[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register] 

Status: Not Logged In; Sign In

"Gestapo" Müller - Hunting Hitler's Secret Police Chief

How Michelle Obama Could Become Democrats' Nominee after Biden's Terrible Debate, with Steve Bannon

Was This Lethal Spitfire Ace Killed by His Own Tactics?

Welsh Police Pay Home Visit To Man For Displaying Reform UK Political Sign

Liz Harrington Drops a BOMBSHELL on How Georgia Was Stolen

Trudeau govt to make all bathrooms in Parliament buildings GENDER NEUTRAL

French official admits censorship is needed for government to control public opinion

Bill Maher Predicts Trump Victory: The Left Is Aggressively Anti-Common Sense

Google is suppressing Blaze Media. Heres how you can help.

Large-scale prisons being secretly erected in all 50 states will they be used to house illegals or force Americans into concentration camps?

Hezbollah is ready to confront Israels military, with Jon Elmer

Balloons Land in Southern Lebanon, Warning Locals the Land Belongs to Jews

German Politician Hit With Hate Crime Investigation For Demanding Migrant Criminals Be Deported

DNC Caught Funneling Millions to Law Firms Involved in Unprecedented Lawfare Campaign Against Trump

Here Are The 20 Biggest Whoppers Biden Told During His Debate With Trump

NYC to ban cellphones in public schools.

New York Times Columnists Turn On Biden After Disastrous Debate Performance

8 Armed Men With Venezuelan Accents Violently Rob Denver Jewelry Store

Uvalde Police School Chief Indicted, Arrested Over Response To 2022 Shooting

Greetings from the Horse

Tonight confirmed every Democrats worst fear.

Five Women Soon To Die In 1928

How Trump Can Lose The Debate

Tucker Carlson Savagely Dismantles ‘Dumb’ and ‘Stupid’ Far-Left Reporter at Australian Freedom Conference

James Clapper, Mr. October Surprise: How Obama's Intel Czar Rigged 2016 And 2020 Debates Against Trump

Biden Campaign Balks Wont Commit to Drug Test

S-500 Prometheus: Designed To Kill Stealth Jets, ICBMs

The US military chases shiny new things and the ranks suffer

USS Dwight D. Eisenhower Now in the Med, USS Theodore Roosevelt Heads to the Middle East

Lefties losing it: Rita Panahi mocks Democrat judge acting like a ‘confused simpleton’


Activism
See other Activism Articles

Title: Rutgers bars band (PokerFace) after critics object
Source: Home News Tribune Online
URL Source: http://www.thnt.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a ... =/20060222/NEWS01/602220401&Se
Published: Feb 27, 2006
Author: Chris Jordan
Post Date: 2006-02-27 09:09:06 by christine
Keywords: (PokerFace), Rutgers, critics
Views: 6759
Comments: 86

The controversial band Poker Face, labeled by critics as anti-Semitic and racist, will not be performing at this year's state Libertarian Party convention, scheduled for Saturday at the Rutgers University Inn and Conference Center in New Brunswick.

The performance has been canceled because University Inn managers are enforcing the Inn's rule that states no live music will be performed while other events are taking place there, said Ray Caprio, Rutgers University vice president of Continuous Education and Outreach. Caprio acknowledged that a letter critical of the band's appearance was sent to Rutgers president Richard L. McCormick.

Poker Face performed at the same convention in the same venue last year.

Critics of the group said the performance was called off after protesters — chiefly activist Daryle Lamont Jenkins of the Jersey City-based anti-racist One People's Project — voiced concerns about the group's message.

"Just because you have the freedom of speech doesn't mean you have the right to be heard if you're intolerant," said Jenkins, a former New Brunswick resident. "Anti-Semitic people or Nazis always say they have a right to believe what they wish.

"We're talking about people who are trying to deny that right to others."

Poker Face's "songs are about love, life and liberty with powerful and poignant lyrics and a rich sound reminiscent of Boston and Pink Floyd," a Libertarian National Party press release stated.

The forum section on the band's Web site, http://www.pokerface.com, contains articles posted — but not authored — by lead singer Paul Topete. The articles call Martin Luther King Jr. a Communist, speculate on whether Israel had a hand in the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, and provide a list of Jewish CEOs of media companies in the United States and Britain.

