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Title: Free Speech on Freedom4um
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://none
Published: Aug 18, 2006
Author: Christine
Post Date: 2006-08-18 12:01:37 by christine
Keywords: None
Views: 13189
Comments: 173

It is time for me to address the issue of "free speech" on Freedom4um. My free speech means that I have 100% control over what I say and everyone else has 0% control over what I say. Now, I understand that there are consequences to exercising my right to free speech, but I still retain 100% control.

Free speech means that I have a right to express or spew thoughts and words of preference, love, hate, or anything with which another may disagree. That said, the rules or policies of this forum, which is my private property (see this forum's Mission Statement), are that members can exercise free speech as long as they (1) do not make a specific threat against an identifiable person or target, (2) earnestly debate or discuss the relevant issues that are part and parcel of this forum's reason-to-be. Let me remind you that these are rules for this forum and, as such, do not necessarily apply off of this forum, as public laws should, in most cases, be even less restrictive than private property rules and regulations.

Again, free speech on this forum means that people can express their love or hatred for anyone, any group, any race, any culture, or any thing, as long as they adhere to the two contingencies listed above. Everyone else on this forum is similarly at liberty to exercise their free speech right to challenge, debate, argue, or agree with the ideas and speech of another.

We will not censor speech as we abhor political correctness and authoritarianism as well as those thought-control and speech-control tyrants who would restrict another's speech. Any limitation on thought and speech constitutes the first level of the destruction of all remaining rights. Afterall, the framers of the Constitution believed that free speech was the most fundamental right to be protected which was the reason that they placed it FIRST in the Bill of Rights.

I do not say this lightly, but anyone who cannot handle the content of another's speech may not be suitable for this forum. Such a person may be better suited for a forum whose moderators control and steer the forum's ideas and speech in a given direction.

Many people have no concept of what Free Speech and Freedom really mean. Do you?

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  

I couldn't care less how I look to you or anyone else here.

That's pretty obvious.

And why should you be anything but ignored?

I'm not the one whining for certain posters to be banned, you are. Name them, if you've got the stones.

Esso  posted on  2006-08-18   15:25:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

What's funny about "the benefits of local fascism"? It just got Christopher Bollyn beat up and arrested in Chicago.

That's funny?

"We can make a natural alliance through the ownership of the great industries of the world and through the sharing of their profits." -Lord Charles Beresford, in a 1903 speech to the (Anglo-American-Jewish) Pilgrims Society.

bluegrass  posted on  2006-08-18   15:35:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

if one values human life, one cannot value its destroyers

from the fountainhead, by ayn rand, is the initial quote provided.

to attempt anything else, is a profane contradiction and the insignia of insanity, without hyperbole.

it is as a farmer who loves and is responsible for his crop, yet refuses to remove the worms that eat his corn. then he blames the fates, the gods, the spirits, the universe, the divine plan of ghosts he has never seen, but never blaming himself for the result- that his field has turned to dust and his corn is gone, and the worms he would not remove have multiplied beyond enumeration, like the grains of sand of the sea. a promiscious love is one of no value. and to hate that which attempts to destroy love, life, liberty, is not only correct, is it vital to furtherance of existence of an organism, either political or otherwise. consider, microcosmically, the white cells of the body, which must destroy that which threatens life in order for the organism to survive. it is not anger or hate that causes the problems, but false love, ...as the false love of a farmer who refuses to remove the worms who destroy the crops he claims to love while he watches them being destroyed. a false love, indistinguishable in the end result from hate itself. judging the tree by its fruit, so to speak then. tsarion states this is due to ego fixation, in the extent one will refuse to acknowledge the darkness, in fear, remaining in the 'light', which ironically, gives free reign to the darkness.

if one contemplates it...in fact, a righteous anger, a cleansing flame, is a repeated theme throughout spiritual teaching.

i am always amused at the christians who speak of christ as this man of peace. i ask them then of the braiding of cords, and whipping the moneychangers in the temple, overturning their tables, etc...a righteous anger, a cleansing flame. today, such activity is vandalism against the state, or in a temple, surely religious bigotry.

so, then, it is not proper, somehow, to hate evil, to hate child molestors, to hate corruption and falsehood, to hate that which seeks the destruction of self and family? to seek its end and elimination, as a white cells seeks destruction of diseased cells or else have the organism as a whole perish?

this is the bumpersticker philosophy new age drivel that is thoughtless and the handmaiden of luciferianism....an agent and catalyst for evil that diguises itself as goodwill and love.

and all evil has been allowed to manifest and grow by those who did not hate it. not indicating violence, but despising it for its very nature, as gandhi did, or christ.

those who say hate has no place against evil have confessed that there is no value to love.

