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9/11
See other 9/11 Articles

Title: 9 11 Fake Video Stars: The J Star Clones – Why Covert Operation’s Cointel Must Have ‘Fake’ Video and ‘No Planes’
Source: Ed Ward, MD's Blog: US Tyranny & Treason
URL Source: http://edwardmd.wordpress.com/
Published: May 5, 2013
Author: Ed Ward M.D.
Post Date: 2013-05-05 20:49:50 by Original_Intent
Keywords: planes, no-planes, 911, towers
Views: 28188
Comments: 451

9 11 Fake Video Stars: The J Star Clones – Why Covert Operation’s Cointel Must Have ‘Fake’ Video and ‘No Planes’

9 11 Fake Video Stars: The J Star Clones - Why Covert Operation's Cointel Must Have 'Fake' Video

US Government Problem: Video of the planes needed to actually fly into the WTCs are readily available to the public.

US Government Solution: Promote the Videos as ‘fake’ based on ‘pixel’ BS – This solves the ‘evidence’ problem while never noting that the planes are NOT commercial airliners – which are not structurally capable of performing the tasks and look nothing like the photographic proof that commercial airliners are ‘not in the picture’ and US Government Military Planes are ‘in the picture’. Actually, an excellent scam premise when pumped out by the covert op truth troops.

Wingtips say B 767-400ERE-10A is THE CLONE USED to fly into the WTCs – Unless someone has a version that matches the video better.

The videos show that a Boeing 767-400ER E-10A was the supposed Super-Powered’ Commercial Airliner’. (One of these all very similar clones is clearly seen – one version of these clones has the ‘swept’ back wingtips used to discredit the video as fakery by some… Boeing 767-400ER E-10A) All early videos show the pod and the swept back wing – Recently, I’ve seen newer posts of truth videos in which the planes have neither.

Something that is fake can prove nothing, except that it is fake. It can not prove whether, how, or even if an actual event happened or not. Of course for this premise of ‘fake’ video proving anything one must also believe that during planning…

Someone says, since the plan is to use hijacked airliners, “Hey, let’s not use real planes. Let’s truck the plane parts in, crews to lay them out, people to say they saw planes, etc, et al, and just make some fake videos of planes going into the towers. Now, when we make these fake videos, instead of photoshopping in a commercial airliner with windows, we’ll photoshop in the plane needed to actually do it. Everybody high fives and says, ‘yeah, it’s just our lives on the line for treason.’ ”

Next day, the moron is no longer a threat… most likely scenario, taken out by their own family out of fear they’d all be taken out. It’s ludicrous on multiple levels.. Not just one.

The Ivy Flats Video, the testing of the first micro nuke, the Davy Crockett, is a perfect example of a camera that simply is too slow. Sure, cameras are a lot faster now, so have the travel speeds. They capture erratic images AT BEST when velocity exceeds capture speed images/PIXELS distort. Fact as clearly seen on the Ivy Flats video as soldiers move off train watch what happens to their legs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nv_q8q6Z9_I

Fake video is only important if one NEEDS to disprove video evidence that a SUPER POWERED IRREGULAR SHAPED, NON WINDOWED ‘COMMERCIAL AIRLINER’ FLEW INTO THE WTCS – INDIRECTLY, without drawing attention to the fact a military aircraft flew into the WTCs. It’s still being done today by so called ‘truthers’. Did the ‘truther orgs’ say? The US government has been caught using its own planes to destroy the WTCs? No everything was silent and then came the need for the ‘fake video’ call.

No Windows in Flight 175 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRC4lCQuBmc&feature=related

Evaluation of Video Footage – for WTC comparisons…

http://911review.org/Wiki/Wtc2PlanePod.shtml

Photo: Boeing N256BA – E-10 MC2A http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3040/2351680318_dcaff7147e_z.jpg?zz=1

Related photos: http://www.spyflight.co.uk/767%20mc2a.htm

There are additional photos in original article ’9 11 Fake Video Stars: The JSTAR Clones. Why Covert Ops Must Have Fake Video 9-11 Fake Video Stars – The JSTAR Clones 10-1-10 Note, the little blue decal up front – one of the WTC witnesses claims to have seen one on the ‘plane that flew into..) BTW, eye witness testimony – the LEAST valuable information WITHOUT additional evidence. http://www.rense.com/general92/911fk.htm

F-4 Phantom at 500 mph into a solid concrete wall http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AB4IEa7jTJw

(Bullets Into Steel – Under pressure and friction metals tend to liquefy) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfFoMyMoiX4

The wall was 12 ft thick, THE PLANE WAS NOT FILLED WITH WATER, but the tanks were to simulate fuel.

