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Title: ISRAELIS were 9-11 short sale stock buyers, betting on WTC terror strikes, story killed...
Source:
TBRNews.org
URL Source: http://tbrnews.org/Archives/a048.htm
Published: Aug 26, 2006
Author: TBRNews
Post Date: 2006-08-26 09:15:57 by RickyJ
Ping List: *9-11* Subscribe to *9-11*
Keywords: 9/11, Israel, Never Forget
Views: 513
Comments: 40
SEC SECRET PROBE OF STOCK DEALINGS BEFORE 9/11 Between August 26 and September 11, 2001, a group of speculators, identified by the American Securities and Exchange Commission as Israeli citizens, sold "short" a list of 38 stocks that could reasonably be expected to fall in value as a result of the pending attacks. These speculators operated out of the Toronto, Canada and Frankfurt, Germany, stock exchanges and their profits were specifically stated to be "in the millions of dollars." Short selling of stocks involves the opportunity to gain large profits by passing shares to a friendly third party, then buying them back when the price falls. Historically, if this precedes a traumatic event, it is an indication of foreknowledge. It is widely known that the CIA uses the Promis software to routinely monitor stock trades as a possible warning sign of a terrorist attack or suspicious economic behavior. A week after the Sept.11 attacks, the London Times reported that the CIA had asked regulators for the Financial Services Authority in London to investigate the suspicious sales of millions of shares of stock just prior to the terrorist acts. It was hoped the business paper trail might lead to the terrorists. Investigators from numerous government agencies are part of a clandestine but official effort to resolve the market manipulations There has been a great deal of talk about insider trading of American stocks by certain Israeli groups both in Canada and Germany between August 26 and the Sept.11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Lynne Howard, a spokeswoman for the Chicago Board Options Exchange (CBOE), stated that information about who made the trades was available immediately. "We would have been aware of any unusual activity right away. It would have been triggered by any unusual volume. There is an automated system called 'blue sheeting,' or the CBOE Market Surveillance System, that everyone in the business knows about. It provides information on the trades - the name and even the Social Security number on an account - and these surveillance systems are set up specifically to look into insider trading. The system would look at the volume, and then a real person would take over and review it, going back in time and looking at other unusual activity." Howard continued, "The system is so smart that even if there is a news event that triggers a market event it can go back in time, and even the parameters can be changed depending on what is being looked at. It's a very clever system and it is instantaneous. Even with the system, though, we have very experienced and savvy staff in our market-regulations area who are always looking for things that might be unusual. They're trained to put the pieces of the puzzle together. Even if it's offshore, it might take a little longer, but all offshore accounts have to go through U.S. member firms - members of the CBOE - and it is easily and quickly identifiable who made the trades. The member firm who made the trades has to have identifiable information about the client under the 'Know Your Customer' regulations (and we share all information with the Securities and Exchange Commission.)" Given all of this, at a minimum the CBOE and government regulators who are conducting the secret investigations have known for some time who made the options puts on a total of 38 stocks that might reasonably be anticipated to have a sharp drop in value because of an attack similar to the 9/11 episode. The silence from the investigating camps could mean several things: Either terrorists are responsible for the puts on the listed stocks or others besides terrorists had foreknowledge of the attack and used this knowledge to reap a nice financial harvest from the tragedy. Adam Hamilton of Zeal LLC, a North Dakota-based private consulting company that publishes research on markets worldwide, stated that "I heard that $22 million in profits was made on these put options..." Federal investigators are continuing to be so closed-mouthed about these stock trades, and it is clear that a much wider net has been cast, apparently looking for bigger international fish involved in dubious financial activity relating to the 9/11 attacks on the world stock markets. Just a month after the attacks the SEC sent out a list of stocks to various securities firms around the world looking for information. The list includes stocks of American, United, Continental, Northwest, Southwest and US Airways airlines, as well as Martin, Boeing, Lockheed Martin Corp., AIG, American