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Title: Why I Don't Think A Mormon Should Be President
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URL Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/why- ... hould-not-be-president-2012-10
Published: Oct 27, 2012
Author: http://www.businessinsider.com/why-a-mor
Post Date: 2012-10-27 09:52:31 by tom007
Keywords: None
Views: 233
Comments: 21
Why I Don't Think A Mormon Should Be President Nathan Nebeker, Contributor | Oct. 27, 2012, 8:20 AM | 2,176 | 51 Email More mitt romney Flickr/Gage Skidmore Nathan Nebeker is a technology executive and entrepreneur. He was born in Salt Lake City, and his family descends from some of the early Mormon pioneers. The opinions expressed below are his own. The founders of the United States had a lot of good ideas, but undoubtedly one of the best was the decoupling of religion from government. In principle, someone from any religion can be President of the United States. So even though all but one president has been a member of some flavor of Protestant Christianity, Mitt Romney’s Mormonism doesn’t disqualify him from the presidency in the eyes of the American public. This is a good thing. In principle. At the risk of sounding like a mullah, I believe there are deeper reasons that a Mormon should be disqualified from being president. Romney’s candidacy, along with a Broadway smash musical and a few other things, have come together to create a “Mormon moment.” But despite this, public knowledge of Mormonism is limited to some superficial cultural impressions, with an underlying feeling of vague suspicion. If Romney were to win, you could say Mormonism is a fringe branch of Protestant Christianity, and therefore he wouldn’t be charting any new territory. Mormonism is actually kind of a hybrid between Protestantism and Catholicism. They embrace the most basic Protestant idea of a personal relationship with God, (for men, anyway), but have the hierarchical power structure, rigid dogma, and the expectation of obedience of Catholics. "Romney's idea of truth is not something discovered after hard-fought inquiry and testing, but instead is declared by a person with authority, often for unexamined reasons, and sanctioned by divine validation." Protestants do not accept Mormonism as one of their own, ostensibly for all sorts of technical theocratic reasons. But the real reason Mormons are regarded as outside the tapestry of Protestantism is that’s just how the Mormons want it. This otherness hints at the problem of a Mormon president, but the deeper reasons are epistemological – that is, having to do with the Mormon notion of truth. I grew up in Utah. My paternal ancestors are among the original Mormon pioneers, arriving into Utah several weeks after Brigham Young. When I was born, my family was nominally Mormon, but with deep fissures. The cognitive dissonance created in me by the Mormon message produced the first serious fracture when I was ten years old. By the time I was twelve, it was all over. Over the next several years of my adolescence, I endured scores – maybe hundreds – of ridiculous religious arguments, many of which I started. One thing that always baffled me then is how Mormonism could have such a successful sociological structure when it is based on such poppycock. I concluded early on that this ardent assertion of this story had more to do with a need to belong than anything resembling “truth.” Joseph Smith Wikipedia Joseph Smith, the fellow who founded the Mormon church. Joseph Smith, the Mormon’s founder, was not an intellectual. He was a creative and energetic megalomaniac, and intensely charismatic individual. But he was no Martin Luther, nor even a Calvin. He didn’t come up with a revolutionary and enduring idea on which to base the religion. Mormonism, instead, is founded on the belief that American Indians are descended from Jews (this is not a joke – you can look it up). He unified two pop culture historical mysteries of the mid-nineteenth century among the uneducated middle class, (1) where did the American Indians come from, and (2) what happened to the two lost tribes of Israel? The “answer” to this twin mystery is the subject of the monumentally tedious and derivative Book of Mormon, which, along with the King James Bible and a few other thin volumes of inspiration from Joseph Smith (which include the original revelation on polygamy), are the holy books on which the religion is based. It tells the story of the lost tribes of Israel getting into boats, settling the Americas, and getting a visit from Jesus while on a layover during his resurrection. So how could such a socially successful creed come from this? A big part of the reason is that Joseph Smith was murdered at the best possible time for the fledgling movement to come under the control of the autocratic and exceedingly gifted social architect Brigham Young, and that all this coincided well with the westward expansion of former Europeans across the United States. The Mormons were swept along into the broader demographic and geographic wave settling of the West. And because of their particular skill in irrigation, a remarkable resilience in the face of serious hardship, and practicing an economically successful version of socialism, including appropriation of property for the collective, they were able to thrive in the desert of Utah, which was otherwise considered uninhabitable, or at least unattractive, by other pioneers. The “bulls and steers” structure of polygamy didn’t hurt, either. But what about now? How, in this day and age of higher common learning and mitochondrial DNA analysis, could not just a religion, but a complete