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Title: (Dallas) Police Deny Excessive Force In Bloody Arrest (black cop, white girl)
Source:
NBC5i.com
URL Source: http://www.nbc5i.com/news/6158812/detail.html
Published: Jan 16, 2006
Author: NBC5
Post Date: 2006-01-16 20:18:09 by BTP Holdings
Keywords: Excessive, (Dallas), Police
Views: 14702
Comments: 855
POSTED: 5:16 pm CST January 16, 2006
DALLAS -- E-mails and pictures circulating the Internet tell the tale of a Dallas woman's bloody run-in with police after a roller-skating outing escalated into an arrest with excessive force, but officers and some witnesses Monday told a different story.
The incident happened early Saturday morning in Deep Ellum after police attempted to speak with Michelle Metzinger, 25, who, according to a police report, was intoxicated and weaving through traffic on roller skates.
Images: The Arrest & Other Slideshows
The pictures that stemmed from the events that followed are dramatic. They show an officer arresting Metzinger. Her face is covered in blood and there is a puddle of blood on the sidewalk.
"Very excessive. Uncalled for, you know. We're talking about a 250-pound guy and a 100-pound girl. It was just over the top," witness "D.C." said. "All I saw were her feet in the air and disappearing behind a cop car."
However, Dallas police and other witnesses tell a totally different story.
They said Metzinger was drunk and that she not only ignored officers who asked her to stop skating in the street, but also shouted profanities.
According to reports, an officer then tried to arrest Metzinger for public intoxication.
She resisted and attacked the officer, Lt. Rick Watson said.
"The officer attempted to turn her around, at which time the suspect then reached up and grabbed the officer's -- right part of his face -- trying to gouge the officer's eye," Watson said.
Despite the interest that the story has generated online and in the media, Metzinger said she would not comment on the incident until she had consulted with a lawyer.
Metzinger also had not filed a complaint report, so Dallas police were not conducting an internal investigation.
When I worked concert security and someone got bloodied, it was always proper for us to "get our stories straight." Or, as Eddie Murphy said in that movie, "You were lying your asses off." That LT is a lying piece of shit and so is the black cop who LIED in his report.
I'll tell you one thing for certain, this bastard needs to be caught and given a damn hard ball-batting. And then a WHITE magic marker taken to his forehead and the words BAD COP inscribed thereon. What was done was brutal, inexcusable and unjustified.
Police Deny Excessive Force In Bloody Arrest
Dramatic Pictures, Rumors Circulate Online
UPDATED: 6:11 pm CST January 16, 2006
Poster Comment:
Pictures taken by a witness clearly show the cops are LIARS!
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#590. To: Richard (#571)
The allusion to medication was in reference to the fact that your comments seem to be addressed to conversations that are not taking place on this thread. I am supposing that they may be taking place in your head. If you took the medications the doctors gave you, maybe the voices would stop. Richard - any evidence of these rash assertations? Of course not. So why would you make obviously false charges. That does not make sense. Unless you are a lier. That makes sense.
"Our country is now geared to an arms economy bred in an artificially-induced psychosis of war hysteria and an incessant propaganda of fear." -- General Douglas MacArthur
I wish this guy would go into "setup" and click on "content filters" so he can see for himself I have him on BOZO. It's really a shame he is wasting all of those incendiary remarks that I can't see trying to insult me. Little does he know I've been called every name in the book by better than him. He just fits so perfectly the profile of paid shills it is remarkable. No way in hell he is not on a damage control mission for the city or the city's lawyers. Just too persistent over a happenstance search on the web for this moron to be here for so long.
The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt
BELAYED? What the hell? be·lay v. be·layed, be·lay·ing, be·lays v. tr. Nautical. To secure or make fast (a rope, for example) by winding on a cleat or pin. To secure (a mountain climber, for example) at the end of a length of rope. Used in the imperative as an order to stop: Belay that order! Figure it out Richard, to belay.I am tired with conversation with you. Let the chains fit you well. And spare me your incessent clucking and scratching.