Express Corp, American International Group, AMR Corporation, Axa SA, Bank of America Corp, Bank of New York Corp, Bank One Corp, Cigna Group, CNA Financial, Carnival Corp, Chubb Group, John Hancock Financial Services, Hercules Inc, L-3 Communications Holdings, Inc., LTV Corporation, Marsh & McLennan Cos. Inc., MetLife, Progressive Corp., General Motors, Raytheon, W.R. Grace, Royal Caribbean Cruises, Ltd., Lone Star Technologies, American Express, the Citigroup Inc. ,Royal & Sun Alliance, Lehman Brothers Holdings, Inc., Vornado Reality Trust, Morgan Stanley, Dean Witter & Co., XL Capital Ltd., and Bear Stearns. The Times said market regulators in Germany, Japan and the US all had received information concerning the short selling of insurance, airlines and arms companies stock, all of which fell sharply in the wake of the attacks. City of London broker and analyst Richard Crossley noted that someone sold shares in unusually large quantities beginning three weeks before the assault on the WTC and Pentagon. He said he took this as evidence that someone had insider foreknowledge of the attacks. "What is more awful than he should aim a stiletto blow at the heart of Western financial markets?" he added. "But to profit from it? Words fail me." The US Government also admitted it was investigating short selling, which evinced a compellingly strong foreknowledge of the coming Arab attack. There was unusually heavy trading in airline and insurance stocks several days before Sept.11, which essentially bet on a drop in the worth of the stocks. It was reported by the Interdisciplinary Center, a counter-terrorism think tank involving former Israeli intelligence officers, that insiders made nearly $16 million profit by short selling shares in American and United Airlines, the two airlines that suffered hijacking, and the investment firm of Morgan Stanley, which occupied 22 floors of the WTC. Apparently none of the suspicious transactions could be traced to bin Laden because this news item quietly dropped from sight, leaving many people wondering if it tracked back to American firms or intelligence agencies. Most of these transactions were handled primarily by Deutsche Bank-A.B.Brown, a firm which until 1998 was chaired by A. B."Buzzy" Krongard, who later became executive director of the CIA. More serious was an article in the Sept. 28, 2001 edition of the Washington Post stating that officials with the instant messaging firm of Odigo in New York confirmed that two employees in Israel received text messages warning of an attack on the WTC two hours before the planes crashed into the buildings! The firm's vice president of sales and marketing, Alex Diamandis said it was possible that the warning was sent to other Odigo members, but they had not received any reports of such. The day after, the Jerusalem Post claimed two Israelis died on the hijacked airplanes and that 4,000 were missing at the WTC. A week later, a Beirut television station reported that 4,000 Israeli employees of the WTC were absent the day of the attack. This information spread across the Internet but was quickly branded a hoax. On Sept. 19, the Washington Post reported about 113 Israelis were missing at the WTC and the next day, President Bush noted more than 130 Israelis were victims. Finally, on Sept. 22, the New York Times stated "There were, in fact, only three Israelis who had been confirmed as dead: two on the planes and another who had been visiting the towers on business and who was identified and buried." Investigators from numerous government agencies are part of a clandestine but official effort to resolve the market manipulations There has been a great deal of talk about the insider trading of American stocks by certain Israeli groups both in Canada and Germany between August 26 and the Sept.11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Government investigators have maintained a diplomatic silence about a Department of Justice (DOJ) probe of possible profiteering by interested parties with advance knowledge of the attack. On Sept. 6, 2001, the Thursday before the tragedy, 2,075 put options were made on United Airlines and on Sept. 10, the day before the attacks, 2,282 put options were recorded for American Airlines. Given the prices at the time, this could have yielded speculators between $2 million and $4 million in profit. The matter still is under investigation and none of the government investigating bodies -including the FBI, the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) and DOJ -are speaking to reporters about insider trading. Even so, suspicion of insider trading to profit from the Sept. 11 attacks is not limited to U.S. regulators. Investigations were initiated in a number of places including Japan, Germany, the United Kingdom, France, Luxembourg, Hong Kong, Switzerland and Spain. As in the United States, all are treating these inquiries as if they were state secrets.
