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Ron Paul
See other Ron Paul Articles

Title: Can Ron Paul Be Tamed?
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2012/02/02/can-ron-paul-be-tamed/
Published: Jun 10, 2012
Author: Justin Raimondo
Post Date: 2012-06-10 01:13:34 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 765
Comments: 45

No – but his campaign can by Justin Raimondo, February 03, 2012 Print This | Share This

You know you’ve hit the big time when the Establishment comes knocking on your door with an offer to sell out. It means you’re drawing blood: that your campaign, or whatever, is having an effect — and not one that pleases the Powers That Be. They want to defang you, if not shut you up, and they’re willing to offer you what Satan offered Jesus up there on that mountain:

"Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me. Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him."

If Ron Paul isn’t exactly Jesus, many of his supporters treat him as if he is indeed the incarnation of Liberty in human flesh: the media routinely describes them as "fanatical" – or, more charitably, "devoted" – and I don’t blame them for their enthusiasm (indeed, I share it). Paul is undoubtedly a messianic figure, although he is the last one to give himself that kind of aura, and that’s because we are indeed living in a time of woe, from whence a great many people are seeking deliverance. Ron is their one hope, a bright spot in an ever-darkening and increasingly scary world – and our elites don’t like that one bit.

What they especially don’t like are his foreign policy views, which are routinely described in the lame-stream media as "isolationist" – as if minding our own damned business and not trying to dominate the world would be an isolating act. And of course none of these geniuses ever described, say, Eugene McCarthy, or George McGovern as an "isolationist" – they were "antiwar" candidates because they were on the left, and because no one on the right can ever be against wars of aggression for moral reasons. Yet the 76-year-old country doctor and presidential candidate defies those stereotypes – and, in the process, delegitimizes them as standards of the American political lexicon. He has succeeded in creating a movement that truly transcends the tired old categories of "left" and "right."

This false left-right dichotomy, which does nothing to accurately map the landscape of 21st century American politics, is one of the main weapons in the War Party’s well-stocked arsenal. Because whatever liberals and conservatives disagree about, when it comes time to unleash the dogs of war both the "left" and the "right" have been equal in their bloodthirstiness. To keep up the illusion of conflict, these two wings of the War Party alternate their warmongering schedules: during the Vietnam war era, it was the right that wanted to obliterate the Soviets militarily and the "left" that took up the anti-interventionist banner – although liberal support for the war made the occupation of Vietnam possible, at least initially. In the1930s, their positions were reversed, with conservatives making the case for "isolationism" (i.e. opposition to empire-building): the warmongering was left to the liberals and the extreme left, notably the American Communist Party.

In both cases, the War Party was able to take advantage of the left-right split. In the Thirties, it was the Eastern seaboard Republicans, the Wendell Wilkie group, that absconded with the GOP presidential nomination and sold out the anti-interventionist cause on the campaign trail, never pushing the issue of FDR’s ill-disguised enthusiasm for getting us into the European war. After the election, Wilkie went over to the enemy completely, becoming one of FDR’s biggest supporters, and a tireless advocate of "internationalism," i.e. an American empire on which the sun never sets. His book, One World, is a veritable manifesto of left-sounding globaloney. Behind Wilkie were the big investment banks, the Anglophile elite whose cultural loyalties – and investments in the bonds of European governments – naturally led them into the pro-war camp.

In the 1960s, pro-war Democrats played the key role in getting us into Vietnam and keeping us there long after that disaster had begun to unfold. Back then, we were all chanting "Hey, hey, LBJ, how many kids did you kill today?!" That was what antiwar protesters were shouting in the streets as they demanded the withdrawal of US troops from Southeast Asia. Pro-war liberals, known today as neoconservatives, were an ideological bulwark protecting a Democratic administration against a massive and growing antiwar movement – a role that earned them the well-deserved animus of the New Left. The little group around Senator Henry Jackson (D-Boeing) which organized the "Committee for the Free World," provided most of the intellectual firepower behind this rearguard action. After the victory of the McGovernites, they threw up their hands and joined the Republicans: today, we know them as the neoconservatives.

The left-right mindset has another key advantage for the War Party: it keeps anti-interventionists out of the GOP. If the right is inherently warlike, and conservatives have a war gene, then anti-interventionists have no place else to go other than the Democratic party. Which means not only that they must buy into the party’s domestic agenda, but also be reduced to pleading when it comes to, say, reducing the "defense" budget, or refraining from intervening to plant the flag of "democracy" in some godforsaken wilderness. Opponents of our foreign policy of global intervention are entirely dependent on the Democratic leadership to implement their agenda, and keeping these people out of the GOP has been one of the key tasks of the neocons, a job they did with some efficiency until the Ron Paul movement came along.

