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Title: Congressional Critics Dream of Confiscating Trump's Military Powers
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://nationalinterest.org/feature ... iscating-trumps-military-23019
Published: Nov 3, 2017
Author: Curt Mills
Post Date: 2017-11-03 07:20:28 by Ada
Keywords: None
Views: 2190
Comments: 69

Sen. Chris Murphy is leading the charge to prevent a first strike on North Korea, while others are renewing the call for a fresh charter on Trump’s ability to conduct war in the Middle East.

Sen. Chris Murphy and allies appeared in front of the Capitol on Thursday to push legislation that would hamstring President Donald Trump’s ability to unilaterally first-strike North Korea without Congressional authorization. Appearing with Murphy were a gathering of anti-war protestors, including Code Pink activists, and colleagues Sen. Ed Markey, the war hero Sen. Tammy Duckworth, and Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee, a star of Trump-era politics, among others. Co-sponsoring the Senate bill with Murphy is Sen. Cory Booker; both Murphy and Booker are widely believed to have future designs on the White House-- and Sen. Bernie Sanders is on the bill, as well.

The legislation “will make it very clear that, absent an attack or an imminent threat, the president has to come to Congress for prior authorization” to launch a strike on the Kim regime, Murphy told reporters on a call earlier this week. “I think that if we were able to get this very simple resolution on the floor of the Senate, it would pass. … I worry that the president’s enthusiasm will not be checked by the advisors around him.”

Matthew Bunn at Harvard tells me: “Basically, there are no formal procedures to prevent the President from using nuclear weapons. In principle, he has sole power to order a nuclear attack,” but notes: “There are, however, a number of human beings in the command chain who would have to implement such an order.”

An advisor to the U.S. Navy says: “The secretary of Defense has to concur for a launch to happen but can’t outright veto it. So, the president can fire the secretary in the case of nonconcurrence and keep firing people until an acting secretary concurs.” Secretary of Defense Sebastian Gorka, anyone?

An advisor to the U.S. Army tells me such a situation -- a Pentagon Saturday night massacre -- would be “unprecedented.”

But Thomas J. Brynne, president of the Korea Society, isn’t that worried, recent presidential bluster aside. “The Democratic Senators and Congressmen seem to be in line with Secretary James Mattis and the South Korean Defense Minister, Song Young-Moo,” based on language the two issued last week in Seoul that was “clearly defensive, deterrent and diplomatic,” Brynne told me, writing en route to Beijing.

“I don’t think it’s likely,” Anthony Ruggiero of the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies, a think tank well-connected with the administration, says of a U.S. first strike. Ruggiero tells me: “I think that would be a hard argument to make, including South Korea, whose made it very clear any preemptive or preventive military strike would have to be done with their approval.”

Byrne and others see politics at play. “It seems to me the Democratic lawmakers are political posturing,” Byrnne tells me.

“Will never pass. Pointless. It’s showboat politics,” a senior fellow at a national security think tank remarks to me. An aide to a prominent Democratic senator singles out Cory Booker’s involvement: “Most things Booker gets on are automatically not serious.” Says the U.S. Navy advisor: “I’m still convinced this stuff is posturing on both sides. Trump is echoing Nixon’s madman theory.”

But others are worried. “I think there is broad concern about the danger of war,” says Harvard’s Bunn. “President Trump’s warlike rhetoric, undermining of diplomatic approaches -- ‘[Secretary of State Rex] Tillerson is ‘wasting his time’ -- and general unpredictability have got people rattled. I’ve had people in California call me and ask if they should get their family out of the city.”

Harry Kazianis of the Center for the National Interest isn’t attempting to read the president’s mind, but points out the folly of any hypothetical first strike. “Pentagon sources I have spoken to have been clear--we don't know where all of North Korea's nuclear weapons and missiles are,” Kazianis tells me. “If we were to launch even the most devastating military strike, the chances are high we would have left at least a few nuclear weapons behind.”

And Kim Jong Un would have every incentive to use them for revenge: Seoul, Tokyo, Guam, Los Angeles.

But FDD’S Ruggiero thinks Murphy’s legislation could compromise U.S. national security interests. Ruggiero hones in on the legislation’s language -- prohibiting a strike “absent an imminent threat to the United States.”

“That does not cover our allies,” Ruggiero says. “So, if there was an imminent threat to South Korea or Japan. Under this authority, would the president have to get congressional approval?”