"Our country is now geared to an arms economy bred in an artificially-induced psychosis of war hysteria and an incessant propaganda of fear." -- General Douglas MacArthur
Makes sense to me. A young arrogent bot, who doesn't understant the seriousnes of the times in which we live.
"Our country is now geared to an arms economy bred in an artificially-induced psychosis of war hysteria and an incessant propaganda of fear." -- General Douglas MacArthur
I want to say sheep, but that would insult the wool bering critter. ;0)
The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt
The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, So it would seem. I am done with him. unless he has a flat tire.
"Our country is now geared to an arms economy bred in an artificially-induced psychosis of war hysteria and an incessant propaganda of fear." -- General Douglas MacArthur
Time for this thread to die. But it will come back to haunt that statist creep later. ;0)
The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Contrary to the author's claim, the pictures DON'T tell the story... the pictures don't show HOW she ended up on the ground. They don't show the cop DOING anything to her... For all I can tell, she may have fallen down... in fact, the way she's lying on the ground with her legs all willy nilly, SHE LOOKS DRUNK ENOUGH TO HAVE FALLEN DOWN ALL BY HERSELF... Someone afraid of a bigger foe hitting them doesn't sit on the ground challenging them like it seems that she is doing in one pix. The pix fit the profile of a drunken jerk making her own trouble and then yelling foul... Does the video show more? Certainly the witness in the pix whose being told to go (pointed finger photo) is wearing an outfit similar enough to the girl to be assumed to be HER PAL... How reliable is that? I'm holding off judgment till seeing the entire video.
Don't force feed me your views... talk to me so I can hear you...
tee hee... whatta brat you are...
Don't force feed me your views... talk to me so I can hear you...
Keep looking thru the thread. It's very long but there is lots of links to videos and other stories about this. I'll try to find some of them. More statements from witnesses tell more of the story.
The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt
This has been a long thread and it is mostly the same old shit over and over.
The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt
There is no way I'm willing to read 500 comments, especially since so many of them are stupid, personal attacks for one reason or another... My response was based on the initial presentation... I guess it's probably better to just stay away from long threads that I'm unwilling to sift through... LOL... btw, Stepp is significantly worse today... )-;
Don't force feed me your views... talk to me so I can hear you...
Make that 600 comments... oy vey
Don't force feed me your views... talk to me so I can hear you...
Tom, I did not make any false charges. I simply made a supposition. That is what the word "SUPPOSE" should have told you in that statement. As I said, you are extremely uneducated. Nicely done.
BTP, My racist friend, it is clear that you are reading my comments, or you would not go to such lengths to show me that you are not. Sadly, calling you a racist is not an insult, it is simply an appropriate label. I could care less that you have me on a filter. How cowardly of you to put me on a filter and then take potshots. But then again, coming from you it is not surprising.
Tom, In the context of your statement, the word Belay is improperly used. I am not stopped by my comments, they do, however, assist me in stopping you. Perhaps you are just so ignorant that you don't know what the word means even in the face of the definition. I am prepared to accept that eventuality. For a guy who claims to be tired of conversing with me, you sure do go out of your way to do so.
Tom, OOOOH... Do you promise?
Does the video show more? Certainly the witness in the pix whose being told to go (pointed finger photo) is wearing an outfit similar enough to the girl to be assumed to be HER PAL... How reliable is that? Siagiah! Nice to see a voice of reason amongst the lynch mob. You are correct, the photos really don't tell us much. You should be warned, however, that there are many here who will viciously attack you for saying so. I am not one of them. Glad to see your contribution. Good of you to hold off judgement being as how you were not present at the time. Nicely done.
