm supposed to believe on this subject since asking the question about 1 year ago this week

one thing of big surprise, based upon the intense programming I received as a youth, is that the word itself, Lucifer, doesn't scare me anymore, it was like a superstition, 'don't even think on this or god will destroy you' - another is that I still hold dear many of the things taught to me about the one they called Jesus - a radical himself, seemingly working against the monster that taught genocide -

the posts I make today are the result of 12 months reflection and dregging up memories of teachings and experience, I've avoided web sites and books and most certainly have not discussed this with peers ... honestly surprised yet to find the topic opening in a forum, after I made my choice not to fear the concept any longer - my conclusion is that the concept of a Lightbeing predates anything the monster taught humans and the only crime I find it is guilty of in memory, from my programming, is not bowing down to a monster


~ the truth will set ya free, but only after it pisses ya off ~

Amandil  posted on  2012-03-23   20:07:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: abraxas (#1)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”

—Samuel Adams

America: Israel's Handmaiden

Eric Stratton  posted on  2012-03-23   21:34:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: Amandil (#20)

one thing of big surprise, based upon the intense programming I received as a youth, is that the word itself, Lucifer, doesn't scare me anymore, it was like a superstition, 'don't even think on this or god will destroy you' - another is that I still hold dear many of the things taught to me about the one they called Jesus - a radical himself, seemingly working against the monster that taught genocide -

My best advice~Fear nothing and seek your own truth. Remember that Lucifer is the name of the morning star, Venus.

As for the Satan aspect, think of the story of the fall from heaven as an analogy for the fall of the heart of man. The counterpoint is the story of Jesus which represents man's redemption. So, naturally, that feels good. Even today Jesus is radical. Imagine if we actually lived the Sermon on the Mount.....what a world this would be. Both the fall and the redemption are continual, always happening, representing the fork in the road for the spirit.

To understand the OT, it is helpful to understand the age of Aries in which it was written. Aries rules war and sacrifice. When Hinduism was evolving the sign was Taurus and what animal holds great reverence in that faith? Bovine of course. Christ represents the move to Pieces and all that entails, so naturally fish are the symbol. We are now shifting to Aquarius and Christianity is feeling the pinch. Sometimes taking a macro view instead of a micro view brings perspective into focus. : )

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-24   0:50:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Eric Stratton (#21)

I listened to some Bob Dillon today and was feeling poetic. : )

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-03-24   0:51:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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