society continue to thrive as well as Mormonism does, when it is based on such clearly false tenets? This question used to really bug me, until I was blessed with another realization (or perhaps I should call it a revelation?) some years ago. Mormonism’s social structure is so strong, not despite its frail basis in truth, but because of it – because it makes the price of admission to the club high. To say “Yes, I am a Mormon” is to say “Yes, I’m in the 2+2=5 club, are you?” This (along with expensive tithing) filters out casual participants. You need to be willing to compromise a normal sense of what’s reasonable and rational to be part of this group. It’s a strong commitment, which makes for a strong creed. Cumorah Hill Cumorah Hill in upstate New York -- the place where it all began. (Click for more) A necessary consequence of this is that Mormons must be insular and secretive. Of course their aggressive proselytizing may make them seem less insular than, say, the Amish. But all of that missionary salesmanship is just an entreaty to join an ultimately insular society. This is what is behind the Mormons’ reticence and awkwardness at being in the cultural spotlight. But the key point of insularity is it’s a society based on a private version of the truth. Now you could go all Dawkins on me and say that all religions have this brittle, monolithic epistemology. But the difference is that once a religion gets to a certain level of maturity, it no longer has to constantly assert the legitimacy of whatever myths it is based on. The theological constructs then become increasingly abstract, the ethics overtake the dogma, and the pragmatic issues are allowed to be pragmatic. So I am not saying having a president with religious convictions is problematic. Far from it. Jimmy Carter was the most outwardly religious president, of the modern era at least. But his Christianity manifests mostly in a deep sense of empathy and forgiveness. Having this key, powerful component of Christianity guide public policy is a good thing in a leader. It can even be inspiring, such as with the Truth and Reconciliation Commission of post-Apartheid South Africa, which, despite not being perfect, enabled tremendous healing within a very wounded society. While Mormons have adopted these Christian ethics and practice them well, particularly among their own, at its core, this isn’t what Mormonism is about. It’s about being a club. Once a month, the Mormon church meeting is devoted to what is called “Fast and Testimony meeting.” Fast means you aren’t supposed to eat that day. Testimony means you are supposed to get up and publicly declare your faith. These meetings start slowly, with awkward silences. But inevitably, they take off, fueled by group psychology and holy one-upmanship. The most common phrase heard during these meetings is, “I know this church is true,” or, more tellingly, “I know this is the only true church.” Or, for those into subtext, “The lady doth protest too much, methinks.” So why does all this make a Mormon president a bad idea? Since it is so deeply ingrained in the Mormon culture to have a sense of truth that is private, unquestionable, and not subject to analysis, debate, or verification, Mormon authority figures, like Romney, become very accustomed to speaking from God’s point of view, and feeling entirely justified in keeping their motives or reasoning secret. Without any checks and balances, authority figures can easily become unmoored and drift from reality. Some individuals drift a long way from reality. Mormon culture has produced more than its share of self-justifying lunatics, like Brian David Mitchell, Mark Hoffman, and Dan Lafferty--as have many other religions. But the difference in thinking between these outliers and mainstream Mormons is a difference, not of kind, but of degree, as both positions are based on truth as monolithic declaration. This helps illuminate Romney’s flip-flopping, etch-a-sketching political character. His is notthe cynical, coldly pragmatic moral calculus that Nixon so masterfully practiced for political gain. Romney actually believes he has a patriarchal right to say whatever he wants. His idea of the nature of truth is not something which is discovered after hard fought inquiry and testing, but instead is declared by a person with authority, often for unexamined reasons, and sanctioned by divine validation. This is much more dangerous than Nixon. Nixon knew he was lying. It also illuminates Romney’s secrecy – about his tax returns, about details of his public policy, or any justifications behind his statements. Within Mormon culture, he is used to speaking to an audience who tell themselves, “ours is not to reason why.” So when you see a smug smile on Romney’s face, it isn’t just the smile of a super rich guy marinating in his own ego. It’s the smile of someone who is always holding in the back of his mind a belief that he has a special, private truth, unknown to those outside his club, that makes him superior and unquestionable. Yet at the same time, he is ignorant of the dangerous fact that this “truth” is all too flexible. This would be a very bad characteristic of the leader of the free world. Now it’s not the case that all Mormons are categorically disqualified from being president. It’s just that we should only consider someone with a bit more distance from the dogmatic traps of this young religion. Someone more like Huntsman, for example. Recommended For You
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#1. To: tom007 (#0)
classic “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken He's a Mormon in name only, just like Nixon was a Quaker in name only.
