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Resistance
See other Resistance Articles

Title: Pat Tillman: Killed by Friendly Fire or Executed by His Own Government?
Source: We Hold These Truths
URL Source: http://whtt.org/index.php?news=2&id=1329
Published: Apr 4, 2007
Author: Charles E. Carlson
Post Date: 2007-04-07 09:42:41 by Ada
Keywords: None
Views: 399
Comments: 31

The Bush Administration knew at the top that celebrity soldier Pat Tillman had been killed by persons in, or attached to his own unit, yet it purposely chose to muffle the incident for more than two years; lying to the family while lionizing the victim as a war hero. Circumstantial evidence, primarily illogical actions at very high levels of the administration, suggests more than a cover up of a “friendly fire” accident (a common mistake during war.)

Had Tillman been accidentally shot by one of his own unit the whole matter could have been put to rest by holding a few harsh court marshals of those immediately involved, and issuing profuse apologies to everyone. But, America’s most famous volunteer soldier was, according to his brother and constant companion, on the verge of whistle-blowing the bankruptcy of US policy in Iraq. The untimely death of Tillman could not have been timelier for the top civilians in charge of making war, but covering for an assassination is not so simple.

The Tillman brothers were both professional athletes who enlisted in the US Army together in May 2002, 8 months after day 9/11, but before the bombing of Iraq. They were first shipped to Iraq where they lived together in the same unit; then they were transferred to Afghanistan where Pat Tillman was killed about two years after his enlistment by parties unknown. The Army now admits Tillman was killed by his own unit, but there appears to be much more to the story. Tillman’s own brother Kevin, who was with him every day, says Pat despised and rejected the war in Iraq as unnecessary and brutal. Kevin wrote a public letter on 20 October 2006:

"Somehow the most reasonable, trusted and respected country in the world has become one of the most irrational, belligerent, feared, and distrusted countries in the world." (1)

The Not So New Military Art of Selective Execution…of its Own

Pat Tillman's family has firmly rejected the Defense Department's findings on the former NFL star's friendly-fire death in Afghanistan; calling for congressional investigations into what they see as broad malfeasance and a cover-up. They are told in the reports that nine Army officers, including four generals, “made errors” in not reporting the friendly fire death to their superiors and to the Tillman family. The Defense Department has stated one or more of those officers who provided misleading information as the military investigated could be charged with a crime. However, there is a gaping hole in this story. It has now been disclosed that the “friendly fire” story of his death had to be known at the top of the chain of command, probably by Bush and acting Army Secretary Les Brownlee. (2)

Pat Tillman's father, a lawyer, while avoiding the legal term “murder” is having none of this explanation. (3)

Logic dictates that we raise the possibility of Tillman’s assassination by his own government. Top civilian leadership had the reason and the opportunity to assassinate Tillman, and now they are acting quite guilty.

The Tillman story has a great chance of breaking out: survivor Kevin Tillman was with his brother constantly at war. Pat and Kevin were shipped from Iraq to Afghanistan because Pat made no secret of his opinion that war in Iraq was “illegal and unjust,” and he was, according to his brother, prepared to tell his story publicly at the first opportunity. The Tillman brothers were due for a furlough, and Kevin stated in interviews that Pat had arranged to meet with an anti-war journalist while at home. We wonder if others might have known this.

We do not know if Pat ever admitted he had been fooled into enlisting, but he privately denounced the destruction of war in Iraq as immoral and brutal. As Pat’s outrage grew, he was probably reassigned before he could refuse to serve in Iraq. It does not appear he renounced his original ideas about fighting the war on terrorism, presumably against the Taliban in Afghanistan.

Justifiable Homicide

When O. J. Simpson was found not guilty of the murders of his wife and her friend Ron Goldman, some Americans believed the Court. OJ is a football hero with a fan club, and others simply believe that courts render correct decisions. Fewer now believe OJ’s innocence, especially after he tried to market a book on how he would have killed his wife if he had wanted to. But he stands innocent under the law.

