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Title: New Mural In Florida’s Capitol Building Shows Zimmerman Shooting Trayvon Martin
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URL Source: http://www.mrconservative.com/2013/ ... -in-floridas-capitol-building/
Published: Aug 11, 2013
Author: Kristin Tate
Post Date: 2013-08-11 08:56:15 by James Deffenbach
Keywords: None
Views: 1584
Comments: 127
A huge new mural called “We Are All Trayvon Martin” was unveiled in the Florida State Capitol. It was created by a Miami artist who is clearly very sympathetic towards Martin. Artist Huong unveiled the creation during a sit-in to protest Florida’s so-called “stand your ground” law. (Stand your ground had absolutely nothing to do with this case. Effin' idiot). Poster Comment: Alternate title: George Zimmerman now set for another defamation suit against an alleged "artist" who has to know better. At least if she had paid any attention at all to the trial she would have. The man was found NOT GUILTY and for good reason. He was attacked and defended himself. Case closed. George Zimmerman should sue the "artist" as well as whoever approved putting this pos in the Capitol Building. I hope he sues their asses and breaks them from doing stuff like this. Titled, “We Are All Trayvon Martin,” the painting shows Zimmerman firing a gun at a hoodie-wearing figure. The painting features a mirror to signify that the shooting could have happened to anyone. There is also an image of Martin Luther King Jr. with blood trickling down his head.
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#40. To: Lod, GreyLmist (#39)
(Edited)
Below is a piece of info that made me think there's more that we are not being told. -------------- See GreyLmist's post #157 “Turns out that he wasn't even acting as an on-duty Neighborhood Watch Patrol that night and, reportedly, the HOA/Homeowners Association stated that they aren't supposed to be armed there.” http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/re...tNum=157244&Disp=165#C165
There are so many conflicting stories out there - from "we asked GZ if he would be the (armed) watchman" to whatever, I'm losing interest in this case. Bottom line - GZ was protecting himself from a life-threatening assault. Dude is not guilty. I'm readying for the next one. Manual rapes here in Texas should get as much attention... “The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken
What, you aren't feeling any multi-generational guilt for oppressing Shitavius and Rastus and Shaniqua for the last 400 years?? Hmmph! Next thing, you'll be asking why the gas chambers of Hitler's death camps only had creaky, wooden- framed screen doors to seal in the Zyklon-B.
In other words, uninformed, reactionary, morons who don't know a thing about the facts of the case.
#41. To: purplerose (#40)
#42. To: Original_Intent (#36)
-Alex Kurtagic
#43. To: randge (#19)
Thanks randge. A good article for the unbelievers I guess.
Americans who have no experience with, or knowledge of, tyranny believe that only terrorists will experience the unchecked power of the state. They will believe this until it happens to them, or their children, or their friends.
Paul Craig Roberts
#44. To: Big Meanie (#31)
Not one more black life? Saint Skittles should have asked himself what value, if any, he placed on his own life and if it was more valuable than the street cred he would have gotten for injuring or killing whitey.
Americans who have no experience with, or knowledge of, tyranny believe that only terrorists will experience the unchecked power of the state. They will believe this until it happens to them, or their children, or their friends.
Paul Craig Roberts
#45. To: Original_Intent, Big Meanie (#35)
Those people holding the signs like the one Big Meanie posted and the ones clamoring about the stand your ground law(s) don't give a damn about any facts, they don't want to be confused. They know what they believe and that is good enough for them. The next one is a little longer but carefully recounts the facts of the Martin/Zimmerman Case.
Americans who have no experience with, or knowledge of, tyranny believe that only terrorists will experience the unchecked power of the state. They will believe this until it happens to them, or their children, or their friends.
Paul Craig Roberts
#46. To: Turtle (#37)
You and I are in complete agreement on that one, Turtle. If I was Zimmerman I would sue the hell out of her and everyone involved.
Americans who have no experience with, or knowledge of, tyranny believe that only terrorists will experience the unchecked power of the state. They will believe this until it happens to them, or their children, or their friends.
