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Title: Top Cardinal Blasts 'Da Vinci Code' as 'Cheap Lies'
Source:
Netscape News
URL Source: http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/ns/news ... 2&dt=20050315130200&w=RTR&covi
Published: Mar 15, 2005
Author: Reuters
Post Date: 2005-03-15 17:59:13 by Mr Nuke Buzzcut
Keywords: Cardinal, Blasts, Cheap
Views: 7543
Comments: 568
Top Cardinal Blasts 'Da Vinci Code' as 'Cheap Lies' ROME (Reuters) - A top Catholic cardinal has blasted "The Da Vinci Code" as a "gross and absurd" distortion of history and said Catholic bookstores should take the bestseller off their shelves because it is full of "cheap lies." Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, in an interview with the Milan newspaper Il Giornale, became the highest ranking Italian Churchman to speak out against the book, an international blockbuster that has sold millions of copies. "(It) aims to discredit the Church and its history through gross and absurd manipulations," Bertone, the archbishop of the northern Italian city of Genoa and a close friend of Pope John Paul told the paper in its Monday edition. "This seems like a throwback to the old anti-clerical pamphlets of the 1800s," he said. The central claim of the book, written by American Dan Brown, is that Jesus married Mary Magdalene and had children. The Bible says Jesus never married, was crucified and rose from the dead. Bertone's comments were significant because until the Pope named him archbishop of Genoa in 2003 he was for years the number two man at the Vatican's most powerful department - the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. "You can find that book everywhere and the risk is that many people who read it believe that those fairy tales are real," he said. "I think I have the responsibility to clear things up to unmask the cheap lies contained in books like that." HOLY GRAIL A central storyline of the book is that the Holy Grail is not the cup which Christ is said to have used at the Last Supper but really the bloodline descended from Jesus and Mary Magdalene. Bertone calls this idea "a perversion." Bertone is so incensed about the novel that he will be the key speaker at a roundtable in Genoa Wednesday night attempting to dismantle the book, which also accuses the Church of covering up the female role in Christianity. "I will try to clear things up and help form consciences," the cardinal said. "I think that when faced with affirmations that are so shameful and unfounded, readers who have even a minimum of basic (Christian) formation should react," he said. He said it was "sad" that even Catholic bookstores were selling The Da Vinci Code "for purely economic reasons." One bookstore selling "The Da Vinci Code" is the one in the Gemelli Hospital, a Catholic institution where the Pope spent a total of 28 days in two stints in February and March. In the interview, Bertone firmly rejected the book's claim that the feminine role in Christianity had been suppressed. "This is one of the most vulgar of inventions. The feminine element is present in all the Gospels," Bertone said. Bertone also strongly defended Opus Dei, the conservative Church organization that the book depicts as a ruthless, Machiavellian group that resorts even to murder in its attempt to keep the Church's secrets hidden. The novel is going to reach an even wider audience next year with the release of a film based on the book staring Tom Hanks. © Copyright Reuters Ltd. All rights reserved. The information contained In this news report may not be published, broadcast or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of Reuters Ltd. 03/15/2005 13:02 RTR
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#384. To: CAPPSMADNESS (#361)
I heard that! ROTFLMAO....... I think someone is mixed up.....that 'thumpity thump thump' sound goes with Peter Rabbit, or was it the Easter Bunny our friend was lamenting early on in this thread?
The resurrection, oohhh, shall we discuss? That will be fun... The resurrection of Jesus NEVER happened, BTW, it was faked, he FLED the holy land, for his life. The sherriff was after his ass and his families ass to. Best thing to do, pay off the magistrate, fake your death and run like hell. Which is EXACTLY what happened. BTW, the raising of Lazarus, was a mystical exercise, Lazarus was Never really dead, he died of his old life, and was reborn again. Interesting that, huh? He was literally put into a tomb, and then his teacher, his mentor, would come in, wake him up from his death and bring him back into his new life of enlightenment.
