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Title: Why Christians Should Not Pray for the Troops
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URL Source: https://www.lewrockwell.com/2020/01 ... hould-not-pray-for-the-troops/
Published: Jan 14, 2020
Author: Laurence M. Vance
Post Date: 2020-01-14 09:53:02 by Ada
Keywords: None
Views: 457
Comments: 17
Some years ago I gave my expression to my own feeling – anti-patriotic feeling, it will doubtless be called – in a somewhat startling way. It was at the time of the second Afghan war, when, in pursuance of what were thought to be “our interests,” we were invading Afghanistan. News had come that some of our troops were in danger. At the Athenæum Club a well-known military man – then a captain but now a general – drew my attention to a telegram containing this news, and read it to me in a manner implying the belief that I should share his anxiety. I astounded him by replying – ‘When men hire themselves out to shoot other men to order, asking nothing about the justice of their cause, I don’t care if they are shot themselves.’” ~ Herbert Spencer (1820-1903) If you skipped over the quotation from Herbert Spencer, then go back and read it. If you just skimmed the quotation, then go back and read it carefully. If you read it all the way through, then go back and read it again. “When men hire themselves out to shoot other men to order, asking nothing about the justice of their cause, I don’t care if they are shot themselves.” These are harsh words. Most—probably a great majority of—Americans think that this is a despicable attitude to have about U.S. soldiers. You know, the ones who “serve” us, keep us safe, preserve our freedoms, “support and defend” the Constitution, keep us from having to speak a foreign language, and fight “over there” so we don’t have to fight “over here.” There are almost 50,000 U.S. military personnel in the Persian Gulf region and tens of thousands more military contractors. There are 35 U.S. military bases that surround Iran. More U.S. troops are now being deployed to the Middle East after President Trump’s foolish act of state terrorism in ordering the political assassination of Iran’s Maj. Gen. Qasem Soleimani. According to military.com, in the days since the Jan. 3 drone strike that took out Soleimani, “roughly 9,000 conventional troops have been deployed to the Middle East, ranging from Marines on amphibious ships to Army Rangers and paratroopers.” “We’re going to war, bro,” cheered a young soldier of the 82nd Airborne Division at Fort Bragg, North Carolina, while he held up two thumbs and grinned. I have already heard, and heard reports of, conservative Christians expressing the opinion that we should pray for the troops being deployed to the Middle East. We should pray for their safety, pray that they be kept out of harm’s way, pray that they avenge the attacks on the American embassy in Iraq, pray that they neutralize the threats to the United States, and pray that they get the terrorists before they get us. A more shameful prayer has never been uttered. U.S. soldiers are invaders, occupiers, destroyers, aggressors, and killers. As a conservative Christian, I cannot in good conscience pray for their safety or the success of their mission. And I fail to see how any Christian can. The fact that U.S. troops are young and dumb, just obeying orders, are ignorant of U.S. military interventions for the past 200 years, don’t draft the rules of engagement, don’t make U.S. foreign policy, can’t just quit their job, don’t get to vote on whether the United States should intervene militarily, or just joined the military because they couldn’t find a job is immaterial. Christians should not pray for the safety or the mission of the troops when they fight unnecessary, immoral, offensive, unjust, foreign wars. Christians should not pray for the safety or the mission of the troops when they intervene militarily based on lies. Christians should not pray for the safety or the mission of the troops when they fight “in a region and in a string of backwater countries that have virtually no bearing on homeland security, safety and liberty?” Christians should not pray for the safety or the mission of the troops when help carry out a reckless, belligerent, and meddling U.S. foreign policy. Christians should not pray for the safety or the mission of the troops when they fight against a country that is “zero threat to the American homeland.” Doing these things is like praying for a member of a criminal gang or the Mafia while they “shake down” a store owner, “send a message” to a rival, or commit acts of violence. A military uniform does not magically transform evil into good. But does not the Bible say that “supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; (1 Timothy 2:1)? Okay then, if you want to pray for the troops, then here are some things you can pray for: Pray that they stop fighting immoral and unjust wars. And especially for now, pray that they will have the moral courage to say enough is enough, I refuse to deploy to another country and fight for Uncle Sam.