Paul and his movement are onto the War Party’s games, and they are consciously fighting this left-right illusion — with amazing success. The time is right for it: the nation faces a crisis on a scale not seen since the 1930s. Once again we face the twin specters of an economy in collapse and a world at war. Paul cuts through the ideological fog and in doing so breaks with all the conventions, the worn and now useless political labels that have misled us for so long.

Smearing him hasn’t worked, mockery has just added to his fame, and ignoring him has seriously backfired on the mainstream media, which has made itself more hated by the Republican rank-and-file than it already is — no mean feat. Their last hope is to co-opt him – or, at least, co-opt his movement. And we are seeing the first signs of such an attempt in a front page story in the Washington Post, which posits the existence of a "strategic alliance" between Mitt Romney and Paul.

Let’s get this out of the way before we get to the really disturbing stuff: there is no such "alliance," strategic or otherwise. Reporter Amy Gardner states categorically that "Mitt Romney and Ron Paul haven’t laid a hand on each other." This is demonstrably and even brazenly untrue. How does Ms. Gardner explain this, and this, and this, and especially this? I could go on, but you see my point.

The piece goes on to note Romney and Paul "became friends in 2008," and "so did their wives." This confuses friendship with cordiality, and, again, proves nothing. Undeterred, Ms. Gardner presses ahead with the punch line:

"The Romney-Paul alliance is more than a curious connection. It is a strategic partnership: for Paul, an opportunity to gain a seat at the table if his long-shot bid for the presidency fails; for Romney, a chance to gain support from one of the most vibrant subgroups within the Republican Party."

So what’s this "strategic partnership" based on? Certainly on nothing Paul has ever said or done – but the people around him are a different matter, and here’s where it gets interesting. After citing various anonymous "senior GOP aides" who advise against alienating either Paul or the Paulians, we are given the following inside information:

"Romney’s aides are ‘quietly in touch with Ron Paul,’ according to a Republican adviser who is in contact with the Romney campaign and spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss its internal thinking. The two campaigns have coordinated on minor things, the adviser said — even small details, such as staggering the timing of each candidate’s appearance on television the night of the New Hampshire primary for maximum effect."

Yes, well, so what? That’s hardly a "strategic partnership": if anything, it’s a tactical convenience that has nothing to do with any policy or real political issues. On this front, Romney has little or nothing to offer Paul, but that doesn’t stop wily old Satan from taking Jesus up to the mountain, and offering him the following:

"’Ron Paul wants a presence at the convention,’ the [GOP] adviser said — and Romney, if he is the nominee, would grant it.

"What Paul and his supporters would demand, and what Romney would offer, are subjects of some speculation. One Paul adviser, speaking on the condition of anonymity to talk freely, said prime-time speaking slots for Paul and his son Rand, the junior senator from Kentucky, are obvious goals. On the policy front, Ron Paul’s priorities are reforming the Federal Reserve and reducing federal spending. So promises to audit the Fed and to tackle deficit reduction seriously could appease the congressman and his supporters, the adviser said.

"Less likely are concessions on foreign policy, where Paul’s non-interventionist stand is at odds with that of Romney and most other Republicans."

So here is the bargain: give up this non-interventionist foreign policy stuff and we’ll let you speak at the convention, maybe let your son speak – all in exchange for an endorsement of Romney. We may even pay lip service to some of your economic views: maybe we’ll set up a Gold Commission, as was done some years ago under Reagan. Just shut up about foreign policy.

It isn’t going to happen: unless it’s a wide-open convention, Paul will not be given a speaking slot of any prominence, because he won’t endorse Romney. Period. But there are other ways to influence the candidate, who is after all conducting more of an educational and movement-building campaign within the GOP, as opposed to a conventional candidate-centered campaign. In the Paul camp, the focus is on the message, not the candidate – but there are ways to influence the manner in which that message reaches the general public.

Ron himself is incorruptible: indeed, he is far more radical on foreign policy than I ever expected him to be. When the subject is economics, he always brings it back to foreign policy, pointing out the indissoluble link between a free and growing economy and a peaceful foreign policy. He is constantly saying that if only we would get rid of the Empire, we could begin to reform our domestic entitlement programs and deal with all the problems we have right here at home.

They can’t influence Ron – but they can influence his organization. Gardner reports that after Ron’s son, Rand, won the Kentucky primary against an Establishment opponent, "Then, quite strangely, the establishment and the Pauls came together":

"At [Sen. Mitch] McConnell’s request, the National Republican Senatorial Committee sent an adviser to Kentucky to watch over Rand Paul’s general-election campaign — ‘to be the grown-up in the room,’ according to one Washington Republican who spoke on the condition of anonymity to talk candidly.