Damn, I missed that post, can you point me to it, this thread is getting REALLY long....LOL
Did you know there is no such thing as time? It's all an illusion!
BAC? BAC??! Please say it isn't so!
Cast not your pearls before swine !
He was literally put into a tomb, and then his teacher, his mentor, would come in, wake him up from his death and bring him back into his new life of enlightenment. That's a Skull and Bones ... Secret Society mystical practice that is the satanic practice, Christ's followers were baptized in water. Lazarus was in the tomb, 4 days, wrapped in the death cloth, while at the same time his sister (Mary Magdalene) and others were in mourning at the house. The Scriptures note that his body smelled like one would after being dead for 4 days. Where did Lazarus die ? Where was he buried ?
All human speech, (verbal or written), that does not concern factual physical matters, and that is not mere social lubricant, is about a -- “Search For The Truth.” Men may call their particular activity the study of: History, Anthropology, Psychology, Philosophy, Theology, Sociology, Political Science, The Liberal Arts, etc, but the underlying reality is and has always been the same thing: A search for -- “THE TRUTH.” You do not have to be an academic, or even know how to speel, “philosophy” to be so engaged for every time a man talks about the kinda guy he is, or comments on one football team’s superiority, or denounces some other person’s opinions on any subject, the man is engaged in -- A Search For “The Truth.” Note that I put, “The Truth” in quotation marks, since even though, everybody believes it exists, there is no common agreement as to how it can be objectively recognized. A man telling you about the kinda guy he is, is searching for the TRUTH about what he is via his endless, self-centered palaver, yet there is no pre-established standard set by which he will be able to ultimately recognize the truth about what he is as separate from all that he has said about himself that is not. And men debating the relative merits of different sports teams have no final, impartial model by which to make a conclusive determination of, “The Truth” about which is the better team. And verbal tug-of-battles in all other second reality areas such as: politics, religion, economics, morality, are in the same situation. The cellular activity in men’s brains called, the mind, is in a relentless search for, “The Truth,” but will admit to having no advance notion as to how it is to be correctly recognized -- if found. (The popularity of religions is based on their claims of having such knowledge from extrinsic, suprahuman sources; brain cells pointing their little fingers away from themselves as they insist that the image they just made up ACTUALLY EXISTS! -- “just over there somewhere.”) Those of a more metaphysically wired mind of course, profess it to BE, “Metaphysical,” perhaps being SO removed from everyday life as to be beyond human comprehension, (but fun to think about anyway), but as is always the case, (if not the sixpack), to a clear channel eye -- the matter is not nearly so uncertain -- it’s just a matter of the mind being a creature of a reality of which it was also the creator -- which, pragmatically, results in a situation wherein, (as should be a surprise to no one), an eyeball in a Dali painting cannot, even with its very best efforts, ever see itself in context, or perceive its origin. The Little Mermaid can never recognize Christian Anderson as, “The Truth.” There it is, and there is nothing else to say. The first word said after that is useless, and any after that -- misdirective. But note: even after hearing the truth about, “The Truth,” your mind is probably not instantly Enlightened, and satisfied -- it still wants to argue and debate the issue; pick holes in the sentence; accuse it of gross “materialism,” (Ooooooo! the mystic’s ultimate insult & dismissal!) But there it is and there it remains: The “Truth” is what happens. The instinct mind of the brain knows this full well, always has, ‘s’never been in question; the entire life of your body operates by the principle; it is your hand selecting; your mouth opening; your throat swallowing; your stomach accepting, your bowels boweling so that life in your case – goes on, all based on this simple reality: The truth is what happens. …(and of course if you somehow ate poison -- you died, and that was the “truth” of what happened in that particular instance.) The routine cellular activity that produces thought in our brains is not arranged in such a manner as to act like a mouth that can swallow itself…. ….which is about what it takes to, “Wake up”; ordinary thought cannot take in completely the reality of those five words: ”The truth is what happens” in