Pray that they don’t make widows and orphans.
Pray that they stop killing civilians.
Pray that they stop being a pawn of the Pentagon.
Pray that they engage in defense and not offense.
Pray that they stop intervening in other countries.
Pray that they stop serving as the president’s personnel attack force.
Pray that they cease being a global force for evil.
Pray that they stop policing the world.
Pray that they don’t reenlist.
Pray that they come home, permanently.
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#1. To: Ada, 4, NeoconsNailed, Cynicom, Pinguinite, Former or Current US Servicemen (#0)
This essay is the kind of thread which could have a thousand posts at a larger forum (yeah, like FR or Breitbart.) If you check it out, in it the accomplished author (Laurence M. Vance) engages in *some* absolute truths -- but also a litany of half-truths, and...troubling embarrassing claims and lies which demonstrate a sickening lack of empathy and understanding of those who've served in the US military. (TO THOSE WHO *HAVE* SERVED, WHAT SAY YOU?) Would alleged "Christian" author, Laurence M. Vance, NOT "pray" for the the Lord's protection of *his* son in a war zone? OR for HIS nephew? HIS grandson?? Haven't U.S. soldiers always believed what they are told -- that their mission, their obligation, and their honor as well as nation's honor and safety are what's at stake? How can any blame be put to those honorable U.S. troops and servicemen who've been told they "serve" America -- with righteousness and honor? Why is it their fault that they might have been duped or used as tools to support the bloody lies and dark motives of the Globalist ruling class and the Military/Industrial Complex? I believe the author is way outta line. FACT: A vast super majority of all American fighting forces have *always* believed they are righteously "protecting" America and Americans back home...AND battling "evil." But because they have been programmed to believe their President, their Govt, their history books, their commanders, their dads (that the above is indeed THE case -- much like 95% of those American troops in WW1, WW2, Korea and Vietnam), why on earth would we NOT "pray" for The Almighty to ensure the safety of our sons? AND for "success" of their mission? Okay then, if you want to pray for the troops, then here are some things you can pray for: Pray that they stop fighting immoral and unjust wars. MUCH better. I get the author's frustration with US Military Interventionism... BUT... he still doesn't understand the full situation given the Elites' propaganda machine, programming & mind-control manipulation that's affected us ALL. Uh, why should we pray for the success of their mission when the mission cannot be justified? And is the safety of our sons more important than the safety of the people they are shooting at?
Where do you stand in the case of NOT knowing exactly what any particular "mission" is?? (the truth is neither one of us knows when/if a mission is "justified.") All missions are NOT un-justified; some military missions ARE actually righteous and saving others' freedoms and lives in foreign countries.) Buying into just one premise is tricky. And is the safety of our sons more important than the safety of the people they are shooting at? MINE certainly is. Remember -- HE and other sons have been told they are fighting FOR US. You are entitled to believe in leaving the fate of YOUR son to the whims of the wind and "karma." He deserves the chance to eventually learn the truths of this world. If our respective son is involved in any mission, a FAILED mission might mean their demise. You are certainly entitled to pray *against* the safety of your son; to question his morality and ethics to be there in the first place. But at the same time, whatever the mission they are assigned is NOT our sons' call. Was this also true of Nazi troops, great person? And the Japs who perpetrated the Rape of Nanking? Was it just as right to pray for those that bombed Pearl Harbor, shot people desperately trying to pass the iron curtain, and crushed Hungary in 1956? _____________________________________________________________ USA! USA! USA! Bringing you democracy, or else! there were strains of VD that were incurable, and they were first found in the Philippines and then transmitted to the Korean working girls via US military. The 'incurables' we were told were first taken back to a military hospital in the Philippines to quietly die. – 4um
MINE certainly is. Remember -- HE and other sons have been told they are fighting FOR US. You are entitled to believe in leaving the fate of YOUR son to the whims of the wind and "karma." He deserves the chance to eventually learn the truths of this world. If our respective son is involved in any mission, a FAILED mission might mean their demise. You are certainly entitled to pray *against* the safety of your son; to question his morality and ethics to be there in the first place. But at the same time, whatever the mission they are assigned is NOT our sons' call. Our sons are required not to commit war crimes or to obey an illegal order. Their officers cannot be depended on to inform them so they must determine for themselves whether what they are doing is right or wrong. (My son saw combat in Iraq and was nominated for the Silver Star. Simply put, some Iraqis fired on his platoon and he fired back. However, if he had been shot, I would not have blamed the Iraqis who were defending their homes and country but I would have held Bush 43 and Dick Cheney responsible.)