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#1. To: *Israeli Espionage* (#0)
ping
"If there’s another 9/11 or a major war in the Middle-East involving a U.S. attack on Iran, I have no doubt that there will be, the day after or within days an equivalent of a Reichstag fire decree that will involve massive detentions in this country." - Daniel Ellsberg Author, Pentagon Papers This is the first claim I've seen that the SEC identified the short sellers as Israeli citizens. Can anybody substantiate this claim?
I haven't been able to find anything to corraborate that claim yet. I have written to the website in the source link for more info and a source.
Do I hear a fat lady singing?
Perhaps a ping to Kamala, honway??
I wouldn't worry so much about 4Dumb. Once we get the hate laws through, that anti-Semitic hellhole will be shut down for good. It's about time some of these Americans start to get some understanding that this crap's not going to be tolerated much longer. Anybody caught badmouthing Israel is committing treachery and treason against the American government in a time of war, and that's the death penalty. When the Pres finally signs the capital punishment order for anti-Semitism, these haters aren't gonna know what hit 'em. posterboy posted on 2006-08-25 01:28:13 ET
I doubt you are going to get anyone to substantiate this since the probe itself is secret and the sources no doubt would want to remain anonymous. Yes, it could be a bogus story, but considering the other known involvement from Israelis in 9/11 I wouldn't be surprised if it was true.
God is always good! Here is the bottom line. Do people in the 911 truth movement want to move forward? Do people want an independent investigation and criminal indictments? Or will we be sitting here talking about this 40 years later like JFK? Does the 911 movement want to be inclusive or exclusive? By painting yourself into a corner with the nonsense that "Israel did 911" you become exclusive. Seeing Israel behind every tree, rock or under your bed will destroy your credibility. As soon as you would bring this up with someone, they will shut you down, and you have lost that citizen. While the likes of Smith, Hufshimt(SP) are asking retarded questions like, "Who funds you?", "What is your family tree?", "How big is your head?". I'm out talking to people and passing out dvd's, postcards and VHS tapes and trying to wake a few more Americans up to at the least question 911 or at the most, convince them of government involvement. It is as simple as this. Will we move forward with truely credible evidence and research or will we be bogged down with fission bombs, Israel, holograms, pods, etc... Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
Kamala, I was pinging you really for critter. I don't disgree with anything you have said above. I just want the whole truth, and if there is an Israel component to it, it should be as evident as anything else. I am finding during the course of this year, any mention of the complicity of Israel, or someone Jewish, if identified and pointed out, is howled at as if any such mention of a fact is an attempt to denegrate an entire group, faith, country, policy, blah blah. I'm sick of it. You make an excellent point not to get bogged down in such things or become obsessed. But it's becoming more and more clear, as we clear the cobwebs of history, SOMETHING looks very bad, and there is an interconnection to many parties. I, personally, want the light to shine on each one. If someone takes that as a spoiler point, too bad. It's not going to stop curiosity. Curiosity, is NOT an accusation.. it's a search for an answer that makes sense, THEN, one can move on. Just my 2 cents.. :)
"Are we at last brought to such an humiliating and debasing degradation that we cannot be trusted with arms for our own defense? Where is the difference between having our arms under our own possession and under our own direction, and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?" -- Patrick Henry (1736-1799) US Founding Father
you both make good points. as far as discussion, i want it all out there. then i want to sift through it and decide for myself what is fact or fiction. i don't, however, like the attacks and infighting among those in the leadership of the 911 Truth movement. no one can do or say it all. each person plays a part in bringing information to light...disinfo agents not withstanding.
"Freedom4um" -- The Forum for Real Americans and where America and Americans are always First!
Well said. Just the facts ma'am.
"Are we at last brought to such an humiliating and debasing degradation that we cannot be trusted with arms for our own defense? Where is the difference between having our arms under our own possession and under our own direction, and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?" -- Patrick Henry (1736-1799) US Founding Father
ditto, just the facts. I like to verify everything I can. That's why I wrote the article's source to find out their source, so I can verify if possible. If not, it's not worth the pixels it is written with. :)
Do I hear a fat lady singing?
Excellent. Many will not take the time to do such things on their own. I've had pretty decent responses to letters sent direct to authors. Have generally received a response within a couple of days. If you get a response, perhaps you can let us know??