that it is immediately unable to see that what EVER comment it may have in reaction thereto IS now a part of “what happened” -- that every time your thought denies the truth of the statement, your denial becomes part OF the truth of the statement. Trying to shake your brain’s cellular activity of consciousness into a new mode of operating is truly akin to a mouth attempting to swallow itself, and staying frustrated, and unable to accomplish this is due simply to your failure to recognize how things are in your own neural headquarters. Your heart, lungs and all the rest of your body know that -- “The Truth” is what happens, but the thoughts that normally occupy your mind never will -- they never can. The job of thoughts is to think about what happens in life in ways OTHER THAN it is, for only by so operating is man able to change the natural conditions of this planet to better accommodate his particular needs, and while neural activity is a boon to his physical life, it seems disinclined to do anything beneficial for itself, in the sense of self-scrutiny & revelation, the very stuff of specific interest to those men already being driven by their own neurons urging to, ”Search for The Truth” – (which in truth IS): a search for the truth about thought. …and in this -- you get no natural help from your own thoughts. What a game! -- what a sport, the reality of which, few -- even among, “The Few” -- ever come to realize. The simplicity of it completely confuses the mind; the brain does not produce thoughts for the purpose of dealing with simplicities -- Nay, on the contrary, thought is specifically constructed to work with the physical complexities that are the conditions of life, and to break them down into simpler, mentally manageable pieces, but thought, as now constructed, is not built nor intended for the contemplation of the simple and obvious,and is not programmed to have an interest in how thing ARE, but rather, as they COULD be; not interested in the “Truth” of what happens, but an open-ended, “Truth” that is forever arguable. The “Truth” about things, to a man’s ordinary thinking, is whatever his thinking can momentarily imagine they COULD be, while the truth to superheated thinking is: What ever happens - -- not whatever the thoughts in your brain SAY happened; not whatever they say COULD have happened, and not anything they say SHOULD have happened; this is what makes up "the truth" of ordinary reality, but is not the one perceived by a man who can see-to-the-bottom-of-things; he takes into account only what happens, both -- “out there" (in life), and, ”in here” -- in what is apparently -- him. Nothing that will ever naturally pass through your mind will ever reveal to you, “the truth” about things; only the things themselves can do that -- and they do so -- relentlessly! Life is revealing to you, "the Truth" at every moment, by letting you witness what actually -- happens. It is then up to you whether you see it or not, and recognize that what you see happening is the long sought-for “Truth" -- and that there IS no other. ….simple, huh?! and neater’an the curl in a pig’s tail. Oink! -- galahad -- oink.
I'm not surprised Tom Hanks would be in a movie like this. I sincerely hope this movie flops.
The Bible is a religion? The Gnostic Gospels are a religion?
And here we stand at loggerheads, as Don said earlier. You can't prove that is.. .I can't prove to you that it isn't...
which is why I generally aviod theological arguments: they resolve little and prove even less. But I do have this question for the more theologically inclined here: Do dogs go to heaven? Do living being other than humans go to heaven?
I imagine Mel Gibson won't be among the producers.
Got A Bible?
I think there is one here somewhere. Do you know what page?
I just knew Santa Claus was real since I saw him once at the shopping mall. (Wow, that was a long post and I guess if it saves Santa Claus it was worth it).
Mr. Buzzcut, do you believe there exists a thing called "Love" ... if so prove its existence. Do you love your parents ? Did your mother love you ? Prove the existence of this "thing" called love then.
Are you in a hotel? Should be in that top drawer ... under the phone.
start at page #1 right through to the end. You'll probably find what your looking for if you ignore conventional Christian beliefs and focus on what it really says.
Never is an often misunderstood period of time ... we should "never" say "never" ... I have found that whenever I have poorly chosen this word NEVER to express my determination regarding almost any subject ... never is just around the corner.
You can try it with the Grimm's Fairy Tales too. Works about the same. Morality plays with a supernatural twist.
The Founding Fathers didn't agree with you...