I went to the park and saw this kid flying a kite. The kid was really excited. I don't know why, that's what they're supposed to do. Now if he had had a chair on the other end of that string, I would have been impressed. -Mitch Hedberg

gengis gandhi  posted on  2006-08-18   15:38:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

How curious this thread is. While other forums utilize the dreaded purge, 4 achieves self exile by simply asserting that a constitutional right remains intact. My how far some would have us fall.

Thanks for this semi-brilliant observation. :-)

I agree that is an accurate, even semi-brilliant observation.

"If there’s another 9/11 or a major war in the Middle-East involving a U.S. attack on Iran, I have no doubt that there will be, the day after or within days an equivalent of a Reichstag fire decree that will involve massive detentions in this country."

- Daniel Ellsberg Author, Pentagon Papers

robin  posted on  2006-08-18   16:28:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

What's funny about "the benefits of local fascism"? It just got Christopher Bollyn beat up and arrested in Chicago.

That's funny?

I guess it depends if the jackboot is on your foot, or on your neck.

Esso  posted on  2006-08-18   16:32:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

so, then, it is not proper, somehow, to hate evil, to hate child molestors, to hate corruption and falsehood, to hate that which seeks the destruction of self and family?

The same can be said for Communism, Zionism and the Fractional Reserve banking that's fed both.

"We can make a natural alliance through the ownership of the great industries of the world and through the sharing of their profits." -Lord Charles Beresford, in a 1903 speech to the (Anglo-American-Jewish) Pilgrims Society.

bluegrass  posted on  2006-08-18   16:42:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

I guess it depends if the jackboot is on your foot, or on your neck.

Well put.

"We can make a natural alliance through the ownership of the great industries of the world and through the sharing of their profits." -Lord Charles Beresford, in a 1903 speech to the (Anglo-American-Jewish) Pilgrims Society.

bluegrass  posted on  2006-08-18   16:43:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

if one contemplates it...in fact, a righteous anger, a cleansing flame, is a repeated theme throughout spiritual teaching.

i am always amused at the christians who speak of christ as this man of peace. i ask them then of the braiding of cords, and whipping the moneychangers in the temple, overturning their tables, etc...a righteous anger, a cleansing flame. today, such activity is vandalism against the state, or in a temple, surely religious bigotry.

so, then, it is not proper, somehow, to hate evil, to hate child molestors, to hate corruption and falsehood, to hate that which seeks the destruction of self and family? to seek its end and elimination, as a white cells seeks destruction of diseased cells or else have the organism as a whole perish?

very well said...there's a poem about righteous anger that i've posted before and i'll be darn if i can find it again and i can't remember its author. do you know it?

christine  posted on  2006-08-18   16:49:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

I do not say this lightly, but anyone who cannot handle the content of another's speech may not be suitable for this forum. Such a person may be better suited for a forum whose moderators control and steer the forum's ideas and speech in a given direction.

Amazing. Those folks proved themselves quickly, didn't they?

BTW, is this piece the result of someone trying to talk you into "moderating" F4 a little bit more?

"We can make a natural alliance through the ownership of the great industries of the world and through the sharing of their profits." -Lord Charles Beresford, in a 1903 speech to the (Anglo-American-Jewish) Pilgrims Society.

bluegrass  posted on  2006-08-18   16:54:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

We (Zipporah and I) will not censor free speech as we abhor political correctness and authoritarianism as well as those thought-control and speech-control tyrants who would restrict another's speech. Any limitation on thought and speech constitutes the first level of the destruction of all remaining rights.

ZING ZANG BAMMO! HOME RUN!

Aye to that mates!!

Law Enforcement Against Prohibition

"Freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in ...into an unbearable hell and a choking life."
-OBL
"Prohibition...goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A prohibition law strikes at the very principles upon which our govt was founded."
- Lincoln
All our liberties are due to men who, when their conscience has compelled them, have broken the laws of the land.
--William K Clifford

IndieTX  posted on  2006-08-18   17:04:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Thank you, I appreciate your affirmation.

christine  posted on  2006-08-18   17:10:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Henry Van Dyke (1852-1933)

Righteous Wrath

There are many kinds of hatred, as many kinds of fire; And some are fierce and fatal with murderous desire; And some are mean and craven, revengeful, sullen, slow, They hurt the man that holds them more than they hurt his foe.

And yet there is a hatred that purifies the heart: The anger of the better against the baser part, Against the false and wicked, against the tyrant's sword, Against the enemies of love, and all that hate the Lord.

O cleansing indignation, O flame of righteous wrath, Give me a soul to feel thee and follow in thy path! Save me from selfish virtue, arm me for fearless fight, And give me strength to carry on, a soldier of the Right!