Paul Craig Roberts
#47. To: X-15 (#42)
What about Fried Chickenisha, Tawanda, Lavonda, Yonell and Tyrell? You left them out and I suspect did it on purpose. That bese rayciss!!! What, you aren't feeling any multi-generational guilt for oppressing Shitavius and Rastus and Shaniqua for the last 400 years??
Americans who have no experience with, or knowledge of, tyranny believe that only terrorists will experience the unchecked power of the state. They will believe this until it happens to them, or their children, or their friends.
Paul Craig Roberts
#48. To: Lod (#28)
I hate this. Well it's been 8 1/2 hours. Did you get one yet. Uh-oh.
“Anti-semitism is a disease–you catch it from Jews”–Edgar J. Steele
“The jew cries out in pain, as he strikes you.”–Polish proverb
“I would like to express my heartfelt apologies for the unfortunate and tasteless quotes I published in my tag lines. I am very sorry and ashamed. I never wanted to offend anyone, or to encroach human rights."- Hmmmmm
#49. To: purplerose (#40)
-------------- See GreyLmist's post #157 “Turns out that he wasn't even acting as an on-duty Neighborhood Watch Patrol that night and, reportedly, the HOA/Homeowners Association stated that they aren't supposed to be armed there.” http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/re...tNum=157244&Disp=165#C165 The Twin Lakes Retreat Neighborhood Watch group is apparently unregistered, with HOA standards of its own, but its Homeowners Association President agrees with the Training Program not to act as the police. Some sources on that and Zimmerman being off-duty: Interactive map: The Trayvon Martin killing Your Zimmerman questions answered in 15 seconds! -- video at 1:04-1:28 | HOA rules + Training Program Zimmerman Trial Day 2 – Analysis of State’s Witnesses: Donald O’Brien, President Twin Lakes Home Owners Association - 7.5 minute YouTube of court testimony from 6:00 on the Neighborhood Watch Program (the "stucco guys" crew discussed starting at 2:50 were not part of the HOA's Neighborhood Watch group and are not said to have been armed) George Zimmerman not a member of recognized neighborhood watch organization Below is a piece of info that made me think there's more that we are not being told.
His lawyers have indicated that they will pursue a self-defense strategy, arguing that Zimmerman, a neighborhood watch volunteer who was off-duty, was protecting himself in a confrontation with the teenager.
1. ...Zimmerman volunteered for his neighborhood watch group, but he was not on duty the night of Martin’s death. ...
When 28-year-old George Zimmerman was discovered by Sanford, Florida police standing over the body of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they accepted Zimmerman’s claim that he killed in self-defense as a neighborhood watch captain. Now, through a statement released by the National Sheriffs’ Association (NSA) — the parent organization of USAonWatch-Neighborhood Watch — it has been revealed that Zimmerman was not a member of any group recognized by the organization. Zimmerman violated the central tenets of Neighborhood Watch by following Martin, confronting him and carrying a concealed weapon.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#50. To: Hmmmmm (#48)
heheh - no, I got a grip instead. But it surely is sweet.
“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out... without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” ~ H. L. Mencken
#51. To: Lod (#41)
Bottom line - GZ was protecting himself from a life-threatening assault. Dude is not guilty. I'm readying for the next one. Manual rapes here in Texas should get as much attention... i agree.... There are so many conflicting stories out there - from "we asked GZ if he would be the (armed) watchman" to whatever, I'm losing interest in this case.