Topete said the band is drawing fire for speaking openly about controversial subjects.

"We expose Zionist crimes and if you expose Zionist crimes, you're an anti-Semite," Topete said. "I can expose black crimes, I can expose Hispanic crimes, but if I expose Zionist crimes, people are so Semite-sensitive that you can't expose them, because right away you get labeled an anti-Semite."

Barry Weinstein of New York is a supporter of the band who accompanied Topete to a Home News Tribune interview in New Brunswick yesterday.

"I'm Jewish, and I don't find Paul Topete or the band to be anti-Semitic," Weinstein said. "What I find is an inquiring mind looking to find out what is going on."

Topete, who is strongly anti-illegal immigration, also denied the charges of racism, stating he's part Mexican.

Topete said he plans to address the convention on Saturday about the controversy if his appearance doesn't conflict with a new show the band just booked for that day. Topete declined to say where the new show was to take place.

Tom Howard of Edison, who has been following the band's career, has been outspoken in his criticism.

"The thing about the band is that they're not explicitly white power or blatantly racist, a band like Poker Face tries to hide behind a lot of other things," Howard said. "They try to hide it by putting it in very mainstream packaging but it also sends a very wrong message."

Jeffrey Pawlowski of Sayreville, who ran for governor of New Jersey on the Libertarian Party ticket last year, said he was not aware of the controversy, but said if he found Poker Face to be anti-Semitic or racist, he would confront the band.

"I personally hope it's not true," Pawlowski said. "Their music is inspiring and they played for free."

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

Comments (1-45) not displayed.
      .
      .
      .

#46. To: pokerkid (#37)

Christine, my awakening was even earlier then that. My mom has already read the cutting edge books into the cabal that is ruining this earth. At two, some of the first words out of my mouth were Rockyfella, and Rothychild, and bankers bad, seriously. The rest I gained by traveling all over the world and seeing how the other half lives.

I'm amazed...really. I'll try to call in when you're on John's show next Monday. I'm like G_C though--air shy. ;)

christine  posted on  2006-02-28   19:18:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: Tauzero (#44)

Anarchocapitalism: Just Another Jewish Cult.

ANCAPS are clever in disguising their true nature.

Their loyalty resides with the state.

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   19:20:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: christine (#46)

I'm like G_C though--air shy.

Let's see, BULLSHIT comes to mind. Give'em hell!

“Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes...known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few…No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.” – James Madison, Political Observations, 1795

Hmmmmm  posted on  2006-02-28   19:25:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: Hmmmmm (#48)

do you know how many times i've been in studio with john and bill and haven't said a word? :P

christine  posted on  2006-02-28   19:29:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: Mind_Virus, Tauzero (#47)

How about a little Free Market Anti-Capitalism, Mutualism

And don't miss the blog, http://mutualist.blogspot.com/

The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt

BTP Holdings  posted on  2006-02-28   19:29:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: christine (#49)

But how many times have you said a word?

“Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes...known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few…No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.” – James Madison, Political Observations, 1795

Hmmmmm  posted on  2006-02-28   19:32:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: christine (#49)

do you know how many times i've been in studio with john and bill and haven't said a word? :P

You've been in a studio?

Who the hell are you girl?

I don't care...I'm in love.

I live in California..You single?

;-)

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   19:32:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: Mind_Virus, christine (#52)

You've been in a studio?

Who the hell are you girl?

I don't care...I'm in love.

I live in California..You single?

;-)

My job used to be to keep the freaks away from the stars. ;0)

The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt

BTP Holdings  posted on  2006-02-28   19:35:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: BTP Holdings (#53)

My job used to be to keep the freaks away from the stars. ;0)

LOL!!

I have a feeling Christine can take care of herself.

She knew what she was getting when she invited me to this forum.

Christine is a player.

As i've always said.."HATE THE GAME NOT THE PLAYER."

Christine is a sister in action..I like that. A true patriot.

She's got my backing.

If anyone attacks her on this board..Stand the fuck by...;-)

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   19:49:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: Mind_Virus (#54)

oh, you sweet thing, you. ;)

christine  posted on  2006-02-28   19:51:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: Mind_Virus (#54)

She knew what she was getting when she invited me to this forum.

