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Title: NO PLANER COINTELPRO Operation Becoming Transparent
Source:
Prison Planet Forum
URL Source: http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=945.50;wap2
Published: Aug 1, 2008
Author: Morgan Rose
Post Date: 2012-10-06 10:54:21 by FormerLurker
Ping List: *9-11* Subscribe to *9-11*
Keywords: None
Views: 19567
Comments: 309
COINTELPRO, an acronym for Counter Intelligence Program, was a series of covert operations conducted by the FBI starting in the mid 50’s and continuing until 1976 when it was exposed by the investigations The Church Committee. One of the primary methods of COINTELPRO consisted of forging pseudo-movement groups as a means of conducting Psychological Warfare operations to spread disinformation, disrupt, and divide existing movements. These ‘psy-ops’ tended to foment suspicions among the targeted movements and try to dissuade sympathies from people outside the targeted movement. Today, COINTELPRO has reared its ugly head again, with infiltrations popping up everywhere from Anti-War activism groups to peaceful gun owners and militias. Provocations have become more and more conspicuous to the public as the Seattle World Trade Organization protests and Ontario Security and Prosperity Partnership protests successfully exposed provocateur operations. Of course, something as dangerous to the establishment *body politic* as 9/11 has not been without its alleged incidents of COINTELPRO action. Allegations of government disinformation have been swirling around certain figures in the movement, such as former Bush Administration official Morgan Reynolds, who has recently proposed that “no planes hit the World Trade Center”, has alleged “TV Fakery”, and submitted that the towers were brought down by “Directed Energy Weapons” a.k.a. “Laser Beams”. While the government has spent innumerable resources trying to contradict eyewitness statements regarding reported explosions in the towers, Morgan Reynolds and his “mockingbirds” expect the 9/11 truth movement to put their energy into further contradicting even more numerous eyewitness statements . See a problem here? Typical of the above outlined methods, “No Planers” have become a pseudo-movement, adding lunacy, deception, and division to the legitimate questions emanating from 9/11 families, first responders, government officials, intelligence experts, scientists, engineers, architects, academics, entertainment personalities, and so many others. Perhaps the more visible purveyors of this pseudo-movement are supported by Paula Gloria’s “Concordia Foundation”. The “Concordia Foundation” claims 501 (c) 3, or “nonprofit” status, However, recent investigations conducted by concerned donors have uncovered that her “foundation” does not retain “nonprofit” status with the IRS. In fact, more rigorous inquires have obtained that no records of the “Concordia Foundation” even exist in its home state of New York. Funding of Paula Gloria’s “foundation” originates solely from an information technology firm, Bit By Bit Computer Consultants. “Donations” to the “Concordia Foundation” are actually billed directly to Bit By Bit. The apparent fraud has appropriately prompted multiple complaints with the FTC and IRS. Bit By Bit, and its subsidiary 3BDigital, admittedly list among their portfolio Bloomberg LLC, Chase Bank, The National Football League, Citigroup, and The National Security Council. 3BDigital boasts to have partnerships with Nokia, Cisco Systems, IBM, Compaq, Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, and Level (3) Communications. Level (3) Communications, a defense contractor doing business, primarily, with US and UK interests, is the developer of the WESCAM system said to be the delivery mechanism for the supposed “TV Fakery”. Of course this is nonsense, but it is fascinating that these harlequins would incorporate their partnerships into their own theories. The “Concordia Foundation” numbers among its surrogates Nico Haupt,” a man who exhibits *prima facie *schizophrenic behavior. Allegations of COINTELPRO surrounding Haupt have, in the past, seemed to be justified. WeAreChange recently had two unprovoked incidents with Haupt, where he assaulted the groups members, only to be ignored by onlooking NYPD. Haupt continuously spreads disinformation, even abject lies, surrounding the 9/11 truth movement. From calling legitimate 9/11 truthers “Plane Huggers”, to claiming “Alex Jones works for ABC” and is “covering up for the media”, Haupt’s tactics and behavior exhibit classic COINTELPRO methods. Haupt even advocates “waterboarding Plane Huggers”. So a “foundation” with intimate ties to international defense contractors, major Wall Street banks, prominent telecommunications firms, and The National Security council is a driving force behind the “No Plane” pseudo-movement? The information promulgated by Paula Gloria, Nico Haupt, Morgan Reynolds, and others is clearly suspect in light of these new revelations. Whereas, before, all of the speculation regarding “No Plane” theories were simply diffused by logic and common sense, now we see that something much more sinister is at play. The divide and conquer tactics employed by these clowns has warranted past allegations of COINTELPRO. Today, the charade has been fully exposed: the pyschological warfare, the subliminals, the allegations of ‘cover-up’ within the movement, the show on the Howard Stern Channel. Although these revelations should prompt further investigation, it certainly begs the question: does it get any more transparent?
