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9/11
See other 9/11 Articles

Title: 9/11 and the Evidence
Source: VDare
URL Source: http://www.vdare.com/roberts/070326_evidence.htm
Published: Mar 27, 2007
Author: Paul Craig Roberts
Post Date: 2007-03-27 12:26:54 by Peetie Wheatstraw
Ping List: *9-11*     Subscribe to *9-11*
Keywords: None
Views: 2023
Comments: 178

Professor David Ray Griffin is the nemesis of the official 9/11 conspiracy theory. In his latest book, Debunking 9/11 Debunking, Griffin destroys the credibility of the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) and Popular Mechanics reports, annihilates his critics, and proves himself to be a better scientist and engineer than the defenders of the official story.

Griffin’s book is 385 pages divided into four chapters and containing 1,209 footnotes. Without question, the book is the most thorough presentation and examination of all known facts about the 9/11 attacks. Griffin is a person who is sensitive to evidence, logic, and scientific reasoning. There is no counterpart on the official side of the story who is as fully informed on all aspects of the attacks as Griffin.

At the outset, Griffin points out that the reader’s choice is between two conspiracy theories: One is that Muslim fanatics, who were not qualified to fly airplanes, defeated the security apparatus of the US and succeeded in three out of four attacks using passenger jets as weapons. The other is that security failed across the board, not merely partially but totally, because of complicity of some part of the US government.

Griffin points out that there has been no independent investigation of 9/11. What we have are a report by a political commission headed by Bush administration factotum Philip Zelikow, a NIST report produced by the Bush administration’s Department of Commerce, and a journalistic account produced by Popular Mechanics. Various scientists who work for the federal government or are dependent on government grants have issued speculative statements in behalf of the official conspiracy theory, but have not produced meaningful evidence in its behalf.

The relevant skeptics of the official story are approximately 100 independent researchers consisting of experts and professors whose careers have required them to deal with evidence and its analysis. Their individual contributions to 9/11 analysis can be found online.

Griffin has undertaken to absorb the arguments and evidence for the official account and the arguments and evidence against it. In his latest book, which has just been released, he presents the case for the official account and its evidential failure.

Polls show that 36% of Americans do not believe the official story. Setting aside the 25% of the public that is so uninformed or uninvolved as to believe that Saddam Hussein was responsible for the 9/11 attack, leaves 39% of the public who believe the official story. However, this 39% is essentially relying on the mainstream media’s endorsement of the official story. Griffin believes, perhaps naively, that truth can prevail, and it is his commitment to truth that has motivated him to shoulder the enormous task.

Everyone who believes in the integrity of the US government or the Bush administration will find Griffin’s book to be disturbing. Readers will have to confront such issues as why US authorities seized the forensic evidence resulting from the destruction of the three World Trade Center buildings, the attack on the Pentagon and the crashed airliner in Pennsylvania and prevented any forensic examination of any part of the 9/11 attacks.

Despite widespread belief that Osama bin Laden was responsible for the attack, the evidence we have is a suspect video declared to be "bogus" by Bruce Lawrence, perhaps the leading American expert on bin Laden. The US government has never produced the promised report on bin Laden’s responsibility. When the Taliban offered to hand over bin Laden on presentation of evidence, the US government had no evidence to deliver; thus the invasion of Afghanistan.

The fragility of the NIST report is astonishing. The report succeeded because people accepted its assurances without examination.

Griffin shows that the Popular Mechanics report consists of special pleading, circular reasoning, appeals to the authority of the NIST report, straw men, and internal contradictions in the report itself.

There is not space in a review to present the evidence Griffin has mustered. A few highlights should suffice to alert readers to the possibility that the Bush administration has lied about more than Saddam Hussein’s weapons of mass destruction.

The two WTC towers did not collapse. They blew up and disintegrated, as did WTC 7. There is an enormous energy deficit in every account that rules out the use of explosives. Gravitational energy is insufficient to explain the pulverization of the buildings and contents and the severing of the 47 massive center core steel columns in each of the towers into convenient lengths to be picked up and loaded onto trucks; much less can gravitational energy account for the pulverization of the top floors of the towers and ejection of steel beams hundreds of feet horizontally just prior to the disintegration of the floors below.

Damage caused by airliners and short-lived limited fires cannot explain the disintegration of the buildings. The massive steel skeletons of the towers comprised a gigantic heat sink that wicked away whatever heat the limited fires produced.

