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Title: Science told: hands off gay sheep
Source:
The Sunday Times via the raw story
URL Source: http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle ... stuff%2Findex.php%3Fid%3D10250
Published: Jan 1, 2007
Author: Isabel Oakeshott and Chris Gourlay
Post Date: 2007-01-01 15:08:50 by robin
Keywords: None
Views: 640
Comments: 74
The Sunday Times December 31, 2006 Science told: hands off gay sheep Isabel Oakeshott and Chris Gourlay Experiments that claim to ‘cure’ homosexual rams spark anger SCIENTISTS are conducting experiments to change the sexuality of “gay” sheep in a programme that critics fear could pave the way for breeding out homosexuality in humans. The technique being developed by American researchers adjusts the hormonal balance in the brains of homosexual rams so that they are more inclined to mate with ewes. It raises the prospect that pregnant women could one day be offered a treatment to reduce or eliminate the chance that their offspring will be homosexual. Experts say that, in theory, the “straightening” procedure on humans could be as simple as a hormone supplement for mothers-to-be, worn on the skin like an anti-smoking nicotine patch. The research, at Oregon State University in the city of Corvallis and at the Oregon Health and Science University in Portland, has caused an outcry. Martina Navratilova, the lesbian tennis player who won Wimbledon nine times, and scientists and gay rights campaigners in Britain have called for the project to be abandoned. Navratilova defended the “right” of sheep to be gay. She said: “How can it be that in the year 2006 a major university would host such homophobic and cruel experiments?” She said gay men and lesbians would be “deeply offended” by the social implications of the tests. But the researchers argue that the work is valid, shedding light on the “broad question” of what determines sexual orientation. They insist the work is not aimed at “curing” homosexuality. Approximately one ram in 10 prefers to mount other rams rather than mate with ewes, reducing its value to a farmer. Initially, the publicly funded project aimed to improve the productivity of herds. The scientists have been able to pinpoint the mechanisms influencing the desires of “male-oriented” rams by studying their brains. The animals’ skulls are cut open and electronic sensors are attached to their brains. By varying the hormone levels, mainly by injecting hormones into the brain, they have had “considerable success” in altering the rams’ sexuality, with some previously gay animals becoming attracted to ewes. Professor Charles Roselli, the Health and Science University biologist leading the research, defended the project. He said: “In general, sexuality has been under-studied because of political concerns. People don’t want science looking into what determines sexuality. “It’s a touchy issue. In fact, several studies have shown that people who believe homosexuality is biologically based are less homophobic than people who think that this orientation is acquired.” The research is being peer-reviewed by a panel of scientists in America, demonstrating that it is being taken seriously by the academic community. Potentially, the techniques could one day be adapted for human use, with doctors perhaps being able to offer parents pre-natal tests to determine the likely sexuality of offspring or a hormonal treatment to change the orientation of a child. Roselli has said he would be “uncomfortable” about parents choosing sexuality, but argues that it is up to policy makers to legislate on questions of ethics. Michael Bailey, a neurology professor at Northwestern University near Chicago, said: “Allowing parents to select their children’s sexual orientation would further a parent’s freedom to raise the sort of children they want to raise.” Critics fear the findings could be abused. Udo Schuklenk, Professor of Bioethics at Glasgow Caledonian University, who has written to the researchers pressing them to stop, said: “I don’t believe the motives of the study are homophobic, but their work brings the terrible possibility of exploitation by homophobic societies. Imagine this technology in the hands of Iran, for example. “It is typical of the US to ignore the global context in which this is taking place.” Peter Tatchell, the gay rights campaigner, said: “These experiments echo Nazi research in the early 1940s which aimed at eradicating homosexuality. They stink of eugenics. There is a danger that extreme homophobic regimes may try to use these experimental results to change the orientation of gay people.” He said that the techniques being developed in sheep could in future allow parents to “play God”. People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, the pressure group, condemned the study as “a needless slaughter of animals, an affront to human dignity and a colossal waste of precious research funds”. The tests on gay sheep are the latest in a long line of experiments seeking to alter the sexuality of humans and animals. Günther Dorner, a scientist in the former East Berlin, carried out hormone-altering tests on rodents in the 1960s in the hope of finding a way to eradicate homosexuality. In 2002, Simon LeVay, an American neurologist, claimed to have discovered that homosexual and heterosexual men had physically different brains. His tests on the corpses of gay men who had died of Aids were widely criticised.
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#1. To: robin (#0)
The Iranian sheep and goat herds would be most grateful for this technology...