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#2. To: FormerLurker (#0)
Thanks for the dogged defense of the positions that you have taken, FL. Given the effect of ten years of debate on the internet, which has brought the debate out into the open and has now made discussion of these many questions acceptable in polite social conversation, a reaction on the part of the most dangerous parts of our establishment is to be expected. We have to be extra vigilant these days when we examine evidence and theories as to causes and methods used in the attacks on that day. There is a lot of disinformation out there. COINTELPRO is not dead.
You're welcome randge. And it's quite obvious that COINTELPRO is not dead, it is thriving and kicking in full bloom. It's to be expected with something as huge as 9/11 that it would be used to divide and conquer the truth movement, while at the same time discrediting those who are the most vocal, such as Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth, Pilots for 9/11 Truth, etc.
i noticed that the clique of "mainstream" (kosher) truthers bombasted reynolds & fetzer yrs ago. Dr. Fetzer addresses the zionists & even the holhoax, which makes him trustworthy in my book.One may debate matters without necessarily being cointelpro.
Liking a guy because he claims to be "addressing the zionists" or pretends to do so, is like voting for Mitt Romney because he calls himself a conservative and pretends to be one.
he doesnt 'claim' to be discussing the forbidden topic of jews, It's just something i noticed after he was excluded from the kosher 'clique'. It has nothing to do with the no-plane stuff, a topic which i find irrelevent.
The "no-plane" nonsense seems pretty clearly to be disinformation planted to disinform, discredit 911 Truth, and mislead. I don't pretend to have the final data set but I think it is safe to say that the "Official Conspiracy Theory" involving a "Magic Arab" with his "Charmed Cellphone" in a cave in Tora Bora makes about as much sense as "no planes". In other words both are disinfo. I do think focusing on the likely Mossad connection is a bit of a Red Herring as well. It is not that I do not think that there were Israelis involved, but that they were not in charge of the Op but just one of the players.
And why do you say that? Have you looked into it as deep as you could have? I know I did not become a no planer over night. But their remain problems... big glaring huge ,"drive a mack truck through the hole in the plot" problems... Problems I can not turn a blind eye away from. Inconsistencies I refuse to ignore. One plane can not be caught on camera flying on different flight paths. ....... I am not attempting to mislead anyone. I may not have the fine debate skills of GreyLmist but at least I don't resort to using disinformation tactics strait from the disinformation hand book.... it is very hard to deal with that kind of shit Original-Intent... god knows FormerLurker is just getting his jollies off on it all... thats part of the problem with utilising the tactics of disinformation.... Amateur enthusiasts forget the tactics are a weapon and then that becomes their default style of internet posting.... In my view he discredited himself..... especially when he crossed that line of using innocent bystanders to get at me. One should never use another friends against them... only scum do that. ...... This topic has exhausted me. I don't get paid for this shit... I damn sure earned nothing for my tens of thousands of hours of investigation. ..... I am no shill. I am not discrediting anything.... I may not know the whole truth of all.. in fact if I did I would probably need to stand trial.. as for the planes though... NO plane at the pentagon. No plane at shanksville. No planes.
Isn't it amazing what can be done with Photoshop these days? The "no-planes" does not pass the smell test. There is too much independent footage, too many witnesses, and it would simply be technologically more advanced and complicated than I credit the gooburmunt with. No, the planes did not bring down the buildings, but the combination of internal demolition charges (nano-thermites and possibly a micro-nuke or two) along with some type of microwave or particle beam better accounts for the observed phenomena - particularly in terms of the microfine concrete dust. No, the "no planes" is planted disinformation - of that I am pretty well convinced just in terms of logic and known, or even extrapolated, available technology.