No I did not. And I should know because... I was there.... I mean here. I know what I implied and you should believe it because I said so and I was there. Seriously. I did not imply that I didn't believe you. I said you "claimed" to be there, which you did, which you somehow took as an insult, I guess because I didn't accept your claim as gospel. I called you a fruitcake because you talk like you are the be-all-end-all in witness reporting and expect us to trust you when to us you're nothing but type on a webpage.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. They probably want to wait for the results of the internal investigation before filing any complaint, and interview as many witnesses as possible. I place no significance on the lack of prompt action.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. 'fraid so.... Yes. Mindless lack of respect for other people.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. 74.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. I fixed it.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. That's what I'm guessing at this point.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. Neil, I never claimed to be the "be-all-end-all" witness. I do happen to be the ONLY person on this thread who was actually present at the scene. And yet YOU call me a liar and somehow say that it does not mean that you don't believe me. How odd...
Neil, It is not the lack of prompt action that should surprise you. It is the lack of ANY action that should surprise you. It is clear that you have not done much work in this arena. If they were going to press a civil case they would be sowing the seeds NOW using the initial wave of PR that was generated to stir public interest. Instead this story has slipped off the headlines and disappeared into the ether. Other than on a few websites, it is now a non-story. If her attorney thought they had a chance in hell of making the civil case, they would not have sat back, they would have taken the offensive and handled the story. Being as how they did not, and are not, doing that... it is easy to see that they will not be pressing the civil suit very seriously, if at all.
Neil, My only involvement with this case is that I was a witness to what happened. I do not stand to profit in any way regardless of what verdicts may be handed down in this matter. Being as how that I am, other than being a witness, in no way affiliated with any of the parties involved in this matter, why does what I do for a living concern you so much?
There are indeed limits to what information can be gleaned from the photos. But the photos do give a fair amount of information. Some of that information reasonable people can agree on. I feel like I've just stated something extremely obvious, but it seems there's one here that seems to make it his goal in life to be as disagreeable as possible with anyone who doesn't trust him.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. Link? I suppose in your binary way of fruitcake thinking, anyone who doesn't trust what you say completely is calling you a liar. If, in your mind, it isn't possible for someone to simply *not know* whether you're telling the truth or not, and all people must be in one extreme or the other, then fine. Put me down as one who calls you a liar. Because until you've earned my trust I'm sure as hell not going to take your word as gospel.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. Neil, Here is one example of you calling me a liar... see, I have a far better memory than you do.
Neil, Here is ANOTHER example of you calling me a liar. Are you starting to remember yet, dumbass?
Low..... Don't call me that, I'm not your friend. And if you think you have insulted me, try again, you missed. And besides, I've seen more hooter shots working those concerts than you've ever imagined, even if you have been lucky enough to have a wet dream. ROTFLMAO! BTP, I can, and will, call you whatever I please. You are a racist, and make no attempt to deny it. I am not trying to insult you by calling you my racist friend, because you are a racist and you are my friend. No insult implied. I can call you "friend" if I please because I am the one who decides who I call friend. SO, you are indeed my racist friend. OOOH, BTP has seen boobies! WOW, that certainly qualifies him to give expert testimony about the behavior of a police officer in a situation that he did not see, and investigative and medical reports that he has not read. Oh, and I thought you were not reading my posts... ROFLMAO!!! Ooopsies... my racist friend BTP screwed up again....
I suppose in your binary way of fruitcake thinking, anyone who doesn't trust what you say completely is calling you a liar. If, in your mind, it isn't possible for someone to simply *not know* whether you're telling the truth or not, and all people must be in one extreme or the other, then fine. Put me down as one who calls you a liar. Because until you've earned my trust I'm sure as hell not going to take your word as gospel. Neil, I posted two links where you were explicitly calling me a liar. I suppose, according to your incoherent way of thinking, calling someone a liar does not mean that you are actually calling them a liar. In your addled brain, calling someone a liar must somehow equate to meaning "someone who simply does *not know* whether or not that person is telling the truth." I don't care if you take my word as gospel, I never said it was. I simply said what I saw at the scene. I have no intention of "earning" your trust, as trust is an emotion and can not be "earned" in any way, it can only be given.