Orwellian!
Crazy, am I? We'll see whether I'm crazy or not.
These sheep are easily identified because they lisp when they baa and flap their front paws.
"We become what we behold. We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." -- Marshall McLuhan, after Alexander Pope and William Blake.
the fact that there are gay animals proves, does it not, that homosexuality is biological and not choice?
No, these are secular humanist sheep who have foresaken the word of God and chosen the path of decadence Ted Haggard was a human with such inclinations, but a program similar to the one above is slowly bringing him back to the path or rightiousness. He no loonger seeks out gay prostitutes, but he is now boinking goats.
.
Do you really want to go down that debate with some here? I think I've sided with that it is genetic. There are some pretty written in stone beliefs on this. I mean, just one morning, someone wakes up and decides to be gay? It dosen't make sense. Whats the upside?
Mark "I was real close to Building 7 when it fell down... That didn't sound like just a building falling down to me while I was running away from it. There's a lot of eyewitness testimony down there of hearing explosions. [..] and the whole time you're hearing "boom, boom, boom, boom, boom." I think I know an explosion when I hear it... — Former NYC Police Officer and 9/11 Rescue Worker Craig Bartmer
thanks. i got it straight now. :p
well, i'd like to see some's here answer to that one. :P
It certainly should be considered along with the rest of the theories.
That there are men in all countries who get their living by war, and by keeping up the quarrels of Nations is as shocking as it is true... A lack of breeding females or males creates gay animals. Social heirarchies are also a factor. Humans don't have that social structure, although I would say just about everyone I've met lately seems to be an unthinking sheep.
Imagine this technology in the hands of Iran, for example.
#2. To: robin (#0)
#3. To: robin (#0)
His tests on the corpses of gay men who had died of Aids were widely criticised.
I've already said too much.
#4. To: robin (#0)
#5. To: no one in particular (#0)
(Edited)
#6. To: christine (#5)
(Edited)
#7. To: christine (#5)
#8. To: ... (#6)
#9. To: Kamala (#7)
Do you really want to go down that debate with some here?
#10. To: christine, Diana (#5)
– Thomas Paine
#11. To: christine (#5)
 | This country's priorities are all fucked up. |
#12. To: TommyTheMadArtist (#11)
that makes sense. still, i'm not convinced that there isn't also some brain chemistry component.
A lack of breeding females or males creates gay animals.
#13. To: christine (#12)
Biology has a certain amount of influence, but people overcome biology every day. I mean, take a look at the population of this country. 99% of the people in this country have a brain, but apparently never need to use it.
| This country's priorities are all fucked up. |
#14. To: robin (#0)
Well, you sure posted this piece at the wrong place. (try saying that 3 times real fast...)
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#15. To: YertleTurtle (#4)
The ram I've got here gives a grunt as he tries to interest the ewe. If he didn't try to do his job he would be turned into ramburger.
These sheep are easily identified because they lisp when they baa and flap their front paws.
"It is the old practice of despots to use a part of the people to keep the rest in order; and those who have once got an ascendency and possessed themselves of all the resources of the nation, their revenues and offices, have immense means for retaining their advantages." Thomas Jefferson to John Taylor, 1798
#16. To: BTP Holdings (#15)
Somehow I'm not surprised to learn that you own sheep.
The ram I've got here
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#17. To: Redheadedstranger (#14)
ponchy, we put up the gay sheep bopping article specifically to lure you in.
"I am your superior, in every respect..." -- ponchy
#18. To: Kamala (#7)
I dont believe it's a 'decision' like what color shoes will I wear today..it's psychological .. having to do with arrested development.. just as it was viewed prior to political pressure ..
#19. To: Redheadedstranger (#16)
Hello Poney Poker! I think you're projecting here.
Somehow I'm not surprised to learn that you own sheep.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#20. To: Redheadedstranger (#14)
my ponchy, you are getting to be quite the regular. does it always take you 400 posts to opus?
"I am your superior, in every respect..." -- ponchy
#21. To: All (#20)
test of new tagline
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#22. To: christine (#5)
that is a very good point. I keep telling people that the female hormones in the beef/chicken/pork & other diet factors are likely a cause of the increase in homosexuality.
the fact that there are gay animals proves, does it not, that homosexuality is biological and not choice?
Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
#23. To: Red Jones (#22)
ponchy chews tabacco. that probably plays havoc with his blood chemistry. could explain a lot ..... remember that movie deliverance?
