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Title: In Case I Disappear
Source: Truthout
URL Source: [None]
Published: Sep 29, 2006
Author: William Pitt
Post Date: 2006-09-29 13:53:49 by bluedogtxn
Keywords: None
Views: 793
Comments: 53

In Case I Disappear By William Rivers Pitt t r u t h o u t | Perspective

Friday 29 September 2006

I have been told a thousand times at least, in the years I have spent reporting on the astonishing and repugnant abuses, lies and failures of the Bush administration, to watch my back. "Be careful," people always tell me. "These people are capable of anything. Stay off small planes, make sure you aren't being followed." A running joke between my mother and me is that she has a "safe room" set up for me in her cabin in the woods, in the event I have to flee because of something I wrote or said.

I always laughed and shook my head whenever I heard this stuff. Extreme paranoia wrapped in the tinfoil of conspiracy, I thought. This is still America, and these Bush fools will soon pass into history, I thought. I am a citizen, and the First Amendment hasn't yet been red-lined, I thought.

Matters are different now.

It seems, perhaps, that the people who warned me were not so paranoid. It seems, perhaps, that I was not paranoid enough. Legislation passed by the Republican House and Senate, legislation now marching up to the Republican White House for signature, has shattered a number of bedrock legal protections for suspects, prisoners, and pretty much anyone else George W. Bush deems to be an enemy.

So much of this legislation is wretched on the surface. Habeas corpus has been suspended for detainees suspected of terrorism or of aiding terrorism, so the Magna Carta-era rule that a person can face his accusers is now gone. Once a suspect has been thrown into prison, he does not have the right to a trial by his peers. Suspects cannot even stand in representation of themselves, another ancient protection, but must accept a military lawyer as their defender.

Illegally-obtained evidence can be used against suspects, whether that illegal evidence was gathered abroad or right here at home. To my way of thinking, this pretty much eradicates our security in persons, houses, papers, and effects, as stated in the Fourth Amendment, against illegal searches and seizures.

Speaking of collecting evidence, the torture of suspects and detainees has been broadly protected by this new legislation. While it tries to delineate what is and is not acceptable treatment of detainees, in the end, it gives George W. Bush the final word on what constitutes torture. US officials who use cruel, inhumane or degrading treatment to extract information from detainees are now shielded from prosecution.

It was two Supreme Court decisions, Hamdi v. Rumsfeld and Hamdan v. Rumsfeld, that compelled the creation of this legislation. The Hamdi decision held that a prisoner has the right of habeas corpus, and can challenge his detention before an impartial judge. The Hamdan decision held that the military commissions set up to try detainees violated both the Uniform Code of Military Justice and the Geneva Conventions.

In short, the Supreme Court wiped out virtually every legal argument the Bush administration put forth to defend its extraordinary and dangerous behavior. The passage of this legislation came after a scramble by Republicans to paper over the torture and murder of a number of detainees. As columnist Molly Ivins wrote on Wednesday, "Of the over 700 prisoners sent to Gitmo, only 10 have ever been formally charged with anything. Among other things, this bill is a CYA for torture of the innocent that has already taken place."

It seems almost certain that, at some point, the Supreme Court will hear a case to challenge the legality of this legislation, but even this is questionable. If a detainee is not allowed access to a fair trial or to the evidence against him, how can he bring a legal challenge to a court? The legislation, in anticipation of court challenges like Hamdi and Hamdan, even includes severe restrictions on judicial review over the legislation itself.

The Republicans in Congress have managed, at the behest of Mr. Bush, to draft a bill that all but erases the judicial branch of the government. Time will tell whether this aspect, along with all the others, will withstand legal challenges. If such a challenge comes, it will take time, and meanwhile there is this bill. All of the above is deplorable on its face, indefensible in a nation that prides itself on Constitutional rights, protections and the rule of law.

Underneath all this, however, is where the paranoia sets in.

Underneath all this is the definition of "enemy combatant" that has been established by this legislation. An "enemy combatant" is now no longer just someone captured "during an armed conflict" against our forces. Thanks to this legislation, George W. Bush is now able to designate as an "enemy combatant" anyone who has "purposefully and materially supported hostilities against the United States."

Consider that language a moment. "Purposefully and materially supported hostilities against the United States" is in the eye of the beholder, and this administration has proven itself to be astonishingly impatient with criticism of any kind. The broad powers given to Bush by this legislation allow him to capture, indefinitely detain, and refuse a hearing to any American citizen who speaks out against Iraq or any other part of the so-called "War on Terror."