The "no-planes" does not pass the smell test. There is too much independent footage, too many witnesses, and it would simply be technologically more advanced and complicated than I credit the gooburmunt with. No, the planes did not bring down the buildings, but the combination of internal demolition charges (nano-thermites and possibly a micro-nuke or two) along with some type of microwave or particle beam better accounts for the observed phenomena - particularly in terms of the microfine concrete dust. No, the "no planes" is planted disinformation - of that I am pretty well convinced just in terms of logic and known, or even extrapolated, available technology. NO.... what was amazing is what graphic technologies were available back on September tenth 2001... the day before. ....Man.... You should not just say "Disinfo" and dismiss me outta hand. THis is not dis-info.... this is an unhappy realization. Years of observation and ...unwanted conclusion... yet it is what it is. LIke the microwave thing you refer too... are you really gonna acknowledge that fucked up spire and disavow the possiblity of CGI effects and planted charicter acotrs? ... The producers of the news media play a big role in 911... from fox to NBC and on and on.. many of the on the ground reporter, interviewers, and interviees were " Major News Media Producers" ....... BIG FREAKING COINCIEDENCE THAT!!!! Ever seen wag the dog? It is a propaganda war man... To fight it they need as much diversion as possible. With us truth seekers the wilder the truth the better,,,, It was controlled demolition...WTC 7 was totally conventional..... wtc 1 and 2 and the surrounding buildings were not conventional... those were a combination of DEW weapons and conventionals... I think the conventionals were used to make the plane holes and destroy the tops......... From all that I read and know of WTC 1 and 2... they were built like all modern sky scrapers with a destroy plan ( a forethought plan of building removal for when it became outdated) .. it was so huge and new (I love the tube within a tube concept) built in three sections ... to eventually be destroyed in three sections starting from the top down.... And if you follow the squibs and blow outs that is pretty much what it looks like. Top section first, then mid section, then bottom and spire ......freaky,,, As you learn about areodynamics, and wake vortex and videographic alteration ......man.... things become apparent. in 93 the plan failed because an untrusted asset was used. in 2001 their were no untrusted assets , no way for anyone uncommited to fuck ip the evil plan twice. The pentagon plane couldn't bank and survive those alleged angles of desent... the WTC plans can not have multple flight paths leading into the impact points,... those cell phone calls are BS, WTF is up with the atomization of it all... AHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! NO!!!! Discount nothing until you can prove it wrong.... Their was no WIFI connections for those remote connections. Not Atop WTC1 september elvenenth two thousand and one. ..... Remote planes.... I wanted to believe that at one point... I went about to prove it as I looked for the evidence... Truth lead me to the sad strange truth instead. THE PATH OF "THE LEAST AMOUNT OF EFFORT USED TO OVERCOME THE MOST RESISTANCE" IS, WHAT WAS ENACTED! Deadly Shadow puppet games used to distract a people from ever getting to the truth.
However, NO ONE has produced, AT ANY TIME, evidence for the existence of holographic technology of the requisite level, nor any evidence that equipment capable of producing such an illusion was in place on September 11th 2001. Here we are almost on the same page. I do believe multiple technologies were used both to initiate and control the building's collapses. It is the only hypothesis which accounts for ALL of the observed phenomena. As I pointed out above the "No Planes" hypothesis is at very best a distraction. Having spent a lot of time studying disinformation and how it is planted and used the "No Planes" hypothesis carries a lot of the hallmarks of disinformation used to discredit and divert into profitless lines of inquiry and on down the "Rabbit Hole". As for the fallacious argument that I must "prove it wrong" to discredit the "hypothesis" that is in and of itself a logical fallacy. From the point of view of sound reasoning and logic the burden is simply to show that there is no evidence of the technology of the requisite scale to produce the observed phenomena. Can you cite even one example of holographic technology which can be verified and crosschecked which would support that technology being available on September 11th 2001?