NIST’s final report stated that of the steel available to it for examination, "only three columns had evidence that the steel reached temperatures above 250 degrees Celsius" (482 degrees Fahrenheit). The self-cleaning ovens in our home kitchens reach temperatures higher than this, and the ovens do not melt or deform.

Steel begins to melt at 1,500 degrees C or 2,800 degrees F. Temperatures of 250 degrees C would have no effect on the strength of steel. The explanation that the buildings collapsed because fire weakened the steel is speculative. Open air fires do not produce temperatures sufficient to deprive steel of its structural integrity. Steel framed buildings have burned 22 hours in raging infernos, and the steel skeletons remained standing. The WTC fires in the towers lasted about one hour and were limited to a few floors. Moreover, it is impossible for fire to account for the sudden, total and symmetrical disintegration of powerfully constructed buildings, much less at free fall speeds that are obtainable only with controlled demolition.

Griffin provides quotes from firefighters, police, and tenants, who heard and experienced a series of explosions prior to the disintegration of the towers. Such witness testimony is generally ignored by defenders of the official conspiracy theory.

Molten steel was found in underground levels of the WTC buildings weeks after the buildings’ destruction. As everyone agrees that the fires did not approach the melting point of steel, a possible explanation is high explosives used in demolitions that produce 5,000 degree temperatures. The possibility that explosives were used remains unexamined except by independent researchers.

Contradictions in the official conspiracy theory leap off the pages and hit the reader in the face. For example, the evidence that Flight 77, a Boeing 757, crashed into the Pentagon is the government’s claim to have obtained from the wreckage enough bodies and body parts to match the DNA for each person on the passenger list and flight crew. Simultaneously, the absence of passenger luggage, fuselage, wing and tail sections--indeed the absence of a 100,000 pound airliner--is attributed to the vaporization of the airplane due to the high speed crash and intense fire. The incompatibility of vaporized metal but recovered flesh and blood stood unnoticed until Griffin pointed it out.

Another striking inconsistency in the official conspiracy theory is the difference in the impact of airliners on the Pentagon and the WTC towers. In the case of the Pentagon, the emphasis is on why the airliner caused so little damage to the building. In the case of the WTC towers, the emphasis is why the airliners caused so much damage.

Perhaps it is merely a coincidence that just prior to 9/11 Cathleen P. Black, who has family connections to the CIA and Pentagon and is president of Hearst Magazines, the owner of Popular Mechanics, fired the magazine’s editor-in-chief and several senior veteran staff members and installed James B. Meigs and Benjamin Chertoff, a cousin of Bush administration factotum Michael Chertoff. It was Meigs and Benjamin Chertoff who produced the Popular Mechanics report that Griffin has eviscerated.

In his conclusion Griffin reminds us that the 9/11 attack has been used to start wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, to plan an attack on Iran, to curtail constitutional protections and civil liberties in the US, to radically expand US military budgets and the power of the executive, and to enrich entrenched vested interests. Griffin is definitely correct about this regardless of whether a believable case can ever be made for the government’s version of the 9/11 conspiracy. Subscribe to *9-11*

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#22. To: BeAChooser (#19)

By the way chooser, I never got a chance to ask you, did Goldi ban you for being a kook or for just being a butt hole?

Seems it could have gone either way.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   20:56:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: BeAChooser (#19)

Chooser, I got it. Why don't you post ten pages of black spam that no one will read. Down at the bottom say something about the world being unfair to you. Then, two weeks from now, when Christine calls you on your bullshit, you can claim you have already proven her wrong in a prior post. Ask her if she remembers it and go ROTFLOL!!

That should change reality and make things go your way.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   20:58:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: ... (#21)

Ghandi wouldn't toss out veiled threats this way

What would Jesus BUSH do?

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-03-27   21:00:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: ..., ALL (#23)

By the way chooser, I never got a chance to ask you, did Goldi ban you for being a kook or for just being a butt hole?

This should answer your question:

**********

From my first post here at 4um ...

***************

http://freedom4um.com/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=45230&Disp=75#C75

Hello everyone!

In my first post here at Freedom4um, I wish to set the record straight regarding my recent banning at LibertyPost by that forum's owner.

Post #293 of the following LP thread,

http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=175627&Disp=327#C327 ,

is where Goldi-Lox kicked me off her forum. She stated I was "disruptive" to the thread (and it's "important message").

