[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help] 

Status: Not Logged In; Sign In

BBC Under Fire for CENSORING Gaza Medic Documentary

US is Agreement Incapable

Blow to Israeli Intelligence. taping Israelis in bathrooms

“They have 500 mRNA shots in the pipeline.”

A US federal judge has DENIED Gavin Newsom's request to stop Trump from using the National Guard in Los Angeles.

Have You Noticed That Seismic Activity Has Been Going Nuts All Over The Globe

The Vax was meant to CAUSE cancer.... listen to this - this clip from RFK Jr's site

CNN Immediately Cuts Off Panelist Who Tells the Truth About the LA Riots

Army Secretary declares war on the military industrial complex

Former Israeli PM Threatens U.S. Will Get 'A Re-Run Of 9-11' If It Doesn't Fight Israel's Wars

7 Examples Of The “Mostly Peaceful” Los Angeles Riots Becoming Even More “Peaceful”

Biden Admin and ActBlue Funded Group Behind Abolish ICE Protests in LA

Murderers, rapists, gang members: ICE busts 12 of LA's 'worst' illegal alien criminals amid riots

LA Mayor Karen Bass Threatens Feds: Withdraw From LA Or the Violence Will Escalate –

Woman points gun at police and finds out

EXCLUSIVE: Rep. Ronny Jackson Accuses Biden Doctor Kevin O’Connor Of Sexual Misconduct

WHAT YOU’RE WITNESSING IN LOS ANGELES ISN’T JUST UNREST—IT’S MORAL COLLAPSE

Anna Paulina Luna Exposes the Guy Behind the Anti-ICE Riots

Mike Huckabee Working To Keep Netanyahu in Power

Israeli Military and Israeli-Backed Gang Shoot Aid Seekers in Gaza, Killing 14

Only 68 Building Permits Issued for Pacific Palisades After Wildfires Destroyed 6800 Structures

Violent Rioters Fire Off Exploding Projectiles at Police Horses Use Fireworks and Explosives to Attack Police

ICE Just Shattered Records With One Massive Operation That Has Democrats Fuming

Nolte: Insurrectionist Democrats Plan Another Summer of Blue City-Riots

Violent riots have now been reported in over 30 American cities. Heres a full list:

Mass shooter opened fire at graduation party was an migrant who was busted in LA ICE raids:

Cash Jordan: ICE Raids Home Depot... as California Collapses

Silver Is Finally Soaring: Here's Why

New 4um Interface Coming Soon

Attack of the Dead-2025.


Religion
See other Religion Articles

Title: Couples faith in "jesus" gets them nothing but 2 dead kids and a murder charge(my title)
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://news.yahoo.com/dead-pa-babys ... -divine-healing-025704613.html
Published: May 25, 2013
Author: j
Post Date: 2013-05-25 07:58:50 by PSUSA2
Keywords: None
Views: 6875
Comments: 177

PHILADELPHIA (AP) — After their 2-year-old son died of untreated pneumonia in 2009, faith-healing advocates Herbert and Catherine Schaible promised a judge they would not let another sick child go without medical care.

But now they've lost an 8-month-old to what a prosecutor called "eerily similar" circumstances. And instead of another involuntary manslaughter charge, they're now charged with third-degree murder.

"We believe in divine healing, that Jesus shed blood for our healing and that he died on the cross to break the devil's power," Herbert Schaible, 44, told Philadelphia homicide detectives after their ninth child, Brandon, died in April. Medicine, he said, "is against our religious beliefs."

The Schaibles were ordered held without bail Friday, two days after their arrest, although defense lawyers argued that they are neither a flight risk nor a danger to the community.

"He is incarcerated because of his faith," said lawyer Bobby Hoof, who described client Herbert Schaible's mindset as resolute.

"He's strong willed," Hoof said. "(Yet) he's mourning this son. He's hurting as any dad would."

The only people theoretically at risk are the couple's seven surviving children, who are now in foster care, the lawyers said.

A judge acknowledged that the couple had never missed a court date in the first case but said he worried that might change amid the more serious charges. And he feared they may have supporters who would harbor them.

"Throughout this country ... there are churches like the Schaibles' whose members and leaders probably don't think they did anything wrong and might be willing — to paraphrase the Schaibles' pastor — to put their interpretation of God's will above the law," Common Pleas Judge Benjamin Lerner said.

About a dozen children die each year in the U.S. when parents turn to faith healing instead of medicine, typically from highly treatable problems, said Shawn Francis Peters, a University of Wisconsin lecturer who has studied faith-healing deaths.

In Oregon, four couples from a faith-healing church have been prosecuted, the most recent in 2011 when a couple was sentenced to more than six years in prison for manslaughter in the death of their newborn son.

The state legislature that year removed faith healing as a defense to murder charges. Members of the Followers of Christ have consistently refused to speak with journalists.