This thread and the longevity of Christ's Gospels are very similar. The harder the Sanhedrin tried to extinguish Jesus ... the more Jesus tended towards expansion ! Long live the debate.
Sorry, wrong on ALL counts, this is NOT a skull and bones mystical satanic exercise. Jesus was a nazarene, and as a nazarene and a mystic, it was one of the exercises that a teacher went through with a student when the student had graduated. You don't know your history very well, but then again, that's not unexpected.
Time is relative change. An abstract illusion of dimension.
Psst! Over here! You gotta know your quarry. With this guy, it's ALWAYS a skull and bones mystical satanic exercise.
The existence of God is a matter of faith, and always will be a matter of faith. Unless God comes down to earth and starts working miracles at some point in the future, which is NOT going to happen, then there will never be any proof positive or negative to the existence of god. The rapture as some Christians call it is NOT going to happen, and Jesus is not coming back to take the Christians to heaven nor start a 1000 year reign. So sorry charlie, but it was made up by selfish men for selfish reasons, the miracles were never miracles and are misunderstood by most people, and of course by most Christians. Christians, as such, take the bible at face value, claiming that it is the word of God, well, sorry, it is the word of man, written down by men, to control other men.
Oh no, say it isin't so! BAAAAWH
Capps asked very politely if we would drop this subject for the time being before permanent hard feelings were created. I agreed to her request. I'm sure the topic will come up again and we'll have the opportunity to jump back in with both feet. But, until then -- be well. :-)
Perhaps you recall this sad news event: Jesus a "No Show" At New Year's Eve Rapture Party, Causing 167 Baptists To Plummet to Their Deaths A police officer and several pastors watch as Mrs. Cartwright dangles from an oak tree, wondering when she will finally fall to the ground. DES MOINES, IOWA (AP) Almost one hundred members of Bringing Integrity To Christian Homemakers and their spouses were killed at a December 31, 1999 "Rapture Bon Voyage" party. All of the women had paid Mrs. Betty Bowers $34,000 to be among the first to be taken to heaven as Jesus' special guest at the stroke of midnight. Party attendee Mr. Tommy Jenkins had reportedly told friends, "Eunice was real excited about scraping enough money together to get to go. It was Becca's college money, but Eunice knew it was End Times so there wasn't going to be no college and Mrs. Bowers always does everything really nice. Eunice wanted to go out with a little flourish." The party was held on the rooftop of the 35 story Landover Hotel & Prayer Convention Facility. Special 40 foot golden staircases had been constructed to start the partygoers on their journey up to heaven. Hourly catering staff dressed as angels were positioned at the top of each staircase to beckon the partygoers on to Heaven at midnight. The exclusive party featured everything from Petrossian caviar to French nonalcoholic "Champagne-like" sparkling beverage for the teetotalling Baptist crowd. "I knew something was amiss," lamented Mrs. Bowers, "when I went to open a case of Clicquot for my millennium party in Maui and realized it was that dreadful faux-champagne I'd ordered for Landover. UPS must have swapped the orders. And the implications of that blunder didn't occur to me until those dear BITCHs were already dead. To be as honest as my Savior, I was simply too busy worrying about how the mix-up would be the figurative death of my party to stop and think how it might lead to the actual death of those poor women who never drink even an unpretentious hock, much less a lovely quality champagne." An obviously homosexual waiter for the event recounted, "I told several of the ladies that I was going to cut them off because they were getting real drunk. But they told me that they never drink and they were just 'drunk in the Spirit.'" He then rolled his eyes and added in that snide, homosexual way of theirs: "Spirits was more like it." According to the waiter, all of the partygoers were horrendous tippers and as it got closer to midnight they started to walk up the golden staircases located all along the periphery of the roof. "They were yelling things like 'I'm coming, Jesus,'" recalled the fey waiter. When the Landover Chapel bell struck twelve, each member of Bringing Integrity To Christian Homemakers grabbed her husband's hand and began racing up the golden