"Are we at last brought to such an humiliating and debasing degradation that we cannot be trusted with arms for our own defense? Where is the difference between having our arms under our own possession and under our own direction, and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?" -- Patrick Henry (1736-1799) US Founding Father
I've been doing that too. I was wondering, which ones have you had the best results with? Seems like what I hand out to folks they either just ignore it, or maybe they never even watch it. Also, because of working off a budget, I have downloaded video off the internet, and convert it to a format which I can use to make video CD's (cheaper than DVD's). Have you done this, or do you use hard copies to make copies from? The biggest problem with doing this I've run into is the converter I've been using always leaves glitches in the conversion, and causes a nuisance at best, and at worst causes hangups - rendering the video useless. I agree with you in that trying to put out things as FACT when we don't know it to be so is doing more harm than good. Concerning 9/11, about the only FACT we know is that we haven't been told the TRUTH...
"Give me liberty, or give me death!" - Patrick Henry "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote" - Ben Franklin
These independent investigations have already been done. The perpetrators are basically known. There will never be an indictment or prosecutions of these criminals under the current system, ever! Revolution is the only solution and that won't happen I fear until it is way too late, as it may be already even now. The truth is still important to know however. It is always important to know one's enemy even if you may not be able to defeat them now. Yes, Israel most definitely is America’s and more precisely and importantly Christian’s enemy.
God is always good! Agreed.. some pigs are more equal..
Of course Israel did not do 9/11 by themselves that would be impossible. But to ignore their huge roll in it would be lying to people. If you do that you know longer care about the truth. It is not being exclusive to tell people the whole truth. To not tell people the whole truth you are being exclusive and not inclusive about the truth of 9/11.
God is always good! I agree with what you have written, but the "Israel did 911" crowd will not be happy unless you come to the conclusion that Israel, planned, guided, funded the whole thing. The ISI of Pakistan has more ties and smoking guns leading to them being the front for the whole operation, not the government of Israel. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
Yep, they own 8 or 9 US media companies, a spy network and a huge Lobby. Absurd Mark.
The infighting comes from the Israel and pod crowd. People doing solid research are being attacked for not talking about holograms, microwave bombs and the Mossad. Take a quick look here. I was told I should stay away from a certain forum because its dis- info and doesn't use Israel as its main topic. This is what is going on. If you don't discuss their pet topics, the fingerpointing starts. Let me say this, go start an Israel Did 911 site. Watch how many members it grabs. The likes of Bollyn, Smith, Hufshimt(SP) stomp their feet and demand attention like some children. The only way they can get some PR is through pointing fingers at anyone and everyone. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
I make hard copies off my dvd/vhs player. Loose Change 2, 911 Revisited, 911 Eyewitness, William Rodrequz speech, along with some talking point postcards pointing people in the right direction to research on their own. Don't waste your time with people who are not open about 911. Just move on to the next person or family. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
Really? Please point me to all these truely independent investigations. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
Show me the huge roll that the government of Israel had in 911. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
Show me the proof of the 8 or 9 media corporations carrying out 911. The ISI of Pakistan has done more of our dirty work, along with the MI6 than Israel has. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
More absurdity Mark? Are you Jewish? Why did ISI sack their intel chief after climbing on board (bribed) for a phony "WoT"? Are you related to "BlackJade"?
The ISI didn't just climb aboard. A great deal of the operation was run through Pakistan with money being funneled through the Saudis and other countries to Pakistan from government/intellignce fronts here in the states. As far as pure speculation, I wouldn't doubt if the ISI were used to rig the buildings in NYC. The Saudis with their Bush family ties have benefited greatly from 911. Oil was $12 a barrel before 911, now its $70 plus. Yeah I'm jewish. Or better yet, I'm a Cripto- jew. Do you want to know my "funding" and my "family tree"? What nonsense. Just to add, you can do a search on my posts and articles here, I'm no fan of the Israelis government, or the Mossad, or the Zionists. There is just too much evidence pointing that this was an operation carried out by a power hungry, greedy, murderous cabal moving covertly in certain numerous agencies throughout our own government. So many corps, countries and people have benefited by 911, we couldn't name them all. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
This comment isn't directed at you Christine, it is just a general statement for those who like to point out that not enough attention is going to that topic. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
The ISI of Pakistan has more ties and smoking guns leading to them being the front for the whole operation, not the government of Israel. Pakistan? Please, that is just absurd. What has Pakistan gained from this? It's obvious which nation gained the most form 9/11, and it sure wasn't Pakistan, nor was it the USA.