“But there was a test similar to what is described above. In 1988, an
unmanned F-4 Phantom, ballasted with water and mounted on rails, was
“flown” into a concrete wall at 480 MPH. As reported, the plane crumpled,
and penetrated only about 2 inches of concrete. A very impressive test -
except it wasn’t meant to be a test of nuclear reactor safety. The wall
the F-4 crashed into was not a simulation of a nuclear plant’s wall. It
was a 12-foot-thick wall mounted on an air cushion. The test was designed to study impact forces by measuring how far the impact would push the wall. Breaking through the concrete was the last thing any of the involved scientists wanted to achieve. Furthermore, the F-4 was ballasted with water to give it the same weight as a plane fully loaded with fuel, and its final weight was 42,000 pounds. Needless to say, crashing a 412,000 pound 767 loaded with fuel into a fixed wall would have slightly different results.

Because according to a 1982 study by the Argonne National Laboratory in Illinois – a study which was conducted by request of the DOE and the NRC – the explosion from a 707 crashing into a containment dome at 466 MPH would probably overwhelm the reactor’s shielding. Note – that’s a 707, which weighs 336,000 pounds. In 1982 those were big jets. But we’ve “advanced” considerably since then. The 767s that were flown into the World Trade Center weighed 80,000 pounds more than that and carried a lot more fuel.

Other studies, again conducted for the NRC at the Lawrence Livermore
National Laboratory, found that a 125,000 pound jet had a 32 % chance of piercing a containment building’s six-foot base and an 84 % chance of
breaking through the dome.” http://everything2.com/user/DejaMorgana/writeups/Nuclear+Power

“A key report, Sugano et al 1992, covers a rocket sled crash experiment using an F-4D Phantom jet fighter impacting into a 10 foot thick reinforced concrete block.

Sandia notes:
The purpose of the test was to determine the impact force, versus time, due to the impact, of a complete F-4 Phantom — including both engines — onto a massive, essentially rigid reinforced concrete target (3.66 meters thick). Previous tests used F-4 engines at similar speeds. The test was not intended to demonstrate the performance (survivability) of any particular type of concrete structure to aircraft impact. The impact occurred at the nominal velocity of 215 meters per second (about 480 mph). The mass of the jet fuel was simulated by water; the effects of fire following such a collision was not a part of the test. The test established that the major impact force was from the engines. The test was performed by Sandia National Laboratories under terms of a contract with the Muto Institute of Structural Mechanics, Inc., of Tokyo.

With very minimal damage to the concrete target block, the plane and its engines were easily converted into small chunks of metal confetti and shrapnel at the physical interface of the two impact objects. Upon initial impact, the follow-on rear portions of the plane yet to make contact retained their shape integrity until their respective impact. (This seriously contradicts claims by Jean-Pierre Desmoulins that the wings of a 757 would have folded forward, as well as claims in the popular press that the wings folded back before entering the “too-small” hole.) The resulting shear caused debris being spread out to the left, right, and rear of the impact locus, having no ability to proceed in their original vector path, having grossly failed the test of strength with the concrete block. However, the wings are wider than the concrete block, so the wingtips are sheared off whole, and they tumble forward after being cleanly separated from the aircraft.