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#24. To: Red Jones (#22)
Think about this, big picture, past any discomfort you feel about gay and lesbian relationships. Do we want them screwing with us genetically in a eugenic sort of way to engineer the "right" behavior in us? If we go down this slippery slope, where does it end? I am very much apposed to this odious back door attempt to get the public seal of approval of eugenics, the science of engineering humans to make them the way we want them to be to be better social cogs and citizens.
#25. To: Ferret Mike (#24)
you make a reasonable argument. but I would contend that all the female hormones in the beef & pork are in fact them screwing with us with detrimental effect. and we should consider that these are I think not wild animals we're talking about, these are domesticated animals used in industry. what has this industry done to them to get these animals out-of-whack perhaps. But like the scientist in the article said - you can't learn these answers unless you study them.
Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
#26. To: Red Jones (#25)
Except that homosexually has been with us throughout history. It is part of human sexual behavior and it has not kept us from breeding the species until we overrun the Earth with a heavy population load of people. Homosexuality involved consenting adults. It is inherent to the natures of some people and not a lifestyle choice. I do not consider this to be anymore damning about a person to be gay or lesbian the having blue eyes or being left or right handed. I would never shun anyone for any reason merely for being homosexual. Doing so would be perverted, hateful behavior. So would acting like the American Kennel Club when some scientists try to breed pedigree humans. I am strongly against eugenics. We should not think of ourselves as our own creator.
#27. To: christine, BTP Holdings, Zipporah, Jethro Tull (#5)
Well, let's wait and see because the research is at least focused in the right direction. By this I mean that mommies make boys into sissies! ;)
the fact that there are gay animals proves, does it not, that homosexuality is biological and not choice?
"When the going gets tough, the tough make coffee!"
#28. To: HOUNDDAWG (#27)
And after we 'research' this and try to 'engineer' this out of the fabric of our being as human beings, what do we go after next? Do we want to be like the book 'Brave New World' where 'Deltas' and 'Epsilons' are developed as strong and stupid workers to do work the 'Alphas' and Beta' humans are too brainy to do without being bored? This proposal is an abomination that will never get off the ground. We are screwed as a species if that did happen.
"Well, let's wait and see because the research is at least focused in the right direction."
#29. To: Ferret Mike (#28)
Do we want to be like the book 'Brave New World' where 'Deltas' and 'Epsilons' are developed as strong and stupid workers to do work the 'Alphas' and Beta' humans are too brainy to do without being bored? This proposal is an abomination that will never get off the ground. We are screwed as a species if that did happen. You HOMO! ;) (just kidding)
And after we 'research' this and try to 'engineer' this out of the fabric of our being as human beings, what do we go after next?
"When the going gets tough, the tough make coffee!"
#30. To: Ferret Mike (#28)
I posted accidentally before I waz finished! Actually, the potential abuse of research is so frightening to me that I don't want to think about it. I have little confidence in those who do it and those who fund it. If there is such a thing as a weapon that can target just "us or them" then someone in govt somewhere is salivating at the prospect....
"When the going gets tough, the tough make coffee!"
#31. To: Ferret Mike (#26)
So have other physical and mental birth defects of every sort. YOur point was, again?
Except that homosexually has been with us throughout history.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#32. To: Redheadedstranger (#31)
He likes you alot.
#33. To: Redheadedstranger (#31)
ponchy, why are you so obsessed with homosexual farm animals?
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#34. To: Redheadedstranger (#31)
First and foremost, homosexuality is within the envelope of normal human sexuality. There is nothing wrong with it. More importantly though is who is to judge what is a defect and what isn't? Should we breed out excessive size and strength as this creates envy and possibly bullies? Who are we to play God and act like the judge jury and executioner trying to second guess our species' creation? No, you are being foolish. No human should engineer humans to meet the criteria for the optimal sort of person to better society, this is not possible to do as so much is subjective and we do not know where and how to draw the like with this sort of obscenity. Anyone who tried to engineer the species is a criminal and has reduced humanity to the level of being no more then being somewhat intelligent livestock.
"So have other physical and mental birth defects of every sort. Your point was, again?"
#35. To: Fred Mertz, Dakmar. (#32)
And you was drunk (Can't find teh u-tube fro that song and its not my racket anyway.) maybe Dakmar can...
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#36. To: Fred Mertz (#32)
I hope you are being sarcastic. I don't know this person beyond a very superficial level, so I neither 'like' him or 'hate' him.
"He likes you allot."
#37. To: Redheadedstranger (#35)
I had a very dull New Year's eve last night. I barely got tipsy.
