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Title: White Supremacists Ratchet Up Anti-Hispanic Action As U.S. Immigration Debate Rages
Source:
www.adl.org
URL Source: http://www.adl.org/PresRele/Extremism_72/4822_72.htm
Published: Jun 22, 2006
Author: staff
Post Date: 2006-06-22 12:38:17 by Ferret Mike
Keywords: None
Views: 4611
Comments: 192
New York, NY, May 24, 2006 … As the national debate over immigration continues to hold the national spotlight, neo-Nazis and white supremacists have ratcheted up their anti-Hispanic action, using everything from Internet video games to street demonstrations and other confrontational tactics in an effort to exploit the debate as a means to spread hate. Their goal is to draw new attention to their hateful notions about minorities and hopes for making America a nation for "Whites only." The Anti-Defamation League (ADL), which monitors and reports on the activities of far-right extremists, has updated its online report, "Extremists Declare 'Open Season' on Immigrants" with new information showing that extremists continue to focus their energies on Hispanic hate-mongering through racist rhetoric, crude stereotypes, and threats of using violence to intimidate illegal immigrants. "As we have gotten deeper into the discussion on immigration, the white supremacist movement has reinvigorated itself and closed ranks around the cause of fighting immigration and turning America into a nation for 'Whites only'", said Abraham H. Foxman, ADL National Director. "The immigration debate has provided the perfect storm for America's white supremacist fringe to recruit, organize and sow the seeds of racial discord and hate." On the Internet, right-wing extremists have championed video games such as "Border Patrol," where the aim is to shoot to kill Mexicans as they attempt to cross the border, and used their Web sites to spread hateful anti-Hispanic messages. In the real world, white supremacist leaders have organized protests and encouraged their followers to act violently against immigrants or anyone of Hispanic origin. Anti-Hispanic Violence ADL's report cites two recent incidents as the latest in a multi-year trend of increasing violence targeting Hispanics: •A teenager was arrested in East Hampton, Long Island, on April 29 after he allegedly threatened a Hispanic teenager with a machete and chased a second teenager with a chain saw while shouting racial epithets. Described by classmates as a skinhead, the alleged perpetrator had posted to the Internet photographs of himself posing as a Nazi and adorning a shed with swastikas. •David Henry Tuck, 18, and Keith Robert Turner, 17, were arrested and charged with aggravated sexual assault in the brutal April 22 attack of a teenage Hispanic high school student in Houston. The victim was beaten and sodomized with a plastic pipe from a patio umbrella, then kicked in the head with steel-toed boots. White Supremacist Protests In recent weeks, white supremacists have organized protests, rallies and other events across the country: •In Seattle, Washington, and Las Vegas, Nevada, members of the neo-Nazi National Vanguard held anti-immigration protests on May 20. On its Web site, the National Vanguard declared that day to be a "day of protest against George W. Bush's plan to destroy America," calling the president's immigration proposals a "sellout of the nation." •In Keene, New Hampshire, New England members of the Arkansas-based neo-Nazi group White Revolution held a self-described "anti-invasion" demonstration on May 7 to protest "the invasion of America by illegal non white hordes.' •In Russellville, Alabama, members of the Alabama chapter of the Indiana-based National Knights of the Ku Klux Klan held an anti-immigration rally on May 6, yelling "Let's get rid of the Mexicans!" After the rally, the Klansmen burned a cross in a field outside of town. •In Montgomery, Alabama, the neo-Confederate group League of the South and the Coalition against Illegal Immigration together organized an anti-immigration "Cinco de Mayo" demonstration on May 5. The event was promoted in the racist and anti-Semitic newspaper, "First Freedom." •In Greenville, South Carolina, the racist Council of Conservative Citizens held an anti-immigration demonstration on April 29 in front of the offices of Republican Congressman Lindsey Graham, where they burned Mexican flags and displayed signs such as "More INS, Less IRS," "Vote for Pedro to Go Home," and "I Didn't Fight in Iraq for Illegal Aliens."
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#118. To: bluegrass (#114)
Bullshit. The historical fact is incontrovertible. The game Holocaust deniers play is to cast aspersions on well documented fact with hide the peas in the shell verbiage to try to obscure it to justify a return to the good old days of pogroms against scapegoated Jewish people. The facts are in the way of effective use of a favorite wedge issue and you don't like it. Anti Shoah advocacy is an assault against the historic record to further an agenda of hatred. The fact you can't handle the truths your problem, not the world's.
Gee, that means allot coming from a fella that gets an orgasm looking at Adolf Hitler's picture.
Precisely my point concerning your game. It's a scripted program selling the snake oil of fascism and the bigotry of Jew baiting and hating.
What I wrote is the truth. What you wrote is not.
Freeper motto: "I read, but do not understand; I write, but make no sense."