F4 aircraft impacting a solid concrete barrier. Note that the wings and tail do not fold as the nose impacts the concrete. (source: don’t bother moved -http://www.sandia.gov/media/NRgallery00-03.htm)

Sugano (in itself) doesn’t show that a 757 hitting the Pentagon would be turned into confetti and small chunks, but it does show that an F4 was completely destroyed in arguably similar circumstances. Furthermore, it wasn’t anywhere close to an even contest between the wall and the F4. The F4 started with a speed of 215 m/sec — and the tail was still traveling at 185 m/sec when it smashed into the wall. The F4 is a very strongly build aircraft, although at 18 meters long and 19 kg, it’s about a third the length and a fifth the weight of the 757. In terms of comparing what would happen to a 757 versus what happened to the F4, it would be difficult to do an accurate calculation without detailed design information on both aircraft. In a preliminary analysis, the extra length of the 757 means that it has three times the distance to decelerate — but the 757 is also much heavier, so it’s more difficult for the crushing process to supply enough force to decelerate even as rapidly as the F4 did.” http://www.911-strike.com/missing-confetti.htm The article from the ‘pentagon disinformation unit’ counters the information from the ‘WTC no planes disinformation unit’.

Ed Ward, MD – http://edwardmd.wordpress.com/ ;
https://www.facebook.com/EdWardMD3 ; http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EdWard-MD/messages

More US Drill Death in Waco Explosion – Drill Stops for Reality, Again http://edwardmd.wordpress.com/2013/04/28/more-us-drill-death-in-waco-drill-stops-for-reality-again/

Boston Marathon: The Finish Line For US Treason. Drill Death. Everything’s In Place For Police State. by Ed Ward, MD http://edwardmd.wordpress.com/2013/04/16/boston-marathon-the-finish-line-for-us-treason-drill-death-everything-is-in-place-for-police-state-by-ed-ward-md/

Pictures: US Boston Weapon – Both ‘Explosions’ – The Secret of the Pure Fusion Weapon – Li7 – Lithium 7 http://edwardmd.wordpress.com/2013/04/19/photograph-of-boston-fireball-2nd-explosion/

Dr. Ed Ward MD, AS, BS, MD – Reporting and investigating Constitutional abuses of the US government for almost 2 decades. AS, BS in Medical Technology – Minor in Organic Chemistry and Physics, volunteer during the Viet Nam war 6 years stateside active duty ‘med tech’ ‘US Air Farce’ – a decade experience in Medical Technology. MD degree from LSU, New Orleans – 2 decades in the field of General Practice. (My) Articles are also referenced by valid experts in their field.


Poster Comment:

For you "no planers" there are other rational explanations other than the planted disinfo (to discredit questions on 911) that there were no planes.(1 image)

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#224. To: PSUSA2 (#223)

I'm trying to get you people to present your evidence that there were no planes hitting the towers. It seems my efforts are in vain.

You haven't offered me any money yet.


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   13:02:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#225. To: wudidiz (#224)

You haven't presented anything worth paying for.

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-13   13:05:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#226. To: PSUSA2 (#225)

I never said it was worth paying for.


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   13:15:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#227. To: All (#224)

I'm trying to get you people to present your evidence that there were no planes hitting the towers.

Racist.

It seems my efforts are in vain.

Where there's a will there's a way. Believe what you want. If you want to believe the tv and the govt when they tell you that planes were used, fine. It's your life.

I'd like to see some evidence that is more convincing evidence than fake videos and "thousands" of mystery eyewitnesses.


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   13:32:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#228. To: wudidiz (#227)

Believe what you want. If you want to believe the tv and the govt when they tell you that planes were used, fine.

Present your case for there being no planes hitting the towers.

It's a simple request. Allegations have been made. Now back them up with proof.

I'm asking you out in the open to do this. Personally I think the no-planers are full of shit, but I give you and others the chance to prove me wrong. So, go ahead. Prove me wrong. Make me go away in shame after being defeated by you no-planers.

Here's your chance. It's a golden opportunity to prove you are right and I am wrong. Show everyone here that you are 100% justified in saying "I TOLD YOU SO!"

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-13   13:47:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#229. To: PSUSA2 (#228)

If you want to know the truth, like I did. Like I did with the holohoax and vaccines and other assorted myths.

You can take the time to figure it out in your own mind using your own resources.

I may be crazy, but I'm not stupid enough to think I can change your opinion against your will.

Take as much time as you like. There's no shortage of it.


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   14:10:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#230. To: wudidiz, every last no-planer here (#229)

nonsense.