The ability to take over networks already existed. Live time insertion of pre-recorded stuff would of been no problem... What is a problem is What wreckage (what little of it there was) was found and where. What is a problem is PBS showing off the wrong planes as the ones alleged to hit the towers. I don't believe in holographic planes. If the holographic technology were their it would of been re-used by now. ... And I still don't think the Blue spiral lights over norway counted.... IDK what the fuck that was but it wasn't hologram. NO.......no........ When I think about the easiest most plausible best way to accomplish this monstrous act certain actions line up .... By not using planes but rather only showing CGI planes... or plane... only one. On that day we saw alleged flight 175 over and over and over ... not any other plane... just that one... over and over... in the hypnotherapy industry they would call that a repetitive program. Later all sorts of other images would appear .... I prefer the zero hour images ....... Too few of those. Anyways it is from that zero hour film that we can see everything. Every flaw, Every inconsistancy... every failure on there part.. of which their are legion... but they did not have to make it work forever.... they only needed to fool everyone for a short amount of time.... God Help us. Their is another terrible fact about four real planes. and that is the human factor. The unpredictable human factor. Real Hijakers might of really been over powered. Real drones would of really exploded all over the place and into the hands of the public. Remember the columbia? Some private individuals still own genuine wreckage. The public. We are wild and unpredictable. The best way to over come that risk is to fake it. Plant the charges , fake the event with CGI and if anyone says they did not see any planes ignore them and riddicule them and give attention to every exagerator on the planet ewarth that will swear to god and zues and pan that they saw the planes just like their brother and cousin and best friends....... never mind the alleged speeds of the planes, the angles,... and never ask these fuckers what they were doing, when and where... cause when someone claims to of seen a plane asking them the finer details of the event always pisses them off.........exagerators. go figure. Very useful to promote propaganda though,. IF the TV shows it over and over and over that does not make it true. I mean it's like the jews who swear to god xyclone B is at awshuwitz in the walls and showers and such... but science can't prove it... someone or something is lying... it aint science. The details of the devil are important.
Every flaw, Every inconsistancy... every failure on there part.. of which their are legion... but they did not have to make it work forever.... they only needed to fool everyone for a short amount of time.... God Help us. That is not proof of a holographic projection system. It is evidence that suggests the images were played with but NOT WHY. It is certainly suspicious (and I trust the Propaganda Broadcasting Service about as far as I can throw the twin towers) but is not proof supporting anything more than that the images were manipulated. It could just as easily be because the projectiles/planes that were used for the distraction and shock value were other than as represented, but not that there were NO planes. It is ambiguous without additional verifiable information. I also agree, to a limited extent, that it did not have to work forever. However, when you control the media the only place for the information to get out is through other venues such as the Internet. Effectively the media are the arbiters of reality. That it is a created and false reality is almost irrelevent so far as public "Perception Management" is concerned. The official unreality is the only reality allowed on the airwaves without being disparaged or completely censored out. As a result a large percentage of the Sheeple either believe the official conspiracy theory or are afraid to face ridicule by admitting that they don't. No it doesn't. However, as Goebbels and Hitler proved you can repeat a big lie over and over and over and a certain large percentage of the weak minded herd will accept it. My point is that it does not have to be true to get enough of the Sheeple to Baaaa with the chorus. Again, relying on basic logic, "If two datums are mutually contradictory the first thing we can conclude is that ONE or BOTH are false.
As far as I can tell their is no holograms nor any holographic projection system in that time that could produce the elaborate and huge holograms needed.... I do not see the evidence out there to convince me personally that holograms were used. I may not be willing to 100% Dismiss it completely outta hand but I think something else was used. CGI!!!! Computer generated images . I know what altered poor pixiliation looks like, I've been able to help other graphic experts spot the flaws. CGI was most definitely used... Amongst other stuff..... The truth is more outrageous then any theory we could of ever thought of.
Provide an example of any such flaw in the original live broadcast footage. I'd really like to see what you have, if anything.
We need to demand the Pentagon provide their videos and the gas stations videos before we argure about this crap. The evidence is there. The criminals are not going to release it.
We have demanded it.... I think the real problem is that their is nothing to release..... By that I mean nothing that will show a plane. ...
We have demanded it.... I think the real problem is that their is nothing to release..... By that I mean nothing that will show a plane. ... They probably have videos of an explosion with no plane which I imagine they are afraid to release because most people of average intelligence or over will figure out then (using logic n stuff) that there actually wasn't a plane. Let's not be too surprised if/when they release one with a cgi plane in it ;)
If things were as you claim, where CGI was used in the WTC impacts, fireballs, and smoke plumes, then it'd be child's play to fake the Pentagon impact using the same techniques. That they haven't done so, and refuse to release video from the Pentagon roof cams amongst others, tells us that what THOSE videos show WOULD blow the lid on what really happened that day. However, it ALSO blows your story out of the water since they HAVEN'T released them and broadcast them umpteen times each day after the attacks.
No amount of reason will change the mind of someone whose already made theirs up. I'm still waiting for the details on your "millions of eyewitnesses". Or does that threaten your preconceived idea of what happened?