I rebuted your sad foggy words trying to repair Hitler's image and you didn't answer that post because you couldn't. You counldn't because the facts go against the lie that Hitler had done good by the German people you had posted that I refuted.
You refuted nothing. Usually I don't answer you because 99% of the time you don't know what you're talking about. By the way, nearly everyone here will agree with my opinion of you.
Freeper motto: "I read, but do not understand; I write, but make no sense."
Translation: You can't refute the historic facts I cited so you are vainly trying to declare victory and retreat. My opinion of your speaking for everyone else is zero hero. Cry me a river.
Go to the post and refute it if you think you can screw up the courage. You are a racist and a baiter and hater and talk of Mexicans as "as failed race as they should be." I call bullshit on you and say you are a failed interlocutor that doesn't have balls and runs from a verbal scrap.
(2). The Jewish people have suffered a broad spectrum of Anti-Semitic tactics and efforts to destroy, harass and harm them since the country disappeared centuries ago. (3). In light of the six million Jews and other peoples who died due to the Nazi German genocide, it is logical to end a major vulnerability of the Jewish people and re-create Israel. (4). I am even more deeply unhappy however with a continuation of the poison or anti- Semitism unabated from the days before World War II, and I would never ,ever drop my support of Israel's existence in large part because of it. (1). Are you of the opinion that the State of Israel's legitimacy is based upon an alleged promise that God made to Abraham that is noted in Scripture ? (And are you an Ashkenazi Jew ?) (2). Right, there's been a worldwide conspiracy of bigots that have allowed the "persecuted" Jew into their country simply to further the persecution. Whaaa, every nation that has been forced to expel the Jew was wicked and the Jew was good. (3). Much evidence exists today demonstrating collusion between the hierarchy of Zionism and the Nazis that resulted in the deaths of lesser brethern Jews for the sake of establishing a State of Israel in which people that had no historic or ethnic relation to claim would be allowed to murder and kill innocents in order to establish the Terrorist State of Israel. I personally think they are one and the same, with similar beliefs and methods of operation. Zio-Nazis ! (4). Ashkenazi Jews descend from Japeth not Shem [Genesis 10:3]. Today, the Ashkenazi make up 92% or more of modern Jewry according to the Encyclopedia Judaica. The term semetic indicates descendancy from Shem. The Ashkenazi aren't even semetic ! The Ashkenazi were known as Khazarians and they converted to Judaism (Talmudism) in 750 AD. There is no proveable link between Abraham and the Ashkenazi Jews. Modern day Jews and Christians have been deceived by their respective leadership. 1st, the land was promised to 12 Tribes, not the interbred portion of one. 2nd. The Ashkenazi converted to Judaism long after the alleged promise was made to Abraham a descendant of Shem, not Japeth. And lastly, in a modern secular world, where a great deal of the international community embrace a variety of religious views based upon other texts than the Scriptures, it is beyond ludicrous to even imagine displacing through genocide a people that have lived in Palestine for thousands of years, based upon an unwitnessed promise made by an invisible God to a man that lived 4000 years ago. And here's the straw that breaks the camel's balls, this fraud we call the State of Israel is the creation of Lord Rothschild (you know the criminal banking cabal) and Lord Balfour ie., the Balfour Proclamation, and implemented by the godless UN ... any professing Christian that could think anything good would fall from this poison tree is in derision and should have DUFAS stamped on their knucklehead. Think on this factoid Christian soldiers ... why is there NEVER any mention of a SYNAGOGUE in the Old Testament. Because the religion conducted in a SYNAGOGUE was never practiced by the Israelites, but descended upon Jerusalem/Palestine from BABYLON after the 2nd Captivity. Why is the SYNAGOGUE described in Revelation 2:9 and 3:9 as "THE SYNAGOGUE OF SATAN" ??? Wake up ! The State of Israel is central to the chaos that is intended to bring WW III into our living rooms. It is an artifice just like Rome and the Catholic Church, created to manage the masses and terrorize them to the benefit of the satanists ruling the planet.
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. Samuel Adams ... and I concur !