If what you claim is true, one average sized post could contain the necessary information, If you think it takes a book to tell your side of the story, all that means is that you think you can bury a bunch of crap and hope no one notices.

That you refuse to do that, and that every no planer here refuses to do that, tells me that you and other no-planers are using this to distract others from finding out what happened on 9/11.

You are full of shit, wud. You and every other no-planer here and elsewhere are full of shit.

I dont know if you and others are disinfo, or just a bunch blithering idiots. In the long run, it doesn't matter, because neither choice is good. Personally I think you are nothing but a bunch of morons, too fucking stupid to have any link to any kind of organized effort.

I gave you all the opportunity, out in the open, to prove your case. None of you had the balls to do so.

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-13   15:12:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#231. To: PSUSA2, every last planer here (#230)

What Witnesses?


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   15:38:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#232. To: wudidiz (#231)

Yes, you could feel it. It was a gigantic sonic boom.

jesus fucking christ.

A sonic boom.

I guess when a plane hits a building, it should go "pfft", like a little fart.

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-13   15:46:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#233. To: PSUSA2 (#232)

That's it? You're done? Wow you're fast. And so easily satisfied.


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   16:05:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#234. To: wudidiz (#233)

yeah i'm done adios

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-13   16:14:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#235. To: PSUSA2 (#234)

Have fun


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   16:22:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#236. To: PSUSA2 (#218)

What is the relevance if these vortices to your ideas of 'no planes'?

Perhaps you have a video of your 'no planes' flying thru smoke? Fire?

FOCUS!

Why are you married to the notion that their must be smoke for the wing vortecies to exists.

And how do you fail to understand.

OK a plane allegedly flew into a building. The plane allegedly exploded. The Wake vortex did not allegedly explode , just the alleged plane.

Now the wake vortex can not explode so that is not in question.

What is in question is how come we do not see the wake vortex slamming into the fireball?

No, their is no video of the 'no planes' not hitting the towers. Asking for such a video is stupidity. Foolishness. You are asking for a video of nothing and loling to yourself. Ha ha ha super funny but not very smart.

You can see the explosion from hundreds of different angles.

YOu never see the wake vortex that should of been following the planes. It should of swirled into the fire ball and resulting smoke.

The plane would of still had a huge wake vortex following it after it crashed... that vortex would of caught up to it and into it.

If a semi truck crashes the trailer he is pulling still has forward momentum.

Just because the planes crash does not negate the forward momentum of the wake vortex.

If those planes were real we would of seen that evidence.

That their is a lack of wake vortex means those planes were most likely not real.

And if you can not understand that it is only because you do not want to understand it.

______________________________________

Suspect all media / resist bad propaganda/Learn NLP everyday everyway ;) (It's a more positive message)

titorite  posted on  2013-05-13   17:32:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#237. To: titorite (#236)

Why are you married to the notion that their must be smoke for the wing vortecies to exists.

A) You should learn to spell if you wish to be taken seriously.

B) Nobody said you need smoke to have wing vortices. What was said is that you need smoke or fog to SEE those wing vortices.

C) Explain how wing vortices are formed and what makes them move in a spiral.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-13   17:40:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#238. To: FormerLurker (#237)

A) you must be new in that seat

B) the majority here know

c) what happened to the former dude in your seat. He didn't rely on notes so much.

______________________________________

Suspect all media / resist bad propaganda/Learn NLP everyday everyway ;) (It's a more positive message)

titorite  posted on  2013-05-13   17:44:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#239. To: titorite (#238)

So you have nothing but nonsensical remarks, and have no intention of giving any sort of honest thought out answers.

It's clear what you're doing here. So are you working the 2nd shift, taking over for wud?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-13   18:00:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#240. To: titorite (#236)

Why are you married to the notion that their must be smoke for the wing vortecies to exists.

Where did I say that?

You need something like smoke to see it.

"YOu never see the wake vortex that should of been following the planes. It should of swirled into the fire ball and resulting smoke. "

The fire and smoke exited the building on the opposite site of the impact. Proof is on the videos. (yeah I know they are all fake blah blah blah) So how would a vortex affect that? Don't answer. I don't even want to hear it.