Law Enforcement Against Prohibition

"Freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in ...into an unbearable hell and a choking life."
-OBL
"Prohibition...goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A prohibition law strikes at the very principles upon which our govt was founded."
- Lincoln
All our liberties are due to men who, when their conscience has compelled them, have broken the laws of the land.
--William K Clifford

IndieTX  posted on  2006-08-18   17:18:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

The point being of what positive value whatever are lies and hate? The caveat is, of course, that lies and hate cannot always be identified because they often shroud themselves in supposed fact. But so what? If in doubt, tolerate. If not, ban

Whose judgement wouldst thou use to determine the veracity of the words? You admitted yourself that lies and hate can not be readily identified.
Your post is an oxymoron. [You also contradicted yourself.]

Example: A few here believe that commercial jet contrails are "chem trails." Are they lying? Of course not. The deceivers on the chemtrail sites may be lying for profit, but those who believe them may simply be misguided and deceived. Besides, nobody can know the real truth about this because TheStateInc plays it too close to the vest. So we disagree. Who is lying? Answer: Nobody.

Therefore, tell me please...whose judgement wouldst thou use to dtermine the veracity of a post?

Free speech can not be restricted. This now fascist country began its spiral to political correctness and repudiation of the Constitution years ago and we've paid the price with a new link in our chains every day. It is the one thing that, thankfully, is still sacred here on 4UM.

If it were to deteriorate to the level of an LP or FR, I would have the choice to fill my bozo list first, and thereafter to leave..which I would. That is also everyone's choice here.

Rarely do I see any ad hominems here. LP is FULL of them, the most intellectually and creatively lethargic slur of which is the term "moonbat."

Law Enforcement Against Prohibition

"Freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in ...into an unbearable hell and a choking life."
-OBL
"Prohibition...goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A prohibition law strikes at the very principles upon which our govt was founded."
- Lincoln
All our liberties are due to men who, when their conscience has compelled them, have broken the laws of the land.
--William K Clifford

IndieTX  posted on  2006-08-18   17:34:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

BTW, is this piece the result of someone trying to talk you into "moderating" F4 a little bit more?

Yes, but I wouldn't characterize it as trying to talk me into anything. The correspondence(s) did, however, make me realize that I needed to clarify our position so that everyone knows what to expect as far as our admin moderation.

This would probably be a good time to remind all that we have provided a bozo filter as well as a category filter so that each member may self moderate. ;)

christine  posted on  2006-08-18   17:36:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

that's it! thank you.

christine  posted on  2006-08-18   17:37:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

This would probably be a good time to remind all that we have provided a bozo filter as well as a category filter so that each member may self moderate. ;)

Even with that, it seems the actual problem is that people are speaking of things that others wish them to remain silent about, not merely to be protected from seeing them. For the record, I don't use bozo filters, though I have been tempted.

You and Zip are doing God's work, christine. My thanks to both of you for providing this forum.

"We can make a natural alliance through the ownership of the great industries of the world and through the sharing of their profits." -Lord Charles Beresford, in a 1903 speech to the (Anglo-American-Jewish) Pilgrims Society.

bluegrass  posted on  2006-08-18   17:59:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Even with that, it seems the actual problem is that people are speaking of things that others wish them to remain silent about, not merely to be protected from seeing them.

IOW, the issue isn't about getting the truth out, as the argument was presented, but rather making sure that the truth doesn't get out, because it makes certain people uncomfortable and their cause undefendable.

Esso  posted on  2006-08-18   18:24:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

(3) earnestly debate or discuss the relevant issues that are part and parcel of this forum's reason-to-be.

Was that a shot at me? :)

Quit bogarting that peace, Herbert!

Dakmar  posted on  2006-08-18   18:36:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

thanks, bluegrass, your words are very much appreciated.

christine  posted on  2006-08-18   18:51:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

yep, you saw the silent D. :P

christine  posted on  2006-08-18   18:52:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

someone above posted a poem. is that it?

I went to the park and saw this kid flying a kite. The kid was really excited. I don't know why, that's what they're supposed to do. Now if he had had a chair on the other end of that string, I would have been impressed. -Mitch Hedberg

gengis gandhi  posted on  2006-08-18   19:53:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

yes, that's the one. it's Righteous Wrath, not Anger. that's the reason i couldn't find it again.

christine  posted on  2006-08-18   19:55:02 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

To: lodwick

Yes, ma'am. Looks like SOMEONE got the bitter stevia in HER coffee this morning...

I believe that's what's called "submissiveness," kind of like a dog who urinates in the presence of the dominant dog.

DeepPockets  posted on  2006-08-19   14:34:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

I believe that's what's called "submissiveness," kind of like a dog who urinates in the presence of the dominant dog.