Neil, Please state for us information about the night in question that YOU believe that Reasonable People can agree on based SOLELY upon the photos. This should be quite humorous...
I stand corrected. Thank you. For the record, here are my statements in context: .... My reasoning, however, was impeccable. (You do still consider yourself neutral witness, right, in seeing a girl you are sick of have a rough run-in with a cop?) I guess I was considering my statements more argumentive than conclusive. I'll now consider them conclusive, if there is no argument. You are a liar.
BTW: I have a better name for the software .... Microsoft Internet Exploder. Let's see... Jesse Ventura and some black dope addict from California come to mind. I will concede that wrestlers don't wear skates and Michelle isn't black, at least not in the first picture.
“Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes...known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few…No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.” – James Madison, Political Observations, 1795
PC correction follows: Let's see... Jesse Ventura and some “Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes...known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few…No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.” – James Madison, Political Observations, 1795
I have neve never seen a witness to what amounts to a summons take such
interest in a case. But then the City of Dallas has millions to lose when this
goes civil. There is more to our friend Richard than he has allowed us to see.
While Richard is out scoring more amphetamine for another long posting day,
I'll kick around some possibilities.
I really don't think it is fair to Richard to put your statments in context as it blows his Whole argument out the window. I believe Richard . . . . . . . . . . . Sorry, where was I? I believe Richard should let his Gerbil out for a while.
“Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes...known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few…No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.” – James Madison, Political Observations, 1795
True you didn't. In fact a few times on this thread
when asked for details of what you saw, eliciting those details from you was
like pulling teeth. One presumes however you were a fount of volunteered
information when you gave your statement to the police (which statement you
could have reiterated for us), but here you have to be asked repeatedly and
you are not forthcoming with details or clarification of whatever you saw or
not. Having compared all the news reports and background with what you
have reported here, you haven't added anything substantive, and in a few
notable instances your eyewitness reporting here even conflicts with what is
alleged to be the police departments' version of events. Does that make
you a liar? No. But it does make you uninformative and questionable as an
eyewitness. Your claims of having been there hold out the possibility to learn
from you what has yet to be discovered. But since you refuse to volunteer all
the details, insisting instead on telling us what to decide (you are spinning)
about the officer, the girl, the town, etc (ie she deserved it, he's a good
cop, the town has too much PI), you leave an inquisitive person no choice but
to ask you, repeatedly. At which point you take offense for being asked to
reveal that which you claim to be the only source on this thread. And yet
you equivocate that as an eyewitness, you can't tell whose blood was on the
pavement even though the girl's bloody face was pressed into the pavement and
she received stitches for facial lacerations (plural) which you concede can
bleed profusely while the officer only had scratches; that you can't tell the
difference between the officer 'simply taking her down' versus the 'officer
losing his balance and falling'; that the girl herself smeared the blood on
her face and yet she was handcuffed from behind; That inspite of her refusing
treatment at the scene as reported by the police you insist she was 'triaged';
but you have yet to say what sequences of movements you saw to explain how the
girl went from standing to being face-down under the officers knee (for
example, other testimony adds that the officer grabbed her hair and yanked her
down - did you see that?). Well, you don't get to have it both ways.
You proclaim ad-nauseum to be the only eyewitness on this thread, but not the
best eyewitness, while witholding details of what your eyes witnessed, yet
taking offense when being asked for corroborating details (you are ostensibly
the only eyewitness here that we can ask, right? - did you not expect to be
asked?) but expecting strangers on the internet to believe your
conclusions about the girl deserving what she got and the officer's
force being measured. Read that again. You expect us to believe your
conclusions , suspending our own judgement. We'd rather form our own
conclusions from as many facts as can be gathered, and not simply endorse your
conclusions in lieu of corroborating facts. However true that may be, none of that is a guarantee
that you have been accurate. None of that is a guarantee that you have been
complete. None of that is a guarantee that you have been unbiased or
impartial. And none of that is a guarantee that you have been honest. You are
an anonymous, unsworn stranger and an insulting one at times (as are the rest
of us). You have no rational reason whatsoever to presume what you post on the
internet will be accepted as impartial factual truth. Any sane person would
anticipate questions. Any honest person would understand the desire of others
to have more facts and less spin. One can be mistaken and honest in their testimony and
not be a liar. To ascertain if there are any mistakes, questions are asked,
details solicited, differences (if any) reconciled, and credibility assessed.