#52. To: GreyLmist (#49)
When 28-year-old George Zimmerman was discovered by Sanford, Florida police standing over the body of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they accepted Zimmerman’s claim that he killed in self-defense as a neighborhood watch captain. Now, through a statement released by the National Sheriffs’ Association (NSA) — the parent organization of USAonWatch-Neighborhood Watch — it has been revealed that Zimmerman was not a member of any group recognized by the organization. Zimmerman violated the central tenets of Neighborhood Watch by following Martin, confronting him and carrying a concealed weapon. Very very interesting information. I am well informed about neighborhood watch programs and usually when a person is involved with such a program, they are registered and recognized by that agency as well as local police departments, sheriffs, and their neighborhood. George Zimmerman not a member of recognized neighborhood watch organization
#53. To: purplerose (#52)
Dorival, a civilian with the Sanford police department, was volunteering as a coordinator because she believed in neighborhood watch programs. She would do presentations to those wanting to start such programs. She said she is still at the police department but in a different position. Dorival testified that in fall 2011, she visited Zimmerman and other residents at the housing complex to discuss setting up a watch program. During her testimony, prosecutor Guy focused on her instructions to residents about how to behave when they spotted a suspicious person. “Their duty is to be the eyes and ears. Report crime as they see it,” said Dorival, adding that she provided handouts stressing this and also explained it verbally during the meeting. Zimmerman was there as the neighborhood watch coordinator, a role he told Dorival had been assigned him by the president of the homeowners' association. articles.latimes.com/2013...ighborhood-watch-20130625
#54. To: purplerose (#52)
This case is an example of why the State Militias should be in charge of Neighborhood Watch patrols, imo. Very very interesting information. I am well informed about neighborhood watch programs and usually when a person is involved with such a program, they are registered and recognized by that agency as well as local police departments, sheriffs, and their neighborhood.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#55. To: James Deffenbach, All (#43)
You're welcome, James, belatedly. I did some digging on the Sanford hammer beating attack on Mr. Mark Slavin. I thought I'd share what I found out. The case wouldn’t leave me alone for a number of reasons, one of which was the savagery of the attack. The man's skull was fractured in 51 places. Another reason was the total press blackout on the crime and the consequences. Looking at the case information for the assailants/perps/accused Julius Bender and Yahaziel Israel, it’s revealed that these two animals were arrested on 03/30/2012. They were charged with 1) armed burglary of a dwelling/structure 2) attempted first degree murder 3) burglary of a conveyance with battery and 4) carjacking with a deadly weapon. Israel was charged with possession of more than 20 grams of cocaine at the time of his arrest and has a rap sheet that includes domestic violence, escape, battery upon a police officer, resisting an officer with viokence, criminal mischief, all within the last three and a half years in Seminole County. Israel's father is a local leader of the “Nation of Yahweh.” www.seminole clerk.org/CriminalDocket/case_detail.jsp? CaseNo=592012CF000953A Bender appears to have no other criminal history in Seminole County. His case was before Judge Debra S. Nelson, but both of these cases are now before Judge Marlene M. Alva. A confession by Bender was suppressed. Amazingly Israel made bond for $100,000 but was returned to custody three days later. www.seminole clerk.org/CriminalDocket/case_lookup.jsp? CaseYear=&CourtType=__&CaseSeq=&LastName=Bender&FirstName=Julius I found the comment below today at wftv.com Channel 9 dated last April. Cops: Man beaten with hammer, 2 arrested • comment (22) • Posted by smrtgrl80 at 6:33 p.m. Apr. 16, 2012 • Report Abuse This man is a former co-worker of mine who will likely die. He is a good person who has children and people who care for him...this was a horrible crime commited by 2 black males against a white male and yet there is no outcry for him!! No news conferences or special proscecutors for him! I am outraged that they have not been charged with any hate crimes!! www.wftv.com/news/news/de...-beat-another-man-hammer- sanford/nMHW6/ The case notes for May of last year say in part: 05/22/2012 PLNG (1)ATTEMPTED FIRST DEGREE PREMEDITATED MURDER - RECLASSIFIED 782.04(1)(A)(1) Looks like these cases are still at trial and a plea deal has been reached. Whatever has been hammered out in judge’s chambers is a state secret as far as the press is concerned. 782.04 of the Florida Statutes reads “Murder.—(1)(a) The unlawful killing of a human being: 1. When perpetrated from a premeditated design to effect the death of the person killed or any human being.” So it appears that Mr. Slavin passed last May. There was not a word in the nightly news, not a newscrawler, no comment from the squawking heads. Nothing. There you are.
Know guns, know safety, know liberty. No guns, no safety, no liberty.