Yep, and I've got bunches of stories from when I worked that gig.

I'll be pleased to stand on the edge of the mosh pit for a change rather than jumping into the mix. LOL

The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt

BTP Holdings  posted on  2006-02-28   19:55:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: christine (#55)

oh, you sweet thing, you. ;)

Thank ya babes..;-)

I'm a 100% fucking hellraiser.

Then again..You knew that..*grin*.

So what do ya say?

Lets ROCK this place!!

I like to see 5,000 members strong and growing by the minute.

I'll do my part.

You up to it?

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   20:02:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: BTP Holdings (#56)

I want to see activity on this board jump.

I want threads to move and shake.

It doesn't matter if you respond to my postings, as long as the board moves with a purpose.

I arrived at LibertyForum when there were 400 to 500 members.

I like to think that i had some influence on it's success.

Unfortunately for them management didn't move with the times.

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   20:09:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: Mind_Virus (#58)

I arrived at LibertyForum when there were 400 to 500 members.

How long ago was that??

Zipporah  posted on  2006-02-28   20:11:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: Mind_Virus (#57)

I'm a 100% fucking hellraiser.

my fav type!

Lets ROCK this place!!

I like to see 5,000 members strong and growing by the minute.

I'll do my part.

You up to it?

hell, yeah! let's do it!

christine  posted on  2006-02-28   20:17:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: Zipporah (#59)

How long ago was that??

I had 4 to 5 names on LF going back to early 2001.

Free Republic was gaining ground rapidly..Especially after the old Newsmax forum shut down..I believe in 1999 or 2000.

I still believe to this day that RimJob and his CPAC force bought out Newsmax.

The Newsmax forum back in the day was making waves.

Constituionalist & Bassman to name a few members were pro Libertarian and the shit was hitting the fan.

I woke up one day and the forum was gone..Newsmax had sold out.

There's been a forum war ever since.

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   20:26:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: Mind_Virus (#61)

I had 4 to 5 names on LF going back to early 2001.

Free Republic was gaining ground rapidly..Especially after the old Newsmax forum shut down..I believe in 1999 or 2000.

I still believe to this day that RimJob and his CPAC force bought out Newsmax.

The Newsmax forum back in the day was making waves.

Constituionalist & Bassman to name a few members were pro Libertarian and the shit was hitting the fan.

I woke up one day and the forum was gone..Newsmax had sold out.

There's been a forum war ever since.

So LF pretty much peaked about a year ago or before? I joined FR in 98 and also posted on the old MSNBC boards....after they them down I only posted on FR. Then left for LP.. I often wondered what the deal was with JimRob when he would ban people or those that were seen as dissenters. he'd tell them go to LP.. thought that odd..

Zipporah  posted on  2006-02-28   20:31:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#63. To: Zipporah (#62)

So LF pretty much peaked about a year ago or before? I joined FR in 98 and also posted on the old MSNBC boards....after they them down I only posted on FR. Then left for LP.. I often wondered what the deal was with JimRob when he would ban people or those that were seen as dissenters. he'd tell them go to LP.. thought that odd..

Free Republic IMO is a multi-million dollar propaganda machine financed by the jew controlled media / military complex.

RimJob might run the show but the FoxNews execs & Hollywood jew types pump a lot money into it to ensure the masses are kept in line.

I will expound on this later.

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   20:41:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#64. To: christine (#60)

hell, yeah! let's do it!

Can i at least get a hug first?

Mind_Virus  posted on  2006-02-28   20:42:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#65. To: Mind_Virus (#63)

Free Republic IMO is a multi-million dollar propaganda machine financed by the jew controlled media / military complex.

RimJob might run the show but the FoxNews execs & Hollywood jew types pump a lot money into it to ensure the masses are kept in line.

I will expound on this later.

Oh I dont disagree it's a propaganda machine.. but this is the first I've ever heard about Fox News etc.. pumping $$ into it.. I dont get though is how they could possibly collect that much money from posters.. and what could possibly cost him that much money to run FR? Just seems odd..

