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9/11
See other 9/11 Articles

Title: 9/11 Families Outraged After Body Parts Found
Source: msnbc.msn.com
URL Source: http://msnbc.msn.com/id/15345694/
Published: Oct 20, 2006
Author: MSNBC
Post Date: 2006-10-20 11:37:13 by Mind_Virus
Keywords: None
Views: 267
Comments: 30

9/11 Families Outraged After Body Parts Found

Utility crews stumble onto bones that might be from WTC victim

NEW YORK - The discovery of human bones in a damaged manhole at the World Trade Center site has outraged victims’ families, who say the city hasn’t done enough to ensure the remains of those killed in the 2001 terrorist attack are located and treated with respect.

Some relatives called for a new, systematic search by outside experts, such as the military command that identifies missing soldiers’ remains.

“We can no longer rely on accidental discoveries,” the group WTC Families for Proper Burial said in a statement Thursday. “This must be a deliberate search. May this awful news be the catalyst needed to go back and do the job well.”

The remains, some as big as arm or leg bones, were found Thursday by a Port Authority contractor working with a Consolidated Edison crew excavating a manhole, said Steve Coleman, a spokesman for the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, which owns the trade center site.

The crew had already hauled excavated materials to a work center, and more remains were later found there, said Con Ed spokesman Mike Clendenin.

Near area where 9/11 events held

The area where the remains were found is near the spot where a podium is erected each Sept. 11 for families to read the names of their loved ones. It was roped off after the discovery, and investigators began sifting through the dirt under a white tarp.

Police said there was no evidence of wrongdoing but the investigation was continuing.

WTC Families for Proper Burial said it would hold a news conference Friday “to express our outrage at the continued cavalier attitude toward the retrieval of human remains.”

Five years after 2,749 people died in the World Trade Center attack, families of about 1,150 victims still have not received word that their loved ones’ remains were found amid the rubble.

The remains of Charles Wolf’s wife, Katherine, 40, were never recovered. He said his wife, an employee of insurer Marsh & McLennan, was on the 97th floor of the north tower when the building collapsed.

“I am totally shocked that this was found in the pit,” said Wolf, 52, who was notified of the discovery by television stations.

“The fact that they were found in ground zero says there was some major, major shortfall in the recovery effort,” Wolf said. “Where else are we going to find them next?”

Military investigators?

Wolf called for a “qualified independent party” to get involved, such as investigators with the military’s Joint POW/MIA Accounting Command, which identifies the remains of U.S. soldiers once listed as missing in action.

The excavation of the 110-story twin towers began the evening of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks and lasted for nine months. About 20,000 pieces of human remains were found. The DNA in thousands of those pieces, many small enough to slip into a test tube, was too damaged by heat, humidity and time to yield matches in the many tests forensic scientists have tried over the years.

The city told victims’ families last year that it was putting the project on hold, possibly for years, until new DNA technology is developed, because every known process had been tried.

Last month, Medical Examiner Charles Hirsch said advances had been made by Bode Technology Group, the Virginia company contracted to work on recovered Sept. 11 bone fragments, and that “new identifications will be forthcoming.”

Besides the new remains found by the utility workers, the lab recently received hundreds of bone fragments discovered on the roof of a nearby building. The building was condemned after the attacks and was about to be torn down when workers found the bone pieces.

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#1. To: Mind_Virus (#0)

........offer them another million or so, that will shut them up and make them happy ........ for awhile ......... then the outrage will reappear because of some other reason .......... perfect example of people thrust into the limelight and not being able to deal appropriately ........... these relatives are not special in anyway .......... the least stupid took their booty, shut their pie holes and ran ..........

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   11:49:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Mind_Virus (#0)

How horrible. I feel sorry for the workers making such grisly discoveries. How can one be prepared for that?

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-10-20   12:22:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: It Is A Republic, all (#1)

Don't you have any goddamn sense at all? Seriously, if that was a relative of yours - your husband or wife or kid blown to bits and lying in a manhole pit for 5 years wouldn't YOU BE UPSET????? What the FUCK is WRONG with you?