The same types of questions were asked of the assassination of President John F. Kennedy (JFK) in 1962 only to be shouted down by the Warren Commission. It now seems all too obvious that Lee Harvey Oswald did not, and could never have carried out such plot alone, if indeed he even knew about the plan. Had Kennedy been touring Afghanistan when he was murdered it would no doubt have been called a “friendly fire” accident.

And there are older plots, Pearl Harbor being one, where the original story taken at face value is now rejected by many scholars. The complicity of the US government in 1941 is now an accepted historical conclusion that seriously challenges the “official story.” For many years any critic who saw the obvious inconsistencies was muzzled by labels of “conspiracy nut” and even “traitor.”

And how could two airplanes bring down no less than three buildings in Manhattan? A few challenged the accepted official story, and more are now asking. Pat and Kevin Tillman were caught up in the emotion of the moment and believed, not thinking past what seemed so obvious. But when the US bombed Iraq, Tillman knew something was very wrong, as his brother tells us. Perhaps Pat knew he had made an error in judgment that he would need to correct. His story seems to tell us this, and his superiors had to know about his change of heart, for they shipped the brothers from Iraq to Afghanistan without leave to go home.

It seems overwhelmingly likely that Tillman was not a victim of fratricide or “friendly fire” as it is euphemistically called, but was deliberately assassinated. Much of the daily killing is performed by “contractors” in Iraq. Tillman may not have been shot by anyone in the military. The Tillman “probable assassination” (our word) would have been temptingly easy, for instance for the CIA, which runs and hides secret prisons and torture camps, and creates false identities at will. It could have been carried out with the knowledge of a mere handful of persons above Army level, including as few as one assassin. It has been asserted that even now some of Tillman’s unit cannot be located for questioning. This would seem nearly impossible in an Army that maintains detailed personnel records, but likely if the CIA was involved. And we are told Pat’s personal diary was burned with his body armor- if this is true, we can only wonder what was in this diary.

This author’s purpose is limited to suggesting that someone above the military had a very good motive and opportunity to kill Tillman. Now the Army has a very guilty look as those above the army finger officers far up the chain of command. People who were carrying out orders are now implicated in the “friendly fire accident;” their faces shine in the light of a whitewashing investigation. The four generals and dozens of lesser officers and enlisted men are probably scapegoats; pleading incompetence and error at lower levels to take the wrap for the planners and executioners. The few in prison for torturing humans at Abu Ghraib had to take the blame for those who issued the orders.

The Motive for Assassination:

Pat Tillman was perhaps the most dangerous man to the war propaganda effort on April 22, 2004 when he died. Unlike his brother Kevin, his father Patrick Sr., or any other member of the armed forces, Pat could arrange publicity for what he had to say any time he warned to. Reportedly he told Kevin they would have to wait until they mustered out to talk. Few can raise a crowd faster than an articulate NFL star. Tillman is one of the few who could sing with certain credibility this marching cadence:

“I once was blind, but now I see.

I enlisted to fight

But soon I’ll be free.

Been there, I’ll talk;

You can believe in me.”

Circumstantial Evidence of an Assassination

Most of us have glimpsed the several coroner shows now so popular on TV, where every shred of evidence is saved and protected to expose the crime; no eyelash is ever lost or discarded. But Tillman’s clothing and body armor, as well as his personal diary were all burned. Those who destroyed it have yet to name those who told them to do so, and they may never tell. Everything about the killing suggests it was intended, including the fact that Tillman was shot twice in the head in broad daylight. Anyone good enough and close enough for a headshot can identity who is being shot. Maybe this is why his body armor was destroyed; perhaps it proved the assassins shot at his head, and did not pelt him with dozens of randomly placed rounds. “Friendly fire” is thought of as randomly sprayed artillery or gunfire that hits unintended individuals. It is truly not meant to be fratricide. Not so with assassination; there is nothing friendly about it.