Women’s liberation is freedom from the authority of men. Men’s liberation is the freedom from responsibility to women.
We have to be careful about trampling on the religion of others. In the lifetime of most of us, we should not forget the huge resistance to John Kennedy, a Catholic becoming President. I recall the hatred that was heaped upon "protestants" because they had a dislike for Kennedy. Yet when JFK won, everyone was back to being nice people. Whites elected a black man, yet all whites are racists Throwing religion into the mix is PARTISAN POLITICS AT ITS worse.
The worst is already here, being practiced by too many.
I don't believe that mormons are any worse than the crips or the bloods. If that's who the elites want to select, go for it. “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken The most hated group of organized religion are the "bible thumpers" of the South. Pouring scorn upon their backs has always been practiced by all sides, in and out of politics, just for sport for many "enlightened people". Believer, atheist or agnostic, it is for each to decide for himself, leave the rest alone.
During the war, I met but one type of man, believers all. There were no Mormons, atheists, Catholics etc etc etc, we were all in the same boat, if there was anything said, it was "thank God" we survived. Didnt matter who said it. It was the root feeling of all present. Mentioning religion in politics is gutter politics.
Battlefield is totally different from politics. Most all grunts are believers once engaged with enemy. Anyone diving into the cesspool that is politics should expect any question, from their underwear preference, to where TF were you born, to what God (if any) do you worship? And they deserve all such questions, imo. “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken Questions yes. Diatribes going back sixty years to find another yard stick to measure a persons religions worth is more an epistle than a question. Nixon has been a whipping boy since he made known his distrust for jews many years ago. Carter made his distrust of jews rather plain plus being a redneck bible thumper, he also has been fair game for people that that want to insert religion into politics. Romney on the other hand worships Israel, would fight to the last drop of my blood to defend them. That makes it neither for or against the jews, but square in the middle of politics to deride. a mans religion in Obamas favor without saying so.
This country, and most all the western world, is so izzy-whipped that not a single negative word can be whispered about the zioturds that are running everything without serious repercussions. See something, say something; you may die. “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken You might be surprised as to how many there are in.....CHINA.... Beijing has thousands of jews, their own conclave, all are in the financial and commercial structure. Plus there are untold others that are jew by culture but have Chinese blood. For years, during the cultural revolution, Mao and his wife had a jew adviser.
The question is, are they Torah Jews or zionists? I don't know the answer, do you? “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken Zionists... Israel Epstine was the jew I had in mind. Mrs. Mao had him thrown in prison for five years and the jew bastard went right back to work for them to maintain power. Here is url for the jews that controll China from inside. Click on the top two for something you never see nor hear of in our media.
Sir Lod... Click this url, check the eighth photo from top, front row second from right, who does that look like from Texas?????
A short history journey. The Hebrews* are actually a segment from inside the Ancient Hurrian culture.
One guy looked like an older, more tanned, Lee Harvey Oswald. But, I's prolly looking at a different picture. Most all the white guys looked jewish, though...big beaks. “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken Do you believe in any higher being? And if so, who and why? Thanks. “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken I am amazed that OB became P. And was proud of America for that. He is a war criminal. Lee Harvey Oswald it is. That is Israel Epstein that ran China for years. He was in charge of the money, is'nt that an odd one????? He was their most honored person, until he was about 95 when the grim reaper caught up with him. People are fooled when they "believe" that China is anti Israel. That is for the rubes to believe. War is their ultimate money maker.