I highlighted the paragraph that describes the most compelling reason I support the existence of Israel. Without this state the Jewish people are cannon fodder against people like you whose anti-Semitism builds conspiracy theories and leverages genetic pedigrees to justify their use of the Jewish people as the scapegoat in their wedge issue building. To justify your racist aspirations for a White nationalist agenda of ethnic cleansing and even a separate state where the Constitution doesn't interfere with your demagoguery you need a focus to use to try to panic and scare people into accepting an agenda they normally wouldn't buy. The establishment was assured because people like you got in power in Germany and demonstrably showed what letting your anti-Semitism leads to if allowed to run it's full course. Six million people murdered by others like you call bullshit on your agenda of hating and baiting. ERETZ-ISRAEL [(Hebrew) - the Land of Israel, Palestine] was the birthplace of the Jewish people. Here their spiritual, religious and political identity was shaped. Here they first attained to statehood, created cultural values of national and universal significance and gave to the world the eternal Book of Books. After being forcibly exiled from their land, the people kept faith with it throughout their Dispersion and never ceased to pray and hope for their return to it and for the restoration in it of their political freedom. Impelled by this historic and traditional attachment, Jews strove in every successive generation to re-establish themselves in their ancient homeland. In recent decades they returned in their masses. Pioneers, ma'pilim [(Hebrew) - immigrants coming to Eretz-Israel in defiance of restrictive legislation] and defenders, they made deserts bloom, revived the Hebrew language, built villages and towns, and created a thriving community controlling its own economy and culture, loving peace but knowing how to defend itself, bringing the blessings of progress to all the country's inhabitants, and aspiring towards independent nationhood. In the year 5657 (1897), at the summons of the spiritual father of the Jewish State, Theodore Herzl, the First Zionist Congress convened and proclaimed the right of the Jewish people to national rebirth in its own country. This right was recognized in the Balfour Declaration of the 2nd November, 1917, and re-affirmed in the Mandate of the League of Nations which, in particular, gave international sanction to the historic connection between the Jewish people and Eretz-Israel and to the right of the Jewish people to rebuild its National Home. The catastrophe which recently befell the Jewish people - the massacre of millions of Jews in Europe - was another clear demonstration of the urgency of solving the problem of its homelessness by re-establishing in Eretz-Israel the Jewish State, which would open the gates of the homeland wide to every Jew and confer upon the Jewish people the status of a fully privileged member of the comity of nations. (continued in link) Blah, blah, blah ... Nothing good has ever come from the State of Israel, the Rothschild's or the UN ... you are either a shill or a complete dufas ! Maurice de Hirsch (A so-called Jew) established a Trust with 50,000,000 dollars for the purpose of assisting Russian Jews (Babylonians) migrate to the U.S. and Palestine in 1887 "TEN YEARS PRIOR TO HERZL'S ZIO-NAZI CONVENTION of 1897" ... Maurice de Hirsch was a "BANKER" ...
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. Samuel Adams ... and I concur !
A followup to my last. East asians are on average slightly more intelligent and less violent than most Americans. Does it therefore follow that there should be no limit on the rate of immigration from east asia? Ray Nagin has a point. There is nothing wrong with honey. There is also nothing wrong with aversion to honey in one's chocolate shake. Enough honey, and it won't really be a chocolate shake anymore.
Okay, here's the other thing you don't seem to get (because you'd rather just blame white people for their past misdeeds). Guess what - we can BOTH hate corporatists and want to restrict their behaviors that are having such a negative impact on America AND want to send the Mexicans back to their homeland. There is no conflict between these two ideas. We can believe in both and we could DO both if we had the political will. You are setting up a false dichotomy. Moreover, I am not ready to absolve the illegals from their responsibility for breaking our laws rather than straightening out THEIR OWN COUNTRY. THAT'S what they should be doing. Instead of marching in the streets of OUR country,where they should HAVE NO RIGHTS AT ALL, they should be marching in the streets of THEIR OWN COUNTRY, demanding change, and possibly rioting or accomplishing such change by violent means if that's the only thing that will be successful. They need to go back and fix their own countries. As long as the US exists as some magic safety valve that these corrupt countries can dump their poor on, these countries WILL NEVER CHANGE.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
Mike intentionally lays his agenda bare when he confuses illegals as migrants.
He has bought into the open border, kumbaya poison.
That's what I see, JT. I think Mike is indeed an open borders, globalist kind of guy. I can see no other explanation for his opinions. If we did things the way Mike wanted we'd have half of Mexico in here in no time (which he apparently thinks would be a good thing), and eventually there would no longer be a United States, Mexico, or Canada, but one North American Union. Well, I'll fight this till I die.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
Yep. His warped sense of compassion might get kudos from the internationalists, but his progeny, and ours, will be left a 3rd world slum as a nation. Cultural diversity is a foggy notion passed on to us by the same people who gave us forced busing, affirmative action, and the nanny state. It's a morphed socialism designed to destroy America. Sadly, it's working.
That's the bottom line. I actually like most people in general - most individuals, races, ethnic groups, whatever. But this is not a voluntary association. These people are being forced upon us and they're very different from us. Why are we supposed to like this and be nice to them and make room for them? I never did anything to these people and neither did my Canadian and New England forbears (did I spell that right?) This kumbayah crap is totally one sided. We're supposed to make room for them, and make life easier for them, and tolerate them and celebrate their diversity, meanwhile, they don't remotely do the same for us. They don't even do basic things like conduct their business in English. If you try to make them do that, they bring suit against you. Bleep this shit, momma didn't raise any weak minded, masochistic, guilt-ridden children.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
I'm also a hell of a lot smarter and knowledgeable than you. That's why I see through you. You're a hater, like all leftists. The smart understand the stupid a lot better than the stupid understand the smart. That's why I understand you but you don't understand me. I know the reason why; you don't.