What part of "US" Troops did you miss, inquiring-person? Was it just as right to pray for those that bombed Pearl Harbor, shot people desperately trying to pass the iron curtain, and crushed Hungary in 1956? (See Above) EXCEPTIONS: It WAS ok for members of the Federation to pray for the Romulans and Klingons. Who said anything about that?? Their officers cannot be depended on to inform them so they must determine for themselves whether what they are doing is right or wrong. AND...JUST how would the troops know whether "war crime" is being committed? OR, "illegal order" given by a Commander? Mai Lai was over a half-century ago. (My son saw combat in Iraq and was nominated for the Silver Star. Simply put, some Iraqis fired on his platoon and he fired back. Did your son volunteer to serve? (and why?) Did he fulfill his duty and mission as part of the US military? Did he have definitive foreknowledge and a guarantee that his mission was "justified"? (The point is: THAT determination is near-impossible while in the field.) However, if he had been shot, I would not have blamed the Iraqis who were defending their homes and country but I would have held Bush 43 and Dick Cheney responsible.) Did you hope for or pray for his safety? OR, did you hope for and wish his mission -- whatever it was -- failed? Btw -- If any "blame" is assigned to anyone for service/war casualties, it should be at the feet of Moloch or Satan. OR in the interim -- I could go with BOTH Bushes, Cheney, Bubba, 0bama, LBJ, Wilson, etal while we're at it. Thus my question -- why only American troops. All troops everywhere think they're fighting for the right, are gambling on surviving and collecting big benefits, are stupidly looking for adventure, or were forced into it. Is it wrong to pray that the "wars" go so badly that ameriKa learns its lesson and stops sending their "young and dumb" people to fight in them? It's our only hope of peace this side of DC running out of money, i.e. the massive crash that's been warned of for so long. DC is never going to stop them voluntarily. They're a massively profitable business. I fear ameriKa is truthfully going to go down as the most violent country in history -- not the most wonderful as it loves to imagine. John McCain said to expect a 100-year-war, longer than the USSR's lifespan. _____________________________________________________________ USA! USA! USA! Bringing you democracy, or else! there were strains of VD that were incurable, and they were first found in the Philippines and then transmitted to the Korean working girls via US military. The 'incurables' we were told were first taken back to a military hospital in the Philippines to quietly die. – 4um
Because THEY are the subject of our premise. All troops everywhere think they're fighting for the right, are gambling on surviving and collecting big benefits, are stupidly looking for adventure, or were forced into it. True. Is it wrong to pray that the "wars" go so badly that ameriKa learns its lesson and stops sending their "young and dumb" people to fight in them? It's our only hope of peace, this side of DC running out of money, i.e. the massive crash that's been warned of for so long. Nobody is defending war-adventurism, interventionism or hoax wars. THAT said, whomever serves in the US military is told they/we will only fight "righteous" wars. In ANY case, we/I shall pray for their safety and NOT for their death. YOU and Ada can pray/NOT pray as your prerogative. DC is never going to stop them voluntarily. They're a massively profitable business. Many are awakening to that realization; But it does NOT mean that we stop praying for the safety of our people who serve who believe they are supporting freedom and fighting the righteous fight. MOREOVER...You have to understand that the US Military has been hijacked by the Globalist-Industrial Complex and their New World Order (so saith Poppy Bush in 1991), ergo their mission and MO ever since. AND...JUST how would the troops know whether "war crime" is being committed? OR, "illegal order" given by a Commander? Mai Lai was over a half-century ago. Wasn't it a helicopter pilot who recognized Lt. Calley's order to slaughter the civilians was a war crime? Wasn't that difficult a call although I can appreciate there is sometimes a fine line just as there is with police shootings. (My son saw combat in Iraq and was nominated for the Silver Star. Simply put, some Iraqis fired on his platoon and he fired back. Did your son volunteer to serve? (and why?) Did he fulfill his duty and mission as part of the US military? Did he have definitive foreknowledge and a guarantee that his