In the process, when the eyewitness (ostensibly you) rather than relating
those details instead conveys conclusions and judgements that are at odds with
other facts in evidence (police reports, photos, testimony of other
eyewitnesses and proclaims prior to any finding of fact or ajudication
that the girl will be convicted, the officer and department exhonerated,
that "eyewitness" has impeached their own impartiality and credibility; that
eyewitness has demonstrated an agenda. Someone whose testimony differs
from other factual accounts and who seems to have an agenda might reasonably
be suspected of lying. Read that again. Reasonably suspected . When,
acting upon those suspicions, in an effort to uncover the truth one is met
with insults instead of clarifying facts, the appearance of lying is
reinforced. In the end, the bulk of your argument has been not a
disclosure of evidence but a disingenuous effort to constrain the discussion
to a hypothetical formed by only the pictures posted. As if there weren't
other news stories and other eyewitness accounts and a video or post-treatment
photos of the girl we may yet get to see, and maybe even forensic DNA testing
of the blood on the street to satisfy you who provided it. If you weren't
spinning, you'd understand the questions and discomfort the rest of us have.
(The Gospel of Jesus Christ is the only true good news)
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/LatestI know you claim to be educated, but the word is GRAMMAR, not grammer. You are right that you are not the best by a long shot, so you got one right! Way to go! You should be happy with that!
#591. To: tom007 (#587)
#592. To: Richard (#589)
elayed by your own comments."
#593. To: BTP Holdings (#591)
No way in hell he is not on a damage control mission for the city or the city's lawyers. Just too persistent over a happenstance search on the web for this moron to be here for so long
#594. To: tom007 (#593)
Makes sense to me. A young arrogent bot, who doesn't understant the seriousnes of the times in which we live.
#595. To: BTP Holdings (#591)
He just fits so perfectly the profile of paid shills it is remarkable. No way in hell he is not on a damage control mission for the city or the city's lawyers. Just too persistent over a happenstance search on the web for this moron to be here for so long.
#596. To: tom007 (#595)
#597. To: Neil McIver (#4)
We should be sure of all the facts. The story claims witnesses said she was aggravating the situation by attacking the cop. Were the witnesses impartial?
#598. To: BTP Holdings (#588)
You heard about the fire at the circus? It was in tents. LOL
#599. To: siagiah (#597)
How reliable is that?
#600. To: siagiah (#598)
tee hee... whatta brat you are...
#601. To: BTP Holdings (#600)
#602. To: All (#601)
#603. To: tom007 (#590)
#604. To: BTP Holdings (#591)
#605. To: tom007 (#592)
Figure it out Richard, to belay.I am tired with conversation with you. Let the chains fit you well. And spare me your incessent clucking and scratching.
#606. To: tom007 (#595)
So it would seem. I am done with him. unless he has a flat tire.
#607. To: siagiah (#597)
Contrary to the author's claim, the pictures DON'T tell the story... the pictures don't show HOW she ended up on the ground. They don't show the cop DOING anything to her... For all I can tell, she may have fallen down... in fact, the way she's lying on the ground with her legs all willy nilly, SHE LOOKS DRUNK ENOUGH TO HAVE FALLEN DOWN ALL BY HERSELF... Someone afraid of a bigger foe hitting them doesn't sit on the ground challenging them like it seems that she is doing in one pix. The pix fit the profile of a drunken jerk making her own trouble and then yelling foul...