"The adviser, Trygve Olson, developed a friendship with Rand Paul, and the two realized that they could teach each other a lot — to the benefit of both candidate and party. Olson showed Paul and his campaign establishment tactics: working with the news media, fine-tuning its message. And Paul showed Olson — and by extension, McConnell — how many people were drawn to the GOP by his message of fiscal responsibility…. And at Rand Paul’s suggestion, Olson joined his father’s presidential campaign this year, basically to do what he did for Rand: help bring the Paul constituency into the Republican coalition without threatening the party. It’s probably no small coincidence that the partnership helps Rand’s burgeoning political career, too."

Who is Trygve Olson? A former official of the International Republican Institute (IRI), a tax-funded "regime-change" operation under the rubric of the National Endowment for Democracy, Olson was involved in several of the "color revolutions" that swept Eastern Europe and the central Asian former Soviet republics during the Bush years. This New York Times article reports on his activities in Belarus meddling in their internal politics and plotting to overthrow its thuggish President, Alexander Lukashenko: he also played a part in stirring up similar trouble on Washington’s behalf in Serbia and Poland.

At a meeting of the New Atlantic Initiative, another semi-official interventionist outfit, in 2004, Olson appeared on the same podium as various government apparatchiks of the old Cold Warrior/Radio Free Europe type, who gave seminars on the ins-and-outs of successful "regime change." While others gave talks on Lukashenko’s "links" to Saddam Hussein and Israel’s other enemies in the region, Olson gave a presentation on polling results in the country. A particular area of concern was the possibility of an economic or political union with Russia, which was seen by the participants as the main threat to "democracy" and Europeanization in Belarus. And while meddling in Eastern Europe appears to be his specialty – his wife, Erika Veberyte, served as chief foreign policy advisor to the Speaker of the Lithuanian parliament – this biography on the web site of the Freeman Spogli Institute for International Studies at Stanford University says:

"Mr. Olson has helped advise political parties and candidates in numerous countries throughout the world including nearly all of Central and Eastern Europe, Indonesia, Ukraine, Kyrgyzstan, Nigeria, Venezuela, and Serbia."

The "color revolutions" of the Bush era were brazen attempts to overthrow regimes deemed unfriendly to the US, and absorb the scattered pieces of the former Soviet Union into the Western sphere of influence. Of course, these efforts all backfired: in Georgia, for one example, our chosen candidate set up a veritable dictatorship, jailed his opponents for "treason," and launched a disastrous war against Russia. In Ukraine and Kyrgyzstan, too, our sock puppets set themselves up for a backlash: both US-installed regimes have since been ousted, either by being unceremoniously voted out of office or by force. In Venezuela, the US government has long sought to overthrow the blustering caudillo, Hugo Chavez, and our meddling has only played into his hands, enabling him to muster nationalist resentment against the democratic opposition. The same is generally true elsewhere. These "strategic" deployments of "soft power" never work, and wind up hurting our interests rather than advancing them.

Another aspect of these "soft power" deployments is the inevitable involvement of the American intelligence community in some form or other, engaging in covert operations with no real congressional oversight and without the knowledge or consent of the American people. This can lead to all kinds of abuses that inevitably impact on our domestic politics – an area where the CIA is supposedly forbidden from entering, although that has never been the case.

In the New York Times piece on the Belarussian operation, the reporter describes a meeting attended by Olson and Belarussian dissidents as "a meeting of the freedom industry," a telling description because that’s exactly what it is: an industry, one in which Olson is a player. It’s the "regime change" industry that has flourished in this country ever since the start of the cold war. The necons played a key role in staffing the organizations and semi-official front groups into which billions of our tax dollar flowed: Reagan gave the National Endowment for Democracy to them as a sort of playground, where they were out of the way and free to think they had some real influence on the administration. In the post-cold war world, the NED took on added importance – and more tax dollars – as the US tried to cash in on the Soviet collapse by sponsoring "color revolutions" throughout the former Soviet bloc. It didn’t matter that the very reason for launching these cold war institutions was no longer in existence: as one needn’t explain to a Ron Paul supporter, government programs have a life of their own, and killing them is akin to driving a stake through the heart of a vampire – a difficult and often impossible feat.

So we have a major player in the "regime change" industry as a "senior advisor" to the Paul campaign: and not only that but a pedagogical relationship between Olson and Rand Paul. The latter has presumably learned from the former why draconian sanctions on Iran – deemed an "act of war" by his father – are a good idea and ought to be supported. Paul recently joined ninety-nine other similarly clueless US Senators in voting "aye" on what is in effect an economic blockade against Iran.