And if so, who and why? Before I give you a general answer,...a few notes about Ancient world,...for those reading along. Parrot: on final...
Thank you for your thoughtful reply. I know some of the information; but there's much more that I would like to learn about. Personally, I'd just as soon that the Mayans have it right. “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken...marinating in his own ego.
#2. To: tom007 (#0)
#3. To: Turtle, Lod (#2)
He's a Mormon in name only, just like Nixon was a Quaker in name only.
#4. To: Cynicom (#3)
Throwing religion into the mix is PARTISAN POLITICS AT ITS worse.
#5. To: Cynicom (#3)
#6. To: Phant2000 (#4)
The worst is already here, being practiced by too many.
#7. To: Lod (#5)
I don't believe that mormons are any worse than the crips or the bloods.
#8. To: Cynicom (#7)
#9. To: Lod (#8)
And they deserve all such questions, imo.
#10. To: Cynicom (#9)
#11. To: Lod (#10)
#12. To: Cynicom (#11)
#13. To: Lod (#12)
#14. To: Lod (#12)
#15. To: Lod (#10)
(Edited)
This country, and most all the western world, is so izzy-whipped that not a single negative word can be whispered about the zioturds that are running everything without serious repercussions.
The Hyksos Kings which sat on the throne of Egypt for several hundred years,...an Elite ..of the Hurrian culture.
Hurrians existed way back during Sumer and Akkad.
They excelled in trade,held the trade routes to the Causcus's and East towards India.
They knew Metallurgy,..and brokered that for everything from weapons making to jewelry.
They brought the war chariot,compound bow,body armor etc making them unique among cultures.
The Elite who lost[where driven out]from Egypt went into Canaan and elsewhere to try and renew their bloodline rule.
[They need a Religion too so as to effectively rule.... They learned* that Egypts religious system was complete BS and a socio control front.
This is why the magic Hebrew god and books of the Law appear out of nowhere.
The story is so obvious fake....Moshe on a mountain.....only He meets YHWH,..and then only He is rightfull power with a Preist cast [Levites]serving him and being Homeland Reich.
There was no King David or Solomon,....no nations in the region know these Kings..or their claimed Kingdom sizes in area,...its BS...its all made up and contrived [probably during Babylon dispersion]
Israel does exist....but its more probable a patchwork of Mitanni lords in the North [Mitanni nobles ruled in Canaan]...the Mitanni are the last phase of the Ancient Hurrians....and they eventually become obsorbed by the Hittites.
The Assyrians end Israel and drag it off...scatter it to the 4 winds.
The YHWH cult [YHWH was a named god in the east 1000 years before Israel,..as it is listed on Cuneiform tablets]
This YHWH cult flee's south as the Assyrians sack the north...and they weasel in with the Hyksos Elite in Judah/J'Lem....cut a deal.
later...the Elite adopt the YHWH cult and their priests run the game...until the Babylonians crush Judah and the Phillistines.
The OT with its beginnings is contrived...probably cast during the dispersion in Babylon by the Jewish Elites and their Priest cast.
the later end of the OT is more historical....but still has the fake prophetic thing and the promises to Jews/Israel.
The Ancient Egyptians hated the Hyksos...and know the Jews are realy their seed.
Numerous OT scripture is nearly 100% cut paste off of Egyptian ceremony/writing.
The Law and the Books of Moses are BS ...cobbled together law concepts from around the ME of the day.
The Jews/Hebrews have been running a deception...Shell game for 1000's of years.
They are good at it.
But they over reach...become arrogant....and peoples just end their asses when they can't take it anymore.
The story of AB.RAM is probably true to the degree that Hurrians would travel from Sumer to Canaan.
You are told that AB.RAM went from UR to Paddan Harran,...[PH was a Key Hurrian trade city]..and from their....to Canaan,..and then to Egypt....where Hyksos/Hurrians are already on the throne.
Noah is just the old Gilgamesh story spun for Hebrews/Jews.
When you deep search this stuff...its fails the test over and over.