Freeper motto: "I read, but do not understand; I write, but make no sense."
Not that you are egotistical or anything like that now, yes? If you are so smart, then back up your statement that Hitler did good for his people and refute the bad he did in the same time period you refereed to I talked about in my post. No, your statement here is just indicative of ego and delusion. Like ALL leftists, huh? Why do lovers of Bigotry aways talk about ALL, and do it in a modus fraught with allusions to conspiracy? The world is not starkly black and white, nor is it as two dimensional as you see it. Un huh...... Why don't you go see a psychologist about this problem, I'm here to talk politics, not handle your problems with megalomania.
All of history is open to question. That Germany targeted Jews is known, just as the Jewish/German Weimar Government's targeting of Gypsies in the 1920's is also known. If your primary interest is making sure that everyone agrees on six million dead people and gas chambers, whether through name calling or threat of legal action, methinks you're going to miss the finer points of history. Like Zionist cooperation with the Nazis. And Communist war crimes. And international corporate backing of the Nazis, the Communists and the Americans. My favorite trivia from the era: Max Warburg was the only director of I.G. Farben NOT prosecuted for war crimes. You do know the Warburgs, yes? I can find no evidence of mass death using gas chambers. Eisenhower, Churchill and DeGaulle neglected to mention them in their various accounts of WWII. If you can present actual physical and forensic evidence of mass deaths using gas chambers, then I might respect your faith in the "Story". BTW, have you ever read the Nuremberg transcripts? Do you actually believe the crap they were pushing at those trials, such as 20,000 Jews being incinerated in an atomic blast at Auschwitz?
"All of the rabbis appeared on my behalf, the ADL guy appeared on my behalf. Finally they voted to let me in." Isn’t is funny how the kumbayah crowd allows for Mexicans & other 3rd worlders to celebrate their nationalism - in our nation no less - but reject our desplay of American/white nationalism? The PC, double standard they employ would be comical if it weren’t so deadly, personally and nationally. As you said, bleep them. I hold no hope for those who demand that we open our borders to ‘migrants.’ They’re the enemy among us.
You use these words as cant and rhetoric, not as language meant to to convey meaning and opinion. It's at least the second time I've seen "snake oil" from you on this thread, and the others are stock words and phrases that you use to stop yourself from thinking. You won't confront your own brainwashing and youa accuse others of it. It's called "projection". Having once been a informational victim of the ADL (I got over it), I know the symptoms well.
"All of the rabbis appeared on my behalf, the ADL guy appeared on my behalf. Finally they voted to let me in." You won't confront the methodology of Holocaust denial to start with a premise that there was no Shoah and to work back wards to try to find evidence this is so. This is largely why your stuff has so little credibility. Despite having destroyed as much evidence to the Shoah as possible in the waining days of the ware, hundreds of thousand of documents still exist damning the Nazis in the implementation of their "final solution." I'll be back after work and and well interlocate some more in regards to the Shoah, but suffice it to say in light of the evidence, you are the on facing a daunting burden of proof problem, not those documenting what happened to millions of genocidal murdered people.
No one with reason intact can deny that innocent Jews suffered in the 1930's and 1940's. By the same token, no one with reason intact can assert that what happened went down the way the ADL and other B'nai B'rith fronts claim as there's no actual evidence for it. That same reason also gently instructs us that Jews were a fraction of the innocents that suffered. I grant no special dispensations to any group to claim a monopoly on suffering.
"All of the rabbis appeared on my behalf, the ADL guy appeared on my behalf. Finally they voted to let me in." JT, I'm sick of the double standard. I'm sicking of apologizing for 2000 years of European history. I can't help it if people in Africa are still carrying water from the local stream in baskets on their heads, or people in Backassastan are wearing the same clothes their great grandparents wore in the 14th hundreds. I'm sick of apologizing for progress. Without Western civilization there would be no America, and as flawed as it's become, it's still the best there is. I don't want to live in Mexico and I don't want Mexico moving to a neighborhood near me. I don't hate other people, or fear them (without reason). I don't care what color they are or what religion they practice - but STOP telling me that I owe them something or I should excuse myself for breathing because they live BLEEPED up lives in their own countries. Let them do something about it. You mean to tell me the Indians haven't found out about birth control yet? Or the South Americans? IF they want to believe the crap peddled by the Catholic Church that is their problem. I'm FED UP.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
Let me ask Mike my favorite question in order to determine the strength of his brainwashing. Mike you say 6 million jews perished in the holocaust during WWII, how many United States service men and women lost their lives? No googling or looking it up. I LOVE to ask that question to the sheeple. Oh by the way, I know the answer..
I have actually seen 'BORDER PATROL' t-shirts for sale on the net. The word 'UNDOCUMENTED' appears in very small letters under the BP logo. Thought I might pick one up to wear when I go the farmer's markets in North Carolina next month...should be interesting.