Could this even pass? Murphy says if this can get a floor vote in Mitch McConnell’s chamber, it would even get some Republican support to push it over the top. Sens. Jeff Flake and Bob Corker, the foreign relations chair, have openly called into question the president’s fitness in recent weeks. Requests for comment into their offices went unanswered.

But universal Democratic support isn’t assured, either, despite the president’s pariah status on the left. “It would set a dangerous president if this was passed,” an aide to one of the most hawkish Democratic senators tells me, noting the member is undecided, but that lawmaker “has always been on the side that president shouldn’t be handicapped when it comes to military force.”

There are other efforts underway to curtail the military authority of the president, as well. Markey and Rep. Ted Lieu have legislation that would prohibit the president from using nuclear weapons unless it was authorized by Congress, or if a nuclear attack on the United States or its allies was actually underway. Says Bunn: “Most Presidents would argue that this is contrary to their power as Commander in Chief. Like the North Korea legislation, this is not likely to become law in the current environment – though there’s a strong case to be made that it’s the right direction to go.”

And on Monday night, Mattis and Tillerson appeared before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee to defend the existing Authorizations for Use of Military Force (AUMF), in effect the president’s charter for continued war against extremism in the Middle East. Tillerson noted that while they would welcome a renewed statement of support for their efforts, it is not necessary, and that a new AUMF that curtailed their autonomy would be potentially calamitous.

But the status quo is not going to cut it for Democrats and even some in the president’s own party who view him as reckless, to put it mildly. And Murphy doesn’t trust Tillerson, oft-hailed by the president’s critics as “one of the adults in the room.”

Murphy told me earlier this year that the former Exxon chief seeks to “neuter” his own department. “I think he took this job knowing that he was going to oversee the dramatic weakening of this department … he's been fairly enthusiastic in that endeavor.”

Critics of the president are clearly disturbed by many of the messages coming out of this White House. But absent a Democratic takeover of Congress in 2018, are their efforts to assert greater authority anything more than political statements-- or auditions to take on Trump in 2020?

Curt Mills is a foreign-affairs reporter at the National Interest. Follow him on Twitter: @CurtMills.

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#1. To: Ada (#0)

Byrne and others see politics at play. “It seems to me the Democratic lawmakers are political posturing,” Byrnne tells me.

There it is. It's all about sending the "subtle message" that Trump and his supporters are war-mongering lunatics that want to set the world on fire so they can bar-b-que and eat your babies,not like us. You can trust US!"

Mostly to surrender after a 1st strike by the NK's.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-03   8:10:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: sneakypete (#1)

Mostly to surrender after a 1st strike by the NK's.

Any first strike by NK would be a false flag.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-03   9:29:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Ada (#2)

Any first strike by NK would be a false flag.

ROFLMAO!

Would you care to explain that to the relatives of the people killed,and more importantly,do you think such a strike should just be ignored because NK was nuking us at someone else's suggestion?

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-03   9:46:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Ada (#2)

Any first strike by NK would be a false flag.

next false flag?

Beware of Kim Rocketman Trump and the Dew weapon

www.youtube.com/watch? v=9FcLab3PRSw

[Dew = DEW = Directed Energy Weapon]

"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2017-11-04   6:52:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#4) (Edited)

I've considered the definite possibility of a nuke being set off in the U.S. and the numerous and varied directions the finger pointing would take.

The population would never be able to ascertain the truth of the nuke's origin.

Welcome to the Twilight Zone !

In America, Allah Akbar when shouted means "shoot me now" !

noone222  posted on  2017-11-04   7:11:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#4) (Edited)

Any first strike by NK would be a false flag. next false flag?

Beware of Kim Rocketman Trump and the Dew weapon

If AF1 is downed during Trump's upcoming visit to Asia, don't believe the assertion that NK did it.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-04   7:54:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: noone222 (#5)

I've considered the definite possibility of a nuke being set off in the U.S. and the numerous and varied directions the finger pointing would take

Now that you mention, that may be part of the "continuity of government" plan....perhaps in a place like Denver:

DEATH OF THE PHOENIX - FINAL ACT FOR THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

"...A preview of the terrors that have been planned for the U.S. is featured in a shocking video game that was released in October of 2005 and is being marketed to teenagers. The purpose of the game is to give young Americans experience in strategic combat against other regions of their own country which have seceded from the Union and divided into seven nation-states, including Washington, D.C. and surrounding states which are occupied by a European Union peacekeeping force.