staircases. As each got to the last step, they threw themselves off the side of the 470 foot building and into the waiting arms of Jesus. According to eyewitness accounts, however, Jesus, apparently tied up elsewhere, was a "no show" and was regrettably not able to stop them from denting car hoods, flattening expensive shrubbery or staining the sidewalks below. Mrs. June Gordon was the only Bringing Integrity To Christian Homemakers member on the roof not to make the fateful leap. Crying, she told Channel 2: "Wanda June told me that 'If you have faith in Jesus, you will jump and His warrior angels will swoop down to take you to heaven.' I am embarrassed to admit it, but I did not have enough faith so I did not jump. I am so jealous of all them who died because they had the faith to jump. I will now be sent to Hell for not trusting Jesus." The first witness to the gruesome scene on the ground was Mrs. Jerry Johnson. "I was up on the roof when it was decided that we was going to "Jump to Jesus" at midnight. But I was wearing kick-pleats. What a stupid choice for jumping off the top of a building! I realized that they would just fly up and I didn't want to flash my Personal Savior and have Him think I was some kind of trailer-trash slut and just let me fall. So, I went home to put on a long skirt with thicker unmentionables. By the time I drove into the parking lot, I heard Mrs. Tomkin yell, 'Catch me, Jesus!' as she threw herself off the roof. She was the first to hit the sidewalk. It sounded like a big bag of wet flour. You know, that Italian fellow Galileo said that stuff falls towards Hell at the same speed, no matter how heavy, but Wanda Madison, who is kind of plump, bless her heart, hit that Town Car way before Karla Johnson. And they jumped at the same time. Once again, fine Christians have proved the falsity of secular science." Adroitly deflecting questions of culpability in the deaths, Mrs. Bowers, when reached on her lanai in Hawaii, said, "Well, I thought it was going to be the end. But everyone makes mistakes. Even God started over with Noah when He realized He'd botched His first try at populating the Earth. And this Second Coming business is inherently tricky. I mean, even Jesus told his disciples that he would return before they had all died. So, when your own Personal Savior is clueless and makes wildly exaggerated claims, it makes mortal prognostication rather dicey." When asked why Mrs. Bowers wasn't with the women from Bringing Integrity To Christian Homemakers, Mrs. Bowers stated, "I was with them in spirit. But I had to be at the most divine Millennium party in Sydney and then take the Gulfstream up to Maui to celebrate the new century again with 325 close friends at my place there. And when you are hostessing that many people, you really have no business running off and jumping off buildings. I received news of the deaths just as the clock was about to strike midnight in Hawaii. I said the most lovely and heartfelt toast to the people who had died and we decided that each time someone blew a noisemaker, it would be in memory of those dear dead women. It was remarkable how the whole party joined in on the commemoration. Such a noise! It was really rather moving. Indeed, the whole evening turned out wonderfully. My party was fabulous and I would hardly call the Bringing Integrity To Christian Homemaker's Bon Voyage party a failure. I mean, in addition to to-die-for food, all I promised them was that at midnight they would be with Jesus. And, unless there were sins I am unaware of, that is precisely where they are. So, of course, there will be no refunds." Commenting on the tragic deaths, Pastor Deacon Fred told the Landover congregation on Sunday, "All people are precious in God's eyes, but our Gold Level Tithers are particularly precious to us at Landover. And we lost 14 of them. We are asking the rest of the congregation to take a moment from their grieving to make up the difference." Assessments will be mailed Monday.
Now see, you can post stuff like that, and get laughs. If I post it, I'm the freakin anti-Christ and I get bozoed off the map. ;)
Your problem is that you have a good heart and you care too much. Looking for an ambassadorship to Somali?
Why, no! I'm "laying up treasures in heaven." (smirk) You're right, I do care too much. It's just the internet. A "bozo" or two doesn't affect a dime's worth of my paycheck or rob my table of a single morsel of food. :D
*sigh* You understand the Four S's ... shelter, sustenence, sex and stimulation ... the rest is poppycock.
Where is that Bozo Button Rowdee ???