Defense lawyer Mark Cogan declined to comment Friday on whether the legal actions have changed the practice of any church members. Some testified at the 2011 trial that they do get medical care.

At the Schaibles' sentencing in February 2011 in their son Kent's death, they agreed to follow terms of the 10-year probation, which included an order to get their children regular checkups and sick visits as needed. Catherine Schaible, 43, let her husband speak for her and never addressed the judge.

"It's very clear that the law says that religious freedom is trumped by the safety of a child," Common Pleas Judge Carolyn Engel Temin explained.

But a transcript of a later probation hearing that year shows probation officers were confused by their mandate to oversee the required medical care and felt powerless to carry it out. The family was not being monitored by child-welfare workers, who are more accustomed to dealing with medical compliance.

"I think that we all on the jury thought that it would not happen again, that whatever social and legal institutions needed to be involved in their situation would just take over ... and that the mandated visits would be robust enough that they would not be able to do this again," Vincent Bertolini, a former college professor who served as jury foreman at the Schaibles' first trial, said Friday.

That jury convicted the couple of involuntary manslaughter and child endangerment.

Like other cases Peters has studied, the Schaibles belong to a small, insular circle of believers. Both are third-generation members and former teachers at their fundamentalist Christian church, the First Century Gospel Church in northeast Philadelphia.

Their pastor, Nelson Clark, has said the Schaibles lost their sons because of a "spiritual lack" in their lives and insisted they would not seek medical care even if another child appeared near death. He did not return phone messages this month, but he told The Associated Press in 2011 that his church is not a cult, and he faulted officials for trying to force his members into "the flawed medical system," which he blamed for 100,000 deaths a year.

"These are people who have been brought up in these communities; their beliefs are reinforced every day," Peters said. "They're not trained intellectually to question these doctrines, where the rest of us might engage in critical inquiry, weighing the benefits of medicine versus the benefits of prayer."

A handful of families, including one in western Pennsylvania, have lost two children after attempts at faith healing, according to Peters, who wrote "When Prayer Fails: Faith Healing, Children and the Law."

Peters isn't sure that courts have the means to prevent the problem, since such people don't fear legal punishment, only Judgment Day. Some believe death "is a good outcome," given their belief in the afterlife, he said.

"They don't want to harm their children. They're just in this particularly narrow — and very, very dangerous — way misguided about the potential of medical science," he said.

He believes that "empathetic" intervention, through dialogue between church and public health educators, could help some "get to a point where they allow their beliefs and practices to evolve."

But there's a risk that could backfire, and drive these communities further underground, he said.

For the Schaibles, a third-degree murder conviction could bring seven to 14 years in prison or more.

Said Assistant District Attorney Joanne Pescatore: "Somebody is dead now as a result of what they did — or didn't do."

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 40.

#25. To: PSUSA2 (#0)

About a dozen children die each year in the U.S. when parents turn to faith healing instead of medicine,

A dozen........that must be an epidemic.

6,700 die in automobiles. OUTLAW CHILDREN IN CARS!!!! 1,000 drown to death.......OUTLAW CHILDREN AND WATER!!!! 540 die the horrible death by fire.....OUTLAW ALL FIRE!!! 970 die of unintentional poisoning and 133 intentional is this close to an epidemic yet? 1260 die of unintentional suffocation and strangulation and 740 from intentional suffocation and strangulation. 138 from firearm accidents and 2200 firearm homicides and 680 firearm suicides.

Thousands more children die from the cure after SEEKING medical "expertise" than the dozen that die from not seeking it......do they matter?

Now for medicated children.....25 percent of children in the U.S. were on regular medication. 45 million children are on asthma medications, 24 million are on ADHD medications, almost 10 million are on antidepressants with another six and a half million on other antipsychotics. Then there are the antihypertensives, the sleep aids, the medications for Type 2 diabetes and high cholesterol, and on and on. 45 Million kids are popping pills and going to the doctor...aren't your relieved! Nothing to see here Looky Lou, keep your eye on the 12 that didn't get medical attention while 45 million keep popping pills that kill thousands under doctor supervision.

abraxas  posted on  2013-05-25   12:58:30 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: abraxas (#25)

Thousands more children die from the cure after SEEKING medical "expertise" than the dozen that die from not seeking it......do they matter?

Really?

Don't look at the child mortality rates of the 1800's and early 1900's. You'll REALLY fly off the handle if you did that.

Those medicines (and vaccines lol) save kids lives.

PSUSA2  posted on  2013-05-25   13:27:19 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: PSUSA2 (#32)

child mortality rates of the 1800's and early 1900's

Wouldn't have anything to do with clean water/sanitation/mobility would it? No, of course not, all hail Big Pharma. Lol!

abraxas  posted on  2013-05-25   13:33:47 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 40.

        There are no replies to Comment # 40.


End Trace Mode for Comment # 40.

TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest


[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help]