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9/11
See other 9/11 Articles

Title: Smoke and Mirrors videos-controversy topic
Source: various
URL Source: http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/reada ... gi?ArtNum=149329&Disp=671#C671
Published: Sep 29, 2012
Author: Me and various
Post Date: 2012-09-29 01:19:12 by GreyLmist
Keywords: 9/11, NIST, PBS, CBS
Views: 2966
Comments: 94

Relevant info on this topic is accessible through posts #586 and #671 linked below:

4um Title: How 9-11 Was Done

Post #586 -- videos, links, and details

Post #671 -- WETA/PBS addendum info

Poster Comment:

Tangential discussion starting point [#103] at 4um Title: Pilots Analyze the Government Provided Radar Data of the Planes of 9-11, if needed for referencing here.

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  

Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 22.

#9. To: All, *9-11*, *No Planers* (#0) (Edited)

This is an addendum for references on an additional documentary circa 2003 (Ref. web.archive.org: 911conspiracy.tv - 2nd WTC Attack Videos - CBS3: "The Center of the World - New York: A Documentary Film" | PBS, Lisa Ades, Ric Burns, and David Ogden Stiers, narrator) that is said to be the origin of the now unavailable Detroit Public TV documentary footage (referenced at the start of the Smoke and Mirrors long- version video with the Detroit Public TV logo and also in the 8-sec. US Department of Commerce/NIST video with the WETA logo for Washington D.C. PBS; Ref. Posts #586 and #671).

In comparison to the Smoke and Mirrors (long version) PBS footage: All of the original CBS news footage that I've viewed up to this point of the Empire State Building angle likewise shows the plane image as if it appears out of nowhere to the right of the Empire State Building or from behind it, depending on which broadcast segments are being reported/discussed. Also, in all of the available PBS video-clip examples that I've noted above, the screen jumps as if spliced like the Smoke and Mirrors segment does. Neither of these issues (the appearance of the plane image as if out of nowhere and the screen jump as if spliced) should be attributed to tampering by whomever authored the Smoke and Mirrors analysis videos at the terrorize.dk site or to Elpiper who posted them at YouTube in May and June of 2008 because they are evidenced in MSM CBS and PBS film of 9/11. The color darkening seen more in the Smoke and Mirrors short-version is similar to an MSM Chopper view that I'll try to relocate and post as an example. The copied smoke alteration is debateable as to how and from what source that happened and there could be some interpretive problems with the wording of the comments in the video analyses. It is still my impression as of now, though, from what I can recall of much earlier discussions about this video topic, that the coloration and smoke copying was for dramatic effect by the Media to promote the Iraq war.

At watchdocumentary.com: The biggest source of free documentaries to watch online

Segment 4 at 1:17

New York: A Documentary Film - Episode 08: The Center of the World (1946–2003)

YouTube Playlist by me of the documentary: PBS, New York - 8 Center Of The World -- 7 videos, duration 1:30:50, go to 1:17 of video #4 for comparisons with the other footage in question.

Description excerpts:

New York: A Documentary Film is an eight-part, 17½ hour, American documentary film on the history of New York City. It was directed by Ric Burns and originally aired in the U.S. on PBS. The film was a co-production of Thirteen New York and WGBH Boston.

The documentary is divided into eight parts: * Episode One: The Country and the City (1609--1825) * Episode Two: Order and Disorder (1825--1865) * Episode Three: Sunshine and Shadow (1865--1898) * Episode Four: The Power and the People (1898--1918) * Episode Five: Cosmopolis (1919--1931) * Episode Six: City of Tomorrow (1929--1941) * Episode Seven: The City and the World (1945--2000) * Episode Eight: The Center of the World (1946--2003)

Additional References:

Film Credits . New York The Center of the World . WGBH American Experience - PBS

freerepublic.com: PBS TV -- The Center of the World (a WTC history)

Edit to insert a PBS notation in paragraph 2.

GreyLmist  posted on  2012-10-01   5:48:59 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

One more thing GL. Being that apparently the "Smoke and Mirrors" video is the "best" evidence you can drag off the net in terms of supporting your theory, it should be clear that your theory doesn't hold water.

It's obvious to me that this video is quite important to you, since if it wasn't you'd move on to better things to research and investigate. Being that at least I know that this video is a complete fraud, you're never going to convince me of what you're peddling, although I'm sure you'll be tap dancing all over the forum trying to convince others that it's bonafide evidence.

Yep, it's bonafide evidence alright. Evidence that someone released a doctored video to PBS stations for broadcast, and then others either out of malice or ignorance decided that it's "evidence" of the "no planes" theory.