God is always good! I posted my response to his comment before I saw yours. I agree with you 100%.
God is always good! It makes me laugh, including Mark's predictable proposal to christine.
squabble squabble. how can anyone be 'happy' over sept 11 events and the lack of justice in the situation since unless they focus their mind elsewhere. we're all bound to be disgruntled over it.
I doubt you will get a source name, if you did then they would more than likely be dead before you could call them to verify it, and if you were unfortunate enough to verify it then you and your family would also bite the dust. Sorry, these people are evil with a capital "E" and they play for keeps. Just ask Sam Danner, they are threating his life just for telling the little bit he knows.
God is always good! Where have you been? They have been done and completed for years now. Jim Hoffman with his excellent analysis of the energy required to expand the concrete dust clouds in the time they were observed to expand in proves absolutely that the towers did not come down the way the USA government says they did. Late to the investigation, but nevertheless an important person for 9/11-truth movement because of his physics research position at BYU is professor Jones. He has proved the presence of thermate on the remains of WTC steel. This is extremely important evidence and I would imagine if he is not a plant, then his life is probably most definitely in danger. Jim Hoffman has done even more investigations on his site WTC7.NET that professor Jones was also impressed with, as I was when I first saw it. Hoffman doesn't have the credentials of Jones but his research is sound and his findings have stood the test of time.
God is always good! Stranger Than Fiction is still one of best resources, with googled search terms added to the footnotes...only wonder how many links are dead now?
On September 10, the Pakistani daily The News reported that the Mahmoud visit to the United States "triggered speculation about the agenda of his mysterious meetings at the Pentagon and National Security Council". If he'd been to the National Security Council, he had certainly met Rice. Mahmoud did meet with his counterpart, Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) director George Tenet. Tenet and Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage had been in Islamabad in May, when Tenet had "unusually long" meetings with Musharraf. Armitage for his part has countless friends in the Pakistani military and the ISI. Mahmoud also met a number of high officials at the White House and the Pentagon and had a crucial meeting with Marc Grossman, the under secretary of state for political affairs. Rice maintains she did not meet Mahmoud then. On the morning of September 11, Mahmoud was having a breakfast meeting at the Capitol with Graham and Goss. Goss spent as many as 10 years working on numerous CIA clandestine operations. He is very close to Vice President Dick Cheney. It's interesting to note that two weeks ago Goss suggested to the Justice Department to bring perjury charges against the new Cheney nemesis, Clarke. As it is widely known, Graham and Goss were co-heads of the joint House- Senate investigation that proclaimed there was "no smoking gun" as far as President George W Bush having any advance knowledge of September 11. According to the Washington Post, and also to sources in Islamabad, the Mahmoud- Graham-Goss meeting lasted until the second plane hit Tower 2 of the World Trade Center. Graham later said they were talking about terrorism coming from Afghanistan, which means they were talking about bin Laden. Pakistani intelligence sources told Asia Times Online that on the afternoon of September 11 itself, as well as on September 12 and 13, Armitage met with Mahmoud with a stark choice: either Pakistan would help the US against al- Qaeda, or it would be bombed back to the Stone Age. Secretary of State Colin Powell presented an ultimatum in the form of seven US demands. Pakistan accepted all of them. One of the demands was for Musharraf to send Mahmoud to Kandahar again and force the Taliban to extradite bin Laden. Mahmoud knew in advance Mullah Omar would refuse. But when he went to Kandahar the Taliban leader said he would accept, as long as the Americans proved bin Laden was responsible for September 11. There was no proof, and Afghanistan was bombed anyway, a policy already decided well in advance. It's important to remember than on September 13 Islamabad airport was shut down - allegedly because of threats against Pakistan's strategic assets. On September 14, Islamabad declared total support for the US: the airport was immediately reopened. Mahmoud remained in Washington until September 16 - when the war on Afghanistan was more than programmed, and Pakistan was firmly in the "with us" and not