[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help] 

Status: Not Logged In; Sign In

46% of those deaths were occurring on the day of vaccination or within two days

In 2002 the US signed the Hague Invasion Act into law

MUSK is going after WOKE DISNEY!!!

Bondi: Zuckerberg Colluded with Fauci So "They're Not Immune Anymore" from 1st Amendment Lawsuits

Ukrainian eyewitnesses claim factory was annihilated to dust by Putin's superweapon

FBI Director Wray and DHS Secretary Mayorkas have just refused to testify before the Senate...

Government adds 50K jobs monthly for two years. Half were Biden's attempt to mask a market collapse with debt.

You’ve Never Seen THIS Side Of Donald Trump

President Donald Trump Nominates Former Florida Rep. Dr. Dave Weldon as CDC Director

Joe Rogan Tells Josh Brolin His Recent Bell’s Palsy Diagnosis Could Be Linked to mRNA Vaccine

President-elect Donald Trump Nominates Brooke Rollins as Secretary of Agriculture

Trump Taps COVID-Contrarian, Staunch Public Health Critic Makary For FDA

F-35's Cooling Crisis: Design Flaws Fuel $2 Trillion Dilemma For Pentagon

Joe Rogan on Tucker Carlson and Ukraine Aid

Joe Rogan on 62 year-old soldier with one arm, one eye

Jordan Peterson On China's Social Credit Controls

Senator Kennedy Exposes Bad Jusge

Jewish Land Grab

Trump Taps Dr. Marty Makary, Fierce Opponent of COVID Vaccine Mandates, as New FDA Commissioner

Recovering J6 Prisoner James Grant, Tells-All About Bidens J6 Torture Chamber, Needs Immediate Help After Release

AOC: Keeping Men Out Of Womens Bathrooms Is Endangering Women

What Donald Trump Has Said About JFK's Assassination

Horse steals content from Sara Fischer and Sophia Cai and pretends he is the author

Horse steals content from Jonas E. Alexis and claims it as his own.

Trump expected to shake up White House briefing room

Ukrainians have stolen up to half of US aid ex-Polish deputy minister

Gaza doctor raped, tortured to death in Israeli custody, new report reveals

German Lutheran Church Bans AfD Members From Committees, Calls Party 'Anti-Human'

Berlin Teachers Sound Alarm Over Educational Crisis Caused By Multiculturalism

Trump Hosts Secret Global Peace Summit at Mar-a-Lago!


Religion
See other Religion Articles

Title: The Zionized-Christian political reality: Israel first, Jesus second.
Source: We Hold These Truths
URL Source: http://www.whtt.org/index.php?news=2&id=839
Published: Jun 6, 2006
Author: Charles E. Carlson
Post Date: 2006-06-06 23:47:38 by Red Jones
Keywords: None
Views: 353
Comments: 19

The Zionized-Christian political reality: Israel first, Jesus second.

Uncounted big plot theories abound. We have a few of our own that we cannot quite prove, even to our own satisfaction, to say nothing of convincing you. Most people wonder if there is a "who" and "they" who control, or conspire to control, the world. We think so, but we also know we need to tackle problems that are tangible and concrete. Otherwise we will not make an impact. We can't help but think God wants us to produce some positive results.

One could liken the Bigfish theorist to fisherman on a dark pond, each one holding a line, each one employing his own special talent, tackle and bait in quest of what they imagine to expose the big one. The problem is, no one can see clearly under the water; and Bigfish down there doesn't seem to want to be identified. The lure of catching him is great, so the line wetting goes on...and if you don't score there is always the conversation with other fishermen to anticipate.

It is a lot more romantic to dream about identifying Mr. Bigfish, who you can't see, than to deal with the real world that is crying out for someone to see the obvious, and have the courage to change what is evil right in front of us.

It is better to win back our best and most loved friends than to fight them with bricks and bats. We are talking about our own sons, daughters-in law, fathers, employees, pastors, priests and bosses. But to free any of them from error, we must start with a few demonstrable and self-evident facts that expose the most important errors among those we love.