The Motive to Kill

The army had another reason to fear Tillman- his incredible determination to do what he believed was right. This focus caused him to misguidedly enlist; believing the World Trade Center bombing was as advertised. We do not know what he believed when someone posing as an American in his own unit shot him in the face! The military had a valid motive for killing its poster boy…to keep him from talking very loudly about Iraq. Kevin Tillman has said in interviews that Pat had interviews arranged when he got stateside. He never made it home alive!

The Opportunity Was Present

Anyone who has ever witnessed the confusion of military field exercises can imagine how easy it would be to assassinate one individual during actual combat. Men are moved in and out of units under “orders” which mysteriously appear from above or are carried in the hands of a new recruit. A team of assassins could be ordered into a unit one week and ordered out the next week, with no one knowing their real names. They become who their orders say they are. Furthermore, those in a unit have no contact with the press or anyone else, nor do they dare talk if they did know someone to tell; they are under the total control of the unit. Pat Tillman could have been ordered into a unit at the same time as a hit team was ordered in to assassinate him. No one would be the wiser except the one who “cut the orders.” No one could say for sure if the assassin aimed at Tillman’s face or not.

Patrick Tillman Sr. said: “The army killed its poster boy.”

Responsibility for killing Tillman might reach very high indeed in this administration. Kevin Tillman will be safer if he puts every thought on paper and places them in public hands. We Hold These Truths leaves this endeavor to the Tillman family and many of their friends, with our blessings. We consider it more our forte to focus on the whitewashing of war by the Christian Right, of which Pat Tillman was, according to his friend Jeremy Staat, not part. Oddly, he did display moral courage and the desire to right his own wrongs. Bible teachers refer to such actions as virtue and repentance; qualities much talked about in Christian circles yet seldom practiced in time of conflict. Let us not allow Pat Tillman’s concern for his fellow man to be in vain.

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#1. To: Ada (#0)

what shocked me is that the articles recently published about this are saying that soldiers present when he was killed testified that there were no enemy or Taliban on the scene. a mine went off and nobody was injured. But some Americans who were not in Tillman's normal platoon started shooting in the direction of Tillman & other soldiers. and in the middle of this wild gunfire Pat Tillman stood up and yelled at the shooter "I'm Pat F******* Tillman" and immediately after he said that 3 bullets struck his face blowing off most of his head. Then they burned his diary and his clothes & personal items. Makes no sense to do that. Unless they maybe wanted to set an example to the other soldiers or destroy evidence.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-04-07   10:58:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Red Jones, Ada (#1)

His mom said Tillman thought the war in Iraq was bullshit.

Perhaps he was thinking that aloud concerning the entire middle east operation and was silenced.

Whatever, it is fact that Bush & the Ziomedia lied thier asses off and used Tillman as a poster boy for the war and recruitment. A really prime example of government propaganda hard at work!

Are the 7 th inning homages to the Zionist war machine still occurring at American baseball games? Are they still doing that this year?

Supporters of Bush and the Iraq war for Israel and oil are traitors to America and they hate American troops.

wbales  posted on  2007-04-07   11:05:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Ada, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Red Jones, Diana, Kamala, All (#0)

I hadn't thought about it, but if Tillman had expressed any "independent" views on matters, he could have been marked for murder. If he had communicated anything 'bad' to home, his voice would have uniquely triggererd an early landslide of dissent.

The cover-up was awfully strange, for a lot of reasons.

However, he could have been targetted as an unwitting (manufactured) martyr, also.

I doubt that we'll ever know.


SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-04-07   11:08:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: SKYDRIFTER (#3)

the newspapers have quoted his family and his buddies from the war that he was turning anti-war. He was vocal about it. he had contacted this anti-war journalist Noam Chomsky by email and was planning to meet him when he got out. He was not discreet in his anti-war views. Did you read the anti-war editorial written by Kevin Tillman (linked to in the article if you go to original)

the thing is that the 3'rd round of investigations turned up testimony that there were no enemy present when he was killed.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-04-07   11:14:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: Red Jones, Fred Mertz, aristeides, MUDDOG (#4)

the newspapers have quoted his family and his buddies from the war that he was turning anti-war. He was vocal about it. he had contacted this anti-war journalist Noam Chomsky by email and was planning to meet him when he got out. He was not discreet in his anti-war views. Did you read the anti-war editorial written by Kevin Tillman (linked to in the article if you go to original)

the thing is that the 3'rd round of investigations turned up testimony that there were no enemy present when he was killed.