Since the author of the "Smoke and Mirrors" video claims expertise, and he even includes the source CBS footage in his extended video, it's apparent that he's not doing it out of ignorance.

FormerLurker  posted on  2012-10-01   11:08:20 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

The Smoke and Mirrors videos have never been a No Planes presentation by me or anyone else here in these discussions that I know of, except in your imagination. They are a Media Fakery issue that arose simply as a smoke direction anomaly example. I started this thread as a research center convenience on the issues because or your misinterpretations and besiegings through hundreds of posts that were spanning two other topics, despite all attempts to explain the matter.

The plane out of nowhere appearance is from CBS footage. The splice jump is from PBS footage which used the CBS footage and the NIST footage shows that too. There are numerous examples of MSM footage on the web with comparatively dark coloration of WTC scenes. The PBS documentary footage that I posted at #9 is full of darkened coloration of WTC scenes. Reference watchdocumentary.com: New York A Documentary Film - Episode 08 The Center of the World (1946–2003) and the YouTube Playlist: PBS, New York - 8 Center Of The World; See segment 4 of the watchdocumentary.com film at 1:17 and video #4 at 1:17 of the YouTube Playlist for comparison to the NIST clip at Post #586 listed above and other PBS footage examples in question regarding this topic.

This is a link for the webarchive of the terrorize.dk page in question. It is a vast 9/11 archive and other pages are accessible through the links there. This is a link that I've found to be currently active for the terrorize.dk page in question. At both of those pages, there are two Video: links that I can't access for some reason but you could try to or search for elsewhere, each titled: 911.wtc.2.hit.north.01.wmv

Here is a link to the active Contact page for terrorize.dk. I suggest that you ask them for an explanation since mine have been to no avail with you. As you know, the Detroit Public Television documentary is not available and that was what they were trying to analyze -- without any lines inserted that I can see, like the Smoke and Mirrors videos have. The first set of examples show a smoke anomaly that is said to be viewable for 60 frames/2 seconds. Compare that to the documentary footage linked twice above at the 1:17 mark [Edit to add: and shown in other reference examples]. The second set of examples at terrorize.dk show the smoke copy footage but, evidently, it is only analyed there and at the web.archive.org page for terrorize.dk as "the aircraft's real entrance". Your complaints about the analysis there are misplaced, imo, afaik.

With the Detroit Public Television documentary footage no longer being available, you have no evidence to accuse the terrorize.dk site or the poster of the Smoke and Mirrors videos, Elpiper, of faking the smoke and explosion mirroring issue. At most, Elpiper might be criticized for mistaking the DPTV documentary footage with the anomalous smoke-copy/mirroring as footage originally aired on 9/11 rather than a Media-alteration later for the Detroit documentary, probably as Iraq War propaganda. If you wanted to contact Elpiper with your accusations, I think you could do that at the YouTube video locations. As far as I can tell, they simply questioned more about the footage than was critiqued at the terrorize.dk page and posted videos for inspection of their views. Even though the Smoke and Mirrors videos were an imperfect analysis, they don't give me the impression that they were intentionally misleading as you have. It is an open analysis available for public scrutiny and rebuttal. Human error in open investigations isn't unusual or categorically nefarious but your relentless and speculative insistance of malintent is vengefully suspicious.

Will address your other comments next.

Edited to reword last sentence of 1st and 2nd paragraphs + bracketed insert at paragraph 4.

GreyLmist  posted on  2012-10-04   14:02:53 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

The Smoke and Mirrors videos have never been a No Planes presentation by me or anyone else here in these discussions that I know of, except in your imagination.

Uh huh. Take that up with your little friend titorite, he seems to feel differently about it than you.

With the Detroit Public Television documentary footage no longer being available, you have no evidence to accuse the terrorize.dk site or the poster of the Smoke and Mirrors videos, Elpiper, of faking the smoke and explosion mirroring issue.

My what a twisted web you weave. I had at first thought the alteration was done by the terrorize.dk owner, but once it became clear that the author of that site was saying the same thing I was pointing out in how that video had been altered to make it LOOK fake, it became clear that he was not the author of the alterations.

It is ALSO clear however that the "Smoke and Mirrors" author misrepresented the footage as original live footage from 9/11, and "analyzes" it in a way to "prove" that the plane "came from nowhere" and that the smoke plume was "fake".

Since you appear to be trying to vouch for his "honesty", I place about as much credence in anything you say as I do with him.

FormerLurker  posted on  2012-10-04   19:41:04 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

        There are no replies to Comment # 22.

End Trace Mode for Comment # 22.

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