That is quite obvious in speaking with you these days wudidiz. You refuse to use logic and reason, you simply go on your "feelings" and accept whatever people tell you if it has to do with "no planes". Do you really think the victims were in on these attacks? Did you ever think far enough to realize they would have had to have been in order for any survivors to go along with the lie, that no planes attacked the WTC, it was all a hoax?
Or does that threaten your preconceived idea of what happened? Can you give me at least one?
Find all the names of all the people who were involved with the takeoffs, boarding, air traffic control, the police and firemen at the scene, and the occupants of the office buildings facing the approach. And oh yeah, find the families of the passengers on those doomed flights and ask them if their loved ones really died or not, or if they are faking it.
Well, I mean, if there are witnesses to a plane hitting the wtc, I'd think you'd be able to name at least one or find a video of one saying they saw a plane. I have surely asked you enough times, yet you've not produced anything. Wtf?
Believe what you want...
The "Jumpers" of 9/11 are all FAKES? They were obviously pre-made, and were included into to the storyline of the 9/11 to increase the "shock and awe" effect to steer us to giving up our rights to the real terrorists of 9/11 The "Jumpers" of 9/11 are all FAKES? (Part 2) -- 4:13 no windows that open in skyscrapers For safety of pedestrians below, the glass used in skyscrapers is so strong that it is like a wall that you can see thru, and all these "openings" are very unlikely. Add to this, There is no reason for a jumper-to-be to leave a smoke-free floor.
She asks some good questions. I love her nails! :)
9-11 Gelatin: The B Thing - Go to the 0:52 mark for a view of WTC windows that didn't open as the 9/11 jumper fakery would have us believe. [Cross-referenced from Post #18 at 4um Title: Killers of Americans run Romney campaign, US courts and media ‘Rabbi Dov Zakheim, who was the Pentagon comptroller at the time of the 9/11 attacks, is now top foreign policy advisor to US presidential contender Mitt Romney.’] Edited to activate YouTube link.
What exactly is this supposed to prove GL, that people can look out of a window?
WTC windows didn't open as the 9/11 jumper fakery would have us believe. Is that simple enough for you this time?
Hey genius, those windows had been blasted out by the explosions. Are you that dense?
I unbozoed you. Your statement right there is dense. YOu would have us believe that , what? All the windows in the building shattered upon impact? They didn't . Their are more than enough photos and film to prove very few windows in fact broke... Remarkable and a testament to the WTC construction. Kinda like the amazing windows at the pentagon.... Funny thing ... windows. AND HOW ABOUT THAT IMPACT HOLE! It was cool enough to walk around and even lay down upon yet a jet (Or a high yield incendiary device)had just blew up there not 20 minutes ago.... .... No windows there. Just an open hole for people to run around or jump from.. I only know of two people recorded in the space of the hole... I don't think either jumped.... ANYWAYS You can go to 911research.wtc7.net/wtc/...nce/photos/wtc1hole1.html and look at the close up and see that just one floor below still has intact windows. SO VERY FEW WINDOWS ACTULLY BROKE.... and almost next to none in the floors above and below the impact. Look for yourself but don't lie to yourself.
They didn't . I didn't say they did. I said windows were blown out on impact, not ALL the windows of the building were blown out. Do you know the difference?
Do you know the difference? Do you have any evidence of which ones were blown out and which ones weren't? The non-damage to the building area where the alleged people were standing indicates the windows weren't blasted out there.
Do you either of you have evidence that those who died from jumping from the WTC towers are still alive? Do you have evidence that their families are lying? Do you have evidence that those who filmed people falling from the towers were using fabricated video, or that those who were on the scene witnessing people jumping were lying, that they were all in on this "no plane" scheme designed to kill 3000 Americans that day?
OOOOOOO Do you have the evidence that they were ever real in the first place and not fabricated to sell deadly lies? IN fact how do we know that you are not a brainwashed victim? For all we know you could be one of those air force internet trolls? Where's your evidence now? Disinformation specialist? RULE 14: Demand complete solutions. Avoid the issues by requiring opponents to solve the crime at hand completely, a ploy which works best for items qualifying for rule 10. http://vigilantcitizen.com/lates...-rules-of-disinformation/
You're a real piece of work. Now you're not just selling "no planes", you're trying to peddle "no victims". Perhaps you should go to a 9/11 families get together and try telling your story there, I'm sure you'll convince them that they're all lying.