#56. To: Jethro Tull, GreyLmist (#53)
Is this true, GreyLmist? The part about the President of the Homeowners Association assigning Zimmerman the role as Neighborhood Watch Coordinator? Does that also mean Zimmmerman had a right to carry a concealed weapon to take on that role? “Their duty is to be the eyes and ears. Report crime as they see it,” said Dorival, adding that she provided handouts stressing this and also explained it verbally during the meeting. Zimmerman was there as the neighborhood watch coordinator, a role he told Dorival had been assigned him by the president of the homeowners' association.
#57. To: randge (#55)
Of course no one was charged with any "hate crimes." Apparently only white people can commit those. At least that is what you would be led to believe if you paid much attention to the msm and the "black leaders" like Sharpton and Jackson. It's a damned shame that there is such a blatant double standard. This man is a former co-worker of mine who will likely die. He is a good person who has children and people who care for him...this was a horrible crime commited by 2 black males against a white male and yet there is no outcry for him!! No news conferences or special proscecutors for him! I am outraged that they have not been charged with any hate crimes!!
Americans who have no experience with, or knowledge of, tyranny believe that only terrorists will experience the unchecked power of the state. They will believe this until it happens to them, or their children, or their friends.
Paul Craig Roberts
#58. To: purplerose (#56)
Here's Wendy Dorival's court testimony. Zimmerman wasn't acting as part of a Neighborhood Watch team that Sunday evening. He was on his way to Target for groceries. He was legally armed and perfectly within his rights to get out of his truck and follow TM (especially given the recent rash of crime in his development). TM could have called 911 and reported it, but he chose not to. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BN0QoiSzCJQ
#59. To: randge (#55)
Thanks randge. This is an all too typical example of the racial media bias against Whites that most of us know to be true. The MSM narrative that buries these awful stories runs deep and wide and only serves to foster anger and mistrust in people with open minds.
#60. To: purplerose (#56)
Wow, your last question really shows how little you know about anything. No wonder you think TM was an innocent little child skipping home with some skittles in his hand and a song in his heart.... Is this true, GreyLmist? The part about the President of the Homeowners Association assigning Zimmerman the role as Neighborhood Watch Coordinator? Does that also mean Zimmmerman had a right to carry a concealed weapon to take on that role?
"The Best Way to Control the Opposition is to Lead it." Vladimir Lenin "I am not a Marxist." Karl Marx
#61. To: Dead Culture Watch (#60)
Not one TM supporter realizes that the Sanford PD had a Citizen on Patrol program that was far different than the Neighborhood Watch. The COP program, offered to Z and rejected by him, wore a uniform and patrolled in a marked car. The Neighborhood Watch didn't patrol and instead observed and reported. There's a link a few posts (Wendy Dorival) above if anyone cares to learn about this aspect of the case before emoting.
#62. To: Dead Culture Watch (#60)
hey there, DCW! it's great to see you again. i miss your participation. i hope all is well with you.
#63. To: purplerose (#56) (Edited)
Is this true, GreyLmist? The part about the President of the Homeowners Association assigning Zimmerman the role as Neighborhood Watch Coordinator? Does that also mean Zimmmerman had a right to carry a concealed weapon to take on that role? I think Zimmerman was called the Coordinator because he was involved with organzing the Neighborhood Watch program there from the beginning and was a block-Captain recruiter. He was referred to in a newsletter as "our Captain" to contact after the police on crime issues, etc. Zimmerman was not on duty that night so the Neighborhood Watch protocols are not pertinent to the issue. His right to be armed and carry concealed is not in question Constitutionally or according to Florida State Law. I don't know what that community's firearms/concealed carry rules were for on-duty Watch persons but that is reportedly not something that the official Neighborhood Watch Training Program endorses. I believe they should be armed for their protection but carry openly. One of the problems I noticed in the Officer Smith testimony was that there was no mention of Miranda Rights when he was being taken into police custody. That's not proof that Miranada Rights were denied, just making note of it here as questionable. Edited next to last sentence of paragraph 1. “Their duty is to be the eyes and ears. Report crime as they see it,” said Dorival, adding that she provided handouts stressing this and also explained it verbally during the meeting. Zimmerman was there as the neighborhood watch coordinator, a role he told Dorival had been assigned him by the president of the homeowners' association.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#64. To: GreyLmist (#63)
Anyone carrying openly in FL would need a peace officer certification and would have to be in the line of duty in order to avoid a citation and/or arrest, if I'm not mistaken. I believe they should be armed for their protection but carry openly.