Sayonara. I'm done with your crap too.

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-13   18:18:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#241. To: FormerLurker, SKYDRIFTER (#176) (Edited)

BAC to you.

Well chosen words.. LOL

Thing is BAC was MAGNITUDES more intelligent, and infinitely more polite.

BAC to 9/11 truthers ~ "You guys are kooks." He only appeared intelligent because of his sources of info, which was still debunked almost as easily as this no-plane hit the towers stuff is debunked.

God is always good!

RickyJ  posted on  2013-05-13   18:23:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#242. To: titorite (#180)

I am also sure wake vortex will follow a plane into a wall.

Huh? What the heck are you talking about? Follow into a wall? Do you know anything about physics? I think not talking like that.

God is always good!

RickyJ  posted on  2013-05-13   18:29:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#243. To: FormerLurker (#239)

So you have nothing but nonsensical remarks, and have no intention of giving any sort of honest thought out answers.

It's clear what you're doing here. So are you working the 2nd shift, taking over for wud?

Did I catch you off guard?

______________________________________

Suspect all media / resist bad propaganda/Learn NLP everyday everyway ;) (It's a more positive message)

titorite  posted on  2013-05-13   18:30:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#244. To: titorite (#180)

I am also sure wake vortex will follow a plane into a wall.

Follow into a wall! Dumbest comment I have ever seen ever. First of all they don't follow, as in move the direction the plane is moving, they are produced by the plane flying through the air at the wingtips. They can last up to three minutes depending on the wind and other factors. Their force not comparable to the force of an explosion, which would dissipate the vortex immediately. Damn dude, please stop posting your drivel here.

God is always good!

RickyJ  posted on  2013-05-13   19:08:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#245. To: SKYDRIFTER, FormerLurker (#179)

Who taught you this sort of "science", Jim Fetzer?

That's a truly prominent name in the "no-planes" issue; another persistent but sore loser. I suspect he still loses sleep every time my name pops up.

Someone recently signed up on 4um with the name Jim Fetzer. I don't know if it is really him or not though. The no-brainers are having a field day here lately. I don't know why they are tolerated honestly, they hurt the movement.

God is always good!

RickyJ  posted on  2013-05-13   19:16:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#246. To: RickyJ, SKYDRIFTER, FormerLurker (#245)

To some degree the "no-planers" remind me of militant atheists. It is sort of a self righteous "how dare you believe differently" attitude.

Perseverent Gardener
"“Believe nothing merely because you have been told it. Do not believe what your teacher tells you merely out of respect for the teacher. But whatsoever, after due examination and analysis, you find to be kind, conducive to the good, the benefit, the welfare of all beings - that doctrine believe and cling to, and take it as your guide.” ~ Gautama Siddhartha — The Buddha

Original_Intent  posted on  2013-05-13   19:38:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#247. To: Original_Intent (#246) (Edited)

To some degree the "no-planers" remind me of militant atheists. It is sort of a self righteous "how dare you believe differently" attitude.

The militant atheists are trying to justify their beliefs I think, the no-planners are not really trying to justify their beliefs, they are trying to promote their beliefs despite the very high odds they are wrong. Atheists have a lot invested in the justification of their beliefs, if they can't do it then they better seek God fast. A no planner has relatively nothing invested in their beliefs and there are no bad consequences to them if they are wrong. With very high odds they are wrong, and no real need to promote their position as to the progress of the 9/11 truth movement is concerned, then you have to conclude they are either nuts or dinsinfo artists trying to make the 9/11 movement look bad. I think some are just plain nuts, while others push the nuts on and spread disinfo.

God is always good!

RickyJ  posted on  2013-05-13   20:08:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#248. To: Original_Intent (#246) (Edited)

To some degree the "no-planers" remind me of militant atheists. It is sort of a self righteous "how dare you believe differently" attitude.

Yeah, ... cause people like gerylmist are real bitches right?

And that wudidiz.. when is he not acting like a prick.

But the worst , that absolute worst is that titorite asshole. I mean he has Tits in his name for crying out loud. Always trying to shake hands and agree to disagree. The stupid little shit stain might be more tolerable if he learned to believe as he is supposed to believe.