Do you have the evidence that they were ever real in the first place and not fabricated to sell deadly lies? You're a real piece of work. Now you're not just selling "no planes", you're trying to peddle "no victims". Perhaps you should go to a 9/11 families get together and try telling your story there, I'm sure you'll convince them that they're all lying. "The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen FormerLurker posted on 2012-10-14 16:35:47 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #160. To: titorite (#157) Cool video bro I'm sure you'd find it cool if it was your brother, sister, mother, father, son, or daughter jumping from a building that was on fire. "The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen FormerLurker posted on 2012-10-14 16:38:36 ET Reply Trace Private Reply #161. To: titorite (#157) (Edited) The topic of conversation was about the jumpers... Did you bother watching the video BTW, it WAS showing the jumpers. Or are you so brainwashed you didn't watch it past 5 seconds? "The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen FormerLurker posted on 2012-10-14 16:39:55 ET Reply Trace Private Reply 2. Become incredulous and indignant. Avoid discussing key issues and instead focus on side issues which can be used show the topic as being critical of some otherwise sacrosanct group or theme. This is also known as the “How dare you!” gambit. 5. Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule. This is also known as the primary attack the messenger ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as “kooks”, “right-wing”, “liberal”, “left-wing”, “terrorists”, “conspiracy buffs”, “radicals”, “militia”, “racists”, “religious fanatics”, “sexual deviates”, and so forth. This makes others shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.
Pretty ironic that you seem to have your disinfo rule book at your fingertips. You suck at it dude, go back to disinfo school, since you're obviously doing a piss poor job of it here on 4um. You're changing the subject from jumpers by posting this crap, and accusing me of changing the subject from jumpers when I post a video showing jumpers. Are you shooting something up your veins that makes you stupid, or were you just born that way?
You're changing the subject from jumpers by posting this crap, and accusing me of changing the subject from jumpers when I post a video showing jumpers. Are you shooting something up your veins that makes you stupid, or were you just born that way? I have the disinfo handbook at my fingertips because everyone does. I have been including the internet web address. Even you can click the links. I find your willing use of those dirty tactics to be just awful. No truther would do that. Doing so invalidates credibility. Truthers want to talk about the truth no matter what it might be .... they do not attempt to distract others from speaking about what may be an uncomfortable truth. The subject was already about the reality of the jumpers before you attempted (and continue to attempt) to change the subject with your fall back position of asking us if we think something is real or not. It's like reading the hunger games again with peta asking if something is real or not real..... entertaining in the fiction, repetitive and obvious coming from you former lurker. Their were some questions as to how people could occupy the open windows of the upper floors in some photos when other photos show the same windows unbroken and unoccupied. Kinda like the PBS photo with the plane engines in the wrong place. Kinda like the immortal passports. Kinda like the invisible pentagon plane. A real truther talks about all this and attempts to suppress nothing and they damn sure don't use the dirty tactics to suppress other truthers.
Uh huh. For one, you aren't a 9/11 truther since you insist on spreading lies and disinfo. You refuse to accept when you're wrong, and refuse to take actual evidence into consideration if it deflates your "no planes" balloon. For two, I have you pegged as a shill since you do the very things you list as disinfo tactics, while blaming your victims for your own crimes. It's pretty sad that you've been able to trick some people here on the forum into thinking you're some sort of "patriot". I'm glad I'm not one of them, and hopefully, those who have befriended you won't suffer any consequence from their error in judgement.
Myself, I have better things to do with my time than to engage in circular arguments with shills and idiots. If you want to believe fairies knocked down the towers, that all the victims were in cahoots with news moguls to kill 3000 Americans that day (including themeselves), and that all news media aired fake attacks which never happened, and that all of the first responders, bystanders, and news media employees were in on it too, along with the airports, airlines, and the families of these "non- existent" victims, well hey, who am I to pop your bubble. Rational minds will see through the "smoke and mirrors" you have erected. Those who can't see through it are a lost cause anyways. Unfortunately, you'll drive away a good share of people who would come to this forum for new evidence or facts pertaining to the subject, and perhaps convince a few of them that the good guys are really the bad guys, and that you yourselves are snow white "9/11 researchers", reinforcing the perception a good number of people already have that 9/11 "truthers" are crackpots and lunatics. My only satisfaction here is that there exists such a thing called "Karma", and that it is universal in nature, and can't be fooled or tricked. Those who are knowlingly perpetuating lies and disinformation WILL be dealt with appropriately for their deeds, and those who are doing it out of stupidity or lack of reason will perhaps suffer a milder form of retribution, if there's any forgiveness to be had for those who do things blindly.