FACT OF LIFE: Our Serial wars are at the root of our inflation (money dilution) problem. By this I mean the cost of everything is going up except for the disposable income of the giant middle class, which is declining. The cost of war dilutes our money and makes goods, including gas and food, expensive, and elevates taxes on property. Ending war will not of itself end government waste and intentional inflations, but inflation absolutely cannot be ended without first ending serial wars.

FACT OF LIFE: Politicians will not fix this problems because someone pays them not to. War and dilution are the politician's twin drinking buddies. He will not make them go away unless forced to do so.

FACT OF LIFE: Israel is a catalyst for war; the Serial Wars in the Mideast depend upon acts by and in behalf of the State of Israel to keep wars going, and equally Warmakers depend upon hatred against Israel to keep the embers of war alive...they want Israel to keep on killing and remain hated by its neighbors! This fact is so historically obvious that some might guess Mr. Bigfish created Israel for this express purpose...we move on and leave this for speculations of those on the banks of the pond.

FACT OF LIFE: The so-called Christian Right is the most powerful supporter of the State of Israel, therefore, these Zionized Christians, while mostly well meaning, are the primary enablers of Serial wars.

FACT OF LIFE: Celebrity-Christians own a tax-exempted media is second only in size and power to the Jewish controlled public media. When you combine the votes and media control of Jews and the Christian-Zionist you reach a critical mass for information control. The Internet is the new superstar on the media block, but it too is rapidly being controlled by the Bigfish who control the establishment media.

We wrote about Facing Unavoidable Unpopular Truths and how most people dodge them. Anyone who does not instinctively recognize these few facts of life is lucky not to be a cat, for a cat survives on instincts, and when instincts fail her, she soon becomes a former cat. Only humans can survive without instincts, and not for very long!

We Hold These Truth's Mission

Our indescribably important mission is to do a necessary part to save Christianity from Christian-Zionism. Our target audience is between 30 and 70 million in the USA and more around the world. It is up to us to continue until our "Facts of Life" are understood by a significant minority in most churches and mosques. To this end we join with all those who would end Serial wars, which is the most horrible vehicle for spiritual collapse. Knowing and writing the truth is not enough; we must use every legal means to reach out to those who need to know.

Christian Political activism; in Israel for Israel

Prominent members (celebrities) of the Christian-Right are exposing their Achilles heel to the world when they adopt un-Christian positions in order to do spiritual business with the State of Israel. Zionized-Christians surrender certain basic tenants that Christ accepted, and they accept much of what Jesus resoundingly rejected, including Pharisaism.

In this series we will examine these errors in hopes of restoring Zionized-Christians to followers of Christ. The most obvious example of professing Christians making provable un-Christian statements in support of false values is found in the words of American Celebrity Christians in their ridiculous fawning over the Israel.

We Hold These Truths' Mission

We Hold These Truth's vital mission is to do a necessary part to save Christianity from Christian-Zionism. Our target audience is between 30 and 70 million in the USA and more around the world. It is up to us to continue until our "Facts of Life" are understood by a significant minority in most churches and mosques. To this end we join with all those who would end Serial wars, which is the most horrible vehicle for spiritual collapse. Knowing and writing the truth is not enough; we must use every legal means to reach out to those who need to know.

The Bigfish Conspiracy and the Christian-Right starts with the influence of the Oxford Press on what we think of as “Christianity.” The Scofield's movement, about which this author has written so much, is the flimsy intellectual moorings to which Zionized-Christianity is tethered. It is like a boat tied to a floating stump; its falseness is based on error, fed by heresy. Its celebrity leaders who we will be discussing in this series are the product of a concerted effort to warp and control Christianity by first changing the Bible. We call it "Scofieldism" because of this one man's terrible contribution. Carlson's 43 minute presentation explains is quite well.