Zipporah  posted on  2006-02-28   20:43:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#66. To: BTP Holdings (#50)

Mutualism

I like the approach he suggests to rolling back the state and corporatism, but ultimately all forms of anarchism are guilty of the Fatal Conceit, IMO.

And no, he does not successfully resurrect the labor theory of value.

However, what he and the subjectivist economists (among whose number I count myself) generally do not spend much time thinking about -- or, if they have ideas on them, they do not inform their economics -- is religion, culture, ethnicity, and race. Given a sufficient degree of homogeneity along these vectors, something approaching a labor-value theory may prevail in a manner consistent with the more general and correct subjectivist framework.


The one thing Professor Xavier and Magneto always agreed on was that the world should be safe for mutants.

Tauzero  posted on  2006-02-28   22:59:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#67. To: christine, JRadcliffe, Ground_Control, buckeroo, wbales, Elliott Jackalope, Bayonne, Jethro Tull, Zipporah, robin, Eoghan, Dakmar, buffycat. Lady X, Arete, mirage, Tauzero, abbracadabra, angle, aristeides, MUDDOG, Esso, Hmmmmm, bluegrass, Brian S, wacsog (#46)

Looky looky.... OPP U dont know me gang, did another LOVE piece on us today... http://www.onepeoplesproject.com/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=928&Itemid=2

You got to love it that when your friends keep you posted on what is going on behind your back...

Also someone from OPP is monitoring this thread, you can see one of my posts from this thread posted on the accompanying OPP-FORUM thread here: http://www.oppforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=209

I hope that the people going to his site and reading my words, will actually take it upon themselves to look into the facts that I have posted about the hollowcause, they will learn for themselves where the TRUTH lays. I think most of the folks that he thinks support him, will come to know of his American Hating efforts and know him for his deeds.

peace pk

Poker Face - on the front line battle for our freedoms House Band of the 2nd American Revolution we all know is coming because of the treason in DC http://www.pokerface.com

pokerkid  posted on  2006-02-28   23:29:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#68. To: pokerkid (#67)

Who are these people.. I didnt see anything unless I missed it.. about us.. who runs that site etc?? They're going to report you to Kristinn :P

Zipporah  posted on  2006-02-28   23:35:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#69. To: Zipporah (#68)

OPP U dont know me, reposted my entire post #4 at the top of this thread here on his OPP Forum board: http://www.oppforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=209. thats what I was reffering to. peace pk

Poker Face - on the front line battle for our freedoms House Band of the 2nd American Revolution we all know is coming because of the treason in DC http://www.pokerface.com

pokerkid  posted on  2006-03-01   0:00:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#70. To: pokerkid (#67)

jeez...

What a bunch of uneducated infantile losers those twinks are.

They need to be educated in "I may not agree with what you have to say but I shall defend to the death your right to say it."

Censorship can be a pretty cool two-way street. The smear merchants get one guy censored, he puts on his own campaign and silences the opposition - and where does it end?

It would seem that OPP doesn't even want their own rights since they can't figure out this very simple concept.

mirage  posted on  2006-03-01   0:07:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#71. To: Mind_Virus, Christine (#57)

I'll do my part.

You up to it?

He's not kidding!

Ground_Control  posted on  2006-03-01   0:27:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#72. To: JRadcliffe (#40)

I don't even bother with the MSM anymore.

I only listen to the first hr or so in the morning sometimes. Heard some pretty good calls got through a while back, plugging http://nowarforisrael.com and http://whatreallyhappened.com. Other than that, I wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

Ground_Control  posted on  2006-03-01   1:00:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#73. To: mirage (#70)

Censorship can be a pretty cool two-way street.

But so far, its only been one way. Their way. That's why you can print defaming caricatures of Mohammad and call it free speech, or you can piss in a jar, place a crucifix with Christ in it and call it art, but you'd damn well better agree with the Joovision version of their little holyhoax.

Yep...so far, they've gotten their way. They have no reason to believe that it will be any different.

In speaking of the Truth, Henry David Thoreau once said: "Any Truth is better than make-believe ... rather than love, than money, than fame, give me Truth."

JRadcliffe  posted on  2006-03-01   1:17:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#74. To: pokerkid (#69)

I'd be curious to find out your opinion of The Birdman.