From Betty Bowers?? That's rather like the Onion.. hardly to be taken seriously.
Ok, citizen...be well. Joy, Joy.
Shall we go to Taco Bell for sustenance?
Have you heard the story about the two buzzards sitting on a limb? One buzzard turns to the other one and states, "Patience, Hell. I'm gonna go out and kill something."
Taco Bell, the dining pleasure for all good citizens.
Wait..that's really just three. Unless you meant MENTAL stimulation. :D
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#385. To: rowdee (#382)
#386. To: rowdee (#384)
or was it the Easter Bunny our friend was lamenting early on in this thread?
#387. To: Dakmar (#265)
#388. To: crack monkey, Jhoffa_, FormerLurker (#289)
They're pretty much all cornholers over there too - Trace, BAC and numerous other funny types.
#389. To: Jhoffa_ (#349)
#390. To: Aric2000 (#385)
BTW, the raising of Lazarus, was a mystical exercise, Lazarus was Never really dead, he died of his old life, and was reborn again. Interesting that, huh?
#391. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#374)
#392. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#0)
The novel is going to reach an even wider audience next year with the release of a film based on the book staring Tom Hanks.
#393. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#340)
So... Are you saying that if one religion can wipe out another and destroy all of the writings of the other, that automatically makes the murderous one the truth?
#394. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#339)
And it is. Those of us who read books realize that writers often wrap their fiction around actual historical events. That doesn't magically turn their stories into truth.
#395. To: Continental Op, all (#394)
You can't prove that is.. .I can't prove to you that it isn't...
#396. To: RickyJ (#392)
I'm not surprised Tom Hanks would be in a movie like this. I sincerely hope this movie flops.
#397. To: wbales (#395)
But I do have this question for the more theologically inclined here: Do dogs go to heaven? Do living being other than humans go to heaven?
#398. To: Continental Op (#397)
Got A Bible?
#399. To: 2Trievers (#391)
Nothing that will ever naturally pass through your mind will ever reveal to you, “the truth” about things; only the things themselves can do that -- and they do so -- relentlessly! Life is revealing to you, "the Truth" at every moment, by letting you witness what actually -- happens.
#400. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#366)
IF SUCH A THING AS A god EXISTED. It is a simple matter to prove existence of things that exist. Something as significant as a god would be the easiest of all -- if it existed.
#401. To: wbales (#398)
#402. To: wbales (#398)
#403. To: Aric2000 (#383)
Bit of a quandry there, but neither can disprove the other, and will NEVER be able to.
#404. To: Continental Op (#402)
start at page #1 right through to the end. You'll probably find what your looking for if you ignore conventional Christian beliefs and focus on what it really says.
#405. To: Samuel Gray (#404)
You can try it with the Grimm's Fairy Tales too. Works about the same. Morality plays with a supernatural twist.
#406. To: CAPPSMADNESS (#376)
Don, lets just call a truce - or this thread will never die.
#407. To: noone222 (#390)
#408. To: Diana (#387)
#409. To: Aric2000 (#407)
this is NOT a skull and bones mystical satanic exercise.
#410. To: noone222 (#403)
#411. To: Aric2000 (#410)
The rapture as some Christians call it is NOT going to happen
#412. To: noone222, Continental Op, Don, All (#399)
#413. To: Flintlock (#411)
#414. To: 2Trievers (#413)
#415. To: Samuel Gray (#414)
#416. To: 2Trievers (#415)
Your problem is that you have a good heart and you care too much. Looking for an ambassadorship to Somali?
#417. To: Samuel Gray (#416)
#418. To: Aric2000, Rowdee (#407)
Sorry, wrong on ALL counts, this is NOT a skull and bones mystical satanic exercise.
#419. To: 2Trievers (#413)
#420. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#412)
#421. To: Don (#420)
#422. To: noone222 (#406)
#423. To: Mr Nuke Buzzcut (#421)
#424. To: 2Trievers (#417)
sex and stimulation
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