A Glimmer of Hope

Financially successful celebrities we will be discussing are probley lost causes. Each has made a business of Christian-Zionism. In contrast we must seek out those not yet caught up in it but and who have not become parasites to it. They can be rescued because they can still see the faint light of truth.

IN PART II: The big loud guns we will discuss include Kay Arthur, John Hagee, Jerry Falwell and more who believe Israel is the fulfillment of biblical prophesy, some of whom also claim Jews enjoy a separate, very wide gate into Heaven. Most important, in the interest of winning others we document why they believe this spiritually fatal error.

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

#1. To: Red Jones (#0)

Bonhoeffer made opposition to the Nazis a Confession of the Faith. That is he did not believe you could support the Nazis and be a Christian. Some evangelicals did support Hitler in the 1930s. Martin Luther King would have made opposition to imperialism and miltarism a Confession of the Faith if he had not been assassinated one year to the day from his speech against the Vietnam war at the Riverside church. Maybe we will have a religous teacher who will live long enough to make opposition to miltarism a Confession of the Faith.

Horse  posted on  2006-06-07   0:07:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Red Jones (#0)

"The Zionized-Christian political reality: Israel first, Jesus second."

That's why this country is in decline

Max  posted on  2006-06-07   1:42:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Red Jones, *US is Proxy State For Israel* (#0)

Great article!

No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. – James Madison

robin  posted on  2006-06-07   8:54:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: Horse (#1)

Bonhoeffer made opposition to the Nazis a Confession of the Faith. That is he did not believe you could support the Nazis and be a Christian. Some evangelicals did support Hitler in the 1930s. Martin Luther King would have made opposition to imperialism and miltarism a Confession of the Faith if he had not been assassinated one year to the day from his speech against the Vietnam war at the Riverside church. Maybe we will have a religous teacher who will live long enough to make opposition to miltarism a Confession of the Faith.

Excellent historical points with this article in mind.

No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. – James Madison

robin  posted on  2006-06-07   8:55:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Max, Starwind, Zipporah, AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#2)

"The Zionized-Christian political reality: Israel first, Jesus second."

That's why this country is in decline

Yes, and the article gives a unique perspective.

ping to article and Horse's comments.

No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. – James Madison

robin  posted on  2006-06-07   8:56:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: robin (#3)

Great article!

Yep.

In 1947, the UN created a perpetual war and named it Israel.

wbales  posted on  2006-06-07   9:42:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: rowdee, mehitable, aristeides, Brian S, Itisa1mosttoolate (#0)

ping to another perspective.

No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. – James Madison

robin  posted on  2006-06-07   12:23:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Red Jones, Robin (#0)

It is a lot more romantic to dream about identifying Mr. Bigfish, who you can't see, than to deal with the real world that is crying out for someone to see the obvious, and have the courage to change what is evil right in front of us.

It is better to win back our best and most loved friends than to fight them with bricks and bats. We are talking about our own sons, daughters-in law, fathers, employees, pastors, priests and bosses. But to free any of them from error, we must start with a few demonstrable and self-evident facts that expose the most important errors among those we love.

IN PART II: The big loud guns we will discuss include Kay Arthur, John Hagee, Jerry Falwell and more who believe Israel is the fulfillment of biblical prophesy, some of whom also claim Jews enjoy a separate, very wide gate into Heaven. Most important, in the interest of winning others we document why they believe this spiritually fatal error.

I have been giving a lot of thought myself to that lately. The big picture seems so overwhelming, and I began to think, so what if we win the war, and the ones we love are condemned for eternity because they believed the Big Lie, denying the Lord who bought them. I've decided to spend more time trying to get them to see the error of their ways, and kill two birds with one stone. Once they see the truth, they won't have any choice but to join the battle, or at least ONE WOULD HOPE!

I am really glad to see http://whtt.org back online. I spent a few maddening hours last week, after I found the d'd internet had banned him for the THIRD TIME, trying to find out what had precipitated it. I was so angry last week, I didn't think we'd ever see him again. I saw this thread late last night, and so jumped over to his site and spent a couple of hours going over it.