Welcome to 4 DP we're sure glad you're here. Our house is your house so please feel free to shit in all the corners.

I'm not ready to make nice

Hmmmmm  posted on  2006-08-19   14:41:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Well put.

Esso  posted on  2006-08-19   14:42:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Yet another fine citizen troubled by the 1st amendment :)

Jethro Tull  posted on  2006-08-19   14:43:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

DP is famous for his cowardly little hit and run posts which seldom make a lick of sense.

christine  posted on  2006-08-19   14:51:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

DP is famous for his cowardly little hit and run posts which seldom make a lick of sense.

Hmmmmm, I can explain...... Oh! You mean DP.

I've got this one. Go clean up Dee's mess on the "Why" thread.

I'm not ready to make nice

Hmmmmm  posted on  2006-08-19   15:28:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Once you get rid of bluegrass, then free speech will be great for the rest of us!

(Surely you didn't mean to include that vicious anti-Semite under your free speech umbrella, did you? ;) )

HOUNDDAWG  posted on  2006-08-19   15:35:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

oh, you think he's my troublemaker here? ;)

(i think there might be one or two other LF bad boys too)

christine  posted on  2006-08-19   15:45:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

lol!

HOUNDDAWG  posted on  2006-08-19   15:46:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

BTTT

christine  posted on  2007-04-14   10:27:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

And so many here were banned at LP and FR for simply stating their opinions; and in some cases banned for posting an article from MSM that did not agree with the moderators' beliefs.

"The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes nor between parties either — but right through the human heart." — Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

robin  posted on  2007-04-14   11:25:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Many people have no concept of what Free Speech and Freedom really mean. Do you?

Freedom's just another word for nuthin left to lose ...

--- Janis Joplin

Not true, but a good tune.

Freedom means free to say and think what you want, and if someone can tell me that I can't question the role many Jews are playing in our foreign policy, they're censoring words and thoughts, they're controlling the dialogue, which controls the outcome.

I am appalled that so many topics on so many boards are simply not allowed. You cannot cross those lines. That's why the Imus assassination was so appalling, too.

Paul Revere  posted on  2007-04-14   11:35:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Good comments on this and the Nazi4um thread.

Nostalgia  posted on  2007-04-14   13:56:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

I'm bumping this to the top because of some dissention taking place among some members regarding some posts by others which are being perceived as threatening. I haven't seen a post that I believe violates my contingency #1 in the particular thread (No specific threat against an identifiable person or target). This was first written in 2006. I would like to invite discussion about Free Speech on Freedom4um again.

christine  posted on  2008-03-27   2:14:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

Jim Traficant was censored http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/725006/posts

"You can not save the Constitution by destroying it."

Itisa1mosttoolate  posted on  2008-03-27   3:10:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

posts by others which are being perceived as threatening.

I think I'm out of the loop on this one, as I am not familiar with the thread causing concern.

Perception of a real threat on this forum seems a little paranoid to me. I haven't heard of anyone on this forum ever suffering physical harm as the result of a dispute here, though I have witnessed bruised egos on rare occasions. (Sometimes these are my favorite threads).

This forum is the only one I'm aware of that actually affords free speech, hardly ever mentioning it, while consistently observing it.

If someone feels physically threatened maybe that person should post an article exposing it, and let the forum weigh in on the situation.

And the men who loan money to governments, so called, for the purpose of enabling the latter to rob, enslave, and murder their people, are among the greatest villains that the world has ever seen. And they as much deserve to be hunted and killed (if they cannot otherwise be got rid of) as any slave traders, robbers, or pirates that ever lived. ... Lysander Spooner

noone222  posted on  2008-03-27   3:26:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

and if someone can tell me that I can't question the role many Jews are playing in our foreign policy, they're censoring words and thoughts, they're controlling the dialogue, which controls the outcome.

The disproportionate influence wielded by Jews in the U.S. Govt. (and most others) is so obvious that it begs explanation. To ban the conversation is to ignore the obvious problem and by so doing refuse any attempt at resolution.

Silence regarding such subjects is tantamount to cowardice. The ironic thing to me is that most of the people speaking out on this subject do so knowing that they may be called names or branded a bigot by others less informed but more prolific. Problems never get resolved simply by ignoring them.

No subject should be off limits, no opinion outlawed, no restraint on explanatory offerings. Extending the dialogue rather than limiting it seems reasonable to me.

And the men who loan money to governments, so called, for the purpose of enabling the latter to rob, enslave, and murder their people, are among the greatest villains that the world has ever seen. And they as much deserve to be hunted and killed (if they cannot otherwise be got rid of) as any slave traders, robbers, or pirates that ever lived. ... Lysander Spooner

noone222  posted on  2008-03-27   3:47:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  

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