mission was "justified"? (The point is: THAT determination is near-impossible while in the field.) Not exactly. He was National Guard who are not supposed to be activated unless the Chinese are on the horizon. Volunteering for the Guard means being put to use in disasters or, in his case, patrolling the streets of lower Manhattan after 9/11. Be that as it may, his unit was told to go and it went and he looked forward to it. IIRC some in his unit were hoping to be assigned to Afghanistan where they would come up against "real fighters". Its the job of the whole country to decide if a war is justified, not just the military. However, if he had been shot, I would not have blamed the Iraqis who were defending their homes and country but I would have held Bush 43 and Dick Cheney responsible.) Did you hope for or pray for his safety? OR, did you hope for and wish his mission -- whatever it was -- failed? I hoped for his safety just as I would have if he were in a gang of bank robbers and hoped that the mission failed. Actually he was sort of in a gang of thieves. Btw -- If any "blame" is assigned to anyone for service/war casualties, it should be at the feet of Moloch or Satan. OR in the interim -- I could go with BOTH Bushes, Cheney, Bubba, 0bama, LBJ, Wilson, etal while we're at it. A bit vague but my point was blame should not be placed on those defending their homes and country.
Its time this was stopped. IMO, of course.
Volunteering for the Guard means being put to use in disasters or, in his case, patrolling the streets of lower Manhattan after 9/11. Be that as it may, his unit was told to go and it went and he looked forward to it. IIRC some in his unit were hoping to be assigned to Afghanistan where they would come up against "real fighters". Its the job of the whole country to decide if a war is justified, not just the military. Thank you for responding with respect to your son and the hows on whys he wound up in the Middle East while in the US National Guard... Firstly -- I *wish* it truly were "the job of the whole country to decide if a war is justified, not just the military"; It's just not the reality and never was. What we HAVE hoped for was a Leadership that we could trust to fight and defend America righteously, with honor. That trust has obviously been violated for a very long time -- starting with CW 1. Wit respect to service as a "National Guardsman," the US Govt was/is ethically & morally wrong and engaging in deception by essentially pulling a "bait & switch" with your son and other courageous young men when they sign up to ostensibly defend our borders and sovereignty as a member of the National Guard. Yes -- as you noted -- your son with other enlistees were purposely lied to and coerced to fulfill whatever mission Uncle Sam deemed "necessary." Right -- Mai Lai was an easy call. But I mentioned it because that type of blatant subversive, illegal mission and act was/is rare. And so very long ago. (Not that those types of "missions" haven't taken place since then; SOME folks believe the US Gummint employs the services of "contractors" or mercs for those gray/black-area ops; NOT official US servicemen. I can appreciate there is sometimes a fine line just as there is with police shootings. And sometimes that line isn't so well-defined and blurred, is it? In both cases of military and domestic LE. Yet SOMEONE must step up and get a bit dirty if the rest of us are to be fully protected and free from external threats. I hoped for his safety just as I would have if he were in a gang of bank robbers and hoped that the mission failed. Actually he was sort of in a gang of thieves. No, your son actually was NOT part of any "gang of thieves" -- and I *hope* you've never told him your thought on the matter. The other fact about your son -- he was NOT a bank robber either. (why assume his mission was dishonorable? ) He far more likely was helping liberate abused/oppressed Afghans while nobly helping his military brethren execute their/his mission, survive and go home. There are Day & Night differences in what and why you might be praying for (mission success/safety.) Your analogy presumes the absolute worst of whatever mission your son and unit were executing. It doesn't work on any level. Btw, I wasn't "vague" about names and identities of who to blame at all. I was specific as to who and what could/would unjustifiably engage in war for profit, and/or blood. There IS an actual Evil Entity in this realm who influences man. AND Presidents. Finally...It must be noted that Reagan gave us NO war and peace during his two admins; Same of Trump thus far. I agree wholeheartedly.