Her banning post was a response to a post I made to samcgwire. Goldi deleted, in its entirety, the post I made to samcgwire (#235), calling my post "UNCIVIL".

Now you can decide for yourself whether I was disruptive (at least, any more so than scores of other folks have been on thousand other threads at LP).

Before you do that, however, keep in mind that she responded to a post I'd made nearly 12 hours earlier, and between that time and her post, I posted nothing further to the thread (and there were another 60 posts added by then). I'd hardly characterize that the massive disruption she claimed it to be. And my response was a response to a very hostile post directed at me. Was I supposed to be the only one at LP to just turn the other cheek? Just as I was the only one not allowed to post the word KOOK?

Furthermore, to single me out and ignore countless other examples of folks disrupting the forum in other threads says, I think, something about the consistency of Goldi's management of the forum. Many of these other cases have been pointed out to her (not just by me) and she took no action. So perhaps my banning just shows that only HER "issues" matter at LP. LP'ers take note. But that's ok. She is the owner and can do what she wants.

And a final bit of irony. Note that the assertion being made in the thread by Goldi and others apparently turned out to be more hysteria and rumor, than actual fact. I'm not saying those in Washington aren't above trying to slip something by us, but in this case it appears her concerns were a little overblown. But that's ok. She is the owner and can do what she wants.

Goldi-Lox chose to ban me ... permanently ... and without a real warning ... but that is her right as forum owner. She can do what she wants. So here I am, on Freedom4um. The same is true of this forum's owners. Should they decide I'm no longer welcome, they can ban me and I will make no effort to return. And for the record I have not posted at FR since Jim tossed me nor have I posted (or will I) at LP (unless, of course, invited to do so by Goldi). But, I do intend to give this forum's owner no legitimate cause to cancel my access. More on that later.

First, I do feel that Goldi's pulling my comment #235 and labeling it UNCIVIL is a naked effort to hide the hypocrisy of her own actions. So here are the facts regarding that deleted post (and you know how I love facts).

My post (#235) was a response to this post by samcgwire:

****************

228. To: BeAChooser (#218)

Quite honestly, you Quisling POS. I hope you freaking choke on yourself.

This might be my last night on LP.

Chooser, you and everyone like you will hang before this is over.

You sorry SOB. You can't cover for the treasonous bastards any longer.

The jig is up. Game over. It's time for all quislings to pay the fiddler and start to reap the whirlwind. You and your ilk have done enough damage.

samcgwire posted on 2007-02-05 21:07:36 ET Reply Trace

********************

To samcgwire's statement "Quite honestly, you Quisling POS. I hope you freaking choke on yourself.", I wrote (in #235) "What a civil, family oriented forum."

How can Goldi find that comment uncivil, yet not consider calling someone a "POS" and an "SOB" uncivil? Does she not know what POS and SOB stand for? Or are they okay because they are abbreviations of foul language? And she must think that a death wish is civil, too. I hardly see the logic in that. But it's her forum.

Next, in response to samcgwire's statement "This might be my last night on LP", I wrote "Why? You folks own this forum. I'm one little voice. What do you fear?"

Again, does Goldi think that's being uncivil? There's no foul language. No labels. Just the simple truth. Folks like samcgwire do seem to dominate her forum. And I was just one little voice of rationality (IMO). What did she fear?

Finally, in response to what I perceive to be a highly uncivil death threat, "Chooser, you and everyone like you will hang before this is over", I wrote "This is the sort of person you are associating yourself with, Goldi."

I see nothing uncivil in that observation, either. And it was the truth. She was associating herself with that individual. Later, she even went out of her way in the thread to tell samcgwire to not quit the forum but just take some time off and come back. And samcgwire wasn't the only problematic individual she was chummy with in that thread. In my opinion.

So here was a thread with it's very important topic (and I do think stopping illegal immigration is important) and Goldi willingly associates herself and the topic with an extremist who utters death threats and foul language at the drop of a hat, and others who I had shown (on other threads Goldi was pinged to) have a propensity for lying. I warned her in two emails after my banning that such associations are not going to get her views about this issue any favorable response from anyone who matters. Nor is allowing liars to corrupt a forum going to do that. My emails to her said quite a bit about the topic of liars. She ignores what I said at the risk of her own forum's future. But then it is her forum and I'll say no more on that matter unless asked to do so by her. I'm not holding my breath.