Know guns, know safety, know liberty. No guns, no safety, no liberty.
#65. To: GreyLmist (#63)
I grew up on firearms and living in Florida it is not unusual for residents to carry them. But this thing you mention about the Neighborhood Watch Training Program not endorsing fire arms for their patrol officers is important to consider and especially in this case. Like I said in one of my posts, I'm all for open carry. I don't believe in getting permits. If you have to get permission from the State to carry a fire-arm, then you don't have any rights to bear arms. But again back to the issue on this community watch, this issue about them not endorsing concealed carry is almost a joke. Just like this case is a joke. If I am following some suspect for alleged suspicious activity, and that individual turns on me and jumps on me, on a public sidewalk, I will fend them off as best I can, and if I have the chance, I'll draw out my piece and point it at them and call the cops right away. I will not shoot them because they are not in my home as this took place on a public sidewalk (which means the castle doctrine would not apply to my defense), but I will hold the gun on them until the cops get here. That's how I would have done it. I would probably go to jail charged with assault with a deadly weapon for this but at least I did not kill the individual. The way I see this is just because you have a gun does not give you the right to abuse your rights. You take responsibility for your actions. And people like Zimmerman are giving gunowners a very bad image. I don't know what that community's firearms/concealed carry rules were for on-duty Watch persons but that is reportedly not something that the official Neighborhood Watch Training Program endorses. I believe they should be armed for their protection but carry openly.
#66. To: GreyLmist, purplerose (#63)
Miranda isn't required when detention is brief and voluntary. One of the problems I noticed in the Officer Smith testimony was that there was no mention of Miranda Rights when he was being taken into police custody. That's not proof that Miranada Rights were denied, just making note of it here as questionable
#67. To: Dead Culture Watch (#60)
TM was unarmed. Zimmerman was not. And not every neighborhood watch program endorses their citizens to patrol with concealed weapons. No wonder you think TM was an innocent little child skipping home with some skittles in his hand and a song in his heart....
#68. To: purplerose (#67)
Zs neighborhood watch didn't patrol. The Sanford PD had a separate program for people who wanted to patrol. It was called Citizens on Patrol (COP). Z declined an offer to participate in that program, odd for a man who was painted as a cop "wannabe." And not every neighborhood watch program endorses their citizens to patrol with concealed weapons.
#69. To: Jethro Tull (#66) (Edited)
This is not true! Just because an officer directs you to the police station to "brief" you concerning a criminal matter does not mean you waive your Constitutional Rights per the Fifth Amendment and especially where you are being "detained" for a brief period. This is where all cops lie to citizens. NEVER NEVER NEVER "volunteer" information when you are being "detained". You as a citizen have every right to remain quiet because anything you say or do will be held against you in a court of law. Cops are officers of the courts. Anything you say, they record on you. Unless you have been charged with a crime, you are free to go and if the cop is asking you information relating to the crime (and you personally), you ask the cop, "Am I being charged with a crime?" If the cop does not answer you but insist on further questioning you without charging you, then they wish to detain you. This means they are unlawfully holding you against your will without being formally charged. Let them throw your ass in jail because you refuse to cooperate with providing them information. You can sue them later. The only person one should be talking to is a lawyer! Miranda isn't required when detention is brief and voluntary.
