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Religion
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Title: Jesus 'Denied He Was Son of God'
Source: www.timesonline.co.uk
URL Source: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-2125660,00.html
Published: Apr 9, 2006
Author: Maurice Chittenden
Post Date: 2006-04-09 13:57:37 by Mind_Virus
Keywords: None
Views: 269
Comments: 34

April 09, 2006

Jesus 'Denied He Was Son of God'

Maurice Chittenden A HOLY war between writers is switching from the High Court to the bookshelves.

One of the authors who last week failed to win a plagiarism case against Dan Brown’s The Da Vinci Code has written a new book just in time for Easter to question the very tenets of the Christian faith.

Michael Baigent’s The Jesus Papers tries to strip Jesus of his divinity by claiming that he wrote letters to a Jewish court denying that he was the son of God.

The book was published in the United States last week on the same day as the first American paperback version of Brown’s novel.

The two immediately went head-to-head at bookstore tills with a print run of 150,000 for The Jesus Papers in hardback and one of 5m for the paperback of The Da Vinci Code, dwarfing last year’s 2m-copy release in Britain of Harry Potter’s latest adventure.

The Jesus Papers will be published in Britain next month, nine days before the film of The Da Vinci Code, starring Tom Hanks as a Harvard expert on symbolism on the trail of the holy grail. It will hit the cinema screens on May 19.

Had last week’s verdict at the High Court in London gone in favour of Baigent and another author, Richard Leigh, it could have led to the film being left in the can and Brown’s book, which has sold 43m copies worldwide, being withdrawn from sale. Baigent and Leigh claimed that Brown had stolen his ideas from their 1982 book, The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail. Instead they have been left with a £2m legal bill. (The third co-author, Henry Lincoln, did not take part in the lawsuit.)

However, cynics point out that, whatever the outcome of the legal action, the publishers cannot lose. Lee Curtis, an intellectual property lawyer from Pinsent Masons, said: “Given the fact that both books have seen surges in sales because of the publicity of the court case, the real winner in the case is Random House, which publishes both titles.”

The publicity surrounding the court case has seen sales of The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail, which had stalled at 3,500 copies a year in Britain, soar to 7,000 copies a week, a 100-fold rise. Similarly, The Da Vinci Code was returned to the bestseller lists with sales of 20,000 copies a week.

Baigent, who was not in court for the verdict, said last week that his new book explored how Pontius Pilate, the Roman procurator of Judaea, made a secret deal to save Jesus’s life because Christ had called on the Jews to pay their taxes. He added: “All that Rome required was that taxes were paid. Suddenly he couldn’t execute this man but he had to get him out of the way because he wanted peace in Judaea.”

The Jesus papers in the book’s title are two scrolls supposedly written in Aramaic and found under a house in the old city of Jerusalem in the 1960s. It is claimed they are letters written to the Jewish court, the Sanhedrin, by Jesus, saying he is not the son of God but is filled with the spirit of God.

Baigent also claims he has discovered information about a mysterious document that purports to provide evidence that Jesus was alive in AD45, more than a decade after the accepted date for the crucifixion. The document was supposedly seen by Alfred Lilley, canon at Hereford Cathedral, at a church in Paris in the 1890s but later vanished. Baigent believes it now rests in the Vatican.

Biblical scholars were quick to pour scorn on the claims.

Pierpaolo Finaldi, editor of the Catholic Truth Society which has sold out first editions of its own books that claim to crack The Da Vinci Code and offer the truth about Jesus, said: “All this seems far more far-fetched than the actual resurrection from the dead.”

Canon George Kavoor, principal of Trinity theological college in Bristol, said: “Michael Baigent needs to be a Nobel laureate for his imagination. But these books have created a huge amount of interest in the veracity of the gospels and whether Jesus existed or not.”

Margaret Tofalides, a copyright lawyer at the law firm Addleshaw Goddard, said that Baigent and Leigh had probably hoped for a quick settlement to make money rather than have to go down the high risk route of a full-blown trial.

“Unfortunately, it’s not an ending they would have written for themselves,” she said.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 31.

#4. To: Mind_Virus (#0)

I think it's a fair guess that having people believe he was the son of God was low on his list of priorities regarding the message he was trying to teach, which was mainly how to be civilized human beings (and I not talking "civilized" like the Romans!).

The Old Testament tries to teach civility in a few places, but fails miserably most of the time with examples of violence and corruption even among its "heroes". Even God violates (or tells men to violate) his own rules for civilized behavior.

If Jesus WAS trying to tell people he was God (or son of) I think this was more of an attempt to redeem a corrupt and ineffective god more than an attempt to redeem mankind. That last part we have to do ourselves.

National Geographic Channel (if you have digital cable/satellite) is going to be airing "Gospel of Judas" tonight. Should be interesting.

PnbC  posted on  2006-04-09   15:06:40 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: PnbC (#4)

If Jesus WAS trying to tell people he was God (or son of) I think this was more of an attempt to redeem a corrupt and ineffective god more than an attempt to redeem mankind. That last part we have to do ourselves.

You're entitled to think whatever in the hell you want to but you're so full of shit. And ignorant as well. Is this condition by choice or misfortune?

fatidic  posted on  2006-04-09   18:56:48 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: fatidic (#14)

By choice I suppose. I wouldn't want to be as rude and arrogant as you.