If you write a letter to the editor attacking Bush, you could be deemed as purposefully and materially supporting hostilities against the United States. If you organize or join a public demonstration against Iraq, or against the administration, the same designation could befall you. One dark-comedy aspect of the legislation is that senators or House members who publicly disagree with Bush, criticize him, or organize investigations into his dealings could be placed under the same designation. In effect, Congress just gave Bush the power to lock them up.

By writing this essay, I could be deemed an "enemy combatant." It's that simple, and very soon, it will be the law. I always laughed when people told me to be careful. I'm not laughing anymore.

In case I disappear, remember this. America is an idea, a dream, and that is all. We have borders and armies and citizens and commerce and industry, but all this merely makes us like every other nation on this Earth. What separates us is the idea, the simple idea, that life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness are our organizing principles. We can think as we please, speak as we please, write as we please, worship as we please, go where we please. We are protected from the kinds of tyranny that inspired our creation as a nation in the first place.

That was the idea. That was the dream. It may all be over now, but once upon a time, it existed. No good idea ever truly dies. The dream was here, and so was I, and so were you.

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#1. To: bluedogtxn (#0)

Thanks to this legislation, George W. Bush is now able to designate as an "enemy combatant" anyone who has "purposefully and materially supported hostilities against the United States."

Actually, not just "hostilities against the United States."

a person who has engaged in hostilities or who has purposefully and materially supported hostilities against the United States or its co- belligerents who is not a lawful enemy combatant

So materially supporting hostilities against one of our co-belligerents (presumably including the UK and Israel) is included. So somebody who donates money to or writes in support of Northern Aid (which has been associated with Sinn Fein and the IRA) or an Islamic charity that has passed on any money to Hezbollah or Hamas may well also be included.

Katrina was America's Chernobyl.

aristeides  posted on  2006-09-29   14:01:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: aristeides, Esso, Hmmmmm, Jethro Tull, mehitable, Morgana Le Fay, Diana, robin, IndieTx, lodwick, Ferret Mike, innieway, BTP Holdings, SKYDRIFTER, add925, Quatermass, FibrDog, Elliott Jackalope, JohnGalt, leveller, Lady X, all of us grievers for what was (#0) (Edited)

ping

christine  posted on  2006-09-29   14:17:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: bluedogtxn (#0)

Underneath all this, however, is where the paranoia sets in.

Step out of line, the man come and take you away.

Especially with Pinochet's pal Kissinger back at the White House.


I've already said too much.

MUDDOG  posted on  2006-09-29   14:20:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: bluedogtxn (#0)

Good post. Thanks.

Ferret Mike  posted on  2006-09-29   14:22:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: christine (#2)

Here's the deal. When you torture people, when you suspend Habeas Corpus, when you allow searches without warrants, and faceless accusers, and even take away to right to defend yourself, you have become ONE OF THE BAD GUYS. Got it? No "oh, it's different this time because.." or "they're terrorists, they fight dirty so we have to fight just as dirty" or "if it saves one life...." NO NO NO NO NO! When you TORTURE people, you become ONE OF THE BAD GUYS! FOREVER! GOT IT?

Imagine you're at a party, and the subject of previous careers comes up, and someone says "I used to torture people for a living, but now I'm a social worker, and save puppies and kitties, and do lots of good things for the community, and really, I'm a very nice person." Sure, except for the fact that you used to TORTURE PEOPLE! Once you cross that line, once you strap people down and start using sharp implements on them, or electric shocks, or "waterboarding", or whatever you do while you play your sick torture games, you are ONE OF THE BAD GUYS. FOREVER!

Gold and silver are real money, paper is but a promise.

Elliott Jackalope  posted on  2006-09-29   14:34:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: aristeides (#1)

Actually, not just "hostilities against the United States."

a person who has engaged in hostilities or who has purposefully and materially supported hostilities against the United States or its co- belligerents who is not a lawful enemy combatant

So no more trash-talking about Israel, or you go to Gitmo.

I guess when Ann Coulter said she wanted all liberals deported to Gitmo, she wasn't joking. Of course, I took her at her word.

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   14:41:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: MUDDOG (#3)

Step out of line, the man come and take you away.

And with no access to a lawyer and no access to the courts, reporters, phone calls....

nada.

You truly disappear. What was that existential book about the guy who was in prison and didn't know why forever? Was it "The Prisoner"? or am I thinking of something else?

Anyway, I guess it CAN happen here.