the "against us" column. Million-dollar questions remain. Did Mahmoud know when and how the attacks of September 11 would happen? Did Musharraf know? Could the Bush administration have prevented September 11? It's hard to believe high echelons of the CIA and FBI were not aware of the direct link between the ISI and alleged chief hijacker Mohammed Atta. On October 7, Mahmoud was demoted from the ISI. By that time, Washington obviously knew of the connection between Mahmoud, Saeed Sheikh and Mohamed Atta: the FBI knew it. The official version is that Mahmoud was sacrificed because he was too close to the Taliban - which, it is never enough to remind, are a cherished creature of the ISI. Two other ISI big shots, Lieutenant- General Mohammed Aziz Khan and Chief of General Staff Mohammed Yousouf, are also demoted along with Mahmoud. Saeed Sheikh was under orders to Khan. The fact remains that even with this Musharraf-conducted purge of the ISI elite, the bulk of ISI officers remained, and still are, pro-Taliban. Other former ISI directors living in Pakistan, such as the colorful, outspoken Lieutenant-General Hamid Gul, did not "disappear" and always renew their support for the Taliban. But as Asia Times Online has reported, Mahmoud did disappear. He lives in near seclusion in Rawalpindi. And he is definitely not talking. Graham and Goss may not be interested in talking to him either. Because he may be the ultimate September 11 smoking gun. Conclusion The Karl Rove-designed campaign to re-elect Bush is in essence anchored on September 11. The Republican convention in New York will happen in the first week of September. Bush's speech will be on September 2 - to force the connection with the three-year commemoration of September 11. This whole affair is not about whether Clarke committed "perjury"; whether Rice was really up to her job; or whether George W Bush knew something and then "forgot" about it. The families of September 11 victims, US public opinion, the demonized Islamic world, the whole world for that matter, all everybody wants to know is what really happened on September 11. The only party that does not seem interested in getting to the bottom of it is the Bush administration. The official fable of 19 kamikaze Arabs turning Boeings into missiles with military precision, armed only with box cutters and a few flight lessons and directed from an Afghan cave by a satellite phone-shy bin Laden simply does not hold. The commission is not asking the really hard questions. Here are just a few - and they are far from being the most embarrassing. 1) The "stand down" order: Why, despite more than an hour's warning that an attack was happening, were no F-16s protecting US airspace? Documents easily available online reveal why the Pentagon could not act: because of bureaucracy. Why did the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD) claim it took 25 minutes after the transponder was shut down to learn that Flight 11 - which hit World Trade Center Tower 1 - was hijacked? Why did fighters not take off from Andrews Air Force base just outside Washington to protect the Pentagon? 2) The pre-September 11 suspicious stock option trades in American Airlines and United Airlines were never fully investigated. Who profited? 3) What happened to the FBI investigation into flight schools - when it was proved that at least five of the 19 hijackers were trained in US military schools? 4) Why did Bush keep reading a pet-goat story for more than half an hour after the first WTC hit, and 15 minutes after Chief of Staff Andrew Card told him there had been an attack? 5) What really happened to Flight 93? An Associated Press story last August quoting a congressional report said the FBI suspected the plane was crashed on purpose. The FBI has a flight-simulation video of what happened: the video - as well as the black box - remain top secret. And as far as four "indestructible" black boxes are concerned, how come none were found, unlike Mohammed Atta's intact passport lying in the WTC rubble? 6) Why have no scientific experts examined the physical and mathematical evidence that a Boeing 757 could not have possibly "disappeared" without a trace after hitting the Pentagon? For the most exhaustive and practically incontrovertible analysis available on the net, see this report. 7) What remains of the very tight 1980s bin Laden-ISI-CIA connection? How much did the CIA know about what the ISI was up to? And how much did the ISI know about what al-Qaeda was up to? 8) What does Rice really know about the very close relations between Mahmoud and the top echelons of the Bush administration? The genie - the crucial information - is still in the bottle. (Copyright 2004 Asia Times Online Ltd. All rights reserved. Please contact content@atimes.com for information on our sales and syndication policies.)