The Jews hang all on the fear in the mind and the guilt,...that you will not escape their contrived mental trap : )
#16. To: Cynicom (#14)
#17. To: Parrot with speed dial (#15)
#18. To: Cynicom (#3)
Whites elected a black man, yet all whites are racists
"Satan / Cheney in "08" 
#19. To: Lod (#16)
#20. To: Lod (#17)
Do you believe in any higher being?
I have since mid 1990's followed Electric Universe,...and it is kicking mainstream sciences ass...handing them their hat and showing them the door.
The Sun is Electric...its not a nuclear furnace.
[see -The surface of the Sun -website where NASA/JPL's own trace satellite shows 2 layers of plasma sweeping over the Suns ferrite[iron] calcium surface] The Earth is also...Expanded Earth Theory,...not Continental Drift...which is fail..[See Maxlow and other EXP earth websites on the net]
Are you familiar with Gobekli Tepi in Turkey...9000BC...there are etched megaliths with Zodiac constellations...some 21 ring sites.
Posnansky found the skulls of Giants around Tiwanaku...these skulls are 3x elongated...some are in museums.
Burried uder 6ft of flood alluvial detritus.
and the ground 6ft down was full of charred debris as if the entire region was immolated in a huge conflaguration of fire.
Tiwanaku is over 12,000 ft above sealevel....but has ancient shoreline...warfs...and is viewed as being at sealevel....long long ago.
Posnansky dated the skulls to 13,000BC...and suggested they could go back...33,000.
Now for the real heady stuff.
The lore of the region..and elsewhere in mythos...tells of a time before the Moon [Luna]...before her capture.
Horbiger and Bellamy researched and opine that Earth had 1 or 2 smaller satellite moons....which broke up [Roche limit]...and devastated the Earth.
Luna's capture sequence could have pushed them in.
excerpt wiki/Greek flood myths
"Many great deluges have taken place during the nine thousand years, for that is the number of years which have elapsed since the time of which I am speaking; and during all this time and through so many changes, there has never been any considerable accumulation of the soil coming down from the mountains, as in other places, but the earth has fallen away all round and sunk out of sight. The consequence is, that in comparison of what then was, there are remaining only the bones of the wasted body, as they may be called, as in the case of small islands, all the richer and softer parts of the soil having fallen away, and the mere skeleton of the land being left."
Plato’s Critias (111b)[1]
LLoyd Pye has discovered that our human DNA is fused in the 2/3rd Chromosome segment.
we are 46 pairs....and appear to be hybrid augments.
we also have over 4000** genetic defects latent in our DNA.
Life is now considered to be Panspermia....its Galactic...and takes when conditions support it.
Life is also a program sequence...can be clocked out via numerous factors.
hence....extinctions of species.
The actual history of our Earth,..and Life on it is being challenged by revision,..and ya....the gatekeepers are desperate to continue their game....and sell it to the sheeple.
I know [thats me and others]....that religion is fake and contrived by man.
Of late..and building...its revealed that the Flavians of Rome contrived the Jesus story
Ghia is BS.....
Reincarnation is speculative....and ya...theres a form of religion behind that too.
I have in my life experienced several amazing events...
Which moves me to consider some form of interface with a presence unseen...who is able to initiate events in my life...which are linked to history...a form of me* ..being the certain someone to continue the legacy of something from the past which spreads out and involves 1000's of people.
I'm in complete awe of that...and have no idea how to label it or define it...it just happened.
Have also survived several accidents which should have ended my life..
It seems I am supposed to be down here...for a while.
I have leadings....dreams...but there are no guides....no named beings or voices.
I'm not unique....many people are infact...just like me....but they are too busy..and need to quiet their inner person and learn to listen....slow down....listen.
We live in a time of revision....its exciting...yet its a place where rejection will certainly arrive...as pointing things out....upsets paradigms...and brings strong reaction by those who are trapped in controls....which they do to some degree realize are false...but are not yet strong enough to walk away from.
#21. To: Parrot with speed dial, truth seekers, 4 (#20)
...We live in a time of revision....its exciting...yet its a place where rejection will certainly arrive...as pointing things out....upsets paradigms...and brings strong reaction by those who are trapped in controls....which they do to some degree realize are false...but are not yet strong enough to walk away from.
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