I had read last week that he though that THIS is the article that precipitated his banning:

Why doesn’t God end our Serial Wars? - Charles E. Carlson Mar 18, 2006

http://www.whtt.org/index.php ?news=2&id=767

[It included THIS story: Visiting a Mosque By Tom Compton http://www.whtt.org/index.php ?news=2&id=753 ], which makes a lie out of the "evil Islam" mantra of the Neo-cons. I'm sure they don't want THIS story to get out there, so spread it far and wide.]

See also this letter which explains the trouble they have been having with censorship [it includes the names of 90 ISP providers]:

http://www.whtt.org/index.php ?news=2&id=827

There was an interesting blurb at the bottom of Carlson's letter!

"Full text of letter resulting in the multiple complaints from one person:

Dr. Gordon Ginn, Wednesday night, May 10, 2006, on the NEW TESTAMENT BOOK OF ROMANS CHAPTER 13

70 million people have been told in their churches that this one Bible Chapter justifies America’s warring in the Middle East. DOES IT? http://www.whtt.org/live/

Remember Romans 13 is what the Fascists in GW's CorpUSA are going around and telling Pastors to use to instruct their flocks to obey, when CorpUSA brings on Martial Law and transports them to the concentration camps.

Please see Romans 13, the Higher Liberty

http://www.hisholychurc h.net/sermon/Romans13.html

I agree with Chuck Carlson that we need to spend more time making Christians, particularly those we love and cherish, to see their error [Matthew 23; II Peter 2], in order to save them from the fire, and to put a stop to all this senseless and evil killing in the name of Christ. After all, it is what He told us to do: PREACH THE GOSPEL.

"Is not my WORD AS A FIRE that hammereth the rock INTO PIECES?"

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2006-06-07   12:58:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt, Zipporah, rowdee (#8)

I am really glad to see http://whtt.org back online. I spent a few maddening hours last week, after I found the d'd internet had banned him for the THIRD TIME, trying to find out what had precipitated it. I was so angry last week, I didn't think we'd ever see him again. I saw this thread late last night, and so jumped over to his site and spent a couple of hours going over it.

I had read last week that he though that THIS is the article that precipitated his banning:

Why doesn’t God end our Serial Wars? - Charles E. Carlson Mar 18, 2006

http://www.whtt.org/index.php ?news=2&id=767

Thanks for this info, very interesting.

No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. – James Madison

robin  posted on  2006-06-07   14:26:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: robin (#9)

You're very welcome. I also found it interesting that last week, this article had been pretty much cleansed off the web, and I was only able to get a partial cached version of it. There was a rant posted here a week or two ago, and the Jewish person who wrote it was castigating Christians who were trying to convert the Jews. He said we had plenty of apostate Christians, especially Protestants to preach to, and we were free to do it. One of the cached articles I found by Chuck Carlson offered an invitation to tune into his website for Bible Study, and as he said in his letter, he was obviously NOT FREE to preach to the apostate Christians, since his website had been shut down.

They have taken down the ukar.org site, and a cached article I pulled down a couple of weeks ago has also been taken down. A tax freedom site, preaching very legit articles, has been taken down lock, stock, and barrel, and the website owner is in jail, probably on trumped up charges. They've thrown a minister or two in jail for refusing to go under the State, and it never seems to end with these people.

I hope Chuck Carlson sues big-time. As I said, I am happy he is online again, and greatly relieved. Every time this happens, I worry about the person's safety. These are serious times.

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2006-06-07   14:56:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#10)

They have taken down the http://ukar.org site, and a cached article I pulled down a couple of weeks ago has also been taken down. A tax freedom site, preaching very legit articles, has been taken down lock, stock, and barrel, and the website owner is in jail, probably on trumped up charges.

They harassed http://cryptome.org once or twice. But, I hadn't heard about these websited before.

