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War, War, War
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Title: Two Marines Killed In Fighting In Anbar Province; 23 U.S. servicemembers killed in Iraq this week...
Source: Associated Press
URL Source: http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2006 ... /ME_GEN_Iraq_US_Casualties.php
Published: Oct 5, 2006
Author: Associated Press
Post Date: 2006-10-05 17:16:13 by Brian S
Keywords: None
Views: 379
Comments: 28

Two Marines killed in fighting in Anbar province The Associated Press

Published: October 5, 2006

BAGHDAD, Iraq Two U.S. Marines were killed in fighting in Iraq's western Anbar province, a hotbed of the Shiite insurgency, the U.S. command announced Thursday.

The two Marines, assigned to Regimental Combat Team 7, were killed from "enemy action" on Wednesday, the command said in a statement.

It provided no further details and said their names were being withheld pending notification of their families. Their deaths brought to 23 the number of U.S. servicemembers killed in Iraq this week.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 15.

#4. To: Brian S (#0)

23 U.S. servicemembers killed in Iraq this week...

How many of the 23 were killed by small arms fire? And what does this change in enemy tactics signify?

aristeides  posted on  2006-10-05   17:32:36 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

I agree with Burkeman1, this demonstrates greater strength on the insurgency. It also shows that their tactics and training are improving, and they're growing in confidence. Traditionally, a prudent enemy commander wouldn't countenance giving battle with the US forces anywhere. Now it appears that they're more willing to take that risk, which doesn't bode well for us. They could also be getting more accurate with their firing. For at least two years it was always said that "spray and pray" was the firing technique of choice for the insurgency. Maybe that's changed a bit.

I spoke at length with a Major that was over there with me about how he would train if he was leading them, and what tactics he would use. It was really a common sense type of approach, with in the beginning use ambushes and occasional indirect fire until they're well trained enough to combine an ambush with indirect fire and possibly IEDs. The insurgency has pretty much followed a similar path.

One thing that weakens this argument a little bit is that the Marines were issued the SAPI plates for their body armor (after the scandal about the quality of the armor) but they decided that mobility was more important than protection, as the plates make the armor quite heavy. If one is doing a foot patrol as opposed to a mounted patrol, the body armor wears you out. Since the Marines possibly aren't wearing the extra protective plates, they would have more small arms casualties that the plates would have stopped otherwise. As an aside, I worked last year with a different Major who was involved with the procurement of the body armor, and the PM that was handling it one day looked at him and said "There are worse things than dying, you know." It was a statement in response to all the horrificly maimed soldiers who would have died except for the armor keeping their vital portions so well protected that multiple limbs were destroyed during an attack.

historian1944  posted on  2006-10-05   18:34:38 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

The single greatest life saver in this war has been the development of quick clotting agents that stop bleeding almost immediately even on massive wounds. Men who would have died in minutes after having their lower half blown off have been saved. All sorts utterly disfiguring injuries that no one would have thought possible to be survivable have been treated successfully in Iraq.

The flip side of this is that you have many many soliders who are little more than a torso and head or wounded in such ways that by all right they shouldn't be alive- often with brain damage as well. Things worse than death? Yep.

Burkeman1  posted on  2006-10-05   19:57:57 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

#22. To: Burkeman1 (#15)

In American Lit, Dalton Trumbo's 1938 Johnny Got His Gun is the only book I can think of from that generation of post-World War One writers who focused on this aspect you mention. While Mr.Trumbo was a Red (he had to do the screenplay for Sparatcus under a psuedonym after getting blacklisted), his focus on the individual was uniquely American while the anti- war Europeans focused on the lies of adults (Kipling's poetry and Remarque's All Quiet...where the protagonist has a clean sniper's death at the end) Hemingway, while brilliant in A Farewell to Arms, did join the fray for the Reds in Spain (like Orwell) so they weren't anti-war, just anti-that war...and just like Trumbo after the Werhmarcht invaded Russia.

JGHG:
He threw back his head and started to yell from fright. But he only started because he had no mouth to yell with. He was so surprised at not yelling when he tried that he began to work his jaws like a man who has found something interesting and wants to test it. He was so sure the idea of no mouth was a dream that he could investigate it calmly. He tried to work his jaws and he had no jaws. He tried to run his tongue around the inside of his teeth and over the roof of his mouth as if he were chasing a raspberry seed. But he didn't have any tongue and he hadn't any teeth. There was no roof to his mouth and there was no mouth. He tried to swallow but he couldn't because he had no palate and there weren't any muscles left to swallow with.

FYI, there is a Maine soldier living this hell about an hour from here at a Vet hospital. His story was on tv for 3 minutes a few years ago, and the family said they were just so glad he was alive.

JohnGalt  posted on  2006-10-06 10:23:50 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  

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