It's a horrible thought, but I'm becoming accustomed to horrible thoughts.

"The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes nor between parties either — but right through the human heart." — Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

robin  posted on  2007-04-07   11:27:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: robin (#5)

I've only recently read about Tillman's missing/burnt journal/diary. I'm certain all his personal effects are, by regulation, to be turned over to his family. This is the missing smoking gun IMO.

Fred Mertz  posted on  2007-04-07   11:32:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: robin (#5)

it is horrible that a lot of us are becoming accustomed to horrible thougths.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-04-07   11:34:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Fred Mertz (#6)

I've only recently read about Tillman's missing/burnt journal/diary.

Yet another mystery about his death.

"The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes nor between parties either — but right through the human heart." — Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

robin  posted on  2007-04-07   11:37:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: Fred Mertz (#6)

the other smoking guns are that there were no enemy present when this happened. and then the 3 bullets to the head that can't be done without aiming. and it happened right after he shouted 'I'm Pat F******* Tillman' and the shooter was not from his platoon, he'd been brought in by higher-ups. and there's been so many lies told about it all from the beginning.

the family has reviewed thousands of pages of the various investigations, and they've concluded it was done purposely.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-04-07   11:37:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: robin. all (#5)

It's a horrible thought, but I'm becoming accustomed to horrible thoughts.

bump it

Dr.Ron Paul for President

Lod  posted on  2007-04-07   11:37:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Red Jones (#9)

and the coverup afterwards, his family is outraged

"The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes nor between parties either — but right through the human heart." — Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

robin  posted on  2007-04-07   11:38:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Red Jones (#9)

...the shooter was not from his platoon, he'd been brought in by higher-ups.

Was he the guy with the Italian last name whose hometown was NYC?

Fred Mertz  posted on  2007-04-07   11:46:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Fred Mertz (#12)

That guy was a cop, wasn't he? Name like Merano, Morano, Moreno. Something like that, I think.

To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.

aristeides  posted on  2007-04-07   11:52:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Red Jones, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Red Jones, Diana, Kamala, All (#4)

the newspapers have quoted his family and his buddies from the war that he was turning anti-war. He was vocal about it. he had contacted this anti-war journalist Noam Chomsky by email and was planning to meet him when he got out. He was not discreet in his anti-war views. Did you read the anti-war editorial written by Kevin Tillman (linked to in the article if you go to original)

No one in the Bush Cabal has a conscience; I think we know what was probably true.

If the Tillman family goes all-out anti-war, there may be some more murders.


SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-04-07   12:20:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: aristeides (#13)

I can't find the name in 'official' sources.

Fred Mertz  posted on  2007-04-07   12:24:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Fred Mertz (#15)

This smacks, somewhat, of the fear in some circles that WW.II General Patton would come back to the U.S. and possibly would be elected President. Like Tillman he, too, was hugely popular back home and could raise a crowd. He didn't come back, either.

Bub  posted on  2007-04-07   12:41:56 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Fred Mertz, Red Jones, aristeides (#15)

I can't find the name in 'official' sources.

I don't recall that the name of the shooter was ever released, but maybe Wayne Madsen or some other insider got the info and published the name.

But the man who first knew that Tillman's death was due to fratricide was Stanley McChrystal. He's the czar of black ops. No doubt Stan would have a rolodex full of Jedi Knights' names.

http://www.msnbc.msn. com/id/13392189/site/newsweek/

"The Hidden General: Stan McChrystal runs 'black ops.' Don't pass it on"