It's a real damn shame there aren't more women like you in this country...a damn shame.
Hey Me. I suppose Mike thinks it's just peachy that these migrants receive free education, medical care, a positive affirmative action position and a boat load of other entitlements. There's nothing like putting a sugar cube near an ant hill to attract pests.
He also can't answer how many people Jewish Bolshevists murdered, or why they shot everyone in the back of the head, while Germany, in a war for its life, decided to spend so much time, manpower and desperately needed energy murdering the (non-existent) Sacred Six Million by gassing them and then cremating them.
Freeper motto: "I read, but do not understand; I write, but make no sense."
Can't handle the truth, huh? Instead you respond with typical leftist hatred.
Freeper motto: "I read, but do not understand; I write, but make no sense."
Thank you, evil, I appreciate that. Actually there probably are a lot of people like me, male and female, but they're too afraid or beaten down to say anything. They've been made to feel bad or guilty about being from a white, European Christian background. Now I don't white wash things, and I know, of course, that white European Christians have done a lot of bad things. But...so has everyone else. Everyone has the capability of good and evil. I think we owe our country and our constitution and our legal system and system of government, to those white European Christians from whom it emerged. People all over the world may have strengths and weaknesses, but I would say this system that our ancestors created has been one of our greatest strengths and we should be proud of it.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
Well, Mike's a real lib. I'm sure he sees that the Mexicans are by and large, pretty poor people, and they have been exploited and abused. But he can't seem to work out that there are consequences to our just letting them pour into OUR country and change our country so that eventually large parts of it become just like theirs. That's the inevitable result when you let vast uncontrolled numbers of people in from one particular ethnic group. They don't change...they change the area they're in. That wouldn't be such a bad thing, maybe, if Mexico were a great place and well run. But it's not, and the Mexicans bring the same problems WITH them. Moreover, if we continue to care more for other people then we do for ourselves and the welfare and well-being of our own kids, then we won't have much, if anything left for ourselves, because that is a white liberal guilt thing. Other peoples DON'T have that mentality and would not hesitate to grab the last banana (so to speak) and let us starve. The generosity and tolerance WE are expected to show to others would not be shown to us. We can see this graphically when we compare Mexico's laws and practices (particularly regarding immigration) to ours. Actions have consequences. When you act like a sucker and give away your rights and wealth, people just take more. They lose respect for you. The Mexicans (and other illegals - I just focus on the Mexicans as they're such a large group and a unique problem because of our shared border) have demonstrated a complete lack of respect for our laws, sovereignty, language, customs, and people. We disregard that at our peril.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
He fails to recognize the organized design to this insanity. This invasion is driven by big religion, corporate America, and a unified political class driven by the CFR and their quest for a borderless North America. There’s no need to source their many white papers, we now the agenda, as does Mike. What Mike fails to see is the danger of the “tipping point.” When there are more minorities in America (I believe the year 2050 is projected as the tipping point) these now gardeners, cleaners and day laborers will no longer accept such positions. They’ll be in a position to dictate to us what they’ll do and when they’ll do it. On the plus side, I’ll be long dead….on the minus side, so will the nation.
I don't hate other people, or fear them (without reason). I don't care what color they are or what religion they practice - but STOP telling me that I owe them something or I should excuse myself for breathing because they live BLEEPED up lives in their own countries. Let them do something about it. You mean to tell me the Indians haven't found out about birth control yet? Or the South Americans? IF they want to believe the crap peddled by the Catholic Church that is their problem. I'm FED UP. A fair comment. Let's just remember that our wingnuts have had a great deal to do with their standard of living. We've assassinated their leaders, given billions in aid to fascists (see Reagan, Negroponte, El Salvador, Guatamala, et al), raped their economies, and used their people as a nearly free workforce. If I was a person working in a factory in Guatamala for $2 a day, 12 hours, no health insurance, I would beat feet to get here and earn $10 an hour with healthcare. And don't think for a minute that big business isn't cleverly advertising those jobs in the underground economy. Illegals know exactly which corporations won't ask questions, and people like Tyson are in DC gutting any serious attempt to force employers to do background checks. On NPR today, they found a guy who got a job at an unidentified company by using the SS number 666-66-6666. He was there for over two years. We have a right, just like every other country, to limit who enters our country. But we are in a fairly unique situation: the richest country in the world bordering one of the poorest, and that country borders many of the poorest countries in the world. There's an interesting model the Greeks came up with a long time ago. A whole town in Greece chips in and buys a diner or restaurant here. Young people, men mainly, work basically for free for several years to keep costs down. The profits are shipped back to the town, and everyone works for a few years, then goes home to get married and have a free house and live off the earnings of the diner. Latin Americans would probably go for a similar deal (a lot of them are doing it right now...a woman who owned two restaurants and shipped the profits home to her town in Mexico was recently deported in Illinois after a raid...but her town still owns the restaurants). Enforcement sounds great, but a more porous border would probably be better. Most Mexicans and Latinos really want to just earn some money and go back home. But since it is so hard to get over the border, they feel they can't risk it. I hate to agree with Bush about anything, but guest worker programs, enforced very strongly, is probably the best way to go. If someone really wants to stay here, make them go to the back of the line. But frankly, if you don't want to pay $13 for strawberries (or have our strawberry industry wiped out by