#38. To: Redheadedstranger (#35)
Hi Horse Humper! Got your Irish courage up?
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#39. To: Minerva (#38)
i think you are the one who scares off the poney poker. he always vanishes just as you show up. now it will take him two hours to get greased enough to come back.
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#40. To: Minerva (#38)
and its 'dutch courage' not 'irish courage'.
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#41. To: Ferret Mike (#34)
Sez you. "More importantly though is who is to judge what is a defect and what isn't? " Hey, you've got a son, haven't you? SUppose you had it all to do over again, and the Dr. told you that the scans of the kid in the womb showed this hand was deformed, and that due to the breakthroughs in modern medicine they could fix that defect before he was born by some means. You saying you would take that opportunity and let them fix the foetus's hand, or would you let yoru son go through life with a withered hand because it was "natural?" "Who are we to play God and act like the judge jury and executioner trying to second guess our species' creation?" Ferret, you and I will live to see kids running around with the three arms, just trying to be cool. And speaking of perverting the human body, as Askel5 once put it to you, "does a penis really fit inside a rectum?" (I'm paraphrasing of course.) "Anyone who tried to engineer the species is a criminal and has reduced humanity to the level of being no more then being somewhat intelligent livestock." Most humans are sheeple anyway, so who cares?
There is nothing wrong with it.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#42. To: Fred Mertz (#37)
But the cop hauled you in, anyway, for public indecency, didn't he?
I barely got tipsy.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#43. To: Morgana le Fay (#40) (Edited)
Sorry, I'm not in the groove yet. Ponchy is only the second toss pot I've dealt with.
and its 'dutch courage' not 'irish courage'.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#44. To: Ferret Mike (#34)
Worse, suppose the doctor said the kid was going to turn out like Ponchy. What would you do then?
Hey, you've got a son, haven't you? SUppose you had it all to do over again, and the Dr. told you that the scans of the kid in the womb showed this hand was deformed, and that due to the breakthroughs in modern medicine they could fix that defect before he was born by some means.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#45. To: All (#42)
Here's the real sixty-four dollar question. I've worked livestock all my life, and known literally dozens of experts, vetinarians and farmers. None of them ever saw a ghey sheep. How is that?
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#46. To: Redheadedstranger (#42)
The cop is sitting in the next room. He gave me a t-shirt.
#47. To: Redheadedstranger (#45)
You love horses don't you.
I've worked livestock all my life ...
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#48. To: Fred Mertz (#46)
he must have been desperate...to hook up with the likes of you....
The cop is sitting in the next room. He gave me a t-shirt.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#49. To: Redheadedstranger (#45)
At least not during daylight, right? Hey, like you told me before, don't criticize sheep....they're not ba-ba-ba-ba-d.
None of them ever saw a ghey sheep.
#50. To: Redheadedstranger (#48)
why so hostile ponchy? you should try smoking pot instead of getting drunk all the time.
he must have been desperate...to hook up with the likes of you....
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#51. To: Fred Mertz (#49)
Is it true that you were kicked out of the army for having an inflateable ewe?
Hey, like you told me before, don't criticize sheep....they're not ba-ba-ba-ba-d.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#52. To: Redheadedstranger (#48)
He's heading down the road now.
#53. To: Fred Mertz (#52)
He did pay you first, didn't you? Or was tonight a 'freebie?"
He's heading down the road now.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#54. To: Redheadedstranger (#51)
Are all your misspellings an act? Or are you sauced up on the cheap gin again?
#55. To: Redheadedstranger (#51)
Bzzzzzt! Childish and worn out. Lacking in cleverness. Zero points awarded.
Is it true that you were kicked out of the army for having an inflateable ewe?
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#56. To: Fred Mertz (#54)
He is sauced up, but I think he drinks injun whiskey.
Or are you sauced up on the cheap gin again?
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#57. To: Fred Mertz, Ferret (#54)
Tell Ferret I'll get back to his rebuttal of my statements in teh morning. I'm going out for brisk run get some of this stuff out of my system... Got a full moon tonight...
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#58. To: Minerva (#56)
I'll bet he can't prove he's an injun. I have my papers.
#59. To: Fred Mertz (#54)
ponchy never posts here with a low BAL.
Are all your misspellings an act? Or are you sauced up on the cheap gin again?
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#60. To: Fred Mertz (#58)
Snicker...I got my skin.
I'll bet he can't prove he's an injun. I have my papers.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#61. To: Fred Mertz (#58)
ponchy doesnt' need papers. that is him in the upper right. I'll bet he can't prove he's an injun. I have my papers.