Interview with former ISI chief Hameed Gul http://www.robert-fisk.com/hamid_gul_interview_sept26_2001.htm
I like Jim Hoffman, I like Dr Jones, among many others. I've used both their sites for notes and reference, but they are researchers not criminal investigators. They have no authority. We will have to have a real independent investigation clear of all political ties and federal ties. It will have to have real independent experts and include American citizens from all walks and occupations. I don't know if we have the nerve and guts as a country. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
There is so much evidence of the ISI being used by our intelligence, if you combine that with the Saudi links, it may total in the hundreds and hundreds of ties to 911. Thanks for the Pakistan article. I have a bunch in my files, but whats the use. The Mossad did 911. Period, no matter what the research says. There has been a huge amount of research about Pakistan from Nafeez Ahmed, Paul Thompson, Michel Chossudovsky, Webster Tarpley, Sander Hicks. As in other threads that go nowhere, this will be my last on this one. Mark
If America is destroyed, it may be by Americans who salute the flag, sing the national anthem, march in patriotic parades, cheer Fourth of July speakers - normally good Americans who fail to comprehend what is required to keep our country strong and free - Americans who have been lulled into a false security (April 1968).---Ezra Taft Benson, US Secretary of Agriculture 1953-1961 under Eisenhower
For my own sanity, I've decided to lump all the "intelligence" agencies, from all countries, into the same basket named "Satan's Tools on Earth." Their allegiance is to him, and not to any country. Try it - you might like it. Plus, it saves a lot of bandwidth and time. Cheers, guys, off to find something to toss on the grill this evening.
i know and you've seen me argue against it if i think it's unjust i.e. Alex Jones, 911 Scholars, Dylan and Jason, Aaron Russo. my point is that no one can do and say it all. Alex strikes the perfect balance, imo. he must. he's accused often of being both anti-israel and pro-israel.
"Freedom4um" -- The Forum for Real Americans and where America and Americans are always First!
Kamala, Those guilty will not be happy now will they? Why should the world pay for a fraud upon them? Simply, the truth is, there is a lot of Israeli there, there. Those quick to assume 'WE' who say such things are to be sloshed with drunken accusations of anti-semitism. It is the guilty face who does not want the truth known. That's just how I feel. In an odd way, I feel there are few who REALLY want to know the whole truth. And some say we can't take it. But they are willing to send you to die for a lie. So.. let's clear the air of bullshit.... The world is being ASKED, if not TOLD, THEY MUST support a war on terror, that was launched on 9/11.. You are with us or against us. (utter BS there too).. However, if we are to earn the respect and trust of a world so asked for their support, is it not fair to work with the truth of matters to form the correct plan?? It's not just a few that question the agenda, it's BILLIONS.
"Are we at last brought to such an humiliating and debasing degradation that we cannot be trusted with arms for our own defense? Where is the difference between having our arms under our own possession and under our own direction, and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?" -- Patrick Henry (1736-1799) US Founding Father
I wouldn't be surprised if it is true, but I also wouldn't be surprised if it isn't. I don't think we know. I know I don't.
#2. To: RickyJ (#0)
Between August 26 and September 11, 2001, a group of speculators, identified by the American Securities and Exchange Commission as Israeli citizens, sold "short" a list of 38 stocks that could reasonably be expected to fall in value as a result of the pending attacks.
#3. To: aristeides (#2)
#4. To: Critter, kamala, honway (#3)
#5. To: aristeides (#2)
This is the first claim I've seen that the SEC identified the short sellers as Israeli citizens. Can anybody substantiate this claim?
"It was an interesting day." - President Bush, recalling 9/11 [White House, 1/5/02]
#6. To: jessejane (#4)
#7. To: Kamala, critter (#6)
It is as simple as this. Will we move forward with truely credible evidence and research or will we be bogged down with fission bombs, Israel, holograms, pods, etc...