The Establishment’s strategy is clear: get to the father through the son, whose political career can be imperiled by the GOP elders, like McConnell (although that didn’t stop Paul from getting elected over McConnel’s opposition). If the Paul campaign is "infiltrating" the GOP, as Gardner puts it, then the GOP Establishment is intent on infiltrating the Paul campaign at the highest levels.

So if you wondered why the official Paul for President campaign ads devote almost no time to foreign policy issues, then perhaps now you have your answer. Of course, that hasn’t stopped several independent political action committees from making strong anti-interventionist statements on Paul’s behalf: but still, that this end run is even necessary raises all sorts of questions, one of which is surely the exact nature of Olson’s role.

The libertarian movement has been through this sort of thing before. Back in 1980, the Libertarian Party’s presidential candidate, Ed Clark, and his handlers at the Cato Institute, tried to pass off libertarianism as "low tax liberalism." The scheme failed miserably: as Murray Rothbard put it at the time: "They sold their souls for a mess of pottage, and then didn’t even get the pottage!" A similar effort to sell libertarianism as a marginally less belligerent version of conservatism isn’t going to do much better – and certainly Paul himself would have nothing to do with such an effort. As we all know, however, Paul isn’t a hands-on manager: he tends to trust people to carry out his wishes. That hands-off tendency has gotten him in trouble before.

The GOP Establishment fears – and, yes, hates – Ron Paul, and they have good reason to feel that way. It is hardly beyond comprehension that they would attempt to influence – and, ultimately, derail – the campaign and the movement it represents in this covert manner. I don’t think they are stupid enough to believe they can somehow finagle Paul into endorsing Romney, or whoever the GOP candidate might be: what they rightly fear, however, is that the Paul campaign will not end in Tampa – that Paul will launch a third party bid.

That’s what this wheeling and dealing, these shadowy movements in the background, are all about. Whether they will succeed remains to be seen. The signs, however, are not good. Gardner cites Jesse Benton, Paul’s campaign manager, as saying:

"You can dress in black and stand on the hill and smash the state and influence nobody, or you can realize the dynamics and the environment and get involved in the most pragmatic way to win minds and win votes and influence change. That’s what we’re trying to do."

This is the classic argument for a sell out. The irony is that there is nothing pragmatic about it. The American people stand shoulder to shoulder with Ron when it comes to foreign policy, as every poll has shown. The question is whom do the Paulians want to "influence" – the American people, or the very Establishment they’ve been fighting all these years? The alternative to standing on a hill and making a fashion statement isn’t selling out libertarianism’s anti-imperialist heritage: it’s making that heritage understandable and attractive to the American majority, which is already with us in spirit.

NOTES IN THE MARGIN

The plan, apparently, is to push Rand Paul for the Vice Presidential nomination. These people are deluding themselves – but, then again, that’s how the sell out starts.

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#1. To: christine (#0)

Justin does good research and provides a good analysis - as far as it goes, but the RNC leadership is not the top tier.

We can see that if only by how the two parties coordinate on key issues and play "food fight" on others. The "leadership" of the 1 1/2 parties takes orders from above.

So, the real question is not does the RNC establishment want to stop Ron Paul and the Liberty movement, but who is pulling their strings? They are policy implementers they do not create policy.

The top tier always always always traces back to the Banksters and the Psychiatrists who formulate the large social manipulation programs i.e., The Rotchilds and the Tavistock Institute.

Perseverent Gardener
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2012-06-10   2:25:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Jethro Tull, Phant2000, Christine, Rubes (#0)

You know you’ve hit the big time when the Establishment comes knocking on your door with an offer to sell out

He got that part right.

The rest is excess verbiage laced with political hogwash and nonsense.

Ron made a pact with the devil that benefits his son. Just one more deal made by a professional politician.

The aggrieved parties here are Rons supporters that followed the Pied Piper one time too many. They need to suck it up, admit it and change horses. Many of us were conned last time but we got off the Paul wagon in 2008.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   3:58:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: christine (#0)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”

—Samuel Adams

America: Israel's Handmaiden

Eric Stratton  posted on  2012-06-10   4:49:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Original_Intent (#1)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”

—Samuel Adams

America: Israel's Handmaiden

Eric Stratton  posted on  2012-06-10   4:51:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Cynicom (#2)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”

—Samuel Adams

America: Israel's Handmaiden

Eric Stratton  posted on  2012-06-10   4:55:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Cynicom, 4UM, R.I.P. Supporters, Ron Paul Dreamers, Optimists Everywhere (#2)

Ron made a pact with the devil that benefits his son. Just one more deal made by a professional politician.