#70. To: purplerose (#69)
In order to be entitled to be read their Miranda rights, the individual must be in custody of and about to be interrogated by the police. However, even where Miranda rights are required, several exceptions exist rendering Miranda violations by police inconsequential. Custody “Custody” is a limitation on an individual’s freedom of action by virtue of a lawful process or authority. With regard to criminal procedure, whether a person has officially been placed in police custody is determined on an objective test basis. The test generally measures whether a “reasonable person” would believe that officer in some way suggested that they were not free to leave and custody is therefore not limited to formal arrests. The determination of what does and does not constitute custody can be subtle. It is more likely that an individual is in custody where: There is a traditional arrest and constraint (handcuffs, closed room, etc.) Detention is long and involuntary An individual is placed in hostile and unfamiliar surroundings It is less likely that an individual is in custody where: There is a routine traffic stop Detention is brief and voluntary (as in a brief field interview) The police call an individual on the telephone (since the individual is free to hang up) www.tlgattorneys.com/2012...anda-warning-is-required/
#71. To: purplerose (#69)
And furthermore....... Suspects can waive their right to remain silent or their right to an attorney either expressly or implicitly. To expressly waive Miranda rights, the suspect would state (or sign something stating) that he or she waives the right to remain silent or the right to have an attorney present. Implied waiver means that the suspect behaves in a way that indicates a knowing and voluntary waiver of Miranda rights.http://criminal.findlaw.com/crim...iving-miranda-rights.html
#72. To: purplerose (#69)
I wouldn't have done what Z did, nor would I suggest that anyone do it, however it is what he did nonetheless. This is not true! Just because an officer directs you to the police station to "brief" you concerning a criminal matter does not mean you waive your Constitutional Rights per the Fifth Amendment and especially where you are being "detained" for a brief period. This is where all cops lie to citizens. NEVER NEVER NEVER "volunteer" information when you are being "detained". You as a citizen have every right to remain quiet because anything you say or do will be held against you in a court of law. Cops are officers of the courts. Anything you say, they record on you. Unless you have been charged with a crime, you are free to go and if the cop is asking you information relating to the crime (and you personally), you ask the cop, "Am I being charged with a crime?" If the cop does not answer you but insist on further questioning you without charging you, then they wish to detain you. This means they are unlawfully holding you against your will without being formally charged. Let them throw your ass in jail because you refuse to cooperate with providing them information. You can sue them later. The only person one should be talking to is a lawyer!
#73. To: Dead Culture Watch, Jethro Tull, James Deffenbach, randge, Esso, Horse (#60)
The true story of the martyrdom of Trayvon Martin For those who did not follow the trial, here is a brief summary, compiled from CBS, CNN, and MSNBC news reports: Eighth grade honor student Trayvon Martin is walking home from church, eager to do his homework. Aryan Nation member George Zimmerman is driving around in his pickup truck with Confederate flag license plate and decals. Zimmerman spots Martin in the dark by the light glowing from the little boy’s halo. The Klansman takes chase, hunting Trayvon down like a dog. The budding football star nearly outruns the racist, but he stops when he comes to a “Do Not Enter” sign. Unwilling to disobey a lawful sign, he turns to face his attacker. The child attempts to reason with his attacker, but the illiterate power-mad cop-wannabe is not inclined to listen to reason, or pleas for compassion. Despite numerous specific orders from police officers to not leave his vehicle, Zimmerman exits his truck and says, “Any last words, n****r?” “Praise Jesus. God bless you, Sir,” replies the helpless youngster. Zimmerman drags the future Nobel Peace Prize winner on top of him. A witness sees the youngster repeatedly swinging his arms, apparently attempting to make the sign of the cross. “White-Hispanic Power!” screams Zimmerman, as he empties the high-capacity clip loaded with armor-piercing hollow-point bullets from his semi-automatic assault gun with the shoulder thingy that goes up into the body. Zimmerman then fiendishly punches himself in the face, breaking his nose, and repeatedly bangs his head on the sidewalk while screaming “Help me! Help me!” which obviously is a secret racist code for “Heil Hitler.” When he is finished murdering Martin, Zimmerman gets back into his gas- guzzling, globe-warming pickup truck and makes his escape. http://www.lsrebellion.blogspot.com/
-Alex Kurtagic
#74. To: X-15 (#73)
Damn, my stomach is hurting from all that laughing.
Americans who have no experience with, or knowledge of, tyranny believe that only terrorists will experience the unchecked power of the state. They will believe this until it happens to them, or their children, or their friends.
