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Title: Putin Trolls Trump, Offers to Sell Technology Which Has Made Most of US Military Obsolete
Source: [None]
URL Source: https://russia-insider.com/en/milit ... t-us-military-obsolete/ri27577
Published: Sep 6, 2019
Author: Moon of Alabama
Post Date: 2019-09-06 09:16:40 by Ada
Keywords: None
Views: 1690
Comments: 32

This is some high class trolling by Russia's President Vladimir Putin:

Putin said he offered U.S. President Donald Trump in a recent phone call the chance to buy one of the hypersonic nuclear weapons Moscow is developing. He said Trump spurned the offer and replied that Washington was making its own.

Hypersonic weapons fly faster than Mach 5 or five times the speed of sound. Their high speed leaves little warning time for the target. There are currently no practical defenses against them.

While the U.S. spent an enormous amount on developing large aircraft carriers, 'stealth' airplanes and useless missile defenses, Russia spent much less to developed weapons that can defeat all three. Carriers are today, at least for Russia, India and China, not threats but large and juicy targets. Kh-47M2 Kinzhal Mach 12 capable missile carried by a MIG-31

Trump is wrong in claiming that the U.S. makes its own hypersonic weapons. While the U.S. has some in development none will be ready before 2022 and likely only much later. Hypersonic weapons are a Soviet/Russian invention. The ones Russia now puts into service are already the third generation. U.S. development of such missiles is at least two generations behind Russia's.

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That Russian radar can 'see' stealth aircraft has been known since 1999 when a Yugoslav army unit shot down a U.S. F-117 Nighthawk stealth aircraft. Russian air and missile defense proved in Syria that it can defeat mass attacks by drones as well as by cruise missiles. U.S.-made air and missile defense in Saudi Arabia fails to take down even the primitive missiles Houthi forces fire against it.

The new weapons Russia announced in March 2018 make strategic missile defense useless.

The U.S. military and its weapons are regularly hyped in 'western' media. But it has long been clear to (non-U.S.) experts that U.S. military technology is not superior to that of other countries. In several important fields Russian, Chinese and even Indian weapons have much better capabilities. The reason is simple. U.S. weapons are not developed or built with a real strategic need in mind. They don't get developed for achieving the most effect in an existential war against a capable enemy but to create profit.

The last is probably the only thing Trump knows about them.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 10.

#1. To: Ada (#0)

The problem for the US is that you can't be a world's policemen or empire by creating missiles because you can't point strategic missiles at other countries and tell them what to do. That requires actual military presence in the form of bases and naval fleets, which probably do more to bribe these other countries through money spent on these bases and fleets than do the threat of military action.

Russia has far less money to spend and has been on the defensive since the fall of the USSR. So for them, imposing their will on the world has not been a realistic goal since the USSR fell. Instead, they've gone frugal, out of necessity, and that means focusing on tech that is largely defensive, and that means anti-aircraft systems like the S-400 & S-500 series, nuclear powered strategic nukes, nuclear bomb submarine drones with a 3000 mile range and 200 MPH torpedoes.

The next hot war with Russia will show that US Naval task forces are obsolete, as much as or moreso than Pearl harbor proved battleships obsolete. The US is still figuring that out as the military industrial complex willingly turns a blind eye to this reality as they rake in enormous earnings and congressmen go along for the votes seeing jobs for their constituents.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-09-06   16:36:19 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Pinguinite (#1)

submarine drones with a 3000 mile range and 200 MPH torpedoes.

The next hot war with Russia will show that US Naval task forces are obsolete, as much as or moreso than Pearl harbor proved battleships obsolete.

This being a truism, what is the explanation for Britain, China and India also building aircraft carriers at a fast pace???

Cynicom  posted on  2019-09-06   17:54:22 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Cynicom (#3)

This being a truism, what is the explanation for Britain, China and India also building aircraft carriers at a fast pace???