No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. – James Madison

robin  posted on  2006-06-07   15:17:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: robin, AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt, Zipporah (#9)

From what I've just finished reading in O.T. prophesy, we aren't going to have peace--it is not in man's nature--until the return of Jesus Christ. He's supposed to rule over a peaceful world. But the article is interesting reading, nonetheless.

rowdee  posted on  2006-06-07   20:47:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#8)

or at least ONE WOULD HOPE!

that is a key phrase.

Red Jones  posted on  2006-06-07   22:11:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#8)

I'm skeptical that the people will make things right. I think it is foolish to think the people will fix things. The failure of the humans is on display now for all to see. we put our faith in man to fix things and we idolize man. Man is a failure in attempts to rule the earth, but people are lured into believing in man rather than god. that is what's happening.

I think that 'our' serial wars will be ended. I put in quotes because it is not really our wars, we don't want these wars, we did not create them, it is those who rule our nation that did these things, these wars are their wars.

the serial wars will be ended when the 10 kingdoms that empower, enable and serve babylon get sick of babylon and then plot against it and attack ferociously. that is when babylon's wars will be ended.

I recall in Matthew 24 we are instructed that these things must happen and that we should not be worried over it. When we worry too much, we try to fix things of our own power, etc., we are doing what we are told not to do.

I recall also that early in the book of Daniel (perhaps chapter 3) there is a story about 3 believers thrown into a furnace and yet they do not burn. I think that story is meant for american believers. because we will face the abomination that destroys babylon in one hours' time. the one we serve is powerful enough and able to protect us from harm during that time, and if he chooses to do so, then he will.

we americans have a very special place in god's schemes. Let us not forget. and let us not be sad over the difficulty of our path.

all through the bible there are many many many verses warning that the day will come when god will take vengeance. and so many 'christians' say that all of those verses just don't apply. the day of judgement and of god's vengeance is coming. we must steady ourselves in preparation as it says in ephesians 6, with breastplate of righteousness etc. we must not be deceived into thinking that 'we' can solve these problems. and instead look to the one who can.

Red Jones  posted on  2006-06-07   22:26:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#10)

hope Chuck Carlson sues big-time.

I wish I knew where it says in the bible not to sue people in courts due to the fact that injustice is in the courts run by man. I think it is in the early 'law of Moses' part, but it could be in proverbs or somewhere else in OT.

I mean really, justice in man's court - that is a joke.

and you try to tell people about how censorship is occurring, how some journalists are having problems, that apparently fascism is occurring to some people, and people think you're crazy.

Red Jones  posted on  2006-06-07   22:31:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: rowdee, Robin, Diana, Red Jones, Lodwick, christine, BTP Holdings, All (#12)

From what I've just finished reading in O.T. prophesy, we aren't going to have peace--it is not in man's nature--until the return of Jesus Christ.

There are at least two schools of thought on this, and some days I see it one way, and other days I see it the other.

One verse that keeps coming to mind is:

1Jo 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/1Jo/1Jo004.html#4

This would, IMO, imply that He will put all enemies under His feet, THROUGH US.

Note some related passages:

1Jo 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, [even] our faith.

Rom 8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

Eph 6:10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.

Rev 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/1Jo/4/4.html

Another verse is this one [Note we are to WRESTLE against the powers of this world]:

Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places].

From the concordance: WRESTLE

1) wrestling (a contest between two in which each endeavours to throw the other, and which is decided when the victor is able to hold his opponent down with his hand upon his neck)

a) the term is transferred to the Christian's struggle with the power of evil

As I read this I remembered this:

Who is true Israel today? Christians. Galatians 3 and 4, etc.

Where did the name Israel come from?

Gen 32:24 And Jacob was left alone; and there WRESTLED a man with him until the breaking of the day.

Gen 32:25 And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he WRESTLED with him......