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-10-20   12:23:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: It Is A Republic (#1)

An excellent documentary about the families of the victims of 911 and their fight to uncover and expose the truth of what happened that day. 911 Press for Truth

It was a ten second free fall..that's what I saw, that's what you saw..that's what everybody saw...

christine  posted on  2006-10-20   12:29:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Mind_Virus (#0)

...The DNA in thousands of those pieces, many small enough to slip into a test tube, was too damaged by heat, humidity and time to yield matches in the many tests forensic scientists have tried over the years...

Interesting how the feds were able to match all the DNA from Shanksville and the Pentagon except for the "hijackers".

Mark

The FBI, rather than trying to prevent a terrorist attack, was merely gathering intelligence so they would know who to arrest when a terrorist attack occurred.— Robert Wright - Former FBI agent

Given the scope of the tragedy from last week, I am glad to reassure the people of New York and Washington, D.C., that their air is safe to breathe and their water is safe to drink."— Christie Todd Whitman - 9/18/2001

Kamala  posted on  2006-10-20   13:39:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Kamala (#5)

Interesting how the feds were able to match all the DNA from Shanksville and the Pentagon except for the "hijackers".

cough. cough.

It was a ten second free fall..that's what I saw, that's what you saw..that's what everybody saw...

christine  posted on  2006-10-20   13:40:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: christine (#6)

cough. cough.

BAD cough you have there.

Cynicom  posted on  2006-10-20   13:47:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: mehitable (#3)

Comments like that from "pro life Republicans" are the reason I am no longer a Republican.

Remember...G-d saved more animals than people on the ark. www.siameserescue.org

who knows what evil  posted on  2006-10-20   14:24:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: who knows what evil (#8)

That comment from It's a Republic was the last thing I would expect any decent person to even THINK of, must less write about some workers finding 5 year old body parts from a tragedy. That's way out of line to me.

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-10-20   14:41:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: mehitable (#3)

Don't you have any goddamn sense at all? Seriously, if that was a relative of yours - your husband or wife or kid blown to bits and lying in a manhole pit for 5 years wouldn't YOU BE UPSET????? What the FUCK is WRONG with you?

Are those killed in the WTC better than those killed in battle, in a car wreck, or drowned, or any other way in any other place. Those with their hands out are opportunists. Money will not relieve real grief. I don't need a bag of bones or a sack of cash to see reality. How much would cash would it take to make you happy? Would you feel better if your loved one was killed by a drive by shooter? The question is not what is wrong with me, but how much cash your loved ones are worth to you.

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   14:48:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Mind_Virus, It Is A Republic (#0)

Wolf called for a “qualified independent party” to get involved, such as investigators with the military’s Joint POW/MIA Accounting Command, which identifies the remains of U.S. soldiers once listed as missing in action.

Um...fox, henhouse??? If military investigators were to become involved, perhaps they might find body parts and the DNA of the hijckers, yes?

Just kidding, folks....I'm sure a very thorough job would be done.

There is one aspect of IIAR's point that I agree with 100% though I might phrase the sentiment a bit differently. That is, I thought it was shameful that Congress was so quick to sign off on taxpayer paid million dollar checks to 9/11 victims' surviving families ( some of whom were illegals who should not have been working in this country in the first place) and then Congress and MSM proceeded to refer to the 9/11 victims as "heroes."

a) Why did you and I "owe" $ to the surviving family members for 9/11 - we did not cause the action.

b) And what did these 9/11 victims do [ aside from the rescue workers] that was so heroic?

There are thousands of families who lose loved ones every day through tragic accidents be it by a car accident or corporate negligence or by crime or by illness for which we have not discovered cures yet - are taxpayers held responsible for these tragic deaths just because the deaths occurred on US soil and America "did not do enough" to stop these deaths?