Still waiting for that list of witnesses you keep talking about.
Look up the names of 9/11 survivors, be they office workers, firemen, or policemen. Look up the names of the myraid number of reporters and camera operators who were there. Call them and ask them if they are lying.
Call them and ask them if they are lying. Pack your bags, we're goin on a guilt trip. Can't you even name one?
If you want to ride the disinfo boat and pretend not one of the millions of people of NYC are valid witnesses, and that the passengers of the doomed flights never existed, that all of those involved in the news rooms, production staff, and on-scene reporters and camera crews, along with first responders, bystanders, and victims, along with the passengers, flight crews, airlines, airports, and air traffic controllers, were all part of a conspiracy hatched to fool the public that planes hit the towers, while killing 3000 Americans that day (or don't you think ANYONE was killed), well who am I to pop your bubble. Go on thinking whatever it is you want to believe wududiz, I really don't care.
I can see you're very attached to the idea that there were planes, but why is it that you can't name one witness? Why should I have to go to new york and interview people there? Doesn't the gov't have a list of eyewitnesses? Does anyone? I mean, this was a serious event... didn't anyone take names of witnesses that say they saw a plane? I certainly would have had I been in charge. You'd think it'd be on the internet somewhere and that someone as convinced as yourself would have seen it. My goodness.
Do you have even ONE witness who'll testify as to what YOU claim? Anyone from a news agency, a reporter, a camera man, bystander, survivor, fireman, airport worker, airline employee, family member, ANYONE? Were ALL those people "in on it"? I've shown you a clip of live coverage and interviews from 9/11, THOSE are but some of the witnesses. And they ALL said people were jumping. Are you also saying that there WERE no jumpers, as your pals are saying?
where?
BTW wudidiz, do you agree with your no plane brethren that the jumpers were "faked", and that "Israeli art students" were tossing dummies off the towers instead? Do you feel as GreyLmist, that the entrance holes and people standing in the broken windows were really filmed at a studio in Hollywood?
You're like talking to a brick wall. I showed you where to go to see how the entrance holes could have been rigged, even in the shape of a plane. [Edit to add: Click here again.] Now tell us why there are no coughing, smoke-exposed people in your video. [Edit to add: Where do you see broken windows there?] And those buildings were nearly a quarter mile high. People believing they saw jumpers at a distance isn't evidence of real jumpers. But here's what passes for evidence of someone supposedly killed by a jumper falling on them: 9-11 Pic: "Fr. Mychal Judge", alleged casualty Edited for grammar + sentence 2 rewording + 2 bracketed inserts.
#246. To: All, *No Planers* (#243)
South Tower Anomalies III - Addressing the Debunkers
Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest
#3. To: randge (#2)
(Edited)
#4. To: FormerLurker (#3)
#8. To: Artisan (#4)
#14. To: FormerLurker (#8)
#17. To: Artisan (#14)
#20. To: Original_Intent (#17)
The "no-plane" nonsense seems pretty clearly to be disinformation planted to disinform, discredit 911 Truth, and mislead.
#37. To: titorite (#20)
One plane can not be caught on camera flying on different flight paths.
#59. To: Original_Intent (#37)
(Edited)
Isn't it amazing what can be done with Photoshop these days?
#64. To: titorite (#59)
NO.... what was amazing is what graphic technologies were available back on September tenth 2001... the day before.
It was controlled demolition...WTC 7 was totally conventional..... wtc 1 and 2 and the surrounding buildings were not conventional... those were a combination of DEW weapons and conventionals... I think the conventionals were used to make the plane holes and destroy the tops.........
#67. To: Original_Intent (#64)
However, NO ONE has produced, AT ANY TIME, evidence for the existence of holographic technology of the requisite level, nor any evidence that equipment capable of producing such an illusion was in place on September 11th 2001.
#97. To: titorite (#67)
What is a problem is What wreckage (what little of it there was) was found and where. What is a problem is PBS showing off the wrong planes as the ones alleged to hit the towers.