...JSOC is part of what Vice President Dick Cheney was referring to when he said America would have to "work the dark side" after 9/11. To many critics, the veep's remark back in 2001 fostered his rep as the Darth Vader of the war on terror and presaged bad things to come, like the interrogation abuses at Abu Ghraib and Guantánamo Bay. But America also has its share of Jedi Knights who are fighting in what Cheney calls "the shadows." And McChrystal, an affable but tough Army Ranger, and the Delta Force and other elite teams he commands are among them...Rumsfeld is especially enamored of McChrystal's "direct action" forces or so-called SMUs—Special Mission Units—whose job is to kill or capture bad guys, say Pentagon sources who would speak about Special Ops only if they were not identified...Experts like former Deputy Defense secretary John Hamre are also concerned that Special Ops now has generic authority to deploy where it wants without case-by-case orders...

scrapper2  posted on  2007-04-07   12:49:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: Ada (#0)

Killed by Friendly Fire or Executed by His Own Government?

That's the question now, isn't it?

"First they ignore you. Then they ridicule you. Then they fight you. Then you win." --Mahatma K. Gandhi

angle  posted on  2007-04-07   16:32:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: scrapper2 (#17)

McChrystal warned Bush that Tillman might have been killed by friendly fire a week after Tillman died: General sought to warn Bush of Tillman friendly-fire death.

To reason, indeed, he was not in the habit of attending. His mode of arguing, if it is to be so called, was one not uncommon among dull and stubborn persons, who are accustomed to be surrounded by their inferiors. He asserted a proposition; and, as often as wiser people ventured respectfully to show that it was erroneous, he asserted it again, in exactly the same words, and conceived that, by doing so, he at once disposed of all objections. - Macaulay, "History of England," Vol. 1, Chapter 6, on James II.

aristeides  posted on  2007-04-07   16:34:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: scrapper2 (#17)

I don't recall that the name of the shooter was ever released

You're right. and the journalists didn't specifically say the shooter was from outside his platoon. but from the description I read of the incident - that is what I deduced. One description said that Tillman's group of soldiers was elevated on a mountain and another group of American soldiers was at base of mountain and that this 2'nd group was not normally with them, and the shooter was among them.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-04-07   16:38:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: SKYDRIFTER, Red Jones, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Burkeman1, Diana, Kamala, scrapper2 (#3) (Edited)

However, he could have been targetted as an unwitting (manufactured) martyr, also.

I doubt that we'll ever know

I agree with SKYDRIFTER and I would like to add one more thought directed at Bushbots - If Clinton were president when this happened the accusations would immediately have gone out on the web forums of the right-wing claiming Arkanside.

What has always troubled me is that this kind of thinking did not carry over into the Bush presidency. In other words why do the right-wing types who accused the Clintons of so many murders not contemplate that the Bushies could be just as bloody?

I again must stress like SKYDRIFTER I don't know what may have happened to Tillman and I am not advocating one position or the other - just wondering why that segment of the right-wing could turn off their bullshit radar detection for Bush when under Clinton it worked overtime?

I remember dozens of the right-wing pushing DVD's claiming the Clintons did all these murders (exception being the Ruby Ridge and Branch Davidian documentaries and and I think those had more to do with out of control govt than with the Clintons ordering hits) and claims that the Clintons were inviting UN armies into the USA to take over the country using Black helicopters (not to mention Oklahoma City which I am still unsure about) and I think it soured me on such kind of DVDs exposing conspiracies. I would like to know where these right wing govt is the enemy skeptical types went when Bush came to power?

"The desire to rule is the mother of heresies." -- St. John Chrysostom

Destro  posted on  2007-04-07   19:33:43 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: Destro, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Red Jones, Diana, Kamala, All (#21)

Only the landlord's signature is required for a valid lease.

If a lease doesn't state when the rent is due, it is not due until the end of the rental period.

The differences between the Bush and Clinton dynasties is too little to speak to. The Clintonistas set up 9-11, for the Bush Cabal. In turn, Bush will set Hitlery up for the White House. She'll be easier to elect, than was Boy George.



SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-04-07   20:19:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: SKYDRIFTER (#22)

The differences between the Bush and Clinton dynasties is too little to speak to.

I was not comparing the admins I was comparing the people who cried murder at every turn against Clinton yet went silent on Bush.