The families of Pearl Harbor or Oklahoma bombing were not compensated in such a generous taxpayer funded fashion as the 9/11 ones. What was all that about? I think the quick gov't checks in the mail sent to 9/11 victims' families was probably the first red flag about the tragic event.

scrapper2  posted on  2006-10-20   15:29:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: It Is A Republic, christine, aristeides, war, leveller (#1)

........offer them another million or so, that will shut them up and make them happy ........ for awhile ......... then the outrage will reappear because of some other reason .......... perfect example of people thrust into the limelight and not being able to deal appropriately ........... these relatives are not special in anyway .......... the least stupid took their booty, shut their pie holes and ran ..........

Byeltsin?

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-10-20   16:18:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: It Is A Republic (#10)

Those with their hands out are opportunists.

Funny. There wasn't a single thing about money in the initial post. Just people pissed off that more care wasn't taken with the remains of the dead. Of course, as a GOP tool, the first thing that comes to your mind when people are upset is "how much is this gonna cost me?" That, and "how can I pimp the party line on this story? Oh yeah. Greedy 9-11 widows. That's the talking point on this one." I hope no one's paying you for this amateurish propaganda pimping. They ought to get their money back.

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-10-20   16:23:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: bluedogtxn (#13)

I hope no one's paying you for this amateurish propaganda pimping.

Astute observation !

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."

Samuel Adams

noone222  posted on  2006-10-20   16:29:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: It Is A Republic, all (#10)

You are some kind of mental case. This article is about workers finding body parts from 9/11 in a manhole pit and the relatives are upset about this. Now whether there is any merit to their argument or not, ANY NORMAL PERSON IS GOING TO BE UPSET ABOUT THEIR RELATIVE'S REMAINING SMALL BITS BEING FOUND IN A HOLE 5 YEARS AFTER THEIR DEATH.

There is something profoundly wrong with you that the first thing you think of when someone finds body parts is money. That is NOT the first thing any normal person would think of. You're a nut.

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-10-20   16:29:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: It Is A Republic (#10)

Are those killed in the WTC better than those killed in battle, in a car wreck, or drowned, or any other way in any other place.

George Bush and his GOP made a huge deal out of the WTC dead. Now Bush and Grand Old Pervs wish they'd just go away.

"Stiff-necked and thin-skinned is no way to go through life, son."

bluegrass  posted on  2006-10-20   16:35:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: bluedogtxn (#13)

They took great care of all the remains found. These were just found. I'm sure you think it was intentional and part of the master plot by Bush to take over the world. The same group of money hungry asses still unable to properly dispose of their anger and who have been bitching about everything that does not please them are screaming again. Money shuts them up. They bitched about the kind of ceremony necessary, what kind of replacement building would be acceptable, what tributes would be OK or not OK. They are in the spotlight not because of their sacrifice, but because one of their friends/family/whatever were killed in the WTC. Death happens to a lot of people and their survivors are not treated like these clowns. As usual you make everything DemonRat vs Republican because you are a scum sucking CDA Yellow dog rat regardless of what you claim. Drink your koolaid the rats sent you and go try to get a guilty pedophile off the hook just because you are for sale to anyone willing to pay you.

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   16:54:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: bluegrass (#16)

Regardless of who paid them it was a stupid mistake.

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   16:56:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: It Is A Republic (#18)

it was a stupid mistake.

What was a stupid mistake?

"Stiff-necked and thin-skinned is no way to go through life, son."

bluegrass  posted on  2006-10-20   16:57:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: It Is A Republic (#17)

Like I said. There wasn't a single thing about money in the initial post, but you gotta pimp the "greedy 9-11 families" line.

Oooooh. And the obligatory "you're a bad ole criminal defense attorney" crap you gotta cut and paste onto anything you post to me.

What a predictable shill you are.

the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal bread.

bluedogtxn  posted on  2006-10-20   16:58:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: It Is A Republic (#10)

Really, you do have a point. Think of all the "missing" and dismembered in the World Wars, all those buried at sea since time immemorialor sunk immediately.