Gen 32:28 And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.

http://www.bluelett erbible.org/kjv/Gen/Gen032.html#28

From the Treasury of Scripture Knowledge at BLB:

Israel "i.e., a prince of God. as a prince. Or, according to the LXX., Vulgate, Houbigant, Dathe, and Rosenmuller, ""because thou hast power with God, thou shalt also prevail with men."" There is a beautiful antithesis between the two terms, with [Elohim] Elohim, god, the Almighty, with [anashim] anashim, weak, feeble men, as the word imports; seeing thou hast had power with the Almighty, surely thou shalt prevail over perishing mortals."

[BTW, Jacob means heel-catcher; SUPPLANTER ]. See related passages:

http://www.blueletter bible.org/tsk_b/Gen/32/28.html

Remember the parable of the ten talents. Luke 19. We are each to use whatever talents he gave us to contend for His kingdom on earth. IMO, THIS COUNTRY is the CITY of HIS kingdom, which is the whole earth. Remember He said My kingdom is not NOW of this world, world there meaning that country, that government, that OLD WORLD ORDER of things. He came to MAKE ALL THINGS NEW: new covenant, new people, new city [TRUE New World Order]. There is a cute bumper sticker that says, Jesus is coming. Look busy. We have to contend right up unto the time He steps back onto the stage.

Note these verses at Luke 19:12-13:

12 He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return. 13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, OCCUPY TILL I COME.

I just looked up the word "occupy" in Strong's concordance, Greek #4231. It said "...from 4229; to busy oneself with, i.e. TO TRADE - OCCUPY." Strong's #4229 said "...from 4238,; a deed; by impl. and affair; by exten. an object (material); - business, matter, thing, work." Strong's #4238 said "...a primary verb; to "practice", i.e. perform repeatedly or habitually [thus differing from 4160, which prop. refers to a single act); by impl. to execute, accomplish, etc.; spec. to collect (dues), fare (personally); - commit, deeds, do, exact, keep, require, use arts.

It sounds like we are to be ACTIVELY INVOLVED in building His kingdom on earth [See Micah 4:13], otherwise we could be called an unfaithful servant who bore no fruit. We are to accomplish this goal, not by murder and deceit and thievery, as they do, but maybe by, first and foremost of all, preaching the gospel, and secondly, by taking their game and "hitting them over the head with it". See the parable of the fish and the coin and paying unto Caesar. I have come to see that one as taking the fraudulent debt Caesar has put on us, and trading it for freedom and wealth in order to take their ill-gotten gain [under the Merchant Marine Babylonian Codes they have set up] and consecrate it to the LORD of the whole earth. Search Links to Educate at wealth4freedom.com. We are perhaps to do this until He comes. When he comes, note: there will be NO MORE the Canaanite in the House of the Lord. [Zechariah 14:21]. Canaanite is the same word as MERCHANT in the concordance. See hisholychurch.net for a slightly different view. I think he sees us using the UCC agreement once to come out of their system, but not to use it again. I am still working through all that.

He may allow them to start killing us. We wouldn't be the first. I don't know. Judgment begins at the House of God, and the House has returned to vomit. II Peter 2. And I am with you all, I tend to believe there is a point where He says, enough is enough, when our power is gone, and He will step in to rescue us from those who hate us, and so that the HEATHEN WILL KNOW THAT HE IS GOD:

http://www.bluelett erbible.org/kjv/Eze/Eze038.html#18

God uses good people and evil people to accomplish his purposes. What is that verse "What if I raise up people of my wrath in order to show my mercy and goodness to the people of my choice" [totally paraphrased as my computer is on the verge of freezing, and I can't look it up. As He raised up Pharoah, for instance.] He may use evil people to destroy each other as He did in II Chronicles 20:

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/2Ch/2Ch020.html#11

But at any rate, I do not think we should let Him come and find us sitting on our hands. I don't think He would be too pleased with that.

Now here is another viewpoint, and it is a more Christ-like viewpoint. [I admit, I do tend to get caught up in hating them for all the pure evil they do.] It is leaving with me a lot to think about today. I will probably have to go back and read it again, because I think she may see all these people who do such evil being saved in the 1000 year millenium. I believe the 1000 years is symbolic, and I believe we are living in them now, so that would tend to make me come to a different conclusion than she.

