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Title: Ranchers Add Ladders to Border Fences
Source: Tampa Bay Online/AP
URL Source: http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie ... _LADDERS?SITE=FLTAM&SECTION=US
Published: Jun 17, 2006
Author: LYNN BREZOSKY
Post Date: 2006-06-17 10:18:45 by Dakmar
Keywords: None
Views: 659
Comments: 55

FALFURRIAS, Texas (AP) -- A few Texas ranchers tired of costly repairs to cattle fences damaged by illegal immigrants have installed an easier route over the U.S.-Mexican border - ladders.

"It's an attempt to get them to use the ladders instead of tearing the fences," said Scott Pattinson, who owns one of a group of ranches known as La Copa.

La Copa is just south of a U.S. Border Patrol highway checkpoint that went up 75 miles from the border several years ago, sending migrants through the brambly scrub of nearby ranches instead.

Some immigrants walk for hours or days to skirt the checkpoints in temperatures hovering around 100 degrees. Their feet have worn visible paths through a forest of cactus and mesquite otherwise thick enough to conceal them from Border Patrol helicopters overhead and agents only a few hundred yards away.

The paths lead from one ripped-down section of fencing to another. Texas ranches can be so large it could be days before owners notice the hole in the fence, long after the livestock possibly escapes.

Paul Johnson protects his 2,700-acre exotic game ranch of zebras, scimitar-horned oryx and wildebeests with about 10 miles of high wire fence, and joined his neighbors in placing ladders along the way.

But apparently some immigrants think the ladders are too good to be true.

"They ignore it a lot," Johnson said. "They're afraid that they're monitored by the Border Patrol."

Johnson plans to take the ladders down, worried about the message he's sending.

"I think what it does is give a signal that we are wanting them to cross there, don't mind the crossing, and that kind of magnifies the problem," he said.

Rancher Michael Vickers never liked the ladder idea and instead has ringed his fence with 220 volts of electricity.

"I've had a dose of it myself, it's not fun," he said. "That's just my attitude, why make it easier for them to trespass?"

© 2006 The Associated Press.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 47.

#5. To: Dakmar (#0)

Electricity is the way to go. Up the voltage.

mehitable  posted on  2006-06-17   12:19:43 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: mehitable (#5)

I suspect it won't be long before they drag his ass off to prison and give his ranch to some dumbass who got injured.

Dakmar  posted on  2006-06-17   12:22:28 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Dakmar (#6)

Maybe so, but you've got to make a stand somewhere. Otherwise, they're just gonna run you off your land in the long run anyway. I say, up the voltage to lethal and fry 'em. They wouldn't be able to press charges, so it would put the US govt in the position of pressing charges on their behalf. Lethal is the way to go.

mehitable  posted on  2006-06-17   12:26:39 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: mehitable (#7)

Nothing they do deserves the death penalty. Period. You are foolish for even going there, but I'm glad you do because it is very revealing about much the problem with the mindset vilifying Mexicans in such a distorted and out of context manner.

Ferret Mike  posted on  2006-06-17   12:31:31 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Ferret Mike (#8)

Nonsense. They are foreign invaders - both invading into THIS country and destroying people's private property and endangering their welfare. I have no problem with killing an invader. That's why we have an army. I would say the same thing if it were happening on the Canadian side of the border. The fact that they are Mexican is irrelevant to me.

mehitable  posted on  2006-06-17   12:36:36 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: mehitable (#9)

There is a protocol that should never be violated in regards to the use of deadly force. If someone is directly threatening you with harm or home entry where you are unarguably in fear of your life that is one thing.

But people passing through private property who are demonstrably by virtue of having done this for quite some time can be detained and prosecuted for trespassing, but not murdered out of hand.

I traded posts with one character who thinks Waffen SS-like death teams should fan out and murder Mexicans like the Nazis did to the Jewish people in a new "Crystalnacht," (the night of the shattered glass). But I do not support such fascistic tactics or utter disregard for human life.