"The desire to rule is the mother of heresies." -- St. John Chrysostom

Destro  posted on  2007-04-07   20:22:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Destro, Christine, Brian S, Honway, Robin, Aristeides, Red Jones, Diana, Kamala, All (#23)

I was not comparing the admins I was comparing the people who cried murder at every turn against Clinton yet went silent on Bush.

HUH!

Accusing the Bush Cabal of facilitating 9-11 and going off on the War Crime invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq don't count?

The magical deaths of the post 9-11 microbiologists don't count?

Granted, there have been fewer high-profile cases. The Clintons did have more of those. The media is more tightly controlled, under Bush.


SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-04-07   20:30:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: aristeides, Red Jones (#19)

McChrystal warned Bush that Tillman might have been killed by friendly fire a week after Tillman died: General sought to warn Bush of Tillman friendly-fire death.

Yes, that's what McChrystal claimed and no doubt he did send his memo - my point in referring to him was that he knew awfully fast what went down - he had more clarity of the situation in a matter of days perhaps hours what has taken 3 official investigations to uncover.

Remember that the platoon leader was told by a commander at a base far away to split up his men into 2 groups and though the platoon leader argued against it vociferously, it was to no avail - the commander's order stood.

Maybe I'm getting too "out there" but McChrystal commanded a "Special Mission Unit" as well as Delta Force and Rangers - the black ops "missions" were off the books. To a twisted patriot's mind, an anti-war vocal soldier-celebrity might be viewed as a "bad guy"...

"Rumsfeld is especially enamored of McChrystal's "direct action" forces or so- called SMUs—Special Mission Units—whose job is to kill or capture bad guys, say Pentagon sources who would speak about Special Ops only if they were not identified...Experts like former Deputy Defense secretary John Hamre are also concerned that Special Ops now has generic authority to deploy where it wants without case-by-case orders..."

scrapper2  posted on  2007-04-07   21:58:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: Destro (#21)

What has always troubled me is that this kind of thinking did not carry over into the Bush presidency. In other words why do the right-wing types who accused the Clintons of so many murders not contemplate that the Bushies could be just as bloody?

Correct.

The smirks go back for generations of deception, death, and destruction.

Dr.Ron Paul for President

Lod  posted on  2007-04-07   22:08:48 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: SKYDRIFTER (#22)

Only the landlord's signature is required for a valid lease.

Whomever you were quoting here, is sadly wrong.

Any contract requires TWO competent, willing signatories.

Dr.Ron Paul for President

Lod  posted on  2007-04-07   22:14:06 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: scrapper2 (#25)

your thinking is very sound.

Today in Tempe, AZ near where I live they had a big 10 K run for charity that was named after Pat Tillman. All participants wore a #42, Tillman's # when he played. Incredible glorification. How do you tell people that his mom & dad think he was murdered? They hate you for it if you tell them.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-04-08   0:45:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: Destro (#21)

In other words why do the right-wing types who accused the Clintons of so many murders not contemplate that the Bushies could be just as bloody?

those "right wing" types are GOP party over principle types ala BAC and freakers.

christine  posted on  2007-04-08   1:19:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: Destro (#21)

I would like to know where these right wing govt is the enemy skeptical types went when Bush came to power?

many have been deceived. Isn't that obvious Destro?

why do young people want everything to work out just right? Older people are wiser. Mankind is broken and failing. Isn't that obvious also? why do you expect it to be otherwise?

The failure of man's efforts to rule on this earth are on display for all to see. but people who glorify man and idolize man will develop delusions and idolatries to hide their eyes from these things.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Red Jones  posted on  2007-04-08   1:25:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: lodwick (#27)

Only the landlord's signature is required for a valid lease.

Oops. I had the wrong stuff on the clipboard & didn't notice. (I'm doing Real Estate School, at the moment.)

Actually, it depends on the particular state law. That's a correct statement for Washington. If I'm leasing a house, the rules run with the lease and I get the tenant's signature, also. Not required, per se, but legally convenient.


SKYDRIFTER  posted on  2007-04-08   13:46:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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