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Title: Did LaVoy Finicum ever oppose the "tyranny" of the state stealing people's kids? NO, he fed off of it. CPS is EVIL.
Source: .
URL Source: http://libertyfight.com/2016/tyranny-of-foster-parents.html
Published: Feb 13, 2016
Author: .
Post Date: 2016-02-13 13:00:52 by Artisan
Keywords: None
Views: 350
Comments: 22

State CPS Agents Seize Family's Kids With No Due Process, Outraged Armed Father Seizes Children Back From Foster Parents

The facetious headline above is made up, yet not to say unwarranted in our current society. This is to make a point.

Just a few more thoughts on the whole Oregon fiasco. This isn't to demonize Lavoy Finicum or to say he deserved to die for his acts- I think the whole ordeal could have been handled much better and non violently, on both sides. I am going to 'dare' offer a critical analysis of someone who's been martyred and lionized by the 'patriot' community.

"SHOOT ME! SHOOT ME! SHOOT ME!" is what Finicum shouted to cops, according to his friend and witness Shawna Cox... this after he sped towards the roadblock, crashed and jumped out of the vehicle. I don't think this guy is some hero like many do. He acted like a maniac. According to Cox, Ryan Payne, a passenger in Finicum's vehicle, was arguing with him to stop the truck but Finicum refused. The Oregon newspaper which interviewed Cox after Finicum's death reported

"Finicum's determination to push on, though, triggered an argument with Payne. Payne had participated in the 2014 standoff with federal agents in Nevada over Cliven Bundy's disputed grazing privileges. Cox said Payne grew increasingly agitated, urging Finicum to stop.,, Payne told the group the police "mean business" and stepped out of the pickup, shouting at officers that there were women inside. He was soon in police custody, while Finicum yelled at police that he wanted to go see the sheriff, referring to Palmer."

Finicum had emphasized previously that he was not going to prison. Finicum basically committed suicide by cop. I think he used gravely (literally) bad judgment & failed to respect human life- his own- which belongs to God, not just us.

As the Catholic Catechism teaches on The Fifth Commandment, Thou Shalt Not Kill,

Suicide

2280 Everyone is responsible for his life before God who has given it to him. It is God who remains the sovereign Master of life. We are obliged to accept life gratefully and preserve it for his honor and the salvation of our souls. We are stewards, not owners, of the life God has entrusted to us. It is not ours to dispose of.

2281 Suicide contradicts the natural inclination of the human being to preserve and perpetuate his life. It is gravely contrary to the just love of self. It likewise offends love of neighbor because it unjustly breaks the ties of solidarity with family, nation, and other human societies to which we continue to have obligations. Suicide is contrary to love for the living God.

2282 If suicide is committed with the intention of setting an example, especially to the young, it also takes on the gravity of scandal. Voluntary co-operation in suicide is contrary to the moral law. Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.

2283 We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.

Furthermore, the Hammonds, the father & son in prison whom all these protesters were complaining about didn't even support their acts. "Neither Ammon Bundy nor anyone within his group/organization speak for the Hammond Family," the Hammonds' lawyer W. Alan Schroeder wrote to Harney County, Oregon Sheriff David Ward. The whole thing didn't make much sense to me. There were distinct differences between the Oregon case and the Bundy ranch situation in Nevada, Waco and Ruby Ridge, as libertarian icon G. Edward Griffin pointed out in early January. Griffin had correctly warned "If continued on this course, a bloodbath is assured."

One more thing. Finicum admitted in the past that he made his living NOT as a rancher, but as a "foster parent" to dozens of kids over the years. Did he ever mind or oppose the "tyranny" of the state stealing people's kids? Which is at the very least equally egregious, one could even argue infinitely worse than stealing their lands? No, he fed on that government teat like a leaeh welfare recipient enabler. I find that whole so-called "child protective services" system very evil & revolting, & I've seen how they destroy families. I suppose Finicum is lucky he never came across an armed zealot who was righteously pissed that the state stole their kid and gave the kid to Finicum. I'm Not too impressed with all these Mormon cultists.

The tweet below shows all the bullet holes in Finicum's vehicle. This just emphasizes how irresponsible his actions were. All of those people with him could have easily lost their lives.

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#1. To: Artisan (#0)

Furthermore, the Hammonds, the father & son in prison whom all these protesters were complaining about didn't even support their acts.

On this point, I don't think their support is morally required. An injustice against one member of society that goes unchallenged is arguably a harm to all of society. And the Hammonds clearly saw it as an injustice to them, even if they graciously desired no harm to others result from it.

Pinguinite  posted on  2016-02-13   13:26:49 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Pinguinite (#1)

On this point, I don't think their support is morally required. An injustice against one member of society that goes unchallenged is arguably a harm to all of society. And the Hammonds clearly saw it as an injustice to them, even if they graciously desired no harm to others result from it.

that's a good point but I don't think their protest or goals were well thought out. as G Edward griffin points out, occupying a place that is considered federal is quite different than having a standoff defending your own property.

I remember meeting Griffin in 2007 at a ron paul rally in so. calif. and I asked him on video what he thought if the ed and Elaine brown standoff which was going on at that time . he enthusiastically replied "I SALUTE THEM."

They were on their own property, (which coincidentally, was auctioned by the feds a few months back.)

Artisan  posted on  2016-02-13   14:52:32 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Artisan (#4)

that's a good point but I don't think their protest or goals were well thought out. as G Edward griffin points out, occupying a place that is considered federal is quite different than having a standoff defending your own property.

True, but that is a separate issue entirely.

I am also of the sentiment that it was not the right time/place/opportunity for such a stand.

On the other hand, who am I to judge? Hindsight is one thing, foresight another. And the fact that it made national news is arguably an accomplishment.

What would you think if a bunch of guys got armed to fend off a gun confiscation at a particular warehouse. And what if the year was 1776.

Pinguinite  posted on  2016-02-13   15:13:01 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Pinguinite (#5)

On the other hand, who am I to judge? Hindsight is one thing, foresight another. And the fact that it made national news is arguably an accomplishment.

yeah, I don't have a problem with what they did, other than its sad when this guy is lionized for getting killed so needlessly. I believe his life was worth more than that, even if he didn't. I don't think such actions should be viewed as heroic or something to strive for.

these guys didn't hurt anyone, as far as I know, and they seem like pretty good sincere people. but now they are all headed to the federal pen for five years, ironically just like the hammonds who they were complaining about. and what has changed? if anything the feds seem emboldened by this fiasco, imo. the land grabs will go on as usual. and even the elder bundy was arrested on old charges as he headed to OR. up until this point, cliven's situation had been a great victory and an in your face F YOU to the feds. not anymore.

Artisan  posted on  2016-02-13   20:34:53 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Artisan (#6)

but now they are all headed to the federal pen for five years, ironically just like the hammonds who they were complaining about. and what has changed? if anything the feds seem emboldened by this fiasco, imo.

Don't forget LeRoy Schweitzer and the Montana Freemen. Now there is some real history for you. ;)

BTP Holdings  posted on  2016-02-13   20:38:05 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


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