Brazil and Mexico), undocumented workers are a necessity. A few months back, NPR had a series of reports on the so-called social conservatives. They had a bunch of church ladies from Plant City, Fla. on. They were spitting venom about democrats, gays and immigrants, and praising Bush as a godly man. One woman said, without irony, that she wanted to kick every illegal out of the country except the ones who pick her strawberries, because without them she would go broke. Most latinos are great family people who contribute to the communities they inhabit. I live in Chicago, and Mexicans here are generally very well-liked. There's a garden center right out my back door, and I am pretty sure most of the employees are illegals. The owner is a legal Mexican and a great guy. I rescued his brother, who was at a trade show here and was trying to figure out how to find his brother. After talking in broken Spanish and English, I said, your brother is right next door to me, and took him there. I have a friend for life. Like everything, there's good and bad. I think Latinos add a lot to our country, but we have to find a way to let them come for a few years, then go home, then perhaps come back at some point. The problems come when they settle here permanently and have to find ways to survive without being discovered.
First off, I can't be held to blame for what "our leaders" are doing, both in business and in economics. Most Americans can't. We don't CONTROL WHAT IS HAPPENING. We don't have a democracy anymore, in any real sense,and haven't for some time. Therefore, it's not our fault that these elitists are raping these poor nations. I recognize this is happening, but - guess what? Now they're raping US too. I take no responsbility for that and neither I nor my family, nor anyone I know has contributed to any of that. You made a lot of points which I really don't have time to address at this point, but let me make a stab at a couple. What is happening with illegal immigration is not a voluntary association for most Americans. We, on the whole, did not agree to this, nor do we want these people here. You can see this in virtually any poll you take. These people are being FORCED on us, and we are being asked to adapt to people who are breaking OUR laws and invading OUR country. I have no patience with that. I don't care what they're like as people. Personally, I really can't stand them. But that's just me. I hate their language, and I find them obnoxious. That's a cultural thing. Apparently many, if not most, Americans agree with me. There is a particular problem here with so many illegals coming from a border country. If a few thousand Haitians slip in here illegally - who cares really? They shouldn't do it, they should be rounded up, but it has no real impact on the country. If 10% of Mexico slips in here (and up to 40% WANT to come here), that has a REAL impact on our country. At some point, with enough Mexicans here - WE BECOME MEXICO - or a good part of our country does. From what I've heard of it (never having been there and having no desire to go), Mexico SUCKS. And if enough of them move to various parts of our country - they won't have to leave and we won't be able to make them. That's what's happening RIGHT NOW. It's not like the Greeks who come here for a short period of time and then go back home to their very distant land to live permanently. The Mexicans wno't have to go home. They'll just turn THIS into Mexico. Or those areas that are close enough to Mexico. In another generation, maybe less, we are going to lose large areas of the SouthWest defacto to Mexico. At some point, when enough people of one nation move to another nation and maintain their same cutoms, practices, and language, that area BECOMES the country they came from. That's the essential problem with not allowing the illegal flow from a BORDER country. As for $13 strawberries - what is America worth? Should we sell our country like Esau in the Bible for a bowl of pottage? Should we sell it for cheap Chinese goods that WE used to make? Should we sell it for $4 boxes of strawberries? Damn it, man, if that's the price for America, I am willing to give up strawberries for life. We don't need anything that much. Moreover, that $4 is not the real price for a box of strawberries. The real price is all the things that we pay for because of illegal immigration that is not in the price of the good itself The things that the corporation doesn't cover in their pricing - like transportation for illegals, health care, education, nursing care, state parks, prisons, etc. WE, THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, PICK UP THOSE COSTS. And those strawberries probably cost a hell of a lot more than $13 a box when all of these REAL costs are factored in. And how long will Mexicans be content to be our slave labor? Do we, or people like you who support open borders, expect them to pick our fruits and clean our offices for generation after generation after generation? is this the destiny of the Mexican people - to do all the crap work that we won't do at those wages? (and it's not just low wage jobs - many Mexicans are getting GOOD jobs, but the wages are being depressed because corporations don't want to pay them - it brings down the ENTIRE wage structure). All societies look for some group of people to exploit and do the work that people don't want to do, and for which we want to pay low wages as we regard the work as "beneath" us somehow. That's why slavery exists. The answer is to recognize this and not to give in to this desire to exploit people. If we can't get the job done at a decent living wage, then it should not be done at all. PERIOD. Do without it, or pay for it. What happens when those service jobs dry up? will all those Mexicans go home, or will they go onto our welfare rolls and demand benefits? or will we have a large, angry permaenent underclass with no means to move up as we have a dying middle class. There's no where for them to go. I think your thoughts about this are extremely short-sighted and clouded by your sympathy for the Mexican people and their poverty. I can sympathize with that but the answer is not to screw up the United States - the answer is to fix Mexico. These people need to return home and demand better leadership - or kiil the ones they have and install decent leaders in their place. Mexico has great natural resources and could be a rich country for all its people, but its elite are screwing over their people, just as we are seeing in America. Immigration is not the answer. Taking control is.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
That's
why these arguments about who's going to clean the offices or pick the
strawberries are a bunch of bulls**t. That's just what's happening NOW. What's
it going to be like in a generation or two? Do they think that Mexicans are
somehow born with some intense burning desire to clean offices and pick fruit?