Dear Cyni,

Greetings from Rubeland, USA. Justin and you were both spot on correct as to the outcome or end result of this years "APAULING" primary season that actually looks like a Presidential Reality Show. Entertainment where the bad guys always win !!!

The titular head of this Freedom REVOLUTION (hahahahaha) has been deafeningly silent since his boy's Benedict Arnold moment on the FOX NEWS Syndicated program hosted by Sean Hannity, a program that his daddy refused to appear on.

The timing of the announcement and the fact that the Freedom Fighters had their arms twisted to say "UNCLE Romulus" exactly on the day of the Texas delegate Convention surely must strike Paul's constituents as at least curious if not dowright rude. Now this deafening silence from Ron after his fan base had (AGAIN) sacrificed "everything" especially their sacred honor to see FREEDOM ring - only to hear the death knell tolling for their struggle and their leader. I say this because the only way for Paul to explain his recent behavior is to do it from a hospital bed.

"HEADLINE" RON PAUL SPEAKS FROM BETHESDA HOSPITAL AFTER EMERGENCY TREATMENT"

Roll the cameras, move in for a close up. Ron could say something like, I've been ill for about 6 months now and have recently discovered that my health will decline to such a degree that running the country is out of the question.

We, Rand and I, spoke privately with Mitt Romney about those things we felt critical to the future of the country, as well as my health, and decided Romney's a better candidate to take the Office of President at this time. I must apologize to my constituents for my failing health, but I assure you that Mitt has promised to look at the issues our campaign has relentlessly pursued. (wink-wink)

Again, I'd like to thank my supporters for their tireless efforts. Please give Uncle Romulus a decent opportunity to administer the Office should he be elected President.

Nurse, my enema please !

[Anyway, that's my guess.]

"The few who understand the [FEDERAL RESERVE] system will either be so interested in its profits or be so dependent upon its favours that there will be no opposition from that class, while on the other hand, the great body of people, mentally incapable of comprehending the tremendous advantage that capital derives from the system, will bear its burdens without complaint, and perhaps without even suspecting that the system is inimical to their interests."

The Rothschild brothers of London writing to associates in New York, 1863.

noone222  posted on  2012-06-10   4:58:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: christine (#0)

All I can say is that when this election cycle ends - it will be bittersweet.

"The few who understand the [FEDERAL RESERVE] system will either be so interested in its profits or be so dependent upon its favours that there will be no opposition from that class, while on the other hand, the great body of people, mentally incapable of comprehending the tremendous advantage that capital derives from the system, will bear its burdens without complaint, and perhaps without even suspecting that the system is inimical to their interests."

The Rothschild brothers of London writing to associates in New York, 1863.

noone222  posted on  2012-06-10   6:24:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: All (#7)

This, from Ron Paul's perspective !

"The few who understand the [FEDERAL RESERVE] system will either be so interested in its profits or be so dependent upon its favours that there will be no opposition from that class, while on the other hand, the great body of people, mentally incapable of comprehending the tremendous advantage that capital derives from the system, will bear its burdens without complaint, and perhaps without even suspecting that the system is inimical to their interests."

The Rothschild brothers of London writing to associates in New York, 1863.

noone222  posted on  2012-06-10   6:32:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: noone222, cynicom, christine, 4 (#6) (Edited)

we are indeed living in a time of woe, from whence a great many people are seeking deliverance. Ron is their one hope, a bright spot in an ever-darkening and increasingly scary world – and our elites don’t like that one bit.

The elites don't give a rats ass.

IMO the elites wouldn't have it any other way.

Ron Paul is allowed to do what he does, in order to keep his supporters in The System.

The last thing "they" want is to have a substantial number of loose cannons rolling around on the deck, cutting themselves off from the system and doing their own thing.

And when Paul is gone, the freedom-minded will be forced to look for a replacement, and that effort will keep them in The System.

People haven't learned that working within the system gets them nowhere fast.

They are "seeking deliverance. Ron is their one hope, a bright spot in an ever-darkening and increasingly scary world", but they are seeking this deliverance from the outside, depending on Someone Else to deliver them. And they are doing it out of fear.

How's that working? Has anyone been delivered yet???

------------------------------------------

Whenever there's resistance, examine your motivation. Whenever there's flow, consider taking action.

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-06-10   6:52:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: noone222, Jethro Tull, Christine, Phant2000, randge (#6)

Greetings from Rubeland, USA. Justin and you were both spot on correct as to the outcome or end result of this years "APAULING" primary season that actually looks like a Presidential Reality Show. Entertainment where the bad guys always win !!!

no...

It is indeed difficult for anyone to recognize that they have been used, abused, conned and thrown away, for future political consideration.