"And this is the end of my brilliant career on the 4um..." -- ponchy 12/20/2006
#62. To: Redheadedstranger (#60)
Is it warm and silky smooth?
Snicker...I got my skin.
#63. To: Redheadedstranger (#57)
Since you're not referring to the lunar event I figure you're referring to your figure. I'm glad you have a new year's resolution and are implementing it.
Got a full moon tonight...
#64. To: Redheadedstranger (#57)
The full moon isn't full until early morning on Jaunary 3rd.
Got a full moon tonight...
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#65. To: Redheadedstranger (#57)
Is the liquor store about to close?
I'm going out for brisk run
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts. -- The Poney Poker
#66. To: robin, christine, Kamala, ferret mike, lodwick (#10)
I'm convinced it's not a choice. Gay people suffer a lot because they are outcasts of sorts and get bullied and made fun of, and fundie Christians tend to hate them. They get picked on terribly especially as young teens. If something could be done to prevent homosexuality it could help prevent a lot of grief for potential homosexuals and their families. As I always say, why would anyone "choose" to be gay when it brings so much suffering into their lives? And to you lodwick, why do you say Iranians like to have sex with animals? They are no more gay than any other nationality. In fact Iranians tend to dislike Afganis, one of their stereotypes against them is that Afganis are gay and child molesters.
It certainly should be considered along with the rest of the theories.
#67. To: Ferret Mike, Red Jones (#26)
I've read the theory that homosexuality exists to keep the population in check, though it doesn't seem to have helped too much in that regard. Mike I don't think an available technology to "fix" homosexuality is cruel, I look at it that it would help prevent all the grief and bullying they must endure. Most people are not very open-minded on that subject at all, and reserve special scorn for them. I'm very grateful I was not born a homosexual.
Except that homosexually has been with us throughout history. It is part of human sexual behavior and it has not kept us from breeding the species until we overrun the Earth with a heavy population load of people.
#68. To: Ferret Mike (#34)
Now THOSE would be excellent traits to breed out.
envy and possibly bullies
#69. To: Diana (#68)
After finding out that some animals are gay I'll never look at them the same way again. Here are two cats, a rabbit & a rooster. I wonder which one of them is gay? 
Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
#70. To: Redheadedstranger (#41)
People who love other people are normal. If some want to have same gender partners, that is their business. There is nothing wrong with people loving people. Hating people because you wouldn't chose the same sexual partner as they would is perverse, not the love. If I were told a baby f mine likely would be born gay because of some test revealing some biological trait, I would shoot the doctor for being nosy the wrong way before even thinking about pushing to have the pregnancy terminated. Which would be easy anyway, as I am against abortion.
"Most humans are sheeple anyway, so who cares?"
#71. To: Diana (#67)
I've thought about that argument, but some would extend that to being glad they were born male and not female or Caucasian and not Negro. I have decided I would be glad I was born and not worry about the hand the Goddess drew for me in terms of the details about what kind of individual I was. I would be perfectly fine with being born Negro, color blind, gay, female or what have you. I just do not judge myself better then others thus I just don't care about the trivialities.
"I'm very grateful I was not born a homosexual."
#72. To: Ferret Mike (#70)
Do you mind if I have some time to think that one through? "If some want to have same gender partners, that is their business." And if they want to adopt children, that is everyone's business. "If I were told a baby f mine likely would be born gay because of some test revealing some biological trait, I would shoot the doctor for being nosy the wrong way before even thinking about pushing to have the pregnancy terminated." Answer the question, Ferret. The question I asked. If you had a chance to improve your disabled child, physically or mentally, while it was in the womb, would you or would you not allow the doctors to do so?
People who love other people are normal
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#73. To: Diana (#68)
I must warn you, Palo-lite that I've a hard day ahead of me, and have stocked up on broken beer bottles and rotten fruit for my next visit to the 4um.
If I haven't addressed you, then don't bother to reply to my posts.
#74. To: Redheadedstranger (#72)
No, I would not. I do not like this 'science,' and until strong ethics are put into place insuring the "first they will do no harm" as is what they pledge in their oaths as doctors, I give it no support or currency as legitimate medical science. I simply do not trust those allegedly healing to be healing as long as toxic wedge issues hate politics are part of the package of determining how and where this science is applied.
"Answer the question, Ferret. The question I asked. If you had a chance to improve your disabled child, physically or mentally, while it was in the womb, would you or would you not allow the doctors to do so?"
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