I say anyone murdering another in cold blood are subject to be stopped if it takes their deaths to stop their murderous intent. That is part of the protocol of the use of deadly force too, that those committing murder risk death themselves if they do not put down their weapons and cease and desist in acts of cold blooded murder.

Most Mexicans are decent, hard working people and are not inhuman vermin. Killing on the border or in country has an awful fuzzy line and if you start doing one the other would quickly ensue.

Then the rest of our reputation and any good feeling for us in the international community would be wiped away along with that Bush has destroyed. You are very wrong in your position and it demonstrates much the flaws in he scapegoating of Mexicans rather then going after the real criminals; those high level business and political leaders who enticed them in in the first place to pit them against the American worker to destroy his or her income and standard of living.

Ferret Mike  posted on  2006-06-17   12:51:53 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Ferret Mike (#12)

But people passing through private property who are demonstrably by virtue of having done this for quite some time can be detained and prosecuted for trespassing, but not murdered out of hand.

The problem is that they are not being prosecuted.

I need my car to get to work. If some idiot decided to slash my tires some night, I'll call the police. After twenty nights of it happening with nothing being done I would be justified in killing them, as it's either them or me.

Dakmar  posted on  2006-06-17   13:00:36 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: Dakmar (#17)

Bad analogy, and if you did murder someone who did not put you in immediate jeopardy of your life, you are liable for prosecution and to be quite successfully sued in civil court.

Human life is worth more then property. Period.

Ferret Mike  posted on  2006-06-17   13:02:34 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Ferret Mike (#18)

Human life is worth more then property. Period.

Human life depends on property, which is why we see so many Mexicans risking their lives to come here.

DuQuoigne  posted on  2006-06-17   17:52:58 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: DuQuoigne (#41)

Human life depends on property, which is why we see so many Mexicans risking their lives to come here.

touche!

Failure to understand that basic right is the root of all political problems, which are in turn the root of most socio-economic problems. Who gets to be boss becomes a bitch when the field is opened up to everyone regardless of actual claims to title, established law, or any of that other stuff wealthy communists teach their minions to screech before their tv cameras.

Welcome to 4um.

Dakmar  posted on  2006-06-17   18:14:08 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: Dakmar (#43)

"Failure to understand that basic right is the root of all political problems, which are in turn the root of most socio-economic problems. Who gets to be boss becomes a bitch when the field is opened up to everyone regardless of actual claims to title, established law, or any of that other stuff wealthy communists teach their minions to screech before their TV cameras."

The clear claim to a land title is in jeopardy with the recent ruling concerning eminent domain, and how commercial use trumps anything else regarding who owns the land. Seems to me that is is an example of a far larger problem then border runners passing through ranch land without leave to do so.

Above and beyond that example how case law puts land ownership in the tenuous category, we have problems with many land owners not caring about how that they do affects the overall values and rights of the community at large. We not only need to worry about real issues concerning what others do that hurt property owner's rights, but how property owners can hurt the rights of others with what they do with the land.

It is not an easy issue to reduce to slogans and buzz words - which is entirely my point here.

Ferret Mike  posted on  2006-06-17   18:22:46 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: Ferret Mike (#45)

It is not an easy issue to reduce to slogans and buzz words - which is entirely my point here.

That's fine, but you are the one arguing the merits of humanitarianism versus the specific details of this story.

Dakmar  posted on  2006-06-17   18:25:47 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 47.

#48. To: Dakmar (#47)

I wasn't the one who put property way above concern for human life. I wasn't the one that ignored the consequences of such actions.

I would rather see a higher more impenetrable fence and better protection through U.S. Border Patrol enforcement then see human life so callously cheapened that people are shot or electrocuted like they were vermin.

That is quite germane to the topic in the thread. I fail to see what your gripe with a high value in regards to human life here is.

Ferret Mike  posted on  2006-06-17 18:33:47 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 47.

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