“Shattered Union begins with a premise that hits way too close to home for Americans in these troubled times. A disputed Presidential election and a spate of domestic terrorism incidents push the United States into increased sectarian squabbling. When an atomic bomb detonates in Washington D.C., eliminating the entire Presidential line of succession, the U.S. breaks up into six squabbling nation states. The secession starts with California and Texas declaring their independence, followed quickly by the northwest states of Pacifica, the Great Plains, the New Confederacy, and the New England Alliance. The European Union, desperate to restore order to avoid the worldwide repercussions of a second Civil War, invades the area around Washington D.C. as an occupying army, effectively forms a seventh power on the continent. Each one is attempting to re-unite the United States and cast the new America in its own image…

“Following a great increase in terrorism, internal strife and, ultimately, the nuclear destruction of Washington, D.C., the United States shatters into a half dozen nation-states that descend into war…” (See the trailers: “Shattered Union: United We Stood”)

To justify the destruction of the USA, the Zionists must now portray America as “Babylon the Great” collapsing under the wrath of God, per Revelation 18. Surely, “Ichabod,” which means “the glory has departed,” could apply the United States in its degenerate condition today, yet the propagandists never mention that the Jewish-owned and controlled entertainment media has led the United States down the broad road to moral destruction.

Moreover, the Zionist cabal must incite the people of the world against Americans so that when their beloved country falls, the world will rejoice, never suspecting the truth. Which is why the ubiquitous propaganda mills on the Internet continuously revile the USA as “Babylon” and even gloat over its imminent demise. In 1921, Henry Ford exposed this shell game in his powerful expose, The International Jew:

“It is a most important consideration that most of the national animosities that exist today arose out of resentment against what Jewish money power did under the camouflage of national names.

“‘The British did this,’ ‘The Germans did this,’ when it was the International Jew who did it, the nations being but the marked spaces on his checker board. Today, around the world the blaming word is heard, ‘The United States did this. If it were not for the United States the world would be in a better shape. The Americans are a sordid, greedy, cruel people.’

“Why? Because the Jewish money power is centered here and is making money out of both our immunity and Europe’s distress, playing one against the other; and because so many so-called ‘American business men’ abroad today are not Americans at all - they are Jews.

“Citizens wake up with a start to find that even the white nations are hardly allowed to see each other nowadays except through Jewish eyes. Great Britain and France seldom see a special American spokesman who is not a Jew. That may be the reason why they reciprocate by sending Jews to us, thinking perhaps that we prefer them.” (The International Jew : Chapter 1)

This strategy has succeeded to the point that International Jewry now controls the governments of the world. By “International Jewry” is meant the high cabal of Jews who designate themselves the Learned Elders of Sion or, alternatively, the Priory of Zion or Prieuré de Sion. Under the direction of this high cabal of International Jewry is a global network of Masonic societies. The term “Judeo-Freemasonry” describes this network of secret societies more accurately than “Freemasonry” because it conveys the reality that these fraternities, the majority of which are comprised of Gentiles, are under the covert government of B’nai B’rith, which is under the direction of the Learned Elders of Sion of the 33º. [See: The Synarchy: "Judeo-Christian" Theocracy Fronts for International Banking Cartel]

Rabbi Isaac Mayer Wise, a pioneer of Reform Judaism in America, stated in 1855: “Freemasonry is a Jewish establishment, whose history, grades, official appointments, passwords, and explanations are Jewish from beginning to end.” (See: Heeding Bible Prophecy: New Israel)

The Jewish Tribune stated in 1927, “Freemasonry is based on Judaism. Eliminate the teachings of Judaism from the Masonic ritual and what is left?”

The agenda of International Jewry, called “Zionism,” is the reestablishment of the Kingdom of Greater Israel to rule over the Gentile world. “Zionists” are agents of the high cabal who promote the agenda of the Elders of Sion, which also includes the destruction of Christianity in all of its forms. The terms “International Jewry” and “Zionist” do not apply to all Jews, but to those Jews who have rejected the God of Israel and, through deception and intrigue, are carrying out the directives of their god, Lucifer. [See: Mystery Babylon the Great: Catholic or Jewish?] ..."

watch.pairsite.com/death- http://phoenix.html">watch.pairsite.com/death-phoenix.html

Not to mention:

Denver International Airport Murals

"...AC: You bet. All of them are doing the bidding, and it goes back to their secret societies and the establishment of the New World Order, which all leads back to the house of Windsor. There has been in this country for a long time a grooming process whereby people carry on the bidding of the Crown of England*. That is one of the things the system involving the Rhodes Scholars was set up to achieve. Cecil Rhodes set it up to groom people for this task, to carry the United States into the New World Order. It appears, from what I have been able to find out, that the Crown of England has had this very skillfully planned for hundreds of years, and it could be possible that they have been privy to information that not many of us have been for a long long time about the chaos involving Earth changes that is coming. It is my understanding that England is not going to make it through the changes, so they set up a whole new Empire over here. That goes back to some of the things we discussed before, about lands being bought up in Colorado.

(In fact it's said the Queen is buying up an incredible amount of land here, and America has been bankrupted in a plot (this article is endless, if you want to read it. You probably don't) by the British Crown. Which is why in the last few years, rich, influential American citizens have been Knighted; Ex- President George Bush, General Colin Powell, General Norman Schwarzkopf, ex- President Ronald Reagan, James Wolfensohn (President of the World Bank) and Alan Greenspan in September, 2002 (Chairman of the U.S. Federal Reserve Board). Some think they were knighted for being good little soldiers with their services to the British Crown and the agendas for a One World Government by the elite. But I digress...)

DA: We talked about the Denver airport last night and what is really going on down there. The area is of a pretty high altitude, where it will be safe. (Denver is known as the Mile High City and is strategically protected by the Rocky Mountains/Continental Divide. The view there is breathtaking.)

AC: Yes. Plus, all the symbolism that is apparent in the layout of the new Denver airport says that it is a control center for world control. There is a lot of "secret society" symbology at the airport. We started researching all of this to find out what it all means. It's all very scary. A gentleman by the name of Al Bielek, who has been involved in some very unusual government projects in the past, told me that the Denver area is where the establishment of the Western sector of the New World Order will be in the United States. Little bits and pieces keep coming to me, confirming things I have not had confirmed before. ...."

www.anomalies- http://unlimited.com/Denver_Airport.html

British-Israelism www.seekgod.ca/identity.htm

The British want a one-world rule with them ruling on the "Throne of David" [The one Christ is ruling on right now from the Heavenlies].

The Zionists want a one-world rule with them ruling from Jerusalem [or, secretly, from the USA as Ben Gurion’s Ultimate"One True Zion": www.samliquidation.com/nassi_3. htm - by the late Joe Vialls - I think he was right on target with this.]

"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2017-11-04   10:40:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Ada (#6) (Edited)

If AF1 is downed during Trump's upcoming visit to Asia, don't believe the assertion that NK did it.

If it comes out of the Fakestream Mouthpiece, it is always immediately suspect as far as I am concerned.

When an atomic bomb detonates in Washington D.C., eliminating the entire Presidential line of succession,

It looks like they want him dead too.

"...as long as there..remain active enemies of the Christian church, we may hope to become Master of the World...the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown - B'nai B'rith speech http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm / http://bible.cc/psalms/83-4.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2017-11-04   10:42:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#7)

There definitely is a disproportionate participation by so-called Jews, but I continue to believe that the situation we find ourselves confronted with is made up of descendants of Babylon. I personally think that some of these descendants are what we call Jews, some are associated with Rome (Vatican) and others the "City" of London, which extends to Washington D.C. and New York.

It's hard for me to determine that it's just one group when in truth I think it's all of them.

In America, Allah Akbar when shouted means "shoot me now" !

noone222  posted on  2017-11-04   11:45:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#8) (Edited)

and surrounding states which are occupied by a European Union peacekeeping force.

and surrounding states which are occupied by a European Union United Nations peacekeeping force.

And always remember the IMF headquarters is located in Washington, D.C. It was formed by John Maynard Keynes and Harry Dexter White.

White, of course, was the Communist who slept in the White House across the hall from FDR. ;)

en.wikipedia.or g/wiki/International_Monetary_Fund

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2017-11-04   12:54:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: sneakypete (#3)

Would you care to explain that to the relatives of the people killed,and more importantly,do you think such a strike should just be ignored because NK was nuking us at someone else's suggestion?