IF the TV shows it over and over and over that does not make it true.
I mean it's like the jews who swear to god xyclone B is at awshuwitz in the walls and showers and such... but science can't prove it... someone or something is lying... it aint science.
#109. To: Original_Intent (#97)
That is not proof of a holographic projection system.
#110. To: titorite, Original_Intent (#109)
CGI!!!! Computer generated images . I know what altered poor pixiliation looks like, I've been able to help other graphic experts spot the flaws. CGI was most definitely used... Amongst other stuff..... The truth is more outrageous then any theory we could of ever thought of.
#111. To: FormerLurker (#110)
Provide an example of any such flaw in the original live broadcast footage. I'd really like to see what you have, if anything.
#114. To: tom007 (#111)
We need to demand the Pentagon provide their videos and the gas stations videos before we argure about this crap.
#116. To: titorite, tom007 (#114)
We need to demand the Pentagon provide their videos and the gas stations videos before we argure about this crap.
#117. To: wudidiz, titorite, tom007 (#116)
They probably have videos of an explosion with no plane which I imagine they are afraid to release because most people of average intelligence or over will figure out then (using logic n stuff) that there actually wasn't a plane. Let's not be too surprised if/when they release one with a cgi plane in it ;)
#118. To: FormerLurker (#117)
#119. To: wudidiz (#118)
No amount of reason will change the mind of someone whose already made theirs up.
#120. To: FormerLurker (#119)
I'm still waiting for the details on your "millions of eyewitnesses".
#122. To: wudidiz (#120)
#123. To: FormerLurker (#122)
#124. To: FormerLurker, All (#123)
#126. To: wudidiz, *9-11* (#124)
#128. To: GreyLmist (#126)
#139. To: wudidiz (#128)
(Edited)
She asks some good questions.
#140. To: GreyLmist, wudidiz (#139)
9-11 Gelatin: The B Thing - Go to the 0:52 mark for a view of WTC windows that didn't open as the 9/11 jumper fakery would have us believe.
#143. To: FormerLurker (#140)
What exactly is this supposed to prove GL, that people can look out of a window?
#144. To: GreyLmist (#143)
WTC windows didn't open as the 9/11 jumper fakery would have us believe. Is that simple enough for you this time?
#145. To: FormerLurker (#144)
(Edited)
Hey genius, those windows had been blasted out by the explosions. Are you that dense?
#147. To: titorite (#145)
YOu would have us believe that , what? All the windows in the building shattered upon impact?
#152. To: FormerLurker (#147)
I said windows were blown out on impact, not ALL the windows of the building were blown out.
#154. To: GreyLmist, titorite (#152)
#156. To: FormerLurker (#154)
Do you either of you have evidence that those who died from jumping from the WTC towers are still alive?
#159. To: titorite (#156)
Do you have the evidence that they were ever real in the first place and not fabricated to sell deadly lies?
#165. To: FormerLurker (#159)
#159. To: titorite (#156)
#168. To: titorite (#165)
#172. To: FormerLurker (#168)
Pretty ironic that you seem to have your disinfo rule book at your fingertips. You suck at it dude, go back to disinfo school, since you're obviously doing a piss poor job of it here on 4um.
#214. To: titorite, *9-11* (#172)
(Edited)
I find your willing use of those dirty tactics to be just awful. No truther would do that. Doing so invalidates credibility. Truthers want to talk about the truth no matter what it might be .... they do not attempt to distract others from speaking about what may be an uncomfortable truth.
#215. To: All (#214)
(Edited)
#216. To: FormerLurker, *9-11* (#215)
#221. To: wudidiz (#216)
Still waiting for that list of witnesses you keep talking about.
#224. To: FormerLurker (#221)
Look up the names of 9/11 survivors, be they office workers, firemen, or policemen. Look up the names of the myraid number of reporters and camera operators who were there.
#225. To: wudidiz (#224)
#235. To: FormerLurker (#225)
#236. To: wudidiz (#235)
#237. To: FormerLurker (#236)
clip of live coverage and interviews from 9/11, THOSE are but some of the witnesses.
#241. To: wudidiz (#237)
#243. To: FormerLurker (#241)
(Edited)
Do you feel as GreyLmist, that the entrance holes and people standing in the broken windows were really filmed at a studio in Hollywood?
Replies to Comment # 243.
End Trace Mode for Comment # 243.