Paul Craig Roberts
#75. To: X-15, JD (#73)
We also have this very real possibility.... More likely than that, since there's scant evidence of a struggle on the hands of either one of them, would be GZ rendering TM unconcious somehow where he stood as he spoke to him and all the one-sided hollering heard with TM allegedly witnessed pinning him down and pummeling him during a supposed fracas a staged show as a cover-story for Z, with the point-blank gunfire the "grand finale". http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=157244&Disp=221#C221
#76. To: purplerose (#69)
Thanks for your judicious input on the Miranda Rights issue. Officer Smith's testimony did not mention any waiver signed by Zimmerman and he was handcuffed as officially "detained"/arrested. Maybe Smith thought that aspect was so routine he needn't say anything about it. Doubtful, though, since there are other oddities about his testimony. Just because an officer directs you to the police station to "brief" you concerning a criminal matter does not mean you waive your Constitutional Rights per the Fifth Amendment and especially where you are being "detained" for a brief period. This is where all cops lie to citizens. NEVER NEVER NEVER "volunteer" information when you are being "detained". You as a citizen have every right to remain quiet because anything you say or do will be held against you in a court of law. Cops are officers of the courts. Anything you say, they record on you. Unless you have been charged with a crime, you are free to go and if the cop is asking you information relating to the crime (and you personally), you ask the cop, "Am I being charged with a crime?" If the cop does not answer you but insist on further questioning you without charging you, then they wish to detain you. This means they are unlawfully holding you against your will without being formally charged. Let them throw your ass in jail because you refuse to cooperate with providing them information. You can sue them later. The only person one should be talking to is a lawyer!
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#77. To: randge (#64)
Interesting and another good reason for the State Militias to be our Neighborhood Watch officials. They're already authorized by the Constitution to do their security duties. Anyone carrying openly in FL would need a peace officer certification and would have to be in the line of duty in order to avoid a citation and/or arrest, if I'm not mistaken.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#78. To: purplerose (#65)
Since Zimmerman wasn't on-duty, the Neighborhood Watch questions of no carry/concealed carry/open carry are tangential to this case, imo, but still important to consider in that bigger group-picture. What Zimmerman did is more the picture of Janet Napalitano's "See Something, Say Something" spy/vigilante brigade but expanded to "See Something, Say Something, Do Something Else". Good point. You certainly shouldn't have to go to jail for being sensible. A Homeowners Association with a Neighborhood Watch group, though, probably has more financial concerns about liability over concealed carry. I don't know how a lawsuit was able to be filed last year against the community HOA as if they were responsible for Zimmerman's off-duty actions but it was. Agreed on all that. I grew up on firearms and living in Florida it is not unusual for residents to carry them. But this thing you mention about the Neighborhood Watch Training Program not endorsing fire arms for their patrol officers is important to consider and especially in this case.
Like I said in one of my posts, I'm all for open carry. I don't believe in getting permits. If you have to get permission from the State to carry a fire-arm, then you don't have any rights to bear arms.
But again back to the issue on this community watch, this issue about them not endorsing concealed carry is almost a joke. Just like this case is a joke. If I am following some suspect for alleged suspicious activity, and that individual turns on me and jumps on me, on a public sidewalk, I will fend them off as best I can, and if I have the chance, I'll draw out my piece and point it at them and call the cops right away. I will not shoot them because they are not in my home as this took place on a public sidewalk (which means the castle doctrine would not apply to my defense), but I will hold the gun on them until the cops get here. That's how I would have done it. I would probably go to jail charged with assault with a deadly weapon for this but at least I did not kill the individual.
The way I see this is just because you have a gun does not give you the right to abuse your rights. You take responsibility for your actions. And people like Zimmerman are giving gunowners a very bad image.
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"They're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us...they can't get away this time." -- Col. Puller, USMC
#79. To: Jethro Tull (#71) (Edited)
Does that same way of "behavior" apply when that unarmed individual is forced to "cooperate' by threats of M-16's and/or AK-47's pointed in their face by police? Implied waiver means that the suspect behaves in a way that indicates a knowing and voluntary waiver of Miranda rights.
#80. To: purplerose (#79)
What does this have to do w/Zimmerman & Miranda? Wasn't that what we were discussing? Does that same way of "behavior" apply when that unarmed individual is forced to "cooperate' by threats of M-16's and/or AK-47's pointed in their face by police?
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