Sure. The relatives should blame the guilty parties which wouldn't be NK. Whatever you may think of them, they are not stupid and know that any first strike would result in a retaliation that would vaporize their country.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-04   13:37:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Ada (#11)

Whatever you may think of them, they are not stupid and know that any first strike would result in a retaliation that would vaporize their country.

This is true, Kim is not stupid and he is well aware that his brother was offed in Singapore,

Also be aware that Putin has warned the U.S. "Hands off North Korea." Both China and Russia are now massing troops near their borders with North Korea. ;)

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2017-11-04   15:16:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Ada (#11)

Sure. The relatives should blame the guilty parties which wouldn't be NK. Whatever you may think of them, they are not stupid and know that any first strike would result in a retaliation that would vaporize their country.

What YOU don't seem to understand is there there IS no "them'. There is only a "HIM","Maximum Leader Fat Boy Kim",and he is barking at the moon nuts.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-04   16:19:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: BTP Holdings (#12)

This is true, Kim is not stupid

True,but he IS crazy as a rabid rat.

and he is well aware that his brother was offed in Singapore,

Of course he is,WTF do you think ordered him killed?

Both China and Russia are now massing troops near their borders with North Korea. ;)

Russia isn't going to do anything,but China just might be waiting for the coup to depose and execute Kim,and have troops standing by to move into NK and establish order. If I had to guess,my guess would be it is China that is working behind the scenes to have that madman overthrown.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-04   16:22:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: sneakypete (#14)

Of course he is, WTF do you think ordered him killed?

Kim had his own brother offed? It must have been an egregious thing. You think may be was plotting to overthrow his own brother? ;)

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2017-11-04   21:08:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: sneakypete (#14) (Edited)

If I had to guess,my guess would be it is China that is working behind the scenes to have that madman overthrown.

China has told Kim repeatedly to stop the nuclear testing. And has he? No. So that puts him at odds with the Chinkernese.

And we all know what that means. Every time they want Kim to start something and raise the heat on the peninsula, they would yank his chain to get him going. ;)

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2017-11-04   21:11:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: sneakypete (#14)

True,but he IS crazy as a rabid rat.

You know this how? The MSM tell you?

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   9:29:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: sneakypete (#13)

What YOU don't seem to understand is there there IS no "them'. There is only a "HIM","Maximum Leader Fat Boy Kim",and he is barking at the moon nuts.

You've been drinking the Kool Aid again.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   9:30:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: sneakypete, Ada (#13)

Have either of you seen a night time satellite image of the Korean peninsula?

It is a strange sight to see. South Korea shows large areas illuminated by electricity, while the North is dark all over except for a small spot around Pyongyang. Electricity in North Korea is rationed and only on for a few hours every day. We will be in deep doo doo if Kim does something crazy with his nukes and puts the rest of us back into the stone age. An EMP would do this. And none of us wants to freeze in the dark. ;)

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2017-11-05   9:43:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: sneakypete (#14)

China has publicly stated it would not back NK if it initiated violence which would imply that they otherwise would.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   10:04:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: BTP Holdings (#19)

We will be in deep doo doo if Kim does something crazy with his nukes and puts the rest of us back into the stone age. An EMP would do this. And none of us wants to freeze in the dark. ;)

Our fear is what keeps NK safe. If they didn't have them, we would destroy them as we did Serbia, Iraq and Libya.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   10:06:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: BTP Holdings (#15)

It's all of a piece with the age old problem of dynastic succession. NK's constitution requires the country's ruler be a descendant of Kim Il Sung. KJU's brother was a threat as long as he continued breathing, regardless of whatever designs he might have had or might not have had on his half brother's job. It's reported that China this week threw a wrench into an assassination plot to knock off KJU's nephew.

Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded. - James Madison

randge  posted on  2017-11-05   10:08:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: randge (#22)

Interesting to say the least. What happens if Kim is knocked off and there is no one in line to succeed him? ;)

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2017-11-05   10:21:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: BTP Holdings (#15)

Kim had his own brother offed?

Of course he did. His HALF-brother was a threat to his rule,and wasn't living in NK because he didn't want to be executed like his uncle was. I MIGHT be wrong about this,but I think Kim has his uncle's wife and their children executed,too.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   10:25:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: Ada (#17)

True,but he IS crazy as a rabid rat.

You know this how? The MSM tell you?

Well,he is at least as rational as you are.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   10:26:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: Ada (#18)

You've been drinking the Kool Aid again.

Right. Which one of us has never lived in Asia,and which one of us is a conspiracy freak?