Right -- Mai Lai was an easy call. But I mentioned it because that type of blatant subversive, illegal mission and act was/is rare. And so very long ago. (Not that those types of "missions" haven't taken place since then; SOME folks believe the US Gummint employs the services of "contractors" or mercs for those gray/black-area ops; NOT official US servicemen. Not just contractors but proxies in the cases of killing Saddam and Qaddafi. Was supposedly the locals who did the murders. I can appreciate there is sometimes a fine line just as there is with police shootings. And sometimes that line isn't so well-defined and blurred, is it? In both cases of military and domestic LE. Yet SOMEONE must step up and get a bit dirty if the rest of us are to be fully protected and free from external threats. We aren't in danger from any external threats except maybe Israel, i.e., USS Liberty and in the opinion of some, 9/11. I hoped for his safety just as I would have if he were in a gang of bank robbers and hoped that the mission failed. Actually he was sort of in a gang of thieves. No, your son actually was NOT part of any "gang of thieves" -- and I *hope* you've never told him your thought on the matter. He knew I disapproved but that was before we stole Iraq's oil and antiquities. He found out for himself the low character of some military units but that was not my objection. I had objected to the US destroying Iraq's water purification plants and the use of depleted uranium against the population. The other fact about your son -- he was NOT a bank robber either. (why assume his mission was dishonorable? ) We had no honest reason to attack Iraq and that makes us criminals the same as bank robbers are. Bush43 and his gang lied us into war which did not benefit the US people one iota. He far more likely was helping liberate abused/oppressed Afghans while nobly helping his military brethren execute their/his mission, survive and go home. There are Day & Night differences in what and why you might be praying for (mission success/safety.) Your analogy presumes the absolute worst of whatever mission your son and unit were executing. It doesn't work on any level. He was attacking Iraqis, not Afghans, and there was nothing noble about it. Btw, I wasn't "vague" about names and identities of who to blame at all. I was specific as to who and what could/would unjustifiably engage in war for profit, and/or blood. There IS an actual Evil Entity in this realm who influences man. AND Presidents. You were blaming Satan who for all I know might not have had anything to do with it. Neocon politicians, think tanks and complicit lying corporate media. If Satan were involved, it was because human beings allowed him to be. Finally...It must be noted that Reagan gave us NO war and peace during his two admins; Same of Trump thus far. Trump may very well want peace but he is too willing to order killings in order to appease hawks and the military/industrial complex.
Gott mit uns even if we are a force for evil.