Not only do the abused refuse to publicly admit they were misused, as we see here daily, they go on vicious personal attacks, trying to assuage their crushed feelings by inflicting harsh words on others.

To date only one 4um member has had the integrity to post to me, with instructions where to send their portion of crow. One.

The other steadfast Ron supporters cannot admit they were taken and move on.

The result of these many months of contention is that we will have Obongo, or Oromney for president AND THE WARS GO ON.

In the background this corrupt government is planning for a future much bigger war, that will engulf every American.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   7:14:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: PSUSA2 (#9)

Ron Paul is allowed to do what he does, in order to keep his supporters in The System.

Since Pauls debacle in 2008, I have written here a few times that there is a possibility that Paul IS AND HAS BEEN PART AND PARCEL OF THE SYSTEM.

Pauls position is so far right that no other conservative ever stood a chance to organize Americans as did Perot. Perot brought out 20 million VOTERS IN AN ELECTION, Ron has always been a stalking horse for the system, nothing more.

Now we have Rand who will prove to be a rock ribbed republican, owned and operated by the system and its owners.

A telling point on Rons total approach has been that the Federal Reserve has always been his whipping boy. Voters have not a clue who the Fed is and care less.

If Ron had been beating the drums about the endless wars with all their bleeding, killing and dying, people would have reacted to that. We all understand wars and dying.

To me that gave a clue that Ron was giving the "system" a pass to continue our endless wars.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   7:28:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Cynicom (#11)

I think you may be right. We agree, but from different angles.

Sheep accept the fed as a fait accompli. The only ones that care about it are those already labeled as enemies by our .gov

When I said "Ron Paul is allowed to do...", I gave him the benefit of the doubt, in a moment of weakness.

------------------------------------------

Whenever there's resistance, examine your motivation. Whenever there's flow, consider taking action.

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-06-10   7:53:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: PSUSA2 (#12)

Whatever the payoff might be, we may never know, Rand will be taken care of in the future and all indications are that he will be a big business, anti labor, rock ribbed republican.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   8:06:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Eric Stratton, Cynicom (#5)

Jesse Benton forfeited the Texas primary to Romney on May 14. That decision was very bitterly criticised by a number of people on Daily Paul. If Ron Paul was not O.K. with that, he should have fired Benton. The son betraying the father narrative makes no sense.

The excuses and justifications being given to defend the actions of the campaign are self contradictory. If primaries really don't matter, and there is no such thing as bound delegates, then there is no reason to concede at this point. If, on the other hand, primaries DO matter, then the decision of the campaign not to even try to win a primary is indefensible. If Ron Paul cannot be held responsible for the conduct of his campaign, then how is he qualified to be President?

strepsiptera  posted on  2012-06-10   8:39:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Cynicom (#2)

Many of us were conned last time but we got off the Paul wagon in 2008.

I wasn't on the '08 RP bandwagon, you were. I didn't vote for Jimmy Carter, you did. Some here voted for both Bushes, while others voted for Obama. I really think it's time to drop the personal political admonishments, and agree that we all are in the same boat vis a vis putting hope and trust in politicians at some time in our life.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2012-06-10   8:39:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Cynicom (#10)

It is indeed difficult for anyone to recognize that they have been used, abused, conned and thrown away, for future political consideration.

I am not a victim and I never will be, I will survive with a happy and open heart, refusing to the bitter end to buy into a pity party over "used, abused, conned and thrown away" sniveling.

Time to wipe away the tears and put on your big boy panties Cyni.

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-06-10   9:41:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: abraxas (#16)

Gee AB, someone said you were in mourning.

They lied????

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   9:43:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: Cynicom (#17)

Gee AB, someone said you were in mourning.

I'm moving on and moving forward Cyni...that's what survivors do. I've never been one to cry over spilt milk or carry on like a duped gambler for four years over campaign contributions. I gave with an open heart and good intentions, so that is enough for me. No regrets, not even one.

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-06-10   9:47:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: strepsiptera (#14)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”

—Samuel Adams

America: Israel's Handmaiden

Eric Stratton  posted on  2012-06-10   9:49:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Cynicom (#2)

The rest is excess verbiage laced with political hogwash and nonsense.

You sure have that right. Until these "commentators" and "daily rag writers" tell it how it REALLY is, then their "excess verbiage" is of so little importance, I can't imagine why they waste their time. To keep the bad boys away from THEIR door, maybe???

Phant2000  posted on  2012-06-10   9:51:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Phant2000 (#20)

ntil these "commentators" and "daily rag writers" tell it how it REALLY is, then their "excess verbiage" is of so little importance, I can't imagine why they waste their time.

Okay, Phant, tell us all how it REALLY is........with no speculation or conjecture or opinion. Just the facts please.