The one thing Professor Xavier and Magneto always agreed on was that the world should be safe for mutants.

Tauzero  posted on  2006-03-01   1:44:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#75. To: mirage (#70)

It would seem that OPP doesn't even want their own rights since they can't figure out this very simple concept.

Principles 4 and 116.


The one thing Professor Xavier and Magneto always agreed on was that the world should be safe for mutants.

Tauzero  posted on  2006-03-01   1:50:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#76. To: Mind_Virus (#64)

Can i at least get a hug first?

come back here and get it!

christine  posted on  2006-03-01   9:54:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#77. To: Tauzero (#75)

What I like about the birdman is that he pushes the envelope of what free speach is. Free Speach isnt PC speach which our machiavellian overlords are trying to shove down our countries throat. Like him or not, he has the right to say what he wants. And it will piss off some people. He does expose many of the zionazi crimes, and many of our special interest groups double standards. Other then that, I really dont know the man and cant speak for him.

Ill flip the question back to you, why the interest in birdman, a hero of yours? someone you hate? pk

Poker Face - on the front line battle for our freedoms House Band of the 2nd American Revolution we all know is coming because of the treason in DC http://www.pokerface.com

pokerkid  posted on  2006-03-01   11:25:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#78. To: All (#77)

This is from the link you posted previously about what Birdman posted on his front page about what he thinks:

A Few of the Birdman's Many Quotations on Free Speech and Truth

* Free speech is offensive speech. * Truth hurts -- especially if it's funny. * The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely, but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used against them -- except force. * A good writer should be both insightful and inciteful. * The best ideas are those alive with manly vigor, which rape each virgin mind and fill it with the seed of unborn thoughts. * You will know you have spoken the truth when you are angrily denounced; and you will know you have spoken both truly and well when you are visited by the police. * Things are interesting to the extent that they arouse controversy; and things which are the most interesting are those which are cursed and consigned to Hell. * Free speech is an act of desperation. It is a last resort, an onslaught of quiet fury, and -- in most cases -- an insult to, and abandonment of, vital social norms. Men who murder have usually lost their inhibitions only for a moment; but men who speak freely have lost them forever, and are thus as dangerous to a society as a mad dog. * To be taken seriously, you must first offend. If you do not, people will say, "Oh, he's just like so-and-so, with perhaps a touch of such-and-such", and forget about you entirely; while if you touch a raw nerve, you at least know that you are on the pathway to the brain. The point is, men will rarely think new thoughts without a jolt, and if you expect them to think the ones you have, then you must first crash your way into their consciousness. * Truth has no manners. It is no respecter of persons. It wounds kings as deeply as commoners. It cuts down the high, and confirms the lowness of the low. It may dress up for formal occasions, but it does so only in order that it may more shockingly expose itself in front of the assembled company. And just as it respects no one, likewise there are few who respect it. But those who do are granted many favors -- power, understanding, dominion, and of course the honor of the unswerving hatred of the ignorant millions. * What I say may seem outrageous and outre, but my purpose is to push the envelope of discourse to its outer limits on the theory that freedom of speech, like both mind and body, requires vigorous exercise to remain healthy. Beyond this, the act of pushing the free speech envelope will embolden others to speak, and their acts of boldness reinforce the perception that free speech is tolerated, thereby increasing the probability that it will be. But as I embolden others to speak, so I embolden them to act; and in this way I help insure that free speech is more than a sounding gong or a tinkling symbol. Put another way, I hope to make the world safe for bigotry, ie, safe for the opinions to which -- in Ambrose Bierce's words -- others are intractably and vociferously opposed. But if I advocate free speech, I also advocate and impose upon myself the harshest and most demanding discipline on speech: I acknowledge my critics and call attention to their criticism, and I always respond seriously to any serious criticism they may offer. What this means is that I accept and impose the discipline of truth: If someone is right in their criticism, I have an obligation to acknowledge the error -- publicly if possible; and with as stringent a discipline as this, I am forced to be careful in what I say. For all its stringency, however, this discipline offers some very distinct advantages: It ultimately disarms my critics -- not infrequently turning them into friends -- and continually reinforces my reputation among both friends and foes as one who is as intolerant of error in himself as he is intolerant of it in others, and as morally incorruptible as any man who walks the earth. By this means, then, I retain as enemies only the evil and the stupid; and these are those who would be my enemies no matter what. Thus my fights are few, easy and usually small, while my victories are often grand; and in the process I accomplish one of the most desired goals of any man anywhere -- I can sleep at night.