How fucking dare that little self righteous asshole right?

______________________________________

Suspect all media / resist bad propaganda/Learn NLP everyday everyway ;) (It's a more positive message)

titorite  posted on  2013-05-13   20:17:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#249. To: GreyLmist (#207) (Edited)

Post #220: at 2:05 of that video, Goss says that he got to the office of the Speaker of the House, Dennis Hastert, just as the plane hit the Pentagon; [sic] From that statement about the timing of his arrival at Hastert's office, it can be presumed that the clip of him in a press interview at the beginning of the video (with booming and plane sound effects) was not filmed during the Pentagon attack.

You're assuming Porter Goss is telling the truth.

The Porter Goss that had breakfast with Pakistani general Mahmud Ahmed, the man the FBI says financed flight 77's pilot, Mohammed Atta, on the very morning of 911.

edit add:

Lieutenant General Mahmud Ahmed (HI(M)), is a veteran intelligence officer and a retired three-star general in the Pakistan Army who served as a director general of Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), the principal intelligence body of Pakistan.

The Porter Goss who was co-author of the Patriot act, and co-chair of the original 911 "investigation".

Aquila  posted on  2013-05-13   20:19:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#250. To: Original_Intent, RickyJ, SKYDRIFTER (#246)

To some degree the "no-planers" remind me of militant atheists. It is sort of a self righteous "how dare you believe differently" attitude.

They sure do act like huge drama queens when things don't go their way, that's sort of obvious...

Very impolite drama queens.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-13   22:41:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#251. To: RickyJ (#245)

Someone recently signed up on 4um with the name Jim Fetzer. I don't know if it is really him or not though

I posted a few questions for him, he never responded back...


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-13   22:50:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#252. To: FormerLurker (#251)

I can't imagine him wanting to be seen posting on the same board as you.


"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers" ~ Thomas Pynchon Gravity's Rainbow

wudidiz  posted on  2013-05-13   22:58:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#253. To: wudidiz (#252)

I can't imagine him wanting to be seen posting on the same board as you.

Well no, of course he wouldn't. That, and perhaps he wouldn't want to be associated with the likes of YOU and your little friend.

Ever think about that one?

But no, I'm sure he wouldn't want to risk being shown to be the con man that he really is on a public forum.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-13   23:02:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#254. To: RickyJ (#241) (Edited)

BAC to 9/11 truthers ~ "You guys are kooks." He only appeared intelligent because of his sources of info, which was still debunked almost as easily as this no-plane hit the towers stuff is debunked.

Yeah, but the word "kook" is so goofy and tame compared to what's being hurled around here as of late, his mannerisms could be considered respectful and mild mannered in comparison.

He could talk a load of bullshit for days on end, and would always have his massive chunk of cut and paste material which would take forever to read, and THAT was his tactic, he'd simply wear you down hoping that you'd give up.

This new sort of tactic seen as of late is more of a Mad Dog or yukon approach to shilling. Be nasty, insulting, rude, vulgar, etc. to those whom you target, play the victim with high drama, and at the same time kiss up to those you hope to gain something from.

In all honesty I've never seen this level of high drama on a forum.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-14   0:04:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#255. To: PSUSA2, FormerLurker, Original_Intent, SKYDRIFTER, *No Planers* (#230) (Edited)

If what you claim is true, one average sized post could contain the necessary information, If you think it takes a book to tell your side of the story, all that means is that you think you can bury a bunch of crap and hope no one notices.

That you refuse to do that, and that every no planer here refuses to do that, tells me that you and other no-planers are using this to distract others from finding out what happened on 9/11.

You are full of shit, wud. You and every other no-planer here and elsewhere are full of shit.

I dont know if you and others are disinfo, or just a bunch blithering idiots. In the long run, it doesn't matter, because neither choice is good. Personally I think you are nothing but a bunch of morons, too fucking stupid to have any link to any kind of organized effort.

I gave you all the opportunity, out in the open, to prove your case. None of you had the balls to do so.