Don't they think at some point these people and their children are going to
get fed up and say "bleep this, gringo"!!!! I want what YOU have. And how are
they going to get that in a country with a dying middle class? there are far
fewer ways for people to work their way up any kind of economic ladder. all
this does is create a large, permanent, angry, and alien underclass who will
grow to hate us. And if they stop picking those fruits and cleaning those
offices, then WHO does those jobs? What will be the next wave of poverty
stricken people we're supposed to take in to exploit and use as slaves?
Because that's what they are - slaves. The very same literal economic
arguments used by planters in pre-Civil war days to justify slavery are the
SAME arguments being used by those who bolster this illegal immigration and
talk about how whether we want $13 boxes of strawberries. I would prefer NOT
to eat strawberries again, if the real price is the loss of my country and the
on-going exploitation of a foreign, poverty stricken people. That is
disgraceful.
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
We lost the country when big agribusiness took over after the family farmers were driven off the land. The solution is parity. Everyone deserves a fair price and a living wage for what they produce. And the greatest benefit would be economic stability and an economic engine which keeps humming along with the 1 to 7 "trade turn", that is, for every dollar paid to a farmer, it produces $7 further along in the economic cycle as the farmer spends his earnings back into the economy. We would not see the death of rural America as we have since the late 50s after Ike pulled the plug on parity in 1953. But then the corporations could not make a profit if they had no workers in the metro areas they could plunder. The Mexicans have now taken the place of farm wokers of days gone by. And now with the burden of free trade taking away the industry and manufacturing of the nation, we will soon suffer the fate of Bolshevik Russia and the state capitalism fostered by that group of thugs, murderers and elitists.
"To be nobody-but-yourself - in a world which is doing its best, night and day, to make you everybody else - means to fight the hardest battle which any human being can ever fight; and never stop fighting." E.E. Cummings
What these do gooders refuse to consider is racism; not white racism directed toward invaders, but racism directed toward whites by the invaders. For Foxman and the ADL to paint whites as acting less than compassionate is an intentional provocation. It isn’t normal to welcome criminals who are here to steal our culture, our jobs and our nation. Do the Mikes of this world live in an alternate universe? How can they believe this racist ADL bilge? When entire segments of America grow into barrios, we Americans will be the unwelcome interlopers. These rots are nothing more than the shock troops for a utopian scheme to forcibly integrate America. I HATE it and I HATE the illegal invaders.
You're absolutely right. It comes down to corporate greed. And they are creating a very similar situation for us as was created hundreds of years ago by importing tens of thousands of blacks to work as slaves on the plantations. Of course, that was by force, and the Mexicans are voluntarily immigrating. But the analogy holds - the same arguments were used by the slave/plantation holders for exploiting black people as the corporatists and open borders people use today for exploiting Mexicans: we can't pay them real wages, we can't produce the goods cheaply enough, they work much harder than native labor could, etc, etc. But haven't we seen enough of what the REAL costs of slavery were? That after slavery ended we were left with a permanent, resentful, angry underclass who are only recently starting to move up and frankly there's not much for them to move INTO anymore. Why on earth would we want to duplicate this experience with Mexicans? We must get away from a business model that exists and thrives on the exploitation of a large population of impoverished or enslaved workers. That can only end badly for everyone. With the Mexicans we have the additional problem of their having their own country right on our border. As I've said before, if enough of them immigrate here - with their sole intent to make a buck - NOT TO BECOME AMERICANS - then what is the "tipping" point when that part ceases to be part of the United States and becomes part of Mexico? Just as an aside, we really should be asking something of those who really want to immigrate here and become Americans. It should not be based just on making a buck on either side. They should be willing to give up their past and become part of our present, and future. A country with a permanent large alien underclass cannot thrive and will have constant problems. If not now - eventually. It's is INEVITABLE. Can't we learn from history at all?
"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."