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   10:28:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: BTP Holdings (#19)

Have either of you seen a night time satellite image of the Korean peninsula?

I have. When I was stationed on Okinawa we used to send mobile training teams to South Korea to train with the SK SF.

One of our NCO's was even named as the Defense Minister of South Korean by the SK president in the early 60's. The US and SK teams were at a "end of mission" party where everybody gets drunk and praises each other for a job well done,and the SK SF guys had family and friends there. When the SFC gave his little speech he talked about the positive things they had gained,and said he hoped they could accomplish even more the next time. One of the civilian guys in a suit raised his hand and asked him "what needs to be done to improve our security and training?",and the SFC was just drunk enough he told him. He didn't know it,but the guy he was talking to was the President of SK,who announced on the spot he wanted to make him the new defense minister of SK. I understand heads were exploding in Foggy Bottom over that one for the next couple of days.

The SFC couldn't accept the position for a number of reasons,the prime one being he was a serving NCO in the United States Army.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   10:39:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: Ada (#20) (Edited)

China has publicly stated it would not back NK if it initiated violence which would imply that they otherwise would.

All nations have public policy positions. Some are serious,and some are said for political reasons.

MY best guess is China will eventually come to realize they can no longer control Kim with money,food,weapons,etc,etc,etc,and they will end up being the ones behind the coup that kills and replaces him. No way in hell do they want a nuclear war right on their borders.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   10:43:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: Ada (#21)

Our fear is what keeps NK safe. If they didn't have them, we would destroy them as we did Serbia, Iraq and Libya.

Then why didn't we do it before they had nukes?

OOPS! That's right! If we had done it before,there couldn't be a conspiracy theory about it now,and you couldn't get your little cheap thrill rush from "being one of the few in the know!".

SOMETIMES conspiracy theories are based on actual facts,but mostly they are bullshit.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   10:46:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: BTP Holdings (#23)

Interesting to say the least. What happens if Kim is knocked off and there is no one in line to succeed him? ;)

What will PROBABLY happen is the NK Politburo will meet and name his closest blood relative male the new President for Life.

Then again,his closest blood relative might run for his life at the first whisper of this happening,or their Chinese Masters might order them to hold an actual election with the Chinese pick winning.

They could even be allowed to join with SK to unite the country again,but I can't imagine that happening anytime soon. It would disturb the balance of power in Asia too much.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   10:51:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: sneakypete (#29) (Edited)

Then why didn't we do it before they had nukes?

We tried but had to settle for a cease fire.

The conspiracy theory here has been developed by the US, i.e., that NK plans to nuke another country. No evidence at all to support.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   13:33:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: sneakypete (#28)

And no way does China want one million NK refugees crossing their border to escape .

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   13:37:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: sneakypete (#26)

Right. Which one of us has never lived in Asia,and which one of us is a conspiracy freak?

I pick and choose which conspiracy theories to support. As do you.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   13:39:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: Ada (#32)

And no way does China want one million NK refugees crossing their border to escape .

Will Russia take them???

Cynicom  posted on  2017-11-05   13:40:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: Cynicom (#34)

Will Russia take them???

I think any NK refugees would head toward the Chinese border. In any event, one million refugees to too much for any nation to absorb.

Ada  posted on  2017-11-05   13:45:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: Cynicom (#34)

Will Russia take them???

I doubt it. There are 10 million illegal Chinese in eastern Russia and they can do nothing about it. Where would they put the North Koreans? ;)

"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one." Edmund Burke

BTP Holdings  posted on  2017-11-05   13:51:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: Ada (#35)

I think any NK refugees would head toward the Chinese border. In any event, one million refugees to too much for any nation to absorb.

China Russia NK all communists.

Take a look at their common border.

www.google.com/search?q=p...jAA#imgrc=79iFgcHsHhW0oM:

Cynicom  posted on  2017-11-05   14:03:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Ada (#31)

Then why didn't we do it before they had nukes?

We tried but had to settle for a cease fire.

Where the HELL did you "learn" this stuff?

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   14:59:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Ada (#32)

And no way does China want one million NK refugees crossing their border to escape .

That doesn't worry the Chinese at all. They would just gun them down and not worry about it.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   15:01:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Ada (#33)

I pick and choose which conspiracy theories to support. As do you.

The difference is the ones I support are more fact than theory.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

sneakypete  posted on  2017-11-05   15:02:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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