See:

WHAT HAPPENS AT THE JUDGEMENT

http://www.goodnewsaboutgod.com/studies/judgment2.htm

More TOPICS [SEE ALSO WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU DIE? In order for the dead to be raised, this evil world AS WE KNOW IT must end. I believe it will be fairly soon.]

http://www.goodnewsaboutgod.com/topics.htm

WHAT ABOUT THIS OLD TESTAMENT "KILLER GOD?" [this one even mentions HAARP]

http://www.goodnewsaboutgod.com/studies/otkillergod.htm

[I have read this twice before, and this is the first time I have noticed that is was written by Dr. Day. I am really impressed!]

***** See this one. This one is most relevant to this thread, [and note the "Rapture Hoax" of earlier times. Nothing is new under the sun]:

"....****Today we can recognize the FALSE PROPHETS of Evangelical Christianity by the same unqualified assertions of divine election and restoration for the modern State of Israel.****

Fortunately, some Bible scholars are now beginning to recognize the fact that the Old Testament as a whole is NOT primarily Israel-centered, but Messiah- centered, Christ-centered. The heart of Israel’s prophetic and historic mission is Christ, NOT Israel! After all, Jesus said in John 5:39:

You search the Scriptures; for in them you think you have eternal life: but they (the Old Testament Scriptures) are they which testify of Me!”

The entire Old Testament is about Jesus, the coming Messiah, which is fulfilled in the New Testament. This reveals that we can understand the prophecies of the Bible properly ONLY when we relate the predictions to God and to His Messiah, Jesus Christ. (see 2 Cor 1:20)

Those who refer to themselves as “New Testament” Christians are sorely misled in their interpretation of prophecy precisely because they DO NOT understand that a thorough knowledge of the Old Testament is critical in understanding the New Testament. “New Testament” Christians believe the Old Testament is “for the Jews,” but the Old Testament is actually ALL ABOUT Christ! It is NOT Israel-centered!

False prophets preach of a god who is fundamentally different from Israel’s Redeemer and Ruler, a god who does not require the moral obedience and repentance the Lord insists on in His Torah (see Deut. 30:1-10). The false prophet “has tried to turn you from the way the Lord your God commanded you to follow” (Deut. 13:5).

Jesus even warned, “For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect--if possible” (Matt 24:24).

“Just as false prophecy in the Old Testament had as its sole emphasis God’s promises of peace, while ignoring the conditional aspects of Israel’s moral return to the Lord, so false prophecy in the Christian era stands identified by its failure to connect God’s covenant promises to Israel with faith in Jesus as the Christ. This is now God’s irrevocable condition for the fulfillment of prophecy......"

"....The principle of a geographic literalism that maintains that physical Jerusalem is still the center of prophetic fulfillment makes old territorial boundaries the fulfillment of prophecy instead of Christ Jesus. The person of Christ is, however, the real “holy place.” Jesus Himself declared that “one greater than the Temple is here!” (Matt 12:6; Luke 17:20,21; John 4:21-24)

Consequently, ONLY a Christ-centered interpretation of Old Testament promises, NOT literalism, NOT an Israel-centered interpretation, is biblically correct.

This study clearly demonstrates, based on biblical documentation, that the loudly heralded and massively followed Evangelical Christian leaders who preach prophetic interpretations that are Israel-centered, rather than Christ- centered, are False Prophets! They interpret the Bible prophecies as focused on Israel, rather than on Christ!

They have replaced Christ as the Messiah, with the nation of Israel! According to their interpretation of Scripture, the present-day nation of Israel has become the “Messiah”!