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-06-10   9:56:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: Phant2000 (#20)

One thing I learned when I got my PHD was that when trying to confuse the rubes, muddy the waters, cloud the issue, was to, start with a small grain of truth and then proceed to run everyone astray that when you finished, they forget the truth and will run with the manure.

Works every time.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   10:00:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Phant2000 (#20)

Some wag, that shall remain unnamed, sent me a PM of official Ron Paul mourners, that reside at 4um.

The sender requested I be nice to them, so I have been doing so, except to Jethro.

Jethro had the personal integrity to send me a public note of where to send his portion of Ron Paul Crow.

The other friends have been using naughty words and throwing stones at me.

I am thinking of registering and voting for Oromney and Orando. I want to do my share for Ron Paul. Faithful to the end.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   10:06:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: strepsiptera, All (#14)

deleted

The relationship between morality and liberty is a directly proportional one.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”

—Samuel Adams

America: Israel's Handmaiden

Eric Stratton  posted on  2012-06-10   10:07:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: Jethro Tull, Paul mourners, rubes (#15)

I really think it's time to drop the personal political admonishments, and agree that we all are in the same boat vis a vis putting hope and trust in politicians at some time in our life.

Shucks, you mean it is time to stop rubbing salt in the Paul mourners wounds.

Somehow Jethro, I tend to believe if the shoe were switched, I would be burned at the stake and all my friends would be dancing around the camp fire.

I do not recall anyone calling for a ceasefire during the past few months when I was nearly the lone dissenter.

Make a deal with all my friends at 4um, I will turn a new page but I expect something in return, for the honest ones to spell out what is the Pauls reward. Personally I doubt many have that much integrity.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   10:15:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: PSUSA2 (#9)

Ron Paul is allowed to do what he does, in order to keep his supporters in The System.

The last thing "they" want is to have a substantial number of loose cannons rolling around on the deck, cutting themselves off from the system and doing their own thing.

Exactly.

The zeal and naive enthusiasm of RP's youthful supporters could not be allowed to remain uncontrolled.

At the very least, now their spirit has been broken.

‘Gentlemen, if you’ve ever thought about it,
the quality of a man’s life is directly proportionate to
his commitment to excellence.’
~Vince Lombardi

Buzzard  posted on  2012-06-10   10:16:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: Cynicom (#25)

Make a deal with all my friends at 4um, I will turn a new page but I expect something in return, for the honest ones to spell out what is the Pauls reward. Personally I doubt many have that much integrity.

It's all about YOU Cyni. YOU will make a deal and YOU will turn a new page.....for something in return. Only YOU are honest. Only YOU have integrity. Only YOU know Paul's rewards.

Please, get your arrogance and conceit under control.....you are making a royal ass of yourself. Find a shred of integrity within yourself before you make judgment on the integrity of others.

Let's be honest--YOU do not know Paul's reward (s). You have speculation, conjecture, opinion, and the heavy burden of your own personal butt hurt towards Ron Paul. That might be tough for you to swallow, but it is honest.

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-06-10   10:28:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: noone222 (#8)

The Ron Paul kiddies should have spent more time analysing Classic Rock.

‘Gentlemen, if you’ve ever thought about it,
the quality of a man’s life is directly proportionate to
his commitment to excellence.’
~Vince Lombardi

Buzzard  posted on  2012-06-10   10:28:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: noone222 (#7)

There you go again......playing one of my favorite tunes. : )

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-06-10   10:30:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: Cynicom (#25)

for the honest ones to spell out what is the Pauls reward.

I enjoyed having him in the debates, but was never a financial, or even a bumper sticker supporter.

In any event, here's a bit of speculation:
Now there's absolutely no chance that any of Ron Paul's granddaughters will end up as heroin addicts working in a Mexican brothel.

‘Gentlemen, if you’ve ever thought about it,
the quality of a man’s life is directly proportionate to
his commitment to excellence.’
~Vince Lombardi

Buzzard  posted on  2012-06-10   10:40:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: Buzzard (#30)

I have promised my many friends at 4um that I will no longer post anything concerning certain people.

Today I have been trying to pin down just what date the Nixons and Eisenhowers made such a splash in public of lavishing praise and endorsement upon Obongo in 2008.

I wonder if they are taking a pass this time?

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   10:59:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: Cynicom (#31)

Today I have been trying to pin down just what date the Nixons and Eisenhowers made such a splash in public of lavishing praise and endorsement upon Obongo in 2008.

A Nixon for Obama By MICHAEL LUO April 21, 2008, 4:49 PM

I wonder if they are taking a pass this time?

I'm not sure. But Trump supported him back in '08 & he jumped ship long ago.