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   14:43:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: bluedogtxn (#0)

Over on the lefty blogs I see there are still people clinging to the fantasy that the glorious Democratic Party will fix all this after they win in the mid- terms. Heh. They're gonna play yet another hand of three-card monte with the politicians, and when they lose that hand just as they lost all the others they will still have that comical shocked look on their faces.

They still haven't figured out that their beloved Party is in on it.

alpowolf  posted on  2006-09-29   14:43:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Ferret Mike (#4)

Good post. Thanks.

de nada

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   14:44:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: alpowolf (#8)

Over on the lefty blogs I see there are still people clinging to the fantasy that the glorious Democratic Party will fix all this after they win in the mid- terms.

They aren't going to win in the mid terms.

Moot point.

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   14:45:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: bluedogtxn (#0)

When the JBTs crash into homes and arrest the inhabitants, most people submit to the authority because they know they will have their day in court. Once that presumption is destroyed, once people no longer are assured of due process the uneasy truce between the authorities and the population will fail. If a man knows that upon his arrest he will be "dissapeared" ,then he has nothing to lose, he might as well take as many with him as he can. That is what is on the line here, nothing less.

duckhunter  posted on  2006-09-29   14:48:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: duckhunter (#11)

When the JBTs crash into homes and arrest the inhabitants, most people submit to the authority because they know they will have their day in court. Once that presumption is destroyed, once people no longer are assured of due process the uneasy truce between the authorities and the population will fail. If a man knows that upon his arrest he will be "dissapeared" ,then he has nothing to lose, he might as well take as many with him as he can. That is what is on the line here, nothing less.

It takes a long time before that resistance gels, though. Expect a long, low- heat, simmering insurgency first.

Plus, with these asshats and this legislation, the "attacks" by the "domestic terrorists" will just be used to justify more draconian measures.

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   14:50:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: christine (#2)

~also grieving~

All should review this as well:

Congress Cuts Out, Wrecks Cyberprivacy

http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/postcomment.cgi?an=32685&cn=0

[snip] For starters, its scope. The treaty covers not only crimes commonly considered "cybercrimes," that is, crimes of computers by computers. It covers any activities considered a crime by any signatory country that simply involves the use of a computer somewhere along the line. In other words, if the law enforcement officials in Croatia are investigating activities in their country that they consider criminal — political speech, or possession of a firearm, for example — they can now demand of U.S. law enforcement that it collect and turn over to them information they might demand which they allege involves a U.S. citizen, notwithstanding that U.S. citizen has done nothing deemed a crime under U.S. law. Of course, the U.S. citizen would be unaware his own government was thus snooping on him and sharing the fruits thereof with a foreign government.
Moreover, this latest treaty affords no privacy protections whatsoever for U.S. citizens. It also will force Internet service providers to comply, yet requires neither the U.S. government nor the foreign requesting government to reimburse Internet service providers for costs of such forced cooperation. In addition, if disputes under the treaty arise, the foreign requesting government is empowered to take the issue to the International Court of Justice. Even though the United States has not formally acceded to the court, it would be required pursuant to the terms of the Cybercrime Treaty to be bound by its decisions. Although Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, in a letter to the Senate offering unqualified support for the treaty, promised the administration would not submit any disputes to the International Court of Justice, such promises are meaningless, because other nations will do so. Such fine points apparently were unfathomable by senators eager to do the administration's bidding.
/end snip

~~

jessejane  posted on  2006-09-29   14:53:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: MUDDOG (#3)

Step out of line, the man come and take you away.

G. Gordon Liddy's comments are becoming ever more pertinent.

Buzzard  posted on  2006-09-29   14:54:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: bluedogtxn (#12)

Plus, with these asshats and this legislation, the "attacks" by the "domestic terrorists" will just be used to justify more draconian measures.

Which is in of itself a self propogating system. The more draconian the crackdown, the stronger the insurgency. Sort of an exponential expansion. I believe the low simmering has already begun. If TSHTF continues at this pace it will likely happen before I am a Sr citizen.

duckhunter  posted on  2006-09-29   14:55:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Buzzard (#14)

G. Gordon Liddy's comments are becoming ever more pertinent.

What did that felon say?

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   14:58:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: bluedogtxn (#0)

so the Magna Carta-era rule that a person can face his accusers is now gone.

Since 1215...all gone thanks to the Bush/Cheney Cabal and this Congress/Senate.

"If there’s another 9/11 or a major war in the Middle-East involving a U.S. attack on Iran, I have no doubt that there will be, the day after or within days an equivalent of a Reichstag fire decree that will involve massive detentions in this country."