I don't know how you turned a discussion about jet airflow into a work detail for me, PSUSA2, but there are not enough hours in the day for me as it is to keep up with all that I have to do, need or want to do, and then get some sleep too without demands from Planers to return to square one in every single topic of No Planes issues. It's like they all have a memory retention problem about it for some reason. No other side of the 9/11 spectrum is expected to keep starting over and over again in debates as if the only thing anybody knows about No Planes research is to sling slurs at it like trained automatons. There are threads here with hundreds of posts -- video analysis and more -- all for naught with those whose real objective is not discussing or studying it but embattlement, defamation and such. I don't come to 4um to be at war with people. I will gladly talk about the subject of No Planes if someone is sincerely interested in learning and conversing about it but not here in this acrid quagmire anymore. This thread, imo, is about nothing but a lowdown ambush of No Planers and mindboggling misperception management by their opponents. Ironically, SKYDRIFTER describes those tactics to a tee at 4um Title: MIND CONTROL IN THE 21st CENTURY:

the mother of all tactics, "Coercive Persuasion"

Edited next to last sentence.

-------

"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC

GreyLmist  posted on  2013-05-14   5:45:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#256. To: GreyLmist (#255)

at times like this I like those little like buttons or agree buttons or rep buttons.... spelling out one's agreement is cool too. :)

______________________________________

Suspect all media / resist bad propaganda/Learn NLP everyday everyway ;) (It's a more positive message)

titorite  posted on  2013-05-14   5:49:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#257. To: titorite (#256)

Thanks for stopping by with that refreshment before I left. L8r all y'all, somewhere else on-board...

-------

"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC

GreyLmist  posted on  2013-05-14   6:11:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#258. To: GreyLmist (#255)

I will gladly talk about the subject of No Planes if someone is sincerely interested in learning and conversing about it but not here in this acrid quagmire anymore.

Much has been made of wing tip vortices. Why? I don't know. Their relevance has never been explained, but evidently it is a key phenomenon.

I personally have gone out of my way in order to understand what the no-planers are talking about. It got me nowhere. And wasted effort tends to piss me off, hence my "acridity".

If you or other no-planers can't distill your ideas into a coherent, reasonably sized post, there is something wrong there. It should not take a book to do this. Just something like "Why I believe there were no planes that hit the towers", and then say WHY you believe this.

When it comes to slur slinging, that started from the no-planers, not me. I'm the one that stayed on topic.

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-14   7:45:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#259. To: Original_Intent (#246)

To some degree the "no-planers" remind me of militant atheists. It is sort of a self righteous "how dare you believe differently" attitude.

They don't like people they can't lead by the nose.

Hell, you and I have had our spats. It's not personal. But they take it personally.

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-14   10:09:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#260. To: PSUSA2 (#259)

It's not personal. But they take it personally.

I think it is rude for you to speak for other people's feelings. You don't know how they feel.

SilverStorm  posted on  2013-05-14   11:28:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#261. To: SilverStorm (#260)

Do you need a tissue?


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-14   11:30:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#262. To: SilverStorm (#260)

I'm just going off of what they write.

Facts and feelings generally don't mix well.

------------------------------------------

Can you demonstrate a single instance in history where incursion by niggers blacks has resulted in excellence, prosperity, or improvement owing to their presence, inventiveness, or disposition?

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-14   11:52:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#263. To: titorite, FormerLurker (#166)

confirming that titorite is rustyrale at LP and also registered here as rustyrale before using the titorite moniker.

christine  posted on  2013-05-14   12:58:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#264. To: christine (#263) (Edited)

confirming that titorite is rustyrale at LP and also registered here as rustyrale before using the titorite moniker.

I was getting him confused with a different but similar handle, rustynail. That person is nothing at all like "titorite".

In checking on LP, rustyrale signed on LP for one day of "fun", and it happened to be on April Fools Day a few years back.


"The real deal is this: the ‘royalty’ controlling the court, the ones with the power, the ones with the ability to make a difference, with the ability to change our course, the ones who will live in infamy if we pass the tipping points, are the captains of industry, CEOs in fossil fuel companies such as EXXON/Mobil, automobile manufacturers, utilities, all of the leaders who have placed short-term profit above the fate of the planet and the well-being of our children." - James Hansen

FormerLurker  posted on  2013-05-14   13:15:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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