That's true, but black op "/contractors"mercs and their monkey business created the type of havoc in Libya as well as in Egypt that created the whole "Arab Spring' to begin with -- thanks to the 0bama-Hitlery agenda. We aren't in danger from any external threats except maybe Israel, i.e., USS Liberty and in the opinion of some, 9/11. I agree. But IN ADDITION, don't forget that there are domestic and globalist enemies as well who are actively attempting to take down the US. (are you familiar with Agenda 21/30?) You were blaming Satan who for all I know might not have had anything to do with it. Neocon politicians, think tanks and complicit lying corporate media. If Satan were involved, it was because human beings allowed him to be. Yes, I AM blaming Satan. He is the spiritual source of evil in this world, this realm. I do agree with the bold statement -- "because human beings ALLOWED him to be involved." With respect to the dynamics of your son, I would just say that he was motivated to serve the US people back home AND his unit with honor. I would NEVER assume a typical US military "mission" to be about wanton, in-discriminatory. murder. Please give your son and serviceman the benefit of doubt. Not just contractors but proxies in the cases of killing Saddam and Qaddafi. Was supposedly the locals who did the murders. That's true, but black op "/contractors"mercs and their monkey business created the type of havoc in Libya as well as in Egypt that created the whole "Arab Spring' to begin with -- thanks to the 0bama-Hitlery agenda. As the draft has been temporarily abolished, all US military personnel are mercenaries. We aren't in danger from any external threats except maybe Israel, i.e., USS Liberty and in the opinion of some, 9/11. I agree. But IN ADDITION, don't forget that there are domestic and globalist enemies as well who are actively attempting to take down the US. (are you familiar with Agenda 21/30?) I didn't but googled it up. The US military is useless as far as that danger goes. And, yes, the lefties/socialists are taking control of the local governments and the police. You were blaming Satan who for all I know might not have had anything to do with it. Neocon politicians, think tanks and complicit lying corporate media. If Satan were involved, it was because human beings allowed him to be. Yes, I AM blaming Satan. He is the spiritual source of evil in this world, this realm. I do agree with the bold statement -- "because human beings ALLOWED him to be involved." The responsibility lies with the humans. With respect to the dynamics of your son, I would just say that he was motivated to serve the US people back home AND his unit with honor. I would NEVER assume a typical US military "mission" to be about wanton, in-discriminatory. murder. Please give your son and serviceman the benefit of doubt. Assume he never gave much thought to whom or what he was serving. The adventure was the charm and he was willing to have the gummint justify it for him. The typical military mission is usually not about wanton murder and chaos although our recent venture with assassination and mobs seems to be intended to stir up chaos in Iran. The overall strategy seems to be control of resources and maintaining the supremacy of the US$.
Pray that they don’t make widows and orphans.
Pray that they stop killing civilians.
Pray that they stop being a pawn of the Pentagon.
Pray that they engage in defense and not offense.
Pray that they stop intervening in other countries.
Pray that they stop serving as the president’s personnel attack force.
Pray that they cease being a global force for evil.
Pray that they stop policing the world.
Pray that they don’t reenlist.
Pray that they come home, permanently.
#2. To: Liberator (#1)
why on earth would we NOT "pray" for The Almighty to ensure the safety of our sons? AND for "success" of their mission?
#3. To: Ada (#2)
(Edited)
Uh, why should we pray for the success of their mission when the mission cannot be justified?
#4. To: Liberator, HAPPY2BME-4UM (#1)
#5. To: Liberator (#3)
#6. To: NeoconsNailed (#4)
Was this also true of Nazi troops, great person? And the Japs who perpetrated the Rape of Nanking?
#7. To: Ada (#5)
Our sons are required not to commit war crimes or to obey an illegal order.
#8. To: Liberator (#6)
(Edited)
What part of "US" Troops did you miss, inquiring-person?
#9. To: NeoconsNailed, Ada (#8)
Thus my question -- why only American troops.
#10. To: Liberator (#7)
#11. To: Liberator (#9)
MOREOVER...You have to understand that the US Military has been hijacked by the Globalist-Industrial Complex and their New World Order (so saith Poppy Bush in 1991), ergo their mission and MO ever since.
#12. To: Ada (#10)
He [my son] was National Guard who are not supposed to be activated unless the Chinese are on the horizon.
#13. To: Ada (#11)
#14. To: Liberator (#12)
#15. To: Liberator (#9)
Many are awakening to that realization; But it does NOT mean that we stop praying for the safety of our people who serve who believe they are supporting freedom and fighting the righteous fight.
#16. To: Ada (#14)
Not just contractors but proxies in the cases of killing Saddam and Qaddafi. Was supposedly the locals who did the murders.
#17. To: Liberator (#16)
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