PnbC  posted on  2006-04-10   2:09:05 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: PnbC (#16)

I wouldn't want to be as rude and arrogant as you.

Now that we've traded insults, welcome to 4um. Perhaps we'll find points of ageement on other issues, or not. Is your bad impression of the God who has revealed Himself in the Bible based on personal experience with Him, or on unpleasant experiences with people calling themselves 'Christians'?

fatidic  posted on  2006-04-10   11:24:04 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: fatidic (#18)

Is your bad impression of the God who has revealed Himself in the Bible based on personal experience with Him, or on unpleasant experiences with people calling themselves 'Christians'?

Everything. Regarding the idea of God redeeming himself thru Jesus, I find that the behavior of God and his "people" portrayed in the Old Testament to be reprehensible. The 10 Commandments were clear cut intructions on civilized society and yet shortly afterwards God then tells the Israelites to kill and steal the land that was already occupied by others (just like the UN and modern-day Israel). Now, to give God the benefit of the doubt Moses and Aaron had to herd the vast ex-slave army somewhere after 40 years or they would soon lose control, so they tell a little lie about there being land available given to them by God himself. I think it was a bill of goods. That there were people there with different beliefs and that made everything ok as far as killing and stealing just made it so that eventually the Jews would be subject to the same treatment by others in later history. Karma.

I also find the story of Abraham and Isaac to be downright creepy. Abraham obviously had no conscience of his own or he would have disobeyed God when he initially told him to sacrifice his son. I would have said "no way, God or no god this is wrong". Of course in the end it would seem God was just messing with his head to teach some kind of lesson. Maybe things would have turned out better if Abraham had gone thru with sacrificing Isaac, even with God in the background saying "no no I was only messing with you. STOP STOP please?". After all was said and done, with Isaac lying in a pool of his own blood and Abraham duly smited for ruining everything, God would contemplate his mistake (yes, I believe God CAN make mistakes) and say to himself "Okay NEXT TIME I'm going to be alot more honest, and NO more mind games with the people I choose to communicate with". In the long run a happier ending, I would think.

I can't respect a God who resorts to those kinds of tactics, nor can I respect a God who is "jealous" of other gods (so it is written). An absolutely powerful God (and what is it we hear about the effects of absolute power?) could certainly smite me if he wanted to but that still won't earn my respect. Only a mindless bot worships raw power, whether it is in "heaven" or on Earth.

As for the Gospels, we only have the written (and edited!) accounts of others claiming to quote Jesus (I've heard there is somewhere a "Gospel of Jesus", of course they couldn't include THAT in the New Testament could they? Nevermind the Gospel of Mary). If the apostles and religious leaders came to the consensus that Jesus would be recorded as a larger-than-life figure after his execution, then I think they would want to promote the idea that Jesus said he was the son of God ("I'm the son of God and You're not!") above men. It's not like he was still around to say to the writers: "Hey, I never said that, you're putting words into my mouth!".

Iirc, Jesus referred to his followers as his "flock", as in a "flock of sheep". I think this should be taken as a veiled (or not so veiled) insult at the lack of depth on the thinking of his followers. Today we would use the term "sheeple". And I think that when he said the way to heaven was "thru me" he was either stating that people should follow his example and live in a christlike manner OR that "the kingdom of heaven is within", that is to say "thru ME" refers to the generic "me" as in the personal SELF. It may be hard to say for certain, given the multiple translations that these texts have gone thru, context can differ.

Of course, I don't expect you to agree with any of this, and I'm not here to critcize your faith. I certainly don't think that I am absolutely right and my views aren't subject to change. I'm just letting you know where I'm coming from, and MAYBE after some thought, some of my notions might have merit. We will probably find more agreement on political/foreign policy issues, but living in a Judeo-Christian country religion and the beliefs of my fellow Americans is going to come up from time to time. I appreciate your response, hostile though it may have been initially. All too often I go no response whatsoever from expressing these sorts of views, which kind of leaves me in the dark as to whether anyone agrees with me or not.

PnbC  posted on  2006-04-10   14:03:25 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: PnbC (#23)

nor can I respect a God who is "jealous" of other gods (so it is written).

Only God, who is the Creator, has the right to be jealous and He clearly shows His broken heart over being rejected by people that He lavish His grace upon. He gives us freedom to choose, to act, to think, to be, something other gods do not give. That says a lot, doesn't it?

fatidic  posted on  2006-04-10   15:07:35 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: fatidic (#29)

Jealosy suggests self-esteem issues. Adds a human dimension to him I admit.

The current Apocalypse scenario being set up and played out by "our" leaders suggest that we are not being given the freedom to choose. I don't want this, but most christians would say it is God's will.

PnbC  posted on  2006-04-10   15:18:16 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 31.

#32. To: PnbC (#31)

I don't want this, but most christians would say it is God's will.

And there you have an example of my anguish...the deplorable state of ignorance, harshness, stupidity, warmongering hypocracy of the "churched". As one poster here so clearly put it, Lucifer has gone to church, taken over the seminaries, sits in the pews and appears on TV proclaiming false words and grossly misrepresenting God and everything He stands for.

I don't know how He stands it...it hurts me so deeply. But while there are always false leaders, wolves in sheep's clothing, there is the truth waiting to be discovered by each individual who seeks. God has promised to answer his/her knock.

fatidic  posted on  2006-04-10 15:26:55 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


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