Now, as to my presence on THIS forum, I'd going to try something different. I will not be calling anyone any names or labels (you know ... kook, liar, 5th Columnist, anti-American). No matter what you call me or uncivility you post to me. I won't bozo you (don't believe in that). I'm simply going to turn the other cheek. And we will see who comes out looking the worse in the long run.

I'm also not going to engage in long debates, taking apart posts line by line. But I will be posting linked sources that will allow any open minded visitor to FD4UM to see that a claim made by a poster or a claim made in an article is false. They can draw their own conclusion from that.

One last comment. I appreciate this forum's owners giving me the opportunity to join, despite our past differences. I sure this will be interesting.

Now let the games begin ...

***********

See ... I even addressed to you at the end. Guess you weren't paying attention.

ROTFLOL!

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-27   21:03:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: ... (#23)

By the way, I'm just curious if you ever posted over at LP and if so under what screen name.

Since you seem to know so much about me ...

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-27   21:05:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: BeAChooser (#25)

OK. She banned you for being a kook AND an asshole.

Thanks for clearing that up. But, I suppose I could have figured it out for myself.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:05:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: BeAChooser (#26)

You post here. I don't need to go over there to see you in action.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:06:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: ..., ALL (#27)

Also ... do you have any specific defense you want to make for Griffin?

Or will you just remain mum about that?

And leave my points standing?

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-27   21:08:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: BeAChooser (#26)

So why doesn't Bush go on national TV and spew your WMD drivel? If its true it would save Bush's Presidency and make utter fools of the Democratic Congress.

What is the evil conspiracy that prevents this?

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:09:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: ..., ALL (#28)

You post here. I don't need to go over there to see you in action.

But you do visit that site a lot.

Otherwise, how could you pretend to know what my views are on topics like Ron Brown?

Right?

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-27   21:09:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: BeAChooser (#29)

Or will you just remain mum about that?

And leave my points standing?

Your "points" are from a month old article in a Bush boosting propaganda publication. They were published prior to the BBC's FOIA request coming in. The propaganda you posted has already been refuted by newer articles based upon the more recent information. But you know that already.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:11:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: BeAChooser (#31)

how could you pretend to know what my views are on topics like Ron Brown?

Easy, you are a kook who is too dumb to question NewsMax. All kooks like you buy all the Ron Brown stories all the time.

I know you also buy into the "move the WMD stories" even though I haven't seen you post on it.

All I have to do is read NewsMax once a month to see inside your brain.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:14:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: BeAChooser (#31)

You are a gullible and easily manipulated kook who breathlessly believes every word NewsMax and WND spin for you. I could recite your entire world view without too much trouble.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:15:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: ..., ALL (#32)

Your "points" are from a month old article in a Bush boosting propaganda publication.

You seem a little confused, ...

You seem to think you are posting on the other thread ... the one about the Iraqi death toll.

But this thread is about Griffin and his statements concerning 9/11.

On this thread I asked you whether you were going to let my points about Griffin stand.

This thread has nothing to do with the John Hopkin's study.

WAKE UP before you make a fool of yourself.

Now are you going to defend Griffin or not?

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-27   21:23:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: ..., ALL (#33)

Easy, you are a kook who is too dumb to question NewsMax. All kooks like you buy all the Ron Brown stories all the time.

So you are admitting you haven't actually read the material I've posted on Ron Brown. Correct?

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-27   21:24:53 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: BeAChooser (#36)

So you are admitting you haven't actually read the material I've posted on Ron Brown. Correct?

Are you trying to put words in my mouth? Try again, it didn't work this time.

I know you believe the Ron Brown kookery and go on about it when you think know one is going to hammer you for it.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:28:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: BeAChooser (#36)

Chosen...no one in their right mind would sift threw that pile...

We got the gov't we deserved.

“Yes, but is this good for Jews?"

Eoghan  posted on  2007-03-27   21:29:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: BeAChooser (#35)

Now are you going to defend Griffin or not?

That is not the issue I raised with you on this thread. I asked if Goldi banned you for being a kook or an asshole. You indicated, in a very round about way, that she banned you for being both and kook AND an asshole.

I didn't have much to say after that except that it seemed logical to me.

You are the one trying to keep this going.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:32:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: BeAChooser, Eoghan (#11) (Edited)

Eoghan is right chooser. If you can't make your point if fifty words, you don't know what you are talking about. You should go out to your local Junior College and take a course in Composition and Communications.