I'm unaware of Britain and India's schedule, but I know China is expanding it's economic influence in South American and Africa so they aren't really in defensive mode like Russia is.

I'm just calling it as I see it. Naval task forces are very expensive, very big and being a surface fleet, very slow. Missiles are relatively cheap, quite small and very fast.

Surface fleets will need to rely on staying out of range of known missile batteries, destroying inbound missiles with automated defensive weaponry and detecting underwater threats. That's a tall order, especially if anti-ship missiles and other weaponry can be constructed more and more cheaply, which translates to larger numbers of them.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-09-06   18:12:00 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Pinguinite (#5)

Surface fleets will need to rely on staying out of range of known missile batteries,

I'm unaware of Britain and India's schedule,

Recall the battleships were sent to Pearl Harbor??? For what reason?

Cynicom  posted on  2019-09-06   18:47:41 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Cynicom (#8)

Recall the battleships were sent to Pearl Harbor??? For what reason?

The only reason I've heard advocated was because FDR, being aware the Japanese would attack, wanted to give them a juicy target to hit so the American people would be enraged and get behind the war effort.

But that seems immaterial to this discussion. Granted harbored ships are easier targets for aircraft to hit but there are numerous other examples of the effectiveness of aircraft vs ships, such as the Battle of Midway.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-09-06   18:55:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: Pinguinite (#9)

But that seems immaterial to this discussion.

Quite the contrary. Machinations of war never change.

Plan Orange in 1920 said Japan was coming, Gen. Billy Mitchell in 1920s said Japan was coming, Col. George Patton in 1938 said Japan was coming. US military did not know WHERE but suspected it was Pearl Harbor. Japans DESIRE was to eliminate aircraft carriers. Battleships were expendable, carriers were not.

Now carriers are very useful and expendable. They project power which must be dealt with FIRST if one is to start a conflict.

A British naval officer spy was selling the Japanese torpedo technology. From this the US Navy knew Pearl Harbor was the target. Want to know how the Navy knew???

Cynicom  posted on  2019-09-06   19:30:15 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 10.

#11. To: Cynicom (#10)

A British naval officer spy was selling the Japanese torpedo technology. From this the US Navy knew Pearl Harbor was the target. Want to know how the Navy knew???

I would guess because the tech allowed torps to be dropped from torpedo planes in shallow water, as torps normally descended to some 30 feet in those cases before rising back toward the surface, which was too deep for Pearl Harbor. (I'm somewhat knowledgeable, I think, of the events surrounding the PH attack).

It's one thing to strategically predict a war. Someone has done so predicting a war between China and the USA. But it's quite another to predict the location and day.

It's a controversial subject but IMO, the best info is that yes, FDR and his closest high ranking military personnel did indeed know at least 1 week in advance with further confirmation even hours before. The Japanese code was already broken and US Intelligence was monitoring communications with the Japanese Embassy in DC. That is not in dispute, so naysayers have an uphill argument in suggesting the attack was truly a surprise.

FDR also had motive, perhaps somewhat noble, as he was watching the war unfold in Europe for the previous 2 years and had, with little doubt, already decided that the US would have to enter the war. At the same time, he was dealing with a strong "America First" political movement that did not want to repeat the US entry into WWI, the cost of which was still within living memory, which many probably viewed in hindsight as unnecessary. So a "sneak attack" by Japan would certainly have been a good move to allow to happen as it would have terminated domestic political resistance to entering the war. So... FDR had means to know what was going to happen at PH, as well as motive to allow it to happen without any warning being issued to Kimmel. I would add that, at the time, the power of the aircraft was appreciated only by a few like General Mitchell, and there's no reason to believe that FDR suspected any differently, so it's possible that FDR expected the airborne attack to cause only a fraction of the death and destruction that it did. That would give further argument in support that FDR might not have felt so bad about keeping his knowledge of the attack a secret.

Pinguinite  posted on  2019-09-06 21:43:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 10.

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