#8. To: Kamala, jessejane (#6)
#9. To: christine (#8)
i don't, however, like the attacks and infighting among those in the leadership of the 911 Truth movement. no one can do or say it all. each person plays a part in bringing information to light...disinfo agents not withstanding.
#10. To: jessejane, christine, kamala (#9)
Well said. Just the facts ma'am.
#11. To: Critter (#10)
That's why I wrote the article's source to find out their source, so I can verify if possible.
#12. To: Kamala (#6)
I'm out talking to people and passing out dvd's, postcards and VHS tapes and trying to wake a few more Americans up to at the least question 911 or at the most, convince them of government involvement.
#13. To: Kamala (#6)
Do people want an independent investigation and criminal indictments?
"It was an interesting day." - President Bush, recalling 9/11 [White House, 1/5/02]
#14. To: RickyJ (#13)
. The perpetrators are basically known. There will never be an indictment or prosecutions of these criminals under the current system, ever!
#15. To: Kamala (#6)
(Edited)
Does the 911 movement want to be inclusive or exclusive? By painting yourself into a corner with the nonsense that "Israel did 911" you become exclusive.
"It was an interesting day." - President Bush, recalling 9/11 [White House, 1/5/02]
#16. To: jessejane (#7)
#17. To: Kamala (#16)
The ISI of Pakistan has more ties and smoking guns leading
“Yes, but is this good for Jews?"
#18. To: christine (#8)
#19. To: innieway (#12)
#20. To: RickyJ (#13)
These independent investigations have already been done.
#21. To: RickyJ (#15)
...their huge roll in it..
#22. To: Eoghan (#17)
#23. To: Kamala (#22)
Show me the proof of the 8 or 9 media corporations carrying out 911.
“Yes, but is this good for Jews?"
#24. To: Eoghan (#23)
(Edited)
#25. To: Christine (#18)
Let me say this, go start an Israel Did 911 site
#26. To: Kamala (#16)
I agree with what you have written, but the "Israel did 911" crowd will not be happy unless you come to the conclusion that Israel, planned, guided, funded the whole thing.
"It was an interesting day." - President Bush, recalling 9/11 [White House, 1/5/02]
#27. To: Eoghan (#17)
Yep, they own 8 or 9 US media companies, a spy network and a huge Lobby. Absurd Mark.
"It was an interesting day." - President Bush, recalling 9/11 [White House, 1/5/02]
#28. To: RickyJ (#27)
“Yes, but is this good for Jews?"
#29. To: Kamala, RickyJ, Eoghan (#16)
but the "Israel did 911" crowd will not be happy unless you come to the conclusion that Israel, planned, guided, funded the whole thing
#30. To: Critter, SamDanner (#10)
That's why I wrote the article's source to find out their source, so I can verify if possible. If not, it's not worth the pixels it is written with. :)
"It was an interesting day." - President Bush, recalling 9/11 [White House, 1/5/02]
#31. To: Kamala (#20)
(Edited)
Really? Please point me to all these truely independent investigations.
"It was an interesting day." - President Bush, recalling 9/11 [White House, 1/5/02]
#32. To: RickyJ (#31)
“Yes, but is this good for Jews?"
#33. To: RickyJ. Everyone here (#31)
From the Asia Times on ISI and 9.11 -
#34. To: lodwick (#33)
“Yes, but is this good for Jews?"
#35. To: RickyJ (#31)
#36. To: lodwick (#33)
#37. To: Kamala. E. all (#36)
As in other threads that go nowhere, this will be my last on this one.
#38. To: Kamala (#18)
The infighting comes from the Israel and pod crowd.
#39. To: Kamala (#16)
I agree with what you have written, but the "Israel did 911" crowd will not be happy unless you come to the conclusion that Israel, planned, guided, funded the whole thing.
#40. To: RickyJ (#5)
Yes, it could be a bogus story, but considering the other known involvement from Israelis in 9/11 I wouldn't be surprised if it was true.
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