Be brief, be organized and be to the point.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:34:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: BeAChooser (#36)

So you are admitting you haven't actually read the material I've posted on Ron Brown. Correct?

So is Ron Brown dead or alive, or does he go back and forth?

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:36:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#42. To: christine (#17)

I think there should be a maximum # of times that someone can post the exact same copy/paste

yeah, i was JUST thinking the same thing.

Why don't you limit chooser to a daily word count?

You would actually be doing him a favor. It would force him to sift through his pages of garbage to pull out the single salient point ... if there was one. This would teach him to be both concise and precise in his arguments. Important abilities for any would be propagandist.

It would also be a good thing for the rest of the forum. If chooser had no salient point to make, we would be spared his spam. On the rare occasions where he did have a point, people would actually read it as they would not be forced to wade through his normal reams of garbage.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:45:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#43. To: BeAChooser (#35)

But this thread is about Griffin and his statements concerning 9/11.

Actually chooser, the world has turned. No one gives a shit about your NewsMax headlines cica 1993. They are as irrelevant as Ron Brown or your WMD koOkery. These issues have long since been decided by the rational and effective politicos ... and you lost. And your ranting about it just highlights your kookery.

What you should be doing is telling us about the kooky conspiracy that forces Monica Goodling to take the fifth. Or maybe spinning about what a strong and effective AG Gonzales is. Or take a clue from your hero Rush and tell us that today's Senate vote regarding the pull out provision in the supplemental was part of a Republican master scheme. There is lots of current stuff you could try to bullshit us about as your team circles the hole in the toilet and awaits the big slurp.

Get with the program! You can still claim that 29% of the country still supports you. Make hay while the sun shines. You probably won't be able to claim the 29% after 2008.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   21:56:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#44. To: BeAChooser, SKYDRIFTER, christine, Red Jones (#25)

She stated I was "disruptive" to the thread (and it's "important message").

This was the reason I was banned at FR some time ago, because shortly after the war against Iraq got started I had the nerve to say that that our military would not be greeted warmly by the Iraqi people, that we would not win over their hearts and minds, that in fact they would resent it. The posters at FR thought that was a terrible thing to say, so JR booted me off for being a disruptor.

I'm sure you were considered disruptive on LP in another way though.

Diana  posted on  2007-03-27   22:12:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#45. To: BeAChooser, ..., Red Jones (#26)

Since you seem to know so much about me ...

That's probably because you have become an internet legend, you are famous!

We are so lucky and honored to have you here!!

Diana  posted on  2007-03-27   22:17:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#46. To: BeAChooser (#18)

47 INTERCONECTED box colums, not unlike, but definitely much heavier than the interconnected but much smaller columns in the other picture, which they did show.

Funny how everyone of the fairy tale believers forgets that the core was interconnected.


A new truth movement friendly digg type site: Zlonk it!

Critter  posted on  2007-03-27   22:28:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#47. To: Diana (#45)

That's probably because you have become an internet legend, you are famous!

Yes, he is like caLOL, TLBSHOW or Fahey. A legend, but not exactly in the way he imagines.

.

...  posted on  2007-03-27   22:38:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#48. To: beachooser, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Red Jones, Diana, Kamala, All (#19)

You going to try and censor the truth, christine?

When did you get interested in the truth, BAC?

You're a disinformationist, a deceiver; a LIAR!

Eat shit & die, you sorry piece of shit!


SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-03-27   23:23:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#49. To: beachooser, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Red Jones, Diana, Kamala, All (#25)

I appreciate this forum's owners giving me the opportunity to join, despite our past differences. I sure this will be interesting.

Goldi was part of the 'team' that sent you over here to disrupt this forum. You're not fooling anyone important, BAC!

Don't think you have any permanence here, BAC, we're just keeping an eye on you.


SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-03-27   23:29:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#50. To: ..., ALL (#37)

"So you are admitting you haven't actually read the material I've posted on Ron Brown. Correct?"

Are you trying to put words in my mouth?

So have you read the material I've posted about Ron Brown or not?

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   15:10:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#51. To: ..., christine, ALL (#39)

Now are you going to defend Griffin or not?

That is not the issue I raised with you on this thread.

But it is the topic of this thread. And my raising those issues and christine's indication that she might censor my responses criticizing Griffin are what apparently drew you to this thread. So are you going to defend Griffin from what I said about him or not?