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Top • Page Up • Full Thread • Page Down • Bottom/Latest"Debatable, unless history is illegal in whatever country you debate it in."
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#119. To: YertleTurtle (#116)
"If Muhammad had not tried to found a new religion and instead presented himself as the Jewish Messiah, they might have accepted him. After all, he did fit the description of their Messiah -- slaughter, war, try to conquer and enslave everyone."
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#120. To: bluegrass (#114)
"It's programming, not discussion."
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#121. To: Ferret Mike (#119)
Gee, that means allot coming from a fella that gets an orgasm looking at Adolf Hitler's picture
#122. To: YertleTurtle (#121)
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#123. To: Ferret Mike (#122)
I rebuted your sad foggy words trying to repair Hitler's image and you didn't answer that post because you couldn't. You counldn't because the facts go against the lie that Hitler had done good by the German people you had posted that I refuted.
#124. To: YertleTurtle (#123)
"You refuted nothing. Usually I don't answer you because 99% of the time you don't know what you're talking about."
"By the way, nearly everyone here will agree with my opinion of you.
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#125. To: YertleTurtle (#123)
http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=29037&Disp=29#C29
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#126. To: Ferret Mike (#99)
(1). Well that is your opinion and mine is the creation of Israel in the aftermath of the Shoah is justifiable and my belief in the right of Israel to exist is a very very old and strong belief of mine I am not going to change.
#127. To: noone222 (#126)
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#128. To: Ferret Mike (#127)
Six million people murdered by others like you call bullshit on your agenda of hating and baiting.
#129. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#111)
Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
#130. To: Ferret Mike, all (#50)
#131. To: mehitable, Ferret Mike (#130)
#132. To: Jethro Tull (#131)
#133. To: mehitable (#132)
If we did things the way Mike wanted we'd have half of Mexico in here in no time
#134. To: Jethro Tull (#133)
#135. To: Ferret Mike (#124)
My opinion of your speaking for everyone else is zero hero. Cry me a river.
#136. To: YertleTurtle (#135)
"I'm also a hell of a lot smarter and knowledgeable than you.
"That's why I see through you."
"You're a hater, like all leftists.
"The smart understand the stupid a lot better than the stupid understand the smart. That's why I understand you but you don't understand me. I know the reason why; you don't."
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#137. To: Ferret Mike (#118)
The historical fact is incontrovertible.
-Warren Buffett on his membership at Highland Country Club
#138. To: mehitable (#134)
Bleep this shit, momma didn't raise any weak minded, masochistic, guilt-ridden children.
#139. To: Ferret Mike (#120)
snake oil...bigotry...Jew baiting...hating
-Warren Buffett on his membership at Highland Country Club
#140. To: bluegrass (#139)
"You won't confront your own brainwashing and you accuse others of it. It's called "projection". Having once been a informational victim of the ADL (I got over it), I know the symptoms well."
“Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber.” Plato
#141. To: Ferret Mike (#140)
You won't confront the methodology of Holocaust denial to start with a premise that there was no Shoah and to work back wards to try to find evidence this is so.
-Warren Buffett on his membership at Highland Country Club
#142. To: Jethro Tull (#138)
#143. To: bluegrass, Ferret Mike (#141)
#144. To: BTP Holdings (#104)
#145. To: mehitable (#142)
#146. To: mehitable (#142)
#147. To: Lady X (#143)
Mike you say 6 million jews perished in the holocaust during WWII, how many United States service men and women lost their lives? No googling or looking it up.
#148. To: Ferret Mike (#136)
Why don't you go see a psychologist about this problem, I'm here to talk politics, not handle your problems with megalomania.
#149. To: Click on the white kids (#148)
#150. To: who knows what evil (#145)
#151. To: Jethro Tull (#146)
#152. To: mehitable (#151)
#153. To: mehitable (#142)
JT, I'm sick of the double standard. I'm sicking of apologizing for 2000 years of European history. I can't help it if people in Africa are still carrying water from the local stream in baskets on their heads, or people in Backassastan are wearing the same clothes their great grandparents wore in the 14th hundreds. I'm sick of apologizing for progress. Without Western civilization there would be no America, and as flawed as it's become, it's still the best there is. I don't want to live in Mexico and I don't want Mexico moving to a neighborhood near me.
#154. To: Mekons4 (#153)
#155. To: Jethro Tull (#152)
When there are more minorities in America (I believe the year
2050 is projected as the tipping point) these now gardeners, cleaners and day
laborers will no longer accept such positions.
#156. To: mehitable (#155)
The very same literal economic arguments used by planters in pre-Civil war days to justify slavery are the SAME arguments being used by those who bolster this illegal immigration and talk about how whether we want $13 boxes of strawberries. I would prefer NOT to eat strawberries again, if the real price is the loss of my country
#157. To: mehitable (#155)
#158. To: BTP Holdings, Jethro Tull, Mekons4 (#156)
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