‘Gentlemen, if you’ve ever thought about it,
the quality of a man’s life is directly proportionate to
his commitment to excellence.’
~Vince Lombardi

Buzzard  posted on  2012-06-10   11:09:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: noone222 (#6)

spot on and amusing!

christine  posted on  2012-06-10   11:16:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: Buzzard (#32)

thanks for url.

I voted Ike once and Nixon twice, guess that makes me an Obongo enthusiast.

Cynicom  posted on  2012-06-10   11:17:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: Cynicom (#10)

well said, Cyni

did you get a chance to watch this?

the most crushing part--when Adam asks Penny "do you think Ron knew?," she falters, gets tearful, then answers "I know his portfolio has grown."

christine  posted on  2012-06-10   11:21:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: strepsiptera (#14)

If Ron Paul cannot be held responsible for the conduct of his campaign, then how is he qualified to be President?

ziiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing!!!

christine  posted on  2012-06-10   11:23:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: Eric Stratton (#19)

This ship's going under, even w/ Ron Paul at the helm if by some strange stroke of fate he were actually to get the wheel. In fact, perhaps the PTB would ensure that it goes under w/ him at the wheel. The only question that remains is who's going to still be treading water after the last vestiges of the USS U.S.I. goes under, and what will the rescue ships' names read.

my husband could have written that. ;)

christine  posted on  2012-06-10   11:30:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Buzzard (#26)

At the very least, now their spirit has been broken.

It can be rebuilt.

Really, that breaking had to happen sooner or later. Otherwise there would be no change.

It'll be interesting to see how this rebuilding evolves. IMO it has to be rebuilt into something, because rejoining the herd is unthinkable.

I just hope they don't join another personality cult to replace the one that just got flushed like yesterdays meal.

------------------------------------------

Whenever there's resistance, examine your motivation. Whenever there's flow, consider taking action.

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-06-10   11:47:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: christine (#35)

"I know his portfolio has grown."

Oh geez, the man holds gold so of course his portfolio has grown.

Fact is, she said "I don't know." So, what we have here is more speculation to add to the speculation pile.

" If you cannot govern yourself, you will be governed by assholes. " Randge, Poet de Forum, 1/11/11

"Life's tough, and even tougher if you're stupid." --John Wayne

abraxas  posted on  2012-06-10   12:02:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: PSUSA2 (#38)

At the very least, now their spirit has been broken.

It can be rebuilt.

After reading your response, I realized I had miscommunicated my thought. The word "broken" should have been "fractured" - suggesting that a healing would be needed rather than a rebuilding.

Some of those spirits will knit back together and become stronger - but only those which are properly set and cast.

Most will not. And that is the intention.

because rejoining the herd is unthinkable.

Many of the younger members of the Ron Paul movement had never yet officially become "part of the herd" to begin with. This disillusionment is the first step in the manipulative process resulting in their becoming bridled and saddled.

For many the seed / cancer of futility will enter that fracture and never permit the wholeness of hope to completely regenerate.

I just hope they don't join another personality cult to replace the one that just got flushed

For most it will become a conditioned response. On that you can bet your house. (Just ask the older Ron Paul supporters how many of them had previously fell under the spell of Ross Perot?)

‘Gentlemen, if you’ve ever thought about it,
the quality of a man’s life is directly proportionate to
his commitment to excellence.’
~Vince Lombardi

Buzzard  posted on  2012-06-10   14:02:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Buzzard (#40) (Edited)

Some of those spirits will knit back together and become stronger - but only those which are properly set and cast.

Most will not. And that is the intention.

I tend to disagree with that.

I don't see them as being inferior spirits. I don't see myself as being a superior spirit.

I was in the same boat as they are in now. For example, the things I rail about with xianity, I used to do the same things. I was a fundie. I also wanted to be a cop (failed the psych test), and a lot of other things that most here don't like.

I went hunting for truth, the same as these people did, and I had more than one false start.

Beating this program is a real bitch. Anyone thinks beating it is easy is in for a rude awakening. They look outside for answers, and the answers aren't there.

I do think they have made substantial progress in beating the program. I'm more optimistic. They don't like what they see, but they don't know what to do yet. I think they'll figure it out. If I can, anyone can.

Many of the younger members of the Ron Paul movement had never yet officially become "part of the herd" to begin with. This disillusionment is the first step in the manipulative process resulting in their becoming bridled and saddled.

This is true and I didn't consider that. But disillusionment imo is not the problem. It is the solution. Disillusionment is removing the illusion. It's a shock, but it's not a bad thing.

------------------------------------------

Whenever there's resistance, examine your motivation. Whenever there's flow, consider taking action.

PSUSA2  posted on  2012-06-10   15:09:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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