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   15:15:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#52. To: ..., ALL (#43)

But this thread is about Griffin and his statements concerning 9/11.

Actually chooser, the world has turned. No one gives a shit about your NewsMax headlines cica 1993.

Again you don't seem to know what this thread is about. Why is that?

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   15:19:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: Diana, ALL (#44)

I'm sure you were considered disruptive on LP in another way though.

I'm curious Diana.

Why do you think Goldi LIED about the content of my post?

It clearly was not uncivil as she claimed (and then deleted).

My message to her is the same as my message to you folks.

You will not find the truth or a better world on a foundation of lies.

That message goes out to the posters championing Griffin in this thread.

He's a liar ...

and you will not find the truth on a foundation of lies.

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   15:25:00 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#54. To: Critter, ALL (#46)

47 INTERCONECTED box colums, not unlike, but definitely much heavier than the interconnected but much smaller columns in the other picture, which they did show.

Funny how you still don't get it. ROTFLOL!

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   15:26:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#55. To: BeAChooser (#53)

You will not find the truth or a better world on a foundation of lies.

you're the one whose belief system is based on a foundation of lies. that's what your beloved government does is LIE LIE LIE LIE LIE and you disgustingly lap it all up and puke it all over this forum. as i said before, the only reason you're here is that some posters enjoy engaging you. no one here, including your imaginary lurker fans, reads the spam you've been posting over and over and over. you're the only one who fails to see how many times your "truth" has been nullified.

christine  posted on  2007-03-28   18:57:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: BeAChooser (#53)

Why do you think Goldi LIED about the content of my post?

Because she's a double-knot secret hippie?

"People like truth, it gives us a fucking benchmark." - dakmar

Dakmar  posted on  2007-03-28   19:05:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#57. To: christine (#55)

Good smack down of our resident heeb, christine. I can't see what he wrote to elicit your slap, but I'm sure ROTFLOL! was part of it.

Jethro Tull  posted on  2007-03-28   19:54:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: beachooser, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Red Jones, Diana, Kamala, All (#53)

You will not find the truth or a better world on a foundation of lies.

That message goes out to the posters championing Griffin in this thread.

He's a liar ...

and you will not find the truth on a foundation of lies.

BAC, you're the resident LIAR, wherever you go. You're "clever" about it, but the LIAR, in any case.

Your definition of "truth" is that which the Bush Cabal (read: "Israel") dictates to you.

You're the human epitome of un-truth, lies and deceit!

You were "banned" as an excuse to send you groveling over here - nothing more.

Eat shit, and die; BAC!



SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-03-28   19:59:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#59. To: christine (#55)

Gosh chris ..don't attempt to steer him the right direction.. he puts his trust in the system .. the poor man will be in a fetal position for years if he'd take of the blinders.. but funny the system he so trusts is what Washington, Eisenhower warned against.. HEY and they were a part of the 'system' now werent they?

Zipporah  posted on  2007-03-28   20:02:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: christine, ALL (#55)

you're the one whose belief system is based on a foundation of lies. that's what your beloved government does is LIE LIE LIE LIE LIE and you disgustingly lap it all up and puke it all over this forum. as i said before, the only reason you're here is that some posters enjoy engaging you. no one here, including your imaginary lurker fans, reads the spam you've been posting over and over and over. you're the only one who fails to see how many times your "truth" has been nullified.

I haven't posted any lies to this forum. Not a one. You and everyone else here are welcome to try proving I have. So far, most 4umers simply run from my posts. Bozo themselves. And the rest ignore the content, just as you have done on this thread. And anyone who visits 4um and reads this or any other thread that I've participated in will see this clear as day. None of you seem able to cope with the notion that Griffin has LIED to you about the facts surrounding the collapse of the towers. Hence, your behavior here.

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   21:18:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: christine, Jethro Tull, ALL (#57)

Jethro Tull - Good smack down of our resident heeb, christine. I can't see what he wrote to elicit your slap,

See what I mean, christine?

Most of your flock want to remain clueless and think that's a badge of honor.

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   21:20:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#62. To: christine, SKYDRIFTER, ALL (#58)

SKYDRIFTER - Eat shit, and die; BAC!

Or you have posters like SKYDRIFTER.

Meanwhile, NONE of you have challenged the details of the post I made about Griffin.

Interesting ...

BeAChooser  posted on  2007-03-28   21:22:13 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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