#608. To: Richard (#495)
However, you have skirted the edge with implications that you don't belive I was there on more than one occasion.
Or perhaps that was your continuing to call me a liar and a fruitcake your way of saying "Hey, Richard, I believe you were there and I believe that what you are saying is indeed what you saw."
-- George Bonser
#609. To: Richard (#503)
Note that she has YET to file a complaint of ANY sort. Much lest has she tried to press a civil suit.
-- George Bonser
#610. To: BTP Holdings (#505)
Holy shit, Neil, did he really say that? I've got him on BOZO and can't read what he posts.
It is also the main reason we suffer a police state tyranny at present. And Richard is a sad representative of that whole scene.
-- George Bonser
#611. To: Richard (#514)
You were not there.
I was.
-- George Bonser
#612. To: Dakmar (#524)
tom007 broke this thread :)
-- George Bonser
#613. To: BTP Holdings (#561)
And I think I'm right about him being a lawyer.
-- George Bonser
#614. To: Neil McIver (#608)
#615. To: Neil McIver (#609)
#616. To: Neil McIver (#613)
#617. To: siagiah (#597)
-- George Bonser
#618. To: Richard (#614)
And yet YOU call me a liar and somehow say that it does not mean that you don't believe me.
-- George Bonser
#619. To: Neil McIver (#275)
In insisting you are a fair witness here you've proven to me you are a liar, and THAT does taint your testimony more than your bias alone does. Bias + liar = totally discredited testimony.
#620. To: Neil McIver (#284)
I consider you a liar and therefore don't care what you say. I'll believe you only when an honest witness says the same thing.
#621. To: BTP Holdings (#542)
BTP, Well, well, my racist friend.
#622. To: Neil McIver (#618)
Link?
#623. To: Neil McIver (#617)
There are indeed limits to what information can be gleaned from the photos. But the photos do give a fair amount of information. Some of that information reasonable people can agree on.
#624. To: Richard (#620)
Are you starting to remember yet
There's nothing wrong with being biased. It's just when you lie and claim you are not, as you are, THAT'S where there's a problem. When I first asked if you considered yourself a neutral witness, I already knew the answer. My reason for asking was only to find out how honest you are. Turns out you are not honest at all. In insisting you are a fair witness here you've proven to me you are a liar, and THAT does taint your testimony more than your bias alone does. Bias + liar = totally discredited testimony.
If you care, go and read my first comments on this thread. I try to be fair and my first comments should give evidence of that, if not prove it outright. I never claimed to be there or know all the facts. What irritates me is when a fruitcake comes on board who is bias as all get out and yet claims not to be. You ARE biased here and until you admit it, I consider you a liar and therefore don't care what you say. I'll believe you only when an honest witness says the same thing. Because you'd lied here on this thread about your neutrality, your testimony isn't worth crap, and it doesn't even matter if it's 100% accurate.
-- George Bonser
#625. To: Richard, Jethro Tull (#498)
If she tried to take this case to civil court she knows she would lose. We are not talking about a nun fresh from the convent here, she is a rollerderby chick, she makes her money fighting on skates. No jury will believe that she was just a passive victim who got 'da bomb' dropped on her for no reason whatsoever. Especially when they are looking at her convictions for public intoxication and resisting arrest at the scene.
#626. To: All (#625)
Let's see... Jesse Ventura and some black dope addict from California come to mind.
black dope addict motorist (Rodney King) from California come to mind.
#627. To: Hmmmmm (#625)
#628. To: Neil McIver (#624)
I stand corrected. Thank you. For the record, here are my statements in context:
#629. To: Richard, Neil McIver, Jethro Tull, Tom007, Dakmar, Christine, markm0722 (#614)
I never claimed to be the "be-all-end-all" witness.
I do happen to
be the ONLY person on this thread who was actually present at the scene.
And yet YOU call me a
liar and somehow say that it does not mean that you don't believe me.
.
.
.