The Bible clearly states that when someone, or some group, replaces Christ, they are the ANTICHRIST! Therefore, the present-day nation of Israel, according to Evangelical Christian prophetic interpretation, is the ANTICHRIST! " Please Read All:

Excerpt HOW TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN TRUE AND FALSE PROPHECY

http://www.goodnewsaboutgod.com/studies/spiritual/revelations/true_false_prophec y.htm

Very interesting stuff. I don't know about you, but I have a lot of friends and relatives to set straight. I could send them links from this site [which they probably wouldn't read. I have read that most people will only read printed matter that is put into their hands. OR, I could send them a book or two from Chuck Carlson's website. Or, both.]

Strengthening the church, and bringing new believers in is the LAST THING they want from us, In fact, it is their ACHILLES HEEL. As one of their rabbis said:

"....Let us, above all, make it impossible for Christians to be reunited, or for non-Christians to join the Church; otherwise the greatest obstruction to our domination will be strengthened and all our work undone. Our plot will be unveiled, the Gentiles will turn against us, in the spirit of revenge, and our domination over them will never be realized. Let us remember that as long as there still remain active enemies of the Christian Church, we may hope to become Master of the World . . . And let us remember always that the future Jewish King will never reign in the world before Christianity is overthrown . . . " (London Catholic Gazette, February, 1936; and in Paris Le Reveil du Peuple). luther.htm"

Maybe our victory all depends on one word: LOVE [very difficult for me when I see all the dispicable deeds they continue to commit, but we were given our marching orders and His ways are not always ours],

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/1Jo/4/11.html

and overcoming evil with good:

Rom 12:17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.

Rom 12:18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

Rom 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but [rather] give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance [is] mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

Rom 12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

Rom 12:21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Rom/Rom012.html#21

Jhn 13:35 By this shall all [men] know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Jhn 21:17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, [son] of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

Rom 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to [his] purpose.

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, [even] in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

vs. this:

1Ti 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. [Feed my sheep??]

I have a lot of things to sort out.

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2006-06-10   12:52:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Red Jones (#15)

I wish I knew where it says in the bible not to sue people in courts due to the fact that injustice is in the courts run by man. I think it is in the early 'law of Moses' part, but it could be in proverbs or somewhere else in OT.

I mean really, justice in man's court - that is a joke.

I hear you. I think I have come across the same passage.

There are two court systems in this country, for now. One is the Merchant Marine court [see GET THAT GOLD FRINGE OFF MY FLAG], and the other is the common law court under the ORIGINAL Constitution. The Merchant Marine Court is under CorpUSA's constitution [see ACT OF 1871 - Congress Passes an Act to Provide a Government for the District of Columbia.]. Some wise and educated people [I am not one of them, yet] know how to get their day in courts OF THE PEOPLE. See Links to Educate at http://wealth4freedom.com and also see the book SUI JURIS at http://avoiceforchildren.com for more information about how all of this works.

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2006-06-10   13:02:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: Red Jones (#17)

see ACT OF 1871 - Congress Passes an Act to Provide a Government for the District of Columbia

Sorry. Forgot the link. Pardon me, but was it you I was talking to? My computer is freezing up on me, and I am trying to tie up loose ends and shut it down. Apologies.

http://www.worldnewssta nd.net/history/1871Act.htm

AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt  posted on  2006-06-10   14:50:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: AllTheKings'HorsesWontDoIt (#18)

This link refers to US Code Title 28 3002(15)(a)(b)(c)

A look at the Cornell Law site has a title page for TITLE 28 as follows:

TITLE 28—JUDICIARY AND JUDICIAL PROCEDURE

PART I—ORGANIZATION OF COURTS PART II—DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE PART III—COURT OFFICERS AND EMPLOYEES PART IV—JURISDICTION AND VENUE PART V—PROCEDURE PART VI—PARTICULAR PROCEEDINGS

And a Title and Section search brings up definitions used in these various Parts. TITLE 28 3002 (15) (A)(B)(C) are as follows:

(15) “United States” means— (A) a Federal corporation; (B) an agency, department, commission, board, or other entity of the United States; or (C) an instrumentality of the United States.

rowdee  posted on  2006-06-10   19:48:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest


[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Sign-in]  [Mail]  [Setup]  [Help]