- Daniel Ellsberg Author, Pentagon Papers

robin  posted on  2006-09-29   15:00:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: bluedogtxn (#7)

You truly disappear. What was that existential book about the guy who was in prison and didn't know why forever? Was it "The Prisoner"? or am I thinking of something else?

One of my all time favorite shows with Patrick McGoohan as the spook who knew too much and was permanently exiled to the Village, where they played a wide variety of sometimes fatal mind games.

Be seeing you.

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-09-29   15:02:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: bluedogtxn (#10)

That's part of their fantasy; they think they will win, and nothing can dissuade them from that view.

alpowolf  posted on  2006-09-29   15:03:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: duckhunter, all (#11)

he might as well take as many with him as he can.

You have spoken truly. And people will be disappearing for some time before we/I/you and others become aware of it, because that is the way these sick people operate. Welcome to the Palastinian/Iraq nightmare; war in the streets. Oh, yes, it will take some time to arrive, but it will not take that long for people to start disappearing (can anybody say, bye bye 9/11 government conspiracy?) And do you not believe that this was needed before the next signature event, as Cheny said, a nuclear event, happened? That is when Mr. Bush will come right out and say on TV that we have to take care of who live amoung us and who support the terrorist first. That is when you will know that the gloves are all the way off. Welcome, ladies and gentlemen, to the United States of Amerika.

The Talmudic Khazar-Jew dream; Christians killing Muslims and Muslims killing Christians. What could be better than that? Well, Whites killing non-Whites and non-Whites killing Whites, of course.

richard9151  posted on  2006-09-29   15:04:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: robin (#17)

"Electoral Vote Predictor", a polling place I think is pretty good (called 2004 for Kerry, but had Kerry winning Ohio, which was Diebolded and he probably did win it); has it's current prediction up, which is 215 Democratic seats in the House; 220 Republicans; and the Senate stays Republican by one.

That's only going to shift Republican as the election nears.

So the madness will continue, unabated. No subpoenas, no investigations, no hearings.

Just "forward the dick-tater ship".

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   15:04:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: alpowolf (#8)

Over on the lefty blogs I see there are still people clinging to the fantasy that the glorious Democratic Party will fix all this after they win in the mid- terms. Heh. They're gonna play yet another hand of three-card monte with the politicians, and when they lose that hand just as they lost all the others they will still have that comical shocked look on their faces.

They still haven't figured out that their beloved Party is in on it.

Yeah I still listen to Air America and they are also delusional about that Democratic White Knight coming along and saving their progressive asses. Two sides of the same coin - it's all about the NWO/globalism/corporatism/fascism. No difference between Dem/Repub or Lib/Con. it's a fake dichotomy. They'll wake up someday but it's hard to learn that everything you believed was a lie.

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-09-29   15:04:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Elliott Jackalope (#5)

you are ONE OF THE BAD GUYS. FOREVER!

Christians believe that repentance and redemption are always possible.

Even though Count Helldorf helped to bring the Nazis to power, and served under them in such high positions as Police President of Berlin, and even though the high police official Arthur Nebe was one of the original Einsatzgruppe commanders that started the genocide in the invasion of Russia, I think they both redeemed themselves by the leading roles they played in the plot against Hitler, for which Helldorf at least paid with his life.

Katrina was America's Chernobyl.

aristeides  posted on  2006-09-29   15:05:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: alpowolf (#19)

That's part of their fantasy; they think they will win, and nothing can dissuade them from that view.

Well, if you were about to be shot, but there was JUST A CHANCE of avoiding it, wouldn't you cling to it with all your might?

When they lose (and they will), hopefully the Democratic Party will experience a shaking up, and get rid of the circular firing squad mentality that keeps them from putting up good candidates.

That's MY wishful thinking for you.

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-09-29   15:06:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: mehitable (#22)

They also seem unaware that their cries of "stay with the Party" sound remarkably like Bush's "stay the course in Iraq".

alpowolf  posted on  2006-09-29   15:08:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: aristeides (#23)

Christians believe that repentance and redemption are always possible.

Yes, and George W. Bush is a Christian. A Christian who is advocating TORTURE!

*sigh* - just another day in the shamboozle fraudscam factory...

Gold and silver are real money, paper is but a promise.

Elliott Jackalope  posted on  2006-09-29   15:10:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: robin (#17)

Habeas corpus has been suspended before. Lincoln tried to suspend it in 1861, and, whatever you think about the legality of his attempt, it was certainly suspended by Act of Congress in 1863, for the duration of the Civil War. Congress suspended it again in certain parts of the South during Reconstruction. It was suspended in Britain during the Wars of the French Revolution.