But the nastiness of this is the fact that it's right in the heart of Gotham City.

I bet considering the amount of money handed out, quite a few people wished and thought of a couple of relatives who they wished had been breakfasting at the Windows of the World that morning.

Pray you will never know, the hell where youth and laughter go - Siegfried Sassoon. Ypres, Autumn 1914.

swarthyguy  posted on  2006-10-20   17:00:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: mehitable (#15)

Those remains were not intentionally overlooked or intentionally not found. Those looking and working the site were not political operatives doing political things. They were policemen, firemen, people from all kinds of work, etc. who themselves may have lost friends and loved ones there and have in many cases suffered health problems because of their efforts. It has been 5 years. Those bitching have a motive and it is not because of the loss of their loved ones.

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   17:04:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: It Is A Republic (#22)

I repeat: you have a mental problem. The reaction of people who discover that their loved ones remains have been stuck in a hole for 5 years is going to be sorrow, pain, rage, anger, and probably a host of other emotions. I don't know if their concerns are justified are not, but I certainly understand - as a human being - how they feel this way. That you have no respect or regard for these surviving relatives, and you are so coldly dismissive of their very natural feelings, and so willing to assign a vile monetary motive to them - that NO ONE has mentioned - is simply disgusting.

"I woke up in the CRAZY HOUSE."

mehitable  posted on  2006-10-20   17:13:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: bluegrass (#19)

George Bush and his GOP made a huge deal out of the WTC dead.

it was a stupid mistake.

What was a stupid mistake?

George Bush and his GOP making a huge deal out of the WTC dead and paying the survivors anything.

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   17:29:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: mehitable (#23)

That you have no respect or regard for these surviving relatives, and you are so coldly dismissive of their very natural feelings

Their very natural feelings my axle. They don't yet know who the remains belong to. Again thay are merely people who had family/friends etc who died. Every effort was made by everyday people to recover all remains and show respect the bodies, parts, and their survivors and relatives. To even bitch because some more parts were found shows that their were political/other motives of those bitching. Those people have been dead over 5 years and their bones/parts/ whatever were not disrespected in any way, just not found.

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   17:38:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: It Is A Republic, bluedogtxn (#17)

Drink your koolaid the rats sent you and go try to get a guilty pedophile off the hook

bluedog probably doesnt defend GOPers :p

When it comes to heroes, Renegades are mine..

christine  posted on  2006-10-20   17:47:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: christine (#26)

He would if they paid him. The title has been defined, all that remains is the price to be paid.

It Is A Republic  posted on  2006-10-20   17:53:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: It Is A Republic, mehitable, bluedogtxn (#25)

They don't yet know who the remains belong to. Again thay are merely people who had family/friends etc who died. Every effort was made by everyday people to recover all remains and show respect the bodies, parts, and their survivors and relatives. To even bitch because some more parts were found shows that their were political/other motives of those bitching. Those people have been dead over 5 years and their bones/parts/ whatever were not disrespected in any way, just not found.

There is some truth to what you say, IIAR, though it strikes me you could have made the same observations less crudely, less offensively.

Nonetheless, I do agree with most of what you say, especially with regards to the ulterior motives of the 9/11 victims family spokesperson who is interviewed for this article - Charles Wolf. Though he blusters and rages in this article about the remains that were found, calling for special military investigations, etc, the fact of the matter, just recently, he was interviewed by the BBC and it appeared that Mr. Wolf's pre- 9/11 humble life as a singer living on limited means was transformed by the 9/11 tragedy and compensation and as of 9/11/06 he is now referred to as an in demand businessman and his post 9/11 life is humming along just fine these days- shortly after his wife's untimely death, he got into a serious relationship that lasted 3 years( maybe it's just me, but it seems abit short of a grieving period to supplant spousal loss with a facsimile love product). Also Charles Wolf was adamant in getting maximum $ for loss of family members at the 9/11 site. That seemed to be his main goal if anyone wants to look at his fixthe fund site. He even has 2 versions of text for his site - in one he rails at Mr. Feinberg for being a cruel and unfeeling lawyer. Then a later version of the text, his tone is more moderate regarding criticism of Mr. Feinberg - perhaps Mr. Feinberg upped the ante?