Poker Face - on the front line battle for our freedoms House Band of the 2nd American Revolution we all know is coming because of the treason in DC http://www.pokerface.com

pokerkid  posted on  2006-03-01   11:33:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#79. To: JRadcliffe (#73)

Yep...so far, they've gotten their way. They have no reason to believe that it will be any different.

You mean they have no reason *yet* to believe that it will be any different - and only because the "rules" they wish to lay down simply haven't been applied to them yet.

Eventually, they too will be silenced be an opportunist. Its just a matter of time; we've seen this before....a few hundred years ago....history has a tendency to rhyme if not simply outright repeat.

mirage  posted on  2006-03-01   11:38:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#80. To: pokerkid (#77)

The Birdman's very smart, and I agree with him on a lot. He's clued-in on blacks and Jews, but doesn't hate 'em.


The one thing Professor Xavier and Magneto always agreed on was that the world should be safe for mutants.

Tauzero  posted on  2006-03-01   11:48:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#81. To: pokerkid (#69)

Thanks!

Zipporah  posted on  2006-03-01   11:58:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#82. To: Tauzero, Dakmar (#66)

ultimately all forms of anarchism are guilty of the Fatal Conceit

I'm really not familiar with this, and I don't lump mutualism in with other forms of anarchy. The anarchy stems from the complete lack of government except where it is duly authorized. Indeed, Patrick Henry and the anti-Federalists saw the dangers of which were designed into the U.S. Constitution. If not for the mischief of Congress we would not suffer as slaves to the money power.

Dakmar looked at the info about mutalism once and described it as a sort of Jeffersonian Goldwaterism.

The least interference by government in our private affairs the better for all is what I say.

The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt

BTP Holdings  posted on  2006-03-01   21:34:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#83. To: BTP Holdings (#82)

Fatal Conceit

Hayek reference -- he wrote a book of the same name. It's a criticism he directed primarily against those waging rationalist deconstructive war on traditional society, its forms and institutions, but is applicable to other rationalist traditions (including Objectivism, anarchocapitalism, and more garden-variety libertarianism, in particular its non-aggression supposition.) Mutualism.org has a similar tenor, IMO.


John 7:13

Tauzero  posted on  2006-03-01   22:53:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#84. To: Tauzero (#83)

in particular its non-aggression supposition.) http://Mutualism.org has a similar tenor, IMO.

From wht I've seen on that site it seems as though it is the absense of excessive coercion from government (of which we have waaaaay too much of presently) which is part of what they hope to achieve. And that is achieved by building new structures within the existing corrupt structures so that eventually the new, less coercive (and more cooperative) structures can take their place. It also seems as though this fits in with the limited government ideal of the Founders.

It has possibilities and we should at least be open to it working in some context, though in a purist sense it might have some troubles. If you were to do some checking you would find that Europe has had a large increase in producers cooperatives and other local organizations which tend to remove things from the central control which gives our current corrupted system its tyrannical flavor.

The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt

BTP Holdings  posted on  2006-03-01   23:32:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#85. To: BTP Holdings (#84)

It has possibilities and we should at least be open to it working in some context

Absolutely. The strategy is attractive, and also the society he envisions, with many or most working for themselves rather than as serfs of a corporation or of the state (which is just a corporation with guns.)

(Side puzzle: Why do leftists, who hate guns and corporations, love the state? Makes no sense at all.)


John 7:13

Tauzero  posted on  2006-03-02   0:51:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#86. To: Tauzero (#85)

(Side puzzle: Why do leftists, who hate guns and corporations, love the state? Makes no sense at all.)

Not such a great puzzle, they are commies first and foremost. They love the elitists such as Hillary but think there should be this utopia implemented by the nanny state. It is really quite Fabian of them.

The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or any controlling private power. Franklin Delano Roosevelt

BTP Holdings  posted on  2006-03-02   1:30:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest


[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register]