The trouble is, those were emergencies of limited duration, after which the suspension ended. The War on Terror is apparently intended to be a permanent war.

Katrina was America's Chernobyl.

aristeides  posted on  2006-09-29   15:10:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: alpowolf (#25)

I can only listen to them for so long before I want to hurl the radio at the wall. They just don't get it that BOTH parties are owned by Globalist/Corporate/Fascist NWO elites and it just doesn't matter any more. I'm tired of this election pretense when the vast majority of people now realize that it DOESN"T MATTER if they vote because the pols WON"T do what they want even if the elections don't appear to be rigged. That's why so many people don't vote anymore. They're just apathetic.

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-09-29   15:12:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: aristeides (#23)

May the parallels continue, but with greater accuracy. Warning: oak table legs are very strong.

"If there’s another 9/11 or a major war in the Middle-East involving a U.S. attack on Iran, I have no doubt that there will be, the day after or within days an equivalent of a Reichstag fire decree that will involve massive detentions in this country."

- Daniel Ellsberg Author, Pentagon Papers

robin  posted on  2006-09-29   15:12:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: alpowolf (#25)

Maybe if we can get the idea of "good cop, bad cop" into their heads.....cause that's what the Dems/Pubs are.

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-09-29   15:12:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: bluedogtxn (#24)

When they lose (and they will), hopefully the Democratic Party will experience a shaking up, and get rid of the circular firing squad mentality that keeps them from putting up good candidates.

They have no good candidates. Anyone who advances to the higher echelons of power in the party has already sold out to the point of being indistinguishable from the Rs.

duckhunter  posted on  2006-09-29   15:13:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: mehitable (#28)

I'm tired of this election pretense

I can't remeber who said it (Von Mises?) but today's elections are little more than an advanced auction of stolen goods.

duckhunter  posted on  2006-09-29   15:15:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: bluedogtxn (#16)

What did that felon say?

“They've got a big target on there: ATF.
Don't shoot at that because they've got a vest on underneath that.
Head shot, head shots.”
~~ G. Gordon Liddy

Personally I'd disregard the reference to the ATF and broaden the scope to all applicable parties.

(And IIRC, the main reason Liddy ended up a felon was because he didn't snitch on his buddies.)
When the sh*t does hit the fan, people who can keep their mouth shut (and wits about them) under pressure will be worth their weight in gold.

Buzzard  posted on  2006-09-29   15:16:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: robin (#29)

May the parallels continue, but with greater accuracy. Warning: oak table legs are very strong.

Greater accuracy indeed...

duckhunter  posted on  2006-09-29   15:16:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: bluedogtxn (#0)

When it comes time to 'disappear', I can only hope some of us wind up in the same place, so we can share a glass of stagnant water and a bowl of warm gruel; while reflecting on "the good old days".

Remember...G-d saved more animals than people on the ark. www.siameserescue.org

who knows what evil  posted on  2006-09-29   15:22:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: duckhunter (#32)

I can't remeber who said it (Von Mises?) but today's elections are little more than an advanced auction of stolen goods.

Mencken.

SmokinOPs  posted on  2006-09-29   15:23:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: SmokinOPs (#36)

Mencken.

Thanks.

duckhunter  posted on  2006-09-29   15:23:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: aristeides (#27)

Thanks for the historical correction. I wonder how many 9/11 or Madrid or London bombings will be required and how often for the WOT to be kept alive.

"If there’s another 9/11 or a major war in the Middle-East involving a U.S. attack on Iran, I have no doubt that there will be, the day after or within days an equivalent of a Reichstag fire decree that will involve massive detentions in this country."

- Daniel Ellsberg Author, Pentagon Papers

robin  posted on  2006-09-29   15:26:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: mehitable (#28)

They just don't get it that BOTH parties are owned by Globalist/Corporate/Fascist NWO elites and it just doesn't matter any more.

You're absolutely right...just look at the membership of the Council on Foreign Relations...Democrats AND Republicans galore.

Remember...G-d saved more animals than people on the ark. www.siameserescue.org

who knows what evil  posted on  2006-09-29   15:28:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Elliott Jackalope (#26)

Yes, and George W. Bush is a Christian.

grrrrrr...that makes me absolutely furious when i hear it said. christian words (that's stretching it) with unchristian acts.

christine  posted on  2006-09-29   15:33:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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