I, too, am getting bad vibes about where all this outrage expressed by Mr. Wolf today is headed...in the BBC interview on 09/11/06 he seemed quite calm and bore no ill-will to anyone in government, he had turned a negative into a positive in his words.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi /uk_news/5321746.stm

"9/11 attention 'magnifies pain'" by Clare Babbidge, 09/11/06, BBC News

As 11 September approaches, American businessman Charles Wolf is a man in demand. As well as fending off business calls to his New York office, the 52- year-old is receiving a stream of calls from media organisations, keen to get the widower's viewpoint five years on from the disaster which transformed his world..."One has to understand the memories don't go away for the rest of the year, and all the attention on the anniversary can be very, very difficult," he said.

However, Mr Wolf said he agreed to interviews "in honour of Katherine" - his wife - and also because he saw a necessary relationship with a media which had helped highlight post-9/11 projects he had been part of...On that horrific day, Mr Wolf was at home in the small apartment they shared in Greenwich Village and was alerted by the sound of a low-flying plane.

...Mr Wolf met Katherine, a classically-trained pianist, 13 years earlier when she was visiting New York. She had been working as an accompanist for a London amateur operetta group and went to the US when it staged a joint production with a Manhattan group. Mr Wolf, who sang with the New York group, vividly remembers seeing Katherine for the first time, at the church hall where they were rehearsing.

Following Katherine's death, Mr Wolf was thrust into a new arena, becoming involved in what he calls "post-9/11 activities". He founded a campaign called "Fix the Fund", an advocacy organisation for victims' families aimed at addressing what it saw as problems in the September 11 Victim Compensation Fund of 2001.He also gives his views on New York's future as a member of the Family Advisory Council of the Lower Manhattan Development Corp.

"I have been trying to turn a negative into a positive, trying to do something to help," he said.

It was this attitude which prompted his recent speech to British industry chiefs who are helping to raise money for the British Memorial Garden in Lower Manhattan.

The $6.5m (£3.4m) project, which Prince Charles and Camilla visited last year, is dedicated to the UK victims.Mr Wolf said his involvement in such projects had helped him move forward, as had the passage of time and Reiki healing.

"You can't live in the past, you can remember it, but you can't stay living in it," he said. "The present attention magnifies it, but my life is moving forward... it's been five years now."

He said he was dating again and had had a relationship which lasted nearly three years, while some other spouses of victims had re-married.

Mr Wolf added that he was not angry over his lost future with Katherine, as he could see no point in this emotion...

http://www.fixthefund.org/NYTimes11-13-02artilce.htm

*Original version of fixthefund dated 03/07/03

http://www.fixthefund.org/2003030 7.html

***Updated version of fixthefund dated 12/01/03

http://www.fixthefund.org/

scrapper2  posted on  2006-10-20   18:35:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: bluedogtxn (#12)

Byeltsin?

LOL. One of the greatest of elPee posters.

leveller  posted on  2006-10-21   18:03:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: It Is A Republic (#24)

George Bush and his GOP making a huge deal out of the WTC dead and paying the survivors anything.

The GOP, the media, Israelis and the usual shills on the net made the big deals about the WTC dead. You'd think a bunch of Jews had just died with all of the "Never Forget!" BS coming out of the Jewish and goyish press. Some "Holocaust Uber Alles" Jewish chick is even running the WTC Museum in NYC.

That the Feds paid out any money at all to the families tells me who was actually responsible for 9/11. Hint: It wasn't 19 Arabs.

"Stiff-necked and thin-skinned is no way to go through life, son."

bluegrass  posted on  2006-10-21   23:28:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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